Hello. I've been wondering, I'm worried HRT won't work on me because I'm too old. I'm 23, which is basically the age everyone stops growing (if not earlier), so I'm not sure if HRT will have any effect on me. Am I too old? Do people have successful transitions when they transition at my age? Mind you, I'm not looking for HRT to make me look beautiful, that's what make-up is for. I'm only hoping for it to at least make me look passable without make-up.
This is how I currently look:
(https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/155686_449191125163751_2065800864_n.jpg)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/62621_451018914980972_1739996928_n.jpg)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/562335_451019251647605_1760993849_n.jpg)
I started at age 23, and look at me now! I'm all papery an' stuff!
:D
More seriously, all you have to worry about is bone structure. Everything else is malleable. And honestly, I think you'll do fine - no bones about it. ^-^
It better still work, I started at almost 25! I spent a while concerned that I was starting too late too, but there are lots of pretty women around here that started in their 30s or even 40s. 23 is considered a young age for transitioning :)
Quote from: ZoeM on May 23, 2013, 02:24:42 PM
I started at age 23, and look at me now! I'm all papery an' stuff!
:D
More seriously, all you have to worry about is bone structure. Everything else is malleable. And honestly, I think you'll do fine - no bones about it. ^-^
Good one! And you pass just fine?
Quote from: riversong on May 23, 2013, 03:19:01 PM
Good one! And you pass just fine?
I'm getting there - this is month 4-ish for me. I'm 6' tall, but other than that I'm turning out OK. :)
Quote from: Anna! on May 23, 2013, 02:33:11 PM
It better still work, I started at almost 25! I spent a while concerned that I was starting too late too, but there are lots of pretty women around here that started in their 30s or even 40s. 23 is considered a young age for transitioning :)
"...or even 40s?!? Can you imagine someone starting HRT at that advanced age?"
Asked the 51-year-old who took her first spiro this week.
Don't worry its not to late for you I started at 33 and I'm doing just fine. I wish I had started at 23 which btw is like really young so just relax you'll be just fine. :)
Quote from: suzifrommd on May 23, 2013, 03:32:34 PM
"...or even 40s?!? Can you imagine someone starting HRT at that advanced age?"
Asked the 51-year-old who took her first spiro this week.
Haha! You all know what I meant! The point is you can have good results at any time, so don't spend a lot of time agonizing over if <reader's current age> is too late. Like the saying goes - better late than never :)
Nope, it's not too old!
Besides, there are lots more benefits to HRT than just changes to your appearance. At least that's what I've been told and that's what I'm hoping for!
Quote from: Heather on May 23, 2013, 03:36:10 PM
Don't worry its not to late for you I started at 33 and I'm doing just fine. I wish I had started at 23 which btw is like really young so just relax you'll be just fine. :)
You look great Heather!
And yeah, don't worry Riversong. If you need some inspiration, be on the lookout for Alainluvsu (like the prettiest girl ever) and I'm pretty sure you're younger than her when she first started.
I started HRT about 2 years ago, shortly before my 42nd birthday. Yes, it's working. It's slow, but it's working.
only time it is too late to start HRT is when you are dead, :)
I started when I was 23 and did well and actually stopped for a while then RESTARTED at an older age and I pass fine, I think you will do great.
Quote from: kyh on May 23, 2013, 04:30:44 PM
You look great Heather!
And yeah, don't worry Riversong. If you need some inspiration, be on the lookout for Alainluvsu (like the prettiest girl ever) and I'm pretty sure you're younger than her when she first started.
Thanks! Your right about Alaina her before and afters are some of the most impressive ones on the site! And inspired me to think I could transition too! Riversong just spend some time around the before and after threads there is some amazing transformations on that thread.
Thanks everyone! I still can't imagine having the confidence to post "before" pics. That takes true confidence!
I started at 32 and was passing with makeup by two months and without by four. :) Plus you have pretty reasonable expectations - not to end up as a supermodel - so I bet you'll do great!
I'm in the same age group so I know how you feel. I'm going to start soon (in the next month or so) and often kick myself for not starting at 19. However, 23 is not a bad age to start at all. While Your mileage may vary, you are likely to have a positive response.
Quote from: Jenna Marie on May 23, 2013, 07:40:08 PM
I started at 32 and was passing with makeup by two months and without by four. :) Plus you have pretty reasonable expectations - not to end up as a supermodel - so I bet you'll do great!
