Do any of you feel like you can pass (even a little) and then you find out that you are not "there" yet from others. OR Do you feel like you don't pass, but those around you say you do? How can and do you figure that out. I am finding that I tend to go back and forth with this. I rarely wear make-up, because I don't feel the need to. However, I think that it honestly helps me out. Some days, I feel great about myself, but most days, I do not. I am really fighting hard this depression over this. And because of certain big situations looming over my head, I can't go as fast as I wanted to. At the moment, I've been on Hormones for close to two years. But, my hormones needed a bit of a boost and I would say things really started changing around a year and a half ago with major changes to my body and face. But, I have a really weird sense of where I am at. Meaning, I can't tell if I am too this or too that. My body dysphoria is very intense and my gender dysphoria is a little better. When I go out, I get ma'amed a lot and I get sir'd too occasionally. Again, this causes such confusion for me. I've posted on here a few times and the comments have been minimal, which I would be ready to hear the truth even though I know it would be hard for me. Your thoughts on stuff like this?
Here are a few pics of me as well. Maybe that would help so that you can see what I am talking about.
Thank you so much for your time.
Eyeliner but no make-up.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-djNGRknjy4s/UJLZy3T_qPI/AAAAAAAABHE/qT-NcHLsj-c/s720/20121023_100055.jpg)
Hair's a little on the wet side. And no make-up except a little eyeliner.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-QtV0CRwKB_s/UIXfXKM8GWI/AAAAAAAABGs/tq0MqnJmo_w/s480/ASHLEYNEWHAIRCUT.jpg)
I am 6ft tall so I'm sure THAT doesn't help either, but for now I'm just interested in the face first.
Thanks!
I feel the same duplicity of passing and not passing. At times, I will feel I am passing farely well. Then, something will happen that will cause me to realize I am not passing. Other times I will feel horrible about myself, and "know" I am not passing. Again, something will happen to change my point of view. I think most of us go through this from time to time. I am not concerned about it as I know I am still early on in my transition.
You don't look like a man, you have strong features on your face, but so do a lot of woman. The make up helps but you look perfectly fine, and perfectly feminine without it. You're a very pretty girl so you don't need make up. On account of your height, I am jealous of woman with such height :)
I rarely feel like I'm passing to anyone and most people just humor me. I can't break that mindset no matter what others try to tell me. In a way though, I think it helps me to a degree because I've learned to stop worrying about it so much and just go on and be myself regardless. It seems to work for the most part.
Stephanie,
I'm going to chime in with everyone else. I'm not seeing your features as being overwhelmingly male. You have some strong features, but many, many women do including celebrities. I know that it's easy to be hard on yourself if you're depressed, and depression comes easy to many in transition.
I don't think that height as big a problem as build. You don't have broad shoulders, so that isn't outing you, either.
The only thing that you might consider (and I don't know whether you're full time or not) is to get a more feminine hairstyle. I think that would tip the scales toward the feminine side. You already have a feminine hairline, so that's not a problem.
If I were with you in person, I'd give you a big hug and say "Hang in there! It's going to get better". And it will.
Probably has to do with shifting moods/level of confidence because you look much more female than male to me... When you're sad/angry you come off as more masculine and this is true for everybody. Now obviously we're clueless about your voice/ overall demeanor but if those are fine it's mostly a matter of these 2 factors: Mood/confidence.
Yeah, all the time. Some days I'm like, "lol, look at that, who'd believe I'm a guy?" and then no one genders me as female at all that day. Other days, I'm all "ugh, look at that ugly, muscular, blah, blah, blah" and I get gendered female even after saying my (very) male name.
Quote from: Seyranna on November 02, 2012, 03:10:15 PM
Probably has to do with shifting moods/level of confidence because you look much more female than male to me... When you're sad/angry you come off as more masculine and this is true for everybody. Now obviously we're clueless about your voice/ overall demeanor but if those are fine it's mostly a matter of these 2 factors: Mood/confidence.
I so agree. There are days I am not in the mood and know I don't pass. My confidence goes out the window.
First of all, based on looks alone IDK how people can call you a sir. At worst they may be suspicious but even at that point they should see you're dressed as a female and just assume you're female so that they don't offend you "if you are a girl" ... make sense? However, maybe your voice is killing it all and people just want to be rude.
Second of all, when people see you as female, the entire mood is different. They talk to you differently, especially men. I've noticed that men are much, much more intuitive than women on reading a trans girl. If people see you as female without a doubt they will ma'am you without hesitation. Of course there are those out there who are knowing of trans related issues and will maam you. This is when knowing and understanding how people (especially men) treat cis women comes in handy.
