Hi everybody, I haven't posted much yet so, here's the quick scoop: I am transitioning from mtf, and am 33 years old, have only had laser on face 3 times a few years ago. I am pre-hormones.
I am getting zapped early next week and am afraid because of the last time I had it done. That last time I was on estrogen/spiro and I cried like a little girl and was psychologically scarred for a short while after.
Is there anything I can do to lessen the pain? I am going to do this no matter what but I'm scared.
hmm..i had laser and felt very little discomfort. The only real discomfort I had was the sunburn feeling on the face afterwards.
When someone feels pain during laser, that "usually" means the shave to the face wasn't close enough.
If I were you, I would buy a new good sharp razor (not the disposable kind) and shave immediately before your trip to the laser center.
You could try a topical anaesthetic cream.
We have one here in the UK called EMLA. I don't know if that's available where you are but I'm sure there would be something similar.
An anaesthetic cream eh (Canadian)? I will look into this asap and I will try buying a better razor and shave closer...I had no idea that might help but I will try it.
If anyone else looks here, what about pain killers? I have taken very little in the way of any kind of pills or meds in my whole life, so I am kind of clueless about this
Some questions I need to ask:
1. Were you using a disposable razor prior to laser
2. How long prior to the session did you shave?
I ask these because if you use a good razor and shaved right before going, you only should feel a tingling sensation.
Using a vicodin is a little extreme for laser. I know girls who may use one for electrolysis...but I never seen a girl use one for laser. Because on the selling points of laser vs electro is that it is virtually pain free for laser.
If you shaved an hour before laser that is too far apart.
If you shaved a few hours before laser, I would not wish that on my enemies.
Laser burns the dark hairs in the skin....if you hadn't shaved in a few hours then there is more hair to burn.
Using a bad razor or not shaving immediately prior to laser is like shaving your face as soon as you get out of bed without using water or moisturizer... a dry shave with a dull razor
I have had one session and they told me not to shave. And OMG, it hurt so bad. It was like someone snapping your face with a rubber band. over and over again.
Beauty is pain.
Stephanie_b I know what you mean, especially on the top lip. Omg that f'n hurts. She does that part last for me, so I'm going to ask her to do that first sense the numbing cream is still full effect.. But it also depends on how the intensity of the light is. My sessions, she uses a pretty high setting because my skin can take it. But it hurts.lol ... Mabe drinking some alcohol works. Jk.lol.
I found it not so much painful as shocking - it reminded me of accidentally touching an electrified sheep fence. Oh, and the cold air up the nostrils is definitely to be avoided!
Quote from: Padma on March 14, 2012, 01:27:26 PM
I found it not so much painful as shocking - it reminded me of accidentally touching an electrified sheep fence. Oh, and the cold air up the nostrils is definitely to be avoided!
what were you doing kissing an electrified sheep fence? :P
Quote from: JenJen2011 on March 14, 2012, 12:39:41 PM
Beauty is pain.
LOL it certainly 'can' be.. yeah, I haven't tried the laser treatment myself, I went with good old Electrolysis. 'That' is pain of a different kind, especially in sensitive area's ;D
Quote from: Annah on March 14, 2012, 01:44:12 PM
what were you doing kissing an electrified sheep fence? :P
Oh, my body is
very interconnected... :)
Thanks everyone, for your input, and to Annah: that makes perfect sense to me about what you said (the timing of shaving and quality of razor), and I will definately use the advice given in these replies.
However, they won't give me an appointment now until I have started hrt so for now I am going to wax. I'm presenting as male now, but I don't care: the whiskers have got to go and shaving closely isn't good enough for me, they have to be gone.
Check with the laser people before waxing - I know that plucking and laser are not good to do too close together, so just make sure first, you can end up with a very sore face otherwise.
Yep, it's very painful, even if shaved as close as I could. It's awesome, though, after two sessions I'm almost hair-free. Just a few more spots of hair left.
I've had two sessions on my face so far. The first one I didn't really feel a thing. I mentioned that at the beginning of my second session and my technician upped the laser setting. I felt it more during the session but afterwards it just felt like that sunburn feeling. Also there were patches where it almost looked like i had bruising. It cleared up after a week. We'll see what happens after my third session on the 24th.
