Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Hi everyone!

I am sort of new and I am trying to get myself to become a member of the site so I can exchange ideas and connect with more ladies who have had FFS or are going to, I'm from Manchester, UK, and after researching for several months (almost a year) and doing some money saving, I am getting more and more interested in Dr. Bart, price wise, results, feedback from the girls that have gone to him, it all seems to add up, not to mention a very informative site he has, any who, I am mostly interested in the forehead re shaping, but I wanna know Dr Bart's opinion when I go for a consultation in London. Any ladies with useful information on him and his prices? Any girls who are thinking of going for surgery with him later this year or have been to a consultation and excited about him and his work? I would love to get some contacts and have people to be in touch with so we can help each other through this journey and hear what ladies whom have gone through this experience have to say. My boyfriend and I aren't rich but I will be giving up the idea of a brand new little car for myself to get ffs . I really can see how it's benefited many girls and ladies and I believe it would benefit me too. :) please share your thoughts and say hi, hugs, Carly xox

Hi Carly,

I, like you, am considering Dr. Bart for FFS, but I have some concerns. I have not had a consultation with him yet, but am gearing up for it. I have a couple of other posts (look down on the FFS page) discussing this. What procedures are you considering?

Michelle

Quote from: Michelle33 on April 12, 2014, 12:37:06 PM
Hi Carly,

I, like you, am considering Dr. Bart for FFS, but I have some concerns. I have not had a consultation with him yet, but am gearing up for it. I have a couple of other posts (look down on the FFS page) discussing this. What procedures are you considering?

Michelle

I'm considering the works, but mainly forehead and chin, I don't think the jaw is as much of an issue but I do have a cleft chin. 

I'll look your posts up :)

What is it you're concerned about?

Hi Carly,

I have a trachea shave booked with Dr Bart in May and that cost 3000 euros. I chose him after reading the good feedback on the forums. I went to a consultation in London and found him to be very nice. I also found his team to be very responsive with questions and the whole process from consultation to booking an appointment to be pain free - hope the trachea shave is as well! FFS is something I may consider after I start hormone therapy so I can't really help you there.

Alena x

Quote from: alenauk on April 13, 2014, 03:40:50 AM
Hi Carly,

I have a trachea shave booked with Dr Bart in May and that cost 3000 euros. I chose him after reading the good feedback on the forums. I went to a consultation in London and found him to be very nice. I also found his team to be very responsive with questions and the whole process from consultation to booking an appointment to be pain free - hope the trachea shave is as well! FFS is something I may consider after I start hormone therapy so I can't really help you there.

Alena x

Hi Alena!

That's great, everyone seems pleasantly impressed with Dr Bart and his staff! And I think that friendly customer service is important to me but def more so the results, I will tentatively be going for my consultation for ffs in May or the date in June . Update and let us know how your trachea shave goes :) best wishes x

sure, you look great in your avatar, are you sure you need ffs ;)

Quote from: alenauk on April 13, 2014, 06:54:21 AM
sure, you look great in your avatar, are you sure you need ffs ;)

Awe thanks Hun!

Well my boyfriend made the same comment when I first mentioned my interest in ffs, but I got him on board now, it's the forehead I need doing. Not as much anything else but I would like it all done for an extra soft appearance, I am a whopping 6 feet tall after all. And although I have a very round fatty face, that tends to go with age so I read, leaving behind a more obvious bone structure. So it's also for future peace of mind when I get to be a nice and not so little, old lady lol :)

I'm 5"11, so I'm not far off 6 feet! My forehead is something I'll probably need work on, but I'll look into that after I have been on HRT for a while. Dr Bart did have a look at my face and suggested that as well. My mums face has actually gotten fatter with age, just hope I don't end up like her!

Well, you will definitely see huge differences with HRT, particularly on the second year. The first year is the androgynous year and it gives u a chance to grow your hair out if you haven't yet
, and other stuff, the second year, that's when u go from androgynous to female. Maybe you're right about the face thing. Mine seems to get more and more round but it may be that I have been too free with junk food haha. Still though, many women on here insist you lose fat deposits as you age and the bone structure becomes more obvious with age... The money is an issue with me, my bf and I are working hard trying to save, we're about half way there now, I keep seeing very different numbers when it comes to FFS prices with Dr. Bart though. I think I probably won't need trachea shave or cheek implants and probably minor work to the nose but I really want the forehead and chin done...

So anxious to make this happen lol :)

I know the feeling, I'm so anxious about the whole process. Can't wait for my next electrolysis even though I know its going to hurt! I'm 38, but I can still get away with saying I'm 28 for the moment, so I hope the HRT can still have a good affect on me. Your hair looks really nice as well, I hope I can get mine to that length and that volume! I think Dr Barts price varies according to the procedures performed, so it's probably cheaper to get a bunch of work done as opposed to having them done individually as in my case with the trachea shave. You also get a slight discount if he can use your before and after shots on his website.

Let us know when you start on HRT hun, are you just waiting for the GIC to finally give you the green light to get it? X

I'm hoping to start early June. I went the private route and was given the green light last week. There's a month wait after the okay is given for blood tests and paperwork and I have a holiday to Egypt to take which will delay things a bit further. Would rather start hormones than have a holiday but have to keep my girlfriend happy!

Alena x

Sounds like you have a busy few months ahead! If you look young now then wait for HRT it makes u look even younger! I wanna stay in touch to know about your experiences with Dr. Bart so I sent u a buddy request. Where are you staying when u head over? X

Hi i had FFS done in macclesfield, by Mr musgrove, worked out really well.

Quote from: calicarly on April 12, 2014, 11:10:02 AM
I'm from Manchester, UK, and after researching for several months (almost a year) and doing some money saving, I am getting more and more interested in Dr. Bart,

Well, if you are in Manchester and not in a rush, "Facial Team" are presenting at Sparkle on July 14th/15th and will do consultations at the LGF in Richmond Street.

http://www.sparkle.org.uk/index.php/the-weekend/talks-and-workshops/item/download/10_60c11e1952d0bfc5531fc50d5facef12

Quote from: jebee on April 14, 2014, 07:01:46 AM
Hi i had FFS done in macclesfield, by Mr musgrove, worked out really well.

Nice to see one of Mr Musgrove's ffs patients. You look very feminine, pity he refused to show me any before and afters.

Caroline
x

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 14, 2014, 12:11:54 PM
Nice to see one of Mr Musgrove's ffs patients. You look very feminine, pity he refused to show me any before and afters.

Caroline
x

strange he showed me lots of them, was nice to have it done so close to home as well :)

Quote from: calicarly on April 14, 2014, 06:24:21 AM
Sounds like you have a busy few months ahead! If you look young now then wait for HRT it makes u look even younger! I wanna stay in touch to know about your experiences with Dr. Bart so I sent u a buddy request. Where are you staying when u head over? X

Great, can't wait to look 18 again! As it's just a trachea shave I'm staying at hotel for 3 nights (£80 per night). If I were doing FFS I'd stay in a B&B or rented apartment for more privacy. I can't imagine myself walking into a hotel lobby covered in bandages and a face mask! There's a list of places you can stay on Dr Barts website. I've added you as a buddy and will keep you updated on how things go  :)

Quote from: jebee on April 14, 2014, 07:01:46 AM
Hi i had FFS done in macclesfield, by Mr musgrove, worked out really well.

I keep hearing a lot about Mr musgrove, what was his prices when u went with him Hun? And what did u have done?

I keep thinking I should at the least have a consultation with him, but I am having to save at as fast a pase as I can to get this done and I hear he can be a few grand more for maybe less procedures...

Quote from: provizora3 on April 14, 2014, 07:40:47 AM
Well, if you are in Manchester and not in a rush, "Facial Team" are presenting at Sparkle on July 14th/15th and will do consultations at the LGF in Richmond Street.

http://www.sparkle.org.uk/index.php/the-weekend/talks-and-workshops/item/download/10_60c11e1952d0bfc5531fc50d5facef12

Thank you for the tip! I'm checking their site out now! Anyone have any idea of their price list? They also seem to do consultations via Skype, I may just have one like that!

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 14, 2014, 12:11:54 PM
Nice to see one of Mr Musgrove's ffs patients. You look very feminine, pity he refused to show me any before and afters.

Caroline
x

Hi Caroline I tried to add you to friends list , I know you're going back to Dr. Bart for some extra work, that in itself says a lot about his job and how comfortable he made you!
X

Quote from: calicarly on April 14, 2014, 10:04:20 PM
I keep hearing a lot about Mr musgrove, what was his prices when u went with him Hun? And what did u have done?

I keep thinking I should at the least have a consultation with him, but I am having to save at as fast a pase as I can to get this done and I hear he can be a few grand more for maybe less procedures...


Thank you for the tip! I'm checking their site out now! Anyone have any idea of their price list? They also seem to do consultations via Skype, I may just have one like that!

