Well, I have an odd issue. I have a large upper back tattoo. That is purple. With lyrics of a girly song on it(Natasha Beddingfields "Unwritten"). That is a book, being torn apart on one side, and written in brand new on the other. That has "Today is where my book begins. The rest is still unwritten" on scrolly ribbon.
Without destroying the amazing custom made artwork on my body, how can I hope to make that pass at the beach once I can go topless?!
*sidenote* I was already considering doing an entire back piece to help hide the lower back tattoo(of my baby girls feet), starting with her baby brothers feet right above that.
I just need ideas to bring to my tattoo artist(who is aware of my trans* status.
Quote from: Adrian_Michael on November 26, 2012, 12:38:24 AM
Well, I have an odd issue. I have a large upper back tattoo. That is purple. With lyrics of a girly song on it(Natasha Beddingfields "Unwritten"). That is a book, being torn apart on one side, and written in brand new on the other. That has "Today is where my book begins. The rest is still unwritten" on scrolly ribbon.
I REALLY like that saying and if you wouldn't have said where it was from I wouldn't have guessed. Since it is in purple you could get it redone in black (for added masculine effect). Maybe add a feathered quill to it with the tip breaking off into black birds flying off (see photo). The saying totally relates to transition, imo.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1117.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fk599%2FSimonSez81%2Fbirdtattoo.jpg&hash=c80c3af41fd81f0fe325c2ef7f56ba60932a2a73)
Quote from: Simon on November 26, 2012, 01:10:11 AM
I REALLY like that saying and if you wouldn't have said where it was from I wouldn't have guessed. Since it is in purple you could get it redone in black (for added masculine effect). Maybe add a feathered quill to it with the tip breaking off into black birds flying off (see photo). The saying totally relates to transition, imo.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1117.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fk599%2FSimonSez81%2Fbirdtattoo.jpg&hash=c80c3af41fd81f0fe325c2ef7f56ba60932a2a73)
I like the feather, but here's the tattoo:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1133.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm599%2FNatalie867%2FAdrian_Michael%2FSDC12312.jpg&hash=8ff1b8f3b92af914a9d00f7cd766bd476142e1e0)
It's not really modifiable to black.... :-\
On the bright side it's not a giant butterfly, lol.
I don't think it's completely femme and I doubt anyone at the beach one day is going to be all up on you looking at it. If it is a big deal I'd suggest a cover up but it's not bad.
On my left inside forearm I've got a naked lady on a crescent moon I'm thinking about covering up with a sleeve. You could always do a large cover up if it bothers you that much.
Quote from: Simon on November 26, 2012, 08:24:25 AM
On the bright side it's not a giant butterfly, lol.
I don't think it's completely femme and I doubt anyone at the beach one day is going to be all up on you looking at it. If it is a big deal I'd suggest a cover up but it's not bad.
On my left inside forearm I've got a naked lady on a crescent moon I'm thinking about covering up with a sleeve. You could always do a large cover up if it bothers you that much.
You really think it's not too femme? I plan on adding quite a bit to my back(have 4 tattoos already set up, another set of feet for my son, adding names and birth dates, a pagan motif, and at least one that everyone told me was too "guy" to be put on my "female" body). The saying means so much to me, as a person in transition, and I really do love purple, LOL. I guess I'm just trying to..I dunno, make myself more stereotypical?
Quote from: Adrian_Michael on November 26, 2012, 08:35:42 AMThe saying means so much to me, as a person in transition, and I really do love purple, LOL. I guess I'm just trying to..I dunno, make myself more stereotypical?
Listen, if you like it then that is what matters. Trust me if you're passing in every other way nobody is going to be guessing your gender identity.
...but to answer your question, no I don't think it's too femme.
I don't think it's that femme either, but that could be because it reminds me of the nights watch oath from a song of ice and fire (game of thrones) and that's just completely bad ass. I would just keep it.
I don't find the tat that feminine, but if you do want to masculinize it or get rid of it you can always get a cover. If you want a good one you'll have to do some research to find someone renown for their quality covers and be willing to invest some $$$ and most probably travel a bit though, not every tattoo artist can pull them off successfully.
