You've got 99% of the world living in this happy little bubble where all women have vaginas and all men have penises, and then there's the transsexual bubble, with a suicide rate of nearly 50% and people born with parts that need to be changed.
It's like being albino or something but with life-ruining side effects.
If you say so.
Quote from: bangarang on June 26, 2013, 01:02:33 PM
It's like being albino or something but with life-ruining side effects.
Only if you let it! ;)
The number is tough to pin down, I usually hear a 41% attempted suicide rate. Are you OK? Hugs, Devlyn
I understand you may have some self acceptance issues...
You might find being a human is strange in that we are all
Unique.
If you have a burning desire to mold and fit in...than us going
Stealth isn't wierd..
But thank you for calling me weird..
I don't even know what to say to this really... I don't think it's that weird really... sucky some of us came with the wrong plumbing but not really weird, and it can be fixed so... I mean weird is if a human woman gave birth to a purple dinosaur
Yes, I am weird, especially when it come to saying, acting, dressing and doing things that most people wouldn't dare do most of the time. That's just my personality though, not because I'm trans. Being trans is probably one of the more normalcies that I exhibit.
It is strange as a concept, though. "Hi, kid! Welcome to life! You have a pretty good starting hand - no prebirth abortion, no debilitating illnesses... Oh! Except that you'll spend all your life trying to change your genitals via a process that wasn't even possible up until a few years ago. So, that'll be fun."
Quote from: Jerred1985 on June 26, 2013, 02:33:09 PM
I don't even know what to say to this really... I don't think it's that weird really... sucky some of us came with the wrong plumbing but not really weird, and it can be fixed so... I mean weird is if a human woman gave birth to a purple dinosaur
Very much this.
Quote from: Heather on June 26, 2013, 01:19:15 PM
Only if you let it! ;)
And this.
...I don't think it is weird at all it is only society telling you it's weird. You'll feel better once you embrace it.
Quote from: Jerred1985 on June 26, 2013, 02:33:09 PMI mean weird is if a human woman gave birth to a purple dinosaur
That would be weird.
Biology is never perfect. There are frequently mistakes and anomalies that happen.
Technically, it's also not weird that some people are albino.
Quote from: Jerred1985 on June 26, 2013, 02:33:09 PM
I don't even know what to say to this really... I don't think it's that weird really... sucky some of us came with the wrong plumbing but not really weird, and it can be fixed so... I mean weird is if a human woman gave birth to a purple dinosaur
Huh. Guess that explains Barney the Dinosaur!
...
Anyway!
My personal thought with if being trans is weird or strange or not, is that I don't think it is. It's just who we are.
It does cause me a lot of anxiety and stress day to day though, about how
other people feel about it, especialy my wife, family, and society in general, since I live in a very conservative state in the United States (Kansas).
We are like X men. I love my new super snatch :)
Quote from: Tristan on June 26, 2013, 04:05:20 PM
We are like X men. I love my new super snatch :)
Indeed! In a way, we are "ex-men."
Yes, I am weird. I don't follow the herd, and I don't march to a different drummer...my "drummer" uses a kazoo.
Embrace the weird!
And changing gender is life-affirming...yes, it may "ruin" the old life, but since that was built on a false premise, now is a chance to do it right.
Quote from: Beth Andrea on June 26, 2013, 04:26:05 PM
Indeed! In a way, we are "ex-men."
Yes, I am weird. I don't follow the herd, and I don't march to a different drummer...my "drummer" uses a kazoo.
Embrace the weird!
And changing gender is life-affirming...yes, it may "ruin" the old life, but since that was built on a false premise, now is a chance to do it right.
Or, in some cases, ex-Women, but that doesn't sound as good.
The point has been made.
Now i'll stop typing while i still have dignity.
Tristan I LOLed and almost spit out my candy!!!
What if I don't want to be an x men ..I want to be the
6million dollar bionic woman with a bionic vag
Don't worry....we have the technology to rebuild her!!!
One actually needs to think about being trans as kinda weird???? ???