That's a good reminder. However, I can't help but hope I'll look like a supermodel after it's all said and done. Realistic? Perhaps not. But a girl can dream. :)
Oh, I think all girls dream about it, even cis girls hitting puberty. :) Nothing wrong with dreaming... as long as it's not an expectation that life won't be worth living if it doesn't come true.
I am in my 30s and have been on HRT for 3 months and apparently I pass. BTW, masculinzation is complete by age 20 if not 18. You do not grow after 18 other then maybe a nanometer. This age thing is a dangerous myth. The only time I ever heard of growth after age 18 is here. I asked my friends and they looked at me like I was insane when I said people grow after 18. They don't. A young is good for HRT because the body is more efficient and the skin looks better and T builds more muscle over time. Genetics play a way bigger factor. That and how andro you were when you started. The closer you are to looking female or farther from not male the better.
To echo a previous response... I certainly hope so... because I didn't start until I was 27.
Trust us, 23 is still very young. Don't worry about it. No, you won't get the same results as someone who transitioned in their teens, but you should still get good results. In fact, a majority of the trans-women on Youtube that I idolize are 20-something transitioners, who started HRT between like 18 and 24. In fact, it is VERY rare for someone to begin transition younger than that. So probably a majority of the trans-women that you have ever seen didn't begin transition until after 18.
From what I've seen, most who transition during their natural hormonal "prime," between 18 and somewhere in the early-mid 30's, almost consistently get good results. And hell, a lot of people get excellent results even at 50 or 60. A lot of it is just the luck of the draw in the genetic lottery.
Quote from: Carrie Liz on May 24, 2013, 02:04:01 AM
From what I've seen, most who transition during their natural hormonal "prime," between 18 and somewhere in the early-mid 30's, almost consistently get good results.
BINGO! I actually think the number of people who transition before 18 is in the low 1000s. Maybe less. That might rise in the future but even 10 years it was extremely hard to transition. I wanted to transition at 19. I tried. I failed. There was less then zero information and resources. It obviously happened but it wasn't as easy as it is today by a long shot.
And please keep in mind that at least theoretically there are two big groups of TS - so called "early set" and "late set". While they might appear quite similar, in fact, they are totally different in etiology, sexuality etc. Early set transitioners tend to transition somewhere between their teens and the age of 25. Whereas the late set transitioners can and will transition at any time of their life.
I will try to find that article, which was quite an interesting read... But in general, yes, early set are described as "homosexual" as regards their birth assigned gender, which is, of course, a wrong term with regard to the brain wiring (as stated in the article as well), whereas late set are usually heterosexual or bi, or they start as hetero and turn bi during the HRT.
Quote from: Sammy on May 24, 2013, 10:45:44 AM
I will try to find that article, which was quite an interesting read... But in general, yes, early set are described as "homosexual" as regards their birth assigned gender, which is, of course, a wrong term with regard to the brain wiring (as stated in the article as well), whereas late set are usually heterosexual or bi, or they start as hetero and turn bi during the HRT.
Really looking forward to reading it :)
Quote from: Sammy on May 24, 2013, 03:42:32 AM
And please keep in mind that at least theoretically there are two big groups of TS - so called "early set" and "late set". While they might appear quite similar, in fact, they are totally different in etiology, sexuality etc. Early set transitioners tend to transition somewhere between their teens and the age of 25. Whereas the late set transitioners can and will transition at any time of their life.
I thought this theory was discredited years ago.
Quote from: Sammy on May 24, 2013, 03:42:32 AM
And please keep in mind that at least theoretically there are two big groups of TS - so called "early set" and "late set". While they might appear quite similar, in fact, they are totally different in etiology, sexuality etc. Early set transitioners tend to transition somewhere between their teens and the age of 25. Whereas the late set transitioners can and will transition at any time of their life.
Just sounds like more cubbyholing to me!
Started at 54 and that was 5 years ago and now a 38C. So yes it still works.
Quote from: suzifrommd on May 24, 2013, 11:04:49 AM
I thought this theory was discredited years ago.
I dunno - when I read it for the first time, many things seemed quite reasonable to me.
Quote from: Sammy on May 24, 2013, 12:13:14 PM
I dunno - when I read it for the first time, many things seemed quite reasonable to me.