Hi Caroline I tried to add you to friends list , I know you're going back to Dr. Bart for some extra work, that in itself says a lot about his job and how comfortable he made you!
X

Thank you Alena!! Xx

Quote from: jebee on April 14, 2014, 12:49:20 PM
strange he showed me lots of them, was nice to have it done so close to home as well :)

That's good to hear. I had asked if I could see before and afters before booking the consultation and was told it would be no problem. My appointment was his last of the day at 5pm. I got there in plenty of time and was 30 minutes early. By 5.30pm the reception staff were starting to end their shift and one got her coat on and left. I asked what had happened to Mr Musgrove as it was now 30 minutes past my appointment and they didn't seem to know where he was as he hadn't contacted them.

He eventually turned up a few minutes before 6pm and had obviously had a bad day. He didn't even apologise for being an hour late. It wasn't so much the delay, it was not knowing if I was going to have to drive the 100 miles home without having seen him.

Anyway I was very pleasant to him but it was clear he wanted to get home. I asked about the before and afters but he said they weren't on his computer and suggested I ring his secretary the next day which I did. She then told me they were all on Mr Musgrove's computer so there was no reason he couldn't have shown them to me. When I asked if she could e-mail me a few, she said she couldn't because of Data Protection. But she offered to book an X-ray appointment for me, adding that I could see the photos then.
Mr Musgrove's quote was a lot more expensive than Dr Bart's which included improving a previous rhinoplasty with another surgeon which had left me with a small bump.

Needless to say, I decided to look elsewhere.

Caroline

Quote from: calicarly on April 14, 2014, 10:04:20 PM
Hi Caroline I tried to add you to friends list , I know you're going back to Dr. Bart for some extra work, that in itself says a lot about his job and how comfortable he made you!
X

Hi,

Nice to see you. You look beautiful and if I saw you in the street I would never know and would have no doubt you were cis gendered. There are plenty of very beautiful 6ft tall girls around these days, so being 6ft is not a problem.

I'll have to get back to you about my consultation wth Dr Bart because we're off out and my husband's just put his head round the door and asked if I'm coming or not.

Sorry, must dash, but I'll tell you later what happened and I'll gladly answer any questions you have.

Caroline
x

Does anyone have any information on Dr. Bart's current pricing?

Hi Michelle,

I'm not sure if he has a fixed price list as the amount and combination of work that each person requires does vary. You can send pictures to him for a proposal or arrange a consultation.

Alena x

Alena,

Thanks so much for your response. I'm definitely gearing up to send him my photos and request an online consultation. Thanks again1 :)

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 15, 2014, 04:22:06 AM
Hi,

Nice to see you. You look beautiful and if I saw you in the street I would never know and would have no doubt you were cis gendered. There are plenty of very beautiful 6ft tall girls around these days, so being 6ft is not a problem.

I'll have to get back to you about my consultation wth Dr Bart because we're off out and my husband's just put his head round the door and asked if I'm coming or not.

Sorry, must dash, but I'll tell you later what happened and I'll gladly answer any questions you have.

Caroline
x

Thanks Caroline! You're so sweet!

Lol about your husband waiting for you! My bf's very impatient when waiting for me, but when it comes to me waiting for him, he couldn't be more careless, and I still don't know how a man with a shaved head can require so much grooming!

What do you think made the most striking difference once you had FFS? Also, I know when you last went to see Dr Bart, he was in Ghent and now he's in Antwerp, how did you find navigating around in Belgium the first time? Is it easy enough? I'm not worried about that too much, but I can imagine not getting the accomodation and cabs, etc right , could become a nightmare, Although my bf would be coming with me, I asked him to check on flights to Brussels and they are very economic! So that's good. I still wonder wether I should give seeing mr. Musgrove a try for a consultation, but I don't think it would make any difference, I have read about your experiences with him, and to me, feeling comfortable and seeing someone who is charming and personable is important. I just don't feel good when people behave like they are doing you a favour when they are supossed to be extra nice to you if they want your business , you know what I mean? And then I also think, if he charges £150 for a consult then I'd rather put that towards expenses in Antwerp...

Carly x

Quote from: Michelle33 on April 15, 2014, 11:09:06 AM
Does anyone have any information on Dr. Bart's current pricing?

Hi Michelle!

According to Caroline and Xandra , whom had theirs 2-3 years ago and a year ago  or so respectively, maybe Caroline can correct me, he charged slightly over 11 and a half grand € so we should probably be looking around low 12,000€  To be safe, Plus expenses (accomodation, flights, meals etc) it really does depend on how much work we need doing tho. Also, Caroline is going back for some extra work, I don't know how old you are Michelle but I believe they recommend a face lift after Ffs for ladies after certain age to see best results. It can really cost anywhere from 10 to 15 grand euros depending on how much work u need/ want. I'll post the price list as soon as I have a consultation with him.

Maybe some more ladies who have recently consulted with him can give us some info on that and for what procedures?...

Hugs
Carly x

Quote from: Michelle33 on April 15, 2014, 04:44:47 PM
Alena,

Thanks so much for your response. I'm definitely gearing up to send him my photos and request an online consultation. Thanks again1 :)

At the risk at stating the obvious, Dr Bart will need good quality photos which will be better taken by another person with a decent camera rather than a selfie. If has to be a selfie, then by all means look sideways to make sure you are in frame, but then look straight ahead before taking the picture.

I saw him on Saturday, and the first thing he does with existing patients is take a series of photos. Imagine you are sitting in the middle of a large clock face on the floor with Dr Bart at 12. He will take a full fontal shot of your face. Then you turn to between 10 and 11, shot taken, then to 9, shot taken.

You then turn to between 1 and 2, shot taken and then finally to 3 on the clock face, shot taken. It is also much better if the photos are taken without makeup because, as we all know, blusher can alter the shape of our faces. Also the shots need to be taken without any shadows on your face.

That way Dr Bart will have a much better chance of giving you a true assessment of what will be needed.

From my experience he will be reluctant to do something which he doesn't believe you need. When I went to him in 2011, I told him I wanted cheek implants. He said I didn't need them as my cheekbones were very good. Im glad I listened to him.

Caroline
x

Quote from: calicarly on April 16, 2014, 03:56:54 AM
Hi Michelle!

According to Caroline and Xandra , whom had theirs 2-3 years ago and a year ago  or so respectively, maybe Caroline can correct me, he charged slightly over 11 and a half grand € so we should probably be looking around low 12,000€  To be safe, Plus expenses (accomodation, flights, meals etc) it really does depend on how much work we need doing tho. Also, Caroline is going back for some extra work, I don't know how old you are Michelle but I believe they recommend a face lift after Ffs for ladies after certain age to see best results. It can really cost anywhere from 10 to 15 grand euros depending on how much work u need/ want. I'll post the price list as soon as I have a consultation with him.

Maybe some more ladies who have recently consulted with him can give us some info on that and for what procedures?...

Hugs
Carly x

Hi Carly, Just to correct you on a couple of facts, I had mine done 2 years ago today on April 16, 2012. Xandra has only just joined us on this quest, and may decide to go with Dr Bart.

Here are the details of my costs, but please bear in mind that these were quoted in December 2011, for my operation on April 16, 2012

Rhinoplasty (rasp hump via forehead incision)               €500 *
Frontal bossing reduction, hairline lowering and
browlift (equalise the brows)                   €3.500
Liplift (resection of 9 mm)                     €800
Lip augmentation with periosteum roll from forehead      €400
Jaw side reduction and chin recontouring            €3.000
(leave the jaw angles, chin height reduction of 1 cm)

Special materials for this procedure
Endotines and titanium screws                   €400
Titanium screws and plates                     €150

Cost anesthesia                            €1.375

Hospital costs (including one overnight stay in the hospital)
Total cost material, hospital and anesthesia             €2.000

Total Cost Material
This proposal is valid for 6 months.
Total price (inclusive VAT)          €12.125
Reduced price                €10.900

*This was a special reduction because, as an afterthought I asked Dr Bart what he thought of my nose after a rhinoplasty I had had done by a UK surgeon in the 1980s. He agreed there was a noticeable bump, and offered to do it for a specially reduced price as I was having quite a lot done.

Dr Bart also offers a refund of part of the cost if you agree for your post-op photos to go on his website. I declined the offer because I value my privacy.

Caroline
x

Quote from: calicarly on April 16, 2014, 03:56:54 AM

Maybe some more ladies who have recently consulted with him can give us some info on that and for what procedures?...

As you know, I saw Dr Bart on Saturday and he was looking as handsome as ever........................... sorry, back in the room!

Due to my advancing years following my FFS   :'( , I knew I was going to need a facelift, so that's what we were discussing on Saturday.

Here is his quote for me, however it's important to note that these figures will not necessarily be the same for everyone. Some of us need more work than others.


Facelift (MACS technique) and necklift €6.000
Upper eyelid surgery €1.000
Lower eyelid surgery + tarsal strip + canthopexy €1.200
Cost anesthesia  €1.200
Hospital costs (including one overnight stay in the hospital) €1.655
Total cost material, hospital and anesthesia (inclusive of VAT) €11.055
Reduced Price €9.500

Hope this helps.

