Does anybody know a cure for this? I am a man and it is pretty crappy.
Quote from: NotThereYet on June 08, 2013, 05:20:43 AM
Does anybody know a cure for this? I am a man and it is pretty crappy.
What made you detransition? Can you "retransition"?
Why are you sad?
Quote from: suzifrommd on June 08, 2013, 07:19:04 AM
What made you detransition? Can you "retransition"?
I'm also curious what made you decide to detransition. If de-transitioning made you sad, then maybe you should consider another attempt at transitioning? Maybe you could talk to a therapist to help work through the issues that caused this?
Good luck! *hugs*
If your feeling really bad you can admit yourself and the could do therapy. Idk maybe biofeedback or some other form of therapy
I know the feeling all too well. I have almostly effectively stopped/de-transitioned after 3-4 years of growing, learning about myself, and living part-time. A new job and a relocation brought it on.
I got to realize just how much I don't really want to be a guy. I don't hate being one. It is more of a general lifestyle thing. I felt so much more alive and in touch with my true self before. Now I feel all the wonderfull personal growth I achieved these past 3 years is guickly slipping away as I am back in that old environment.
How do I cope? With transition to full-time just dream, and many years away from happening if at all? With even part-time out of the question thanks to pin-headed people surrounding me? I try to see this new job and relocation back into civilization as part of the journey of discovery. I now have access to all sorts of gender therapist, support groups, and other resources. Far different than having a 90 mile drive to a 'Local' support group. Therpist being 3 hours away and out of the question.
I need to do male mode for now. It does not have to be a permanent situation. In fact I know it cannot be. I rediscovered joy, happiness, even passion while learning that I really can be seen and accepted as a woman. I also know I am that smae person in either mode. While the intensity of these wonderful feelings may differ, I have no reason to deny myself them, as I was. I know I can be somewhat of a whole person, not two seperate beings occupying the same body. I need to be one whole person to be truely strong, happy, and healthy
What made me detransitin after only 7 months of HRT? My family. My wife was going to be permamently upset at me and I wuld have probably seen my kids only once every two weeks... That is not enough for me, therefore I decided to detransition and make my wife happy.
She hated every single minute of my transition and she told me so very convincingly. It was not uncommon for her to say in front of my two little children that their dad likes to take it up his a** and suck di*** and wants to be a woman and dress like a woman... Which is obviously not where it's at given that I just am, I don't want to be and I want to dress like myself. She also told me how much she hated the way I moved, talked, etc. how disgusting and ridiculous my teeny tiny shrinking penis was, how disgusting my breasts were and so were my hips, my puffy butt, and my soft, hairless, feminine skin. She said touching me made her want to throw up....
Anyway, I am a man, now, la tee daa.
Peace
Quote from: NotThereYet on June 09, 2013, 03:04:23 AM
What made me detransitin after only 7 months of HRT? My family. My wife was going to be permamently upset at me and I wuld have probably seen my kids only once every two weeks... That is not enough for me, therefore I decided to detransition and make my wife happy.
She hated every single minute of my transition and she told me so very convincingly. It was not uncommon for her to say in front of my two little children that their dad likes to take it up his a** and suck di*** and wants to be a woman and dress like a woman... Which is obviously not where it's at given that I just am, I don't want to be and I want to dress like myself. She also told me how much she hated the way I moved, talked, etc. how disgusting and ridiculous my teeny tiny shrinking penis was, how disgusting my breasts were and so were my hips, my puffy butt, and my soft, hairless, feminine skin. She said touching me made her want to throw up....
Anyway, I am a man, now, la tee daa.
Peace
While I cannot but feel for your situation, and hate to be a potential doomsayer, but reading the above really does not make me overtly optimistic that your detransitioning will truly change the state of your relationship. One of the worst signs of a relationship that is on the verge of collapse is a breakdown of mutual respect, putting down the other person and flagging their opinions as invalid. Given what you have said, and as painful as it is, I would consider searching for a sympathetic lawyer that can ensure that you see your kids often enough, and file the papers.
Quote from: Theo on June 09, 2013, 04:22:41 AM
While I cannot but feel for your situation, and hate to be a potential doomsayer, but reading the above really does not make me overtly optimistic that your detransitioning will truly change the state of your relationship. One of the worst signs of a relationship that is on the verge of collapse is a breakdown of mutual respect, putting down the other person and flagging their opinions as invalid. Given what you have said, and as painful as it is, I would consider searching for a sympathetic lawyer that can ensure that you see your kids often enough, and file the papers.
I have to agree. Initial hostility is understanable. Months of open war is not a good indicator that she can possible forgive and forget.
