If you are transsexual and poor in the United States you are doomed!!!!
[/b]
You will not have equal access to proper medical and psychiatric care in the United States if you are transsexual and poor. This is a direct result of the hypocrisy in how medical care is rationed in the USA. The two tear system of medical and psychiatric care; one the rich and the other for the poor, which is especially true in regards to psychiatric care available in the United States will deprive you, and force you to live the rest of your life in the gender of your birth.
Further, one can easily assume, in most cases, that if you seek publicly funded psychiatric care, in the United States, as a transsexual, you will be misdiagnosed with some other mental illness. I kid you not; all one needs to do to confirm what I say is truth, is to simply think about the atrocities that American Publicly funded psychiatric hospitals are infamous for.
The blatant tranphobic public financing of medical care in regards to treatment of gender dysphoria is painfully obvious. The glaring and blatant inconsistency in how American society and government define gender dysphoria as a medical illness, but refuses to publicly fund access to adequate medical and psychiatric care in its Medicare- Medicaid programs and even through private medical insurance is just beyond belief.
Plastic reconstructive surgery is only available to the moderately wealthy and very rich in the United States, and to a lesser extent, to those with traumatic medical injuries, but by no means is available to the poor that are transsexual, even though gender dysphoria is recognized as a legitimate medical issue. How can they get away with this!!!!!!
Godiva
This is the case in many countries of the world, particularly third world nations where access to health care is non-existent.
I agree it is very sad. Those who need surgery to feel comfortable in their own bodies, but have little money will either never get it, or spend a lifetime saving up, while others with 'legitimate' medical conditions get treatment. The US does not care for her own citizens.
Posted on: July 05, 2007, 07:37:38 PM
Quote from: Fer on July 05, 2007, 07:34:17 PM
This is the case in many countries of the world, particularly third world nations where access to health care is non-existent.
That's just it. In a country such as the US, you'd think the medical care would be phenomenal, but instead only the well-off can afford access to treatment. It makes me sick.
At least we have the NHS here ::)
Quote from: Godiva on July 05, 2007, 07:30:34 PM
If you are transsexual and poor in the United States you are doomed!!!!
[/b]
You will not have equal access to proper medical and psychiatric care in the United States if you are transsexual and poor. This is a direct result of the hypocrisy in how medical care is rationed in the USA. The two tear system of medical and psychiatric care; one the rich and the other for the poor, which is especially true in regards to psychiatric care available in the United States will deprive you, and force you to live the rest of your life in the gender of your birth.
Further, one can easily assume, in most cases, that if you seek publicly funded psychiatric care, in the United States, as a transsexual, you will be misdiagnosed with some other mental illness. I kid you not; all one needs to do to confirm what I say is truth, is to simply think about the atrocities that American Publicly funded psychiatric hospitals are infamous for.
The blatant tranphobic public financing of medical care in regards to treatment of gender dysphoria is painfully obvious. The glaring and blatant inconsistency in how American society and government define gender dysphoria as a medical illness, but refuses to publicly fund access to adequate medical and psychiatric care in its Medicare- Medicaid programs and even through private medical insurance is just beyond belief.
Plastic reconstructive surgery is only available to the moderately wealthy and very rich in the United States, and to a lesser extent, to those with traumatic medical injuries, but by no means is available to the poor that are transsexual, even though gender dysphoria is recognized as a legitimate medical issue. How can they get away with this!!!!!!
Godiva
I should...just leave this alone.
I am too tired.
Quote from: Godiva on July 05, 2007, 07:30:34 PM
Plastic reconstructive surgery is only available to the moderately wealthy and very rich in the United States, and to a lesser extent, to those with traumatic medical injuries, but by no means is available to the poor that are transsexual, even though gender dysphoria is recognized as a legitimate medical issue. How can they get away with this!!!!!!
If they "just" get away with it in the UK where we have a state funded health system, free at the point of use, which 95% of the population use ... then sorry but the US position is hardly a surprise !
Moral I guess is, if you're TS get an education, get medium wealthy so that you can self finance gender treatment in your mid / late 20's early 30's.
After all we're only looking at the cost of a really really basic new car for GRS, something that 50% of the UK population will repeat buy during their lives ... or a decent middle bracket car, (BMW, small Mercedes) for full FFS.
In the meantime persue state funded treatment .... after all you don't need surgery to be a woman, the important thing is to "live as a woman" .... if you know who you are you shouldn't even need any form of therapy to get on with your life !
Laura x
:: sigh ::
I understand the sentiment, but the attitude has got to go kids. If you are just venting, than
rant away. I am a champion ranter, But when the rant is over the work starts.
I have a quote at the bottom of my posts that I got from some stupid movie, but it makes sense. Cry tomorrow, because we have work to do today.
The reality of life is that for the majority of us, it sucks. It bites. It blows. I have women friends that are a published author (twice), independently wealthy (makes living investing in the stock market), and a triage nurse, who will retire at fifty with a mil in the bank, and her half million dollar home is paid off.
But they are the exceptions! The majority of us are working class and lucky to pay our rent on time. The majority of people in this community are white, middle to upper class, and elitest.
