So far as I can see.. Only Masha and I were gay men before we transitioned... It looks like everyone else was a heterosexual man and lots of you folks have children as well.
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:15:02 PM
So far as I can see.. Only Masha and I were gay men before we transitioned... It looks like everyone else was a heterosexual man and lots of you folks have children as well.
Some would say Mahsa is still a gay man. LOL. Seriously, a ton of people here have called me that because of my associations with the culture, the fact that I have no plans for srs and am a non op, or my interests in makeup/hair/fashion. You know actually not wearing makeup or doing hair makes someone "->-bleeped-<-r than thou" here... LOL LOL
But I've found any topics about gay men, DQs or transgender performers are off limits on this board. I did a post saying how DQs could provide valuable info to TS women and got flamed.... Many people here have said that DQs are an act mocking women, etc....
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 04:16:30 PM
Some would say Mahsa is still a gay man. LOL. Seriously, a ton of people here have called me that because of my associations with the culture, the fact that I have no plans for srs and am a non op, or my interests in makeup/hair/fashion. You know actually not wearing makeup or doing hair makes someone "->-bleeped-<-r than thou" here... LOL LOL
But I've found any topics about gay men, DQs or transgender performers are off limits on this board. I did a post saying how DQs could provide valuable info to TS women and got flamed.... Many people here have said that DQs are an act mocking women, etc....
Non-op? You are not on hormones?
Really? I did discuss homosexuality here on the forums before.
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:22:53 PM
Non-op? You are not on hormones?
Been on hormones 26 months.
I used to look like this:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-snc6%2F190000_197221146967185_100000379048523_585351_2080566_n.jpg&hash=968b94861465ff30e6b11c2231c1989c59f2809e)
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 04:16:30 PM
Some would say Mahsa is still a gay man. LOL. Seriously, a ton of people here have called me that because of my associations with the culture, the fact that I have no plans for srs and am a non op, or my interests in makeup/hair/fashion. You know actually not wearing makeup or doing hair makes someone "->-bleeped-<-r than thou" here... LOL LOL
but you just said you were non-op?
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:29:16 PM
but you just said you were non-op?
Yeah, I don't want the surgery. I am still on hormones.
i dont know why DQ's would be flammed? I was a straight male and now a lesbian. My close dq friends have tought me everything i ever needed to know about makeup. The tricks for hiding beard shadow works wonderfully. Who wouldve thought Clown white from the costume store for .99 would be better than high dollar concealer. I have even got on stage a few times and danced, i had a blast doing it. I do not consider myself even remotley a queen but i deffinatly value their opinioin.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1129.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm515%2FMandy_Dawn1%2Fphoto.jpg&hash=c6a0cb1bb08a60dec9804d59e8d05d1d0377d650)
me "queen'd" up for a show.... just my .02 worth
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 04:16:30 PM
Some would say Mahsa is still a gay man. LOL. Seriously, a ton of people here have called me that because of my associations with the culture, the fact that I have no plans for srs and am a non op, or my interests in makeup/hair/fashion. You know actually not wearing makeup or doing hair makes someone "->-bleeped-<-r than thou" here... LOL LOL
But I've found any topics about gay men, DQs or transgender performers are off limits on this board. I did a post saying how DQs could provide valuable info to TS women and got flamed.... Many people here have said that DQs are an act mocking women, etc....
This made me sad too. It seems like a lot of potentially useful threads on here get derailed with hate.
My best friend came from the gay community, she says the men she was with allways new she wasn't gay and was a woman. So whether she was really a gay man or just a confused transsexual is up in the air .
Huggs
Emily
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 04:26:25 PM
Been on hormones 26 months.
I used to look like this:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-snc6%2F190000_197221146967185_100000379048523_585351_2080566_n.jpg&hash=968b94861465ff30e6b11c2231c1989c59f2809e)
Except for the hair, you still look the same.
Quote from: Jen61 on December 04, 2011, 04:59:14 PM
Except for the hair, you still look the same.
Can we get a
DUH lmao
Really now?
Quote from: Emily Ray on December 04, 2011, 04:57:12 PM
My best friend came from the gay community, she says the men she was with allways new she wasn't gay and was a woman. So whether she was really a gay man or just a confused transsexual is up in the air .
Huggs
Emily
I've had relationships with 2 girls, and both of them told me that being with me was like being with a girl. One of them I never came out to, the other I did after she told me this.
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 04:26:25 PM
Been on hormones 26 months.
I used to look like this:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-snc6%2F190000_197221146967185_100000379048523_585351_2080566_n.jpg&hash=968b94861465ff30e6b11c2231c1989c59f2809e)
Omg my gayradar would crash!
I think u make a wonderfoull woman, while u did an incomplete man.
Being op or non op is also a matter of confidence with sex... So it doesnt change who u are now!!!
I was, and am still :( , a repressed gay man, does it counts?
I was a gay man! I was just really bad at it. :laugh:
Quote from: Jen61 on December 04, 2011, 04:59:14 PM
Except for the hair, you still look the same.
On a second analysis, you look much older now. It is like the bags under your eyes, they make you look older and tired
Quote from: Jen61 on December 04, 2011, 05:11:31 PM
On a second analysis, you look much older now. It is like the bags under your eyes, they make you look older and tired
You're replyin to your own quotes? Ohkay....thats pretty awesome.
Keep talkin to yourself... LOL
I look forward to seeing more conversations with yourself...
Btw Jen61, if you're attempting to piss me off...stop. I enjoy fighting and have a high tolerance for bull->-bleeped-<-. I didn't do crap to you.
I was a gay guy.. I just never felt the need to mention it. Although it does bring back some kinda happy memories from my early 20's..
This should be grounds for interesting research... comparing transgender women who used to be gay men vs those who used to be straight men.