Quote from: Padma on March 14, 2012, 02:18:09 PM
Check with the laser people before waxing - I know that plucking and laser are not good to do too close together, so just make sure first, you can end up with a very sore face otherwise.
Good idea. I am not sure how long it will take for the hairs to grow back after waxing...that would be lousy if when the time comes for laser, that there are no hairs to zap! Lol
I was told not to do any waxing 2 weeks before an appointment.
It's also because plucking/waxing irritates the under-skin, so when the laser zaps it can make the skin very sore, especially on the face.
yeah, waxing and plucking isn't good if you want laser as others have pointed out.
*sigh* okay, I'm convinced, no waxing for me. I was just going to get a waxing kit too, but decided to check here first. Glad I did :)
Did I read something right, did OP say that they won't let you make a laser appointment until you begin HRT? How can that be true?
I had my 2nd session today. I shave 1.5-2 hrs before my appointment (because I have to drive 1.5hrs to the clinic...Groupon). It's not very painful (but it's sure not pleasant!). I have a very high tolerance for pain, though, and don't react even when things hurt.
Yes, I was told by them that it would be wasting my money if I were to do it before I'm on t-blockers and e.
Totally false. However, fwiw, I started 6 weeks ago, and half my treatments will be before HRT, the other half after.
I had laser before, it was before I was on hrt. It did seem to work fine then; I guess that's just the way they do it where I went. She didn't flat out refuse, she just said that in good concience that she couldn't waste my money on it now.
She said that because of the testosterone, that if I did it now than the hairs will just grow back. I don't know. Also there ar other transwomen that get laser done where I went.
Quote from: Stephanie_b on March 15, 2012, 05:09:22 PM
I had laser before, it was before I was on hrt. It did seem to work fine then; I guess that's just the way they do it where I went. She didn't flat out refuse, she just said that in good concience that she couldn't waste my money on it now.
She said that because of the testosterone, that if I did it now than the hairs will just grow back. I don't know. Also there ar other transwomen that get laser done where I went.
I was under the impression that when you kill the follicle it was dead. There's males who are not transitioning or anything and get their faces done, backs, arms, whatever.
I'm beginning to think I got the "bum's rush."
I am going to call them tomorrow and see if I can get it done anyway, because: I can't wax, shaving isn't good enough(I have jet black hair and fairly pale skin) because even with a close shave, my whiskers can always be seen.
I have to make some progress, and laser had me excited and then when I wa told to wait, I became severely depressed.
If they won't do it then I will call somewhere that will.
Thanks for all the comments ladies, it helps quite a bit and is appreciated.
Not every laser is the same nor is every ones tan and hair color. The greater the contrast between the hair color and the skin the higher setting on the laser can be applied.
For people who say laser isn't that painful it is true only for them!
On the beginning of my treatments I cried a lot and had a break down just like the original poster said. I even had to break up the first session and finish the other half of my face the week after. That all with close shave numbing cream and icing before. It is apparently fairly common reaction for the beginners. I am relatively pail with black hair and my hairs were really coarse and grew really deep into my skin. I was able to pull some hairs out that were almost half an inch in length and that from super close shave! It was hard to believe but then I knew why was I hurting so much. My father wouldn't even come close to the coarsens and hair density I used to have on my face as I inherited my mother's father steel brush face.
I'd be careful and not blame people for their probable failure to shave properly, it could be simply genetics!
To the OP, hang in there. It gets easier as with each session you'll have lesser hair density on your face and you learn to breath through the pain. It never gets just a breeze I always feel a bit disoriented after each session but the trauma doesn't reach the same level. I am pretty much done after 10 sessions and I haven't shaved for 3 weeks prior to my 10th session and all the girly blond peach fuzz grew over my face. It was a dream come true.
Quote from: Stephanie_b on March 15, 2012, 05:28:21 PM
I'm beginning to think I got the "bum's rush."
I am going to call them tomorrow and see if I can get it done anyway, because: I can't wax, shaving isn't good enough(I have jet black hair and fairly pale skin) because even with a close shave, my whiskers can always be seen.
I have to make some progress, and laser had me excited and then when I wa told to wait, I became severely depressed.
If they won't do it then I will call somewhere that will.
Thanks for all the comments ladies, it helps quite a bit and is appreciated.