I don't think she meant "weird" in a bad way. I think all she meant was that it is a strange concept to think about, not that being trans is weird, strange, etc. :)
I do agree that it is an odd concept to think about, but we are the way we are and it doesn't matter what anyone thinks~
:police: Changed pronouns: Make sure you use the correct pronouns or I will fall on you like a ton of bricks. I really don't like that. :police:
Another thing that's weird is being born with blond hair and blue eyes. After all, the vast majority of the human species has black hair and brown eyes, so surely black hair & brown eyes are normal and people who don't have those characteristics are weird? Well, aren't we?
It's actually quite difficult to be born with blond hair & blue eyes: the genes for dark hair & eyes are dominant so you need to inherit two sets of the appropriate genes, one from each parent, in order to be born with blond hair & blue eyes. This is what's commonly known as 'recessive traits' or 'recessive genes'.
My father had black hair & brown eyes. My mother had brown hair & blue eyes. So for me to be born with blond hair & blue eyes, I had to inherit those genes from two parents who didn't show any outward signs of having them. So am I weird? Am I a mutant? Am I an X-Man (god, I hope so - I could do with some superpowers!).
Or are our less-common characteristics - such as blond hair, or being one of identical twins, or being transsexual - merely interesting examples of the incredible variety of the human species?
Aren't humans amazing? :)
Weird is the perfect word if you rely on the archaic definition.
"Of or relating to fate or the Fates."
In mythology the Fates, Norns or Weird Sisters determine what happens to you.
Many things in our life are beyond our control. Even if you correct things eventually, it will be difficult, expensive and painful. That's your fate (weird).
I think that if you think about it just a bit more, it really isn't weird at all. It's true that western culture and society is usually not very tolerant of gender variance. Gender and sex are very complex concepts, and marginalizing trans* identities as 'weird' requires one to make a certain set of assumptions that don't necessarily hold true.
The deterministic view that sex/gender are caused by genitalia is considered the norm in mainstream US culture, but really, even 'biological' sex is determined by many more factors than genital anatomy alone (such as secondary sexual anatomy, hormonal composition, genetics). And this flexibility in sex doesn't even account for all of the innate and learned behaviors that combine to form someone's gender identity. So sex and gender can't really be considered mutually exclusive categories, but lie along a spectrum of behaviors and traits (Julia Serano basically makes this argument in her book Whipping Girl).
So really, being trans* is weird only in the sense that it contradicts simplistic assumptions that are often made in our culture.
Well if you think about the rest of the animal kingdom (and then think of plants), transgender is pretty normal. It's human society where it might not be. As I heard someone say "Nature loves diversity, humans not so much."
--Jay
Quote from: FTMDiaries on June 27, 2013, 04:50:08 AM
Another thing that's weird is being born with blond hair and blue eyes. After all, the vast majority of the human species has black hair and brown eyes, so surely black hair & brown eyes are normal and people who don't have those characteristics are weird? Well, aren't we?
It's actually quite difficult to be born with blond hair & blue eyes: the genes for dark hair & eyes are dominant so you need to inherit two sets of the appropriate genes, one from each parent, in order to be born with blond hair & blue eyes. This is what's commonly known as 'recessive traits' or 'recessive genes'.
My father had black hair & brown eyes. My mother had brown hair & blue eyes. So for me to be born with blond hair & blue eyes, I had to inherit those genes from two parents who didn't show any outward signs of having them. So am I weird? Am I a mutant? Am I an X-Man (god, I hope so - I could do with some superpowers!).
Or are our less-common characteristics - such as blond hair, or being one of identical twins, or being transsexual - merely interesting examples of the incredible variety of the human species?
Aren't humans amazing? :)
Neither of my parents have blue eyes but both of my grandmothers do, so apparently blue eyes are not the only long shot bet that I won.
Why does it matter if trans people are "weird" or not?
Most of us want nothing better than to be seen as normal people, and even though we are becoming a more tolerant and accepting society I doubt we will ever be seen as normal by most people, but being normal is overrated.
I'm pretty sure I would be a weird person even if I wasn't trans.
Quote from: xchristine on June 26, 2013, 06:17:23 PM
Tristan I LOLed and almost spit out my candy!!!
What if I don't want to be an x men ..I want to be the
6million dollar bionic woman with a bionic vag
Don't worry....we have the technology to rebuild her!!!