I think one advantage (especially for me) is that I already had a built-in support system from the LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender) community when I transitioned. The people around me was already open minded.
Often times I notice that transgender women who used to be straight men tend to find it hard to find support from people around them because for the most part, they hang out with heterosexual people.
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 05:30:13 PM
Often times I notice that transgender women who used to be straight men tend to find it hard to find support from people around them because for the most part, they hang out with heterosexual people.
I lost all my straight guy friends after high school once I embraced the gay male stuff. Something about me being gay and not wanting to pick up on them. So I hung out with girls....
Imagine being a transsexual lesbian who has bros for friends and partakes in masculine culture. You're no longer one of the guys after you transition and most bros are less than tolerant over that stuff.
Mahsa and Jen, hey. Even if yall hurting each other was okay (which it isn't), I want to remind you both that it's hurtful to uninvolved bystanders when we see loaded and vicious comments about a person's appearance or posting habits. Please try to be nice.
I was a bisexual man before transition so i was attracted to both sex's but to be honest i've always liked men better. Some of the women i dated said they were attracted to my feminine side yet others said they didn't like it cuz they felt like they had to compete with me over who's the girl in the relationship. I enjoyed being in a relationship with a man more but didn't identify as gay man, i felt like a chick and i would pretend i was his girlfriend even though i knew that's not how he saw me.
I have recieved FAR MORE support from the straight community then the gay community.Gay men inparticular dont understand or want to understand. Most lesbians have been noresponive. While EVERY cisgirl is loving and supportive.....Good ol redneck southern indiana i guess.
I'm only into men but I'm pre transition. A lot of people I associate with right now treat me pretty much like a straight female even though I present as male.
EDIT: Mind you, a straight female until it comes to who is asking me out or flirting with me, then they treat me like a gay guy.
Quote from: mandyh92 on December 04, 2011, 05:53:59 PM
I have recieved FAR MORE support from the straight community then the gay community.Gay men inparticular dont understand or want to understand. Most lesbians have been noresponive. While EVERY cisgirl is loving and supportive.....Good ol redneck southern indiana i guess.
Really? I find that incredible to believe. Usually the assaults and violence on trangsender people come from heterosexual people.
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:15:02 PM
So far as I can see.. Only Masha and I were gay men before we transitioned... It looks like everyone else was a heterosexual man and lots of you folks have children as well.
I don't think I was much of anything. I've always been attracted to girls, but I was 24 the first time I was with anyone and she'd known I was a trans girl for over a year. That's the only relationship I've had, and the only one I will have till I'm post-op.
I don't really get why people obsess over drawing connections between sexuality and transsexualism.
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 06:26:40 PM
Really? I find that incredible to believe. Usually the assaults and violence on trangsender people come from heterosexual people.
CISFemales are curious and helpful and often give me advise. I have never in 12 months had an issue..No of course i get the 14-20yr old little girl snickers now and then but i ignore those. And if any men have outed me then i am not aware of it. Gay males constantly refer to me as a crossdresser and that is by my drag queen friends. Every gay man i have talked with is either like "Why would you want to do that to yourself?" or "Cant' you just live as a crossdresser why do you need surgery?". Lesbians are not mean but let it be known that they are not interested in me.
I don't want to take sides here, but I can say that I get as much confusion and rejection from the gay community as from heteros, and it hurts more (to me) coming from queers.
That is true... some gay people are no better than heterosexual people in discriminating and rejecting transgender people, but they usually will not assault or harm you.
That is one of the few reasons I prefer going to gay bars/clubs than straight ones, because I do not have to worry about potential assault if a straight man hits on me and finds out that I am transgender., especially if he is drunk.
However, I have had few pretty wild one-night stands from straight bars, but I consider myself very fortunate that they did not harm me when I revealed my "->-bleeped-<- surprise".
I identified as a gay male for a while, then as bi as I'd fallen in love with a woman... until eventually realizing that I was actually trans. Interestingly, my gay male lovers seemed to know about me not being male long before I figured it out.
Z
Quote from: Zythyra on December 04, 2011, 07:58:16 PM
I identified as a gay male for a while, then as bi as I'd fallen in love with a woman... until eventually realizing that I was actually trans. Interestingly, my gay male lovers seemed to know about me not being male long before I figured it out.
Z
I feel like such an idiot when I think back to how many people knew I was male before I did. Or tbh after I did and before I did again. I spent some time in denial.
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 05:00:41 PM
Can we get a DUH lmao
Really now?
i guess some people equate changing gender to morphing into an entirely different human being. it's really a good thing that you look the same. that just means you were more female looking from the start. it was the same for me, but the only problem is, people can remember me and judge me. so, if someone wants to look entirely different, try "face off."
Quote from: FullMoon19 on December 04, 2011, 08:26:28 PM
i guess some people equate changing gender to morphing into an entirely different human being. it's really a good thing that you look the same. that just means you were more female looking from the start. it was the same for me, but the only problem is, people can remember me and judge me. so, if someone wants to look entirely different, try "face off."
I look the same. People who knew me as female are all what the hell you didn't change anything at all, and people who didn't know me as female are all congratulations on transforming yourself, you don't look at all like a girl. Lol.
I agree, looking similar to yourself in your former presentation-gender is a good thing.
Quote from: Felix on December 04, 2011, 08:00:35 PM
I feel like such an idiot when I think back to how many people knew I was male before I did. Or tbh after I did and before I did again. I spent some time in denial.
Ah yes, denial... the river is deep and the river is wide!
Z
Never was gay, but funny story, when I told my dad that I was trans, he was like "whew, I thought you were going to tell me you were gay there for a minute." He was actually relieved that I was trans instead.
