I was really excited about transitioning and I thought I could pass as a female 100% but there's only one thing holding me back. It's my voice. I have an extremely deep voice in the bass range.
My face is perfectly feminine, my body is feminine and I could make them both 100% feminine and sexy with hrt + some conservative surgery. It's just that's there's nothing that can be done to make my voice in a female range. The best I could probably achieve is sounding like a gay guy.
What about all the great actresses of our time with deep voices? There is nothing wrong at all for a woman to have a husky low sexy sultry voice. Don't let this stop you! No one has a perfect voice in real life. I have worked with some really great and beautiful Paramedic partners who when they got excited or threatened by someone sound just like Arnold Swarzeneggar. Practice will get you there, just look at videos on YouTube. Some of the MTFs there actually practiced their voice so much they could not use their male voice without pain. You can do this! :)
Don't worry, I thought so too once upon a time. It takes time and a lot of practice, but my former bassy booming guy voice passes over the phone now, as do some of my friends' voices. This is doable. Trust me!
Worst case scenario, it's going to be like Demi Moore, right?
If you still don't like what you get, there is always vocal cord surgery.
Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 05, 2014, 09:45:31 PM
I have worked with some really great and beautiful Paramedic partners who when they got excited or threatened by someone sound just like Arnold Swarzeneggar.
Does that include the Austrian accent? :3
My voice is fairly deep as well. I'm hoping to achieve the sexy deep voice from UK girls and I'm from kansas. lol
Cant wait for you to post some pics of yourself! Welcome to the forums! :D
Quote from: ath on March 05, 2014, 10:42:53 PM
Does that include the Austrian accent? :3
You would be amazed!!! It depended on how bad the situation was. I couldn't tell hiding behind them! *giggle* ;)
Natallie, I so want those boots girlfriend! *sheer jealousy* ;)
Quote from: Rena on March 05, 2014, 09:37:16 PM
I was really excited about transitioning and I thought I could pass as a female 100% but there's only one thing holding me back. It's my voice. I have an extremely deep voice in the bass range.
My face is perfectly feminine, my body is feminine and I could make them both 100% feminine and sexy with hrt + some conservative surgery. It's just that's there's nothing that can be done to make my voice in a female range. The best I could probably achieve is sounding like a gay guy.
Voice takes a good bit of work for many of us. Some don't need to work. Some do not care. Some get surgery and still have to do a lot of work.
But to say you CAN'T transition because of your voice? Come on!
We all have hurdles.
Transition is a state of movement from one state to another. It is a time to address these issues and work through them.
You CAN transition.
Really.
I'm bald, I can't transition.
My feet are too big, I can't transition.
My shoulders are too wide, I can't transition.
I have a masculine face, I can't transition.
My parents do not understand, I can't transition.
My hips are too narrow, I can't transition.
I am too old, I can't transition.
I am too tall, I can't transition.
Honey, if we got hung up on can'ts none of us ever WOULD.
Your exactly right Tori! As is everything with transition. Its going to take allot of work to reach our goals. But all are well worth the end results...our true lives. :)
Voice is something you can work on - there are loads and loads of resources out there. Go check out the voice therapy thread here on Susan's.
Now it will take awhile, I am still working on mine and I've been practicing for two years. I am told It is pretty good. Just gotta keep practicing!
We all deal with fear and shame in our own ways and with varying degrees of success. Shame of failure and fear of rejection are two of my biggest Kryptonites. Offering advice to others on a website is far easier than walking the walk I talk.
Many of us are our own biggest trans phobes.
Coming out to people helps me because I learn that they rarely if ever react as poorly as I fear they would... even if they react poorly.
Quote from: Tori on March 06, 2014, 12:19:01 AM
We all deal with fear and shame in our own ways and with varying degrees of success. Shame of failure and fear of rejection are two of my biggest Kryptonites. Offering advice to others on a website is far easier than walking the walk I talk.
Many of us are our own biggest trans phobes.
Coming out to people helps me because I learn that they rarely if ever react as poorly as I fear they would... even if they react poorly.
I've told two people:
My wife is divorcing me
And a "friend" called me a "weirdo" after trying to convince me I was lying to myself and making "the biggest mistake of my life"
I now do not want to tell anyone else. :(
Quote from: Rena on March 05, 2014, 09:37:16 PM
I was really excited about transitioning and I thought I could pass as a female 100% but there's only one thing holding me back. It's my voice. I have an extremely deep voice in the bass range.