As my wife has said to me many times in response to me saying WTF? What's the use? etc. etc.I should just stop all this nonsense.... She says "The cat is out of the bag and you will never be able to put it back in." As much as this applies to me just giving up and going back to some level of coping with faking being a guy, the same can be said about how a spouse will forever percieve you.
We both cried a few gallons of tears these past 3 years during my struggle of finally taking on this beast. Finding that balance between sufficient open honest communication and TMI is still difficult. She had known of me being a T? from nearly day one, and has been understanding and supportive, to a point throughout the 30 years we've been together. Her perception of me changed greatly when I saw that I had finally see where that 'S' fork in the road I had avoided for all those years really does go.
All this also gave her some ammo to really say something that can hurt. During difficult emotional times things get said in the heat of them that need to be forgiven and forgotten to keep hate and resentment from taking root and destroying a loving relationship. I know deep down through every cell in my body that she wants me to be happy even if that will totally change things about our relationship that will not be in her best self interest.
From what you have said I cannot see how your marriage can survive, much less return to loving mutually supportive relationship. She hated what you were doing, constantly lashed out, went out her way to poison the kids against you and many countless things to hurt you. I don't see your stopping transitioning is really going to stop any of her underlaying feelings about you that manifested in those ways any more than your feeling feeling trapped and hating having to continue faking being a guy has stopped
Quote from: NotThereYet on June 09, 2013, 03:04:23 AM
What made me detransitin after only 7 months of HRT? My family. My wife was going to be permamently upset at me and I wuld have probably seen my kids only once every two weeks... That is not enough for me, therefore I decided to detransition and make my wife happy.
She hated every single minute of my transition and she told me so very convincingly. It was not uncommon for her to say in front of my two little children that their dad likes to take it up his a** and suck di*** and wants to be a woman and dress like a woman... Which is obviously not where it's at given that I just am, I don't want to be and I want to dress like myself. She also told me how much she hated the way I moved, talked, etc. how disgusting and ridiculous my teeny tiny shrinking penis was, how disgusting my breasts were and so were my hips, my puffy butt, and my soft, hairless, feminine skin. She said touching me made her want to throw up....
Anyway, I am a man, now, la tee daa.
Peace
I hate to say this but find a good divorce attorney and start the process. You transitioning has nothing to do with her hostility, in my opinion. Saying very negative things bout you in front of your children is the sign of someone who is very insecure or has some unresolved issues of her own. You need to protect yourself AND your children. I have had my own spousal issues and rooms the reps to end the relationship (nothing to so with being transgender as that did not come out until after my divorce). I wish the best for you and that you can move forward with your life.
Quote from: NotThereYet on June 09, 2013, 03:04:23 AM
It was not uncommon for her to say in front of my two little children that their dad likes to take it up his a** and suck di*** and wants to be a woman and dress like a woman... Which is obviously not where it's at given that I just am, I don't want to be and I want to dress like myself. She also told me how much she hated the way I moved, talked, etc. how disgusting and ridiculous my teeny tiny shrinking penis was, how disgusting my breasts were and so were my hips, my puffy butt, and my soft, hairless, feminine skin. She said touching me made her want to throw up....
This is emotional abuse. No other word for it.
Knowing that, are you going to continue to let her control you?
Take it from someone who use to belong to someone. Being under someone's control sucks, you can make yourself think its ok but you have to do your best to please them at there every turn, but it's never enough and you will still be punished. If this is a situation you can get out of I say get out
Well, first things first: I would like to thank y'all for your replies. I really appreciate the interest that total strangers are showing towards me. Then again, if my wife were to read this, she would say that I am getting what I want, i.e. attention. Accorindg to her I have always been clingy, needy. Her nickname for me has always been "needy Sue" and this before I even started transitioning.
Well, she says I can do whatever I want except being feminine. She hates it that I am feminine. She hates it that I like men's attention... But why wouldn't I??? Is it so bad that I simply love it??? Men pay you so much attention, and can be soooo nice and chivalrous. I have enjoyed every single moment of being a woman. I told her how I like it when I am at a store and someone unmistakingly comes to me and says "Is there anything I can help you with, ma'm". I know it may sound silly , but I really like it! It is who I am. To which she says "Well, if it is who you are, then you will have to live with the fact I am always going to be a bitch about it and we (meaning her and the kids) will leave you. You will still be able to see them but I cannot stand this side of you"
My family is very important to me. My children are extremely important to me. I don't want this to get ugly. I don't want to be the one who likes to suck men's d**ks. I just want to be myself.
Plus, she seems NOT to understand that being transsexual does not mean being all frilly, silly, and pathetic. I am a very normal person. She sees a report on TV about some navy seal who would go home at night after work and put on lingerie and a tight dress to watch TV and she says "I'll bet you have done that too!!!" No, I have not. I don't even own a single oiece of lingerie... I don't even own a single tight dress! Why would I wear lingerie and a tight dress to watch TV at night???? Maybe to go on a very special date, maybe...
