I'm not sure how to say all this, please forgive my rambling. I have so many questions/concerns/worries that it's difficult to actually articulate anything at all. A little bit of background: I am biologically male and have not yet started HRT, but am graduating and moving into the workforce ASAP, and as soon as I have a steady income of my own, I want to start HRT. I've talked to a couple doctors and therapists, and am pretty much good to go as soon as I have the income.
I've done a lot of reading on the effects of HRT, and was hoping to get some input on how it effects sex drive. I realize the topic has been discussed on this forum, and I have read everything I could find, notably the "Post-Op Sex Drive ?" and "Does Sexdrive change with the start of HRT" threads, but I was wondering if there was any way to preserve or even cultivate a sex drive during HRT, and post SRS.
Many of the comments in the threads I've read have been along the lines of how wonderful it is to no longer be interested in sex, but, at least from where I'm standing now, I would consider losing my sex drive a considerable negative.
In a larger sense, I guess my biggest fear is that hormones will change who I am to the point that I'm a completely different person than I am now. I like being me, I just want my body to reflect the way I think it should have been born, I don't want to become a completely different person who feels completely different about things.
Thank you in advance for all your help,
Lauren
Hi Lauren and welcome!
I think it's important to say that the effects of HRT vary significantly from person to person. In my case, HRT decreased my libido to nothingness, and if you take a minute to read the other threads regarding this topic, you will notice that many (not all) transsexual women have had the same experience. Physiologically this makes sense, for it is testosterone which is responsible for the peak in sexual interest in men and women. As you are administered estrogen and anti-androgens, your testosterone levels decrease and so does your sexual appetite. Please take a second to visit the wiki (https://www.susans.org/wiki/Main_Page) where there's plenty of valuable information on this issue. Good luck!
tink :icon_chick:
Welcome to Susan's, Lauren!
Since testosterone is the hormone that drives the libido in both natal men and women and since transition involves the use of drugs to suppress the action of testosterone in MtF transsexuals I think you may have to put up with a decreased sex drive, at least for awhile. Of course, HRT affects everyone differently so others may tell us that their drive was not affected at all.
In my case, after almost 7 months of HRT, it has dropped considerably and I think it a blessing not to have to deal with that pressure anymore. That doesn't mean I don't get horny, just not as much, and it's kinda different. I can tell you that sex is alot less important now that I'm on my journey, although I'm old enough where the drive should be dropping anyway.
If sex and its potential loss is a big negative for you I think maybe you should wait and take some more time to decide if HRT and its changes are really what you want to do. HRT will not change you in a fundamental way - I'm still the person I always was - but it will free you up to express yourself truly for the first time, if you are transsexual, and your personality may change from that freedom, usually for the better. So I don't think you need to worry about that. But I think you should accept the possibility that you could lose alot more than just your sex drive when you start transition.
Maybe some more time with a gender therapist would help?
Anyhow, while it's not required, why don't you stop in the Introductions section and tell us more about yourself? I'm happy you found us and decided to start posting and I hope we'll get to know you a little better soon.
again, WELCOME ! ! :)
helen
I don't know about the rest but my sex drive diminished after only three months on estrogen. I didn't care about it. You can ask your specialist for other ways to improve your sex drive if they exist.
I don't think it is possible to enhance or maintain ones sex drive with HRT. One of the known, almost universal effects of HRT is the reduction and change in sex drive. I personally cannot wait to start HRT because what little sex drive I have is very frustrating to me. To me whatever change that HRT will bring will be a change for the better
If this is a concern you really need to talk it out with your gender therapist (you need to see one before you start HRT anyway under the standards of care).
If you strongly identify with your sex drive, HRT may be problematic, this part of you will without question change, for some people this is immediate. Most MtF are frustrated by their sex drive on one level or another (they cannot identify with it), thus when it diminishes and changes with HRT it is by in large seen as a positive. Also remember with SRS that you may not get anything sexual out of the genitalia.
I highly suggest reading more on the subject and talking to a gender therapist.
Just remember, part of why many people start HRT is because we feel our body is poisoned by T, it goes beyond just changing our physical appearance to match our mind, it is changing our body chemestry to match our mind.