My face is perfectly feminine, my body is feminine and I could make them both 100% feminine and sexy with hrt + some conservative surgery. It's just that's there's nothing that can be done to make my voice in a female range. The best I could probably achieve is sounding like a gay guy.
Rena, take a look at the numerous topics concerning Yeson voice surgery in South Korea. On the voice therapy board.
I felt like this,I put off my transition for 12 years.I'm 6'1 and a half,look like a cross between Vanessa Feltz and Rebel Wilson and sound like Lemmy from Motorhead.I've transitioned 23 years ago,try speech therapy classes.I had many attempts and it's difficult.
I understand the voice issue. It's one of the tougher aspects for me... well, pitch wise. It takes a lot of work and time but it's possible. If you are willing to put in the time, it can happen. One of the things I'm realizing is that this is something you can't be lazy with. Like if I make a lot of progress one week and stop practicing the next, I lose all that I previously worked up to. So, if you are really committed to transitioning, then it's possible with a lot of work. There are also transwomen that don't train their voices and pass, but I'd recommend avoiding that as many really do give themselves away no matter how passable they appear.
Quote from: Rena on March 05, 2014, 09:37:16 PM
I was really excited about transitioning and I thought I could pass as a female 100% but there's only one thing holding me back. It's my voice. I have an extremely deep voice in the bass range.
My face is perfectly feminine, my body is feminine and I could make them both 100% feminine and sexy with hrt + some conservative surgery. It's just that's there's nothing that can be done to make my voice in a female range. The best I could probably achieve is sounding like a gay guy.
If your perfectly feminine looking, I dont think your voice will be much of a problem, these days its more of looks, you could say you have a throat defect or somethig of the like.
Quote from: Tic Est Ipse on March 06, 2014, 01:13:50 PM
If your perfectly feminine looking, I dont think your voice will be much of a problem, these days its more of looks, you could say you have a throat defect or somethig of the like.
I have to disagree, your voice is very important in being able to pass. You can be very beautiful but if your voice isn't good it will give you away and people will know you are trans.
Quote from: anais on March 06, 2014, 02:24:04 PM
I have to disagree, your voice is very important in being able to pass. You can be very beautiful but if your voice isn't good it will give you away and people will know you are trans.
and then what ?
Quote from: stephaniec on March 06, 2014, 02:30:08 PM
and then what ?
If your voice isn't good you mean or what is your question?
I think what Stephanie means is, so what if they know you are trans. Is that where you were going Stephanie? All that matters in this world is how YOU feel not others whose opinions are worthless. :)
Quote from: Rena on March 05, 2014, 09:37:16 PM
I was really excited about transitioning and I thought I could pass as a female 100% but there's only one thing holding me back. It's my voice. I have an extremely deep voice in the bass range.
My face is perfectly feminine, my body is feminine and I could make them both 100% feminine and sexy with hrt + some conservative surgery. It's just that's there's nothing that can be done to make my voice in a female range. The best I could probably achieve is sounding like a gay guy.
It's possible to have a feminine voice with voice training. It's one of the things you will do once you start transition. I have heard so many trans women with a perfect sounding feminine voice so it's definately possible. It' just takes a lot of time and practicing your new voice. Theres another route you could take with voice surgery but it's very risky and I wouldn't recommend it.
Quote from: Natallie553 on March 05, 2014, 10:46:24 PM
My voice is fairly deep as well. I'm hoping to achieve the sexy deep voice from UK girls and I'm from kansas. lol
Cant wait for you to post some pics of yourself! Welcome to the forums! :D
I can't tell you the number of times I got told how much they loved my accent (even sexy!) when I was in Montreal last year. But I don't think it was because it's deep, which it isn't much, lol.
OP, if all you've got to worry about is voice, what are you waiting for?! Voice is something that can be modified. A masculine frame is difficult or impossible to modify, but as you say, you're already feminine.
Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 06, 2014, 02:51:38 PM
I think what Stephanie means is, so what if they know you are trans. Is that where you were going Stephanie? All that matters in this world is how YOU feel not others whose opinions are worthless. :)
yes
Quote from: stephaniec on March 06, 2014, 03:49:24 PM
yes
For me personally it's not only about what others think but it's also for myself. I want to hear a female voice speaking when I open my mouth.
Quote from: anais on March 06, 2014, 03:58:46 PM
For me personally it's not only about what others think but it's also for myself. I want to hear a female voice speaking when I open my mouth.