Third of all I have the same issues as you. Some days I think I pass and I'm the prettiest girl I'll run into all day. Other days I wanna hide under the covers because I'm fearful that today will be the first day I've been clocked in so many months. Honestly, I think part of it is hormones. Testosterone makes people confident... lack of it is gonna drain your confidence. Also, you have to remember that you've been looking at yourself in the mirror every day of your life for the past so many years. You aren't going to be able to help looking in it and seeing at least a residual effect of yourself... and for me it's so strong that sometimes I look in the mirror and ask myself what in the world changed... even though countless people have commented on how much I have indeed changed.
You can always get bold... go out and talk to people, then tell people you're trans and see their reactions. Or better yet, get a friend to out you behind your back and have them tell you the response. That is one way I know I pass at least 95% of the time, even on the days I feel like I look super crappy.
I have to be brutally honest. The pictures reveal the makings of a gorgeous beautiful woman. Beautiful eyes! Nice lips and smile.
But...the nose and brow-bossing might be problematic. In fact, the brow bossing is not that bad from what I can tell. Maybe some kind of brow lift and rhinoplasty would be all you would need to become a total knockout.
That said though, I would rate you "highly passable" as is but I just wanted to be honest as to why some will be able to read you.
QuoteDo any of you feel like you can pass (even a little) and then you find out that you are not "there" yet from others. OR Do you feel like you don't pass, but those around you say you do?
This is kind of interesting for you to say but I saw one trans woman ask for advice about if she passed from trans people and they were all very positive and said she passed. Then much later I found the same pictures in a place with more people that was dedicated to having people (mainly cis men) tell you if they thought you were attractive or not. They all said she was "obviously" a man and made very hurtful comments. So I went back and looked at the pictures, but no matter how I tried I couldn't see what the cis men were seeing. I just saw a woman.
Sometimes what trans people think is just so far off from how other people will actually perceive. I don't specifically mean that we think trans people pass when they don't... that can happen, but we also sometimes say trans people can't pass when in their day to day life they actually are doing just that. And then if we're wrong we chalk up to "mannerisms," "voice," etc... basically we blame it on the things we can't see so we can go on thinking our perceptions are accurate. But with that one woman I mentioned earlier, my perceptions just weren't accurate at all.
It's strange, though. And then of course sometimes you can pass one hundred percent to one person and 0% to the person standing next to her, even if they're both cis or whatever normative thing.
Oh by the way: you are cute.
Quote from: Carbon on November 03, 2012, 07:10:27 PM
It's strange, though. And then of course sometimes you can pass one hundred percent to one person and 0% to the person standing next to her, even if they're both cis or whatever normative thing.
People gender you as male or female or, possibly, androgynous, so its always 100% one way or the other...unless they can't make up their mind...then I guess you might call that 50%. ???
Really though, Stephanie has a lot going for her appearance wise. Yet, realistically, some will read her especially at six feet.
I know as I live in an area where if a woman is very tall, she is assumed to be trans. (SF Bay Area)I heard a story recently in which a 6'4" African-American cis-woman was exiting BART and some black guy accused her of being trans. She yelled at the guy, "I ain't no GD man, M-F'er" and slugged the guy. BART police had to be called. I wish someone would have caught this on camera!
Quote from: UCBerkeleyPostop on November 03, 2012, 09:06:56 PM
People gender you as male or female or, possibly, androgynous, so its always 100% one way or the other...unless they can't make up their mind...then I guess you might call that 50%. ???
Really though, Stephanie has a lot going for her appearance wise. Yet, realistically, some will read her especially at six feet.
I know as I live in an area where if a woman is very tall, she is assumed to be trans. (SF Bay Area)I heard a story recently in which a 6'4" African-American cis-woman was exiting BART and some black guy accused her of being trans. She yelled at the guy, "I ain't no GD man, M-F'er" and slugged the guy. BART police had to be called. I wish someone would have caught this on camera!
It's also frame size, feet and hand size, and voice. Individually those characteristics don't matter, but at 6ft a trans woman would usually set off some people's radar and it helps to have as many pluses in your column as possible.
Quote from: Ave on November 03, 2012, 11:53:51 PM
It's also frame size, feet and hand size, and voice. Individually those characteristics don't matter, but at 6ft a trans woman would usually set off some people's radar and it helps to have as many pluses in your column as possible.
I once encountered a 6'4" naked white woman with a large frame and big hands and feet standing next to me at the mirror in the locker woman. She was one of the most beautiful women I have ever seen in my life. I almost fainted.
Quote from: UCBerkeleyPostop on November 03, 2012, 09:06:56 PM
People gender you as male or female or, possibly, androgynous, so its always 100% one way or the other...unless they can't make up their mind...then I guess you might call that 50%. ???
