So, the word '->-bleeped-<-'.
The opinion on the use of this word in our community seems varied.
I've actually caught myself using the word in conversation with a friend - a friend who also uses the word to refer to me occasionally, usually in jest. Sometimes though, my friend will use the word in reference to other transgender people, and that bothers me for some reason. I don't know if it is worth it to point out some people might find it offensive, or if doing so will make it sound like I'm the politcally correct language police, which is something I want to avoid.
Other people's language doesn't bother me - but I do think language constructs a lot of how we think and interact with each other, so it is important to think about the way some words work in context. The meaning and usage of words, especially words like this one, changes over time. Also, a lot of the weight of the word as a potential insult seems tied to the intent of the speaker.
I'm not harping on people who use the word, either, I just think it'd be interesting to hear other people's opinions. Is it derogatory when used by others but not when we use to reference ourselves? Is it always something to avoid?
It is an insult, an adjective, or a convenient way to refer to one's self should you so choose?
everyone have different views on this i think, but for me i dont like that word at all i once been told that i was a ->-bleeped-<- by someone i know and i was hurt.
So for me i think it a bad word, but im intrested to see what other people think of it too.
I would choose either a transmale or transfemale or transgender.
For me, it really depends on the context of how the word is used.
Like N***** or F**, it can be a derogatory word or a term of endearment. Like those words they are mostly all used in a derogatory fashion.
I see it as a kind of "N" word, but for us. Spoken among friends or each other it's ok, but borderline and controversial...and never ok to use to describe someone not known to you.
Sometimes it'll slip out, but I correct myself immediately...like the N word, it's not a word I want to be in the habit of using.
:)
Controversial. Among close GLBTI friends I find it okay, but I stress "close". Otherwise not in favour.
Karen.
I don't use it. It is historically used as a derogatory word towards trans* women and I don't think FTM's have a place using it or reclaiming it. Just my 0.02.
the T word is insulting and demeaning, a Lady or Gentleman should never use it
In conversation with a trans person I know well (we used to pretty much be family) I'll say '->-bleeped-<-' in jest or whatever. We call each other ->-bleeped-<-s, and we're both cool with that. I wouldn't refer to anyone else as anything other than trans man/woman, ftm/mtf etc to them, even if they had used it about their ftm boyfriend before me. I don't care about referring to myself that way, if I'm fine with it then people aren't going to try and use it as an insult. It's not a conscious 'trying to reclaim it' thing, it's just how I've always dealt with things, I laughed about how I was a crazy nutter who went off "to get my straitjacket fitted" (see my shrink) because I'd sliced up my arms "so I could look like a zebra", and no one turned around and tried to use those things as a way to hurt me. Doesn't mean I find them amusing or not serious, just self-preservation, and it's good to be able to put a lighter spin on things rather than always getting down about them.
When my girlfriend -- before she knew about me being trans -- used it in reference to someone who had come into her work I felt bothered more because I felt that I should than actual hurt/anger. I felt a little bit concerned because it didn't seem like a good omen to her being knowledgeable about it and supportive, but I was so, so wrong there. I am a little prejudiced in that case though. The only time I've ever heard someone else use it was insulting someone in my old class at school, because he let some girls put make up on him once and appeared to really be enjoying it throughout. They were basically friends anyway though, and he happened to be the person who sexually assaulted me when I was younger, so... I didn't really give a monkeys what they said to him.
I tend to forgive people who I know don't mean any harm by it, but don't know any better. My mind nags me to call them out on it because that's the right thing to go for everyone else out there, but I've never wanted to out myself by getting all up tight about it, when I did being trans as the idea behind a bit of writing I had to do in school on the theme of "Trapped" I kept saying "oh it's just some bull about a ->-bleeped-<- having a shower." Because of how I presented, a very, butch lesbian, I felt like it wouldn't be too hard for people to make connections and assumptions as to what I really was. I think someone still did work it out, because they kept telling me every time there had been a show on TV about trans people, but that could have just been because I'd let slip how much I knew about hormones, secondary sex characteristics and phalloplasties (I have no idea how that came up in conversation...)
