Feb. 15th I will be 1 year on T and I'm still getting miss-gendered. What is it that makes me look female? This is what I wore and got miss-gendered. I don't understand why I kept getting miss-gendered. Everyone one says I can pass as Dominick. I don't have a problem passing when I tell people I'm Dominick. Why a year on T am I still getting miss-gendered? How much longer will it take before I can completely pass and not get miss-gendered anymore? I know it's different for everybody but being on T for a year and still getting miss-gendered is ridiculous and it is killing me.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi852.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fab86%2FBrody_81%2FMe105.jpg&hash=709048226beccb3dd7b6f46984f2ce54945293f0)
Anyone who's been on T for a year or longer still get miss-gendered? This is really upsetting me. What's the point of taking T if I can't pass? I pass more especially with a hat on, but I want to be able to pass without a hat, and I can too sometimes, it just depends on the person. And the person who miss-gendered me was a young girl, probably in her early 20's.
Nothing looks female in the picture that I see.
I work part-time in retail and my co-worker has called a bearded males "ma'am" by COMPLETE accident, I suppose by habit. Of course they always give her an odd look and she didn't even realize it most of the time.
If it's on rare occasions and in public, fast-paced settings it may just be a case like w/my co-worker.
Could it be your body?
You don't look female at all.
I don't get how someone could call you "ma'am".
*edit*
You could always get a different haircut, I think it could be that.
http://hairstyleideas.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/versatille-medium-style-haircut.jpg (http://hairstyleideas.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/versatille-medium-style-haircut.jpg)
Something like that would be nice.
Quote from: JoeyD on February 10, 2012, 10:03:24 PM
Could it be your body?
You don't look female at all.
I don't get how someone could call you "ma'am".
I completely agree. I would NEVER have assumed you were FTM. Maybe it's your body shape. Regardless, you should feel great because you look amazing! Again, I never would have believed you were FTM.
you look 100% male in pictures so it must be something that we are not seeing like your height or the way you carry yourself. There are guys of all heights so maybe you just need social practice being male to counter-act any years of female conditioning that you picked up sub-consciously due to societal pressures.
good news this is something you can practice if that is indeed what it is
Like everybody else has said, in the picture you posted you look great. How is your voice? Body language? How about a profile picture or some other angles? Body shape?
Another suggestion - when somebody perceives you as the wrong gender, why don't you ask them what brought them to that conclusion? This, while uncomfortable, would likely be the fastest way to determine what your 'tells' are.
Quote from: Klv91 on February 10, 2012, 09:56:45 PM
Nothing looks female in the picture that I see.
I work part-time in retail and my co-worker has called a bearded males "ma'am" by COMPLETE accident, I suppose by habit. Of course they always give her an odd look and she didn't even realize it most of the time.
If it's on rare occasions and in public, fast-paced settings it may just be a case like w/my co-worker.
Me and my friend were the only people in line. I was face to face with this girl I believed she looked at me. She thought my friend was talking to himself b/c I'm so short she didn't see me. The girl said to my friend, " I thought you were talking to yourself, I didn't see her their with you." I was almost gonna correct her, but again I chickened out cause I'm thinking there was something there that she saw that made her think female, and again, I'm thinking it's my height. I was dress and presenting as male. I don't get it? Don't people look for these clues to judge weather your male or female? I'm hoping it's just my height that is hindering my passing. But still, can't people tell the difference between a male and a female?
Quote from: JoeyD on February 10, 2012, 10:03:24 PM
Could it be your body?
You don't look female at all.
I don't get how someone could call you "ma'am".
*edit*
You could always get a different haircut, I think it could be that.
http://hairstyleideas.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/versatille-medium-style-haircut.jpg (http://hairstyleideas.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/versatille-medium-style-haircut.jpg)
Something like that would be nice.
Thanks. I don't get it either. My jacket hides my body. I was thinking a different haircut, but sometimes if you go too short it could bring out feminine features, ya know what I mean? That cut's not bad, I've had something similar to that. My hair kinda grows fast.
