Kia Ora,
Or is a little conflict every now and again just "The nature of the beast" ?
When it comes to Susan's Place, it would seem she has got her work cut out for her, trying to please/support all members and their different tastes/preferences...
Considering the roller coaster emotional ride that many member's here are on....I think Susan's doing a good job...
Abe Lincoln "You can please some of the people some of the time but not all of the people all of the time !"
And that's a good thing to keep in mind....
Metta Anatta :)
You will find conflict on many sites. They don't need to revolve around gender to generate conflicts.
Because we are quite the heterogeneous sample of humanity, we are never going to agree on everything.
There are some things I think should be OK to openly disagree about. Vanilla vs. chocolate, tacos vs. burritos, winter or summer, rock or jazz. These are small things that are a matter of personal taste and debating things like this are insignificant to our being at the end of the day.
Because we come from different times, cultures, genders, religions and political affiliations, care must be taken not to bash on each other merely for being different. These differences must be respected. Some of us seem to enjoy stirring things up, and that bothers me.
Anyway, you will never convince me the Easter Bunny exists, so please don't bother wasting my time with that.
I've been on a variety of sites for a variety of reasons. They've all had conflict. This is the first trans site I've ever been on. I've been reading a lot and was thinking that you can tell a lot about a site/group by how they deal with conflict. I've seen no true bashing. I haven't seen a lot of drama. I've seen strong opinions and disagreements. I haven't seen any "joking" that is really a veil for bullying and meanness. I've seen people really listening to what others said. Now I am new, and so I'm sure there are things I am missing but honestly I am amazed at how well you all do.
Quote from: Jill F on March 20, 2014, 10:03:48 PM
Because we are quite the heterogeneous sample of humanity, we are never going to agree on everything.
tacos vs. burritos
So what side are YOU on?
You BETTER say burrito. >:(
Quote from: Laura Squirrel on March 20, 2014, 10:14:58 PM
So what side are YOU on?
You BETTER say burrito. >:(
You mean on my dinner plate or between mah legs?
Quote from: Jill F on March 20, 2014, 10:57:48 PM
You mean on my dinner plate or between mah legs?
:D Ummm...what?
All support sites have conflict. For one, because when different people gather, there will be conflict sometimes. For two, stress makes people more susceptible to conflict. For three, the anonymity of the internet makes people feel freer to say things they might not in person.
Quote from: Edge on March 20, 2014, 11:04:12 PM
All sites have conflict. Because when different people gather, there will be conflict. The anonymity of the internet makes people feel freer to say things they might not in person.
There. Now you have described the entire internet.
Can any collection of people be free of conflict? I don't know. Conflict seems to be part of human nature, because we're individuals, with our own experiences, values and perceptions. We shape our own world and often that isn't the same as someone else's.
Not to mention that if everyone thought, felt and acted the same, the world would be a very boring place. And written by George Orwell, lol.
One person's support isn't another person's support. People have different needs. But I think we have a pretty good framework here for handling conflicts, and keeping them to a minimum.
I've never charged a cent for the conflict I produce!! >:-) Does that mean I provide free conflict??
I have seen people on forums argue about provable facts, this was in technology, which is much more clear cut than gender.
Well, a lot of people come here during transition (or before or questioning, etc). People in crisis are emotional. And by nature, gender issues, transition, and all that are extremely emotional. Add in people going through huge hormonal upheavals and... :o
Also, discrimination makes people emotional. I see a lot of 'paper bag' like stuff in the trans community. There is always conflict inside minority groups. The pressure from outside makes them lash out at one another and create hierarchies.
Kia Ora,
Thanks for the interesting replies so far...It would seem that none of us want conflict, ie, want to push another's button or have our button pushed so.....................
Now for the crunch question...
The mods do a good job in resolving conflict amongst warring parties, but as a member, how do you personally resolve conflict "without" having to get the mods involved ?
Theories are good and very important, but putting theory into practice is more often than not another story-theories/plans can go out the window when emotions are running high...
Take deep breaths counting to ten one of the most trusted emotional control techniques developed by man, but sadly rarely implemented -often overlooked...
Metta Anatta :)
Quote from: Sephirah on March 20, 2014, 11:19:06 PM
Can any collection of people be free of conflict? I don't know. Conflict seems to be part of human nature, because we're individuals, with our own experiences, values and perceptions. We shape our own world and often that isn't the same as someone else's.
Not to mention that if everyone thought, felt and acted the same, the world would be a very boring place. And written by George Orwell, lol.
One person's support isn't another person's support. People have different needs. But I think we have a pretty good framework here for handling conflicts, and keeping them to a minimum.
I don't even think you have to go as far as a collection of people. Even in a "group" of 2 people there will be conflict.
Quote from: Caysee Danielle on March 21, 2014, 01:29:48 AM
I don't even think you have to go as far as a collection of people. Even in a "group" of 2 people there will be conflict.