Don't forget that it takes around 6 sessions spaced at least 6 weeks apart for full results...so you'll have to be patient. However, you should see some results after the first session, and increasingly good results thereafter. People who are doing theirs 4 weeks apart are doing them too frequently.
Also, note that everyone's pain level tolerance is different...and at different times, too. For me, waxing was totally tolerable, even on the chest and tummy...but after I started menopause supps ("phytoestrogen") the pain was absolutely intolerable. I haven't gone back to waxing since (although I might for my legs/crotch).
OTOH, laser was ok. The bad part (for me) wasn't the upper lip (although that's no joy either), but rather when the laser snaps into the jawbone.
I was told you can't wax the face? At any rate, my first 6 face sessions (laser) removed about 2/3rds of the beard/5 o'clock shadow. (I shave within 2 hours of going; the first time I went I hadn't shaved at all (misunderstood their directions) but it didn't hurt excessively then. I am on my second set of 6, but have only done one of those.
I have had several sessions done. I pop a few OTC pain pills shave an hour before i go in and i feel fine.. It hurts a bit more on the chin and uper lip but its nothing compaired to when i did 12 treatments of Tattoo laser removal that is way worse... Feel like your getting electricuted... So hair removal is way easier... Even tattoos hurt worst... So its all in your mind set... Just think happy thoughts when there zapping you its gonna take your mind off the pain trust me it works.... Good luck
Ok.. So I just did my 4th session today. I figure I tell you a little bit about the experience today. :'(... So I put a thick layer of numbing cream on, which helped a lot more. I also popped some Advil 30 mins before session (helped).Thank goodness I did because she turned the laser up higher today. And just a little too high. :( .. Like it was going fine then she hit a spot on my cheekbone and holy ->-bleeped-<- ballz.. Like it gave me a nice black and blue bruise. I hope it goes away. But that was a little scary. So she actually put the settings back down to the last session, Which I think its (30 joules and 13 mm.. not really sure).. .. So that was an unforgettable experience today. lol
Im hoping to get laser in a week or two, now I'm dreading it...:embarrassed:
Quote from: Siobhan on March 17, 2012, 11:55:33 AM
Im hoping to get laser in a week or two, now I'm dreading it...:embarrassed:
Don't. Try to find someone with years of experience, though. That's so key. Then get the closest shave as possible. Everyone's tolerance is different. For some of us it's no big deal; for others it's hell.
I did electrolysis on a weekly basis for two years, it was expensive and felt like god-awful bee stings although I took a couple of Advil just prior and applied lidocaine. The electrologist never removed any two hairs that were close and used a shotgun pattern approach to avoid scarring. Although I had very light facial hair to begin with I still have to shave every third day to scrape off the stragglers. I would have preferred laser and wished that my facial hair was dark instead of blonde because I had been told initially that laser works well on dark hairs and not well on blonde. I've seen a few MtF's before and after that had really black facial hair that wound up with really beautiful, smooth faces following laser treatments.
Laser. Hurts. Like. Hell.
For the first 3 or 4 sessions it seems to hurt pretty bad, but after that the pain starts to fall off.
Quote from: Samantharz on March 17, 2012, 01:03:05 PM
Laser. Hurts. Like. Hell.
For the first 3 or 4 sessions it seems to hurt pretty bad, but after that the pain starts to fall off.
I hope it does hurt less after a few treatments. How it felt for me was like this: miniature atomic bombs exploding beneath my skin. May sound exaggerated, but its as close a description as I can think of.
Ah, you're all a bunch of girls! ;)
LOL...another thing to do is learn to meditate, and let the sensation you're calling "pain" pass through you, leaving no trace of itself or of the stubble.
Seriously. Meditation--yoga or whatever it's called--helps me out daily, and I do use it on those days I'm sensitive to pain.
The common things I hear to lessen the pain.
1. Go to the bathroom before starting!
2. You'll want to shave before going in. How soon depends entirely on how fast your hair grows.
3. About an hour beforehand, take a few ibuprofen or aspirin. Acetaminophen/paracetamol won't work, it isn't an anti-inflammatory.
4. Lidocaine, Prilocaine, or EMLA (which has both) cream. Get some and apply it about 45 minutes before going in. A lot of laser techs will apply it themselves if you ask.
5. If they don't provide them, try getting a few of those stress-relieving squeeze balls to hold onto during the treatment.