@Nick: Thanks! :)
@spacerace: Thanks. My cousins and everyone has told me I have no female mannerisms to me, and a lady I recently told, told me I don't even walk like a girl. So I'm kinda stumped.
@Danielle: Thanks. I thought about asking but I felt weird. I really wanna know what it is because it really brings me down and upsets me. People say my voice passes. I'll upload a clip of my voice, and my jacket covers my body shape.
How often are you getting misgendered vs you getting correctly gendered. Keep in mind, she might have just accidentally misgendered you, saw you as male but "ma'am" or "miss" slipped out. I'm guilty of it myself, all the people I work with are women, all the people I go to school are women, maybe the last 10 customers were women so it slips out, and I call a man "ma'am".
In the long run, it's nothing to get too down about. If those who are important to you view you as male, that is what should matter. You will probably never see that checkout girl again, or next time she may call you "sir", today was probably just an accidental slip of the tongue.
You look completely male, but understand, you are only one year on T. That is a drop in the bucket of puberty. Puberty takes years, and even after "puberty" you will still go through bodily changes up until you are an old man and die. It's hard, I know it is, I'm 15 months on T and still get misgendered sometimes. Just don't let it eat you up inside.
Quote from: Andy8715 on February 10, 2012, 11:35:42 PM
How often are you getting misgendered vs you getting correctly gendered. Keep in mind, she might have just accidentally misgendered you, saw you as male but "ma'am" or "miss" slipped out. I'm guilty of it myself, all the people I work with are women, all the people I go to school are women, maybe the last 10 customers were women so it slips out, and I call a man "ma'am".
In the long run, it's nothing to get too down about. If those who are important to you view you as male, that is what should matter. You will probably never see that checkout girl again, or next time she may call you "sir", today was probably just an accidental slip of the tongue.
You look completely male, but understand, you are only one year on T. That is a drop in the bucket of puberty. Puberty takes years, and even after "puberty" you will still go through bodily changes up until you are an old man and die. It's hard, I know it is, I'm 15 months on T and still get misgendered sometimes. Just don't let it eat you up inside.
Thanks Andy.
It depends. I've passed every time I wore a hat. Without the hat it's hard to say since no pronouns are used at all.
The people close to me don't see me as male. Only my cousins will use male pronouns. I know everyone who knows me still see's me as female but a few of my cousins are the only people that make the effort to use the right name and pronouns. My friends don't use pronouns at all or call me by any name. I think it's still weird for them or uncomfortable. Some family members I can never see them calling me Dominick. Which is fine as long as they don't call me out in Public. Which does happen and it is very embarrassing.
I hope it was an accidental slip of the tongue but she didn't correct herself when she came over to me and my friend.
I'm sorry you get miss-gendered sometimes too, it totally sucks when that happens especially being that long on T.
You look all-male to me.
Yeah, your face looks great. Maybe it could be your body or mannerisms. It might be helpful to post a video or more pictures.
Even before you got on T you looked male. I wouldn't let the isolated incidents get you down. You could also not chicken out and correct someone who said ma'am.
I get ma'am when I'm out a lot - even when I'm in full on "guy mode". I chalked it up to being short as well, but there are plenty of short dudes out there too.
I pass less with a hat on. Or I look like a fundraising pic for childhood cancer or something. I've only been on T a couple months though. I am starting to get a little bigger and less pale.
I know this is serious, but your spelling it "miss-gendered" kinda made me giggle. Was that on purpose? Anyway you look more like a dude than I do at first glance, and I pass most of the time.
Was the girl by any chance a little odd in any other aspects of her language? I've heard both ESL people and autistics misgender just about anybody as a matter of course.
My first thought on seeing your pic was, "You look a lot like Justin Bieber."
With that in mind, I'd like to share an "fyi" with you...several of my friends/former acquaintances have said that Justin "looks like a girl."
Haircut? Maybe.
Slight facial-and-neck "build"? Maybe.
Maybe the "young 20-something" girl hadn't learned her manners yet, like when a little child says, "Hey Mom! That lady's really FAT!" As we get older, we start to learn how to "play the game", ie, if a person is fat, you don't mention it...if they're missing a limb, you don't mention it...if they look female (or male), but they are presenting themselves as opposite, you don't mention it.