So don't compare your self to this group, because it gives you a skewed view of the world.
Instead, learn to accept the fact that you will spend all of your time and most of your energy to get the same place they do with 10% of your effort. But they will never know what it means to be an average person either, living on the edge. That is where wisdom comes from.
Some of them worked their way up, but not like you will. Especially if you are young, and dealing with the steep increase in SRS prices because demand is skyrocketing.
Surgeons are not your friend. They are greedy bastards like most other medical professionals that like to give the illusion of caring about you. But what they like is your $$$, not you.
Here is what my challenge is to you. Take that anger and angst you feel about being neglected in your needs -- take that resentment you might feel toward those better off than you -- and focus, focus, focus on what you really want. If you are negative, you will attract negative energy to you like bee's to blossoms. Take all of that energy and direct it toward showing people what you are made of, and who you are. It doesn't matter if you really don't care what anyone else thinks. Use that as motivation to get where you need to be in life.
Life is like this. You are predator, or you are prey. Some people might feel that is not the case, but they are wrong. I am older than dirt, and I know better. Don't prey on those below you, find a way to tap into those above you. That might not make sense to you now, but if you focus on that agenda, I guarantee that it will in short order.
In short, have your cry, and then get really pissed about it. Than pick your self up, and go thru, over, or around whatever obstacle you need to overcome to get to point "B."
I feel badly for you, but nobody can help you if you don't at least try to help yourself.
Capeesh?
Rant over.
I can see your points Laura and Thundra, but while you and I are fortunate enough to afford our surgeries, many are not. The US is behind. Programs such as the NHS in the UK and whatever the system is called in Canada may have their faults, but having to wait a few years for treatment is far better than getting no treatment at all because you don't have the money.
HRT and SRS should not be elective, should not be a privilege like cosmetic surgery is, it should be a necessity. In many cases it has been life-saving. It's time the US got on the ball with this.
well, yea duh! why do you think most poor ts girls engage in prostitution? it's their only way out. tsk tsk tsk
Quote from: Katia on July 05, 2007, 11:06:53 PM
well, yea duh! why do you think most poor ts girls engage in prostitution? it's their only way out. tsk tsk tsk
I knew one once. She was also physically disabled (transsexual female). She did it to feed her two year old baby boy. What a beautiful baby. He had such a big beautiful smile and laugh. She once gave me a big girl hug before I surgically transitioned that I have never forgotten. But I think I will never forget that beaufiul child growing up in desparation and poverty in America. :icon_no: :icon_cry2:
I guess he and she can just decide to stop being poor and get out there and earn enough money to feed the baby and pay for the sex change!Godiva
Quote from: Godiva on July 06, 2007, 02:02:08 AM
Quote from: Katia on July 05, 2007, 11:06:53 PM
well, yea duh! why do you think most poor ts girls engage in prostitution? it's their only way out. tsk tsk tsk
I knew one once. She was also physically disabled (transsexual female). She did it to feed her two year old baby boy. What a beautiful baby. He had such a big beautiful smile and laugh. She once gave me a big girl hug before I surgically transitioned that I have never forgotten. But I think I will never forget that beaufiul child growing up in desparation and poverty in America. :icon_no: :icon_cry2: I guess he and she can just decide to stop being poor and get out there and earn enough money to feed the baby and pay for the sex change!
Godiva
What a sad story :( I hope the baby is okay.
Quote from: Laura Eva B on July 05, 2007, 08:03:47 PM
If they "just" get away with it in the UK where we have a state funded health system, free at the point of use, which 95% of the population use ... then sorry but the US position is hardly a surprise !
Moral I guess is, if you're TS get an education, get medium wealthy so that you can self finance gender treatment in your mid / late 20's early 30's.
After all we're only looking at the cost of a really really basic new car for GRS, something that 50% of the UK population will repeat buy during their lives ... or a decent middle bracket car, (BMW, small Mercedes) for full FFS.
In the meantime persue state funded treatment .... after all you don't need surgery to be a woman, the important thing is to "live as a woman" .... if you know who you are you shouldn't even need any form of therapy to get on with your life !
Laura x
THE U.K NHS system does not usually support or pay for the treatment of Gender Dysphoria. I was diagnosed with Gender Dysphoria in early 2000, I was sent by my PCT to a NHS GIC clinic in London in 2001. I attended the clinic for over 6 years and in that time no treatment was ever facilitated. I had to go private in 2003 to start on hormones and any other treatment I have had since then I have had to pay for it. In the meantime my PCT were still paying the NHS GIC to do nothing..
in that time hundreds of other TS's transitioned in the uk perfectly fine, were you FT? did you demand HRT? what was their reason for denying it?
I and many others successfully get treatment through the NHS perfectly fine, these days it's just a few problem PCT's and one rather ->-bleeped-<-e GIC (Sheffield)
I agree that the state of American health care sucks and has huge problems, and I think you could just as easily say "You will not have equal access to proper medical and psychiatric care in the United States if you are poor," period. I don't know that transsexuals are the only category of people to whom that applies; in fact, I'm sure it's not. (Anybody seen Sicko?)
