So early this morning, I was freezing my butt off with my step sister in front of Khole's (or however you spell it) waiting for it to open at 1 a.m. We had no money and no motive for doing it. We're weird like that. So anyways, we waited for three hours in the cold, and then finally got let in. I was binding with suspenders, but was still not confident in my passing, though I had been called Sir and young man earlier in the evening.
I went to the women's room and did my business and was waiting for Kiley to be done when these two ladies came in.
women 1: This is the WOMEN'S room I hope. *looking at me*
women 2: Yes this is the WOMEN'S ROOM.
me: *blushing furiously, but not wanting to leave so it seemed like I was being a creep that knew they were doing something wrong*
Both women got done with the bathroom and walked out, and one said this "You shouldn't be in here unless you're under 3." Obviously directed at me.
That's the last time I'm using a lady's bathroom in public. Most awkward experience of my life.
I'd call that an EPIC WIN! and yea, i can imagine how awkward that would feel.
A similar thing happened to me when I had to use the women's room in America. Here in Adelaide, most places have disabled toilets so I use those or the men's room. Of course, you can also get looks for using the disabled toilet when you're not in a wheelchair, but it's better than getting remarks from ladies in the women's! Sorry you got groused at, mate. Not fun.
Epic win for sure. Does make it hard when you're younger tho to feel ok to use the mens room. I would think its time to switch. I did when I started getting strange looks and comments. I still would rather use a neutral bathroom if I can. Mostly cause my son has to pick the worst times to yell mom at me.
I've never seen a gender neutral bathroom in public. We don't have them where I live. Instead, all men's and women's restrooms have a stall for disabled people as well as a diaper change area. I'm androgynous enough that I'll get strange looks from women no matter which I go in. I seriously had a woman make snide comments at me the last time I went in a men's room. None of the men cared, just some lady who observed me walking in there.
This past week I was on a road trip with my mom. We stopped at a fast food place in Texas. The majority of the time we were in the place, no one was in either restroom. Being paranoid, I still went ahead and went in the women's room. Just my luck, two women had walked in right after me. One went 'oh my god!' when I turned around to close the stall door. The whole rest of the time, she kept shooting glances at me and then whispering to her friend. They'll probably just think that I was some weird lesbian, but that doesn't matter, because I'll never see them again. And you know what, you'll probably never see those women again either. In the brief moment that you saw them, they confirmed that you pass perfectly. Their discomfort was your gain. Good job! :)
haha, that's a cool way to put it. There aren't a lot of gender neutral bathrooms around here either. :/ Women always seem to be the ones talking crap when it comes to clothes, bathrooms, or generally caring about one's gender.
It is usually the women. I wonder why that is? It might have some to do with the guy code of not talking or making eye contact kinda thing in the men's room.
Now that you're not just a man, but a manly man, it's time to move on to mens room basics. :P
Male Restroom Etiquette (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzO1mCAVyMw#)
That video was hilarious. xD
But they do apply to the real world. Mostly. It all goes to crap in the movie theatre as 60 guys rush to the 5 urinals and 4 stalls after a movie. in which case, your best bet is to just wait outside until the rush does down. way less chance of some perv trying to take a peek at your junk too. And men are really paranoid about that.
But i hope it helps you out. ^_^
So guys only use the stalls if they're taking a dump?
Quote from: Wesley_33 on November 25, 2011, 10:11:23 PM
It is usually the women. I wonder why that is? It might have some to do with the guy code of not talking or making eye contact kinda thing in the men's room.
I think it has something to do with the perceived threat of a man in such a private place as a bathroom. Women learn in this society to be hyper-aware of the danger men pose and the ->-bleeped-<- they can do (rape, etc). At least, that's what I learned. :-\
I get looks when I go into women's bathrooms sometimes. It sucks, but I don't really blame them. I just wish more places had gender-neutral restrooms.
EDIT: also, I meant to add -- congrats on passing, dude. :D that's horribly awkward, but it's also a success~
Quote from: Bradd on November 25, 2011, 10:52:22 PM
So guys only use the stalls if they're taking a dump?