Height could be the deciding factor, but height alone probably doesn't account for it. Your face looks completely male to me, but I can't see you move or hear your voice. It's a package deal. What if you got your hair cut shorter? It will grow back, and you might find that the longer hair is read as a girl's haircut even if the features aren't girly.
My buddy is short, too, and he still gets misgendered after a couple of years on T. I'm so used to seeing him as a guy that I couldn't understand why others didn't always read him that way, but I've been thinking about it lately. I think it's because he has a combination of factors, not all of them physical. Working against him are height, some typically feminine hand gestures, and typically feminine inflections and vocal patterns. His voice is male but the way he talks is fairly "female." He also hasn't had top surgery, and that must have an effect on how he carries himself. It did for me.
But I think that for him, one deciding factor is confidence. He isn't assertive enough to correct people, and he deflates some when they misread him. This means that he isn't projecting a lot of security in his maleness. Confidence goes a long way for a lot of trans folks. It has taken me a long time to acquire enough of that of-course-I'm-a-guy solidity, almost a casualness about my body and how it is read. If you're tentative, that looks like femaleness. Way back when, my therapist told me that instead of thinking, "I'm not a girl," I should think, "I'm a boy." I don't know if it helped, but I guess it didn't hurt. I've mostly internalized it now, until I have a moment of self-consciousness. When that happens, I try to relax and recapture the confidence. It doesn't take long, but it used to.
I found that politely or humorously correcting people felt good. So if you're not comfortable correcting people in a serious way, turn it into a joke and question the other person's perceptions with humor. It worked for me. The person is still apologetic, and you don't have to be as assertive to make a wisecrack. You can also relieve some of your own tension this way. And let me tell you one more thing. You say that you didn't correct her because you thought she was seeing something female that made her misgender you? Well, most people have a few characteristics across the spectrum. But a woman with a strong nose and chin is still a woman, and a quiet and polite man is still a man. You'll have greater success when you can just be who you ARE and stop thinking about what might "give you away." I think that some people's obsessing over what gives them away...well, gives them away.
As I said, I do still think about those little clues, but the longer I live as a man, the less I do it. Changing your attitude is a process. Maybe you're just not quite "there" yet. Or maybe this gal just wasn't paying attention.
QuoteI found that politely or humorously correcting people felt good. So if you're not comfortable correcting people in a serious way, turn it into a joke and question the other person's perceptions with humor. It worked for me. The person is still apologetic, and you don't have to be as assertive to make a wisecrack. You can also relieve some of your own tension this way. And let me tell you one more thing. You say that you didn't correct her because you thought she was seeing something female that made her misgender you? Well, most people have a few characteristics across the spectrum. But a woman with a strong nose and chin is still a woman, and a quiet and polite man is still a man. You'll have greater success when you can just be who you ARE and stop thinking about what might "give you away." I think that some people's obsessing over what gives them away...well, gives them away.
This is great thinking. I have a cismale friend who is a bit gender atypical, though he doesn't seem to realize it. Because he's cis, he doesn't think much about it when he gets misgendered or when someone points out something about him that isn't particularly masculine. He corrects the person or shrugs it off.
I could echo the others all day, but try a different haircut, Dominick. I have heard IRL young cisguys getting ma'amed with hair similar to yours. Also with the Emo (not saying that's your look) and similar style, it's sometimes difficult for me to know a person's gender at first glance - i.e. both genders wearing skinny jeans, similar hair, hoodies, etc.
Quote from: Kreuzfidel on February 11, 2012, 02:19:36 AM
I could echo the others all day, but try a different haircut, Dominick. I have heard IRL young cisguys getting ma'amed with hair similar to yours. Also with the Emo (not saying that's your look) and similar style, it's sometimes difficult for me to know a person's gender at first glance - i.e. both genders wearing skinny jeans, similar hair, hoodies, etc.