But, that said, as one who arguably falls into the category of TS and poor (poor being a hugely relative concept--I have very limited income, but I long ago stopped feeling poor, and many people are much worse off than me, I'm well aware of that), I refuse to feel "doomed."
That's an attitude that will kill you, for sure, and immobilize you into hopelessness and despair.
I am determined to find a way to start HRT within the next few months, even if I have to pay for every penny myself (and I may very well have to), and yes, surgery may be a way down the road because of financial limitations, but on the other hand the cost of surgery is less than the cost of lots of luxuries that many people take for granted); there are people who spend more on vacations, and cars, and freakin' huge televisions, than it would cost for me to have top surgery, and I just refuse to see it as something that is permanently unattainable to me.
The need for me to get this stuff going is motivating me hugely to save money on the one hand (tiny bits at a time, but it adds up!), and to find ways (like looking for a better, full-time job and getting off of disability) to increase my income on the other. I sort of feel that time wasted sitting around feeling sorry for myself because I'm not rich and don't have fabulous health insurance is simply time I don't have.
I've also heard (from people who've done it) that in some large cities (San Francisco, for example) there are clinics where you can get at least hormone treatment very cheaply, or free, if you don't have money.
I think you have to be determined, and creative, and resourceful, and very highly motivated, but my point is that if you take that attitude of "Damn, this won't be easy, nobody's going to hand it to me on a plate, so I'm doomed!" you just might be. Pffffffft to that.
No, not everyone can simply just "choose to stop being poor" but realistically, for many of us in America it is possible to begin making (even small) choices in our lives that will eventually make things better and more things possible. You can choose to channel your energy into the positive goal of overcoming whatever your particular adversity is, even if it's a long slow process.
Or, you can choose to be doomed. Whatever that means. I'm not doomed until I take my last breath, and maybe not even then. I'll just be back to take another shot at things later. ;)
Quote from: Laura Eva B on July 05, 2007, 08:03:47 PM
Moral I guess is, if you're TS get an education, get medium wealthy so that you can self finance gender treatment in your mid / late 20's early 30's.
Ya, and if I'd married a rich husband all my problems would be solved.
Well, in regards to the 'go out and get an education'
I just got accepted into an MBA program.
Jessica
Quote from: Rob on July 06, 2007, 08:37:44 AM
I agree that the state of American health care sucks and has huge problems, and I think you could just as easily say "You will not have equal access to proper medical and psychiatric care in the United States if you are poor," period. I don't know that transsexuals are the only category of people to whom that applies; in fact, I'm sure it's not. (Anybody seen Sicko?)
No, not everyone can simply just "choose to stop being poor" but realistically, for many of us in America it is possible to begin making (even small) choices in our lives that will eventually make things better and more things possible. You can choose to channel your energy into the positive goal of overcoming whatever your particular adversity is, even if it's a long slow process.
Or, you can choose to be doomed.
"Sicko" is not yet on release yet here in UK but I read a huge interview with Michael Moore that was in itself an expose of the US health system.
In the country with the most advanced healthcare in the world, the best doctors and hospitals, which spends more on health provision than any other developed nation, its ludricous that even the middle classes struggle, find it hard to pay premiums, feel disenfranchised. Medicare an Mediaid is a joke. The money is creamed off by the insurance companies, the pharmacutical industry, the health technology providers, and not least the beauraucrats and medics .... only the rich and those in good jobs with occupational health cover benefit !
And even most insurers are reluctant to include GID as a "covered" condition ... if its in their smallprint then its in the contract and its their right to do so.
But if you feel doomed and give up because it seems a goal too distant, you might as well jump under that train right now !
Most of the world still sees USA as a land of opportunity, from impoverished Mexicans to European professionals. With motivation and time the opportunity to get what one wants is surely attainable, and what bigger motivation than the "need to transition" ... and transitioning costs are "modest"
OK you may challenge my "Lauranomics", but HRT is cheap ($3-4 / day), in the UK private psychiatric care leading to referral costs about $800 / year, laser beard removal typically $1000 -1500, GRS at $10 - 20k is what I paid for a modest used car, only FFS seems seriously pricey.
You either work towards being able to afford this or give up ... no choice really !
Laura x
Quote from: Godiva on July 05, 2007, 07:30:34 PM
If you are transsexual and poor in the United States you are doomed!!!!
[/b]
You will not have equal access to proper medical and psychiatric care in the United States if you are transsexual and poor. This is a direct result of the hypocrisy in how medical care is rationed in the USA. The two tear system of medical and psychiatric care; one the rich and the other for the poor, which is especially true in regards to psychiatric care available in the United States will deprive you, and force you to live the rest of your life in the gender of your birth.
Further, one can easily assume, in most cases, that if you seek publicly funded psychiatric care, in the United States, as a transsexual, you will be misdiagnosed with some other mental illness. I kid you not; all one needs to do to confirm what I say is truth, is to simply think about the atrocities that American Publicly funded psychiatric hospitals are infamous for.