Kia Ora,
We face conflicting thoughts and emotions on a daily bases... so a group of "one" spells conflict...
Metta Anatta :)
One thing to remember is that a certain percentage of any population will be high on the psychopathic/sociopathic scale and low on empathy. In the general population around 3%. Internet trolls usually fit this profile, and will be willing to go to great lengths to masquerade in order to get the addictive fix that social and psychological sadistic activities bring them. And you can expect, in addition to non-trans psychopaths who are drawn to support sites because there are vulnerable victims to prey on, that at least 3% of preop, nonop, and postop trans people will be psychopaths as well as genuinely trans.
Beyond the psychopaths, there is a larger group who don't derive satisfaction from causing harm, but are simply very low in empathy skills and so are prone to both misreading others' intent, and also prone to saying incredibly insensitive things because they don't understand people who don't feel the same way they do. Some studies and anecdotal evidence suggest that trans individuals are more likely to have empathy deficits than the general population because various brain differences tend to coincide. I would posit that at least 10% of trans folks fit on the low empathy spectrum. They can learn to follow rules but need supervision and feedback because they can't model others' responses easily.
Finally there is an even larger population of trans folks who have lived socially isolated lives because of dysphoria and because of trauma. They have the empathy but lack healthy social experiences so can be rude and hurtful without meaning to be. Unfortunately many of us had very unhealthy relationships growing up, and repeat negative patterns in our adult relationships until we get enough therapy (group or individual, and in a lot of ways Susan's can be like group therapy) and meditation, and feedback from friends, to finally heal and change.
As I said before on a recent high-conflict thread, it seems appropriate that people show more tact here than on many other sites since this is a support site. That might even mean just choosing to stop discussing certain subjects when they get really heated, particularly if those subjects have nothing to do with being trans. There are things like ->-bleeped-<- or other forums where people can go to continue heated debates about such things. I'd be glad to share a couple of the ones I go to that are openly available for endless debates and squabbling. :)
Keeping this short
NOPE
I agree with 'nope'.
But not because of the 'trans' or the 'support' but because more than 1 person is involved. At that, I can be pretty conflicted all by myself, so even groups of 1 aren't conflict free.
And, at times, conflict -- at least in terms of people disagreeing -- is a good thing. We're all different. So something that worked great for one person might be horrible for another. It's out of the pile of disagreeing opinions that we can find the one that works best for us.
Another mild complication I encounter and often makes me have to stop what I am about to write is that there may be three words that are all defined the same way in my dictionary, but use one, I make a friend, use another, I make an enemy, use the third and I make a trip to the psych ward at public expense. On another site, I have a person whom I almost completely agree with, but wading through her word choices to be sure of our agreement is frustrating, which is a form of inner conflict. The person does have a social anxiety issue which does not make life any easier.
Quote from: cisdad on March 21, 2014, 11:40:59 AM
But not because of the 'trans' or the 'support' but because more than 1 person is involved.
That made me LOL. Since the Internet began, there has been heated arguing. I'm optimistic. I think we're actually all getting smarter faster by the more rapid and free exchange of ideas made possible by the Internet. That said, growth can be a painful process and we should all expect a bumpy ride on the way to enlightenment.
Fasten your seat belts!
Quote from: Anatta on March 21, 2014, 01:07:13 AM
Kia Ora,
Now for the crunch question...
The mods do a good job in resolving conflict amongst warring parties, but as a member, how do you personally resolve conflict "without" having to get the mods involved ?
Metta Anatta :)
I try not to allow myself to become emotionally involved when I can clearly identify someone who is intentionally trying to jerk my chain. It's better to take a back seat to someone who is unreasonable or who seems to be having cognitive problems. I don't discount the fact that we are living in the "Me" generation world now, where a lot of folks feel they are standing in the center of the universe and the rest of us are simply orbiting around them. That feeling is not at all uncommon for people on transitional HRT and can simply be just another phase that some go through. Sometimes civility flies out the window and it's time to take a break when that happens. All just part of the human condition I suppose!
A couple of thousands of people on hormones together.. hmmmm :angel: *ducks*
People are different and combine that with being able to hide behind a screen (I, at least, do get a lot tougher than I am IRL) and create sensitive topics and tadaa. I don't mind a smoking discussion as long as people don't pull low blows to make a point out of themselves really.
YOU WANT CONFLICT?! I'LL FIGHT YOU RIGHT NOW!!
123 Fake Street!!
BRING IT!!
:D
I'm no different online than I am offline. If I am in agreement with someone, I say it. If I disagree with someone, I say it.
I might go off on loser trolls if I am in a bit of a mood or they just won't shut up, but most of the time I just ignore them because they are losers and they aren't worth it.
Kia Ora,
Look to"COMPROMISE" and if that doesn't work "COMPROMISE" some more...."COMPROMISE" being the name of the game of life...
To settle a dispute by compromising does not make one weak...It makes one wise....
Metta Anatta :)