Those kids need to get off your lawn. ;D
Quote from: Arch on February 11, 2012, 01:41:08 AM
But I think that for him, one deciding factor is confidence. He isn't assertive enough to correct people, and he deflates some when they misread him. This means that he isn't projecting a lot of security in his maleness. Confidence goes a long way for a lot of trans folks. It has taken me a long time to acquire enough of that of-course-I'm-a-guy solidity, almost a casualness about my body and how it is read. If you're tentative, that looks like femaleness. Way back when, my therapist told me that instead of thinking, "I'm not a girl," I should think, "I'm a boy." I don't know if it helped, but I guess it didn't hurt. I've mostly internalized it now, until I have a moment of self-consciousness. When that happens, I try to relax and recapture the confidence. It doesn't take long, but it used to.
I'm just going to quote Arch here because he's awesome. Really Dominick you need to look people in the eye and make them believe you are a guy. This sulking in the background looking at your feet isn't going to cut it. You need to correct people. It needs to happen because its the best booster there is. I've said this to you at least 6 times.
The T can't transform the inner you, the part that desperately needs a huge dose of self confidence. Stop expecting it too. It's all you man, ultimately, in the end. Take on the world like you are the Hulk and get people to give you what you want.
@Malachite: Thanks.
@Lee:Thanks. I don't think it's my body or mannerisms. My jacket covers my body and I've been told I told have any mannerisms to me that are feminine. Maybe I'll post a video or something, but I can't get my video camera to record for some reason.
@insideontheoutside: Thanks. Yeah, I always mean to correct people when that happens, but I open my mouth and nothing comes out. I think I get more nervous when other guys are around.
I get ma'am when I'm out a lot - even when I'm in full on "guy mode".
Doesn't that suck when that happens? I don't get how people can't see the male signs.
@Felix: "I know this is serious, but your spelling it "miss-gendered" kinda made me giggle. Was that on purpose?" lol. That was by accident. I wasn't sure how to spell mis-gendered. Spelling it with one "S" a red line came up underneath it so I figured the spelling was incorrect, so when I spelled it with two "S" no line came up, lol.
Was the girl by any chance a little odd in any other aspects of her language?
Nope.
I pass less with a hat on.
Huh? I wonder why? My cousins say most people associate hats with guys so that's why wear hats more often now and it helps me pass better.
@Beth Andrea: Yeah, I've heard a lot of people say Justin Bieber looks like a girl. I don't actually. I can tell he's a boy and I wouldn't mis-gender him thinking he was a girl. The way he's dress tells you that he's male.
Haircut? Maybe. Slight facial-and-neck "build"? Maybe.
These are possibilities.
Maybe the "young 20-something" girl hadn't learned her manners yet
Maybe.
@Arch: What if you got your hair cut shorter?
I don't like the real short haircuts. I don't go too much shorter that what my hair looks like in the picture. I'm okay going a litter shorter in the back, maybe even shaved a little in the back, but general I like to keep my hair longer. I never liked the short look. I think longer hair looks better, but that's just my opinion. Maybe if I loose a ton of weight I might get it cut a little bit shorter, but as of right now, going too short wouldn't look good on my face. I think it might make my face look fatter.
My buddy is short, too, and he still gets misgendered after a couple of years on T
That sucks. I've been told I don't have a feminine mannerism to me, so I don't know. But but guys who are gay and have a feminine mannerism to them get called guys, so I'm not sure.
I haven't had top surgery yet so like you said that could be a factor. But I do pass as Dominick when I introduce myself to people like a job interview or something. I say I'm Dominick and they don't think twice about it. I Guess b/c I'm telling them and then that way they are sure I'm male if they can't tell.
I think I have confidence. I don't go out in public thinking I'm not gonna pass b/c I thought I was passing but that experience has brought my confidence down again and worrying weather I pass or not now.
Before I came out to this lady she told me I looked like a little boy. I was happy she said that, but again I had a hat on and I look way too young but, still, she said boy even if I look young at least I passed.
Some people get it right and others don't. Why does it always depend on the person? Why doesn't everyone pick up the same cues?
I found that politely or humorously correcting people felt good.
That's a good idea.