6. Don't stop. The fewer hairs to zap, the less pain there'll be. My second laser session, I was taking breaks more for the smell of the treatment than the pain.
Also, be prepared for uneven results. My first laser session obliterated the hair on the sides of my face, did a decent job of the moustache, and barely touched anything under my jawbone.
Quote from: Beth Andrea on March 17, 2012, 04:33:08 PM
Ah, you're all a bunch of girls! ;)
LOL...another thing to do is learn to meditate, and let the sensation you're calling "pain" pass through you, leaving no trace of itself or of the stubble.
Seriously. Meditation--yoga or whatever it's called--helps me out daily, and I do use it on those days I'm sensitive to pain.
I think that my high tolerance of pain comes from being able to distance myself from the feeling. I'm pretty much naturally able to do this, but it usually takes cultivation through meditation. I highly recommend it! I've always surprised masseuses: they ask how much pain I'm feeling on a scale of 1-10, and I often say 9, but for them to keep going because it doesn't really bother me. I know that the pain is there, but you'd hardly even know it. So this week during my 2nd session, the technician couldn't believe that I didn't even twitch.
Quote from: Renee D on March 17, 2012, 04:38:34 PM
weird, mine had me come in with one to two days worth of growth to do mine. Wasn't bad either except for the upper lip, that hurt. Got good results in 8 treatments spread out at six to eight week intervals, depending on what was actually growing. Now all I really have is white and gray, so don't need a lot of makeup.
I was also told by my laser clinic to leave one to two days worth of growth as well. The laser works better on the full hair follicle that it can reach rather than if someone who is clean shaven.
Quote from: Naturally Blonde on March 18, 2012, 01:01:52 PM
I was also told by my laser clinic to leave one to two days worth of growth as well. The laser works better on the full hair follicle that it can reach rather than if someone who is clean shaven.
Except that this defies physics...why is it easier to reach the follicle (which is under the skin) with hair on the surface (thus getting in the laser's way)? Makes zero sense. I think that there's just a lot of people using these machines and methods without really understanding how they work.
It hurts, but, well, it's not like YOU're doing yourself this pain, like in waxing. So just lie down and wait. Pain isn't so bad to endure if you can't do anything about it.
Anyway, you can buy Emla cream to numb the area... Though it's gonna be costy. It's not generally covered by insurance (not for me, at least) and it's quite expensive. Like 60(?) dollars for a small tube, which will BARELY cover your whole face. You see, you need to apply a very thick layer; multiple millimeters. That, and afterwards, the whole area must be covered in a hermetic layer for at least one hour (?), such as a plastic wrap for food. If you find a way to effectively cover your whole face and be able to breathe, tell me... And even if you do, it will sure be weird to walk into the clinic looking like that.
Anyway, if you want my opinion, just endure it, and apply a soothing product afterwards. You can probably reduce pain a little by taking two or three ibuprofen pills an hour or two before your appointment, but don't expect miracles.
rachl: Longer hairs = larger dark surface = more heat produced = more effective. I'm no expert, but it makes sense to me.
Quote from: rachl on March 18, 2012, 01:07:40 PM
Except that this defies physics...why is it easier to reach the follicle (which is under the skin) with hair on the surface (thus getting in the laser's way)? Makes zero sense. I think that there's just a lot of people using these machines and methods without really understanding how they work.
So why do the laser clinics complain if my skin is clear from hair?
Quote from: Naturally Blonde on March 18, 2012, 03:21:31 PM
So why do the laser clinics complain if my skin is clear from hair?
Quite possibly because they don't know what they're talking about?
A: except that that's not how it works. Heating the hair above the follicle has no help in destroying the follicle: it makes it less effective, in fact, and just causes pain. And the laser puts out a fixed amount of energy: extra hair taking that energy means LESS energy hitting the follicle.
I'll echo what others have said. Takes multiple sessons. My 2 o'clock shadow was horrible before i started lasers. I went through a series of 8 sessions at one place with very good results on the neck and cheeks. Those two spots are almost clean now. The chin, lips and mustache for me are much tougher and more painful. The old place i went to is out of business so i'm at a new place now. Each time it gets better, but the lips and nose area are always painful form.
Scheduling:
1. I have heard that it is more painful in the mornings when the skin is fresh. So I've always schedule mine for the evenings.