Quote from: AlwaysLauren on March 31, 2007, 07:43:48 PM
I like being me, I just want my body to reflect the way I think it should have been born, I don't want to become a completely different person who feels completely different about things.
The thing is, if you're identifying as a female, the HRT may/will enhance the things you DO like about yourself, and reduce the things you don't. That's been my experience at least. A welcome shift or altering of focus, not an invasion-of-the-body-snatchers switch.
Also keep in mind that many people report not only a reduction of the male sex drive, but an increasing attraction to men.
Kate
KK, first off, male sexdrive decreases... I still have A sexdrive but its allot diffrent than it used to be...
Second on that thing down there... you need to use it or you loose it... my ex fience was adament about frequent yeah.... anyways untill I broke up with her I had a fairly "normal?" sexlife.....
It is true that for some people sex drive is important, I guess; but it is also true that for some us, sex drive is at the very end of our priority list. I could care less if I ever regain any sexual drive or experience an orgasm as a post-op woman. It would be nice to have it but if I don't, so be it.
tink :icon_chick:
in my experience:
crazy high dose estrogen only : didn't have a drive to start with HRT kinda increased it recently when I went off AA's it sent my sex drive mad and I was on a stack of estrogen, I went a wee bit mental so I went back on the AA's though I still have to taper them off, i'm on half what I was these days and i'll stop again in a month or two.
AA only: messes with you, you need some hormones, this sucks.
AA + estrogen: mild interest in sex if it comes up but not so much any type of drive
Whatever your doc prescribes is what you'll get so don't pick the experience you like most, it likely won't happen the same way for you just that's what I experienced, I really didn't like the sex drive as it's not like I can act on it in any vaugely comfortable way with the way things are at the mo.
I am not sure how to answer this, I lost my sex drive towards woman before HRT now five years later I have an almost nymphomaniac sex drive towards my BF and just a slight drive towards other woman [I am bi]
My sex drive has changed considerably. Just a look when I was 19 made things get hard. That was the male in me. Since I have been on HRT I don't even feel anything down there too much. That is the physical side. Now the mental state. I do get aroused, but it is entirely different. Nothing gets hard. There are no instant feelings that say I have to releive my self. I respond to warm niceness. And maybe after a while if the right buttons are pressed I start to feel like I am wanted. You see when I was in male mode I did not care about anything, but getting off. When you are a woman you want to be caressed and treated like you are something special.
I started a thread on Periods at Susans. I do have a definate time of the month when I am very receptive to sex. I don't understand why. It is just a mental/emotional thing I think. It last for about a week. It is as if I were in heat.
Deb
Quote from: debisl on April 02, 2007, 09:28:28 AM
My sex drive has changed considerably. Just a look when I was 19 made things get hard. That was the male in me. Since I have been on HRT I don't even feel anything down there too much. That is the physical side. Now the mental state. I do get aroused, but it is entirely different. Nothing gets hard. There are no instant feelings that say I have to releive my self. I respond to warm niceness. And maybe after a while if the right buttons are pressed I start to feel like I am wanted. You see when I was in male mode I did not care about anything, but getting off. When you are a woman you want to be caressed and treated like you are something special.
I started a thread on Periods at Susans. I do have a definate time of the month when I am very receptive to sex. I don't understand why. It is just a mental/emotional thing I think. It last for about a week. It is as if I were in heat.
Deb
interesting! you have a very [unique] way to describe your experiences, debisl.
I can still get *hard* but it takes more effort and i masturbate alot less because I don't feel the need to get off. :) But i certainly do get horny if i am with a man or if god forbid, i saw something online.
On Androcur I lost any libido or desire and went nearly two years without any need to "relieve" myself, and only worked up the odd erection to see "if I still could", and yes it may have been much much harder than before but I could "dry orgasm" although the experience no longer gave me pleasure. I never got spontaneously hard even when looking at things that excited me sexually, just a kind of mental satisfaction ....
Post-op and off Androcur my libido has returned with a vengance :o !
Something makes me get hard most days and it feels really good just squeezing thighs together and dreaming !