That's basically what I meant. Some people are going to have the reaction "Wait, is that person male or female? I
guess they're female." So then if someone came and said "That person is actually a trans woman" they could say "Oh yeah, I can see that now," but they still get 60-90 percent pass (some cis women only get 60-90 percent pass for some reason, too, so it doesn't necessarily mean you are doing bad. I have a friend who told me she got earrings specifically so people would be more likely to refer to her as female. I couldn't see any maleness in
her either.).
But if someone else got told "That person is a trans woman" they might think "I really can't see it at all." That's what I meant by one hundred percent: just not being able to see
any male cues, even if you know to look for them. This is the situation with the woman I mentioned on the other website because I couldn't figure out what the cis men were noticing to gender her male.
QuoteReally though, Stephanie has a lot going for her appearance wise. Yet, realistically, some will read her especially at six feet.
Well, realistically
any woman is going to get some junk at six feet, not because people at six feet don't pass but just because people are mean.
I agree about Stephanie having a lot going for her though. Those pictures are definitely at the point where I can only see "male cues" if I'm told to look for them, there's nothing male about the pictures to me.
Quote from: Carbon on November 04, 2012, 08:16:09 AM
This is the situation with the woman I mentioned on the other website because I couldn't figure out what the cis men were noticing to gender her male.
One person out of many were probably perceptive enough to pick up on it, and everybody else read the comment. Also, I've seen pictures of very pretty women on Facebook that I'm willing to bet every straight guy on the planet would want to take out, where a man comments "She's ugly!" and every guy under that comment pretty much agrees... it's like, um well don't have an opinion for yourself please!
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on November 04, 2012, 09:03:13 AM
One person out of many were probably perceptive enough to pick up on it, and everybody else read the comment. Also, I've seen pictures of very pretty women on Facebook that I'm willing to bet every straight guy on the planet would want to take out, where a man comments "She's ugly!" and every guy under that comment pretty much agrees... it's like, um well don't have an opinion for yourself please!
I've definitely noticed that too so maybe you're right.
I remember talking to my father about how at this camp I used to go to when I was a child*, around middle school age there was this one girl that every thought was so attractive and they kept talking about how hot she was. I didn't get it. I mean sure, she looked nice enough, but so did most of the other girls there. I kept going to the camp through high school age and then people started talking about how ugly she was. I was like uh, what, she basically looks the same as she did a few years ago.
(The part I didn't mention to my father is that one year they picked a new girl that everyone except me and one guy said they wanted to date. The one guy just said that he didn't feel like they could have a personal connection so he didn't want to date her even though she looked amazing, I was the only one who was like "Well she doesn't look incredible or something to me relative to other people.")
My father said something like, "Well at that age a lot of time people just focus on on one thing like 'Oh she has big boobs' and as they get older that changes." And I'm thinking, well, the actual criteria changes but the behavior really doesn't because people keep focusing on arbitrary stuff or other people's reactions.
*Note: At this point I didn't "know I was trans." I knew that I would prefer to be a girl and I had this unexplainable and covert interest in orchiectomy, but I didn't know I was trans and thought that my experience was part of being male/wasn't necessarily different from other males.
Quote from: UCBerkeleyPostop on November 04, 2012, 12:15:02 AM
I once encountered a 6'4" naked white woman with a large frame and big hands and feet standing next to me at the mirror in the locker woman. She was one of the most beautiful women I have ever seen in my life. I almost fainted.
whatever floats your boat, being larger than average will certainly draw attention and scrutiny though :P.
Quote from: Ave on November 04, 2012, 12:00:48 PM
whatever floats your boat, being larger than average will certainly draw attention and scrutiny though :P.
Why is it that you feel obligated to respond with a snarky comment to virtually all my posts? This is a rhetorical question, of course, as I know why it is.
First off, I just want to thank ALL OF YOU that have been honest with me about my looks and stuff. I really appreciate it. As mentioned it's just hard to figure it out sometimes. I am agreeing with most of you on things. However, being 5'12 <---LOL I don't think is too much of a problem. My adoptive mom is 6 feet, she's got bigger hands than I do BUT she has such a beautiful face. So the height doesn't bother me as much as everything else. And I agree with it's about the FULL PICTURE. Since I am not completely full time. I still have to play the boy sometimes. And it's HARD for me to make back-n-forth thing between boy and girl and then come to a 100% full time girl. So, I'm SURE I can work on that as well. I went to the salon yesterday and got my hair cut (see I listen to you guys). The woman next to me said I looked so pretty and she loved my hair. I'm taking baby steps with the hair...eventually I want to go for that Victoria Secret hair. LOL My body is okay...by no means perfect. I got blessed by genetics and HRT with some awesome curves. On halloween I had a man walk up to me and tell me that he loves curvy tall girls. That same night I got a club promoter coming up to my partner and I and asking us "pretty ladies" to come to his club. AGAIN, that's NEVER happened to me. BUT, then I went to the gay part of town, and the moment I'm walking out of a bar a lesbian says outloud to the door guy, "Man, ->-bleeped-<-s love this Halloween stuff." I'm pretty sure she was referring to me. Luckily, my partner was there to catch me as I deflated from being on top of the world to later posting on here.