The blatant tranphobic public financing of medical care in regards to treatment of gender dysphoria is painfully obvious. The glaring and blatant inconsistency in how American society and government define gender dysphoria as a medical illness, but refuses to publicly fund access to adequate medical and psychiatric care in its Medicare- Medicaid programs and even through private medical insurance is just beyond belief.
Plastic reconstructive surgery is only available to the moderately wealthy and very rich in the United States, and to a lesser extent, to those with traumatic medical injuries, but by no means is available to the poor that are transsexual, even though gender dysphoria is recognized as a legitimate medical issue. How can they get away with this!!!!!!
Godiva
As much as you may rant and rave in big cities this is not really the case. Most GLBT centers provide extremely inexpensive medical care to TS. In fact queer people have probably the closest thing to socialized medicine in North America through a system of big city clinics such as Howard Brown and Whitman Walker. These places do both HRT and Psychological Counseling.
Also in many states, including conservative states like Virginia, Medicaid actually pays for TS services. I know several TS who are on Medicaid in Virginia. SRS for them is even covered, something that is not covered for me on regular insurance.
As much as you may rant and rave I know for a fact that you have better luck getting TS in the US being poor, than under the NHS system in the UK.
Of course if you are poor and living in a rural area you may have worse luck. But before you go on a rant about how bad it is, it may be better off to come from a position where you have an actual understanding.
As much as the US healthcare system sucks, especially for TS, realize that it is not as bad as you are making it out to be. It is best to come from a well informed place than to rant endlessly. Yes, its bad, but that does not mean transitioning for poor people is impossible. On the contrary, there are people of all income levels who transition. Its just easier if you have money. The fact is most TS in the US are pretty poor, and they do in fact transition.
You're basically screwed if you are poor in USA, trans or not. The divide between the ultra rich and everyone else keeps getting larger.
zythyra
QuoteI can see your points Laura and Thundra, but while you and I are fortunate enough to afford our surgeries, many are not. The US is behind. Programs such as the NHS in the UK and whatever the system is called in Canada may have their faults, but having to wait a few years for treatment is far better than getting no treatment at all because you don't have the money.
HRT and SRS should not be elective, should not be a privilege like cosmetic surgery is, it should be a necessity. In many cases it has been life-saving. It's time the US got on the ball with this.
Whoa! Hold on a minute here Cochese, before I blow my top. Let's go back a minute.
I totally agree with what YOU are saying. Laura and I have butted heads on this point more than once as I recall.
QuoteMoral I guess is, if you're TS get an education, get medium wealthy so that you can self finance gender treatment in your mid / late 20's early 30's.
After all we're only looking at the cost of a really really basic new car for GRS, something that 50% of the UK population will repeat buy during their lives ... or a decent middle bracket car, (BMW, small Mercedes) for full FFS.
In the meantime persue state funded treatment .... after all you don't need surgery to be a woman, the important thing is to "live as a woman" .... if you know who you are you shouldn't even need any form of therapy to get on with your life !
To me, that POV is total BS, especially the last paragraph. Not everyone is obsessed with gender role, or gender presentation. Many of us here do not even wish to fit into that binary role-playing system. For many people, especially for people I have known in the f2m community, they don't give a flying leap about how they appear to other people, they just want to get their chest, and sometimes bottom fixed. It's strictly access to medical intervention for a physical defect they want repaired. Same is true for many m2f's. Just fix my body is what I have heard over and over in the younger set.
This whole bloody game of linking behaviour modification to obtain medical intervention is ridiculous, outdated, based on an old model, and needs to friggin' go, like yesterday!
So, I agree with the rant that started this thread. You are #%&@*&! And you will continue to be #%&@*&, because society is #%&@*& up! That is a given.
The only question is, what are you going to do about it? Get depressed and mired in your own angst, or get pissed off and move forward. It's OK to get down once in a while, and it's OK, to cry and feel sorry for yourself, but ultimately, only you can pull you forward over and around obstacles to a better place.
If you go back and read the original line, the post said "in the US." It did not say, in the UK.
I don't give a rat's ass about how much better/easier/superior things are across the pond. In this thread, we are talking about how #%&@*& up things are here for these kids NOW! And telling someone to be patient and wait until they are middle-aged and educated sounds nice until you take into account how much demand is going up, and that means so will prices.
If we are going to talk about practicality, than let's focus on what can be done to help these kids get out of their situation and into a better place. Trying to use the social services where applicable is a good idea, but most places in the US are still hostile toward anything viewed as queer. The only thing that I have seen work for these kids, is work, work, work, and then work some more. Sure, they take classes. But the majority of the successful one's I have met that did not have Mommy or Daddy paying for everything worked their asses off to get enough money.
Here is what these people need to hear. If you want to get to point "B," you are going to have to put away all of the spare time, hobbies, toys, and bad habits. You will have to network like a maniac, and probably work 2 or three jobs for at least two to three years, depending on your level of surgical need. It's worse for m2f, because generally, most guys only have top surgery. DONE!
Life ain't fair or easy. But, it is never hopeless unless you give up. Or, you can go the other route and wait to have surgery until you are even older than me -- and I am older than dirt.