I wondered about this too, actually :P
Quote from: Bradd on November 25, 2011, 10:52:22 PM
So guys only use the stalls if they're taking a dump?
Usually. but if the urinals are full, you use a stall. But if you just have to pee, stand, dont sit, unless you are going to do more than pee. Then its ok to pee while sitting. I've seen guys close the stall door or leave them open while they do their business. Must be a comfort/cultural thing.
Mmmhmm, Thats right Boys, there's more to using a restroom than "p***ing in a pot." :P
I get the feeling I started something here... Has no one ever wondered about bathroom ettiquete on here? I mean I didnt mean to hijack your thread and I'm certainly not trying to. But if I can help you guys pass better then I'm always willing to help.
I used a men's room when I guess I wasn't really passing (although wearing the same stuff, I'd gotten The Look in a women's room), because the women's room had a really huge line. Found a small line in the men's, too, and the guy waiting in front of me looked at me and asked something like was I sure I got the right one? I just turned and looked at the wall, not wanting to look at anyone else whether they were using a urinal or not, certainly wasn't going to say anything back, until something was free and ran into the stall - it was a pretty small bathroom. Only time I've ever run into a talking man that wasn't my gay co-worker that recognized my shoes when the women's was out of order one night, but that may be because I tend to only go in when they're completely unoccupied.
Quote from: Keaira on November 25, 2011, 11:16:18 PM
Usually. but if the urinals are full, you use a stall. But if you just have to pee, stand, dont sit, unless you are going to do more than pee. Then its ok to pee while sitting. I've seen guys close the stall door or leave them open while they do their business. Must be a comfort/cultural thing.
Mmmhmm, Thats right Boys, there's more to using a restroom than "p***ing in a pot." :P
I get the feeling I started something here... Has no one ever wondered about bathroom ettiquete on here? I mean I didnt mean to hijack your thread and I'm certainly not trying to. But if I can help you guys pass better then I'm always willing to help.
haha I don't mind it got a little off topic. I've wondered about bathroom etiquette but I could never find anything but "Don't look people in the eye blah blah blah"
I'm glad I'm not the only one who has had these type of experiences, now I know I'm not alone on this. There seems to be plenty of awkward to go around. When I was in an airport after being on a long flight I needed to use the bathroom, but being with my family who aren't accepting at all I had to use the women's restroom, in any other case I would have searched for a gender neutral one. As soon as I walked in a lady started telling me "this is the women's room" and trying to indicate that I did in fact require something other than a urinal in order to pee, I said "Yes ma'am." She then continued to explain to me that the men's restroom was in the next door, so I decided to spare the embarrassing, walk out and pretend I accidentally walked into the wrong one, and then just wait to go at the hotel. Of course, as I'm walking out, my mom starts walking in...cue the more awkward. That's when I realized that I wouldn't be able to walk away without my mom asking questions and getting suspicious, so I had to stay in line hoping the lady would understand that perhaps I did, in fact, have a vagina, and was there to pee on purpose. As my mom got in line I was like "oh, hi mom" and my mom greeted me with my birth name, and, hoping that would end the awkward as the lady got the hint, it actually didn't...instead the lady started saying "OOOOH! I thought you were a boy!" over and over again then asking "Wait, you are a girl? Oh! I thought you were a boy before!"
Probably couldn't have been much more awkward and embarrassing, and that entire situation would have been avoided if my mom was even remotely accepting and would have allowed me to search for a gender neutral restroom or use the men's room.
I've actually heard a similar story with an unaccepting mother. So it seems that your experience is somewhat common, sadly.
But yea, you have a forum that is a virtual no-holds barred of information on experiences and information, where the girls can give you the inside scoop on living as a guy and vice versa. Take advantage of it. ;)
When this started happening to me a lot is when I switched to the men's room. It's been a few months, I don't pack or stp, I always use the stall, I don't talk to people (except nod if I know the person), and I've never had any problems. Even if somebody thinks I'm weird or the wrong gender or up to something funny in the stall, I doubt it'll cause the consternation it causes in the women's room.