Some days, are just better than others. And honestly, I can't wait to go fulltime. I feel like I am going to lose my mind playing this ping-pong game. You gals really picked me up with your honesty and sincerity. I REALLY appreciate it. It's also good to hear everyones perspective on things and how you related to my post. So, I'm going to keep "de-programming" my boy self, and try my hardest to enjoy all the good stuff.
Still listening,
Stephie ;D
Just today walking out of the store, a little girl pointed at me and said "daddy, daddy, what is that a boy or a girl?" He looked over toward me and just said " Destiny, get in the car, both of you, we are gonna be late".
At least the guy spared the 'I don't know' in front of me. I am not sure if that should make me happy as I was wearing some plain black work slacks and a plain black hoodie, not in girl mode at all. At the same point, it does get me down to be seen as other no matter how I am presenting, I just wanna be a normal woman.
Well Steph... in a gay bar I almost automatically assume any girl over 5'11" is trans if I don't get a good look at them. I would take what the lesbian said with a grain of salt. But then again... maybe what you're wearing is highlighting the most masculine features about you. Gotta remember... the hip bone comes up higher on cis women, and on tall girls that is a HUGE highlight into what kind of puberty they went through, if you catch my drift.
Its really strange where I live in NE Florida. There lots of different kinds of people from all over with some of them being limited English speakers. About four years ago I presented as male when I was substitute teaching all over town and I had both adults and students call me ma'am one moment and the next call me sir. Now that I am my female self dressing like I do in my avatar, I am still called sir one moment and ma'am the next. I am also called, "Sweetie," "Dearie," "Honey," which waitresses and clerks seem to use interchangeably with both males and females.
Lots of times, I don't know rather, I pass or not. My girl friend, calls, me Michael, and refers to me as he. I really don't care. At my age, I have come to conclude that I can't change what others think. To me, I am she. Being retired at almost 66 and living on Social Security it hardly matters.
My message to younger trans people is that, don't worry, you will survive, you will get older, and someday, you, too, will become an invisible senior citizen. Just keep yourself together. Consistently be yourself and you will survive. And if you don't survive, at least you tried. If nothing else I hope that in living my life, those that follow after me will have an easier go of it.
At a year + of RLE, my only hit on being read was back on Halloween and the reason for that was "only a guy would look as pretty as you do on Halloween." His mother, who looked like he had been giving her a hard time gave him the dirtiest look you can imagine without it being lethal. I actually gave her a girl to girl look that she returned with a grin, she accepted me.
One of the things I wrote about somewhere else on passing was that I have had many years of experience in a field that required me to carefully observe and later report my observations on law enforcement related situations. When I retired from the job, I was able to relax and do what comes naturally on seeing people. I go lazy and my observation skills have to be manually resusitated to use them. Most people never learn and are following the natural lazy pattern. Like you, they can see every defect in themselves or close family or friend, but the stranger on the street needs to be VERY strange for them to even see that person. Here on this forum, looking at your picture I will see you as transgendered, even if you are DDG (drop dead gorgeous) as any GG. I might jokingly accuse some people as posting pictures of their sister, but I will say I am joking, but here I see you as trans no matter what. On the street without knowing a thing about you, I will not look to your being trans unless something way out catches my eye, or unless I have turned the "observation alert" key on which I am lazy and no longer need or want to do. That is what a normal person does. On the other hand, if I am walking by a noted TG Club, I am going to see a trans person in even the cis/het SO's of the other girls there. Out going to the grocery store, Wal Mart or whatever, big time, long time pass because no one is looking.
On the whole passing thing, I have never had anyone say a word to me about using the ladies restroom or changing areas. Me and a GF of mine spent 2 hour today trying on clothes at Belks, talking the whole time, asking other women what they thought etc. I would assume if I wasn't passable, someone would have been rude or said something/acted weird..
If I have started to walk into the wrong one (brain fart), people stop me and point me to the womens side. I'm just under 6' tall and yes, that does draw attention but it seems favorable to me. I have a lot of guys checking me out :) I have very long shapely legs which most women would die for. I worked very hard for a good voice and that really paid off. I know I am clocked from time to time but I live my life as a woman and no one seems to care. And no, I don't live in a place that is super GLBT friendly. I just think I "present" close enough where people are comfortable seeing me as a woman? Whatever, it works for me.