Thanks Arch for your advice. :)
@Kreuzfidel: Yeah, maybe a different haircut would work. I actually just got my haircut about 2 months ago and grows kinda fast. I can try going a little shorter in the back. Or just get my haircut more often since it grows fast.
@Squirrel698: I know. I came so close to saying something, like my mouth opened but nothing came out and I think she saw something female I better not say anything. I was hoping my friend would say something but he didn't. He was waiting for me to correct her. I was just thinking having a friend there it would be easier b/c they can correct the person. And as once person said here once it's sometimes easier if you have a friend who will correct the person for you. But maybe it's better coming from me instead.
Maybe she assumed 'her' because you're short and didn't really get a look at you. This is where your friend should have said Dominik's a guy. But truthfully when my kids get misgendered they just laugh. I know we're really sensitive about this, but people do slip up without thinking and say the wrong thing even if they know you're male but said female. If it was someone who mattered I'd definitely correct them but otherwise you might want to laugh. And if they say what's so funny? You called me a girl and I'm a guy.
I have met a lot of cis men who have very feminine characteristics, but if misgendered they just correct it and move on.
It's more difficult if you aren't passing; correcting people (that don't matter) just outs you and makes you stand out, which was worse IMO. I dislike (okay HATE) outing myself.
Jay
I wasn't getting misgendered at all after a certain point, at least as far as I could tell. This went on for a good year and a half or two years. Then, about six months ago, I went into an office supply store and was ma'amed at the customer service desk. I can't remember whether it was a man or a woman who addressed me. I think a guy. Without thinking, I got a befuddled look on my face and said, "Ma'am??!!!" We both laughed about it, and he apologized and said that his boss was a woman, so he just fell into it. I don't know if that's true, and I don't care. To me, this was one of those classic misreadings that occasionally happen when clerks don't take a long look at someone.
My ex, who is a little femmy, was occasionally misgendered. He was always amused and never corrected the other person. He is not confrontational. Of course, when he opened his mouth and said something, they immediately realized their mistake and were acutely embarrassed.
Then again, perhaps one aspect of his amusement was his knowledge of my own trans-ness. Sometimes, when we went into a store or went out to eat, the server/clerk would say something like, "What can I get for you gentlemen?" It was always awkward for me because I didn't want to say anything and not sound like a guy.
Dominick, people do tend to make quick evaluations, and height is often an important element. But I know a trans man who is super short, and absolutely nobody doubts that he is male. It could be that with shorter guys, especially those who transition fairly young, it just takes longer for them to be read accurately 100% of the time. But your face looks awesome--you look exactly like a teenage boy to me.
If you're still frustrated about this--and most of us would be--do post a video (or at least a voice clip) and see what kind of feedback you get. Or share it privately with people by PM. One thing I do know--it's easy to miss little cues if you already accept the other person as male. I didn't go out of my way to analyze my friend until I realized that other people were still misreading him. Your own friends might be doing the same. But I still think that it's less stressful to just let the "passing" come in its own time rather than trying to eradicate any "feminine" characteristics you might have.
I would also like to add, that growing up I worked at a 7-11 (convenience store) and I do remember accidentally using the wrong pronouns here and there. It had nothing to do with how the people looked either, I would just "get in the zone" where I was focusing on getting people rung up and out the door and I simply didn't pay attention to them. They were like cattle, and I would make eye-contact and have polite conversation, but rarely did an interaction engage my brain - it was all automatic.
Sometimes I would correct myself, and other times I would just let it go - it depended on whether it elicited any reaction from the person I was speaking with.
Arch, super-thoughtful posts! You rock!
Quote from: Dominick_81 on February 11, 2012, 01:53:11 PM
I was just thinking having a friend there it would be easier b/c they can correct the person. And as once person said here once it's sometimes easier if you have a friend who will correct the person for you. But maybe it's better coming from me instead.
You need to learn to advocate for yourself. Speak up. You need to especially as a trans person.
You look 100% male to me too. I'm not a believer of the hieght thing myself. As a 40 year old I've met alot of adult males my height or shorter.