In my opinion, I think Dr Bart's quotations are very good, certainly less than the UK surgeons, even when you add in flights and accommodation it's very competitive and the results arefantastic - you gals in Belgium get a real bargain.

Get it while you're young if you can because the healing time is often a lot longer for older trans women.

Incidentally, the Macslift cost has increased by €2.000 since 2011 because, as I understand it, the area is undermined more extensively to give a much better result.


Kisses
Caroline
x

Thanks all of you! This is very informative. :) I am definitely taking notes on all of this.

Caroline: how did you like your results?

Carly: I am in my early 40s, but I seem to have good elasticity (I hope). I've taken great care of my skin (sunscreen, topicals, antioxidants) but I'm beginning to see the signs of aging nevertheless. My skin tone is a little more lax than it used to be. I wonder if Dr. Bart will address that. If so, I'd prefer to do any lifting in a separate procedure, just so that he (if I go with him; I'm also seriously considering DiMaggio) can focus solely on the bone work.

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 16, 2014, 06:44:00 AM
At the risk at stating the obvious, Dr Bart will need good quality photos which will be better taken by another person with a decent camera rather than a selfie. If has to be a selfie, then by all means look sideways to make sure you are in frame, but then look straight ahead before taking the picture.

I saw him on Saturday, and the first thing he does with existing patients is take a series of photos. Imagine you are sitting in the middle of a large clock face on the floor with Dr Bart at 12. He will take a full fontal shot of your face. Then you turn to between 10 and 11, shot taken, then to 9, shot taken.

You then turn to between 1 and 2, shot taken and then finally to 3 on the clock face, shot taken. It is also much better if the photos are taken without makeup because, as we all know, blusher can alter the shape of our faces. Also the shots need to be taken without any shadows on your face.

That way Dr Bart will have a much better chance of giving you a true assessment of what will be needed.

From my experience he will be reluctant to do something which he doesn't believe you need. When I went to him in 2011, I told him I wanted cheek implants. He said I didn't need them as my cheekbones were very good. Im glad I listened to him.

Caroline
x

I agree with Caroline, a consultation in person is always best. When I was there he had a good look at my face and felt out the bones, fat, etc. before offering his advice. He also pointed out that my chin was very slightly non-symmetrical which is something I've never noticed, so he does have a good eye for things!

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 16, 2014, 08:17:01 AM
Hi Carly, Just to correct you on a couple of facts, I had mine done 2 years ago today on April 16, 2012. Xandra has only just joined us on this quest, and may decide to go with Dr Bart.

Here are the details of my costs, but please bear in mind that these were quoted in December 2011, for my operation on April 16, 2012

Rhinoplasty (rasp hump via forehead incision)               €500 *
Frontal bossing reduction, hairline lowering and
browlift (equalise the brows)                   €3.500
Liplift (resection of 9 mm)                     €800
Lip augmentation with periosteum roll from forehead      €400
Jaw side reduction and chin recontouring            €3.000
(leave the jaw angles, chin height reduction of 1 cm)

Special materials for this procedure
Endotines and titanium screws                   €400
Titanium screws and plates                     €150

Cost anesthesia                            €1.375

Hospital costs (including one overnight stay in the hospital)
Total cost material, hospital and anesthesia             €2.000

Total Cost Material
This proposal is valid for 6 months.
Total price (inclusive VAT)          €12.125
Reduced price                €10.900

*This was a special reduction because, as an afterthought I asked Dr Bart what he thought of my nose after a rhinoplasty I had had done by a UK surgeon in the 1980s. He agreed there was a noticeable bump, and offered to do it for a specially reduced price as I was having quite a lot done.

Dr Bart also offers a refund of part of the cost if you agree for your post-op photos to go on his website. I declined the offer because I value my privacy.

Caroline
x

Caroline, thanks for sharing all that info with us!

I myself considered an online consultation ladies but, I just think I really need to meet him in person so I know that I'm comfortable with him, and as Caroline says to get an accurate assessment of what needs doing, and i think it shows that I am serious about this too. Although if I was any further away from London or in a different country where he doesn't do consultations, then I would probably just have to do it online. Mind, with prices for flights as they are it would probably be cheaper for me to have the consultation in Belgium lol, but I think my bf and I will just make a little road trip out of this.

Quote from: Michelle33 on April 16, 2014, 10:23:57 AM
Thanks all of you! This is very informative. :) I am definitely taking notes on all of this.

Caroline: how did you like your results?

Carly: I am in my early 40s, but I seem to have good elasticity (I hope). I've taken great care of my skin (sunscreen, topicals, antioxidants) but I'm beginning to see the signs of aging nevertheless. My skin tone is a little more lax than it used to be. I wonder if Dr. Bart will address that. If so, I'd prefer to do any lifting in a separate procedure, just so that he (if I go with him; I'm also seriously considering DiMaggio) can focus solely on the bone work.

Yes Michelle, sounds like you're at an age when it's uncertain wether you need it or not. It will all be down to what Dr. Bart thinks, if you are and have been a non-smoker all your life and have taken care of your skin you may not need it, or only down the line... I think that's what I would do too if I needed a lift, I would go back a year or 2 later like Caroline for that work, it just makes sense.

I gotta say ladies, I had a nightmare situation with a nose job I had beginning of last year, the Dr left a needle in me and I was left with an awful nose for 6 months before they could fix it, and even then, the damage is still visible somewhat. So I've had 3 surgeries to my nose! he also didn't do a great  boob job (it was a double procedure) so, hence me wanting so much info and to be as comfortable as possible with whomever does my ffs. Not scared of the operation, I'm scared of any complications or need for revisions, it sounds to me as if Dr Bart has a low incidence of having to do revisions, does anyone know his policies on revisions? Of course i will be asking when I see him anyway.

Hugs

Carly xx

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 16, 2014, 08:17:01 AM
Hi Carly, Just to correct you on a couple of facts, I had mine done 2 years ago today on April 16, 2012. Xandra has only just joined us on this quest, and may decide to go with Dr Bart.

Here are the details of my costs, but please bear in mind that these were quoted in December 2011, for my operation on April 16, 2012

Rhinoplasty (rasp hump via forehead incision)               €500 *
Frontal bossing reduction, hairline lowering and
browlift (equalise the brows)                   €3.500
Liplift (resection of 9 mm)                     €800
Lip augmentation with periosteum roll from forehead      €400
Jaw side reduction and chin recontouring            €3.000
(leave the jaw angles, chin height reduction of 1 cm)

Special materials for this procedure
Endotines and titanium screws                   €400
Titanium screws and plates                     €150

Cost anesthesia                            €1.375

Hospital costs (including one overnight stay in the hospital)
Total cost material, hospital and anesthesia             €2.000

Total Cost Material
This proposal is valid for 6 months.
Total price (inclusive VAT)          €12.125
Reduced price                €10.900

*This was a special reduction because, as an afterthought I asked Dr Bart what he thought of my nose after a rhinoplasty I had had done by a UK surgeon in the 1980s. He agreed there was a noticeable bump, and offered to do it for a specially reduced price as I was having quite a lot done.

Dr Bart also offers a refund of part of the cost if you agree for your post-op photos to go on his website. I declined the offer because I value my privacy.

Caroline
x

Caroline,

What was the "jaw side reduction"? Was this a procedure to burr down the sides (lateral edge) of the jawline? I'm very interested in reducing my jaw height. But when reading up on procedures it seems most surgeons only talk about the rear mandibular angle and chin and say nothing about the jawline itself.

Quote from: Michelle33 on April 16, 2014, 10:23:57 AM
Caroline: how did you like your results?

Hi Michelle,

It's really strange, because once the bruising has faded and the swelling has subsided, you start to see a new you emerging. OK, so I admit I had a peek thanks to concealer which covered the bruising and had seen what the possible end results would be like. My bruising took over two months to completely disappear, and I was starting to feel a lot more confident.

With younger girls it can take just a couple of weeks or even days for the bruising to disappear.

It does keep on improving though. Dr Bart has kept a photo record of my progress and has taken photos every time I have seen him. So, on Saturday he took more photos and brought the front facial photo up on his computer alongside the one he took in February 2013.

I remember last February thinking it looked better than the one taken during the first post-op consultation in August 2012. This time Saturday's photo looked even better. So I was very pleased. It's not about looking stunning, especially for older trans women, but regaining femininity which had started to fade.

I had successfully lived without being read and was frightened that might change. The ffs has given me back a huge amount of confidence and I hold my head up high now. I've got fine naturally blonde hair and I used to cringe when the wind blew it around. I hadn't lost any hair, it was just that I was born with a higher hairline than I was happy with. Apparently nobody noticed this apart from me. I can be so vain!

So when Dr Bart lowered my hairline by 1cm it made all the difference. My husband and I were out and about one day and it was quite windy and he said: "I've noticed you don't seem to worry about your hair getting blown around any more." It's not the first time he has said this since my ffs but on that day I was in a particularly happy mood which made him notice it more.