I'd like to say a word about confidence, while confidence is great and will certainly get you out the door it takes more than confidence to convince joe shmoe that he (or she) is looking at a woman. I have seen CDers out and about and i could tell they were CDers from yards away. I didn't go up to them and say "hey i can tell your a CDer!" I just minded my own business.
I think you look good, that being said you do have some mild masculine facial features which i'm sure are the reason you are being read. Someone already mentioned your brow bossing and i noticed a wider chin than most natal females. Yes there are woman who have some strong facial features but usually its only one or two things and otherwise they are endowed with an unmistakably female body, that is usually not the case for most of us who not only battle facial features but masculine bodies as well.
Quote from: aprilrain on November 05, 2012, 06:39:37 PM
I'd like to say a word about confidence, while confidence is great and will certainly get you out the door it takes more than confidence to convince joe shmoe that he (or she) is looking at a woman. I have seen CDers out and about and i could tell they were CDers from yards away. I didn't go up to them and say "hey i can tell your a CDer!" I just minded my own business.
I think you look good, that being said you do have some mild masculine facial features which i'm sure are the reason you are being read. Someone already mentioned your brow bossing and i noticed a wider chin than most natal females. Yes there are woman who have some strong facial features but usually its only one or two things and otherwise they are endowed with an unmistakably female body, that is usually not the case for most of us who not only battle facial features but masculine bodies as well.
Yep, I agree on the brow and the nose..the chin...ehhh not as much. But I really appreciate your honesty. You're pretty.
I was in an elevator today, and everyone got out except for this one man. After the doors closed he said, "You're a beautiful woman." I was in total and utter shock! But hey, I'll take what I can get. I'm still look for an FFS doctor. I'm looking at Chestawatt, DiMaggio, and Osterhout for now. I was thinking of getting my nose done first since that's what really bugs me the most.
Again, I really appreciate your sincere honesty and everyones advice. I don't have any T-girl friends around and this is really the only place I have to talk about this. It also helped my depression too.
Cheers!
Stephie
Quote from: Stephanie.Izann on November 06, 2012, 04:55:16 PM
You're pretty.
Thank you! I had FFS with Dr Spiegel last January. There was one procedure he wanted to do which I didn't feel I needed (cheek implants) but I decided to go with it anyway and I'm really glad I did. Whoever you decide to go with, listen to them, they do this all the time and know what they are talking about. Also I wouldn't recommend doing FFS piecemeal, each time you have something done your paying for the OR and anesthesia. Not to mention exposing yourself to more risk, namely anesthesia. Just my 2 cents.
A good friend of mine once said that for some people, the bar on "passing" is just "presenting". I think if it makes them happy though, that should be enough :)
IDK if 100% presenting as male or female would help more than it already does for someone who is doing so. Yesterday I was in lab presenting pretty much like a regular guy with a baseball cap (and I have short hair) and just regular guy clothes but I had three of my classmates use female pronouns and for almost the whole lab until the end.
I'm not sure what it is that makes people get "clocked" or pass anymore...I mean, I do know, but I suppose it's tough navigating that line when as a biological male you don't pass as male...
Quote from: Ave on November 07, 2012, 02:58:20 PM
end.
I'm not sure what it is that makes people get "clocked" or pass anymore...I mean, I do know, but I suppose it's tough navigating that line when as a biological male you don't pass as male...
...Tell me about it. I was delivering some 7 big bags of my boy clothes (with my spouses girl clothes too) to the LGBT Youth Center the other day, and the secretary had to call someone to help me out. She got on the phone and said,"There is a young lady here to see you." Of course, I thought, well, they are just being nice. All I had on was a red plunging V neck and my American Eagle jeans. My hair was finally cut the other day so I felt a little fab.
Then my therapist (later that day) said "I love your hair, you are really turning into a beautiful woman."
Then, I'm in the elevator (all this on the same day within hours) going down and a group of men get off leaving one behind. He asks "So, do you live around here?" I'm caught off guard by this. And I reply "no." He then says, "You are a very beautiful woman." I was in shock ( no....really I was) ...and you're gonna laugh, but I was almost crying tears of joy. "Oh thank you so much. You really made my day." And then I got off. So for me, it was a WOW kinda day! ;D
Just thought I'd share the good times as well as the bad.
Cheers!
Stephie
just hear in thailand i have one time where i was clocked. another ladyboy asked me if i was hear for the internatinal ladyboy contest?
i had no idea how to take that so i just told her i was in thailand on holiday. ???
Quote from: Tristan on November 07, 2012, 08:06:36 PM
just hear in thailand i have one time where i was clocked. another ladyboy asked me if i was hear for the internatinal ladyboy contest?
i had no idea how to take that so i just told her i was in thailand on holiday. ???