Last Christmas I did spend a couple of hours on the phone yelling to someone (who I'd helped out when they were hallucinating, depressed and helped to convince them to see a doctor/not do anything crazy) that I was male, that my birthname wasn't me, and that calling me a '->-bleeped-<-' isn't going to get them anywhere in life. That was... fun... I've not forgiven them for that, although the trans people I mentioned earlier have to some extent, but then I can't understand why someone who is trans would still go anywhere near talking to some who screamed transphobic insults at me and tried to out me on facebook for three days, full stop.
TLDR; I use it to people I know won't be offended, and to refer to myself, or if the situation requires it or I'll be at risk of outing myself. Similarly I don't call people out on it if I think it's going to lead to them scrutinising me, it's just self preservation. People who don't mean to use it as an insult don't bother me, just those who think that they can use it to harm others.
Don't like it.I wouldn't use the N word and I regard it just as demeaning
Quote from: justmeinoz on January 11, 2013, 04:18:02 PM
Controversial. Among close GLBTI friends I find it okay, but I stress "close". Otherwise not in favour.
Karen.
I second this. I don't use it myself though.
With some of my friends we call everything gay (even my hair). When we see a movie with two straight people kissing we call them gay that or: "Eww straight people!". We do this to make fun of gay being used as a slur. I could never dream of doing this to people that might take it the wrong way.
I don't use the word "->-bleeped-<-"in conversation because it does seem demeaning. I've used it for myself just the other day, but that's because I was thinking about how life would be if I came out at work and still managed to get hired at the firm where I intern now (I feel 95% sure that I'd get a job offer upon graduation if I didn't come out, but feel slightly nervous that coming out as trans will lower my chances of being hired since I work at a political republican law firm), and if I lived in the town where I work (which is one of the few republican areas in this state). Everyone would known that I was once female, so there'd be no way that I could be stealth here, so I said in my head "oh well, I guess I'd just be the local ->-bleeped-<-" because I thought ->-bleeped-<- would be a more appropriate word to use because it's not like I could expect anyone to say FTM or transguy. I know people would talk about me behind my back for awhile, and I know that's a word that would be used. I would never call another person a "->-bleeped-<-" though.
Quote from: spacerace on January 11, 2013, 03:45:00 PM
So, the word '->-bleeped-<-'.
Personally I consider the word offensive, inaccurate and reduces people to objects which only makes it easier insult, harm, or who knows what else. I wouldn't want that word used on me and I would never use it on anyone no matter what the circumstances.
I remember hearing people use the word repeatedly on that BBC (?) trans reality TV show last summer and finding it odd. I've also read people use the word in reference to themselves on this forum recently, so opinions are all over the place for sure.
One thing though, and this is not to stay there is a 1:1 comparison at all - but in terms of 'reclaiming words', I like the word queer. I still sorta consider the word as part of my own identity. Queer is absolutely a word that has been hurled as an insult at gay people, but it seems pretty accepted now.
It's a confusing word too, as when I was younger it much more usually was a term of abuse for cross-dressers. I don't like it because as well as for all the reasons mentioned above, it's over-familiar and reduces people to that one thing about them, a bit like when I see someone being called "a gay" (or, for that matter, "the homeless"). When people reduce you to a noun, be wary. What you choose to call yourself is a different matter, but be aware of the effect it might have on others around you - including encouraging people to call others that inappropriately.
I don't like the word, never have. I immediately say something if someone uses that word to me and especially about me. I have even told a brother that I was done with him if he called me one again. I don't even like to see trans people use it. I don't believe in the whole "reclaiming" a word either.
Yeah I don't like it either and it bothers me that other people could see this as a slur. Someone introduced themselves them to saying "I am not a ->-bleeped-<-, a gay boy, etc". It was quite amazing actually. I told this person that they need to be careful that '->-bleeped-<-' could be seen as offensive. My whole little speech went on deaf ears. But I found that even though this word has never been used I did not like it. Felt it sounded a lot like the "n" word.