Nope you Gadda be a x men or you Gadda be a pony
Quote from: FTMDiaries on June 27, 2013, 04:50:08 AM
Another thing that's weird is being born with blond hair and blue eyes. After all, the vast majority of the human species has black hair and brown eyes, so surely black hair & brown eyes are normal and people who don't have those characteristics are weird? Well, aren't we?
Well i must be unimaginably weird then Trans, blond, Blue eyes, Left handed Ohh and i dont like baked beans(not sure that one really counts). :angel:
Quote from: Shannon1979 on June 27, 2013, 06:41:57 PM
Well i must be unimaginably weird then Trans, blond, Blue eyes, Left handed Ohh and i dont like baked beans(not sure that one really counts). :angel:
You're like a unicorn <3
Yes it is!!!
I'm sorry but if none thinks that changing ones sex is not a weird thing...then I am alone.
Now what is the definition of weird: strange; unusual; peculiar
Does the general population really know what a transsexual, transgendered, MTF FTM, gender variant........really is??...No=unusual (not including Seattle and San Francisco)
Does a large percentage of people change their sex??...No=unusual
Is a large percentage of the population transgendered??...No=peculiar
Well sounds like we are as weird as people that have many tattoos or piercings or a man that figure skates, is a ballet dancer or a woman that is a truck driver, or a garbage hauler.
Many people may classify these people as weird...I know when I see someone who's face look like a fishing lure because of all their piercings... I may think their weird....but that's me not them. If they thought they were weird for the same reasons then something is wrong!
I think the human condition overall is kinda weird.
Hmmm what meaning of pony first of all??
I've heard of men refer to woman as a pony...
I do like bionoc woman more though.
...Bionic Woman Intro (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcba-ZgtsT4#)
Quote from: Naomi on June 27, 2013, 06:52:53 PM
You're like a unicorn <3
not sure i would look to good with a horn growing out of my forehead though. And i forgot to mention im double jointed as well.
If you recorded a stranger for an entire day, without them knowing, you'd see things that'd freak anyone out. People are all weird.
Sometimes I wonder if I'm sane. That's how weird I can be. I bet everyone here has those moments though. We're all just a bunch of freaks, even that quaint little housewife down the street.
The universe's existence trumps all in regards to weirdness. And here we are, irrelevant bits of lint on the infinite universalscape of time and space pondering existential questions and what makes something weird. That's weird.
Well, speaking for myself, I think the whole experience of being transgender is absolutely bizarre.
I look male, sound male, act male, am treated as male, have a wife, am a father, do all sorts of things that seem archetypally male and yet I have an absolute, bone-deep, unshakeable conviction that something is terribly, terribly wrong and that I could only be the true expression of myself as a woman.
It has taken me decades to get my head round that idea. So if other transgendered people find it weird, I understand. And if even the kindest, most tolerant, liberal, broad-minded, decent people I know - the kind who will always absolutely stick by me and have my back, no matter what happens - find it impossible to imagine what it would be like to doubt something as fundamental as the gender they were born with, frankly I don't blame them.
That's not to say that we are freaks, or that we deserve to be hated (least of all by ourselves), or that any kind of ignorance or discrimination is acceptable. It's just to accept that this is a very unusual, and in many ways inexplicable situation to be in. So, yeah, it's weird.
PS: To Nicolette and others ... Of course you're right: the whole concept of us tiny little creatures in a minuscule planet in a universe of a hundred billion galaxies is mindblowingly weird on a scale that a little gender dysphoria here or there doesn't even begin to match! :)
Weird?
Nah, I'm awesome.
Weird is for people who cannot accept people for being people.
I'm Cindy and if you have met me, you realize that weird isn't an adjective that even belongs in my descriptive repertoire!
Hee Heee
Cindy
Quote from: Nicolette on June 28, 2013, 05:44:15 AM
The universe's existence trumps all in regards to weirdness. And here we are, irrelevant bits of lint on the infinite universalscape of time and space pondering existential questions and what makes something weird. That's weird.
Yes :)
It's just the norms which encase our social expectations that make us perceive something as weird, or weirder than another thing. If an alien came to earth, we'd all be equally weird to them. Mwahaha.