Do you know what keywords I'd have to use on google to find an article or information about that?
Also, by etiology, in this case you mean the origin or cause of their transsexualism? So, it's proposed that "late set" transitioners have GID for reasons different from "early set" transitioners? I don't know if I can really believe that... I'd have to look into it some more.
I am trying to use the keywords I am remembering, but I keep failing for some reaons... :(
No, there was nothing about the origins, which are still unclear - as far as I know, the theory about insufficient androgynisation of brain is still like not 100% confirmed, is it? But it is not that important for me, since I have to live with what I have and once I am already stuck with GD, I would be better with tools to deal with it, rather than to know what caused it, providing that it is still unreversible :P.
The only thing I disagreed in that theory was the suggestion that for late set the cross dressing played a major part, when forming the TS identity, because it effectively was quite contrary to my own experience, but to each her own ;).
The article also suggested that late set TS tend to have higher than average IQ, whereas early set TS have average or slightly below average IQ - that, of course, can be a major source of hate as well.
OK, I got it - apparently that article was related to the criticised Blanchard theory, which are another cause of major hate at some period of time - I am still learning a lot of "old" things for the first time :P. Well, nevermind, it still was interesting to read notwithstanding how it was received - I guess that is the usual way how theories work.
And I have no idea what "cubbyholing" means :P.
I started at 29... and I have NO problems passing at all.
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on May 24, 2013, 12:37:52 PM
I started at 29... and I have NO problems passing at all.
Miracle girl. >.>
Omg :O ZoeM
What happened?
You look so different! And in a good way! Omg! Hrt is doing wonders for you.
Quote from: Sammy on May 24, 2013, 12:33:17 PM
I am trying to use the keywords I am remembering, but I keep failing for some reaons... :(
No, there was nothing about the origins, which are still unclear - as far as I know, the theory about insufficient androgynisation of brain is still like not 100% confirmed, is it? But it is not that important for me, since I have to live with what I have and once I am already stuck with GD, I would be better with tools to deal with it, rather than to know what caused it, providing that it is still unreversible :P.
The only thing I disagreed in that theory was the suggestion that for late set the cross dressing played a major part, when forming the TS identity, because it effectively was quite contrary to my own experience, but to each her own ;).
The article also suggested that late set TS tend to have higher than average IQ, whereas early set TS have average or slightly below average IQ - that, of course, can be a major source of hate as well.
OK, I got it - apparently that article was related to the criticised Blanchard theory, which are another cause of major hate at some period of time - I am still learning a lot of "old" things for the first time :P. Well, nevermind, it still was interesting to read notwithstanding how it was received - I guess that is the usual way how theories work.
And I have no idea what "cubbyholing" means :P.
I'm not sure what cubbyholing means either :O But I think it means separating people into different categories? The trans community is already pretty divided, so I guess the "early set" and "late set" theory would just further exacerbate that problem xD
Quote from: kyh on May 24, 2013, 01:08:14 PM
Omg :O ZoeM
What happened?
You look so different! And in a good way! Omg! Hrt is doing wonders for you.
Well, let's see. I got rid of the paper mask and hair, then...
Kidding. Actually I think I just got really lucky with the camera. One in a hundred shot, or thereabouts. But thanks. :)
Quote from: ZoeM on May 24, 2013, 01:11:45 PM
Well, let's see. I got rid of the paper mask and hair, then...
Kidding. Actually I think I just got really lucky with the camera. One in a hundred shot, or thereabouts. But thanks. :)
Idk, I think you look female and gorgeous in your new profile pic. Trick of the camera or not! ^_^
Quote from: kyh on May 24, 2013, 01:10:08 PM
I'm not sure what cubbyholing means either :O But I think it means separating people into different categories? The trans community is already pretty divided, so I guess the "early set" and "late set" theory would just further exacerbate that problem xD
Precisely!
Quote from: Sammy on May 24, 2013, 12:13:14 PM
I dunno - when I read it for the first time, many things seemed quite reasonable to me.