I do still try to find single-stall or gender neutral bathrooms when possible.
@Keaira the bathroom thing tends to get discussed pretty often in person when I see trans people get together. It's a pretty big stressor for most people who aren't solidly on one or the other side of their transition.
Berger that airport scenario sounds like a nightmare, but I just wanted to say that you're a great storyteller. ;D
And I really hope your family lets up on you.
Two odd stories, I'll end with a happy one.
Once upon a time there was a little boy in his art class who needed to pee. So he asked his teacher, who thank god was a sub, because he is super paranoid about teachers popping out to check to see he's using the "right bathroom" because they are utterly convinced he will be raped in the men's room (my principal actually said that to me). He skipped off to the loo, oh crap some dude's at one of the two urinals. No choice but to use a stall, confoundit. Realized halfway through shutting the door that the guy was a freshman in my art class. When I went back, the class seemed quiet for a bit, then everyone sort of erupted in laughter. :embarrassed: I am so paranoid, I thought maybe the freshman said something, even though he's "he'd" me a lot.
When I was 3, I had my surname changed. My mother never took the court order to my social security, birth certificate, etc., so the change didn't actually take place in some weird alternate universe. We were at the court house finding out what needed to be done, and I was debating on whether or not it was okay to use the bathroom, considering I was with my unaccepting, "plug-my-ears-and-go-la-la-la" grandma. I kinda decided too late; I was walking to the other side of the building and my mom and grandma were going to the car. Turns out my dad had to go, too -- ohwhatfun! I thought about using a urinal just to mess with his head, but I was nervous and was afraid he'd out me before I touched the door latch. I kicked the door open (I don't know why I always do that) and headed for a stall, and he came in shortly after. No words. A couple of days later we were talking about my plans for transition, and he just says, "Your mom's probably always gonna be weird about it. Hell, I used the bathroom four feet away from my daughter -- IN THE MEN'S ROOM! And that was so weird, so awkward, but I don't care. It's you."
For some reason, people always get weird at me for not using the urinal. I like to think I follow EXTREME PEE-SHY RULES. Only use the urinal if no one else is in, and cease fire when the door creaks open just a little bit, even if it was only the wind. o3o~!
Quote from: Felix on November 26, 2011, 03:13:45 AM
@Keaira the bathroom thing tends to get discussed pretty often in person when I see trans people get together. It's a pretty big stressor for most people who aren't solidly on one or the other side of their transition.
I can understand. Since we are all sharing, I have a few stories of my own I'd like to share.
Shortly after I told HR at work that I was on hormones and intending to transition, I was called to my HR rep's office. Word had spread and now I was making some of the guys kind of nervous about the bathroom. So I was actually asked if I wouldn't mind using the women's restroom. I would have full company backing. I told them if I do that, I'm going full time. Everyone knew about me anyway so I thought 'what the hey.'
So I went full time 2 months into my transition. Management was told to address me as Keaira, I was now a female employee, and even the nametags on my uniform shirts had my new name on. Of course there were some women who were pretty upset. And one of my friend's told me about the protesting. I sat in a break area outside crying my eyes out over it. I didn't want to start WW3. But my friend told me to just ignore them. It was just the 'Hen's clucking.'
Even now, I get into the bathroom and out as fast as I possibly can, but as I'm adjusting and others are, I'm not so nervous anymore. But I look back at that meeting and how screwed up that was. How many HR reps would as an MtF to please use the ladies room?
When I took my son to see the Transformers DOTM movie, I went in guy mode, just because I was with my son and I really didn't want to create a drama there. But when the movie ended, I froze. across from me was the women's room, barely in use. and the bathroom at the movie theater I mentioned earlier? That was the day. I had to go, really badly and there were so many guys in there and I felt so trapped and in the wrong place I about had a panic attack. I had to get out and wait for them to all leave. Now, I go shopping as me. And use the women's restroom. So far, no one has doubted my presence there or told me I was in the wrong restroom.