We'd all die. Without discrimination. The trans people would go. The basketball players would go. The priests would go. The serial killers would go. The naughty school girls would go. All of us would go! :)
Quote from: Cindy. on June 28, 2013, 05:54:52 AM
Weird is for people who cannot accept people for being people.
Well, I guess a lot of this comes down to what 'weird' means. To me it doesn't have to have a negative connotation - maybe that's a British thing: we're generally less phased by people being different to the norm than, say, Middle America (or suburban Australia?) has traditionally been. So something or someone can be weird-but-great. Just think of all the androgynous rock stars that have come sashaying out of England over the decades, and all the drag-wearing Monty Python-esque comedians!
To me 'weird' just means something that's both unusual and a little mysterious - something inexplicable. Like, 'I just had a really weird feeling' ... and my experience of dysphoria has been that it's a very weird feeling indeed.
Quote from: Shannon1979 on June 28, 2013, 05:25:40 AM
not sure i would look to good with a horn growing out of my forehead though. And i forgot to mention im double jointed as well.
hey, someone who's double-jointed and a lefite! Hi-five! :D
Personally, I like being who I am. I'm a minority race, I have a tendency to freak people out with how morbid I can get, and I'm a guy at heart. I think there's no such thing as being weird, because everyone is weird, if you think about it hard enough ;P We all have a standard of what is normal, but even then, we can't pinpoint what would truly be normal. if anything, if we were normal, we would literally just be rocks. And that's no fun, huh?
In life *everything* is weird when u think about it enough. X
All weirdness is relative. Take an Amazon native from a tribe who has never encountered the modern world and drop them into Piccadilly Circus. Tell me that they're not going to go WTF! Take yourself off into their tribe for a week and not freak out because of the 'weird' goings-on. The more you live, the more worldly you become, the less is the weirdness.
Quote from: Nicolette on June 28, 2013, 08:23:06 AM
All weirdness is relative. Take an Amazon native from a tribe who has never encountered the modern world and drop them into Piccadilly Square. Tell me that they're not going to go WTF! Take yourself off into their tribe for a week and not freak out because of the 'weird' goings-on. The more you live, the more worldly you become, the less is the weirdness.
Hey!!! If that isolated tribe made hooch....I would be leading the
Singing and dancing around the fire. .
And use war paints for make up and have a grass dress...
Oh...wait....I'll just be an Indian...tried to be wierd
Quote from: xchristine on June 28, 2013, 08:49:17 AM
Hey!!! If that isolated tribe made hooch....I would be leading the
Singing and dancing around the fire. .
And use war paints for make up and have a grass dress...
Oh...wait....I'll just be an Indian...tried to be wierd
You defo sound weird. Beautiful, but weird nonetheless. ;D
Reminds me of the movie "The Gods Must be Crazy". Native finds a coke bottle and all h___ breaks loose.
--Jay
Quote from: aleon515 on June 29, 2013, 12:59:30 AM
Reminds me of the movie "The Gods Must be Crazy". Native finds a coke bottle and all h___ breaks loose.
--Jay
LOL so true!!
Kind of like Crocodile Dundee walking around New York City!!
I think that you are only as "weird" as you think you are.
If you are comparing yourself or transfolk in general to "normal" folks, then yeah, you're going to be weird in one way (being trans). But "normal" people are weird too. As stated above in this thread, blue eyes, blond hair, left handedness, are all "weird" traits. There is a lot of variety among humanity as a whole, imo.
Personally, I think that a lot of people (the 93-99% of "normals") are absolutely terrified that their boundaries might be moved, so they do all that they can to keep the 1-7% of "weirdos" in check through guilt, force and law.
Personally, I think it's weirder to pop out of the womb and have a whole host of traits/characteristics/ways of life thrown onto you just because of your anatomy. I mean, even before you are born, a lot of preparation is put into how this boy or girl will be treated...pink, Easy Bake ovens, makeup, inferiority, blue, sports, GI Joe, dominance.
I think it's great to have people that question it. You definitely should...as the gender binary is not necessarily the norm...it's the norm for some societies...but, in other societies, there are no "male" or "female" genders (people are classified by what they contribute to that society).
Similarly, homosexuality and heterosexuality definitely does not exist in every society. People are classified by the "role" they play...heck, we love the Romans so much, and yet we forget that they had a very different system.