And the need to relieve myself through orgasm has returned, not as urgent as it used to be, but very definitely a need :) !
Laura
This may be TMI but I've only been on HRT for 3 months now and a few weeks ago I experienced my non-ejaculatory orgasm ever! It was an amazing experience to say the least!
xoxo
Patty
I've had a mixed experience I suppose. There's certainly a sex drive there... I still have sexual desires, but what I don't feel is the need to 'satisfy' my desires as often.
The nature of arousal changes a bit too... it takes a little time to get into the mood, and the mental part is very important. It's not just a physical need. It's actually very hard for me to get 'aroused' if I only physically stimulate myself.
These are all changes that I'd basically expected and desired though. I don't think you can really keep the same sort of masculine sex drive if you're taking any sizable dose of female hormones or antiandrogens.
Okay! Instead of starting a new thread, I'm going to revive this one! I've got a burning question related to HRT and sex drive and the internets have not provided me with the answer.
My problem is that I'm three months into HRT. My brain is still as horny as ever, but my body has more and more refused to go along with the plan. My old male patterns of getting off don't work anymore. This wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing, if I could sort something new out. I know that there has to be a way to get my brain to respond to a more female pattern of orgasm that makes sense now with all my hormones. Any suggestions?
Sorry I can't help you with suggestions :(
But that is curious, I've heard of it in a few cases, but it's not that common. I don't really have much sex drive and just don't care and that's only after almost two months of HRT, so that's odd about yours. You should talk to your doctor about it for sure though, and see if something is up.
It confuses me why someone that wants to use their tool wants to get rid of it.
mines changed a lot....
it went from no desire for sex. to wanting it a lot :D
before i didnt care, now i deffintely have a labido...
it works both ways...
anyway, is sex that big a determining factor in your willingness to transition/take hrt? time for some thinking mebe..
R :police:
After about five month on hormones and blocker I had no interest in sex and really didn't think much about it except for the odd time where just by rubbing down there I could get myself quite stimuated and and have dry orgasm's These were much more intense then they were before. I discovered it was the same after SRS. I guess one is never to old to do it.
Cindy
Quote from: Rachael on October 27, 2007, 12:08:55 PM
time for some thinking mebe..
Quote from: lisagurl on October 27, 2007, 11:04:35 AM
It confuses me why someone that wants to use their tool wants to get rid of it.
I'm not really sure what to say to this. First: I'm not talking about my "tool", I'm talking about sexual desire and drive, which has nothing to do with genetalia for me. Second, I don't think that being interested in sex or wanting to maintain some sort of sex drive is weird or means I should reconsider my transition. In my experience women (especially women my age) consider their sexual desires and drives an important part of who they are, I don't see myself as being any different. Frankly, no matter what society or etiquette say, women who don't care about sex are in a distinct minority.
Sorry if this comes off as harsh, but it makes me angry to be told I'm weird for caring about sex. This is 2007, I won't be made to feel bad about it.
Hi AlwaysLauren
I agree with you. there was a time I thought i would never see the day of experiencing arousals and orgasms with the female anatomy, well now I know, and what's wrong with using it. I think I am hotter sexually now then I was before. Not use to talking about this with other people through ;D
Cindy
Quote from: AlwaysLauren on October 29, 2007, 12:25:23 PM
Quote from: Rachael on October 27, 2007, 12:08:55 PM
time for some thinking mebe..
Quote from: lisagurl on October 27, 2007, 11:04:35 AM
It confuses me why someone that wants to use their tool wants to get rid of it.
I'm not really sure what to say to this. First: I'm not talking about my "tool", I'm talking about sexual desire and drive, which has nothing to do with genitalia for me. Second, I don't think that being interested in sex or wanting to maintain some sort of sex drive is weird or means I should reconsider my transition. In my experience women (especially women my age) consider their sexual desires and drives an important part of who they are, I don't see myself as being any different. Frankly, no matter what society or etiquette say, women who don't care about sex are in a distinct minority.
Sorry if this comes off as harsh, but it makes me angry to be told I'm weird for caring about sex. This is 2007, I won't be made to feel bad about it.