I think some people are trying to "take it back" but I only think it works with close friends.
--Jay
I don't care if anyone uses it. I care more about the message behind someone's words, not the actual semantics. If someone just innocuously says, "She's a ->-bleeped-<-," then I don't care. If someone says, "That dirty ->-bleeped-<-!," I'd have a problem.
Plus, I don't think "->-bleeped-<-" is comparable to the N word.
I don't use it, and I don't condone using it. If someone used it to describe me, I'd be pissed. It has an overall negative effect and as such, I never will use it to refer to another trans person.
I've heard it used negatively too many times to use it myself, even if it was mant to be 'casual' or 'amongst friends.'
I use it when referring to myself on occasion. If I had any trans friends here I'm sure I'd pick around with them and use it in jest.
Yes, I've had the word used used against me. I think it would have bothered me if I hadn't desensitized myself to it a long time ago.
Quote from: Zumbagirl on January 11, 2013, 07:52:17 PM
Personally I consider the word offensive, inaccurate and reduces people to objects which only makes it easier insult, harm, or who knows what else. I wouldn't want that word used on me and I would never use it on anyone no matter what the circumstances.
This. And if someone who knew I was trans (whether they were trans themselves or not) and used it on me I would rip them a new one and end whatever relationship we had.
Quote from: wheat thins are delicious on January 12, 2013, 01:43:09 AM
This. And if someone who knew I was trans (whether they were trans themselves or not) and used it on me I would rip them a new one and end whatever relationship we had.
I can respect your opinion but I don't understand the reasoning behind it. If I cut off everyone in my life who had ever offended me in one way or the other I would have nobody around.
I just see it like a black person using the "n" word, a gay man calling another gay man the "f" word, or a lesbian calling herself the "d" word. One of those "if you are one you can use it, if you're not then don't you say it" sorta things.
Then again I don't really over think it. I've always been a strong believer in minimizing the power that words have over me. Words only have the power that one assigns to them.
Quote from: Ms. OBrien VT on January 11, 2013, 04:14:32 PM
For me, it really depends on the context of how the word is used.
Like N***** or F**, it can be a derogatory word or a term of endearment. Like those words they are mostly all used in a derogatory fashion.
i was thinking literally the same thing. i just think no one should use it because people can get upset and if their intent isn't to upset people then they should find another word.
i have had a cis guy who didnt know i was trans at the time use it in a joking fashion in saying our friend a cis girl has a penis and i was offended.
but me and two of my trans guy friend where hanging out one of them joked saying that we where a ->-bleeped-<- gang and i was fine with that.
Quote from: Simon on January 12, 2013, 02:58:15 AM
Then again I don't really over think it. I've always been a strong believer in minimizing the power that words have over me. Words only have the power that one assigns to them.
Finally, someone who isn't completely oversensitive. :)
we dont have the word ->-bleeped-<-*
we have trans and transexual which some people find offensive and some use. I presonally dont use that word.
-
but in english I would say its pretty much like already said the N or F word.
its not so much what we say but how we say it and in which context.
You can say horrible words and things to people if you know there cool. but if your to be somehow more "political correct, or to speak to strangers who dont know you, then you are to be a bit more polite in general.
Quote from: spacerace on January 11, 2013, 03:45:00 PM
So, the word '->-bleeped-<-'.
<snip>
It is an insult, an adjective, or a convenient way to refer to one's self should you so choose?
I could use it about myself when talking to my best (online) mate, and he could have used it about me and I wouldn't have batted an eye. But, between us various derogatory expressions are terms of endearment.
I never use it in conversation with others, and frown when I hear others use it about anyone that is not themself.
It's a bit more like the "f" word than the "n" word I think. BTW, I don't know re: the whole words have no power. I think that slurs are of somewhat limited power, but certainly people can be more hurt by words (say by a parent or teacher) than by actual physical abuse. I keep that in mind as a teacher.
--Jay
I am pretty sure the term refers to ->-bleeped-<-s and is meant to inflict pain. Its the whole its weird for men to wears womens cloths mentality of our planet.