Very understandable, but not something one should abandon hope in transition for, that's all. :)
For those that don't mind the blending aspect, that is very admirable and I'm glad you have the amount of inner strength to disregard those concerns; however, the voice aspect does tend to be a sensitive spot for many transitioners. Not only because it can lead to someone feeling outed but because a deeper or masculine voice can be dysphoria inducing. Just like many women want to have a feminine appearance for themselves, they want a feminine overall presentation. It's about finding what works for each person and what their own individual comfort levels and needs are. And for better or worse, voice is one of those critical clues that can prevent passing if not fine tuned. Of course, passing isn't the be all and end all, and honestly I wish I could get over my crutch on this issue and am working on it, but it is important to many people. I know I definitely want to have a "female" sounding voice in the end as it is part of my dysphoria.
In any case, I just hope voice isn't the only concern here because with hard work it can be dealt with. It just takes time and can be very frustrating, at least that's been the case with me. If that doesn't work, there are surgical procedures, though I would always suggest seeing if you can get away with it naturally. I've seen plenty of people do just that with great results.
Have you ever heard of a countertenor. These are biological men who have trained their voices to sing in the alto or soprano range. No physical alteration is involved, just training and practice.
http://www.npr.org/blogs/deceptivecadence/2010/11/30/131701596/when-a-man-sings-like-a-woman-a-countertenor-convergence
Sing, practice, extend your range. It CAN be done.
Randi
Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 06, 2014, 04:00:51 PM
Very understandable, but not something one should abandon hope in transition for, that's all. :)
I never said that and the voice is something you can work on.
I know this is going to sound snarky but it really isn't meant to be. If some one is that disabled by their voice you can always learn sign language and note writing and no one will be the wiser. Just another option.
I never had a very deep voice to begin with but it still was one that sounded manly. My voice was one aspect I dreaded about my transition...I first felt very weirded out wanting or needing too do this, I knew this transition was for real when I started to work on it. I then had the thoughts of having to fake my voice for the rest of my life, and not wanting to do that!
I worked on it gradually and very little, I thought I didn't change it much, until I was getting mam'ed on the phone almost always. Even if I didn't get mam'ed, people calling me would ask if "he" was available. I still thought my voice sucked even though I was passing with it. I realized it was quite different when my son told me a couple of days after coming out to him that he thought my voice didn't sound like a women's....I agreed but told him it had changed just over a longer time so he wasn't as aware. I then proceeded to talk in my former voice...I coughed a little and took a big gulp....what happened next shocked the hell out of him and I...it had changed dramatically!!
Today I still don't think my voice is great but it does sound like most other females....but mostly what has changed is how I talk...much more girly but not in a way that I am trying...
I do notice that when I hear myself on a video I sound exactly like my mother!! Its eerie how similar I sound to her!
Quote from: Rena on March 05, 2014, 09:37:16 PM
I was really excited about transitioning and I thought I could pass as a femjale 100% but there's only one thing holding me back. It's my voice. I have an extremely deep voice in the bass range.
My face is perfectly feminine, my body is feminine and I could make them both 100% feminine and sexy with hrt + some conservative surgery. It's just that's there's nothing that can be done to make my voice in a female range. The best I could probably achieve is sounding like a gay guy.
I knew a MtF who worked in Cambridge, MA. Granted she had maybe TOO much work done on her face (cheeks and lips too big), and her voice sounded like a gay guy's, but.....wow, she was a head-turner for sure. It was obvious she was MtF just by listening to her, but nobody cared.
Voice training may be difficult but if you check youtube and have a look at the other mtf girls, it really does give you a confidence boost.
Have a look at Isley :) Definitely gives you a boost in confidence :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mL4xUdy3yE4
Quote from: Natallie553 on March 05, 2014, 10:46:24 PM
My voice is fairly deep as well. I'm hoping to achieve the sexy deep voice from UK girls and I'm from kansas. lol
Cant wait for you to post some pics of yourself! Welcome to the forums! :D
Any examples of the sexy deep voices of UK women? :P
Quote from: castle of glass on March 07, 2014, 10:56:05 AM
Any examples of the sexy deep voices of UK women? :P
I cant remember her name right now, but the British woman on "The Real Housewives of New Jersey" fits the bill.
I have a deep voice with a strong Lancashire accent.Very rarely has anyone said I have a sexy voice!
Quote from: Jamie D on March 06, 2014, 12:43:41 AM
Rena, take a look at the numerous topics concerning Yeson voice surgery in South Korea. On the voice therapy board.
I have but the before and after videos I've watched the girls voices were a somewhat high tenor before the surgery. It actually strains and I dare say almost hurts my voice to do a medium tenor right now.