Here's an example of a good cover (I've seen even better but can't remember by whom) :
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fgallery.triptycs.com%2Ffadi%2Fslides%2FFadicoverupegyfaceblue2011.jpg&hash=13cf0935d59a0ae9d2f4685564056d7eaed86c69)
And here's a bad one (what is that!?) :
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.chzbgr.com%2Fcompletestore%2F2011%2F10%2F13%2F0f150284-b925-4f9d-8757-a705088a95dc.jpg&hash=b7f613f198676f71846cb1728f28691d1e8f1c6d)
Also, I don't want to hurt your feelings as this tattoo probably means a lot to you but... don't go back to the guy who did it. Not for the cover-up and not for any other tattoos, even if he's your friend or the closest from home or the cheapest around. Technique-wise it is really poorly done.
Quote from: Sia on November 26, 2012, 02:24:30 PM
Also, I don't want to hurt your feelings as this tattoo probably means a lot to you but... don't go back to the guy who did it. Not for the cover-up and not for any other tattoos, even if he's your friend or the closest from home or the cheapest around. Technique-wise it is really poorly done.
May I ask why you say that? Because I will say any bad lines/uneven lines and shading are my fault( I move and twitch and can't keep still and, in regards to the shading, I had the same problem with my lower back tattoo, I can't sit still and handle the pain long enough to get a solid shading).
She does amazing work: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.163165387637.120525.511492637&type=3 (https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.163165387637.120525.511492637&type=3)
ETA: The lower tattoo was not even her work, it was someone else, and I twitched and moved so bad there are stray tattoo dots on my hips from my throwing myself sideways when he went near my spine.
Quote from: Adrian_Michael on November 26, 2012, 03:17:47 PM
May I ask why you say that? Because I will say any bad lines/uneven lines and shading are my fault( I move and twitch and can't keep still and, in regards to the shading, I had the same problem with my lower back tattoo, I can't sit still and handle the pain long enough to get a solid shading).
She does amazing work: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.163165387637.120525.511492637&type=3 (https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.163165387637.120525.511492637&type=3)
ETA: The lower tattoo was not even her work, it was someone else, and I twitched and moved so bad there are stray tattoo dots on my hips from my throwing myself sideways when he went near my spine.
Yeah, the lines are wobbly and uneven, and the shading really isn't great as well as the underlying drawing - the book isn't symmetrical, and if you trace its contours under the ribbons it ends up with some weird angles and perspective/continuity errors.
The link you provided doesn't work for me but I googled her and found her MySpace account - a few of her works are indeed better, but overall I've seen the same shortcomings in pretty much every picture. Most people can't stay perfectly still under the dermograph for very long, and working on a living canvas is something all tattoo artists learn to do, so that's not entirely your fault.
I can see how her work looks amazing to someone who isn't pursuing a carreer in drawing/visual arts or isn't a hardcore tattoo enthusiast, but compared to other professionals she's barely around average ; at the same level than many of the tattooers you can find in every town, good enough to make a living out of it but not to establish their name in the scene and get people to travel and save big bucks for it, like they do for this (http://www.tattoo-tatouages.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/tatouage-biomecanique.jpg) or this (http://www.tattoo-tatouages.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/tatouage-portrait-manu-chalon-sur-saone.jpg) or this (http://news.bme.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/littleswastika-masterpiece.jpg) or this (http://www.yellowblaze.net/tl_files/projects/625.jpg).
Again I'm not trashing her or you as persons, just talking about her technique - and mastery of a craft requires not just talent but lots and lots of practice.
A guy in our group had a rainbow. They turned it into this big colorful snake. Awesome.
--Jay J
I don't think it's too femme. I don't think that's something that would be very easy to cover up. If you want to make it more masculine, you could just get the lines darkened and maybe add some navy blue to the purple.
Hmmmm since you're wanting to add to it anyway, an idea could be to add some abstract-y scriptlike writing behind the original to make it stand out a bit less (maybe in black with subtler purple or blue..it wouldn't be actual words, just fluid lines that looked like script), and would flow out and span your shoulders (could make them appear broader too!) and possibly connect the other tattoos and make them work together. I like designing tattoos ;D
I don't think it's very femme. I think some guys stay away from purples because it's been identified with the gay movement, but I don't think anyone's going to think much of it, especially if you're not really presenting yourself as a straight man. (And hell, if straight guys are wearing pink now, I think purple tattoos are fine). And, if you're getting more tats it won't draw much attention, especially if all your other tats are very masculine.
I do agree with MangoSlayer, I think darker lines will makes it seem more masculine.
Yes, it's feminine but nothing anyone would really think about unless they were a lover staring at your back or something. Not enough to out you or anything. If you looked like a guy otherwise, I might just say, 'oh philosophical' :laugh:
@Sia, I think that first one you posted...they seemed to also change the color of the person's skin.