Quote from: Michelle33 on April 17, 2014, 09:25:06 AM
Caroline,

What was the "jaw side reduction"? Was this a procedure to burr down the sides (lateral edge) of the jawline? I'm very interested in reducing my jaw height. But when reading up on procedures it seems most surgeons only talk about the rear mandibular angle and chin and say nothing about the jawline itself.

I think they mean the same thing.  If you stretch out your middle finger and thumb of your right hand and put your thumb on your right jawline about two inches from your ear and place your middle finger on your left jawline again about two inches from your ear, that's the area we're  talking about (hopefully someone will correct me if I'm wrong). I recall Dr Bart saying that it needed reducing as it was just a little noticeable. It's certainly much better now and looks much more feminine.

I am so very pleased with how look now. I'm lucky as I achieved a very feminine voice during my early transition and now I feel I now look feminine again, so all I need is to have a MacsLift and I will see the real benefit of the ffs surgery.

Love

Caroline
x

Quote from: calicarly on April 16, 2014, 03:45:28 AM
Thanks Caroline! You're so sweet!

Lol about your husband waiting for you! My bf's very impatient when waiting for me, but when it comes to me waiting for him, he couldn't be more careless, and I still don't know how a man with a shaved head can require so much grooming!

What do you think made the most striking difference once you had FFS? Also, I know when you last went to see Dr Bart, he was in Ghent and now he's in Antwerp, how did you find navigating around in Belgium the first time? Is it easy enough? I'm not worried about that too much, but I can imagine not getting the accommodation and cabs, etc right , could become a nightmare, Although my bf would be coming with me, I asked him to check on flights to Brussels and they are very economic! So that's good. I still wonder wether I should give seeing mr. Musgrove a try for a consultation, but I don't think it would make any difference, I have read about your experiences with him, and to me, feeling comfortable and seeing someone who is charming and personable is important. I just don't feel good when people behave like they are doing you a favour when they are supposed to be extra nice to you if they want your business , you know what I mean? And then I also think, if he charges £150 for a consult then I'd rather put that towards expenses in Antwerp...

Carly x

Just love the line about your boyfriend's shaved head. Hilarious.

It's difficult to say what made the most striking difference. Probably my lips are now my most noticeable feature. My hairline is my most naturally feminine feature, but I honestly can't say any one thing on its own is my most striking feature.

Regarding Belgium and Ghent. Going anywhere for the first time is a long learning curve. However, we found asking directions was simple as most Belgians speak very good English.

Getting to Ghent rail station was easy enough from Brussels. We were lucky that the first on the rank at Ghent station was a driver who was very accustomed to taking Bart's Ghent girls to the various accommodation listed on his website.

In fact, the taxi firm was recommended on his website. They knew where the clinic was and all spoke very good English. The taxi drivers also knew how to get to EMC2 hospital, but we didn't need to use them for that due to the fact that Dr Bart's delayed holiday flight home led to me having to have my pre-op consultation on the morning of the op.

Dr Bart then drove me and my husband to the hospital which was quite some distance away. On the way there he took a phone call during which I heard my name mentioned. I asked him what it was about and he said the hospital had rang to tell him I had not arrived there. He had to explain he was bringing me.

We arrived and minutes later he was all scrubbed up, masked and ready for action. It was a very weird experience but fun, too.

One of the nurses told me post-op. "We were very worried you weren't going to get here so we rang Dr Bart. He had forgotten to tell us he was bringing you. He's a very naughty man, " she said with a smile.

I imagine Antwerp will be be easy enough to get around. I'm probably going to use airbnb.com for finding suitable accommodation. Here's a link https://www.airbnb.co.uk/rooms/540831
I'm not recommending this apartment because I haven't been there, it's just an example of what's available.

Then just Google the route from the chosen apartment to the Piccard Hospital and find out which bus or tram will take you there, or catch a cab. Don't forget to keep a note of the Piccard Hospital's address because it is fairly new and some cabbies might not know it yet.

After the op I was worried about the reaction of work colleagues but there was no problem just lots of praise for how much better I looked. I didn't tell my children I was going abroad for surgery as I didn't want to worry them.

They live over 130 miles away from where we live so afterwards I told them what I had done over the phone and emailed them photos.

My daughter said she wouldn't have recognised me if I passed her in the street, whereas my son said I didn't look any different!! Go figure. Since then I have visited them several times with my husband, and my daughter is great, she has always talked to me about things as woman to woman, but now we seem even more closer. My son is really cool about it and we get on really well.
 
Incidentally, I just thought of this. The lovely couple who owned the accommodation we stayed at in Ghent were quite used to Dr Bart's girls. They had three apartments which were almost exclusively used by trans women.

Etienne, who was 20 years older than his wife Jeanna and in his 70s, was very active and spent the whole time we were there climbing ladders and drilling things).

His wife, Jeanna said Etienne found it a bit confusing when Dr Bart's patients sometimes arrived there dressed as a guy but insisted on being called by a female name. She said laughing: "He can't quite get his head around that one."

They were lovely and Etienne was very courteous with me. When we left he and Jeanna gave us gifts to remember the stay.

I was looking forward to seeing them both again.

Still, I'm looking forward to Antwerp, it shoudn't be a problem.

Lots of love

Caroline
x

Quote from: calicarly on April 17, 2014, 05:26:12 AM
Yes Michelle, sounds like you're at an age when it's uncertain wether you need it or not. It will all be down to what Dr. Bart thinks, if you are and have been a non-smoker all your life and have taken care of your skin you may not need it, or only down the line... I think that's what I would do too if I needed a lift, I would go back a year or 2 later like Caroline for that work, it just makes sense.

I gotta say ladies, I had a nightmare situation with a nose job I had beginning of last year, the Dr left a needle in me and I was left with an awful nose for 6 months before they could fix it, and even then, the damage is still visible somewhat. So I've had 3 surgeries to my nose! he also didn't do a great  boob job (it was a double procedure) so, hence me wanting so much info and to be as comfortable as possible with whomever does my ffs. Not scared of the operation, I'm scared of any complications or need for revisions, it sounds to me as if Dr Bart has a low incidence of having to do revisions, does anyone know his policies on revisions? Of course i will be asking when I see him anyway.

Hugs

Carly xx

That's shocking Carly and really negligent on that surgeons part! I'm happy everything turned out so well with you Caroline, it gives me more confidence in Dr Bart. Can't wait to get rid of this pesky Adam's apple!

Carly, you are sooo pretty!  Just thought you should know that.  Good luck with your surgery although you hardly need it!

Quote from: calicarly on April 17, 2014, 05:26:12 AM
Not scared of the operation, I'm scared of any complications or need for revisions, it sounds to me as if Dr Bart has a low incidence of having to do revisions, does anyone know his policies on revisions? Of course i will be asking when I see him anyway.

Hugs

Carly xx

Hi Carly,

Here's a link to his Satisfaction Guarantee web page.

http://facialfeminization.eu/practical/satisfaction-guarantee/

Quote from: alenauk on April 17, 2014, 05:15:07 PM
That's shocking Carly and really negligent on that surgeons part! I'm happy everything turned out so well with you Caroline, it gives me more confidence in Dr Bart. Can't wait to get rid of this pesky Adam's apple!

Yes, Alena, it was a tough one, he treated me very bad after the incident too, it's like he saw his mistake in me , not the fact that I needed help, he was so rude. I may start a thread and tell you girls all about it, be very careful! . Now, that's why I take every little bit of feedback on board about surgeons. I may need Dr Bart to have one last go at the nose to hopefully forget all about what happened, maybe just some minor tweaks at least. I will eventually need revision on my breasts too, but again, that's all a different story!

I am sure the Adam's apple gone will be a great breather for you (pun intended!) that would have been the first thing I would have tackled had I had that issue myself too :) x

Quote from: Kylie on April 17, 2014, 11:15:26 PM
Carly, you are sooo pretty!  Just thought you should know that.  Good luck with your surgery although you hardly need it!

Thank you kylie! So much! Funny thing with my American accent every time I tell a British is person my name is Carly they always think I say kylie!! And welcome to the forum!

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 18, 2014, 02:26:11 AM
Hi Carly,

Here's a link to his Satisfaction Guarantee web page.

http://facialfeminization.eu/practical/satisfaction-guarantee/

Perfect. That eases my mind already. My Rob finally said to go ahead and make an appointment for the consultation after Tuesday ( he has an important meeting Tuesday which could affect our ability to get to the consultation) , so looks like it will be either may 10th or the date in June in London at the latest.

And I have to say Caroline, I really enjoy the way you tell your experiences with FFS, you are very eloquent and I can tell that it has made a great deal of difference in your life, in behalf of everyone here thank you for sharing your experiences, they give us great insight!

Funny story about Etienne in Ghent, find it interesting how some FFS patients are still not full time and they head for FFS, it took me a long time of HRT and Other procedures to really consider FFS, but I guess we all have different ways, and I'm sure for many of them it's that extra self confidence that helps them make that leap.