Anyway, I am ok at times, and I wnt to mutilate or kill myself at others.
Sincerely,
Andrea
As others have said, andrea, the way she is treating you is absolutely unacceptable. It is one thing to struggle with accepting that you are trans and coming to terms with your transition - it is another to be outright abusive, hostile, etc. It really sounds so dehumanizing, and my heart breaks for you. :( No one deserves to be treated that way, to be treated like they are disgusting, especially for just trying to be themselves. And especially from a life partner who is supposed to be the main source of support and safety.
With your wife spewing that kind of venomous emotional abuse towards you in front of the kids (she has NO respect for you or them in doing this) I would worry if she confers this level of emotional abuse on them when your not around, which may not be about you. If this continues therapy will be coming down the line for someone if not all involved. Also, CPS could be knocking on the door if your kids relay some of this emotionaly abusive behavior to an athoritative figure they come in contact with(warrantable action in NYS). You have grounds... talk to a lawyer. Abusers never stop for long and as Tristan said nothing you do will be good enough.
You know your situation better, I'm just going by your post. It seems there is a lot more thinking that needs to be done in reguards to your actions in both the short and long term.
Things aren't going to get better with your wife, she clearly doesn't respect you, or your children (you don't say how old they are, or if you have I've missed it, but any good parent should realise that their children need to develop their own opinions and not alienate them against one of their parents). She's not going to suddenly start respecting you again, with or without transition, so you need to respect yourself and get out of there. We don't know all of your situation, but it wouldn't surprise me if things weren't 100% okay before, whether you liked to realise it or not. Your being trans could simply be an "excuse" to get out of it, or she could just be transphobic. Either way I can't see things improving, and you're miserable.
You've got two choices to make, fight for your children and divorce, giving you the chance of being yourself and finding happiness that way, or staying in this relationship, pretending to be someone you're not, and listening to emotional abuse from your wife.
Well, I would really like to thank everyone who has been kind enough to post thoughts and/or suggestions.
My kids are 5 and almost 7, and, especially being boys, they are attached to their mommy a lot. My wife loves them a lot but seems to me as if she is buying their affection: a new toy almost every day, no schedules, no bed times, no bath times, teeth are brushed when the kids feel like it, they make the rules, and she goes along with them. She is always the good guy, I am always the bad guy.
I don't know why she is so mean to me, but I think she is really homophobic/transphobic.
I hate the idea of seeing my family breakup. My kids love it when we do stuff all together. They truly do. I love them so much, I cannot even explain it.
She is so weird: she does not even come near me, neither physically nor emotionally in many years, but then she tells me that my physical appearance disgusts her and she no longer finds me attractive, as if she did before. She has not wanted any intimacy in years and now she says she hates my breasts, which she says are ugly, and she complains about my, and I quote, "shrivelled up, ridiculously small" male parts... She contradicts herself every other minute....
She keeps saying that I am very ugly and I look like an ugly man who is trying to look like a woman... I mention all the guys who seem to find me attractive and flirt with me, and she tells me that they are all gay, which I know it is not true, especially bc I do not find gay guys attractive at all and I would not flirt with them...
Andrea, if your relationship with your wife and kids is that important, then you are going to have to "grin and bear it."
Frankly, as distant as your wife has become, I don't see what you can do to save the relationship. If I were you, I would focus my energy on the kids.
That means, in the meantime, you are being manipulated into not becoming the real you. Your decision, though. I wish you the best.
Hell hath no fury like a woman when scorned (with respects to W Shakespeare)
Emotional abuse - worse thuan physical a use as the scars don't heal as quickly. There is a lot of negative energy coming from your wife. There is no respect on your house, for you or for your children (as ou said, she is letting THEM make the rules). Your children will start to notice, if they haven't already, the interactions between you and your wife. I had an emotionally abusive wife as well (untreated mental illness), so I now how it feels to have negative comments thrown at you. There was also a young child in the house. I made the decision that this had to end and took the necessary steps. I am not saying end it but there needs to be at a minimum, discussions with a family therapist to discuss what is going on in your marriage. Honestly, you being transgender has nothing to do with it. There is something rooted deep that has never been addressed.
Just my thoughts. I do wish you the best though.
It's quite understandable why your wife is so angry: she's not only married to a man who turns out to be a woman, but a woman who's into men too!
She feels rejected as a straight woman, a mother, a spouse and most certainly tries to 'channel' her utter confusion and bitter disappointment through emotional abusing you.
I bet she didn't have a clue before you came out as a MTF.
What's the use of staying married if you're both into men anyway?
Your children only?
They won't have a peaceful moment anymore with their parents staying together.