Quote from: Nygeel on November 29, 2012, 12:06:55 AM
@Sia, I think that first one you posted...they seemed to also change the color of the person's skin.
Cause tans don't fade right?
Quote from: Nygeel on November 29, 2012, 12:06:55 AM
@Sia, I think that first one you posted...they seemed to also change the color of the person's skin.
Maybe its redness after getting it done or his tan.
And no offence, but a lot of her work lacks in the anatomy department.
Quote from: Nygeel on November 29, 2012, 10:14:51 AM
They don't fade that much.
I'd have to disagree with Nygeel here.
And to the OP, my main concern is more of how long ago did you get this tattoo and how important to you was it at the time? I only ask because getting a tattoo is usually seen as a fairly permanent decision and is something people usually get to represent onself since if they don't want to they don't even have to display it to the world - did you once comfortably identify as femme, is the tattoo part of a prior facade, or do you not see the tattoo as femme at all & just are afraid others might think that?
In life, just remember you should keep dear to you things that remain important to you, not things that are only important to others.
Quote from: JasonRX on November 29, 2012, 01:09:39 PM
I only ask because getting a tattoo is usually seen as a fairly permanent decision and is something people usually get to represent onself since if they don't want to they don't even have to display it to the world - did you once comfortably identify as femme, is the tattoo part of a prior facade, or do you not see the tattoo as femme at all & just are afraid others might think that?
In life, just remember you should keep dear to you things that remain important to you, not things that are only important to others.
Sage agrees. :D
Quote from: Nygeel on November 29, 2012, 12:06:55 AM
@Sia, I think that first one you posted...they seemed to also change the color of the person's skin.
I don't know if you're impliying that it's a fake or something, but I've seen several WIP pics of the process on a tattoo forum and I can tell you that it is indeed the same person on the before & after :P (I won't post them here as they are personal pics from the client in a private forum, unlike the before/after here that was uploaded by the artist on a couple of public websites).
The cover was done over the course of 8 months(!) and I suppose the guy kept his arm from sun exposure as much as possible over that time, you can see the tan fading away in each WIP pic (he was also paler in the very first one, so I guess the "before" pic is even older).
Quote from: JasonRX on November 29, 2012, 01:09:39 PM
And to the OP, my main concern is more of how long ago did you get this tattoo and how important to you was it at the time? I only ask because getting a tattoo is usually seen as a fairly permanent decision and is something people usually get to represent onself since if they don't want to they don't even have to display it to the world - did you once comfortably identify as femme, is the tattoo part of a prior facade, or do you not see the tattoo as femme at all & just are afraid others might think that?
In life, just remember you should keep dear to you things that remain important to you, not things that are only important to others.
I got the tat in November 2011. It is a momento of a major change in my life. I was determined to remind myself that the only person who writes my future is the one living today, me. Of course, I stopped listening and fell into familiar patterns, but that is neither here nor there.
I think it is a fantastic quote and I designed it myself with the help of my artist. I don't particularly find it too femme, considering that my love for purple will never change :laugh:.
But I guess I do fear people questioning me about it because it's a girly song and is purple.
Of course, now I can just add around to it and make sure a few of them are the ones I have avoided putting on my body because they are too "manly".
I don't know, I just feel subconscious about everything. My powder blue glasses, my purple tattoo, my "tramp stamp(which is thankfully black and the start of a back piece dedicated to my children)", my huge eyes, my pierced ear holes, my short stature, my loose post TWO baby stomach, the stretch marks, the "birthing hips", the 36G tits, everything.
Quote from: Nygeel on November 29, 2012, 12:06:55 AM
@Sia, I think that first one you posted...they seemed to also change the color of the person's skin.
I don't know why the skin color changed so much but it's definitely the same person. The shape of the arm is exactly the same and if you look back and forth you can see where the artist reused some of the lines from the original to help hide it.
Quote from: Adrian_Michael on November 29, 2012, 01:57:56 PM
Quote from: JasonRX on November 29, 2012, 01:09:39 PM
And to the OP, my main concern is more of how long ago did you get this tattoo and how important to you was it at the time? I only ask because getting a tattoo is usually seen as a fairly permanent decision and is something people usually get to represent onself since if they don't want to they don't even have to display it to the world - did you once comfortably identify as femme, is the tattoo part of a prior facade, or do you not see the tattoo as femme at all & just are afraid others might think that?