Tristan, I can totally understand you find that irritating. But speaking from one who was originally from there, I think she was just being friendly. Thai society is probably the most open about LGBT issue. Most don't care if they are being clocked because they are accepted in general. Many consider themselves as the third sex and were proud of it and they just live life mostly as normal as cisgender. She may have thought the rest of the world are the same. When it comes to legal issue, however, Thailand is still very backward.
It is strange, but I often will go through a day with some folks mostly (strangers) regarding me as a woman and others (Mostly people that already knew me) being adamant about still using male pronouns etc.
Having a University in town, we get students from all over the world and often their parents will visit :) This evening at the store I overheard a father and son 'guy talking' about me in Italian
I don't speak a lot of Italian, but I learned enough from various friends in younger days to understand what they were saying about me 8)
Some of it can't be repeated >:-) (They obviously didn't know I could understand quite a bit of what they were saying) But basically the father kinda had the hots for me and his son told him that I was to tall for him :laugh:
It did make me feel good so I walked by and gave the father a devious smile :)
Quote from: V M on November 07, 2012, 09:05:37 PM
It is strange, but I often will go through a day with some folks mostly (strangers) regarding me as a woman and others (Mostly people that already knew me) being adamant about still using male pronouns etc.
Having a University in town, we get students from all over the world and often their parents will visit :) This evening at the store I overheard a father and son 'guy talking' about me in Italian
I don't speak a lot of Italian, but I learned enough from various friends in younger days to understand what they were saying about me 8)
Some of it can't be repeated >:-) (They obviously didn't know I could understand quite a bit of what they were saying) But basically the father kinda had the hots for me and his son told him that I was to tall for him :laugh:
It did make me feel good so I walked by and gave the father a devious smile :)
lol! I remember seeing a pic of you from a thread a long long time ago and you are cute so those italian guys were probably saying some dirty stuff lol.
@stephanie lol, yea men are...odd, interesting, but odd. Since I dress completely like a boy, not overly masculine, but just like a regular guy my age nothing effeminate really (who invented that word? ::) ) they almost always give me that bemused kinda head tilt. Not unfriendly by any means, they're all pleasant,they just really like staring at me to figure me out
a lot
no really, it's a little unnerving?
Women on the other hand can usually go two ways, the automatically concerned mother type (the curse of having a babyface) or just the really friendly let me talk to you even though I'm obviously in a bad mood and spilled my morning coffee on this new jacket way...
I have nothing to compare this to though, I was always feminine in appearance and female-gendered pretty often, which is annoying seeing as my hair has never been "long" even by guy standards and I dress like a guy...
Quote from: mintra on November 07, 2012, 08:32:15 PM
Tristan, I can totally understand you find that irritating. But speaking from one who was originally from there, I think she was just being friendly. Thai society is probably the most open about LGBT issue. Most don't care if they are being clocked because they are accepted in general. Many consider themselves as the third sex and were proud of it and they just live life mostly as normal as cisgender. She may have thought the rest of the world are the same. When it comes to legal issue, however, Thailand is still very backward.
i figured that as well thats why i did not press the issue. plus she was really nice. as was the girl today
Quote from: Ave on November 07, 2012, 10:14:40 PM
lol! I remember seeing a pic of you from a thread a long long time ago and you are cute so those italian guys were probably saying some dirty stuff lol.
It was mostly the father with the wild ideas :) He seem to be teasing his son and trying to flatter me at the same time, it gave me both good and bad memories of younger days
Who knows, maybe he was making fun of me, but he did say I was pretty... It was just some of the other things he was saying that I didn't care for
He was just being a stereo typical guy
Doesn't matter really, I'll probably never see them again
Quote from: Tristan on November 07, 2012, 08:06:36 PM
just hear in thailand i have one time where i was clocked. another ladyboy asked me if i was hear for the internatinal ladyboy contest?
i had no idea how to take that so i just told her i was in thailand on holiday. ???
You look beautiful and I wouldn't worry about it too much...Look who's giving you that advice LOL the person that started this thread!
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Last night we went to Lesbian night at a local Bar/Restaurant. I could tell a few of the women were trying to figure me out. My wife said it was probably all in my mind. When my wife and I were dancing I overheard the girl next to me say "You guys are hot." But, later I had this really chunky and dare I say FUGLY butch start pointing the finger at me. I have to say my wife is pretty cute too so maybe she was pointing her out. I handled it really well, when I started to point the finger back at her and mirrored her then she gave up kinda frustrated and walked away. I'm not the type to let people step all over me anymore....THANKS TO THIS GROUP.