You need to clearly define sex drive. According to data collected in many research papers about 35% of women do not have a sex drive or desire. I would think physically that the genitalia play a large role in the feeling. What is sex without the genitalia? Love is different than sex and does not need the genitalia. Physical closeness is also not sex, kissing, tickling etc. Physical stimulation of the genitalia is sex.
Hormones effect different people in different ways. Some lose all sexual feeling others can still have erections. SRS also is a gamble some never have an organism again others have better one's after the pain stops.
What is weird is putting sex as a more important factor then what gender your mind is. Many would rather not live if they can not transition. That puts sex as a secondary factor. The question is are you more than willing to take that gamble? Remember after a few months on hormones you likely will never be able to father children.
This is not everyones experience but after 6months HRT I am a different person. And I love every minute of it, I do not miss my drive before, actually I never liked my sex drive before HRT. I too have certain times of the month when I am in heat but it's different than male sex drive. Best I can explain it is I can turn my sex drive on and off easily. I have changed a lot so much that people I worked with a year ago don't recognize me by looks or behavior, I went to get my hair done and the receptionist did not recognize me even though I worked with her for almost a year. For me all the changes are fantastic and happen in a natural way, so I wouldn't be fearful. I have heard of T-Girls in the sex traid who take small doses of HRT to preserve there sex drive and combine that with surgeries to make up for things. But if you ask me being a passable woman means giving up certain male things.
Quote from: lisagurl on October 29, 2007, 03:56:21 PM
According to data collected in many research papers about 35% of women do not have a sex drive or desire.
This seems to contradict my experience. Can you provide a source? I find it very difficult to believe that more than a quarter of women have zero sexual drive or desire at all. I realize there are many areas in the US and elsewhere where female sexuality is very much repressed, but I find the 35% figure questionable.
Quote from: lisagurl on October 29, 2007, 03:56:21 PM
I would think physically that the genitalia play a large role in the feeling. What is sex without the genitalia? Love is different than sex and does not need the genitalia. Physical closeness is also not sex, kissing, tickling etc. Physical stimulation of the genitalia is sex.
I was thinking of "sex drive" as sexual feelings or attraction, which I think has little to nothing to do with genitals. It's hard to articulate, but an attractive man or woman can make you swoon or feel completely different, I wanted to know if those feelings still exist on HRT. I think kissing and tickling can fall squarely into the domain of "sex drive" the way I've defined it. We can call it the "kissing/tickling drive" if that makes everything clearer :-)
Quote from: lisagurl on October 29, 2007, 03:56:21 PM
What is weird is putting sex as a more important factor then what gender your mind is. Many would rather not live if they can not transition.
I'm not putting sex ahead of gender, and frankly, I'm a bit offended that people seem to be willing to make that assumption about me. I had a question about the effects of HRT on sex drive, and it seems like a fair chunk of the responses are attacking me for caring instead of answering my question.
(Sorry, mini-rant coming, this has been bothering me for a while)
To be honest, I sometimes feel like the online transsexual community is incredibly judgmental towards anyone who doesn't fit very neatly into idealized categories, and people seem very quick to proclaim how much more transsexual than everyone else they are. Of all the groups of people out there, this one should be the last group calling people "weird", people that have to put up with as much discrimination and harassment as transsexuals should know better.
(end mini-rant)
Quote from: Ember L on October 29, 2007, 08:59:48 PMI too have certain times of the month when I am in heat but it's different than male sex drive.
This is exactly what I mean by sex drive. It makes me happy to hear that a female sex drive exists, at least for some transwomen. I guess I have a pretty feminist view on female sexuality, but I think it's a pretty important part of being a woman, and denying it is a very bad thing.
I have seen a remarkable shift in my sexality, from fairly conventional male to something that seeks closeness and foreplay. I have lost the desire to masturbate or to dive into quick intercourse, but I'm still very horny in the sense that I really love diving into bed with my wife and spending ungodly amounts of time kissing, touching, and loving.
I really enjoy my body and my sensibilities right now, and have come to see my former sexuality as something that paradoxically erected more walls and increased distance between me and my lover.
We're still working on how this is going to evolve, but for the past few months, I honestly couldn't be happier.