Although many months back when I was still living as a male, When I was coming out of the Walmart men's room by the check-outs, I did see and overhear 2 women talking about me. one was saying "I thought that was a girl." as she was looking at me. The other lady agreed with her. All I could think was "Just wait til HRT. then you'll really be confused."
And you are right Felix about the bathrooms being a topic of great discussion. At my last PFLAG meeting, an MtF who..umm.. I dont know how to say this without sounding mean or condescending or anything... She doesn't appear to put any effort into appearing female. But she's been on HRT since the 90's. She asked me if I used the women's room at work.
I didn't think anything of it and said "of course. why?"
She looked at me like my head turned into a fireball!
"And you don't have any problems from other women?"
Again I shrugged. 8 months along I think everyone has figured out I'm not going to just hide in a corner somewhere. "No, not really. I mean there's been talk about it but that's all. I even used the one's in Walmart last week."
Again, my head caught fire, only with a deeper intensity. by now I was beginning to think I looked like Ghost Rider.
She said "I've been fired for using the women's restroom, everywhere I go it's been an issue."
It was pretty sad to hear but at the same time, I could understand why people who didn't know her reacted the way the way they do. they just saw a guy who maybe stuffed a bra full of socks walking into their territory. And it was hard to stand there and be quiet. She could probably cut down a lot of the negativity towards her if she just made an effort to blend in.
Anyway, those are my 'Tales from the Loo.'
QuoteShe asked me if I used the women's room at work.
I didn't think anything of it and said "of course. why?"
She looked at me like my head turned into a fireball!
LOL :laugh:
I can't imagine transitioning and then permanently continuing to use the bathroom of your birth-assigned sex. That lady must have a really hard life. Odd that she'd think the right solution was to present as female and use male restrooms, though.
Kind of awesome that HR took the initiative in encouraging your on-the-job transition. That is definitely not usually in the script. XD
Quote from: Bradd on November 25, 2011, 10:52:22 PM
So guys only use the stalls if they're taking a dump?
Na guys use the stalls for a lot of resons, pee shy or they dont like using the urinal.....they wont give u weird looks or so if u acted funny or if u look at them, just hold ur head up high walk in confidence walk into a stall, out, wash hand and then out u go, no eye contact or any talking, then u be fine.
if u walk in all packly or scared they might look at u and think :s
i never had any problems and yeah i was scared they might look or so but i hide it and just went in and did what i need to do....if it full wait outside or find somewher else and try again.
i mean as much as that must have sucked at the time, if your getting strange reactions in the women's room it means a pass. i wish i could say that, all i get is a couple awkward looks from time to time. i just try to go when no one is in there kind of deal.
Quote from: rexyrex on November 26, 2011, 11:26:00 AM
Na guys use the stalls for a lot of resons, pee shy or they dont like using the urinal.....they wont give u weird looks or so if u acted funny or if u look at them, just hold ur head up high walk in confidence walk into a stall, out, wash hand and then out u go, no eye contact or any talking, then u be fine.
if u walk in all packly or scared they might look at u and think :s
i never had any problems and yeah i was scared they might look or so but i hide it and just went in and did what i need to do....if it full wait outside or find somewher else and try again.
I agree here. I figure people just assume I'm pee shy or self conscious. For all they know I might have a medical problem or something. Also, my last boyfriend was cis and at home he sits to pee as often as he stands.
One time I was at a restaurant and had to use the bathroom, they were small two-stall bathrooms and I walk in and some lady is at the sink and she goes "This is the women's room..." and I had a thousand thoughts race through my head I didn't know what to do so I was just dumbly like ".....yeah....." and went in the stall haha. AWKWARD.
