Double Scare In Bathroom
Man & Woman's Bathroom?
ERIC SINGER
KRDO NewsChannel 13
POSTED: 3:30 pm MDT October 14, 2011
http://www.krdo.com/news/29488435/detail.html (http://www.krdo.com/news/29488435/detail.html)
COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. -- One woman says she had a double scare at the Chapel Hills Mall bathroom on Wednesday. It was in the women's facility near the Children's Place.
She says a man was in the bathroom. She rushed to get help from mall security. The man was gone when they got the restroom. The woman also says she was told by security that they couldn't restrain him unless he was doing something criminal. She says security told her it was because of a 2008 Colorado law.
As a Colorado Springs resident, I sent the following letter to the News Director on the day the story aired:
As a local transgender activist, I was morbidly offended by your story about the man in the women's restroom at the mall. You are just stirring fear that a good law is not perfect. I would like the opportunity to educate you and your newstaff in regards to this law, so you can better educate the community.
First, I suggest you cover an opposite story, where the law was applied as intended. In July, I was ejected from a bar for using the restroom that matches my gender identity and my gender presentation, but not my driver's license. I live as a woman, I work as a woman, everyone knows me as a woman - but the evolving laws about ->-bleeped-<- are such that it's not feasible to change my driver's license. I'm female by state law, but not federal law. I could change my driver's license, but not my social security or bank information. To become female by federal law would require thousands of dollars in expenses for counseling that I don't need, that I would find onerous. I would have to prove to two doctors that I am transgender, and literally get their permission to be myself.
Colorado Springs police filed a complaint with the DA, seeking criminal charges against the bar that ejected me. Whether the DA follows through with the case is probably a news story in itself.
What I found so offensive in your coverage was that the story presented that the person in the restroom was "a man." Was this somebody who was genetically male, and dressed as a male? Or was this somebody who was presenting as female, that your complainant gendered as male? Because these are two entirely different situations, by common sense and by law.
It strikes me that simple questioning of the complainant could have illuminated this issue, to make your story more accurate..
Security forces are not prohibited from inquiring why someone is in a place where they might not belong. If this was indeed a man in the ladies room, as opposed to a transwoman - simple questioning may have determined this. "Are you female?" is a simple question. If the person answers "yes" that's the end of it. If the answer is "no," then the situation goes in another direction.
Let's take the worst-case scenario. A male pervert wants into the ladies room to molest somebody or violate their privacy. He lies, and claims a female gender identity. He could still be charged with felony sex crimes, and let the jury decide the facts of the case based on police investigation and expert testimony, the same as any other crime. Does the defendant have a criminal record? Does the defendant work as a woman, do people know him as a woman, has he sought counseling? Does he have a counselor to back up his claim, or does the police psychologist support his claim? Does he testify, and is his testimony convincing? These are all factors that a jury could consider when determining the facts of a given case, specifically, does the defendant have an innate sense of gender identity that is female, as he claims?
I have every confidence that, in a case like this, the justice system would send this worst-case offender to prison. Colorado Anti-Discrimination Law, and the affiliated regulations, do not give Get Out of Jail Free cards to sex offenders. However the law does give needed protections to an oppressed minority. Your story implies the former, but does not illuminate the latter. I think it was bad journalism and harmful to the community. I would like to see you attempt to amend that.
As yet, no reply.
I totally missed this news article. I'm glad you responded. I really like the letter; it sums things up quite well.
Let us know if they do ever get back to you.
Dana
Gina,
Thank you very much for your letter. I'm really pleased you are holding the media accountable for such appalling, for want of a better word, journalism. I'm confident if they were to take a completely different view of our community, there would be so many stories of heroics that they'd need at least 10 discovery channels to air the content. Perhaps too idealistic though. We don't live in Utopia.
The trials and tribulations of the so called 'normal' or gender compliant members of society; pail to absolute insignificance when compared to what what our community are subjected to on a personal basis. This journey is by no means a 'cake walk' for anyone. Truly it deserves the highest commendations and respect form all concerned.