It's kind of fascinating how such a small "group" of people can have such differences in approach. That just shows us that no matter what labels we have for everyone, we are all simply and uniquely humans!

I took notice of all your comments Caroline, thank you for the guidance about Belgium.

Oh I almost forget, on a different note, last night,  I finally got to take out my iPad and show my uncle some before and afters also while he was in town for a visit (he's like my dad), after going for a yummi Indian meal, before I got to show him and just mentioned it, he just kept saying why do you wanna get that done? You're beautiful, etc, basically same situation I went through with Rob my bf, but after I showed him what it was all about, he understood it wasn't about beauty in particular, but about femininity, so he is onboard now, although he insists I don't need it that much. I always like to have his blessing on these things and I feel I do now.

I also joined the yahoo ffs support group. I am waiting to be allowed to join. Anyone been? Is it any good? . I am decided to go see Dr. Bart, but In the meantime I am looking under every rock for info and to share ideas, etc.

Love

Carly x

Quote from: calicarly on April 18, 2014, 04:02:07 AM

And I have to say Caroline, I really enjoy the way you tell your experiences with FFS, you are very eloquent and I can tell that it has made a great deal of difference in your life, in behalf of everyone here thank you for sharing your experiences, they give us great insight!

Thank you so much, Carly,

It was very emotional for me reading your words of thanks. Just glad I can help in some way. I'm afraid I wrote the post which included reference to Etienne very quickly and have since corrected some errors in it and added his wife's name -- Jeanna.

Carly, you asked about striking differences I've noticed since my ffs. I've thought about it a bit more and I guess probably the best one is the brow reduction which has given me a lovely smooth forehead which joins perfectly into the slope of my new nose. I never had a noticeably male forehead but the new female version makes me so happy that I'm glad I decided to have ffs. When I transitioned ffs was unthinkable.

Be careful Carly, don't ruin that beautiful face of yours, some surgeons have their own idea of beauty. Dr Bart is an artist, and I don't mean Picasso.

Stay sweet Carly.

Caroline
x

Thanks Carly!  It is so awesome that everyone shares their experiences to help each other here!  I just hope that I will somehow find the courage one day to take the leap like you all have! It makes me tear up to hear stories of people who have found peace and happiness through transition.  I am so happy for you all.

Hello,

I actually just joined this group today in order to get some more information on FFS and Dr. Bart. Yesterday was my second consultation with him, as I wanted more information on the procedures he proposed. He was very helpful and patient with my questions. He also seemed extremely motivated. Without me asking it he started to show some patients he had worked on and started to explain what he did and why he did it. I noticed that he reminded me a bit of a professor I had, who loved his work and was so eager tell his students. This of course gives confidence. He also proposed to give me a nose moulder so I could try and wear my glasses on it (because I asked about nose job and glasses). So in my opinion Dr. Bart seems really motivated and competent. If you want more information on him you can join his facebook group, Dr Bart FFS group (500+ members). I asked a lot of questions there and got a lot of answers.

Marieke

Quote from: calicarly on April 18, 2014, 04:02:07 AM
Yes, Alena, it was a tough one, he treated me very bad after the incident too, it's like he saw his mistake in me , not the fact that I needed help, he was so rude. I may start a thread and tell you girls all about it, be very careful!
Love

Carly x

That was a terrible thing to have to go through, Carly, but please be aware of the laws of libel regarding a surgeon's professional abilities.

Hugs
Caroline
xx

Quote from: calicarly on April 18, 2014, 04:02:07 AM
Yes, Alena, it was a tough one, he treated me very bad after the incident too, it's like he saw his mistake in me , not the fact that I needed help, he was so rude. I may start a thread and tell you girls all about it, be very careful! . Now, that's why I take every little bit of feedback on board about surgeons. I may need Dr Bart to have one last go at the nose to hopefully forget all about what happened, maybe just some minor tweaks at least. I will eventually need revision on my breasts too, but again, that's all a different story!

I am sure the Adam's apple gone will be a great breather for you (pun intended!) that would have been the first thing I would have tackled had I had that issue myself too :) x

Rude and negligent, that's even more shocking, any decent person would be apologetic! I'm with you when it comes to getting as much info as possible as it is our lives in their hands. Anyways, you're so pretty and you didn't have a Adam's apple to deal with - I'm so jealous!!! Just three weeks to go before the trachea shave - it feels weird that I'm actually looking forward to going to hospital!

Quote from: Kylie on April 18, 2014, 09:50:59 PM
Thanks Carly!  It is so awesome that everyone shares their experiences to help each other here!  I just hope that I will somehow find the courage one day to take the leap like you all have! It makes me tear up to hear stories of people who have found peace and happiness through transition.  I am so happy for you all.

Kylie,

There is courage in all of us darling, be driven by your happiness and motivated by your goals and not held back by fears . Positive thoughts will win over the negativity. What's right for you is what matters, don't be too hard on yourself either. If the desire is strong enough, it WILL happen. Hugs xx

Quote from: Marieke on April 19, 2014, 02:55:06 PM
Hello,

I actually just joined this group today in order to get some more information on FFS and Dr. Bart. Yesterday was my second consultation with him, as I wanted more information on the procedures he proposed. He was very helpful and patient with my questions. He also seemed extremely motivated. Without me asking it he started to show some patients he had worked on and started to explain what he did and why he did it. I noticed that he reminded me a bit of a professor I had, who loved his work and was so eager tell his students. This of course gives confidence. He also proposed to give me a nose moulder so I could try and wear my glasses on it (because I asked about nose job and glasses). So in my opinion Dr. Bart seems really motivated and competent. If you want more information on him you can join his facebook group, Dr Bart FFS group (500+ members). I asked a lot of questions there and got a lot of answers.

Marieke

Hi marieke!

I've joined Dr. Bart's Facebook page! So thanks for that bit of info and glad to hear of another girl with positive views of Dr Bart.

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 20, 2014, 12:13:11 AM
That was a terrible thing to have to go through, Carly, but please be aware of the laws of libel regarding a surgeon's professional abilities.

Hugs
Caroline
xx

Yes Caroline, true. Thanks for the reminder, to be honest with you I don't think I'll tell that story any time soon , it's not really necessary and If I do I won't name names, but regardless of that, and changing the subject, I feel fairly confident about Dr. Bart and I am looking forward to seeing him and hopefully going ahead with it.

Quote from: alenauk on April 20, 2014, 09:03:03 AM
Rude and negligent, that's even more shocking, any decent person would be apologetic! I'm with you when it comes to getting as much info as possible as it is our lives in their hands. Anyways, you're so pretty and you didn't have a Adam's apple to deal with - I'm so jealous!!! Just three weeks to go before the trachea shave - it feels weird that I'm actually looking forward to going to hospital!

Yes Alena! You would think so, but well, such is life! Wow your trachea shave is getting close!!! Exciting!!


Ladies!! My man gave me the green light today to book the consultation in London with Dr. Bart! , and thanks to my lovely uncle whom I went to visit for Easter and his platinum membership points at the Marriott i have a hotel room booked too so my Rob and I are gonna spend the night in London. I am so excited to meet Dr. Bart and intrigued to know what he thinks I need in terms of FFS.

My uncle is a doubly qualified nurse himself so I asked him if he will come to the consultation along with me and my bf, he said he might but that he's of the opinion that professionals should be left to do their job and not questioned by other professionals too much.

Things are moving along little by little and I am getting excited already. Please Dr. Bart, give me a good price so I can afford everything you suggest!!! Lol

That's exciting news Carly!

My consultation was at a hotel close to Canary Wharf. It was easy to get to and close to the DLR station. I just asked the guy at reception who pointed me to Dr Bart's room number. He actually had two rooms - one for waiting and one for the actual consultation with a door separating them. There was a sign on the waiting room door so you know where to go. It was all a breeze and couldn't have been simpler. I hope all it goes well and keep us posted!

you look pretty in your avatar ! :)

I had my forehead implant + brow contouring/shaving (also SRS in one sleep) with Dr.Kamol in Bangkok 7-8 months ago

didnt feel any pain when i woke up .. but a bit uncomfy because all those bandages around my head/face ... for me,i felt no pain at all , the only thing that i felt a bit uncomfy was when the nurse took all the staples out of my head lol .. other than that, all good ..

good luck with your surgery !

Quote from: alenauk on April 22, 2014, 07:01:33 AM
That's exciting news Carly!

My consultation was at a hotel close to Canary Wharf. It was easy to get to and close to the DLR station. I just asked the guy at reception who pointed me to Dr Bart's room number. He actually had two rooms - one for waiting and one for the actual consultation with a door separating them. There was a sign on the waiting room door so you know where to go. It was all a breeze and couldn't have been simpler. I hope all it goes well and keep us posted!

I love my visits to see Dr Bart. The hotel is just about 300 yards from the Westferry DLR station and I love the "waiting room". The magnificent panoramic view of the London Eye, the Shard and Westminster never fails to captivate the Londoner in me.