I wonder about stance (Pre-top surgery and post-top can make a huge difference) and also wether your hips are broader than your shoulders. Behind the head pull-ups and chin ups will help broaden the neck and shoulders.
When I was a teenager I was very andro and my gender was often confused. Before I knew I could even get gender corrective sugery, I remember trying to convince someone I was a girl (LOL). Anyway, she told me to stand up and put my feet together. I did and she was then positive I was a girl. I asked her why. She said all girls legs taper in toward the feet. I don't know how true that is but I have noticed it since with observation. I now make sure I never stand with my feet together.
I feel your pain.
I am almost 1 year on T and still get misgendered.
I also get a lot of "Are you a boy or a girl?".
Quote from: meh on February 12, 2012, 12:07:55 AM
I also get a lot of "Are you a boy or a girl?".
Do adults honestly ask people this question? I can understand kids doing it (and by kids I mean age 12 max, most older than that should know better etiquette IMHO), but what kind of adult actually asks this? I'm just appalled at the lack of tact and manners if people are asking this for real.
Quote from: Kreuzfidel on February 12, 2012, 12:26:30 AM
Do adults honestly ask people this question? I can understand kids doing it (and by kids I mean age 12 max, most older than that should know better etiquette IMHO), but what kind of adult actually asks this? I'm just appalled at the lack of tact and manners if people are asking this for real.
I've had an older woman (40's/50's) ask me this at work once. She is the only adult that's had the audacity to ask me that.
Dominick, I see absolutely NO female in you whatsoever.
Quote from: Kreuzfidel on February 12, 2012, 12:26:30 AM
Do adults honestly ask people this question?
Sadly, yes. But it's worse when they call you "it" or "that."
Quote from: Arch on February 12, 2012, 01:31:23 AM
Sadly, yes. But it's worse when they call you "it" or "that."
indeed. rude questions or female pronouns are marginally better than being dehumanised.
@sneakersjay:
Maybe she assumed 'her' because you're short and didn't really get a look at you.
I was thinking that.
This is where your friend should have said Dominik's a guy.
I was waiting for him to say something and he was waiting for me to say something.
Yeah, laughing it off might be a good idea.
It's more difficult if you aren't passing; correcting people (that don't matter) just outs you and makes you stand out, which was worse IMO. I dislike (okay HATE) outing myself.
I agree.
@Arch: Oh wow, that sucks. I'm glad it was just a mis-reading. But I still don't get how people get into this zone and look at a male and still call him miss, I just don't get it. I would think you would immediately correct yourself if you said that wrong pronoun. I would anyways.
My ex, who is a little femmy, was occasionally misgendered. He was always amused and never corrected the other person. He is not confrontational. Of course, when he opened his mouth and said something, they immediately realized their mistake and were acutely embarrassed.
When I talk, people still don't recognize their mistake. My voice is not female, but it's not real deep either. I think it sounds male though.
Then again, perhaps one aspect of his amusement was his knowledge of my own trans-ness. Sometimes, when we went into a store or went out to eat, the server/clerk would say something like, "What can I get for you gentlemen?" It was always awkward for me because I didn't want to say anything and not sound like a guy.
I understand that.
Dominick, people do tend to make quick evaluations, and height is often an important element. But I know a trans man who is super short, and absolutely nobody doubts that he is male. It could be that with shorter guys, especially those who transition fairly young, it just takes longer for them to be read accurately 100% of the time.
Is 30 years old still young? To me that's not too young anymore.
But your face looks awesome--you look exactly like a teenage boy to me.
Thanks. Teenage boy, that's cool, takes a lot of years off my age, lol. :)
I think I might do a voice clip. I'll try to post that soon.
@Danielle: That's good to know.
@Andy8715: I know. I just haven't learned how to do that yet. I gota work on that.
@Rock: Stance? I'm not sure. I don't think I stand like a girl.
When I was a teenager I was very andro and my gender was often confused.
Same here. Mostly as a kid though.