From Julia Serrano's "The Case Against Autogynephelia" (http://learningtrans.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/serano-agreview-ijt.pdf (http://learningtrans.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/serano-agreview-ijt.pdf)):
QuoteBlanchard's
subtypes were not empirically derived but rather
stemmed from his initial grouping of individuals
based on their sexual orientation, thus, "begging
the question" that transsexuals fall into subtypes
based on their sexual orientation; (b) that he
did not include nontranssexual female control
groups; (c) that Blanchard relied exclusively on
clinical samples that may not accurately reflect
the greater nonclinical transgender population
(c.f., Hooker, 1957); and (d) that his results had
not been replicated. Indeed, Blanchard himself
described his results as "provisional" and stated
that "the present findings, therefore, need repli-
cation"
PQ
There is no difference in masculinization between someone at 19 and that same person at 25. In fact, I would doubt you could tell any difference at all in appearance other then skin, and aging. The only thing that grows after 18-20 is your nose. And really a late transitioner is 26-34? No way. Late transitioner is more defined by age 50 or over. The single most important factor in how well you will pass is how masculine your are. I passed at 73 days and have been called sir exactly once since then. (Had a really bad beard shadow going on). Oh yeah and I like guys. I'm 30. I'm also well on my way to C cups. And if you look at some of the other 30 year old MTFs here I see the same pattern. In fact, us 30 year old old hags are some of the prettiest MTFs there are! Ha! Take that. JK lol But really...
The single reason I did not transition earlier is because it was nowhere near as easy in 2001-2. There was no YouTube. No Susan's. No nothing. If I would've known then what I know now I would have done something. The reason this makes me so mad is because right now there is prob some 27 year old reading this who will give up because they read stuff like after 25 you can't pass as easy. BS. They may even turn to drugs or worse as the pain becomes unbearable. I would hate that and I can't stand for it. As a community we really need to stop separating ourselves so much. (I mean look at some of the comments sometime about drag queens. eww I say.I would become I drag queen for money but I am too feminine.) I would bet 90 percent of so-called late transtioners would have transitioned when they were 20 if the conditions then were the same as today. The whole sexuality thing is absurd. Sorry. rant over. I hope I didn't offend anyone I wasn't trying to.
Yeah, it seems most people would want to transition earlier if they could have. I don't think there really is a difference between early and late transitioners. It sucks that society makes things so hard and I really feel for those who couldn't transition until they were older. However, even though us younger ones have more support out there, it still is tough. In my case, I should have had no problem transitioning earlier, but was very weak. I had a friend who had started transitioned that supported me in every step of the way and an educational system that I could have taken advantage of. Still, when you are young and facing the pressures of transitioning it is pretty difficult. Even with the support structures around us today, it is still incredibly hard. Now, I'm still in my early twenties and actually making a start, but wish I had gone forward when I was 19.
I don't think the dearth of information in 2001 is quite right. I discovered what to do about my GID via the internet in '94 by browsing the USENET forums. It was yesteryear's equivalent of Susan's. My indelible messages are still public, yikes. Granted, computers were a bit more unwieldy and unfriendly back then, but by 2000 PCs were common place and the internet was exploding with information about GID. An Altavista, or even Google search, would have brought thousands of hits. But certainly, there was nothing as user friendly as today's YouTube or Susan's.
I do feel pretty stupid I didn't figure out how to do it in 2000. I really have no excuse. My main problem was money and I was going to join the army to finance it but went to school instead and get straight As just so I could up my chances of gettign a great job. In 2008, I had the money and when I got this big raise the first thought in my mind was "I won. I can finally get SRS. I did it." But for whatever reason I kept putting it off and then was violently assaulted and nearly murdered and that set my transition back to today. I try not to think about it because I could have done this so long ago.
Really the main thing was my ex. She knew I was trans and she proposed to me anyway. She asked me. And I would always tell her "are you sure? I want to transition." And she would say "yes, I'm sure. even if we never have sex again that way I will always love you more then you will ever know." She even used to tell people I was her girlfriend and that I was a woman who was born with a birth defect. But then at the very end of our relationship when people would mistake me for a woman or comment on how feminine I am, she changed. She started saying things like "yeah it really scares me sometimes how he is." When I dressed up as Miss America (her idea) for halloween she was going to put extensions in my hair but then backed out and was like it won't look like a costume you will look like a GG. People still thought I was GG and some guy hit on me. That's when I think she really realized what she was getting into.