Quote from: Felix on December 04, 2011, 08:35:43 PM
I look the same. People who knew me as female are all what the hell you didn't change anything at all, and people who didn't know me as female are all congratulations on transforming yourself, you don't look at all like a girl. Lol.
I agree, looking similar to yourself in your former presentation-gender is a good thing.
people hold bias when it comes to gender. like how i used to get called "handsome," but i knew people were just trying to make me feel "better" about myself.
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:15:02 PM
So far as I can see.. Only Masha and I were gay men before we transitioned... It looks like everyone else was a heterosexual man and lots of you folks have children as well.
I was pansexual before my transition. Was faithful and married to a female with three children. After my transition, I am still pansexual.
Quote from: FullMoon19 on December 04, 2011, 08:26:28 PM
i guess some people equate changing gender to morphing into an entirely different human being. it's really a good thing that you look the same. that just means you were more female looking from the start. it was the same for me, but the only problem is, people can remember me and judge me. so, if someone wants to look entirely different, try "face off."
It was just an attempt at a mean comment from Jen61... Don't read completely into it.
i was basically asexual before transition. i had no gf/bf, and was mostly disinterested in romance, but i transitioned at 18, so it's not the end of the world.
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 08:54:35 PM
It was just an attempt at a mean comment from Jen61... Don't read completely into it.
i understand. it's happened multiple times before.
Quote from: FullMoon19 on December 04, 2011, 08:59:52 PM
i understand. it's happened multiple times before.
Well her stuff is more hilarious than bothering. Like replying to her own quotes which were suppose to burn me, never posting pics of herself, etc....
Just let people be people.
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 09:03:36 PM
Well her stuff is more hilarious than bothering. Like replying to her own quotes which were suppose to burn me, never posting pics of herself, etc....
Just let people be people.
good idea.
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 04, 2011, 08:54:35 PM
It was just an attempt at a mean comment from Jen61... Don't read completely into it.
Oh, now you are hurting my feelings, there is no a single mean bone in my body, Honey.
You just being mad with me when I told you that in that picture of you and your brother he looked like 50 and you like 40. I did not mean to offend you, that was just my opinion from your picture.
I guess we will continue to dance, I do enjoy your posts, they are so entertaining
Haha! I first came out to a Gay Man, realized I wasn't Gay...then tried tried to be a Hetro Male...
Alas...turns out I'm predominately a Hetro Female...and Pansxual too :laugh:
Quote from: FullMoon19 on December 04, 2011, 09:05:20 PM
good idea.
now you two can make a movie, :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
Quote from: Jen61 on December 04, 2011, 09:05:42 PM
Oh, now you are hurting my feelings, there is no a single mean bone in my body, Honey.
You just being mad with me when I told you that in that picture of you and your brother he looked like 50 and you like 40. I did not mean to offend you, that was just my opinion from your picture.
I guess we will continue to dance, I do enjoy your posts, they are so entertaining
Now Now...don't turn the Sandbox into Litter Box...
TOS...
9. If you disagree with transgender individuals, or activities which cross gender boundaries take your arguments to a more appropriate web site.
10. Bashing or flaming of any individuals or groups is not acceptable behavior on this web site and will not be tolerated in the slightest for any reason. This includes but is not limited to:
Advocating the separation or exclusion of one or more group from under the Transgender umbrella term
Suggesting or claiming that one segment or sub-segment of our community is more legitimate, deserving, or more real than any others So...play well with others...
Quote from: Jen61 on December 04, 2011, 09:05:42 PM
You just being mad with me when I told you that in that picture of you and your brother he looked like 50 and you like 40. I did not mean to offend you, that was just my opinion from your picture.
Uhhh, I forgot about that.
A reminder:
Quote
15. Items under discussion shall be confined to the subject matter at hand, members shall avoid taking the other users posts personally, and/or posting anything that can reasonably be construed as a personal attack.
If you have issues with each other, please use PM to work it out, rather than the public forum!
Admin
I went through a gay male phase, but after awhile I relized I really am bisexual pansexual.
Having been openly straight, gay, bi, and now pansexual I think I have seen a rather wide swath of humanity. (at least I got allot of sex out of the deal) :D
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:15:02 PM
So far as I can see.. Only Masha and I were gay men before we transitioned... It looks like everyone else was a heterosexual man and lots of you folks have children as well.
Kia Ora Ms Daz,
::) It's quite possible some male bodied members didn't actually lead an 'openly' gay life, more so theirs was on the 'down low'...But then I guess even on the down low the androphilic trans-women before coming out didn't consider themselves as gay, just having a strong[somewhat confusing] desire for sexual intimacy with a male ....
::) BTW gay men and confused androphilic trans-females have [due to the social pressures to conform] had sex with women and have fathered children ....Some totally convincing themselves[due to social pressure] they were [as men] heterosexual
Metta Zenda :)
I was heterosexual, then bisexual, now asexual.
Before I transitioned, I was asexual, and gay-acting. I didn't want to get into any relationships because I knew that it would have to be as male, and I knew that sort of thing could never end well. However, it may be noteworthy to say that, during that period of my life, I was attracted to girls. Since then, this has switched; there isn't nearly as much attraction to women as there once was - rather, I strongly prefer men now. It may have been the hormones, or perhaps before transition, I merely didn't explore the issue of men to enough extent to know if I enjoyed them. I don't know.
The gay-acting was just me being me... To be flamboyant was the only way to live - it was fun, and I could enjoy myself a little.
By no means was I a heterosexual male (I transitioned before I could even be called a "man" - not that I would ever call myself such a thing anyway), but I didn't quite fit the archetype of the gay male either. I was just a weirdo.
Why do we always try to make it black and white?
What about the 'straight men' that weren't all macho and manly. Everyone thought I was gay until I married my wife. For that matter she has always been more manly than me I've always hung around with the lesbians in any crowd.