Joyce
That's amazing and beautiful Joyce :-)
Hi
As for me the sexual drive kind of died after 4 moths on hormone. Before that I was quite normal and active in the male mode. I just simply lost interest. I was three years into full time as a female and occasionally i could still get a dry orgasm but it was not a priority on my list of things to do during the day. I have now been four years post-op and I really still don't feel that sex is a priority of the day but when I do have sex I find the orgasms very different and profoundly satisfying. And it really does help to have a partner that will hold and cuddle me and make me feel wanted and warm all over. It's wonderful to feel loved and needed.
Cindy
I would not call what you are talking about sex drive. I would call it the desire to love and be loved.
I that case it has nothing to do with hormones.
Quote from: lisagurl on November 03, 2007, 08:58:50 PM
I would not call what you are talking about sex drive. I would call it the desire to love and be loved.
I that case it has nothing to do with hormones.
From some of the other posts it seems like it changes a lot.
My T is low and my sex drive is very high.
A high estrogen level also gives a high sex drive.
many TS have a low sex drive because of low T AND E levels (too conservative)
High E levels during the menstruel cycle makes females receptive to sexi in humans as in all animals.
Keira I agree!
My sex drive has been ok (prior to SRS), but a certain time of the month for me it is off the charts. It is like I am in heat. It is going to be interesting to see how all of this works its self out now that I have had SRS. I will have to admit right now, it is not what I want to do at this point. On Halloween night I thought I starting to get that warm feeling all over again. This was a mental thing, and not physical. So hopefuly with some recovery time it will come back.
Deb
Being depressed has a big effect on Libido. In dulls all motivation to action, including sexual actions.
But, ironically, being stressed increases libido.
Cortisol released during stress increases libido.
That's why sexual predators are more likely to act in stressfull periods.
Happy you're starting to feel better Deb.
Of course results vary from person to person.
I've noticed an increase in libido and even an increase in the force of ejaculations since being on HRT.
However, I find sex unpleasurable lately because the smell of genitilia is apparent to me as soon as the other party is declothed, and it makes me gag.
I didn't have much of a sex drive before HRT and I would say since being on HRT for the last 7 years, my sex drive hasn't increased or decreased....
For it's never been a big issue.....but obviously for men it's more important to them.
I don't know why it would be more important for men?
Meaning women can live without sex drive?
I've lived without sex drive for 40 years.
I hope the next 40 years will be better in that respect.
Like I said Berliegh, low estrogen levels and/or depression or feeling not desireble has an impact on sex drive. Its suppressed, doesn't mean its normal not to have it.
Even in men aromatisation of testosterone in the brain is primordial to sex drive.
If estrogen is suppressed in men, they have a lower sex drive also even with a normal testosterone level.
This is one thing that has really, really suprised me about this place. So many people who don't care about sex, don't want sex, don't have or want a sex drive.
I love sex. I don't like penitrating anyone (was in a VERY sexual relationship for 4 years without me ever putting myself in someone else), never have. My penis has nothing to do with my sex drive (though it does want attention of its own), and those "orgasms" are unfufilling. It's when I'm pleasing someone else, or getting penitrated that I can experence an orgasm that's deep down, in my center, that effects my entire body and leaves me satisfied.
I couldn't imagine not wanting that.
Quote from: Cire on November 04, 2007, 11:54:21 AM
It's when I'm pleasing someone else, or getting penitrated that I can experence an orgasm that's deep down, in my center, that effects my entire body and leaves me satisfied.
For me, it revolves around WHY I'm wanted, and WHY I can please someone. Being desired in any way for my "maleness" is just horribly heartbreaking. It doesn't matter WHAT they or I do, it's the WHYs behind it that bother me. So my sexuality has always been just terribly frustrated. Sex with a gay man is just as bad as with a straight woman, as both would want me for my maleness.