She never said she left me for being trans but with the way she was treating me I do think it was a big part. And it annoys me because I was so honest and so forthcoming and she led me to believe it was okay and then she left me and that destroyed me for a long time. A really long time. Hell I had to stop writing this cause I broke down crying. After that I tried for a long time to win her back by telling her I was not trans that I just said that cause I thought she liked it. But honestly I became best friends with this girl who is really trans friendly and she wanted me to move in with her and she knew I wanted to transition so I have no excuses. I messed up. But that was only five years ago so it is water under the bridge and I am transitioning now and I'll get the money for SRS so it is what it is. I would like to see me ex again. I miss her and I think we could be friends now I mean it's not like I even want to get with her she is not as manly as she was so I need a man or a really butch girl.
Wow, you've gone through such a lot. Your relationship with your ex doesn't seem to have been so healthy though. You know, if you were still with her today, you may have never decided to transition. She does sound quite manipulative. God knows what would have happened to me if I had got into any relationship before transition. But relationships didn't interest me as a male and the ones I did manage were all platonic.
You haven't lost too much time and you have a precious gift. Male puberty seems to have been very kind to your body. I do think that you're going to do really well, Joanna.
I remember thinking something like, "Oh well I was born a boy I'll just have to be a boy," between the ages of 5 and 7 years old. That would've been between 1974 and 1976. Around the age of 12 is when I used to wish and pray that I'd get a bizarre disease where the only life saving option would've been a sex change. That would've been in 1981.
No YouTube. No Susans. No Carla's Boutique in San Jose. I was so ignorant I didn't even know which questions to ask.
If I hadn't gotten married at 19 and had gone to college instead, I would've been exposed to more than what I'd seen so far in 13 years of Catholic school. It's possible I would've started transition a long time ago. But I had a family to provide for: I'm 19.5 years older than my son, and about 22 years older than my daughter. For me, transition was delayed because as a parent I felt that what I wanted for my life just didn't matter compared to what my kids needed.
I began transition when my youngest was 18.
5 June 2013 will be 2 years HRT for me. Sure, I wish the results were faster as I still don't quite have A-cup breasts. But things are happening, even if they are happening slowly. I've encountered articles that imply starting sooner is better and that it doesn't matter how long one's body has been poisoned by testosterone. I guess it really just depends on the individual.
Quote from: Nicolette on May 25, 2013, 02:48:02 PM
Wow, you've gone through such a lot. Your relationship with your ex doesn't seem to have been so healthy though. You know, if you were still with her today, you may have never decided to transition. She does sound quite manipulative. God knows what would have happened to me if I had got into any relationship before transition. But relationships didn't interest me as a male and the ones I did manage were all platonic.
You haven't lost too much time and you have a precious gift. Male puberty seems to have been very kind to your body. I do think that you're going to do really well, Joanna.
It prob wasn't too healthy at all. Her mom said it was some weird kind of co-dependency. I lived with her and her parents for most of the relationship because my parents treat me like dirt. Actually they treat dirt better. You're right though if we were still together I would not be transitioning. She straight up told me no not ever. And when we broke up that was the first thing I thought of: well at least I can transition now.
Thanks though I guess puberty wasn't too hard on me! I can't wait to get past this awkward period and pass a whole lot better. That will be awesome.
Hey Riversong,
Nice name BTW. I christened a favorite old sailboat "River Song." Speaking of old, you have a great opportunity for success and as a 60+ yo HRT is working sweetly to assist my transition. Like Constance I always felt my kids, wife, and family came first and back in the 1950s-1960s there was no internet and only a rare headline about anything other than the straight life. Thanks for posting your pics and good luck with what appears to be a very passable future.
This is what I know from hormones, Of course the younger you are the better they will work, like say for male pattern baldness that wont happen to you because your starting early before that kicks in. However some older trans people have seen good things happen.
I started hormones in 2002 and have been on them since now 2013. With no bottom surgery thus yet. I started in my early 20's and am now 33 of age. Iv had no FFS though some have thought so in the past. And I have no real reason to mess with my face was born with a pretty decent face. Though have always wanted a smaller nose but doubt that will ever happen.
I would not worry about anything.
Mira I started when I was 22 and I'm now 23 I'm two weeks shy of my 11 month mark...sweetheart yu should see the attention I get from men...dnt fret chica yu will do just fine just make sure yu start working on your voice gud luck :)