Age and orientation division gets us no where.
What right does someone else have to deny me my identity. I know I didn't imagine telling my (grand)father when I was 5 that the penis attached to me was to dig my hole and then it was going to fall off, because he mocked me with the name peedigger until I got married. Just because I let my grandparents / adoptive parents control my life until my 30s doesn't mean I didn't want to transition in high school.
Please let's stop the hurtful dividing. We are too few to make society accept us as it is.
I use to identify as a gale male because that was the closest thing I could relate to as I didn't know what a transsexual was at the time.
Quote from: Jeneva on December 05, 2011, 07:19:43 AM
Why do we always try to make it black and white?
... Age and orientation division gets us no where.
What right does someone else have to deny me my identity.
... Please let's stop the hurtful dividing. We are too few to make society accept us as it is.
Um, okay, I don't totally understand what you're talking about, as all that was asked was whether or not you were gay prior to transitioning. I don't see this as dividing or denying anyone their identity. If you were a hetero straight man who didn't act macho, there's nothing wrong with that; being gay means you are attracted to the same sex, which has nothing to do with personality. If it must be said, personality that is perceived as "gay" would technically amount to being "flamboyant", which anyone of any sexual orientation can be.
Quote from: mandyh92 on December 04, 2011, 05:53:59 PM
I have recieved FAR MORE support from the straight community then the gay community.Gay men inparticular dont understand or want to understand. Most lesbians have been noresponive. While EVERY cisgirl is loving and supportive.....Good ol redneck southern indiana i guess.
You know, I have lost count of the number of Trans-persons that have said that exact same thing; that they were always well recieved and accepted by the heterosexuals, or atleast fairly so, and hadn't tasted serious discrimination until they sat foot in the gay community.
And I can attest to many gays being
extremely hating towards trans-persons.
Speaking of it; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaaGzsyZN_M# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaaGzsyZN_M#)
Quote::) BTW gay men and confused androphilic trans-females have [due to the social pressures to conform] had sex with women and have fathered children ....Some totally convincing themselves[due to social pressure] they were [as men] heterosexual
This is very, very common where I grew up.
How come it is possible to upload some videos directly, while others just result in a simple link?
Crappy functions. ::)
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:15:02 PM
So far as I can see.. Only Masha and I were gay men before we transitioned... It looks like everyone else was a heterosexual man and lots of you folks have children as well.
Kia Ora Ms Daz,
::) https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,98683.0.html (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,98683.0.html)
Metta Zenda :)
Quote from: stldrmgrl on December 05, 2011, 09:15:22 AM
Um, okay, I don't totally understand what you're talking about, as all that was asked was whether or not you were gay prior to transitioning. I don't see this as dividing or denying anyone their identity. If you were a hetero straight man who didn't act macho, there's nothing wrong with that; being gay means you are attracted to the same sex, which has nothing to do with personality. If it must be said, personality that is perceived as "gay" would technically amount to being "flamboyant", which anyone of any sexual orientation can be.
Sorry I was responding to a Mahsa quote on the ->-bleeped-<- thread that spawned this thread. It was basically a ->-bleeped-<-r-than-thou for a 'gay male' that discovers she is a transsexual because the others are so macho. Given the timing I don't see this as an independent thread.
Quote from: Jeneva on December 05, 2011, 11:57:04 AM
Sorry I was responding to a Mahsa quote on the ->-bleeped-<- thread that spawned this thread. It was basically a ->-bleeped-<-r-than-thou for a 'gay male' that discovers she is a transsexual because the others are so macho. Given the timing I don't see this as an independent thread.
Ah, okay. No worries.
I was Gay before too. I am a red hot blooded lover of men >:-) My sexual persuasion has gone from homo to hetero.
Have you guys ever considered this? Typically women try to avoid conflict more than men and be at harmony with the feelings of those around them; so if some of us had been openly gay that would have resulted in conflict and disharmony with people in our life.
In other words, trying to be heterosexual males was, in a way, a very feminine thing to do. :)
Quote from: Inanna on December 05, 2011, 03:58:25 PM
In other words, trying to be heterosexual males was, in a way, a very feminine thing to do. :)
LOL. Funniest thing I've heard on this site.
I disagree. Most heterosexual males see femininity as a foreign concept. You can justify that anyway you want...But gay men have it all.
Quote from: Inanna on December 05, 2011, 03:58:25 PM
Have you guys ever considered this? Typically women try to avoid conflict more than men and be at harmony with the feelings of those around them; so if some of us had been openly gay that would have resulted in conflict and disharmony with people in our life.
In other words, trying to be heterosexual males was, in a way, a very feminine thing to do. :)
I agree, this is basically why, after asking if my name wss wrong at 4 years, asking to replace the colour of my blue school dress at 5, I decided to remove and pray everynight to become a man, I did so hard in some time I forgot to be a woman
Quote from: Inanna on December 05, 2011, 03:58:25 PM
Have you guys ever considered this? Typically women try to avoid conflict more than men and be at harmony with the feelings of those around them; so if some of us had been openly gay that would have resulted in conflict and disharmony with people in our life.
In other words, trying to be heterosexual males was, in a way, a very feminine thing to do. :)
yes
very much so
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 05, 2011, 04:23:53 PM
Most heterosexual males see femininity as a foreign concept.
Can't argue with that !
I used to be a gay man. Now, I identify more as a woman; Specially since I started HRT. In any case, I'm not too hung up on labels. I am who I am and I accept everyone as they want to be accepted. "Just be yourself, everyone else is already taken" :)
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 05, 2011, 04:23:53 PM
LOL. Funniest thing I've heard on this site.
I disagree. Most heterosexual males see femininity as a foreign concept. You can justify that anyway you want...But gay men have it all.