It's quite obvious she doesn't like your breastgrowth, soft skin, feminine manners and your adulation of men who treat you nicely too.
And you make it quite obvious you like men.
Quote from: Dahlia on June 11, 2013, 07:47:42 AM
It's quite understandable why your wife is so angry: she's not only married to a man who turns out to be a woman, but a woman who's into men too!
She feels rejected as a straight woman, a mother, a spouse and most certainly tries to 'channel' her utter confusion and bitter disappointment through emotional abusing you.
I bet she didn't have a clue before you came out as a MTF.
What's the use of staying married if you're both into men anyway?
Your children only?
They won't have a peaceful moment anymore with their parents staying together.
It's quite obvious she doesn't like your breastgrowth, soft skin, feminine manners and your adulation of men who treat you nicely too.
And you make it quite obvious you like men.
She was in denial up the time that I started radiating feminity from every pore, up to the point where I started having to wear a 36 B bra and had basically no penis left, coupled with a puffy butt and wide hips and no hair anywhere. She was that much in denial, but when it hit, it hit real bad. Extremely bad, even violently bad, at times. She shoved me against a wall a few times, she kicked me real hard (she was a real good soccer player in high school) and she even squeezed my left breast so hard that it hurt for three days straight.
About men... Well, I don't think it is as relevant as it may sound that I very much enjoy the attention of men, I mean, who doesn't?? Plus, maybe I was never totally out and about flirting with guys, but I also never lusted after girls. I was always very aware of girls but not in a sexual way. When my wife realized that my bitchy comments towards some TV queeny were not those of a frustrated man who could not have the girl but those of a woman who was jealous of the girl on the TV screen, the light bulb appeared next to her head and she became furious. She said, like you suggested, that I destroyed her present, her future and even totally ruined her past!
HRT did it for me, in terms of guys: I cannot even envision myself with a woman, now, not even the way I always did on the few occasions that I slept with my wife, were I imagined I was the woman and she was the man. Plus, men pay a lot of attention to me, now, and maybe that has awakened very stronlgly in real life what I always felt on the internet, where I happily had internet flings with men for ever. Men make me feel good, I love to be desired, as silly as it may sound. Men are wonderful and very chivalrous. I love men. I have come to realize that I was born to be a wife and a mother. Is that clear enough?
Quote from: NotThereYet on June 12, 2013, 12:31:15 AM
About men... Well, I don't think it is as relevant as it may sound that I very much enjoy the attention of men, I mean, who doesn't??
I don't. And I'm pretty sure my feelings are common amongst lesbians - there are a few of us getting around..
QuoteHRT did it for me, in terms of guys: I cannot even envision myself with a woman, now, not even the way I always did on the few occasions that I slept with my wife, were I imagined I was the woman and she was the man. Plus, men pay a lot of attention to me, now, and maybe that has awakened very stronlgly in real life what I always felt on the internet, where I happily had internet flings with men for ever. Men make me feel good, I love to be desired, as silly as it may sound. Men are wonderful and very chivalrous. I love men. I have come to realize that I was born to be a wife and a mother. Is that clear enough?
I can't imagine myself with a man.
Quote from: NotThereYet on June 12, 2013, 12:31:15 AM
I love men. I have come to realize that I was born to be a wife and a mother. Is that clear enough?
Sure. You shouldn't have married an unsuspecting ciswoman and not have become a biological father in the first place.
Some major therapy for everybody in the family should be in the immediate future. There is way too much going on in this situation that needs to be brought out and analyzed by a professional.
Quote from: Dahlia on June 12, 2013, 07:50:13 AM
Sure. You shouldn't have married an unsuspecting ciswoman and not have become a biological father in the first place.
It's not that simple for everyone. Not everyone is willing to embrace the feelings of being trans, or even just that they're attracted to men while being brought up being told they were male, then go into denial, and end up with a partner who doesn't know and of the gender they're not really attracted to. It's not just a problem with trans people, I know a cis woman who ended up marrying a man, has two kids and is now going through a messy divorce mostly fuelled by realising she isn't heterosexual.
It's easy to say something like that with the power of hindsight, but probably wasn't for the OP at the time. It doesn't make it fair for the wife in question, but I'm sure the OP knows that too.
Quote from: Dahlia on June 12, 2013, 07:50:13 AM
Sure. You shouldn't have married an unsuspecting ciswoman and not have become a biological father in the first place.
I am such a bitch, ain't I? Well, back then I did not know what I was, yet, and I acted out love: my wife is the only person I have ever fallen in love with in my whole life and I did marry for love. How many can say the same?? Regarding my children: they are the best thing that ever happened to me. I should have not mentioned them on this forum: it hurts to have some individual tell me I should have not had them.
