Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I recently linked to an event that included drag shows on a TG Facebook page and got an angry response. This is honestly new to me. Is drag generally considered offensive? I've never been a huge fan of it myself. I can enjoy it in small, occasional doses, but I have not heard of too many people in the LGBT spectrum actually being offended by it.

DQ make everything better.

I don't enjoy the shows, but I'm not offended by it.  I like really well done outfits, but they're usually over the top so I don't care for it.

I can't speak in general terms. However, personally I'm not offended by them in the slightest. In my view, it's a method of self-expression and creativity. If that's how people choose to perform, and they get enjoyment and maybe even a healthy living out of it, more power to them.

I don't think so.  Drag shows seem exotic.  If I had the right body I wouldn't mind doing anime girl drags. o.o 

Then again to be fair I've never been to a drag show so this is all just speculation from my end.

Quote from: JoeyD on May 16, 2012, 11:20:56 PM
DQ make everything better.

Do you mean the ice cream?   ;D

I don't find the concept of drag offensive.. But it depends on the show.. A good show is great.. A badly done show I can be offended by - mostly because I've done it myself...

I know what dalebert means, but I think back to all-male kabuki theater, whcih is a cultural staple in Japan for hundreds of years.

They don't offend at all. But most (I have seen) are quite amateurish and make me cringe. But I wouldn't deliberately go and see one. If it is on in the club/hotel when I am there, fine; but unless a friend was involved I wouldn't bother to seek one out.

To me it is very like stand up comedians. Do you go to places to laugh at the bad ones or be entertained by the good ones? I get upset/sick laughing AT people, I respect people too much for that to be entertaining for me. JMO.
C.

Quote from: Jamie D on May 17, 2012, 04:31:14 AM
I know what dalebert means, but I think back to all-male kabuki theater, whcih is a cultural staple in Japan for hundreds of years.

I went to a kabuki event at the Adelaide Festival of Arts years ago. I think it was the first time the National Japanese Kabuki Theatre (?) had done a tour , this is 25yrs ago ish, Goddess it was boring. Sorry. The audience was a quarter of the sell out size after the interval, and then I walked out, I'd had enough, I was trying to be polite but lordy I prefer laser hair treatment.

Quote from: Cindy James on May 17, 2012, 04:42:36 AM
They don't offend at all. But most (I have seen) are quite amateurish and make me cringe. But I wouldn't deliberately go and see one. If it is on in the club/hotel when I am there, fine; but unless a friend was involved I wouldn't bother to seek one out.

To me it is very like stand up comedians. Do you go to places to laugh at the bad ones or be entertained by the good ones? I get upset/sick laughing AT people, I respect people too much for that to be entertaining for me. JMO.
C.

I'm going to have to take you a Vegas sometime.  ;)

Oh I've been to great ones. S**T woman Carletta and her boys at Les Boys in the Cross revoluntised drag shows.

I was talking about the local hotel ones, the amateur, , I thought that was the track of the thread.

I have no probs with the 'big production shows' I may have got the wrong drift

I agree that it is more about quality of the performance than anything.  I have seen some great shows, and some that were awful.  Not really my thing I must admit, I'd rather listen to a jazz  or blues band actually.

Karen.

As other have said, it boils down to how good the show is.
A good show is enjoyable, bad one is cultural cringe - and that's for any sort of live gig as far as I'm concerned.

Quote from: luna nyan on May 17, 2012, 05:58:55 AM
As other have said, it boils down to how good the show is.
A good show is enjoyable, bad one is cultural cringe - and that's for any sort of live gig as far as I'm concerned.

+1

I have seen several and I was never offended by them.  In fact, here we have Darcelle XV Showplace, which is famous.  Always a good show.

I had, at one time, thought about getting into drag.  But I love being a Veterinary Tech.

I didn't like my High School's "Drag" show, which seemed to be the more ugly they intentionally made themselves the better people received it, but otherwise it doesn't bother me.

Not at all. I've actually done a few "drag shows". It doesn't bother me that they call it a drag show but I don't consider myself to be a drag queen so it doesn't quite fit me. I don't do all the extreme make-up and costumes that drag queens do but I do admire them. Seeing the way these boys transform behind stage is truly remarkable. It's definitely an art form.

Quote from: Jamie D on May 17, 2012, 04:31:14 AM
I know what dalebert means, but I think back to all-male kabuki theater, whcih is a cultural staple in Japan for hundreds of years.

I love Kabuki, which is also very fun to preform.   Still not a fan of drag shows, but I can watch Kabuki for quite a bit.