But, it turns out that people get very unhappy when other people's beliefs are forced upon them. It's not so much of "weirdness," so much as it's just that people seem to be uncomfortable with accepting the fact that other people can live their lives in a drastically different manner and be just as happy (if not happier). So, it seems a lot is done in order to make the people with a different way of life miserable.
When you really give it some thought, gender is very strange...I don't think it's right for everyone.
I knew I was weird long before confronting my transness. The best thing to do is embrace it :)
Everyone is 'weird' if you want to put it that way. Everyone is different in their own way. 'Normal' doesnt really exist. Being different is what makes things interesting. If everyone looked and acted the same the world would be an incredibly boring place. Im not happy I've had to go through all this but its made me understand and appreciate things in a way I never otherwise would have. I dont care what anyone thinks of me, its their problem not mine. Its our society thats weird and constantly forcing people to try and conform to a 'norm' which in itself is abnormal. As has been said, diversity is normal in nature so this is actually the unnatural situation. Many animals are not just one gender, some are both, some are neither, some are gay. Its all perfectly normal in nature so why is it seen as 'weird' in us? It really isnt. Its society that needs to change and let us be free to be who we are than trying to force us to be something we're not
"Normal is an illusion. What is normal for the spider is chaos for the fly"
Weird no. Natural variety within a species that is not accepted by the general populist, yes.
If you ask me, the fact that 99% of the population is cis is extremely weird.
Think about it - you're assigned a gender at birth, arbitrarily chosen based on their perception of your genitals, with all the cultural expectations and beliefs that apply to each gender... and 99% of people go along with that assignment and think nothing of it?
That is weird.
I do not think it is weird at all to want to become normal. The weird fact is our society that tries to make each person a male or female. You would think people would help & support other people that just simply want or need to change gender. What is the big problem with people. Why does this scare them so much???
Quote from: Cassandra Hyacinth on July 04, 2013, 11:41:48 AM
If you ask me, the fact that 99% of the population is cis is extremely weird.
Think about it - you're assigned a gender at birth, arbitrarily chosen based on their perception of your genitals, with all the cultural expectations and beliefs that apply to each gender... and 99% of people go along with that assignment and think nothing of it?
That is weird.
I agree with your assessment.
It makes me think about a former good friend who is expecting a baby next week. I saw her latest posts on facebook and how they are all about how she can't wait to meet her son, and all of the boy things they have gotten for him. It's like they KNOW he's a boy and they don't really plan on considering the possibility that their baby may not be 100% boy.
Most likely, he will, if they stay in this area though. Hell, more people around here watch Duck Dynasty than the nightly news. The odds of their son being anything other than a cookie cutter boy's boy is very low, imo. Especially since the dad is very anti-gay, anti-arts, anti-everything not sufficiently manly.
QuoteEspecially since the dad is very anti-gay, anti-arts, anti-everything not sufficiently manly.
This has
nothing to do with a child being mis gendered at birth.
Look, the world is weird. I can tell that you just came here to post this messing around and trying to incite a reaction. But here is what I think on the matter. The suicide rate is so high because the world continues to be non-accomodating and hostile towards anyone that happens to fall out of the box of male or female even a little bit. People who are socially conservative will say something like the world is too accomodating to transexuals (but they probably won't use that word in lieu of something more insulting) and go on about how the world is falling apart. What is falling apart now is structures of many years of gender oppression that people have built in some cases depending on the country. These people are desperate and clinging at straws kind of similar to the misogynist response to feminist movements. But it's still hostile for our kind, believe me. I have thought for several years out of my life to change genders but decided against it because of all the oppression that still exists. But think about where we are now. Some people would want to bring religion into it and say that God would be against an unnatural order but to me that seems very oppressive. I'm not surprised of the suicidal statistics. There's no need to be condescending about it like anyone that doesn't feel like they fit into the socially constructed box of male or female characteristics is human filth. Suicide is tragic and anyone who kills themselves should not be spat on and mocked because that trivializes the issue of suicide. But besides all of that I see the current transgender state of being able to get sex-change operations if a person is deemed too uncomfortable with their body as a refection of today's world and technology. Back when the technology didn't exist people would have to stay in their bodies most of the time. Depending on the culture they lived in cross-dressing may or may not have been an option. Even today in some parts it continues to be a dangerous one.