Dahlia: please do not mention my children ever again.
Hi Alexander, thanks for your kind words.
Well, I knew that I was different and my wife very much knew I was different and was ok with it. The thing is that after many years together, I became "more" different, and from being openly bi, shaving my legs, liking make-up and clothes and female fashion and stuff, like I did before getting maried, I developed into being TS. She, on the other hand, moving back to the rural area her whole conservative family is from, became more conservative and less accepting and made me repress for years those characteristics that I had had throughout our dating times and the times when we were first married and not back near her family, yet.
The moment her parents, her family noticed that I went from androgynous, alternative, "different", to clearly developing into a very passable, even pretty woman, she went berzerk. It is not my fault if my body responds to HRT very well and quckly, and I also understand her, I know that she is very close to her parents and she cares about appearances a lot, but we have to do what is best for our children. They love us both, and they love to be with both of us. They have no problem with me being a girl, children are smart and they grew up with me being the way I am. They love me as a girl, as the person who loves them a lot and spends every single minute of her spare time with them. My wife also loves them a lot and, although she parents differently that I would like her to, she is a very loving, giving mommy.
Alexander:
What does "OP" mean?
Original post or original poster
Quote from: Dahlia on June 12, 2013, 07:50:13 AM
Sure. You shouldn't have married an unsuspecting ciswoman and not have become a biological father in the first place.
I don't want to read any more of this judgmental BS. Not every transgendered person realizes or understands the nature of their being until after they have tried living lives within the societal norms.
The implication of your post is that Andrea understood her transsexualism at the time she fell in love, married, and had children. Life doesn't work that way.
Hindsight is 20-20. Foresight is not. And comments like these do not belong at a transgender support site.
Hi Andrea,
I have to say there is nothing with reaching out for help, I would seek live allies to get to know what being treated humane is like, nobody deserves to be degraded and insulted. Im sorry for your situation :( truly, seek live allies for friends. I suspect you will need them in the future.
Quote from: Jamie D on June 12, 2013, 03:49:21 PM
I don't want to read any more of this judgmental BS. Not every transgendered person realizes or understands the nature of their being until after they have tried living lives within the societal norms.
The implication of your post is that Andrea understood her transsexualism at the time she fell in love, married, and had children. Life doesn't work that way.
Hindsight is 20-20. Foresight is not. And comments like these do not belong at a transgender support site.
Couldn't agree more. A few days going through the posts here is enough to understand how many of us took years to understand and accept who we really are.
However, when we do finally get there, it is also very important to understand just how traumatic it can be for those who are close to us, wives who discover after years that they are married to a woman, kids who discover that their Dad is not the model of virility they had though "he" was, etc..Quite a minefield to get through and one of the unfortunate things about going through minefields is that you do sometimes set off mines.
In this particular case, avoiding serious damage to all concerned, probably does require the help of a really good demining specialist ie. someone who really knows their stuff in both gender issues and family issues.
Really wishing you all the best in a very difficult and complex situation.
Donna
P.S. I'm another one who can very happily survive without guys... :)
Thank you, Donna. Our paths through life are unique. And fraught with hurdles and complexities. That is why it is so important to offer support to the members of our community who find themselves in difficult situations.
That is why we have boards dedicated to "Coming Out," "Significant Others," "Therapy," and other subjects to help us better cope.
Quote from: Jamie D on June 12, 2013, 03:49:21 PM
I don't want to read any more of this judgmental BS. Not every transgendered person realizes or understands the nature of their being until after they have tried living lives within the societal norms.
The implication of your post is that Andrea understood her transsexualism at the time she fell in love, married, and had children. Life doesn't work that way.
Hindsight is 20-20. Foresight is not. And comments like these do not belong at a transgender support site.
+1 My heart goes out to you Andrea, you don't deserve condemnation and abuse at home and especially not here. Wishing you well in the days ahead.
@NotThereYet0
"Does anybody know a cure for this? I am a man and it is pretty crappy."
I understand you very well. Being a man, or being born male can feel pretty crappy or worse.
I do not know a cure, and i am not convinced that to transition is right for me.
There are many possibilities. The gender spectrum is huge. As are the possibilities to be happy and to be unhappy. You are a free person and can decide freely.
But i agree with others here to look out for allies.
First i think its good to know, you are not alone in feeling pretty crappy as a man.
And you are not alone having the heart's wish to transition and live a woman's life.
But , i believe, still in this complex and difficult situation, there are still possibilities
, good possibilities to live a good and happy life, for all of you.
Be careful, choose wisely.
"What made me detransitin after only 7 months of HRT? My family. My wife was going to be permamently upset at me and I wuld have probably seen my kids only once every two weeks... That is not enough for me, therefore I decided to detransition and make my wife happy."