I think it's more like, "If I'm going to be in the closet about my gender, I might as well be in the closet about my sexuality too." My family would have rejected me for either one, so why would I come out as liking men before coming out as trans? I just did both at the same time.
And for what it's worth, I never had any children with a woman... pretty hard when you transition at 20 as a virgin. :laugh:
Okay, I see that we got some variety here as in terms of who you were pre-transition....
I am wondering, does if the experience of being gay helps making transitioning easier than having being straight? I am talking about for yourself within the self - not the people around you....
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 05, 2011, 09:05:44 PM
Okay, I see that we got some variety here as in terms of who you were pre-transition....
I am wondering, does if the experience of being gay helps making transitioning easier than having being straight? I am talking about for yourself within the self - not the people around you....
For me it made it a lot easier. I like mostly boys, but I'd be lying if I said I'm never attracted to girls. That flexibility has made transitioning way easier. I don't judge myself much for it, and I don't try too hard to do the proper heteronormative (or whatever) things.
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 05, 2011, 04:23:53 PM
Most heterosexual males see femininity as a foreign concept. You can justify that anyway you want...But gay men have it all.
Hmm, I don't know about that. Most gay guys seem to have a form of femininity that is really exaggerated and artificial and doesn't even feel like real femininity at all. Even worse, some of them who transition take this form of femininity with them into their new life, which leads to the "transitioned drag queen" effect.
There are always exceptions of course. I once saw a gay guy that was so incredibly feminine that I wouldn't be surprised if he came out as transsexual one day. I also don't understand why his gay partner could tolerate so much femininity, maybe the partner was a closeted heterosexual? ;)
I was bi before my transition and im bi now. Most of my friends are heterosexual males. I dated men and women before my transition but i was never involved in the "gay community" very much. Bad music and a bitchy attitude seemed to be the hallmarks of the community and i didnt see the need for it, my type of guy was never the flamboyent gay man but the gay man who acts just like anyone else and doenst let an attraction to men make them fall into a stereotype. I still struggle to see how sexual attraction can make people all act the same.
I know what people mean when they say that the "gay community" has been more transphobic than straight people towards them, ive been blamed by lesbians for trying to "steal their women" and had gay guys tell me that im just a gay man taking it further than it needs to be. Straight people however as soon as i explain ive always felt like a woman and theres nothing sexual about my transition tend to be fine with it, male and female from ages about 17-50 seem to be completely ok with it (and i dont live in the most liberal-left-wing bit of the UK either!).
I find when straight people give me trouble its usually economically disadvantaged 20 year old white chavs who shout things from the window of a peugeot 106 (that their mum probably pays the insurance on).
Quote from: Inanna on December 05, 2011, 03:58:25 PM
Have you guys ever considered this? Typically women try to avoid conflict more than men and be at harmony with the feelings of those around them; so if some of us had been openly gay that would have resulted in conflict and disharmony with people in our life.
In other words, trying to be heterosexual males was, in a way, a very feminine thing to do. :)
Hmm.. I am not too sure about that, actually. For one, females can be very conflicting aswell, and in some aspects even more so than males, but in a different way. Males are more
aggressiv in their revilary, or what to call it, while females are more practitioners of "psychoterror" and mental bullying towards chosen subjects in their surrounding.
I do see what you mean with females being more accepting, in general, and also agree with that to a part, but also disagree for the mentioned reason that females may be very conflicting too, just as males.
Also, the theory falls when considering closeted "straight acting" gay males, that keeps their sexuality a total secret without being closeted transsexual or any of the like at all.
Funny thing is, some of those males can be quite confliting too. ::)
"Who else used to be a gay man before transitioning?"
Well, not me! Just about the only thing I seem to know these days...
AXELLE
I was a panda bear before my mind started to ache too much, now I feel like a grizzly surrounding a little pink tortoise.
I dated bamboos back then, now I mostly spend my time in search of an intergalactic transgendering hitchikers guide.
Quote from: El on December 06, 2011, 04:35:32 AM
I know what people mean when they say that the "gay community" has been more transphobic than straight people towards them, ive been blamed by lesbians for trying to "steal their women" and had gay guys tell me that im just a gay man taking it further than it needs to be.
Gay men are hyper masculine at the moment.
I acknowledge my gay past and they don't say anything else but then again, I entertain gay men instead of denying. I think I am some kind of rainbow mage...LOL. I make men "gay".... But I am very much in touch with my "male" side...whatever that means. I think for me to have the respect of the gay community and transition, I had to be a very gay male first... I mean from other perspectives, most transgirls are just "extreme femmes" when it comes to how gay men view them.
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 06, 2011, 01:37:06 PM
Gay men are hyper masculine at the moment.
At the moment? When did they decide to try that fashion out?
Look, there is
Nothing wrong with non-masculine gay guys, not in the least, but, the number of gay males I have met, seen and interacted with throughout the years, that have been truly and genuinly masculine and haven't radiated an
act of masculinity, are far from many at all, I would even say rare.
Masculine Bisexuals I have met considerably more of, but truly masculine gay males, not many at all.
Sure, I have met many gay males that have
acted masculine, or, as they call it themselves, been "straight acting", but when it is an act, it is very easy to see through that act, although a number of Cis-heterosexuals at the same time would actually consider that very same male as being masculine, as they generally cannot see through that facade in the way a "trained eye" can.
QuoteI acknowledge my gay past and they don't say anything else but then again, I entertain gay men instead of denying. I think I am some kind of rainbow mage...LOL. I make men "gay".... But I am very much in touch with my "male" side...whatever that means. I think for me to have the respect of the gay community and transition, I had to be a very gay male first... I mean from other perspectives, most transgirls are just "extreme femmes" when it comes to how gay men view them.