2. I also usually schedule for later in the week (Thursday or Friday). See shaving comment below for rationale.
3. Both places i've been to recommend spreading the sessions 6-8 weeks apart.
Before each session:
1. My skin is pale and hairs are dark / dense. So i shave the morning of the appointment, then again a few hours before the appointment.
2. Sometimes I use the ibuprofin an hour or so ahead of time. It seems to help, but it might just be in my mind.
After each session:
1. You could try some non-alcohol based soothing sunburn cream / spray to use for a few days after each session. That seems to help my skin recover (and feels wonderful).
2. Putting an ice bag on the area immediately after each laser session. This helps to minimize swelling. But i don't leave it on my the artery on my neck for too long because i get woozy >:(
3. I also don't shave for a day or two afterward due to sensitivity of my skin, swelling etc. after each laser session. This is why I schedule my session for late in the week, so i don't have to good to work looking unshaven.
Lastly, Not sure if others notice this as well. On some parts of my face/beard, it just gradually decreases the amount of hairs uniformally :). But on some spots like my neck, i noticed after one session that i had several small hairless spots. >:( Then in the next sesssion i saw fantastics results :) like all the bare spots connected and all the hairs dissappeared in between. Smooth like a baby's bottom.
Now I have some small bare dots on my chin... and i'm eagerly looking forward to my next session to see if it will yield fatastic results for the rest of the chin area.
Obviously not scientific, but the patchiness seems to be a good omen for me. :angel:
Yeah it sounds really strange to let the hair grow out =/. My laser therapist told me to shave as close as I could before coming over to her.
The heat will spread onto your skin if the hairs are too long and thus be less effective. And damn it will be alot more painful.
Quote from: StaceyC on March 18, 2012, 05:07:16 PM
Lastly, Not sure if others notice this as well. On some parts of my face/beard, it just gradually decreases the amount of hairs uniformally :). But on some spots like my neck, i noticed after one session that i had several small hairless spots. >:( Then in the next sesssion i saw fantastics results :) like all the bare spots connected and all the hairs dissappeared in between. Smooth like a baby's bottom.
Now I have some small bare dots on my chin... and i'm eagerly looking forward to my next session to see if it will yield fatastic results for the rest of the chin area.
Obviously not scientific, but the patchiness seems to be a good omen for me. :angel:
I have the same experience as you have regarding the results. On my neck there is almost no hair left and it is smooth like never before :D. I have small spots in my face where the hair still grows but they are not close to what it was before and I have only done 4 sessions now. The shadow is almost completely gone now and after I shave my skin is smooth for a little more than 24hrs (before I could never experience this even directly after shaving). I am happy as hell about the results :D
Also, if the last session was too painful, say something to the technician. You don't want to be traumatized. Each time i go in, the technician looks at my sheet with my history, asks how the last session went, how the results were etc. Both the places i've been to, and multiple technicians at each do this initial discussion each time so that's a perfect opportunity. So if it was too strong, they could drop the laser down a notch if necessary.
Anyway good luck. Hope it goes better the next time.
And just to confuse things more, the reason I was told to not shave the first time was so they could take a "before" pic. As it turned out, I was in and out so fast they didn't have time to get the camera.
After that, they tell me to shave "the morning of the appt." (I usually have mid-afternoon appointments).
The laser is not a precision instrument for hair removal...it was described to me as a "hand grenade", which affects a quarter-sized area. That's why the tech skips around the face, about an inch (25mm) apart; closer than this and some areas will get a double zap (which increases pain + redness) They tell me they can tell which areas have been treated thoroughly, so they don't re-do an area that's currently bare.
I would think if the beard hair is long (like 2-3 days "long) that would have an effect on surface burns and weakening of the laser under the skin...but very short "shadow" whiskers (just enough to detect as "needing a shave") would not affect performance/outcome.
But, whatever. Laser works for me, and it's tons cheaper than electrolysis.
Ooouuch!! To me, laser feels like hot needles poking my skin! Afterwards, my face is burning and swelled up for a couple of days! I get big "duck lips" so I joke to my friends that I got Botox on them. lol Even being on hrt for eight months my facial hair is still very resistant! I will be going for my ninth session next month. Ugh! I'm so anxious to get rid of them!