NotThereYet, that was very brave of you for sure. What a great sacrifice of you !
You sacrifice your heart's wish and passion for the love of your wife and kids.
I hope your wife can honor what you do for her and your kids and how deep is your love.
"She hated every single minute of my transition and she told me so very convincingly."
It's her true opinion i guess. Must be a terrible pain for you. i do wonder why there is so much affection in her judgement, maybe you hurt her loving heart by transitioning.
"It was not uncommon for her to say in front of my two little children that their dad likes to take it up his a** and suck di*** and wants to be a woman and dress like a woman... Which is obviously not where it's at given that I just am, I don't want to be and I want to dress like myself. She also told me how much she hated the way I moved, talked, etc. how disgusting and ridiculous my teeny tiny shrinking penis was, how disgusting my breasts were and so were my hips, my puffy butt, and my soft, hairless, feminine skin. She said touching me made her want to throw up...."
Also her true opinion i guess, but now in relation to your kids, your changing body and mind.
I am sorry, you suffered so much.
I agree with others here that mentioned emotional abuse, which is some kind of domestic violence.
NotThereYet, you are a free person, you have every right to live a happy life, to be you.
But you live now in a family and there are rights and duties for all of you.
I still believe there are good possibilities for you and your family.
Your wife loved you once and maybe still loves you, although her heart is hurt, your kids love you.
you are a very good, loveable person with a great heart.
IMHO, That is a very difficult situation now, what to choose for you and your family and the next moves.
I wish you strength, support, love and understanding, respect and brightest blessings to all of you .
In my eyes you are a very loving person with a great heart.
I wish you the best.
Hello everybody and thanks for y'all's posts.
@Alexander
What a fine and smart young man you are (and a rather good looking one, as well, I might add). You have banged the nail right on the head: It took me a very long time to sort things out, also because I am indeed of a generation which did not have as much access to info as the more recent generations do. There was no World Wide Web when I was a teenager, or even when I was in college... On top of that I got locked into a certain, very competitive sports activity from age 10 to age 18-19 by my family who only had dollar signs in their eyes, and therefore my emotional development was slowed down to say the least. Up until age 20 I had done only one thing in my life: practice 6-8 hours a day, 365 days a year, and compete at every event I could possibly participate in. I had no time for introspection and self discovery. I was basically home schooled all the way through. I knew nothing! I was as ignorant as they come, in all senses.
I did know I was not gay, because I knew I was not attracted to gay men, and I knew I was not attracted to men in a "from man to man fashion". I also knew I did not lust after women. I knew that all those magazines that had naked women in them, did not appeal to me, even though they seemed to be extremely appealing to my male peers. I knew my best friends had always been girls. I knew I was not into rough and tumble games and activities, growing up. I knew that as a little child I enjoyed role playing, playing dress up, and do other fun activities that are not stereotypically male. I knew these things I liked so much were extremely bad and my parents would get very mad if they caught me doing those. Even trying on a little dress was a major no-no. It was very bad and disgusting. My mother did not believe Martina Navratilova was gay because, and I quote "sie sieht doch so menschlich aus", i.e she looked so human... How can anybody who looks so normal and human be gay??? "Gay people and those deviants who dress like women to be whore and walk the streets, are disgusting!". Well, I did not know a lt of things, but I knew that I did not want to be a whore, I did not want to be disgusting, I did not want to walk some gross back street somewhere and sell myself to gross animal like individuals who end up killing you. I was just normal, at least in my own eyes and heart.
There was no publicly available knowledge about transsexualism back then. There were only gays and straights. I tried the gay route but I did not find it right for me. Where was I supposed to go?? Like Jamie D said: hindsight is 20/20. She is totally right. Thanks again for your help and support, Alexander, and let me know if you are ever in the Pacific Northwest.
@Shan(tel)
I am pleasantly surprised by your words. I am impressed by your moral and emotional stature. Thanks and I hope you accept my public apologies for having misjudged you. Greatness comes with grace, in not kicking people when they are down and not feeling Schadenfreude. You have shown greatness.
@Donna Elvira
Thanks for your words. I do agree with you and all the others who have suggested seeing a therapist. Unfortunately, my wife has never accepted to come with me to go see a therapist. I have been banging on that same nail for many, many years. Our problems unfortunately did not start with me becoming visibly female, but much earlier. Without going into too much detail, she has a very difficult relationship with her parents and she suffers a lot because of that. She is also a compulsive liar and gambler, she has gotten us bankrupt 3 times in the last 10 years. We also always had a not very affectionate relationship and we have been going years without any cuddling, kissing, etc, let alone anything more than that.
I hope that my not realizing how many TS women are actually lesbians did not offend anybody... I would have never guessed. I wonder what the stats are on that one aspect, i.e. how many are straight, how many are lesbians, and how many are bi...