In life, just remember you should keep dear to you things that remain important to you, not things that are only important to others.
I got the tat in November 2011. It is a momento of a major change in my life. I was determined to remind myself that the only person who writes my future is the one living today, me. Of course, I stopped listening and fell into familiar patterns, but that is neither here nor there.
I think it is a fantastic quote and I designed it myself with the help of my artist. I don't particularly find it too femme, considering that my love for purple will never change :laugh:.
But I guess I do fear people questioning me about it because it's a girly song and is purple.
Of course, now I can just add around to it and make sure a few of them are the ones I have avoided putting on my body because they are too "manly".
I don't know, I just feel subconscious about everything. My powder blue glasses, my purple tattoo, my "tramp stamp(which is thankfully black and the start of a back piece dedicated to my children)", my huge eyes, my pierced ear holes, my short stature, my loose post TWO baby stomach, the stretch marks, the "birthing hips", the 36G tits, everything.
OT but where did you get the powder blue specs? I haven't been able to find any good blue frames let alone powder blue. The men's section is so sparse. Sucks if you like color at all.
Also, if you've already got a tramp stamp, I wouldn't worry about the purple journal.
Quote from: Forum Admin on November 29, 2012, 02:54:11 PM
I got the tat in November 2011. It is a momento of a major change in my life. I was determined to remind myself that the only person who writes my future is the one living today, me. Of course, I stopped listening and fell into familiar patterns, but that is neither here nor there.
I think it is a fantastic quote and I designed it myself with the help of my artist. I don't particularly find it too femme, considering that my love for purple will never change :laugh:.
But I guess I do fear people questioning me about it because it's a girly song and is purple.
Of course, now I can just add around to it and make sure a few of them are the ones I have avoided putting on my body because they are too "manly".
I don't know, I just feel subconscious about everything. My powder blue glasses, my purple tattoo, my "tramp stamp(which is thankfully black and the start of a back piece dedicated to my children)", my huge eyes, my pierced ear holes, my short stature, my loose post TWO baby stomach, the stretch marks, the "birthing hips", the 36G tits, everything.
OT but where did you get the powder blue specs? I haven't been able to find any good blue frames let alone powder blue. The men's section is so sparse. Sucks if you like color at all.
Also, if you've already got a tramp stamp, I wouldn't worry about the purple journal.
The $10 section of walmart. They are TINY frames, ridiculously femme.
As for the tramp stamp, it's actually my daughter's footprints with a pagan symbol between the heels. No fancy flowers, no fancy lines, just a full outline of her birth prints. My son's are going right above that, and I'm planning on tattoos going up both sides. Since I'm certain those two are my only kids, I can then start working on the rest of my back piece.
Quote from: Adrian_Michael on November 29, 2012, 02:57:23 PM
Quote from: Forum Admin on November 29, 2012, 02:54:11 PM
OT but where did you get the powder blue specs? I haven't been able to find any good blue frames let alone powder blue. The men's section is so sparse. Sucks if you like color at all.
Also, if you've already got a tramp stamp, I wouldn't worry about the purple journal.
The $10 section of walmart. They are TINY frames, ridiculously femme.
As for the tramp stamp, it's actually my daughter's footprints with a pagan symbol between the heels. No fancy flowers, no fancy lines, just a full outline of her birth prints. My son's are going right above that, and I'm planning on tattoos going up both sides. Since I'm certain those two are my only kids, I can then start working on the rest of my back piece.
Oh darn. They probably wouldn't fit me. I have a big head. :laugh:
Sounds good. I'd say the tramp stamp is most outing but sounds like you're getting it hidden a bit.
As for this stuff:
QuoteI don't know, I just feel subconscious about everything. My powder blue glasses, my purple tattoo, my "tramp stamp(which is thankfully black and the start of a back piece dedicated to my children)", my huge eyes, my pierced ear holes, my short stature, my loose post TWO baby stomach, the stretch marks, the "birthing hips", the 36G tits, everything.
We all had features going against us in some way. None of us are born with perfect male bodies. That's the whole point.
Glasses and tits - will be gone with time (if you plan on top surgery)
Birthing hips - depending on composition may be helped with T. Are they all bone or fat?
Short stature - nothing to be done outside of those 'lift shoes'. Don't know how tall you are but at barely 5'6, I'm around plenty of guys of all races my height or shorter. In almost every group situation, I've found this. You may think you'll stand out now, but you probably won't.