Heading along the corridor for my consultation last year a man stepped out of the room next door to Dr Bart's waiting room and as he turned I realised it was David Gest who was married to Liza Minnelli a few years back. For a moment, I thought he had been to see Dr Bart but no, it was definitely the room before Dr Bart's!

I'm looking forward to my MACS-lift later this year, and then that's it, no more Dr Bart for me :(  . He has become like a friend to me and has changed my life by boosting my confidence.

Caroline
x

Quote from: DianaWonderWoman on April 22, 2014, 07:14:40 AM
you look pretty in your avatar ! :)

I had my forehead implant + brow contouring/shaving (also SRS in one sleep) with Dr.Kamol in Bangkok 7-8 months ago

didnt feel any pain when i woke up .. but a bit uncomfy because all those bandages around my head/face ... for me,i felt no pain at all , the only thing that i felt a bit uncomfy was when the nurse took all the staples out of my head lol .. other than that, all good ..

good luck with your surgery !

Wow Diana! You are brave!!! I had a BA and nose job in one go and I thought that was brave of me lol.  I know this is the right thing for me to do. And I feel confident I want to do it thanks for the good luck wishes, the more I've researched FFS and Dr Bart the more excited I get. I am certain the biggest and most striking difference , like Caroline, will be my forehead. But I am hoping to be able to do everything that Dr Bart recommends for maximum harmony.

Quote from: alenauk on April 22, 2014, 07:01:33 AM
That's exciting news Carly!

My consultation was at a hotel close to Canary Wharf. It was easy to get to and close to the DLR station. I just asked the guy at reception who pointed me to Dr Bart's room number. He actually had two rooms - one for waiting and one for the actual consultation with a door separating them. There was a sign on the waiting room door so you know where to go. It was all a breeze and couldn't have been simpler. I hope all it goes well and keep us posted!

Quote from: Caroline2000 on April 22, 2014, 09:03:25 AM
I love my visits to see Dr Bart. The hotel is just about 300 yards from the Westferry DLR station and I love the "waiting room". The magnificent panoramic view of the London Eye, the Shard and Westminster never fails to captivate the Londoner in me.

Heading along the corridor for my consultation last year a man stepped out of the room next door to Dr Bart's waiting room and as he turned I realised it was David Gest who was married to Liza Minnelli a few years back. For a moment, I thought he had been to see Dr Bart but no, it was definitely the room before Dr Bart's!

I'm looking forward to my MACS-lift later this year, and then that's it, no more Dr Bart for me :(  . He has become like a friend to me and has changed my life by boosting my confidence.

Caroline
x

Omg ladies!!! I am getting so excited to meet him! Really looking forward to my consultation and I am glad I got an idea of the waiting room/ consultation room situation!!!

Yes, it's the Four Seasons in canary wharf. As a foreigner who's been in the Uk for a few years now I don't stop being excited of visiting London no matter how many times I've been there.

Wow Caroline, wasn't David Gest the one that accused Liza Minelli of spousal abuse / beating him up?  Only some years ago if I'm not mistaken. Stand up comedians came up with lots of jokes on that one!

  knowing what a pleasant relationship you've had with Dr Bart I almost want to mention you to him, Caroline, as a word of mouth recommendation type thing, just to let him know that all his attentions to his girls have definitely paid off, I'm sure he would be pleasantly surprised to hear that you speak this highly of him, and hopefully so he takes extra good care of me too! He he. But if you're ok with that we can private message. No probs if not darling.

Not long for the May date !

Carly x

Ok, I've definitely taken Di Maggio off of my short list of possible surgeons for ffs, there is something's I read that I didn't like at all, now, I'll still have an online consultation with the facial team in Spain since it's free and I do want to have some point of comparison, but I get more and more excited to meet Dr Bart the more I've researched.

Carly x

I'm curious about Facial Team as well, but any FFS i do won't be for a while. I think they performed some FFS on a Brazilian police officer who took a few months off work and went back as a very attractive woman - much to the surprise of her colleagues!

Quote from: calicarly on April 22, 2014, 01:07:16 PMWow Caroline, wasn't David Gest the one that accused Liza Minelli of spousal abuse / beating him up?  Only some years ago if I'm not mistaken. Stand up comedians came up with lots of jokes on that one!

I think you're right. I was surprised at how short he was and I'm only 5ft 7in. I didn't really know what to say, so I think I said something like: "Hi there, how are you?" and all he said was: "Fine thanks".
I always find meeting famous people slightly weird because we only usually see them in 2D!!

I've sent you a PM

Caroline 
x
:-*

Only one week to meet Dr. Bart!! I know I want forehead and jaw/chin work, everything else is up in the air , I wonder what he will recommend?!! X

Quote from: calicarly on May 02, 2014, 02:16:47 AM
Only one week to meet Dr. Bart!! I know I want forehead and jaw/chin work, everything else is up in the air , I wonder what he will recommend?!! X

I'm so excited for you, Carly. Like you, I've pretty much taken DiMaggio off my short list and have just about settled on Dr. Bart for my FFS. I'm really interested to see what he says during your consultation. As I'm in the U.S., it's probably not feasible for me to fly to Belgium to have a separate in-person conusltation. But I'm hoping he will do a Skype consult or something beforehand.

Anyway, I do hope you will report back and let us know how it goes!

Michelle

Quote from: Michelle33 on May 02, 2014, 10:56:05 AM
I'm so excited for you, Carly. Like you, I've pretty much taken DiMaggio off my short list and have just about settled on Dr. Bart for my FFS. I'm really interested to see what he says during your consultation. As I'm in the U.S., it's probably not feasible for me to fly to Belgium to have a separate in-person conusltation. But I'm hoping he will do a Skype consult or something beforehand.

Anyway, I do hope you will report back and let us know how it goes!

Michelle

Hi Michelle!

I will certainly report back about my consultation experience with Dr Bart, you should hear from me Friday or on the weekend at latest  Hun!

Hugs

Carly x

Hope it all goes well Carly, this time next week I should be in Antwerp!

Quote from: alena on May 06, 2014, 04:05:25 PM
Hope it all goes well Carly, this time next week I should be in Antwerp!

Will you let me know where you stayed in Antwerp and whether it turned out to be a good choice? I plan to be going there later this year and don't want to make a mistake in the choice of accommodation. I'll be thinking of you next week, Alena. Have a good trip.

Caroline
x

The price of Facial Team is similar to Dr. Bart. I had forehead, nose, chin and hairline lowering done there 7 weeks ago. I am veeeeeery happy :-)

Lara

Quote from: alena on May 06, 2014, 04:05:25 PM
Hope it all goes well Carly, this time next week I should be in Antwerp!

Wow Alena best of luck to you darling please report back to us how it goes will be looking forward to hearing about your experience :)

Quote from: Caroline2000 on May 07, 2014, 01:03:26 AM
Will you let me know where you stayed in Antwerp and whether it turned out to be a good choice? I plan to be going there later this year and don't want to make a mistake in the choice of accommodation. I'll be thinking of you next week, Alena. Have a good trip.

Caroline
x

I second Caroline's request! Any info on that will be helpful for me sooner or later this year x

Quote from: Lara1969 on May 07, 2014, 02:17:33 AM
The price of Facial Team is similar to Dr. Bart. I had forehead, nose, chin and hairline lowering done there 7 weeks ago. I am veeeeeery happy :-)

Lara

Hi Lara,

Yes like said I'll still have a Skype consultation with them. We'll see how that goes and make a decision.

But both seem to have some happy customers and I'm not really wanting to travel much further. I considered it at first, but not now. So glad you are happy, I did see your results in another thread and you look great xx

Thanks everyone! I'll be staying at the Tryp By Wyndham Hotel. I figured that as the trachea shave is a fairly simple operation (should take less than 30 mins) any hotel or B&B would be fine. If I were going for FFS then I would definitely get a rented apartment for privacy. When I was looking online I found the perfect hotel, but silly me I decided to wait a week later to book. When I searched for that hotel a week later it was all booked up and almost everyother good hotel in the city due to some major conference taking place at that time - just my luck  ;)

Quote from: Caroline2000 on May 07, 2014, 01:03:26 AM
Will you let me know where you stayed in Antwerp and whether it turned out to be a good choice? I plan to be going there later this year and don't want to make a mistake in the choice of accommodation. I'll be thinking of you next week, Alena. Have a good trip.

Caroline
x

Carly, make the most of those 30 minutes with Bart, tomorrow (Saturday).

Caroline
x

Hope your consultation goes well today Carly!

Quote from: Caroline2000 on May 09, 2014, 03:49:30 PM
Carly, make the most of those 30 minutes with Bart, tomorrow (Saturday).

Caroline
x

Hi ladies!!