Now that I look much more female (aside from the genitals), I dunno... we'll have to see what evolves. And after SRS, it's all good ;)
~Kate~
sex doesnt influence my daily life. I dont even care about it, till i get into a situation that gets me turned on. im literally that polar, turned on or off. a guy kisses me, my tummy sortof melts, and im floating, its amazing. only then do i start wanting him in me, its like some primal urge and desire. pity i cant follow my feelings :(
R :police:
Sorry peeps. I started this discussion and should have been checking in more often. Anyway, after reading up and seeing what some people have said, I want to clarify my position.
This isn't about liking my "tool" as it's been so tactfully put. I really don't. But I still have a sex drive and no girlfriend. This leads to a need for some serious self-love and it's the only option I've got right now. I'd rather be using parts I'd be happy with for sure. I dunno, I'm just at a loss for what to do to get the mental sexual energy to translate into something physical again. I think men (including me at one point) don't appreciate just how easy it is for them to get off or just how much work it is for women. Assuming my experience thus far relates in any sort of way. I can't really go out on that limb.
Has anyone else had this sort of problem and found a solution? Or are we all either a) not missing the sex drive or b) having issues with it like I am?
Quote from: Kate on November 04, 2007, 12:58:20 PM
Quote from: Cire on November 04, 2007, 11:54:21 AM
It's when I'm pleasing someone else, or getting penitrated that I can experence an orgasm that's deep down, in my center, that effects my entire body and leaves me satisfied.
For me, it revolves around WHY I'm wanted, and WHY I can please someone. Being desired in any way for my "maleness" is just horribly heartbreaking. It doesn't matter WHAT they or I do, it's the WHYs behind it that bother me. So my sexuality has always been just terribly frustrated. Sex with a gay man is just as bad as with a straight woman, as both would want me for my maleness.
Now that I look much more female (aside from the genitals), I dunno... we'll have to see what evolves. And after SRS, it's all good ;)
~Kate~
I could not agree more, I hate being wanted in a male way, it just doesnt do anything for me. I think this is one of the greastest problems in my relationship right now, and I am ultimately convinced it will be the cause of our seperation. :((
Posted on: December 17, 2007, 04:26:17 AM
MY CONCLUSION FROM ALL OF THESE POSTS: :police:
Just like Keira said. After HRT, WHILE ON HRT
SEX DRIVE caused by Testosterone will go to nill, the kind we all know what its like, kinda annoying always there, causing you to get spontatneos erections, men thinking about sex like every 8 seconds somehow.
SEX DRIVE caused by Estrogen will occur, I.E. you will hopefully feel more wanting to be loved, more emphasis on Why, more of a profound desire for love.
Experience to Back this: :police:
Well I only have the Male side for now, but I know that alot of time I just jump into bed, spend very little time kissing, even though I think I am trying to be more concerned about making it last longer, I usually cannot help the fact that I just go at it, till its over and pass out. This angers women to be honest but at the same time is a very male characteristic, caused by T.
I am think from conclusion of these posts, that it is possible to for the sex mindset to change to reflect that of a natal women, given that E is also a Hormone and can/does influence sex drive.
MYTH: Sex drive becomes nill. I dont think it does, I think it evolves into a sex drive characteristic to that of a female.
OPINIONS, RANTS ABOUT ME, Feel free to leave me a Rep point or two. LOL all welcome and needed
One option for those who don't want their sex drive to be totally obliterated is to take Bicalutimide rather than the usual anti-androgens. Bicalutimide blocks reception of T rather than production, so sexual desire still exists. However, maybe this is only my perception; I've never taken Androcur or Spiro, so maybe I would feel the exact same way taking those instead. At the same time, I don't think that it's possible to do real HRT and maintain the the original sex drive. Mine still exists, but it's... different. But I understand the reasoning of the original poster, being a women doesn't mean that one has to be sexually "neuter." Of course, if sex sickens you and you don't want to feel sexual, there is nothing wrong with that, that's your choice. But for every Charlotte, there's a Samantha out there.
Lia
Charlote may be a prude. but shes not afraid of sex.... shes more a miranda, shes not quite decided WHAT sex she wants :P
Gotta love satc analogy)
R :police:
"sex drive" seems to me to me sort of two different things, female/male. I have a deep "sex drive" when it comes to cuddly, touchy and even the act itself, but that is love-specific. If I don't love you I don't specifically wanna have sex, or even think about it, with someone.