Quote from: Thundra on July 07, 2007, 12:38:50 AM
QuoteI can see your points Laura and Thundra, but while you and I are fortunate enough to afford our surgeries, many are not. The US is behind. Programs such as the NHS in the UK and whatever the system is called in Canada may have their faults, but having to wait a few years for treatment is far better than getting no treatment at all because you don't have the money.
HRT and SRS should not be elective, should not be a privilege like cosmetic surgery is, it should be a necessity. In many cases it has been life-saving. It's time the US got on the ball with this.
Whoa! Hold on a minute here Cochese, before I blow my top. Let's go back a minute.
I totally agree with what YOU are saying. Laura and I have butted heads on this point more than once as I recall.
I stand corrected. :)
i'm in the U.K and hoping to win the lottery or something similar in order to find the money for transition.
I'm long term TS but unforunitely didn't get any support pr help through the U.K NHS system and so it's up to me to find the financial funds as and when I can...
There's always doing your homework by researching the costs of the transition-related health care. Since I am now considered to be taking hormones, that took almost hundreds of dollars of research to find out what the best course of transition-related treatement.
Let's face it, it should not matter if you can afford transition-related medical expenses. It is simply a matter of finding the right price (and in many cases the lower price.) And what I think about the government is doing to the needs of transgendered men and women. What ain't right about transition related health care isn't right for transmen and transwomen (thus we live in a homophobic society here in America.) What ain't right about M2Fs and F2M's isn't right for health care. And what ain't right about health care isn't good for "Old Glory."
Peronally, since I am M2F, the only two transition related surgeries I would need to undergo are Facial Feminization Surgery and M2F Orchiectomy. Worst case scenario, they will cost me about $5,000 (or less) if I make the right decisions.
I was just E-mailed this from FFS-support website about the cost of revision Rhonplasty that by the statistics, a minimum of 10 percent of us will require.
Hi
Dr Denenberg quoted me for revision rhinoplasty $18 000 + anaesthesiologist fee, medication & hospital fee & lab tests & other expenses.
He was recommended by a friend ...
goodluck
----- Original Message ----
From: pirjokaasinen <pirjokaasinen@ yahoo.co. uk>
To: ffs-support@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Saturday, July 7, 2007 12:45:59 PM
Subject: [ffs-support] Re: Rhinoplasty: Nose surgery questions
I must confess, I do not have this kind of money for only one of the many surgeries I have had and will need to have, and I am not poor, but fare from rich. This E-mail frightens me very much!!!
By the way, the proposed solution to paying for SRS by postponing the surgery until you get an education is, in my opinion, highly questionable. First, not all of us can to afford to go to college, or able to get into a decent school. Second, an unspoken truth about college in America is that a very large number of those that start college never graduate. Third, the real pay off for going to college has been declining for years, as measure by the real purchasing power of what you earn with a college degree. This goes doubly for funding the cost of plastic surgery. Fourth, most graduating from college will have major student loans to pay off for many years after graduating school. Fifth, the older you start your transition, the more expensive and complicated it is to achieve. Ideally, transitioning should be done as young as possible, before college age.
But, even for most college graduates in America, spending $18,000 for a second Rhonplasty would be unrealistic. As fare as America, being the land of economic opportunity, it generally is fare from that for the majority of transsexuals. They are more likely to experience unemployment and under employment related directly to prejudges and discrimination. Just in San Francisco alone transsexuals, on average earn a whopping $15,000 less a year than the general population and this is San Francisco!!! Yes, if American is the land of opportunity, one must ask, opportunity for who? Certainly America is not the land of justice and equality for all!!!!
Godiva
If someone's belief system tells her she is going to be poor than certainly that is what she is going to be. OTOH if one believes that she is going to do whatever it takes to get this thing done, that is what she is going to do. With all the advantages that young women have over those born in the baby boom generation, there is simply no excuse for not finding a pathway to transition. There is always a way, all one has to do is become focused on that goal and become determined that nothing is going to stand in her way.
It amazes me how so many of us on this site actually conform to the rules society as placed on us.
Although we break the rules or "the Norm" everyday by being ourselves
The title: If you are transsexual and poor in the United States you are doomed!!!!
I disagree with.
Being a Transexual who was born poor and I do mean poor as in housing project poor I seem to have made it through transitioning. All though a hard time time being without a lot of currency there are always "legal" ways around everything!
I have never been to a psychatrist..(except for employment screening) and still received HRT through a well respected MD.
My Drivers License clearly says Female although I never had any type of paper work to correct this
( a very nice woman at the DMV just looked at me and said let me correct this typo in the system!) true story
I know friends and ex-lovers who are Plastic surgeons who will "help out" my TS friends and bill on a "sliding scale"
I know (and have worked for) non-profit state and governemnt funded clincs that offer assistance to poor - low income Transgender individuals often with no charge to them.
My bottom line is
where there is a will...there definitly is a way
regardless of the system we live in and the rules society sets into play for us by the so called normal people of society.
YES, I was poor, a hood rat, ghetto, whatever the case or class but was I DOOMED?
only if I let myself be doomed.
But a sista wasn't trying to go out like that. Niether was I about to lay my life down and conform to what the rules and society said that a person like me and in my "Social Status" was capable of
You just have to decide in your mind how important Actually Living your life is to you!