The consultation went great, I now know Dr. Bart is the man for the job!, him and his wife/partner really do make a nice team, are very professional, took all my before pictures, talked about what I needed and he suggested the following:

-Forehead

Forehead Recontouring with slight brow lift, and he said in my case he would approach the hairline differently as he thinks the corners need lowering slightly and says the top is too low so he would go behind the hairline in the middle to actually higher that area of the hairline, he said it would be a curved line that weaves behind the hairline in the middle to give me a good inverted U shape. He also said he might use a small amount of bone cement to get the forehead shape perfect, he could tell my biggest concern was the forehead. He said a shave will most likely do, but there is a possibility I could need a full reconstruction, he suggested I don't have my eyebrows done and let them grow out just before I go for surgery so he can see exactly where to take them to.

-Chin and jaw.

He uses a kind of steel ruler and does measurements on your face (he said the jaw angle was around a centimetre too much for a female jaw, which he would shave away, chin height about 8 mm too long, he did the same measuring to 3 points of the forehead and told me about lowering corners slightly and highering mid hairline which I mentioned before.

-Lipo under the chin (yes, I have a bit of double chin! Lol)

He went on to look for Adam's apple, which he didn't find, looked and measured at my nose, lips, eyes, and says: the rest of your face is very feminine so I would only do forehead and chin/jaw, then he pinched at my double chin and said -what you think about that? why don't we do something about that while we're at it? not that it makes any difference to femininity but it would be nice-, I said I notice that often and would like to do something about it but didn't know it was something you could do, he said we can do that, he almost suggested a lower facelift but then said no, it's not lose skin it's fatty, I said I know, my weight yo yo's and it seems to be a result of that, I was pleasantly surprised that he wants to, and is capable of doing that as well.

I then said -can't we do something with the nose?, he then said - if you really want to... there is some work we could do, explained what he could do, not major things but making the nostrils smaller and some tweaks here and there, and they gave me 2 proposals, one excluding the nose and one including it.

He also did a profile simulation, that if I am able to upload, I'll try and show you.

The price was right within what I imagined including the nose and nice and low-ish without the nose.

Now all I am left to consider is shall I get the nose done one last time or just let it be it's funky self... My bf Rob thinks just go for it while you're at it and I am of the same opinion, they didn't push the rhinoplasty until I suggested it, you can tell he wants what's gonna be right for you no more no less. I am very excited and should be booking the surgery in a month or 2 as soon as Rob knows when he can take the time off work (I would like to have it done in August and Rob thinks that's a good idea too)


Anyone know how I upload pics?

Smooches

Carly x

That's great news Carly! I'm glad it all went well. I found Dr Bart and his wife to be nice and professional as well which really put me at ease, plus the hotel was really nice with a good view! I've never uploaded a photo to Susan's, I'm interested in how its done so I can post a few pics of myself in the future too!

Quote from: alena on May 11, 2014, 08:25:37 AM
That's great news Carly! I'm glad it all went well. I found Dr Bart and his wife to be nice and professional as well which really put me at ease, plus the hotel was really nice with a good view! I've never uploaded a photo to Susan's, I'm interested in how its done so I can post a few pics of myself in the future too!

I'm excited for your trachea shave soon!! Don't forget to tell all about it Hun!!, yeah if I can upload the pictures then maybe y'all can help me decide on the nose situation...

Carly x

Hi Carly,

Just read about your experience with Dr Bart. I'm so glad you got on well with him.
What he's planning to do with your forehead will mean that any scarring will not be seen because it will be behind your hairline. Did he say how many millimetres he would be raising your hairline? He has an amazing eye for balance and obviously saw that you would benefit from this procedure.

He is being very careful to only go what he feels has to be done. You are so lucky to look the way you do.

The profile simulation interests me. I didn't realise he could do that. Maybe he has a new toy!

It's amazing he can do what he can do and yet manage to keep his prices so low.

Regarding your nose, I'm sure Dr Bart will do the minimum necessary. I think Rob probably knows you a lot better than anyone on here, so listen to him.

What did you think of the view from the waiting room? Amazing, isn't it?

Well, it certainly sounds as if you got a very good consultation with Dr Bart and were able to really focus on what you were there for.

Go Girl!!


Love
Caroline
x

Quote from: Caroline2000 on May 11, 2014, 01:25:22 PM
Hi Carly,

Just read about your experience with Dr Bart. I'm so glad you got on well with him.
What he's planning to do with your forehead will mean that any scarring will not be seen because it will be behind your hairline. Did he say how many millimetres he would be raising your hairline? He has an amazing eye for balance and obviously saw that you would benefit from this procedure.

He is being very careful to only go what he feels has to be done. You are so lucky to look the way you do.

The profile simulation interests me. I didn't realise he could do that. Maybe he has a new toy!

It's amazing he can do what he can do and yet manage to keep his prices so low.

Regarding your nose, I'm sure Dr Bart will do the minimum necessary. I think Rob probably knows you a lot better than anyone on here, so listen to him.

What did you think of the view from the waiting room? Amazing, isn't it?

Well, it certainly sounds as if you got a very good consultation with Dr Bart and were able to really focus on what you were there for.

Go Girl!!


Love
Caroline
x

Hello lovely Caroline!!

Yes, it really went great, it was worth going to London from Manchester for the in-person consultation, I'm even more excited now, the proposal puts surgery time at 6 hours including rhino and at 4 excluding it... Rob came home last night and said preferably book it during the summer vacations but if it's before or  after he doesn't mind much and he will be with me the whole time wether they like it at work or not... He is fully behind me getting FFS and I could see some excitement in his eyes at the consultation too..

Oh yes, the four seasons is a beautiful hotel and I took pictures of London skyline from the waiting room, I actually got there about 15 mins too early because we feared getting lost in those one way London streets, London itself looked really beautiful this time around, maybe cause we stayed at a different Marriott... Some very pretty residential areas...

It seems he has been doing some slight changes during consultations, he offered me a quick profile simulation picture which he emailed to me along with the proposals, he also whipped out (!) his new camera and said I am using this new camera for the first time on you today!! Rob got a few loud laughs from both of them too, it went smoothly... I tried to listen and not digress with conversation like I normally do. They both were very complimentary towards me too. But the appointment stayed on point and if anything they spent a few mins more than the half hour on me.

Carly x  .

Quote from: Caroline2000 on May 11, 2014, 01:25:22 PM
Hi Carly,

Just read about your experience with Dr Bart. I'm so glad you got on well with him.
What he's planning to do with your forehead will mean that any scarring will not be seen because it will be behind your hairline. Did he say how many millimetres he would be raising your hairline? He has an amazing eye for balance and obviously saw that you would benefit from this procedure.

He is being very careful to only go what he feels has to be done. You are so lucky to look the way you do.

The profile simulation interests me. I didn't realise he could do that. Maybe he has a new toy!

It's amazing he can do what he can do and yet manage to keep his prices so low.

Regarding your nose, I'm sure Dr Bart will do the minimum necessary. I think Rob probably knows you a lot better than anyone on here, so listen to him.

What did you think of the view from the waiting room? Amazing, isn't it?

Well, it certainly sounds as if you got a very good consultation with Dr Bart and were able to really focus on what you were there for.

Go Girl!!


Love
Caroline
x

I don't remember him mentioning an exact measurement but I remember him whispering some numbers out as he was measuring it, then when he looked at the eyebrows, he said they are nice and high , I said I do a lot of eyebrow shaping from underneath the eyebrows tho, so don't let that fool you, he said ok, try let them come out so I can see where to take them to when you come for surgery.

It just seems like everything is coming together and that's always a good sign...

On a funny note, when we arrived at the Four Seasons and the valet Took the car I walked in and took my sunglasses off, and as I walked through the hotel I felt like Meryl Streep in death becomes her, the part where she visits the woman for the youth potion... ;) it was fun in a way and I can see the importance that Dr Bart gives to give his patients as much privacy as they may want for comfort .

Carly x

Hi girls!

Just a quick update from Antwerp. I'm in bed in my hotel room after the trachea shave. Now that the anesthetic has worn off my throat hurts like hell whenever I try to swallow. The operation went well and its just a case of recovering and seeing what the end result is once the swelling has gone down. Aside from that Antwerp is a lovely city with really friendly people. Most people we met spoke english so getting around is fairly easy. More news as I recover x

Quote from: alena on May 15, 2014, 01:47:24 PM
Hi girls!

Just a quick update from Antwerp. I'm in bed in my hotel room after the trachea shave. Now that the anesthetic has worn off my throat hurts like hell whenever I try to swallow. The operation went well and its just a case of recovering and seeing what the end result is once the swelling has gone down. Aside from that Antwerp is a lovely city with really friendly people. Most people we met spoke english so getting around is fairly easy. More news as I recover x

Wow it's great to hear most people speak English there!! Hopefully your recovery is swift , are u there for one night or a couple of nights?? Hugs Alena xx

Carly x

I just got back today and was there for three nights in total. I was pleasantly surprised with Antwerp, it's a really diverse city with a lot happening. The pain in my throat has almost gone away and I can eat again. I was surprised by how mild the swelling was and the lack of bruising. So far I'm really pleased with it!