OTH, I think with my partner, when I do think of having se with her and she with me, it seems more of a "love exchange" that's on a different level, a giving, sharing merging and orgasm is simply a wonderfully intense "oceanic" experience. Like everything, and I mean everything, is one, the whole universe coalesces in our exchange.
I know, that is really very vague.
But on T it was definitely different: intrusive thoughts that did occur with much frequency and wasn't necessarily limited to a love relationship.
Its hard to explain if you haven't been there.
As for the pornstar question, Kiera, I have heard, but don't know for sure that especially in Eastern European and South American meccas for that that a lot of surgery is involved and that HRT is not. That is more in the way of rumor I have heard from people who are definitely NOT, well, claim they are not, in-the-biz. So I don't really know at all.
something thats happening here, is a large number of people posting, who dont have any experience...
ON HRT YOU DO NOT HAVE 0 SEX DRIVE.... it s a total myth, i have a healthy sex drive like any normal female my age. I get hot for boys, swoon, and get arroused in a very fulfilling way... so its total crap that it just vanishes. women do have sex drives too :) estrogen is as much a sex hormone as testosterone.
and regarding MTF pornstars: usually they dont use hrt, and have LOTS of surgery... or do use it, and then stop T, not ALL actually have functional male genetals btw....
R :police:
Edit used to remove an offensive term.
Please, folks. I think we all know a particular word that is used for MTF pornstars is offensive. Some people are more offended than are others. Kiera, sorry if we simultaneously made edits.
So please avoid the word when "MTF pornstars" works really well and is not nearly as pejorative. Thanks.
And believe it. I will always ask you to do it first.
Nichole
Posted on: December 21, 2007, 10:20:50 AM
Quote from: Rachael on December 21, 2007, 08:53:40 AM
something thats happening here, is a large number of people posting, who dont have any experience...
ON HRT YOU DO NOT HAVE 0 SEX DRIVE.... it s a total myth, i have a healthy sex drive like any normal female my age. I get hot for boys, swoon, and get arroused in a very fulfilling way... so its total crap that it just vanishes. women do have sex drives too :) estrogen is as much a sex hormone as testosterone.
I think what we often lose track of is that my experience is not usually 'universal.'
There are a number of reasons that might lead to no or small sex drive in women and men that are extremely valid and that also might not get talked about a lot.
The biggest might well be sexual abuse as children. Or sexual assault as adults. Often enough TSes are more susceptible to both of those. And there's nothing like a rape to 1) make you not want sex at all: if I have no sex drive then I won't be abused. 2) Or to make someone hyoper-sexual, or at least that's what it looks like. What it probably actually is is what it was for me for a long stretch of time. "I am already filthy and used, why not just act that out constantly."
Neither of those options show a drive for sex. Instead, one is an absolute loathing that may be mirrored in physical response: the victim is incapable of having sexual activity. In the other the victim has a drive to debase herself (more prevalent in women than men is the reason for the pronoun) and constantly show the world just how terrible she is.
So before I get too convinced that people don't know what they are talking about, maybe i should consider other options. Maybe they know exactly what they are talking about, they just have very good reasons not to share with me what they know and how they know it.
Trauma of that sort, of any sort actually, does change the configurations of neurons and synapses -- it literally 'changes our minds' and our bodies.
Does E in and of itself change someone from a sexual being to a non-sexual one? Prolly not, but it can relieve tensions formed elsewhere so that the person is not as fixated on the sexual urge as they were. After years of a 'male' response, that can well be viewed as being non-sexual.
Often TSes become sexual after SRS when they were not before it. The operation may well 'free' them. OTH, some never achieve any interest in sexual activity and very often that's because they learned that sex is a power relationship that is betraying and hurtful and not to be desired when they were very young.
I wish these complexities didn't exist. But they do and it seems like i need to be mindful of that.
Nichole
Yes, we humans often try to make the world a black and white place, regardless the evidence that it is multi-colored top include all sorts of grey shades.