I don't doubt that is the case for some, but hardly always, as gays that are transphobic generally don't care squat about what or how the transitioner were or acted like before.
Yes, there are gay guys and gay females that are truly wonderful and accepting persons, but unfortunately they somehow seems to be outnumered by the ones with the opposite attitude.
Or, those with the crappy attitude may perhaps just out-voice the others, or how to put it, making it only seem like they are more.
In either case, they are defintely there and they are not few.
Also, if one has to openly be a gay male before transitioning to be "accepted" by the Gay Community, then that
is Transphobic in itself.
Quote from: Bishounen on December 06, 2011, 02:43:41 PM
Also, if one has to openly be a gay male before transitioning to be "accepted" by the Gay Community, then that is Transphobic in itself.
Not really. Many of them think transsexual women are gay men in denial. But they praise dq's landing "straight" men.
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 06, 2011, 02:47:33 PM
Not really. Many of them think transsexual women are gay men in denial. But they praise dq's landing "straight" men.
Well that
is Transphobic. I guess they would get their undies in a real twist if someone said that they(The gay males) are just transsexuals in denial, so why would it be less phobic to state that transsexuals are gay males in denial?
Because it isn't.
And as for why transphobes can be more accepting of Drag Queens, that's simply because they don't have to take a Drag Queen seriously regarding the gender identity. But, if that same Drag Queen would say; "You know, I've decided that I am really transsexual", than several of those that have thought that the queen where "fabulous" would make a 180 degree turnaround.
Let's call it a draw and move on.
Quote from: Sarah Louise on December 06, 2011, 03:18:36 PM
Let's call it a draw and move on.
Yeah, let's move the subject to just "who is the more fabulous here?"
Or
Seriously let's talk about way to improve our transgender journey.
the vast majority of the gay men in my college (the majority of our campus are gay males) are masculine gay...not bisexual.
There are three non masculine type of gay men. The rest (about 20) are masculine. The gay bar in town is similar (with the feminine gay males as slightly more).
This is in Pennsylvania.
Bumping this thread for the sake of comparing replies in the recent thread bout "when did you realize you were not gay but trans?"
seeing if people are being honest ;)
As someone who is heavily thinking about transitioning from a gay male to a straight woman, did any of you have problems being intimate with your boyfriends/partners as a gay male? That's the hardest part for me. I'm a totally receptive person.
I think your problem is more that you'll find him becoming less interested in sex with you as you start picking up female secondary sexual characteristics. Gay men don't like boobs... says my roommate :P
Quote from: Carly on June 26, 2012, 08:43:50 PM
As someone who is heavily thinking about transitioning from a gay male to a straight woman, did any of you have problems being intimate with your boyfriends/partners as a gay male? That's the hardest part for me. I'm a totally receptive person.
is he bisexual? if he isnt im sure thats going to be a problem
Quote from: SandraJane on December 04, 2011, 09:08:41 PM
Haha! I first came out to a Gay Man, realized I wasn't Gay...then tried tried to be a Hetro Male...
Alas...turns out I'm predominately a Hetro Female...and Pansxual too :laugh:
For awhile, I thought I was trisexual. If it came to sex, I was willing to try it.
Me.... but I was pretending to be gay, thought I could get away and hide my true inner feelings.
I had so many gay friends but never boyfriends even very limited sex.
Things have certainly turned the other way around, for good :)
Quote from: Bishounen on December 06, 2011, 09:04:01 AM
Hmm.. I am not too sure about that, actually. For one, females can be very conflicting aswell, and in some aspects even more so than males, but in a different way. Males are more aggressiv in their revilary, or what to call it, while females are more practitioners of "psychoterror" and mental bullying towards chosen subjects in their surrounding.
I do see what you mean with females being more accepting, in general, and also agree with that to a part, but also disagree for the mentioned reason that females may be very conflicting too, just as males.
Also, the theory falls when considering closeted "straight acting" gay males, that keeps their sexuality a total secret without being closeted transsexual or any of the like at all.
Funny thing is, some of those males can be quite confliting too. ::)
ive know quite a few women who are very aggressive and confrontational , lets not resort to gender stereotyping
Quote from: Joandelynn on December 06, 2011, 02:28:04 AM
Hmm, I don't know about that. Most gay guys seem to have a form of femininity that is really exaggerated and artificial and doesn't even feel like real femininity at all. Even worse, some of them who transition take this form of femininity with them into their new life, which leads to the "transitioned drag queen" effect.
There are always exceptions of course. I once saw a gay guy that was so incredibly feminine that I wouldn't be surprised if he came out as transsexual one day. I also don't understand why his gay partner could tolerate so much femininity, maybe the partner was a closeted heterosexual? ;)
theres lots of genetic women who also have this exaggerated and artificial look , i dont really get your point ? are you saying that just becuase someone like a exhagorated look than it makes them look less trans ?
Bit by bit I'd found out, being increasingly 'typecast' as a gay male in the closet, long pre-transition.
I never really felt that way (gay male) - yet I was way more comfortable with gay males, than either women or more so, straight males.
Straight males bored me, I bored straight women - or they bored me.
If I was interested in females they were not interested in me.
One confusing merry-go-round, enough to just let things be, much as possible.
I have seen at least one case of a gay male bringing this über-femme behaviour into a post-op situation; it instinctively made me wonder if this person had not made a big mistake - SRS.
Also had a strong dislike for women, being quite outspoken...
It was somewhat confusing to say the least; sitting there 2 – 3 days post-op and some friendly platonic motherly g/f having to take it all in.
For some things on just seems to be at a loss, to place in one's own repertoire of experiences...
Axélle
Quote from: Axélle on June 27, 2012, 01:07:11 AM
Bit by bit I'd found out, being increasingly 'typecast' as a gay male in the closet, long pre-transition.
