there are many pov's of what it means "to transition". i find it amusing that some so-called "ts's" consider [their crossdressing] transition. if some of "us" keep on thinking this way, soon we will not need anything at all to be [recognized] and [accepted] as women in our society. >:D what a gag transsexualism would be then...
transition means exactly what it implies. to stop living your life as your birth sex completely and begin the quest to be physiologically, psychologically, anatomically and legally the gender you identify as.
Quote from: Katia on March 31, 2007, 12:02:42 PM
there are many pov's of what it means "to transition"....transition means exactly what it implies. to stop living your life as your birth sex completely and begin the quest to be physiologically, psychologically, anatomically and legally the gender you identify as.
Actually a transistion is the process of change from one state of being to another, not the completion. When you finish your transistion, you just continue on with your life, your transistion is said and done, but like it or not, you now live with the history and label of having transistioned. The question is when the "done" occurs. Right now the medicial and legal definition is SRS and an amended birth certificate where you can change the rest of your documentation.
Just my $.02.
--Susan--
Using some of the words from the former two posts, we can conclude that transition is the process to be physiologically, psychologically, anatomically and legally the gender you identify as. We have to remember, however, that this is only true and a MUST for transsexuals (not other gender-variant people), unless of course there is a medical condition which prevents you from doing so.
tink :icon_chick:
The concept of transition in this regard is not solely the domain of transsexuals. People transition from school to working in the real world. People transition from one line of work to another. People transition from being babies to children to adults and so on. Transition means to move from one state to another. So we could be talking about Phase Transition of matter through its possible states [solid, liquid, gas, plasma, bosonic condensate, fermionic condensate]. Either way, the concept of transition is simply universal, but that when we are talking about transsexuals, transition means to change from one sex to another in the context to their target sex.
Now, I do have my own transition plans as a TG, but not from male to female, but from man [masculine] to what I wish to be [which I am still figuring out to a point, but it really have no single word to describe it other than androgyne]. But my transition probably won't entail SRS, it could entail HRT if certain therapists and endos are willing [which I know a few from friends], and a name change, a work change [in the respect that I may have to work as an independent contractor in systems development and analysis], and etc. I do definitely plan to get other kinds of surgeries [FFS, and other cosmetic surgeries] as well. None of these are at all exclusive to my transition, whereas your transition has one singular exclusive surgery which is often the big red dot center for all transsexuals: SRS.
-- Bridget
Psychologically transitioning is very hard to define as long as we don't have a clear definition of what a "woman" is - and it seems tied to culture. Would we define this as "takes the social role of a woman"? But this requires passing in many places...
For anatomic transition it has been impossible for most TSs who have lived in history. And it is still impossible for most TS people living in third-world countries. And many people have counterindications for HRT and/or surgery. Thus clearly not all TS do transition anatomically.
Legally transitioning varies from country to country. It doesn't affect the daily lives most of the time.
What part of transitioning is universal?
It's universal in that it's the definition for a change of an entity from one state of being to another. Basically, that's the metaphysical use of transition.
-- Bridget
Quote from: Anemonie on April 01, 2007, 12:04:08 PM
I wouldn't call that a completed transition, but I think that it is certainly one aspect of transitioning.
The problem is transitions never end. That's the nature of existence. If there's a God, please call him and ask for an upgrade on our ontology. :3
QuoteI'm also not sure if I agree with the use of the term "cross-dressing".
When I see that term or hear it I usually conceive of people baring crosses like Roman prisoners. :3
-- Bridget
That part I don't think is true, since when we die that which we are is now gone. The memories, the thoughts, and the ideas. So I would say we can avoid death, only if we ensure life. :3
-- Brede
The root meaning of trans is across. So transgender is across gender, transsexual across sex. The word transition implies movement to something different. Transition isn't necessarily the result, but the process. At least, that's how transition works in my life :)
zythyra
Quoteto stop living your life as your birth sex completely and begin the quest to be physiologically, psychologically, anatomically and legally the gender you identify as.
Well, which part of a woman's life are we referring to here? Most women go thru three easily identifiable periods [no pun intended] in her life, pre-mensual, mensual, and post-mensual.
The feelings, level of intensity of those feelings, and experiences vary greatly from one period to another, and so do the goals.
Since most transitions I have observed are designer [self-administered hormones], which period of a woman's life is the typical person aiming for? Does it matter to you? Why?
My goal in transition changed from 'living the life' to 'anatomically and legally' female the day the submarine base police took me out of the commissary because two employees compalined about my rest room use. I didn't want that sword hanging over me nor the inability to use a ladies locker room. That little push made me sign up for SRS. It was a few weeks before the still quiet voice told me I needed to fully transition. How about that. The police knew what God wanted me to do before I did.