It sounds like that was a fun night. I am happy it went so well for you.
Quote from: Stephanie.Izann on November 08, 2012, 11:27:40 AM
You look beautiful and I wouldn't worry about it too much...Look who's giving you that advice LOL the person that started this thread!
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Last night we went to Lesbian night at a local Bar/Restaurant. I could tell a few of the women were trying to figure me out. My wife said it was probably all in my mind. When my wife and I were dancing I overheard the girl next to me say "You guys are hot." But, later I had this really chunky and dare I say FUGLY butch start pointing the finger at me. I have to say my wife is pretty cute too so maybe she was pointing her out. I handled it really well, when I started to point the finger back at her and mirrored her then she gave up kinda frustrated and walked away. I'm not the type to let people step all over me anymore....THANKS TO THIS GROUP.
im not. she was really nice about it. ;)
Quote from: Stephanie.Izann on November 08, 2012, 11:27:40 AM
You look beautiful and I wouldn't worry about it too much...Look who's giving you that advice LOL the person that started this thread!
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Last night we went to Lesbian night at a local Bar/Restaurant. I could tell a few of the women were trying to figure me out. My wife said it was probably all in my mind. When my wife and I were dancing I overheard the girl next to me say "You guys are hot." But, later I had this really chunky and dare I say FUGLY butch start pointing the finger at me. I have to say my wife is pretty cute too so maybe she was pointing her out. I handled it really well, when I started to point the finger back at her and mirrored her then she gave up kinda frustrated and walked away. I'm not the type to let people step all over me anymore....THANKS TO THIS GROUP.
This literally sounds like something a twelve year old would do.
I worked with a bunch of twelve year olds over the summer so I mean this more specifically than the "you suck because children suck and you remind me of them" thing that most people mean. Children don't suck but this is exactly the kind of thing a lot of twelve year olds would do to someone they thought was weird.
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on November 03, 2012, 01:26:45 AM
I've noticed that men are much, much more intuitive than women on reading a trans girl.
In my experience its the complete opposite... guys will just stare at my assets n thats it. Girls on the other hand always give me the extra double/triple stare like wth and i can just tell that they know.
I know it's hard, but sometimes you've gotta act like everybody can read your mind. That means if someone is staring at you, instead of thinking "Oh crap they know I'm trans!!", think "WTH is this B**** looking at??"
Quote from: Noelle on November 08, 2012, 02:42:25 PM
In my experience its the complete opposite... guys will just stare at my assets n thats it. Girls on the other hand always give me the extra double/triple stare like wth and i can just tell that they know.
That's not what I think.
It's easy to think that the double take is being clocked but I find that actually the reverse is true.
Where I work, it's ground zero for trans people, and I see the reactions to other trans people. An obviously clockable person will not get a second look because they have been labelled in a millisecond glance and the viewer is moving on with their day.
The other confusing issue is being hit on. My wife never was, even in her younger days, I ,OTOH, do get hit on (and I don't pass).
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on November 08, 2012, 05:12:45 PM
I know it's hard, but sometimes you've gotta act like everybody can read your mind. That means if someone is staring at you, instead of thinking "Oh crap they know I'm trans!!", think "WTH is this B**** looking at??"
Oh this made me laugh so hard!
I love hearing about everyones experiences! It makes me feel less weird about things. ;)
Quote from: Noelle on November 08, 2012, 02:42:25 PM
In my experience its the complete opposite... guys will just stare at my assets n thats it. Girls on the other hand always give me the extra double/triple stare like wth and i can just tell that they know.
Definitely, not even close.
I noticed in a recent visit to Vancouver that as I was realizing NO ONE KNOWS ME HERE, I could be more of myself. Yet, there were so many times that I just kept thinking, they are going to know. As some of you have noted, I really need to just program my mind NOT to think too much about this or it WILL not help me pass. WHen I am more confident, everything changes.
To be honest, I'm sure I don't pass in the slightest. I'm still waiting for the grinding machinations of the NHS to catch up so I can start getting some treatment. That and living in a tiny town (population circa 12500) and being chatty enough that people recognise me means I don't really have a choice but to carry on doing what I need to do and hang the consequences.
I WAS absolutely terrified by the idea of going out and about but it turns out that people either don't notice, don't care or are too polite to be unpleasant.
Quote from: Ave on November 03, 2012, 11:53:51 PM
It's also frame size,
Ehm, yes. What looks like a giveaway to me is the shoulder and trunksize on the bottom pic. Especially your trunk.
Too wide to be a woman's and emphasised by too thin shoulderstraps on the top you're wearing.
People will look at you for all sorts of reasons, trans or not. Sometimes they're not even looking at you, but you feel like they are. Everybody deals with it even gg's. I'm not saying people don't get clocked, but I think the majority of the times we think we have been are more that we're reading into things because we're so self-conscious.