I never really felt that way (gay male) - yet I was way more comfortable with gay males, than either women or more so, straight males.
Straight males bored me, I bored straight women - or they bored me.
If I was interested in females they were not interested in me.
One confusing merry-go-round, enough to just let things be, much as possible.
I have seen at least one case of a gay male bringing this über-femme behaviour into a post-op situation; it instinctively made me wonder if this person had not made a big mistake - SRS.
Also had a strong dislike for women, being quite outspoken...
It was somewhat confusing to say the least; sitting there 2 – 3 days post-op and some friendly platonic motherly g/f having to take it all in.
For some things on just seems to be at a loss, to place in one's own repertoire of experiences...
Axélle
amanda lepore acts uber feminine and she doesnt seem to have any regrets ?
I had no idea who Amanda Lepore was so I looked it up.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffamousplastic.com%2Fcategoryimages%2Famandalepore.jpg&hash=20ac98789c55547458496c26adc7fdcaba78a8de)
If I looked like that, I would not only have regrets, I would probably be suicidal.
i think shea beautifal . i love her makeup and style . she did look better before she tilted her eyes though
Amanda Lepore - Cotton Candy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Gc1HbTsjCI#) looks pretty amazing in this clip
Quote from: mementomori on June 27, 2012, 01:43:19 AM
i think shea beautifal . i love her makeup and style . she did look better before she tilted her eyes though
Well, each to their own, um. :P
I think she looks like a clown, of totally exaggerated female facial proportions.
Must be a nightmare to behold, before all this make-up is applied.
Lordy, Lord...
Axélle
Quote from: Axélle on June 27, 2012, 01:56:07 AM
Well, each to their own, um. :P
I think she looks like a clown, of totally exaggerated female facial proportions.
Must be a nightmare to behold, before all this make-up is applied.
Lordy, Lord...
Axélle
she didnt want to look natural though , its the look she was intentionally going for
Quote from: mementomori on June 27, 2012, 02:02:58 AM
she didnt want to look natural though , its the look she was intentionally going for
So was she a gay male then, before all of this intentional 'non-natural' look transition?
Not sure it slots into the OP at this point...
Axelle
Quote from: Axélle on June 27, 2012, 02:30:00 AM
So was she a gay male then, before all of this intentional 'non-natural' look transition?
Not sure it slots into the OP at this point...
Axelle
i doubt it becuase she started hormones at 14
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on June 26, 2012, 10:04:14 PM
I think your problem is more that you'll find him becoming less interested in sex with you as you start picking up female secondary sexual characteristics. Gay men don't like boobs... says my roommate :P
Some gay men turn out to be on the bi side and are interested in your femininety...and your softness and boobs. They've seen enough dicks so less interested in that...
Most 'straight' guys are interested in MTF dick (only).... and fiercely claim they are '100% straight', mind you! LOL!
They have 'real pussy' available..so they're not exactly looking for that in a MTF.
It's really funny how this works 'the other way around' with pre/non op MTF considering some gays on the bi side and most 'straight' guys interested in MTF dick, no less! lol!
PLUS an added 'bonus': most of those 'straight' men have deeply hidden gender issues themselves.
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:15:02 PM
So far as I can see.. Only Masha and I were gay men before we transitioned... It looks like everyone else was a heterosexual man and lots of you folks have children as well.
Sorry but I don't fit in either camp! I wasn't a gay man and I wasn't a heterosexual man with kids. I knew I was TS from an early age and had no intention of walking down the isle dressed up as a man. I was also infertile long before I started HRT.
I was a bisexual man until February, when I rebooted and found myself being a bisexual woman instead :). And yes, there's a considerable difference...
Quote from: Inanna on December 05, 2011, 03:58:25 PM
Have you guys ever considered this? Typically women try to avoid conflict more than men and be at harmony with the feelings of those around them; so if some of us had been openly gay that would have resulted in conflict and disharmony with people in our life.
In other words, trying to be heterosexual males was, in a way, a very feminine thing to do. :)
I don't see it that way at all but whatever floats your boat I suppose?
Quote from: MsDazzler on December 04, 2011, 04:15:02 PM
So far as I can see.. Only Masha and I were gay men before we transitioned... It looks like everyone else was a heterosexual man and lots of you folks have children as well.
I am still livign as a gay man, and from chatting with others I find it that not many TS are attracted to males before transition, and several are still attracted to females after transition
I always liked both.
Its goo to be greedy >:-)
Quote from: Dahlia on June 27, 2012, 03:56:06 AM
Most 'straight' guys are interested in MTF dick (only).... and fiercely claim they are '100% straight', mind you! LOL!
They have 'real pussy' available..so they're not exactly looking for that in a MTF.
LOL, this so true in every part of the world ;)
Quote from: Dahlia on June 27, 2012, 03:56:06 AM
Some gay men turn out to be on the bi side and are interested in your femininety...and your softness and boobs. They've seen enough dicks so less interested in that...
Most 'straight' guys are interested in MTF dick (only).... and fiercely claim they are '100% straight', mind you! LOL!
They have 'real pussy' available..so they're not exactly looking for that in a MTF.
It's really funny how this works 'the other way around' with pre/non op MTF considering some gays on the bi side and most 'straight' guys interested in MTF dick, no less! lol!
PLUS an added 'bonus': most of those 'straight' men have deeply hidden gender issues themselves.
This. Is. So. True.
A lot of people thought I was gay, and I myself assumed I might be for a while. :) But I actually wasn't really interested in either gender before coming out, and eventually started to identify as asexual if I was asked to put a label on it. The thought of dating anyone in my current body, male or female, just felt weird to me from an early age. And my sex drive is presumably naturally very low anyway, as my body never seemed to push me in one direction or the other.