Hope you get a thoughtful and positive reply. Here in Oz, a complaint of this type can be escalated to government licencing level that can impact on a broadcast providers licence. Although ACMA is a bit of a toothless tiger, there is some room to give the broadcaster some bad press.
Be safe, well and happy
Lotsa luv
Catherine
I grew up in Colorado springs and spent a lot of time at that mall. knowing the people down there im not really surprised.
I dont get tv of any kind so I'm glad I came across this here.
Or maybe the person was a very butch womyn .. many lesbians / women look just like men
Oh, no! Oh, by all that is holy, they're letting transwomen in the ladies' rooms of Colorado? And next to children's play places? Oh, the humanity!!! Let's summarize the tropes applied in this news article:
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/YouCanPanicNow (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/YouCanPanicNow)
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FreaksOfTheWeek (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FreaksOfTheWeek)
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PaedoHunt (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PaedoHunt)
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ThinkOfTheChildren (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ThinkOfTheChildren)
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AllGaysArePedophiles (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AllGaysArePedophiles)
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ActivistFundamentalistAntics (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ActivistFundamentalistAntics)
I'm sure there are more, but I believe I've hit the major ones.
Great letter! If you hear back from them please let us know what they say.
Julie
Well stated...I assume you havent heard back from them yet. Second, I wonder how many interviews they did? Is that the best they could come up with?
Journalism in this country is appalling. I recently read an article about a fire at a "eunuch convention" in India. Yeah. . . they didn't bother to do a little research and discover that they're not eunuchs, but are called hijra. Typical lazy American journalism.
Quote from: Amazon D on October 20, 2011, 06:58:45 AM
Or maybe the person was a very butch womyn .. many lesbians / women look just like men
That's what I was thinking... there's a really good chance that this "man" was just a masculine looking cis woman.
ETA: I doubt this is even a real news story. It's ridiculous. Omg there's a not very feminine looking person in the bathroom, ALERT THE MEDIA!!! It's ridiculous. Either it's a REALLY slow news day, the author of the article has a cissexist agenda to push, or a combination of both.
While I have reservations about the journalistic merits of the story, I can assure you it was regarded as a real story by the local media. The north end of town where Chapel Hills Mall is located is known for being highly Conservative. The west side of town, especially Old Colorado City, is much more openminded. I can easily believe that a "local" might have shared the restroom with a transwoman, "clocked" her, and dramatically overreacted. From what little I could glean, she was unaware of our fairly new "Bathroom Bill".
What I want to know are things that were not discussed in the article, such as: 1) as Gina pointed out, was this a man presenting as male, a very masculine ciswoman, or a transwoman presenting as female and failing to "pass" in this instance? 2) Was the person acting in any sort of intimidating or threatening way, or just minding her own business?
For that matter, could it have been a janitor? I certainly can't tell from the writeup or the video.
The article is lacking enough in facts that I would call it sensationalism more than journalism. Very disappointing to see from one of my "hometown" stations. *sigh*
Just as an aside,
What gender presentation are the people who change over the sanitary napkin disposal thingys in your area? Where I am it is mostly guys. They just go into the female loos and change them over. Doesn't matter if there is anyone in there at the time. If a stall is occupied they just wait until the person comes out and then changes over the unit.
I take it that this would be a journalistic scoop in some parts of the USA. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Cindy
I used to do some janitorial work when I was just out of high school. Most places just send in whoever on staff happens to be available. If the worker is (or seems to be) of the "opposite" gender for the bathroom, protocol is usually to knock loudly and call out "janitor". If no answer, try again. If still no answer, enter cautiously and call out one more time. If no answer and stalls all seem to be empty, proceed with cleaning.
Now, if it were a male janitor cleaning the women's bathroom and the woman using the facilities was unaware that he had entered (deaf, ipod turned up high, lost in thought, whatever), a situation like the one in the news article could easily arise... even though there is actually nothing inappropriate going on.
I think I've only encountered one place that I am aware of that made an effort to match workers to bathroom duty by gender. (That was years ago, I couldn't begin to tell you what place it was.)