Robyn
Gender transitioning is for me a process that won't be over until I find happiness. I am transitioning from miserable to happy. Whatever I do to get there and however I end up doesn't matter as long as I'm happy.
Too often we press our definitions on others and expect them to conform or we won't recognize them as they define themselves. And we classify them accordingly. Kind of like what society does to us. That's one of the reasons the trans community hasn't become a strong voice that people take seriously.
I used to prescribe to more rigid definitions but as I go through my own transition I realize that I have been just as guilty as the society that repressed me when I "force" those definitions on others. If they work for me, that's all that matters. Everyone should find what makes them happiest and do it (as long as it doesn't harm others).
Julie
Quote from: zythyra on April 01, 2007, 03:41:13 PM
The root meaning of trans is across. So transgender is across gender, transsexual across sex. The word transition implies movement to something different. Transition isn't necessarily the result, but the process. At least, that's how transition works in my life :)
zythyra
Aha! good point! :) and this is exactly why I said that for a
TRANSSEXUAL, transition means exactly this:
Quote from: Tink on March 31, 2007, 05:43:30 PM
transition is the process to be physiologically, psychologically, anatomically and legally the gender you identify as. We have to remember, however, that this is only true and a MUST for transsexuals (not other gender-variant people), unless of course there is a medical condition which prevents you from doing so.
tink :icon_chick:
Naturally, if a person is not transsexual but falls into another category of the gender spectrum, then the meaning of
transition changes according to the category that they identify as.
tink :icon_chick:
just to clarify, this post pertains to transexuality. what does transition mean for the transexual?
Quote from: taru on April 01, 2007, 02:26:19 AM
Psychologically transitioning is very hard to define as long as we don't have a clear definition of what a "woman" is - and it seems tied to culture. Would we define this as "takes the social role of a woman"? But this requires passing in many places...
For anatomic transition it has been impossible for most TSs who have lived in history. And it is still impossible for most TS people living in third-world countries. And many people have counterindications for HRT and/or surgery. Thus clearly not all TS do transition anatomically.
Legally transitioning varies from country to country. It doesn't affect the daily lives most of the time.
What part of transitioning is universal?
ya, there are always going to be exceptions if you live in a foreign country, have a medical illness, are paralyzed from head to toe or whatever. the fact of the matter is that if someone identifies as ts, that person will definitely seek anatomical correction. if someone says they are ts but doesn't want to go through all this process, then that person [isn't] transexual but another form of tg.
Transition means doing the do, to quote Betty Boo.
Less talk, more walk.
Quote from: Stormy Weather on April 02, 2007, 02:49:51 AM
Transition means doing the do, to quote Betty Boo.
Less talk, more walk.
i agree. yes you heard me correctly, i agree! ;) more walk and less talk. gotta love it! it isn't a pretty dress every weekend, or every day for that matter, it isn't to wear makeup, it isn't to wear tutus, etc.
Quote from: Katia on April 02, 2007, 03:08:05 AMit isn't a pretty dress every weekend
Yep, I bought one which was fun and all, then quickly realised that although it was nice I had no reason whatsoever to wear it, :/.
~returns to domestric drudgery~
Quote from: Katia on March 31, 2007, 12:02:42 PM
...
transition means exactly what it implies. to stop living your life as your birth sex completely and begin the quest to be physiologically, psychologically, anatomically and legally the gender you identify as.
Didn't you mean
in your opinion?Good greif, who's to say? Where is this universal law written down? I am not "so-called" transsexual and quite frankly I am getting more than tired of this condescending attitude as if someone made you an authority on what transsexualism is.
When your published on your views and peer reviewed and you can support what you say with at least one shred of evidence, I will listen. Until then you sound like a condescending, insecure, who are you trying to convince(us or you), know it all.
Let's see some evidence. You talk a real big game but can you support any of what you say? Or is it your opinion? Back up what you say or stop saying it. Repeating the same old tired stuff does no one any good. I don't beleive any of it, because I see plenty of people that don't fit your model.
I know you want to beleive that you are ok, everyone else are the fetishists, but it don't work that way. Your continuing to imply that anyone who does not see things like you, must be something different than you is based only on your own insecurity and opinion.
There are plenty of people here who did not transition until late in life. Are they all sex deviants too? Everyone but you? Lets try a little acceptance and try to figure this stuff out instead of continually insulting people and acting as if you are somehow better than everyone else because you had SRS.
Love always,
Elizabeth
Transition includes many things including changing ones sex. My therapist told me I should consider transitioning after I was diagnosed as having GID soon after that I started HRT and began carrying a letter that explains my diagnosis on my letter the key words that got me outa trouble at the Denver airport are "GID includes a chemical and hormonal imbalances" as soon as the coppers saw hormonal imbalance they were cool with it.
Hopefully this thread won't get stuck with one answer only, like I said before why ask?