I doubt my kids ever saw me as a model of virility given that they grew up with me and they are used to me being such a girlie. They have always been very well aware of my being a girl and they never really showed any akwardness about it.
Thanks again, I will once again try to convince her to go to counseling together.
@Sonadora
What do you mean "live" allies? I am not sure I am familiar with what a "live" ally might be. :-(
@AngelaTS
Zu allererst möchte ich mich für deine wunderschönen Zeilen bedanken!!! Es ist ja echt klasse so viele lieben Menschen kennenzulernen.
Ich schreib lieber weiter auf Englisch da hier viele mitlesen die der Deutschen Sprache nicht mächtig sind, also, in aller Ehrlichkeit muss ich dir verraten dass es mir viel schlechter geht als before I started transitioning. I had always been afraid not to be able to pass, I had always been convinced that I was way to ugly, way to manly looking to ever come close to being a passable woman, and so, when after only a few months on HRT I started developing into a pretty convincing woman, I was absolutely ecstatic. It was amazing to just be the way I was. Incredible. Such a nice natural feeling. People told me that even my eyes smiled...
Unfortunately my life at home was horrible. My wife was angry 24/7. She would go from restrained, badly restrained I should say, anger to bouts of fury, and I don't use the word "fury" lightly, WUT war das!!! It was impossible. My kids would just hide away together in one of their rooms and not come out. It was a tearjerker to see such little sunshines be visibly scared...
No, she does not honor jack, that is just the way she is, she feel entitled to everything that comes her way. Her parents have bought her cars, given her thousands of dollars, which she promptly gambled away (ja, wie man mehr als 100,000.00 Dollars innerhalb eines Jahres verzocken kann ist mir auch unklar, aber... Naja, ich lass es lieber), been there for her on many occasions, and she still acts like she is an orphan or something.
The things is, I don't think I really have any othet option at the moment, at least until my kids have grown a bit and develop a little bit of independent thinking. I mean, what do you think?
I need to take a break from the PC here, I will be back later
Thanks everybody, I really appreciate how nice and supportibe y'all have been. Please, forgive any ypos, I don't feel like proof reading the whole thing... Too long...
Andrea
You've mostly only talked about how your wife is regarding your transition, so I feel wrong to assume she carries a lot of those traits with her in general (edit: it seems like you talked about this a bit in your post above mine, so maybe not so wrong!), but your wife sounds like an extremely self-entitled bully. Especially given what she said about you in front of your children; she COMPLETELY disregarded the ability of her children to perceive both you and her in a healthy way because of what she wanted for herself. She physically abuses you. She gives you life-altering ultimatums that hold your children hostage. She chooses highly manipulative language to coerce you and eschew her own responsibility.
She also has no shame in attacking you as a minority; she doesn't show respect towards the rest of us by brazenly insulting what you are and feel and calling you names.
I just .. I felt angry reading how she treats you. Her insecurities are absolutely not an excuse for her behavior. She seems very unreasonable, and I really feel for you and am genuinely sad at what you've gone through. It's horrible. As a human being, where the mind is central to everything we do, you are being forced not to be yourself. I feel like someone is forcing you not to be human.
Please don't misunderstand me: if you don't want to transition, I completely support that and think that your life belongs to your wisdom and your wisdom alone. It just pains me to see someone treated this way, and I hope that things somehow turn out the best for you.
Hi again,
I'm very wary about giving advice regarding family matters, especially when I have heard only one side of the story. However, just from what you say, what I am hearing is this:
- you want to transition and you seem to be discovering that you like guys at least as much as women, maybe even more. Your wife knows this.
- you only real interest in staying in what looks like a very toxic relationship is so that you can be with your kids. Your wife also knows this.
- what your kids are being forced to hear has the potential to be very damaging to them.
While I really understand how difficult it is for you to imagine being separated from you kids (I had to do the same thing when mine were respectively 15, 11 & 7 and paid a very heavy price for it for a few years), I don't see how you can imagine continuing with such a state of affairs which seems to be damaging to all involved:
- your wife who seems to have nothing left to hope for in the mariage beyond getting as much as she possibly can out of you.
- you who cannot live the life you aspire to.
- your kids who are growing up in an athmosphere of hate and violence which can only be damaging to them.
Against that, relationships will nearly always last for as long as all parties find some reason to want them to last so if you have a civil discussion with your wife about where she sees all of this going and how that meets the needs of all involved, who knows where it might go? Making such an exchange successful requires a lot of honesty though and that it very unlikely to happen without outside assistance.