I never put my feet together, I always have my feet apart. Doesn't seem natural to have my feet together. Thanks for the tip. :)
@meh: That sucks, I'm sorry. People don't ask me if I'm a boy or girl, (I used to get that as a kid though) but now I think people can't tell that why a lot of time no pronouns are used at all.
N-O-T-H-I-NG
Maybe only smoothness of the skin and no facial hair but many boys don't like keeping facial hair. It could be other factor as your boobs, hips or voice. But overall in the pic you look male at a glance and so passable.
QuoteIs 30 years old still young? To me that's not too young anymore.
Yes!!!!!!! Never underestimate the "reverse age effect" that so many FTMs face when they transition before forty.
Everybody is different, but so many guys I've seen who transitioned in their twenties AND thirties are read as teenagers or under twenty-one when they're early in transition. And, let's face it, a lot of teenage boys still look androgynous. That could be a deciding factor for some people who are misreading you.
One guy I know was out with his wife, and people thought he was her sixteen-year-old son. He's got to be pretty close to your age--thirtyish. My short friend, the one who is still misread sometimes, is now in his early thirties. I was out with him about eighteen months ago, and we ran into my regular doctor. We talked for a few minutes before he took off. I had an appointment with that same doctor a few weeks later, and he was curious about my friend's age. I said, "Thirty...thirty-one...something like that." He was surprised. He knows my age, so maybe he was wondering why I was hanging around with underage boys now! Another guy I know transitioned in his late thirties, and he still looks like he's in his mid-twenties. He's well into his forties now...must be forty-five. Looks twenty years younger.
And then there's me. My age is finally catching up with me. When I was earlier in transition, lots of people thought I was in my late twenties. I was forty-six, forty-seven. Now I'm routinely placed in my thirties, but I'll be fifty this year.
I can't quite wrap my mind around that. I spent so many years frozen in adolescence (in my head) that I don't know what age I am anymore. I'm pushing fifty, people think I'm maybe thirty-five, and I feel fifteen a lot of the time. Augh.
I will be at 15 months soon. I am misgendered at least 9 times out of 10. It makes me feel horrible. It gives me a whole lot of social anxiety and discomfort. I do not know why I am misgendered. It's super frustrating.
Have you done any videos lately, Nygeel?
Quote from: Arch on February 13, 2012, 01:53:38 AM
Have you done any videos lately, Nygeel?
Indeedalee. I locked the video as private though, and based on videos people here can't figure Ou why I'm not seen as male.
@Happy Girl: Thanks. It's not the breast. I bind and my jacket hides everything. I didn't speak until after she gave me my change back and she called me "she" before she heard my voice.
@Arch:And, let's face it, a lot of teenage boys still look androgynous. That could be a deciding factor for some people who are misreading you.
That's a possibility.
It's cool to take a lot of years off the aging, but it's a good thing and bad thing at the same time depending on the age.
Now I'm routinely placed in my thirties, but I'll be fifty this year.
Wow! That's cool! Your gonna be 50 and you don't look it. I hope when I turn 50 I don't look it either. See, that's where it's a good thing to look younger than older.
@Nygeel: I'm sorry. That totally sucks to be on T that long and not pass so much. Hopefully you'll start passing more soon.
Quote from: Kreuzfidel on February 12, 2012, 12:26:30 AM
Do adults honestly ask people this question? I can understand kids doing it (and by kids I mean age 12 max, most older than that should know better etiquette IMHO), but what kind of adult actually asks this? I'm just appalled at the lack of tact and manners if people are asking this for real.
I get this from kids and adults. >.>
Standing in line at a restaurant some old people were talking VERY loudly asking each other "Is that a boy or a girl?". One of them turns around, right in my face and turns back around and says "You just can't tell these days". I was a little amused. My boyfriend was really pissed though.
Quote from: meh on February 13, 2012, 10:44:07 PM
I get this from kids and adults. >.>
Standing in line at a restaurant some old people were talking VERY loudly asking each other "Is that a boy or a girl?". One of them turns around, right in my face and turns back around and says "You just can't tell these days". I was a little amused. My boyfriend was really pissed though.
That exact exchange happened to me long ago - except I was at a servo and it was a young (country bumpkin) couple.