Now we have many non-transexual people doing such things as altering their body with breast implants, eye surgeries, limb surgeries, circumcisions done later in life, weight loss surgeries, you name it. People take a pill manufactured by technology for almost anything. Non-transexuals take hormone therapy with synthesized hormones of their own gender. All kinds of new and creepy, possibly even unnatural technologies are around. If you are religious you could probably also apply many of these types of things as also going against the laws of God or nature. So now how abnormal does it seem for someone to get this particular kind of cosmetic surgery? And hormone treatment with it? Because that's all it is. We are still human. We still have a beating heart. And can breathe. This is just a particular way of adapting to a hostile society and a more technological society in my view. If you were one gender and could never really fit in no matter how hard you tried with your gender and wanted to be the other gender what would you do given the current technology? Would you stay as you were and feel miserable or try to act really fake? Or if there was another opportunity around to feel more like who you really felt you were would you take that?
It's not an easy issue, believe me.
Wow .....tadpole...you should really write a thesis
Or somethng ...
It looks ad though you almost have it all broken down.
Family unit.. collective unit....cultural .....religious...
It all does for together...
Yeah being trans is weird and most of the time it does not make any sense, and no matter how good a spin you put on that it can suck at times. I dont want to be an x-men or anything like that. I am a social outcast either way and even though I have come to terms with being weird and I have a group of friends who are weird like me sometimes it would be nice to just be normal and not have to deal with the struggle as much.
I know everybody has issues with fitting in, but being trans does not really help that cause all that much most of the time.
Now before anybody asks I am fine just frustrated with it.
Quote from: bangarang on June 26, 2013, 01:02:33 PM
You've got 99% of the world living in this happy little bubble where all women have vaginas and all men have penises, and then there's the transsexual bubble, with a suicide rate of nearly 50% and people born with parts that need to be changed.
It's like being albino or something but with life-ruining side effects.
When I say the next bit, I want you to laugh with me--I'm actually doin' okay :) I'm poking fun at myself...cause I'm on the mend...
I don't have any bits at all ATM :) Gone! I'm smiling though ATM - because - I figured out I'm gunna be okay....I wasn't after it first happened, but now I'm okay.....I'm gunna be okay cause.....
I get a
bionic schlong! Is how I'm lookin' at it, and the darned thing I had
before never did what it was told anyway! Hard when uninvited, soft when needed, and too totally precious for words...mind of its own the darned thing!
:) So HOORAY - I am gunna have a bionic thingywhatsit, I can relax with my sexual partners and just enjoy the whole experience....I've turned the loss into a positive.
*gets a little more focussed/real*
Ya know, ur right to the extent that the world just has this darned 'blindspot' about 'genital configurations' and this rigid assumption of 'plumbing a on body a' and 'plumbing b on body b'. Add to that that it mixes up gender concepts with biological sex concepts, and *gets a headache* then sexual orientation with gender identity. And the cost to mental health from this all.
That doesn't make anyone here weird. That makes the world just a little
dim witted. The whole 'losing my gonads' journey for me has awakened me to what the world looks like when bits and parts are not where general public people expect them to be.
All I can say is that I've taken ownership of 'what I got'. Might not be what KenDoll next door has - or even Barbie up the road.
But ya know what--let's make a freakin' new doll - the KBarbie Doll or the BarKenDoll :) and I swear, I'll mass market the darned new doll and give it to kids with their other dolls, so that kids can grow up realising there's just a little bit more to the natural variation of the human being than we've been told!