Quote from: calicarly on May 15, 2014, 07:12:42 PM
Wow it's great to hear most people speak English there!! Hopefully your recovery is swift , are u there for one night or a couple of nights?? Hugs Alena xx

Carly x

Now I'm off the painkillers and feeling a bit more like myself I thought I'd post more details of my trip to Antwerp for my trachea shave.

We found Antwerp to be a well connected city - buses, trams, taxis, cycle paths. The cycle path runs next to the pedestrian path on the pavement so watch out! We used the tram the most and it cost about 2 euros a journey with the ticket being valid for an hour. I think you can also get day passes as well. We found that trams 7 and 15 stopped closest to the Picard clinic. We did catch a taxi a few times. It cost about 16 euros from Central Station in the heart of the city to the clinic. Most people we met spoke english so communicating wasn't a problem. My girlfriend tried her hand at Flemish at one point as she can speak a bit of Dutch and German, but the tram driver just said, "Can you speak english?" which was quite funny!

The pre-op consultation was held at the Picard clinic which is a modern minimalist building that is super clean inside. It's located at one side of a roundabout in a nice residential area. The staff all spoke English and were really friendly. We had a brief chat with Dr Bart, signed a few things and I was handed my medication to take after the operation. I was impressed at how everything was labelled. For the painkiller it said - Pain Medication - Use when you are in pain!

Next up was my CT scan at a large public hospital which was a 10-15 min walk from the Picard Clinic. We asked at reception where to go and found it with no problems. It was a busy day there so we had to wait about 30 mins to register. After registration we were asked to go to another waiting area. Another patient of Dr Barts was there for her scan as well.

My op was back at the Picard Clinic. It was delayed for a few hours, so we went to get something to eat. If it was FFS that would not be allowed, but with a trachea shave it was okay. When we got back I was whisked upstairs and and was given 10 minutes to change. Then I was given a mild sedative and brought into the operating room once it had worked its way into my system. The trachea shave went smoothly with everyone working quickly and efficiently. Once it was over I was helped over to the recovery room. After about 20 minutes there, I said I was fine to leave so got dressed and took the tram back to my hotel. The following morning I returned for my post-op consultation and the removal of a drain I had attached to me. Overall my experience was a good one, my Adam's apple which was quite noticeable before is now gone, but there's still a bit of swelling to go away before I can fully judge the end result. The big test is if my family or colleagues will notice anything different when I get back from my holidays ;)

Hi Alena,

Sounds as if you had a great time in Antwerp. As mentioned here already, I am expecting to go there later this year for a facelift and wondered if you could recommend the hotel in which you stayed? If your Adam's apple was quite noticeable, they will probably know something has changed about you but not quite know what it is. That's what I found when I had mine done.

Caroline

x

Quote from: alena on May 18, 2014, 06:13:12 PM
Now I'm off the painkillers and feeling a bit more like myself I thought I'd post more details of my trip to Antwerp for my trachea shave.

We found Antwerp to be a well connected city - buses, trams, taxis, cycle paths. The cycle path runs next to the pedestrian path on the pavement so watch out! We used the tram the most and it cost about 2 euros a journey with the ticket being valid for an hour. I think you can also get day passes as well. We found that trams 7 and 15 stopped closest to the Picard clinic. We did catch a taxi a few times. It cost about 16 euros from Central Station in the heart of the city to the clinic. Most people we met spoke english so communicating wasn't a problem. My girlfriend tried her hand at Flemish at one point as she can speak a bit of Dutch and German, but the tram driver just said, "Can you speak english?" which was quite funny!

The pre-op consultation was held at the Picard clinic which is a modern minimalist building that is super clean inside. It's located at one side of a roundabout in a nice residential area. The staff all spoke English and were really friendly. We had a brief chat with Dr Bart, signed a few things and I was handed my medication to take after the operation. I was impressed at how everything was labelled. For the painkiller it said - Pain Medication - Use when you are in pain!

Next up was my CT scan at a large public hospital which was a 10-15 min walk from the Picard Clinic. We asked at reception where to go and found it with no problems. It was a busy day there so we had to wait about 30 mins to register. After registration we were asked to go to another waiting area. Another patient of Dr Barts was there for her scan as well.

My op was back at the Picard Clinic. It was delayed for a few hours, so we went to get something to eat. If it was FFS that would not be allowed, but with a trachea shave it was okay. When we got back I was whisked upstairs and and was given 10 minutes to change. Then I was given a mild sedative and brought into the operating room once it had worked its way into my system. The trachea shave went smoothly with everyone working quickly and efficiently. Once it was over I was helped over to the recovery room. After about 20 minutes there, I said I was fine to leave so got dressed and took the tram back to my hotel. The following morning I returned for my post-op consultation and the removal of a drain I had attached to me. Overall my experience was a good one, my Adam's apple which was quite noticeable before is now gone, but there's still a bit of swelling to go away before I can fully judge the end result. The big test is if my family or colleagues will notice anything different when I get back from my holidays ;)

Hi Alena,

So glad to hear that Adam's apple of yours is no more! Lol, sounds interesting. How long a procedure was it? 1 hr?, I like your post cause it tells us a lot about the surroundings in antwerp, I may want to venture out a couple of times cause Rob probably won't be able to stand being in all day, although I don't really see myself minding it too much while I'm in recovery, any of the girls from ffs can tell us how long you had to wear your masks and face bandages? I'm meant to wear one that hold my chin up like the ladies that get a facelift cause I'm getting lipo done on my chin, dr Bart said I'll be wearing that for 3 weeks.

It really does make me at ease that everyone speaks English, I added Antwerp on my iPhone weather app even now lol.

I'm sure you can't be touching the area where the Adam's apple used to be but, I bet you've gently felt the area and it must be totally different, more so if you had a particularly prominent one, I bet anytime u ever even scratched your neck or put some kind of necklace on you would touch it and now it's not there; it has got to be one of if not the biggest gender marker, so I'm glad you were able to get it taken care of Alena, let us know how it keeps healing.

Definitely looking forward to visiting Piccard clinic, I like a clinic to be clinical and clean and shiny, when I first started researching ffs, I read about some clinics (Femilife, Cardenas) that some people described as right down scary...

All my research has always taken into consideration a balance of quality, value for money and convenience, that's how I decided for Dr. Bart...

Carly x

The procedure took about 30 mins, I asked my girlfriend how long I was away for in total and it was an hour and a half. Those sedatives really altered my perception of time! For my post-op consultation we saw a lady who had facial surgery leave before me and her face was swollen and bandaged up. Later on in the day we saw her and a friend sightseeing in the historical part of Antwerp, so if you have Rob with you I'm sure you'll be fine  ;)

Quote from: calicarly on May 19, 2014, 02:42:14 AM
Hi Alena,

So glad to hear that Adam's apple of yours is no more! Lol, sounds interesting. How long a procedure was it? 1 hr?, I like your post cause it tells us a lot about the surroundings in antwerp, I may want to venture out a couple of times cause Rob probably won't be able to stand being in all day, although I don't really see myself minding it too much while I'm in recovery, any of the girls from ffs can tell us how long you had to wear your masks and face bandages? I'm meant to wear one that hold my chin up like the ladies that get a facelift cause I'm getting lipo done on my chin, dr Bart said I'll be wearing that for 3 weeks.

It really does make me at ease that everyone speaks English, I added Antwerp on my iPhone weather app even now lol.

I'm sure you can't be touching the area where the Adam's apple used to be but, I bet you've gently felt the area and it must be totally different, more so if you had a particularly prominent one, I bet anytime u ever even scratched your neck or put some kind of necklace on you would touch it and now it's not there; it has got to be one of if not the biggest gender marker, so I'm glad you were able to get it taken care of Alena, let us know how it keeps healing.

Definitely looking forward to visiting Piccard clinic, I like a clinic to be clinical and clean and shiny, when I first started researching ffs, I read about some clinics (Femilife, Cardenas) that some people described as right down scary...

All my research has always taken into consideration a balance of quality, value for money and convenience, that's how I decided for Dr. Bart...

Carly x

Hi Carly,

I'm so sorry if you've mentioned this already, but how much did he quote you?

Thanks!

Michelle

Quote from: Michelle33 on May 30, 2014, 12:15:04 PM
Hi Carly,

I'm so sorry if you've mentioned this already, but how much did he quote you?

Thanks!

Michelle

Hi Michelle,

For the work he thinks I need, which is:
-forehead
-jaw/chin
-lipo under the chin
€12,085 Total
€10,800 Discounted

Including a Rhinoplasty requested by me:
€15,865 Total
€13,800 Discounted

Probably more interesting than the prices I was quoted, for you, is that he will be doing a consultation in Seattle, June 28. Not sure if you're east or west coast or where but, if you don't find it too hard to organise try and make it to an in person consultation with him, I made the trip from Manchester and stayed overnight in London just for an in person consultation and I'm ever so glad I did.

Carly x

I just realized I put the wrong date down, it's July the 28th x

Carly x