DOOMED I THINK NOT
Only if you believe and always yourself to be doomed!
QuoteBy the way, the proposed solution to paying for SRS by postponing the surgery until you get an education is, in my opinion, highly questionable. First, not all of us can to afford to go to college, or able to get into a decent school. Second, an unspoken truth about college in America is that a very large number of those that start college never graduate. Third, the real pay off for going to college has been declining for years, as measure by the real purchasing power of what you earn with a college degree. This goes doubly for funding the cost of plastic surgery. Fourth, most graduating from college will have major student loans to pay off for many years after graduating school. Fifth, the older you start your transition, the more expensive and complicated it is to achieve. Ideally, transitioning should be done as young as possible, before college age.
But, even for most college graduates in America, spending $18,000 for a second Rhonplasty would be unrealistic. As fare as America, being the land of economic opportunity, it generally is fare from that for the majority of transsexuals. They are more likely to experience unemployment and under employment related directly to prejudges and discrimination. Just in San Francisco alone transsexuals, on average earn a whopping $15,000 less a year than the general population and this is San Francisco!!! Yes, if American is the land of opportunity, one must ask, opportunity for who? Certainly America is not the land of justice and equality for all!!!!
All very true! Especially for young people that never have established a financial stake as the wrong gender. They operate in a different world than people that educate themselves and become successful living as the wrong gender, and then use that $$$ to change genders.
QuoteIf someone's belief system tells her she is going to be poor than certainly that is what she is going to be. OTOH if one believes that she is going to do whatever it takes to get this thing done, that is what she is going to do. With all the advantages that young women have over those born in the baby boom generation, there is simply no excuse for not finding a pathway to transition. There is always a way, all one has to do is become focused on that goal and become determined that nothing is going to stand in her way.
Also very true! You absolutely must take full advantage of the few opportunities that might present themselves to you.
Look. This is not an either/or situation. That should be the point -- the focus. Fantasizing about getting out of a bad situation will leave you older and no closer to where you need to be. Only hard work and determination will get you there. You have to take baby steps to get started with anything.
Work the system, and work your ass off to make $$$. And in your "spare time," educate yourself. That is the reality of the modern world.
When I lived in the states (Vegas) for a year in 1999, I couldn't believe what it was like. It made me really appreciate Canada. Although Canada isn't perfect, nor is the health care system, it has a good start.
I feel pretty bad for my US friends who have a difficult time affording SRS, as well as other things like Laser and FFS.
SRS isn't universally covered in Canada. Most provinces do not cover it, or do not provide any actual funding or a means to get SRS in a real time frame. Several provinces have "de-listed" SRS from Health Care funding. So, there are plenty of Canadians who do not get funding, or wait for years and years going no where. Canada is also home to the Clarke Centre (Ontario), which, from what I hear, wasn't a great place to go to get funding in Ontario. Ontario, btw, is one of the provinces who has de-listed coverage.
The only province that I'm aware of that fully covers SRS is Alberta. They only cover SRS in Montreal (Bassard/Manard) except for certain medical cases. I have a friend, for example, who has diabetes, and Montreal will not take her -- so she is going to Arizona to see Meltzer. They also cover the cost of travel. They don't cover, however, Laser, FFS, breast augmentations, and so on.
The process here has a waiting list. It can be a long process, but the average is about two years from the time you start living full-time. A lot of it depends on how well adjusted you are and luck. Some people get things done quickly, while others wait for years. I've heard of people waiting much more than two years. The other option, of course, is to pay for your own surgery.
I'm already in the process and hopefully my funding application will get in this Summer, and approved by the end of this year. I'm very lucky that laser has worked for me, and lucky that I don't need FFS or an adam's apple shave, etc. I just need a new hair cut... my hair is all fried and full of split ends.
I couldn't imagine how hopeless I'd feel if I had to pay for everything from my own pocket, including SRS.
I know I'm going to step on some feet here but I'll post anyways.
The medical industry in the USA is a business like any other. Prices are going up because of the jive-medical insurance industry and screwball doctors and screwy lawyers and dingbat politicians. I'd say about 50 - 70% of the 'medical industry" is nothing more than paper pushers and people who drive around in Hummers and F350s claiming to be "medical sales representatives". I know this because my mother works as middle management at a hospital and most hospitals are run like...garbage. These surgeons asking for 15k - 18k for surgery, they certainly will fight anyone offering it for 2k or 3k. They'll make up excuses from "they aren't certified" or "we have specialists on demand here" or some other hokey reason. I personally don't respect the medical establishment that much since much of it is quack fu medicine anyways. (Have you ever seen the malpractice rate of doctors?)
QuoteIf you are transsexual and poor in the United States you are doomed!!!!
Golly, I make exactly $13,450 annually, a fixed income on social security. Assuredly I qualify as poor, but I had no idea, no idea at all that I am doomed.
Here I thought that I was happy, what ever should I do? ;)
QuoteI know I'm going to step on some feet here but I'll post anyways.
Right on! Some people need their feet stepped on.
Nice post too.