Quote from: Nicolette on March 06, 2014, 03:47:47 PM
I can't tell you the number of times I got told how much they loved my accent (even sexy!) when I was in Montreal last year. But I don't think it was because it's deep, which it isn't much, lol.
OP, if all you've got to worry about is voice, what are you waiting for?! Voice is something that can be modified. A masculine frame is difficult or impossible to modify, but as you say, you're already feminine.
I'm waiting to lose all the bulky muscle on my feminine frame :)
Quote from: Just Shelly on March 06, 2014, 05:35:57 PM
I never had a very deep voice to begin with but it still was one that sounded manly. My voice was one aspect I dreaded about my transition...I first felt very weirded out wanting or needing too do this, I knew this transition was for real when I started to work on it. I then had the thoughts of having to fake my voice for the rest of my life, and not wanting to do that!
I worked on it gradually and very little, I thought I didn't change it much, until I was getting mam'ed on the phone almost always. Even if I didn't get mam'ed, people calling me would ask if "he" was available. I still thought my voice sucked even though I was passing with it. I realized it was quite different when my son told me a couple of days after coming out to him that he thought my voice didn't sound like a women's....I agreed but told him it had changed just over a longer time so he wasn't as aware. I then proceeded to talk in my former voice...I coughed a little and took a big gulp....what happened next shocked the hell out of him and I...it had changed dramatically!!
Today I still don't think my voice is great but it does sound like most other females....but mostly what has changed is how I talk...much more girly but not in a way that I am trying...
I do notice that when I hear myself on a video I sound exactly like my mother!! Its eerie how similar I sound to her!
So does purposely not using a lower range weaken the vocal cords so that your new normal is higher?
Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on March 11, 2014, 08:14:38 AM
Estrogen itself softens Your voice a bit - I certainly do not sound the way I used to - unless I make specific effort and go into deep assertive chest-voice mode. If I pay specific attention then my voice becomes somewhat neutral/andro and I have done very little in terms of training (mostly singing scales, songs and intentionally isolating the lower part of my voice box).
this is how it seems is happening to me. it's like my voice is more flexible , but a lot of posters say HRT does absolutely nothing so I don't know. To me it does help even though there's places on line that says it doesn't.
WPATH talks about things that HRT will do for almost all women versus things you should not count on. Change in voice is one that the WPATCH SOC doesn't support because most trans women don't see that.
However, having said that and my therapist dealing with lots of trans clients, she has stated that she's seen lots of her clients (not a majority but "lots" meaning more than a few) have changes in voice from HRT before they began practicing voice.
My own case appears to be getting more complicated as time passes. I have one vocal cord fully paralyzed that only functions because of complete vocal cord medialization of that cord via an implant (back in 1996). The goal at that time was to match my normal male voice, which was in the upper end of the male range (130-150 Hz).
HRT has been altering my voice with some odd results. Some days it's easier to speak in a more falsetto voice than anything else and that's without trying. I can get a more normal female voice, not so falsetto but still male resonance suppressed if I try, but how hard I have to try varies. My voice currently surprises me almost every day. On days that I have to go into the office, I actually work on my voice in the car to sound at least somewhat male. :P
Everyone's struggle with voice is unique. My medical issues are one reason I am considering Yeson. I've already been informed by Yeson that they can deal with a patient who has undergone full vocal cord medialization of one cord. I just have other issues to address before I get to that point. And in the meanwhile, my female friends assure me my voice is "good enough", especially for an older woman.
Quote from: FilaFord on March 06, 2014, 12:08:18 AM
Tori, I love reading your posts. You inspire me, although right now I fear it is not enough. I'm so depressed lately because I think I am making a mistake. When I think about the future all I can see is me being miserable and my son being ashamed of me. My therapist tried to comfort me and tell me that he is so young (4 next month) that he will be the most understanding person that I know, but I just can't make myself see it. I think I am ashamed of myself and I KNOW I shouldn't be...
I thought the hormones were supposed to make me feel more at peace with this but it seems they are making me stress out more than before.
Your son will actually be the most understanding especially when you tell him at a young age where he will understand. My gf has three kids, ages 9 and 11, when they met me they thought I was a guy with a penis, but we decided to tell them the truth, that Ryan was born with a certain part, but hes a guy, they were just like ok, so your a dude in a girls body, can you have plastic surgery to fix that? lol I just tried to be as honest as I could with them, I think the older the harder it is, but your son will actually get it, better than adults lol