You are all beautiful! ALL of u - and me too.
cheers
stav
Thank you stav
It has been a very long time since I was
Called beautifull :-)
I appreciate that I'm ways I can't express
Quote from: xchristine on July 07, 2013, 06:47:04 AM
Thank you stav
It has been a very long time since I was
Called beautifull :-)
I appreciate that I'm ways I can't express
well you are! You really are - and all of you. The world needs to learn to bow in respect for you all. Believe me--they all will one day.....there's an inevitability to that at work, though so very very slow.
this whole journey has opened my eyes to this whole area. I've never, in my life, been so very moved by what I've found here. We darned well lost Andrea! Goddamit! She was beautiful -
With my culture as a Native American, to us it is pretty sacred. I love being two spirited, and wouldnt change myself for the world. Weird? no. Different? yes. but who isnt different? My only difference is my gender, and I am proud to identify as and be a woman, and I feel blessed that it is in this day and age I was born, so that modern science can help me out with who I am :)
I couldnt imagine being two spirited two hundred years ago and not having the medical care available to be able to help me find balance :) It is a blessing to be able to walk between adn understand the genders, not a curse. Only modern society with its strict mores/norms on what is male female in such a binary pattern that create those feelings. If you can over come those limitations, you help change society by proper interaction with those in our lives, because they effect other peoples views when negativity is expressed on our gender roles, and place within society.
So walk strong in who you are and love and help all that cross your path find a smile. Only through self acceptance and the above, can we change the binary mores/norms, and move who we are out of a subculture and into the mainstream again :)
~Dayna xoxo
What Dayna said.
There have probably been MORE cultures that believed in trans identities as normal (or hyper normal perhaps) than have thought otherwise. IN the whole hx of the world the idea of trans as abnormal and bad is probably the minority. Just went to an awesome presentation on gender throughout the world. It was just amazing and eye opening.
--Jay
Quote from: PrincessDayna on July 07, 2013, 01:39:42 PM
With my culture as a Native American, to us it is pretty sacred. I love being two spirited, and wouldnt change myself for the world. Weird? no. Different? yes. but who isnt different? My only difference is my gender, and I am proud to identify as and be a woman, and I feel blessed that it is in this day and age I was born, so that modern science can help me out with who I am :)
I couldnt imagine being two spirited two hundred years ago and not having the medical care available to be able to help me find balance :) It is a blessing to be able to walk between adn understand the genders, not a curse. Only modern society with its strict mores/norms on what is male female in such a binary pattern that create those feelings. If you can over come those limitations, you help change society by proper interaction with those in our lives, because they effect other peoples views when negativity is expressed on our gender roles, and place within society.
So walk strong in who you are and love and help all that cross your path find a smile. Only through self acceptance and the above, can we change the binary mores/norms, and move who we are out of a subculture and into the mainstream again :)
~Dayna xoxo
love this bit, especially - I believe there is great insight, though a painful journey at some or many points. The eyes of the transgendered community can see through the myopia of the conventional world and pierce the illusions of stereotypes with much greater acumen than those not challenged by adversity. That is why policy reform, I believe, is impelled by minority groups, and their power to make social reform to mirror their truth, in defiance of society's conventions, and despite the momentum of society's monolithic pressure to conform.
Quote from: stavraki on July 07, 2013, 06:02:59 PM
love this bit, especially - I believe there is great insight, though a painful journey at some or many points. The eyes of the transgendered community can see through the myopia of the conventional world and pierce the illusions of stereotypes with much greater acumen than those not challenged by adversity. That is why policy reform, I believe, is impelled by minority groups, and their power to make social reform to mirror their truth, in defiance of society's conventions, and despite the momentum of society's monolithic pressure to conform.
I agree on every aspect :) The problem is once somone is minoroty in one way, there is such a myriad of issues concurrent with societal monolithic mores and norms, that it can be a challenge to adjust. For instance, not every native tribe shares the same culture or same approach to the two spirited, ad to not delve into culture rape; certain tribes have more then 2 genders, some up to 4! :) These old ways are deeply ingrained in those who walk their traditional paths...and its normal to us that do :) But ya inevitibly in the end, larger societal change is always formed by minority cultures :)
Quote from: PrincessDayna on July 07, 2013, 06:15:07 PM
I agree on every aspect :) The problem is once somone is minoroty in one way, there is such a myriad of issues concurrent with societal monolithic mores and norms, that it can be a challenge to adjust. For instance, not every native tribe shares the same culture or same approach to the two spirited, ad to not delve into culture rape; certain tribes have more then 2 genders, some up to 4! :)
So much would be lost if each culture did not somehow both retain some ancestral trace, in a great road backwards and forwards through time.