The guys who look after the disposal units are from a private contractor and they just walk straight in. ;D
Quote from: Cindy James on December 22, 2011, 02:33:33 AM
Just as an aside,
What gender presentation are the people who change over the sanitary napkin disposal thingys in your area? Where I am it is mostly guys. They just go into the female loos and change them over. Doesn't matter if there is anyone in there at the time. If a stall is occupied they just wait until the person comes out and then changes over the unit.
I take it that this would be a journalistic scoop in some parts of the USA. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Cindy
OUTRAGEOUS!!!
;)
I'll remember that anecdote the next time I'm debating a nutter lol
A few months ago, I went into the wrong restroom by mistake in a small airport away from home, sat on a toilet, did my business (not knowing I was in the wrong place and not letting the sanitary napkin dispenser alert me to my mistake!), went to a sink, washed up, and saw a very confused lady on my way out (when I saw her go in, I looked back and realized my mistake!).
Nobody would mistake me for a woman. I'm glad she didn't scream, call the cops, etc (this was a state not as enlightened as Colorado) - it truly was an honest mistake that quite embarrassed me (I was very glad she wasn't waiting for the same plane!). I suspect I'm not the first man who has accidentally done their business in a woman's room, nor do I suspect I'll be the last. I also suspect I would be uncomfortable if a man, in the men's room, started peaking under the stall at me - the problem isn't the gender of the pervert, but their acts.
But the original article is talking about the home of Focus on the Family and associated other anti-gay organizations (like the front group that did the Amendment 2 hate), so I'm not terribly surprised by it.
I just try and stick to the one seaters and enter the bathroom I feel most comfortable at that particular time because within the same five minutes one person will call me ma'am and the person right next to them will call me sir. If their is a family restroom I use that one. I try to avoid the restroom either male or female that are multiple occupentcy because I feel that I could get into trouble either way. Somebody is going to say I am in the wrong rest room. I have had clerks direct me to the ladies room when I try and go in the men's some times. I figure that the more I am around and people see me constantly presenting as female the more I will be accepted as one at a glance.
??? That's very weird...and very scary I might add!
Hi,
I know this case goes back a while . any way is it a man or a woman...try this then im intersexed now what the issues is & not addresed is it, ,
Theres quite a few of us who are intersexed im one of those. in my case a intersexed woman. who has male facial features, & what has happened though the two people concerned did not know ,
one i pointed out i was in fact a woman when i told her she was taken aback...... oh dear a ooops , thank you.
she will have no dought been told & read my profile from her boss's concerning people like us, no big deal . i am very public & seen by many 1000's of people, toilets swimming pools & the like, so with out knowing or info on people one does not allways know if ...we.... are in fact woman , because im well known theres very few problems .
...noeleena...
There are people who when they see something that does not fit their notion of propriety will make a complaint. Bathroom door says women, I am a woman, the rest room is for women like me, end of discussion. You look like a man, you don't look like a woman, this place is for women like me, I am going to file a complaint. End of story. You don't belong. What's you say there a Federal Law which says that you can be here. What law, I don't see one posted. You don't belong here. I am going to the manager. If the manager holds that the complaintent is always right, the manager calls the police and files a criminal complaint. If the police officer who arrives always agrees with the manager, the police officer takes the manager's complaint and halls you off to the police station. You say there's a Federal Law that says you can be in the Woman's rest room. Let the feds enforces it, its not the law in this jurisdiction. You are arrested and have to hire a lawyer to defend your rights and spend lots and lots of money. All of this happens because you were not what one woman considered a woman and down the line everyone felt obligated to agree with her because she made a complaint. Many times this is how things happen. The farther you go up the legal chain the less likely they will ever admit a mistake even if they drop the charges and wipe the whole incident from your record. But every time after you have to file a job application and you come to the question, "Have you ever been arrested for ...?" You will pause and wince and check . . . !
Every time I go into the women's rest room and every time I go into the men's restroom that are not one seaters, this kind of scenario goes through my head because I do not look like some men's idea of a man. Some man may bellow, " There's a woman in the men's room. I am going to complain with the same results as above.