Quote from: Kreuzfidel on February 13, 2012, 11:54:25 PM
That exact exchange happened to me long ago - except I was at a servo and it was a young (country bumpkin) couple.
Servo
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Servo may refer to:
* Servomechanism, or servo, a device used to provide control of a desired operation through the use of feedback
o Servo (radio control), a small, cheap, mass-produced actuator used for radio control and small robotics
o Servo bandwidth
o Servo control
o Servo drive, a special electric amplifier used to control electric servomechanisms
o Servo valve
* SERVO Magazine, a monthly robotics publication.
Servo may also be:
* Tom Servo, a fictional character from the television series Mystery Science Theater 3000
* A fictitious multipurpose tool used by Gary Seven in the Star Trek episode Assignment: Earth
* A Naval tool used to measure voltage
* Servotronic, speed-dependent power steering
* Australian slang term for a petrol station; a contraction of "service station"
* A character in the television series Superhuman Samurai Syber-Squad
* A non-playable character from computer game The Sims: Livin' Large
* A playable character from the expansion pack The Sims 2: Open for Business
* A song by The Brian Jonestown Massacre from the album Give It Back!
* A defunct UK punk band
-----
I do have to say I've gotten the "you just can't tell these days" comments too often. Especially from out-of-towners and suburbanites who think our little urban area is NYC or Tokyo or something. Getting clucked at like I'm not there is unpleasant.
Sorry, Felix! The slang for service station - it just becomes second nature lol :)
Quote from: Kreuzfidel on February 14, 2012, 12:18:35 AM
Sorry, Felix! The slang for service station - it just becomes second nature lol :)
Thank you I actually love hearing these kinds of cultural nuances. I just feel the need to demonstrate either what I learned or the fact that I'm clueless. ;D
Quote from: meh on February 12, 2012, 12:07:55 AM
I also get a lot of "Are you a boy or a girl?".
The closest I have gotten to this was about 7 months on t, in a situation where everyone was extremely drunk, when a guy I'd just met said something like, "so...are you a guy, or are you male?" Which was kind of hilarious rather than annoying considering how that came out.
Lol at the 'you just can't tell.' Sounds like it comes from a very simple mind. It's not like gender variance or different presentations are anything new.
I'm told I sound like a teenage boy when I talk. Thankfully I don't look like a teenage boy anymore but I could see how some people could place you in that category, Dominick. I've always looked younger than I am though. A lot of people I meet now think I'm somewhere in the 20's. In reality I'm quickly approaching 40. My parents both look 10-20 years younger than they are so for me I think genes comes into play too.
Sometimes I can gauge whether someone is taking me for male or female in a situation where ID might be required to purchase something. Usually I'm not carded, but I think because the clerk might guess female. If they guess male, they often ask for my ID. I was buying some cigars earlier and it was raining so I had the hood of my sweatshirt on and the lady asked to see my ID.
Only if I'm in a "off" mood or having a bad day do I get miffed about the misgendered thing. I mean I kind of walk a very androgynous line anyway, so it's to be expected. Sometimes I kind of enjoy tripping people up a bit ... making them question themselves in their minds, "is that a guy or a girl?"
Heh. I was 46, a few months into transition, and just at the tail end of my androgynous phase when I went to a liquor store I hadn't been to before. The guy carded me, and I reluctantly relinquished my ID, which had a male name but a female marker. He looked at the ID and back at me and back at the ID and back at me...didn't look at all happy but let me buy the booze. But I felt so conspicuous that I tried a different store the next time.
I figure he read me as male at first and then saw my age or the F (or both) and was trying to figure me out. Ugh. I hate feeling like a bug under glass.
I know that I've been lucky because that andro phase didn't last for very long after I started T, but I actually think that middle age has helped me to "pass" better. I might not have looked my age, but I was no longer a fresh-faced youth, either. A few grey hairs and a few character lines can go a long way toward making a newly transitioned guy look more manly. Of course, there are too many little factors to fully account for, and they all add up in different ways and vary from guy to guy. It's all rather mysterious.