Quote from: Dahlia on November 29, 2012, 05:09:03 AM
Ehm, yes. What looks like a giveaway to me is the shoulder and trunksize on the bottom pic. Especially your trunk.
Too wide to be a woman's and emphasised by too thin shoulderstraps on the top you're wearing.
LOL, yeah, not to worried about that...even the height doesn't bother me anymore since posting since I have met sooooo many tall women. Some even taller than me (CIS girls) As far as trunk size, I'm not sure about that. I know more than a few ladies that are not skinny. I've got curves and that really seems to help, besides that's always something that I can trim off...it's just hard when you are bound to the Hospital cafeterias and you have a child in the Intensive Care Unit to eat right. I have a friend who is 6'6 and she laughed and told me yeah, even I get asked if I am trans! You get used to it when you are a tall girl CIS or not. I guess in the end like most of us say here, it's how you handle it. I've been going out more and more as me, and I have had no problems and even a few people telling me I'm pretty...which at this moment in time, is sooooo appreciated.
Again, I thank all of you for posting on here. Your honesty is appreciated. And I have been able to walk out as me more thanks to all of your amazing words. You've turned a negative into a positive in my heart.
Quote from: Stephanie.Izann on November 29, 2012, 03:08:49 PMI thank all of you for posting on here. Your honesty is appreciated. And I have been able to walk out as me more thanks to all of your amazing words. You've turned a negative into a positive in my heart.
Awesome news. I'm glad you're feeling better.
I have found that going out and passing has been extremely weird for me. I have gone out and my bra straps have showed, wear makeup, padded bras, effeminate shorts, socks, pants, shorts, and have really not seen anybody looking at me too weirdly. The line seems to be drawn at skirts. In my neighborhood I have worn skirts and dresses outside and for the most part have been either ignored or or accepted without too much negative responses especially since I have been consistent about wearing dresses.
However, I have been lazy about switching my skirts to women's pants when going down town. I have simply put the pants over the skirt. At Krystal Burgers the other day the skirt stuck outside the pants and boy did I see people looking at me out of the side of their eyes with weird frowning looks on their faces.
What's with that. I can be called sir wearing makeup, apparently having breasts, carrying a purse, effeminate tops and shorts, wearing tights with sandals and its seemingly ok, but the line is drawn with wearing a skirt. I don't get it. This also seems the line drawn with the other women in my household also. Wearing dresses and skirts around the house both inside and out even when our kids friends are over is ok. Wearing a dress or skirt downtown is out, but everything else is ok.
I am getting kind of confused over what it means for me to pass or not and now that I am disappearing as a senior does it really matter or not.
I have a secret weapon in knowing how well I pass. I have hyperacute hearing; under the right conditions, I can hear a low conversation from far across the room.
I think if you could hear what I hear, many of you would be very surprised. Some people were just not raised with good manners, so they don't get that staring, talking about strangers, pointing at strangers is just not done. They do it all the time. Heck, I do it sometimes too.
But when an aggressive looking woman in a club is pointing your way, there's a damn good chance what she is saying if you could hear it is "I would so tap that!" or something a little more crass.
When I started really listening, instead of tuning out, to the crowds around me, I learned that the little girl staring and pointing at me (only a few months of hormones and even fewer full time) was talking about how much she liked the lady in the red hair and isn't she so pretty mommy. I learned that the guy was saying to his friends to check out that chick and what a nice um behind she has. We the trans* tend to have distinctive features that make us more, not less, beautiful and noticeable.
The nastiest comments I ever hear about me are the ones in my own head.
Quote from: MadelineB on December 02, 2012, 02:27:13 PM
The nastiest comments I ever hear about me are the ones in my own head.
I hear ya sister!
I tend to assume that everyone knows I transitioned but I will never admit to having transitioned. Often times I considered how if a partner finally said something to me I would just say, "Oh I just figured you knew and you were being polite." Except I would only say that if I was ready to end the relationship.
On second thought I would never admit to having transitioned for any reason.
I have had a couple of uncomfortable doctor visits with new doctors where I would not admit to having transitioned or write it down in the paperwork and where they would say things to tell me they knew or suspected. I just ignored their bad behavior. There is absolutely no reason why a doctor needs to know I transitioned in order to do lipo/body sculpting or hair transplantation and there is no reason a doctor needs to know I transitioned to prescribe an anti-biotic for having passed a kidney stone.
No one really needs to know for any reason (IMHO) assuming one is finished with transition.
Quote from: MadelineB on December 02, 2012, 02:27:13 PM
The nastiest comments I ever hear about me are the ones in my own head.
I wish this was true for me.