Huge eyes - I had a similar issue and somehow they look a lot smaller now due to facial changes. The area around my brows has changed and just the overall look of my face. They look smaller and more 'guy like' now somehow.
Tats - you're working to fix this situation. And I've seen guys with all kinds of shapes and 'out there' sayings on their bodies. Especially if they've done any time. People get real creative in there and the results aren't always stellar. The tramp stamp is the only thing that would give me pause but you're working at fixing it.
Pierced ears - I have these too. But I hadn't worn earrings since I was a pre-teen so they're shriveled up. Still visible. Like long thin lines. Never had any comments.
Loose post TWO baby stomach and stretch marks - not sure about this one. Won't the baby stomach get better after breastfeeding or something? You just had a kid, right? Doesn't this stuff go away with time? As far as the stretch marks, are you heavy at all? Might be able to pass them off as gaining/losing weight marks. They'll probably fade with time as well.
Anyway, T is usually strong enough to overcome these 'tells'. You'll feel a lot better about your body with surgery and time on T. If you plan that.
Quote from: Forum Admin on November 29, 2012, 03:29:36 PM
Loose post TWO baby stomach and stretch marks - not sure about this one. Won't the baby stomach get better after breastfeeding or something? You just had a kid, right? Doesn't this stuff go away with time? As far as the stretch marks, are you heavy at all? Might be able to pass them off as gaining/losing weight marks. They'll probably fade with time as well.
Anyway, T is usually strong enough to overcome these 'tells'. You'll feel a lot better about your body with surgery and time on T. If you plan that.
I do plan on getting T and top surgery.
My baby is 14 months old, I'm not sure I'll ever lose the stomach at this point. I split the muscles along the vertical ridge...toning it up is proving difficult. I am actually a pretty slender 180, mostly hips and tits.
The hips, a combination of fat and bone. :-\
Quote from: Adrian_Michael on November 29, 2012, 04:55:52 PM
My baby is 14 months old, I'm not sure I'll ever lose the stomach at this point. I split the muscles along the vertical ridge...toning it up is proving difficult.
I think Dr. Garramone can do some sort of lipo to make the stomach and hips look more masculine while you're already under for top surgery. I am not sure how much it costs though...
Quote from: LearnedHand on November 29, 2012, 05:11:20 PM
I think Dr. Garramone can do some sort of lipo to make the stomach and hips look more masculine while you're already under for top surgery. I am not sure how much it costs though...
Total(top and lipo/sculpt) is $11,000. So I'll be waiting awhile. :-\
Quote from: Adrian_Michael on November 29, 2012, 01:57:56 PM
I don't know, I just feel subconscious about everything. My powder blue glasses, my purple tattoo, my "tramp stamp(which is thankfully black and the start of a back piece dedicated to my children)", my huge eyes, my pierced ear holes, my short stature, my loose post TWO baby stomach, the stretch marks, the "birthing hips", the 36G tits, everything.
We ALL have things we are weird about. The glasses can be changed. With a talented artist tattoos can be covered. Why are you worried about pierced ears? I'm in the process of stretching my holes to 5/8 (almost at a 0g). There is nothing "girly" about pierced ears. Body fat will redistribute with T and time. Moobs will be removed. Two baby stomach? No kids here but I have a gut...things can change with working out. A big thing is to know that things CAN and WILL change but it all takes time.
There are times I wish trans folks all could live in the same area. It would be nice to be able to support each other. Then I think about how some trans folks act "->-bleeped-<-r than thou" and size each other up. Saying "this looks femme" or whatever. Be you...and be happy. Life is too short to be picking yourself apart. Just give yourself time and take things one day at a time.
As long as you're working on it that is all you can do. It's going to be alright bro. 8)
I've got a pretty butterfly on my foot. It really sucks because I go barefoot for martial arts classes four times a week, so it's always staring me in the face. And on top of being a butterfly, some of the ink didn't take so it has blank patches. The only problem is to get it covered or even touched up, I need at least two weeks when I don't have to wear shoes, which between my two shoe-requiring jobs is nearly impossible, and I wouldn't be able to do my martial arts classes until it was healed (can't have a gaping leaking fluids all over the mats/bags/other people). It sucks.
I love purple too. ;D
I'd say it looks a bit femme but not really femme. I don't think it will stop you passing. I do think it could make people think you're gay, but that's not the same thing and none of their business in the first place.