When I think of drag, I think of theatricality. Someone can be a really good cross-dresser (not necessarily trans, but maybe that's part of the spectrum of trans) and be convincing and blend right in as the gender they're displaying. On the other hand, a drag queen or king to me, generally, is being over the top and attention-getting, which is completely appropriate if it's for entertainment purposes.

It seems one can even do "drag" within one's identified gender. I don't watch it regularly but I saw one episode of a show where drag queens act as guides for cis women looking to spice things up and maybe get a confidence boost. I only watched it because a friend's sister was in it. They had a "drag" competition involving make-up, outfits, putting on a show, etc. It was kinda cute.

Update: The person who left the angry response is still raging on the FB thread. There were positive responses by several other people and she seemed to lighten up a little bit and take a "Just not my thing" approach, but then sort of reverted back to "It's really offensive". I really triggered something, I think.

I haven't gone into any details about the actual shows. I don't even know them. Someone else is handling those details and they're still in the works. All I've said is "drag shows".

Drag shows do not bother me at all. They are drag queens performing as entertainers.

What really puts my panties in a knot is when transgenders put pics of themselves with their legs spread wide open for the world to see and making their profiles public so anyone can see it.

What upsets me about this is the issue that they strengthen the stereotype that transgender people are exhibitionists.

Drag Queens, in my opinion are different. The vast majority of them are highly respectful entertainers. They entertain. It doesn't affect me.

Transgenders who show their privates as if people actually enjoy seeing that....that affects me.

Looking at the language being used, it appears this angry person has a very strict interpretation of what it means to be trans. I don't tend to think of drag queens as trans, but clearly some of them identify as such. I know there have been trans people who have done drag shows at some point or another. I've known of some back in Atlanta. But even if someone just likes to dress as a woman sometimes, they're expressing their feminine side for a little while, or their masculine side in the case of drag kings, whether that's because it's fulfilling in some way or just to entertain and get a little extra attention for a little while.

She's saying that drag queens mislead people about what it means to be trans and that causes people to misunderstand her, but for at least some of them, that is what it means to be transgendered for them. What they do for their own reasons isn't about her. I've gotten the impression that most people here recognize a spectrum of trans and all different types of people who veer off of the narrowly-define gender path blazed by a tyrannical culture. This person doesn't seem to see it that way. In a way, her attitude is just as tyrannical because all she's done is try to blaze one more narrowly defined path that's a little different from the one blazed by the other tyrants, and not by much.

I definitely don't want to offend anyone but I'm actually getting offended myself by some of these judgments of me. She's compared me inviting trans people to a party with a few drag shows to inviting black people to a minstrel show (white people in black-face). I'm sure there is offensive drag out there but that's not fair to all drag queens. It's like she's saying she's a real trans woman and they're fake trans women, which seems blatantly hypocritical to me. I asked her what she expects of me. Does she expect me to cancel the drag shows? Does she think I shouldn't have invited TG people to the event?

These are just my thoughts. If I'm out of line, please put me in my place. I've learned a lot from folks here and I'm sure I have a lot left to learn.

I am not offended by them, sure maye someone out there could but so far I havent got offended by anyone.
there suposed to be outspeaking, kind of bitchy, but still in a funny way, thay make fun of us, but they make fun of all of us, and themself. it the whole point to be a queen.

I have heard before people being offended by them, everyone has diffrent taste and opinions.

Quote from: JenJen2011 on May 17, 2012, 08:17:24 AM
Not at all. I've actually done a few "drag shows". It doesn't bother me that they call it a drag show but I don't consider myself to be a drag queen so it doesn't quite fit me. I don't do all the extreme make-up and costumes that drag queens do but I do admire them. Seeing the way these boys transform behind stage is truly remarkable. It's definitely an art form.

My ex boyfriend does what you do.

You know John Wayne Gacy did art too. He was a lovable clown too.

I don't like drag shows at all I got burned by some rainbow flames about 5 years ago. Those shows are offensive to transgender and ciswomen alike.

Quote from: JoeyD on May 16, 2012, 11:20:56 PM
DQ make everything better.

Dairy queen? Carbs. Thighs.

I don't find it offensive but also it wouldn't matter if I did since people have a right to do what they want to do.

Drag shows don't do anything for me - I've never understood the appeal.

But I think it's a high art form. Requires makeup, movement, acting etc. I may not enjoy the shows but I have a lot of respect for the talent it requires.

I'am not offended at all.I think they may over do themselves in the way they dress,make-up etc.They do posess extreme courage in this world of so much prejudice.I believe its a form of entertainment and some of the Drag Queens are very good at it, and most likely they may have the same stories of life as we do.Honestly I like watching them. :)