Quote from: Berliegh on July 07, 2007, 02:09:33 AM
i'm in the U.K and hoping to win the lottery or something similar in order to find the money for transition.
I'm long term TS but unforunitely didn't get any support pr help through the U.K NHS system and so it's up to me to find the financial funds as and when I can...
Care to go into more detail?
Quote from: Mawd on July 08, 2007, 01:59:12 PM
Quote from: Berliegh on July 07, 2007, 02:09:33 AM
i'm in the U.K and hoping to win the lottery or something similar in order to find the money for transition.
I'm long term TS but unforunitely didn't get any support or help through the U.K NHS system and so it's up to me to find the financial funds as and when I can...
Care to go into more detail?
Yes I can Mawd, I have done several times on this site. I spent 6 years attending a clinic in the NHS GIC system in the U.K (2001 - 2007) and wasn't able to access any treatment though the NHS. The NHS is a kind of tax we pay towards our own healthcare in the U.K and according to the medics there are facilities for treatment of gender dysphoria through the NHS.
After 2 years of begging the NHS GIC clinic for hormones I eventually went to see a private consultant to start on them. The same happened with my requests for 4 referrals, I was denied everything. The clinic aknowledged that I complied with the HBSOC and their own protocol, had been living RLT for over 4 years yet I was denied any form of treatment without explanation. My health authority (PCT) are now looking inro this case on my behalf as they have lost £1,000 a year on sending me to a clinic which did not facilitate treatment but instead chose to profit from my health authority and other health authorities.
I am now slowly working my way through private treatment which is very expensive. I have lost 6 years of my life and I am seeking legal advice. I reported the clinic to the Healthcare Commisssion, Department of health and various other legal bodies who are now looking into this case and many others like it.
Weird. Was this charring cross?
The NHS is not like that with everyone though.
Quote from: Mawd on July 16, 2007, 02:34:07 AM
Weird. Was this charring cross?
The NHS is not like that with everyone though.
It was indeed Charing Cross GIC....the NHS might not be like they have been with me with everyone but a petition with 800 signature's says otherwise..
weird, they must have just not liked you, I know a fair few people who went through them fine at that time.
I know they can be right pricks some time but they were not completely and utterly useless for everyone.
Quote from: melissa90299 on July 07, 2007, 10:16:17 AM
If someone's belief system tells her she is going to be poor than certainly that is what she is going to be. OTOH if one believes that she is going to do whatever it takes to get this thing done, that is what she is going to do. With all the advantages that young women have over those born in the baby boom generation, there is simply no excuse for not finding a pathway to transition. There is always a way, all one has to do is become focused on that goal and become determined that nothing is going to stand in her way.
Exactly. "There is simply
NO excuse for not finding a pathway to transition"
tink :icon_chick:
P.S. Cookie time again, Melissa! ;)
Quote from: melissa90299 on July 07, 2007, 10:16:17 AM
If someone's belief system tells her she is going to be poor than certainly that is what she is going to be. OTOH if one believes that she is going to do whatever it takes to get this thing done, that is what she is going to do. With all the advantages that young women have over those born in the baby boom generation, there is simply no excuse for not finding a pathway to transition. There is always a way, all one has to do is become focused on that goal and become determined that nothing is going to stand in her way.
I agree Melissa and you are the prime example of someone who has been able to set her goals and achieve them. I once met a young FTM who worked three menial jobs for three years and saved everything he made. He paid for the complete surgery on his own.
There are of course exceptions and extenuating circumstances in many cases (like supporting your kids which should take a higher priority).
Still, we need to aim high and work towards those goals. Don't plan to fail. Plan to succeed!
Cindi
The main point is that younger transsexuals of today have more opportunities to transition than any other generation in all of human history. When I was young, transitioning was not an option. It is really hard for me to stomach any "woe is me" attitude from younger TSs.
thats why i live in Canada!!
Phoenyx
Quote from: Mawd on July 17, 2007, 05:20:33 PM
weird, they must have just not liked you, I know a fair few people who went through them fine at that time.
I know they can be right pricks some time but they were not completely and utterly useless for everyone.
Yes, they didn't like me...
November 1984: Diagnosed as Gender Dysphoric. No help made available at that time. Went into deep depression. Started to affect my everyday life. Affected loss of job after 6 years.
September 2000: Sixteen years later after seeing my present GP for severe depression sent to local psychiatrist Dr Fieldsend. and officially diagnosed as Gender Dysphoric once again. Dr Fieldsend recommended hormone therapy and gender re-assignment surgery Present GP wanted to help.
My NHS GIC Charing Cross GID Clinic Timeline....
24th August 2001: Appointment made at Charing Cross Identity Clinic in London. I was worried about this decision, as I had heard many bad reports about Charing Cross GIC. Saw Psychiatrist Dr James Barrett. Inaccurate but descriptive letter sent to GP. I asked for hormone treatment but was denied.
26th November 2001: Saw second Psychiatrist Dr Donald Montgomery for an appointment. Asked for hormone treatment but denied. Critical and inaccurate letter sent to GP. In it Montgomery describes me as 'quite short and very thick set and very masculine and so is the pitch of my voice'. Tell that to people who know me! In reality I'm 5'7" and quite skinny with a very high voice and at no time have I looked masculine. It is possible my notes were mixed up with another patent. This mistake was later exposed by the Healthcare Commission as many patients end up with their notes being mixed up with others.