Quote from: ssindysmith on April 02, 2007, 07:36:23 AM
Transition includes many things including changing ones sex. My therapist told me I should consider transitioning after I was diagnosed as having GID soon after that I started HRT and began carrying a letter that explains my diagnosis on my letter the key words that got me outa trouble at the Denver airport are "GID includes a chemical and hormonal imbalances" as soon as the coppers saw hormonal imbalance they were cool with it.
Hopefully this thread won't get stuck with one answer only, like I said before why ask?
right, this is the process called [transition] and starts with a diagnosis. crossdressing isn't transition anywhere, here, in china, or pluto.
So anyone transitioning but lacking a diagnose is not really transitioning?
It seems Dr. Harry Benjamin would not agree.
http://www.symposion.com/ijt/benjamin/chap_06.htm#Psychological%
20guidance%20in%20transsexualism (http://www.symposion.com/ijt/benjamin/chap_06.htm#Psychological%%3Cbr%20/%3E20guidance%20in%20transsexualism)
QuoteDr. Harry Benjimin
The TRANSSEXUAL PHENOMENON
Harry Benjamin, M.D.
...
Living completely as a woman (though illegally) can actually be a life-saving measure for those transsexuals who find an operation unattainable. I know at least a dozen who are in this situation right now. They work as women in offices, factories, beauty salons, as nurses, domestics, and some, alas, as prostitutes, all quite unknown to their employers, associates, or clients. They would best have psychological as well as medical help in addition to living in their female gender identity; but very few actually have such help. Merely the opportunity to talk to somebody about their problems has its therapeutic value. To find some understanding from a doctor instead of coldness, rejection, or ridicule goes a long way toward easing their burden.
...
Love always,
Elizabeth
I would disagree that transition includes or requires a diagnosis, ever her the term "nonya" it's short for "non of your business" if I choose to transition I would have done so with ĉ or without ŝ a diagnosis :) I did begin my transition before my first visit with my T and really the only reason I went was to get a script for HRT, now thats something I would NOT fool around with.
People throughout history have transitioned gender without diagnosis. The diagnosis is only necessary if one currently requires medical services. And the need for these gatekeepers is highly questionable, in my opinion. An adult should be able to have access to these treatments without having to go to a psychiatrist.
zythyra
oh this is a gag lol, :D the same people who [disagree] with the dsm and the hbsoc are now citing harry benjamin as a reference. ??? people cant have their cake and it too? it's either or.... not both. :)
Actually it is quite consistent.
Some people were referring to hbsoc/dsm diagnosing as something that all "real" transsexuals would do when transitioning - and quoting Harry Benjamin just shows that he doesn't seem to believe it either.
Quote from: Katia on April 04, 2007, 11:00:49 PM
oh this is a gag lol, :D the same people who [disagree] with the dsm and the hbsoc are now citing harry benjamin as a reference. ??? people cant have their cake and it too? it's either or.... not both. :)
I don't beleive you have a clue as to what I beleive and do not beleive. Trying to change the subject to me, with false statements about what I beleive, does not change the fact that Dr Harry Benjiman just refuted all the nonsense you have been spewing, and all the name calling in the world won't change that. Once again, you are speaking your opinion as if it were fact, when really you don't know what you are talking about. Now run along and read the article I linked, before you get caught with your foot in your mouth again.
Love always,
Elizabeth
What's to transition? the metamorphosis from the birth sex to the target gender. That's the best I can explain.
Quote from: Yvonne on April 05, 2007, 03:21:42 AM
What's to transition? the metamorphosis from the birth sex to the target gender. That's the best I can explain.
Now that is a simple and compelling definition.
Love always,
Elizabeth
A----->B
See the -----> bit, that's transition.
What A and B are definied as or even if they really exist or not is where it gets fuzzy
Warning to those concerned and you know who you are. There several replies that are in violation of the rules in this thread. If this persists those concerned run the risk of loosing their posting privileges. Lets keep this civil as I'm not in favour of locking topics just because of a couple of hot heads. Read the rules and act accordingly.
Thanks in advance.
Steph
Matter can phase [transition] too. :icon_nerd:
-- Brede
Quote from: Katia on March 31, 2007, 12:02:42 PM
there are many pov's of what it means "to transition". i find it amusing that some so-called "ts's" consider [their crossdressing] transition. if some of "us" keep on thinking this way, soon we will not need anything at all to be [recognized] and [accepted] as women in our society. >:D what a gag transsexualism would be then...
transition means exactly what it implies. to stop living your life as your birth sex completely and begin the quest to be physiologically, psychologically, anatomically and legally the gender you identify as.
I agree completely Sis, My greatest irritation is those folks in our own community who feel they never have a right to leave the word Transsexual out of their descriptive of themselves after surgery.
JaneX