Quote from: AlwaysLauren on March 31, 2007, 07:43:48 PM
In a larger sense, I guess my biggest fear is that hormones will change who I am to the point that I'm a completely different person than I am now. I like being me, I just want my body to reflect the way I think it should have been born, I don't want to become a completely different person who feels completely different about things.
Well... Hormones didn't change anything about me except my body. Getting rid of T got rid of that wretched overpowered sex drive, thank goddess! Believe me, there's nothing gone that I miss. Unless you count missing how miserable I used to be.
Hi Nichol
Thank you so much for this information. You have went to many places that have opened doors to things I had not even given thought to for many years. Doors I dared not open.
Cindy
why use m2f pornstars, when ->-bleeped-<- is the term they use regarding the genre, im not calling anyone here a ->-bleeped-<-, heck, apparently some identify as it.
they arnt m2f pornstars, thier ->-bleeped-<-s. because a LOT are in it as sex workers, and transition FOR SEX WORK...
i would ask the moderator who edited my post without permission to CHANGE it back please. i dont feel it is justifiable to sneak around changing peoples posts when its a legitimate thing to say.
because we ignore a term, and sing la la la, it wont go away... When i call someone here that name, get offended, when i use it in its RIGHTFUL PLACE ie, taking about this type of sexworker, im actually shocked people are so sensative that the mere mention of the word breaks out herds of drama llamas...
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi111.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fn125%2FBelladonna_06%2Fmeme%2Fmanatee.jpg&hash=c04228b981f17d02f661ab294d9ecb2fcd8db12a)
R :police:
Hi,
One must not forget that there are TSs that work the streets as sex workers as well. Most are there to make enough money to get the surgery. Each night they go out risking their lives doing this type of work. There are also those whose drug dependencies keep them out there. Given the way the world treats us, I cannot blame them for being on the street.
Cindy
if your telling me every sex worker is an empoverished transperson forced onto the streets... i may well die laughing... i wasnt saying they all weere, i simply cant see the problem, with using a porn industry term, for a porn industry WORKER....
and dont try and suggest thier all forced against thier will either...
R :police:
I didn't mean to imply all, Rachael, but I should have been clearer on the emphasis of [some]
No one can be forced to live any life style against their will, that we do on our own, but some get caught up in that web.
Cindy
Hi, Rach. If I offended you by editing the word then i also think you should say that i pmed you about it first and requested you change it.
Yes, the word is used, frequently. But being honest and using words that you know may well offend some when there are other words (you used a couple 'sexworker', 'pornstar') just seems a bit confrontational when there is no need.
My personal take is not that the word is problematic to me. But, I do know, as I imagine you do as well, that it's a problem for other people.
I spoz my problem is, if I can use something else that doesn't ignite revulsion in someone else, why shouldn't i do that. I just don't see the point in needless confrontation and hurt for someone when there are ways around doing that that don't require me to be dishonest.
We could all probably use the word 'punk' to insult someone if we wished. But the use o the word is not particularly an 'honest' one.
I understand that you wish to be heard and that maybe you even wish to engage me in some test of wills. I see no need for either. This is not about either you or me. It is about how we may make other people feel badly when we needn't do so.
I really wish you would go back to your next-last post and just delete the word and substitute one of the words you have already used instead of it. This time I'll ask you in public since private messages didn't work before.
Neither of us have any 'face' issues going here. This about simply being considerate of others when there are ways to be both considerate and honest. The rawer a word is in usage doesn't make it more honest, just more raw.
So please. Remove the offensive word.
Thanks so much. I know that you understand.
Nichole
sex worker isnt offensive
pornstar is not offensive
if these words upset you, get off the plannet... im sorry, but this is taking poltical correctness, and making them stop saying correct, because it might offend those who are INCORECT!
I stand by my post.
R :police:
Hi Kiera
Sighhhhhh, do I know what spending Christmas alone is like. For many years now I don't even bother puting up anything in the house. But I do have some memories of some beautiful happy Christmases in the past. See the nice things In that part of our mind is nothing ever dies.
Merry Christmas
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi11.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa191%2Fcynthiag932%2FSugarPlumFairy_small_finished_im-1.jpg&hash=20cd4079c8ec0619c62de29b7adaaa7f2d3a3553)
Cindy