13th March 2002: Saw Psychiatrist Dr Montgomery for a second appointment. Again, I asked for hormone treatment but denied. Another critical letter sent to my GP.
9th September 2002: Saw Dr Montgomery for a second appointment. Asked for hormone treatment yet again but denied. Another critical letter sent to GP.
21st March 2003: Saw Psychologist Dr Penny Lenihan for forth appointment. She seemed very nice but totally inexperienced as to regards to gender matters. Dr Lenihan seemed to confuse Gender Dysphoria with cross dressing and transvestitism. I again asked for hormone treatment but was still denied. She was also critical of me for taking hormones and androcur illegally. These allegations of course were not true and I was not taking hormones illegally.
25th July 2003: : Saw Dr Barrett for third appointment. Asked for hormone treatment but again denied. So told him I had started on hormones anyway. But then he made totally unfounded and untrue slanderous statements which he had written in critical letter to my GP. He accused me of obtaining them from the internet and illegally and said they were not real hormones. All comments he made were slanderous and untrue. This was also later uncovered by the Healthcare Commission and Barrett denied the statement.
20th October 2003: Saw private consultant psychiatrist Dr Russell Reid. He wrote a very long and very professional and positive accurate detailed letter to my GP. He recommended hormones. My GP then set up the NHS prescription for me. Dr Russell Reid said I had to arrange my own annual blood and lipid tests at Amersham Hospital. Mr Reid was very thorough and understanding..
14th May 2003: Saw Dr Barrett for a forth appointment. Barrett tried to stop my GP prescribing androcur without explanation. My GP overruled Dr Barrett comments and was not impressed with his attitude. We discussed other treatment options and continue to do so. At this time I decided it was in my best interest to quit Charing Cross GIC. A friend told me to keep them on the back burner but I wasn't happy about it.
September 2003: Saw Charing Cross Speech therapist Christella Antoni . At last some kind of help from Charing Cross Hospital. Unfortunately I was preoccupied with my problems and dissatisfaction with the GIC which distracted from the few sessions I had. The Speech therapist was very kind and helpful and suggested an appointment with a local psychologist in my area. At this time I had already changed my details, driving licence, passport and bank details. I took my birth father's surname and changed my Christian name.
24th May 2004: Saw Dr Barrett for a forth appointment. Dr Barrett wrote a favorable but totally inaccurate letter to my GP. But still no treatment had been facilitated. Judging by the letter he sent to my GP he had no idea I had already changed my details.
25th October 2004: Saw local PCT Psychologist Dr Corinne Usher who got to the root of the problems. The first time someone wanted to help me after years in the wilderness. She didn't see my problems as psychological at all but more about lack of help with my physical gender situation.
24th November 2004: Tried to arrange an appointment with an endocrinologist. Pushing GP to write to two Endocrinologists at Hospitals in London, one being Charing Cross. My GP claimed she couldn't get the funding even though I was already a patent at Charing Cross GIC where the endocrinologist is located. Changed GP for a while.
December 2004: GP wrote to Endocrinologist Dr Meeran at Charing Cross Hospital.
13th January 2005: Wrote to Endocrinologist Dr Leighton Seal at St George's Hospital, London to access a referral to see him.
22nd April 2005: Had first appointment with Endocrinologist Dr Leighton Seal.
27TH May 2005: Saw Psychiatrist Dr Richard Green for the first time. We got on well and I believed he would be able to help me.
14th October 2005: Saw Dr Richard Green again.
27th February 2006: Saw Richard Green for the last time. He was the best person to see but he was retiring.
24th October 2006: Saw Psychologist Penny Lenihan. She seemed more obsessed with writing about my new hair extensions and skipped around the real reason of why I was there.
8th January 2007: Saw Stuart Lorimer for my last appointment. He admitted I had fulfilled all the clinics protocols of the 'real life test' yet they continued to refuse a referral without explanation.
Quote by Lorimer in a letter date 23rd February 2007: '
she presented as female in terms of clothing, mannerisms and general appearance. I was not surprised she is generally excepted without question as female. I would broadly agree that she has fulfilled the requirements for the 'real life experience' as laid out in this clinics protocol, and I suspect she would be eligible for genital surgery if she wishes this'.Because I mentioned that what I really needed was physical treatment such as gender re-assignment surgery and facial surgery I was thrown out of the clinic. I insisted I no longer need to see people in a psychiatric capacity and when treatment or surgery is mentioned they seemed to put up a brick wall against the patient and treatment.
May 2007: I made a request to the clinic at Charing Cross GIC to send me the details as to why they refused my referral for gender re-assignment surgery. They continued to not reply despite several recorded delivery letters to their clinic. I also later asked Dr Barrett in person and he refused to comment or answer my question.
I am now looking at my legal options and will be taking legal action against West London Mental Health (Charing Cross GIC).
More stories like mine can be found here: http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?nhsgidsp&251