I have been using the men's room almost all the time and just go in with confidence and walk into a stall and sit to pee. I have had noone look at me any differently that I know of. Guys say so little in there anyway, which is great for me as my voice is not real deep yet. I wish I could pee at an urinal as that look so neat to pee through a fly and not have to get partially undressed everytime.
been using the men's room for quite a while....last week i went for a stall and some guy (in his 40s) shouted "what you think they have urinals for??" as i started peeing oO so that was the only scary moment really.
before i switched, girls would regularly walk back out and look at the sign on the door. one time a guy followed me into the girls bathroom because he just expected that the bathroom i went in was the guys' bathroom.
I've gotten looks before in the women's restroom. I've also had the awkward, "This is the WOMEN'S restroom" (I love how they always emphasize the word women's and say it louder like you're restarted or something) thing before.
I usually try to scope out the "neutral" restrooms. They are few and far between though ... a few restaurants ... the Trader Joe's ... the occasional one in the mall for handicap. Every time I go into the women's restroom I usually just keep my head down and make a b-line for a stall ... unless of course there's a line ... which there often is. If there's a line I just try to look down at the floor or anywhere to not make eye contact with anyone in there.
As for the men's room. I usually avoid that too. Too many people take me as female for me to get away with it consistently. But I do know that plenty of men use the stalls. One of my friends won't use a urinal at all - just always goes for the stall. My other half will only stand to piss when out and about - at home he always sits. So there's a lot of variation going on there with other men and toilet habits.
I've gotten the same sorta thing in the desperate times where I've actually needed to use the bathroom so badly while I've been out that I use a public one, but now I try and find a disabled toilet which is usually never occupied. I live in an area where people are quite obnoxious when it comes to others who they do not perceive to be normal, and I've been given a lot of dirty looks when I used the female toilets.
Actually, the area where I live, people are kind of obnoxious enough to stand and look at me and laugh, or say "ew" or "what the ****" (even out of car windows when I walk home, not so much recently, but long before I started T) which is partly why I'd love to move. I never feel comfortable in my surrounding suburbs. :D
Quote from: Morgan (138) on November 26, 2011, 08:00:52 PMI never feel comfortable in my surrounding suburbs. :D
Suburbs scare the crap out of me no matter where they are. :icon_weirdface:
Not really related, but my daughter and I had someone yell out a car window at us today. It seemed pretty totally pointless, and the best I could figure was that it was some after-thanksgiving drunk.
Quote from: Morgan (138) on November 26, 2011, 08:00:52 PM
Actually, the area where I live, people are kind of obnoxious enough to stand and look at me and laugh, or say "ew" or "what the ****" (even out of car windows when I walk home, not so much recently, but long before I started T) which is partly why I'd love to move. I never feel comfortable in my surrounding suburbs. :D
What a polite place you live in. ::) Jeez, some people...
Don't worry about being pee-shy (this thread seemed to turn into that?). My cismale housemate can only use a stall, he physically can't pee if he's at a urinal. Once we went out to a club, and the bathroom only had one stall, with someone in it. So he waited, and waited, and waited... eventually a guy came out, but there was another guy kneeling on the floor. Before my housemate knew what to do, another guy pushed past and, well, took his turn, I guess.
He ended up waiting about an hour for that guy to stop sucking other guys off. We visit classy places.
You have to take people directing you out of the women's with a sense of humour, but it's hard. In the UK I use the women's exclusively, but get a lot of stares, jumps and "oh... sorry..."s. It gets really old.
I don't know if I'm the only one who does this, but I actually kinda re-adjust my binder so I actually look more feminine when I use the female toilets to avoid confrontation. S: It makes me feel really uncomfortable, but I'm still scared ->-bleeped-<-less (excuse the bad pun) of using male toilets.
I hardly get any any crap from people in Australia actually, people stare, but they just go on with their business. But in Asia I seemed to pass 99% of the time, and I got a few 'Are you sure you're in the right toilets?' and it was pretty horrible.
Last year I went to china for the first time, and the worst thing was, most of their toilets are either disgustingly dirty, or have no doors/broken doors, or just plain see through ones. So even when I did go into the male stalls sometimes, they can kinda make out the shape of you sitting down to take a piss. S: THe worst thing was the fact that there was 3 people in line directly outside the door, it was horrrribble.