QuoteThese old ways are deeply ingrained in those who walk their traditional paths...and its normal to us that do :) But ya inevitibly in the end, larger societal change is always formed by minority cultures :)
...I'm thinking about the Stonewall riots here, on the one hand, and on the other, mysticism and spirituality of great, ancient cultures, as I ponder transgender journeys.
In the fusion of the two something is emergent that is a whole greater than the sum of the parts. Ancient Greek mythology is full of beings of blended races, in varied composites. I love the Minotaur for this reason: unstoppable mental fortitude. But, I'd blend with the Minotaur, the Wisdom of the Goddess Athena, to temper the heart and stay the hand, until the right time for a firm hand, and then add in Aphrodite--love--and in that composite blend, tackle the face of society's Chimeras--(Chimeras are mean and not equipped to use power wisely).
cheers n good to meet u, :) stav
Of course being trans is weird, lol. Can't say I've met very many of them.
Thats all really deep, and very nice to meet you, too, sir :) As far as Spiritual, Im reminded of all sorts of things having mixed cultural roots with Scottish and Irish in my blood: it reminds me of an aunt on my dads side (well great aunt) who helped name me in the womb :) The name spirtitually is the mother of the shidhe folk, or the Tuatha de Dannan (tribe of Dana), mother of all celts. She was a practitioner of the "old ways", i inherited alot of her books/writings but never practiced...makes me wonder if she knew my gender way ahead of time because of that? I feel my name is pretty sacred in those regards.
I am just now reading more into all that side of things, but will never mix it with my native culture, by heart I am a typical native woman for my age :)
QuoteI couldnt imagine being two spirited two hundred years ago and not having the medical care available to be able to help me find balance :) It is a blessing to be able to walk between adn understand the genders, not a curse. Only modern society with its strict mores/norms on what is male female in such a binary pattern that create those feelings. If you can over come those limitations, you help change society by proper interaction with those in our lives, because they effect other peoples views when negativity is expressed on our gender roles, and place within society.
I think that perhaps in past times, when tribes still lived together without much or any outside interference, being two spirited was seen as accepted and ok. They may have simply been themselves within their communities and tribal society. I'd like to think that was the case, anyway.
I agree that today's stricter gender binary standards do create those negative feelings that being trans is a curse. It's not. It's different, but it's not a curse.
I really wish that I could upvote your original post, Dayna. It's a great one, imho.
QuoteEspecially since the dad is very anti-gay, anti-arts, anti-everything not sufficiently manly.
Quote
This has nothing to do with a child being mis gendered at birth.
I do think that the attitudes of one's birth parents and the type of culture they are born into have a great deal of influence in how they are gendered at birth and how open they are about expressing their true identity throughout their formative years. In this particular example, I do not think that my friend's son will be allowed to express feminine traits even if that his true personality or even if he identifies as a non-binary. Most of this due to the strict masculine culture that is very prevalent where we live. My friend's husband is not very open minded and has made rude comments about different things such as men who perform drag, guys who wear make up and even guys who prefer to be clean-shaven instead of wearing ridiculous-looking wooly-willy beards. It's idiotic and I don't say much to him these days.
You can't speak truth to people like that, imho. I feel bad for their son because I know that my friend is the exact opposite. She was very active in the LGBT community prior to "settling down" with her husband/baby daddy. She confided in me that she wouldn't have a problems if her son wanted to play dress up or wear girl's clothes or even if he came out as gay or bi later in life. But I know that her husband would because he is anti-anything that doesn't fit his narrow-minded worldview when it comes sexuality or gender.
Quote from: Beth Andrea on June 26, 2013, 04:26:05 PMI don't march to a different drummer...my "drummer" uses a kazoo.
'She definitely marches to the beat of her own drummer. Actually, I think she makes her own drums.'
Quote from: dpadgett628 on June 27, 2013, 12:58:58 AM
I don't think she meant "weird" in a bad way. I think all she meant was that it is a strange concept to think about, not that being trans is weird, strange, etc. :)
I do agree that it is an odd concept to think about, but we are the way we are and it doesn't matter what anyone thinks~
:police: Changed pronouns: Make sure you use the correct pronouns or I will fall on you like a ton of bricks. I really don't like that. :police:
Changed pronouns? Did I say he or something? In that case, I swear it was just typing too fast then. I'm sorry :c