Since it takes two to tango, if your wife refuses to work with you on finding solutions to your issues, my instinctive reaction is to say that you owe to both yourself and your kids to put an end to this situation. I took 18 years to do that in my first mariage and went through misery for several years after that but it was still the right decision. I again have a very close and open relationship with my kids and they have grown into adults I am proud of, in spite of all the violence they were witness to between their mother and I.
The fact is, once my ex and I were separated and everyone had to assume their own responsabilities, the kids were really able to see that they had two parents who were much better people than anyone could have imagined when we were together.
Obviously, I don't know enough about the details of your situation to be able to say any more than that but hopefully this will help you a little with your own thinking.
Bon courage.
Donna
Just wanted to reply, and say I feel very sorry for you, NotThereYet. Reading your posts has really made me feel bad for you, and as a rather insensitive guy, this means something.
Your wife sounds rather horrible. Of course, I don't know her, and my judgement is only based on what you wrote here. She can be a really loving and nice person at times for all know. But from what you wrote...I cringed. Physical and emotional abuse? That is just not cool. And the fact she is pressing you back to being a man shows that she does not care for you as a lover should. I mean, what lover wants to keep their loved ones from being theirselves, and happy? It sounds wrong to me. And you really have to ask yourself if staying with her is worth it. From what I read, she causes a lot of mental harm to you. I can understand you wish to stay with her for your children. But it sounds like a rather unhealthy environment for children to grow up in, especially when your wife is so upfront to you in front of them.
I really hope you manage to sort this, and can become yourself. No one should be surpressed like this. -Especially- not by supposed loved ones.
Well, she is ok the moment I am the person she wants me to be. The thing that hurts the most is the way that she goes about the whole thing: she never ever worries about how I am doing, whether it is hard for me to be the way she wants me to be...
I agree with Donna Elvira, there are always two sides to every story and she would probably say that one thing is to be a guy that is definitely different and rather feminine, and another is to be a woman. She has been trying to "fix me" within a year or so after we got married... "Don't sit like that, you look like a woman". "Don't hold that pen like that, you look like a woman". "Don't do this, don't do that..." At this point we have two kids together and we have to do what is best for them. She loves our kids and that is a fact. I just need to decide whether it is better to see my kids every day and put up with my wife and her demands of me being the way she wants me to be and not the way I am or be OK with not living in the same house as my kids but also not having to be who I am not and not having to put up with my wife in general: we have a lot of other issues, not just my transsexuality.
About guys: my problem is that I never really understood how things were until I realized I was not a very feminine guy who was maybe gay, but I was transgender. I have always found women very pretty and interesting, but somehow I have never really had that sexual drive to be with one. I would find some men rather attractive but I could not possibly see myself with one as a man. I also knew I was not attracted to gay men in the least. In the meantime, all the literature I was looking at would not mention transsexuality, but just either homosexuality or the possiblity of it just being a phase that I was going to grow out of. Knowing that I was not gay, I thought it was just a phase and I was going to eventually grow out of it.
Plus, my problem is that I only found, and I still do, a few guys attractive and therefore I thought I was just confused. Then one day I explained that to my therapist, I told her: "I find most guys totally not interesting and if one of them tried to kiss me or something I would go blaaaaaaaaaaa and run for my life." To that she answered: "You know, that is actually totally normal!!! I find most guys also not really attractive and if they were to try to kiss me or something I would go blaaaaaaaaaaa and run for my life!!!" After that and with the effect of hormones I started to feel free and embrace my feelings and at that point I started just accepting the fact that inside I am just a heterosexual woman. Nothing more and nothing less. Make sense?
Quote from: NotThereYet on June 17, 2013, 04:15:10 AM
Plus, my problem is that I only found, and I still do, a few guys attractive and therefore I thought I was just confused. Then one day I explained that to my therapist, I told her: "I find most guys totally not interesting and if one of them tried to kiss me or something I would go blaaaaaaaaaaa and run for my life." To that she answered: "You know, that is actually totally normal!!! I find most guys also not really attractive and if they were to try to kiss me or something I would go blaaaaaaaaaaa and run for my life!!!" After that and with the effect of hormones I started to feel free and embrace my feelings and at that point I started just accepting the fact that inside I am just a heterosexual woman. Nothing more and nothing less. Make sense?
Hi again,
Yes it does make sense and, to the extent that you realize that, inside, you are a heterosexual woman, I guess you already have the answer to many of your questions, no? If the conclusion you come up with is the similar to one that comes to my mind, maybe the focus of this whole discussion should be on how you preserve the things that really count for you, like access to your kids. Like where is the rule that says you can only see them every two weeks if you divorce?
Since you say she loves your kids and she would most likely say the same about you, couldn't you just work with her on coming to an agreement to insure that your kids continue to have as much access as possible to two loving parents?
One more thing by the way, what are your wife's thoughts on separation/divorce. Is it something you have already discussed?
Bises
Donna