Lawlz.
I loved that video - just going to say- and wholeheartedly appreciated that it was done with Sims.
;p
I never use the mens' room because I don't pass and because my only stp is the top of a 16 oz soda bottle which I use at home. But when te\he line is long, I just use the guys' bathroom and if asked I say "Have you seen the line out there? Women take forever." or something to that effect and no one cares. Another fear of transitioning: Using a passable STP in the mens' room.
A big win? I wanted to try on a mens' dress shirt at Wal Mart. I was escorted to the mens' side. The same night at another store, i wanted to try on a different mens' dress shirt (long story but i was picky) and was escorted to the womens' room.
Country Boy-
I'm thinking about getting the Peecock soon, but I don't know how well that passes in public. However, I am pretty handy with an stp device, so it might end up working better for me than most. I dunno. I've heard the Peecock was one of the more functional "stp packers" out right now, but there are plenty of others. I'm not sure if you already know about all that jazz or not though.
I have seen a few but the part you pee in before it goes into the packer seems too small
Actually, it's not. You just need to know how to position it. Have you seen most of these?
http://transguys.com/features/stp (http://transguys.com/features/stp)
http://www.ftmguide.org/bathroom.html (http://www.ftmguide.org/bathroom.html)
They are good references.
Personally, I use a medicine spoon style most of the time, though I have others.
It's one of the smaller stp styles and it's always worked best for me out of what I have tried.
I'm hoping I'm going to be capable of using a urinal soon enough though.
xD
I think the peecock sucks huge. I've voiced on that in other threads but yeah it sucks.
Jason yes some stp are to small for some of us to use. Its more than a matter of position. Some of us pee more, larger flow, than others.
I think if there were non gender bathrooms all over life would be so much easier. Not fair we have to go threw so much stress just to pee. Or we will go threw the day not drinking just to avoid bathrooms. We all should be free to pee!!! Talking about it now I need to go :o
I could definitely make one and I think I know which one I could buy but I have to wait til I get money and another job. There are a lot of gender neutral bathrooms here because of small stores and such so it wouldn't be hard. Finding a job however... ugh
I just dont want to end up [eeing on myself.
Quote from: CountryBoy120390 on December 16, 2011, 10:25:08 AM
Another fear of transitioning: Using a passable STP in the mens' room.
You don't have to use an STP in the bathroom. You can sit to pee. I only sit because I haven't found an STP yet that works with my anatomy and no one has said anything yet.
Quote from: Wesley_33 on December 16, 2011, 03:17:35 PM
Jason yes some stp are to small for some of us to use. Its more than a matter of position. Some of us pee more, larger flow, than others.
I find that for me because I'm so heavy set it's hard to position STPs correctly to my bits.
Quote from: Andy8715 on December 16, 2011, 07:39:54 PM
You don't have to use an STP in the bathroom. You can sit to pee. I only sit because I haven't found an STP yet that works with my anatomy and no one has said anything yet.
;)
In each and every normal men's room there is some normal toilet. If not... that is the question.I mostly use women's room because I often go out with girl friends and sometimes I follow them by holding their bags, coats - then it's my turn, they hold mine. I usually go the main library, and with girl friends I visit women's, by myself men's... others look like so confused but I don't mind. I was many times told to go out, but I didn't listen to those women. ;D Just don't give a sh... (sorry ::) )
If there is some normal "device", just use that! Even my father told me he hates public toilets, that so called stalls so he does not use them. My gay friends told me some of them pee by sitting just because it's more comfortable for them. After all, said that even men can sit, guess when. :)
Once it happened that I was a bit dizzy and as it was new to me, so I tried the men's room if maybe... Well, it contained two stalls. For God's sake, it was so awkward: I tried to came out to correct the error, but a drunk buddy and his buddy pushed me back with some "Are you some ->-bleeped-<-? Come on, pee, my bladder's full..." Somehow I could run out, into the women's.
I gotta admit that was waaay the worst pub I've ever been to...