Since coming out... I don't know, really. I feel as if I might like boys, but it's a very slight inkling, and the thought of actually going out with one still seems patently ridiculous to me. Perhaps that will change as my body does, and as I become more and more comfortable with myself as a woman. To be honest, though, part of me actually hopes it doesn't. The thought of suddenly becoming sexually and romantically active after living for twenty-six years without having ever had so much as a crush on anyone is far more terrifying to me than coming out and deciding to transition was. :'D I have about the same level of sexual maturity and relationship know how as an average ten year old girl, and wouldn't even know where to begin if I found myself crushing on someone or if someone I liked asked me out.
I was never a man.
Quote from: Noey Noonesson on July 03, 2012, 05:08:35 AM
I was never a man.
i think the original poster more means what they were physically/ how society viewed/ read than as opposed to their internal identity
I have lived as both a straight man and a gay man though I identified with women. My wife was like my sister much to her discontent and being with a gay man allowed me to live more as a woman, though I never felt that I fit in as gay. Now I am working on being the woman I have always been. Leigh
Interesting topic tbh.
Before transitioning, I was definitely heterosexual 100%, although for some reason a few of my girlfriends thought I was gay (I really never understood why!), even though I presented as a typical guy and didn't "act" anything other than a straight guy who was into his sports/movies/gaming/monster trucks ;).
However when I realised I wanted to start hormones, everything took on a different perspective. I'd know consider myself more attracted to boys, but still 'appreciative' of women. I'm probably bi, but being on hormones has totally altered my sex drive. Either that, or the whole mind-set of "be a woman, women like boys, I should like boys" may be taking precedence :-\
X
I attempted to transition a couple years ago, but I got scared and I will be transiting very soon under a doctor's supervision. Before my first attempt at transitioning, I gave off the appearance of a manly man. Girls said there was some kind of aura of "coolness/badassness" that caused girls to gravitate towards me and the guys to be intimidated. Almost every girl that got to know me or know of me had a crush on me during sometime. I dated numerous girls and am very attracted to girls, but when it came down to anything intimidate, I never felt anything. Girls would realize not long after that I was not what they expected and was more of the woman in the relationship, so they would leave. Basically nobody suspected my gender dysphoria or sexuality (even the girls I dated despite being more of a woman in the relationship). In fact, I recall people stating "You are the last person on the planet I would ever expect to be gay." My facade and the number of girls I dated, got my the reputation of being a player (despite being a virgin). Nowadays, I do not care about keeping up the manly man appearance. I am still uncertain of my sexuality, but as of now I am bisexual.
Quote from: silentone on July 05, 2012, 06:29:36 PM
I attempted to transition a couple years ago, but I got scared and I will be transiting very soon under a doctor's supervision. Before my first attempt at transitioning, I gave off the appearance of a manly man. Girls said there was some kind of aura of "coolness/badassness" that caused girls to gravitate towards me the guys to be intimidated. Almost every girl that got to know me or know of me had a crush on me during sometime. I dated numerous girls and am very attractive to girls, but when it came down to anything intimidate, I never felt anything. Girls would realize not long after that I was not what they expected and was more of the woman in the relationship, so they would leave. Basically nobody suspected my gender dysphoria or sexuality (even the girls I dated despite being more of a woman in the relationship). In fact, I recall people stating "You are the last person on the planet I would ever expect to be gay." My facade and the number of girls I dated, got my the reputation of being a player (despite being a virgin). Nowadays, I do not care about keeping up the manly man appearance. I am still uncertain of my sexuality, but as of now I am bisexual.
A LOT of this rings true to me too (so im glad im not alone! :))
Without wishing to brag, I was a 'Player' and always out with different girls, however whenever I got into bed I was always quite submissive, or found reasons to change the situation (normally I would feign that I had drunk too much alcohol and leave at the earliest opportunity). I would very rarely follow through on the deed, or if I did I would feel confused/ashamed/embarassed at the end of it.
Gender dysphoria sucks! lol
X
I am a gay man by definition because I like men but the reason I decide to transition was to never have to associate myself with gays because I dont identify to their life style, manerisms, and other cultural nuances that make gay men less of males to me. Well, I am a woman in bed and gays do not like female-acting partners. Therefore, I reject being w gays because as a woman I seek real Alphas. They treat me as a lady and so on....
Therefore, I do not see myself having GID, but sex orientation disphoria.. my sexual identity is not in tandem with my bio identity to the point I find more apealing becoming a female.
People w GID have their gender not in tadem with their biological persona, but they do not have sexual disphorias because their are not disputing their heterosexual preferences after transitioning
Clear!!
Quote from: Jackie Witt on July 05, 2012, 10:55:45 PM
I am a gay man by definition because I like men but the reason I decide to transition was to never have to associate myself with gays because I dont identify to their life style, manerisms, and other cultural nuances that make gay men less of males to me. Well, I am a woman in bed and gays do not like female-acting partners. Therefore, I reject being w gays because as a woman I seek real Alphas. They treat me as a lady and so on....
Therefore, I do not see myself having GID, but sex orientation disphoria.. my sexual identity is not in tandem with my bio identity to the point I find more apealing becoming a female.
People w GID have their gender not in tadem with their biological persona, but they do not have sexual disphorias because their are not disputing their heterosexual preferences after transitioning
Clear!!
you dont have to transition hormonally etc to be treated that way, you could always just remove all your body and facial hair permanately , get surgery to feminize your face etc, theres so many different ways you can do this . do you really want breasts ? http://resources3.news.com.au/images/2011/02/24/1226011/593103-andrej-pejic.jpg (http://resources3.news.com.au/images/2011/02/24/1226011/593103-andrej-pejic.jpg) im sure he gets treated like a woman is traditionally treated in a relationship by a aplha male , but is living as a feminine male