I was making copies of a girl friend's nephews wedding. The attire was formal, gals and guys all looking good. The separation of sexes; the gender wedding roles, party games, etc. etc, where all black and white. I can't think of any other situation where your presentation as a male or female is going to be more scrutinized.
Would you avoid going to a wedding at all costs? I think I would ;D
I went to my brothers wedding and it went fine.
Quote from: Alainaluvsu on May 23, 2014, 10:13:06 PM
I went to my brothers wedding and it went fine.
Yeah but you pass! I guess I should say, if you are androgynous, how would you present at a wedding?
Wear a grey suit with heels? ;D
I may pass but I was still there with people that knew me when I was living as a male.... lol
Imagine a tough 100 person crowd dressed similar to this:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi62.tinypic.com%2F5l10d1.jpg&hash=1e68befab24da3695a53047ca3170311e0257fce)
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi61.tinypic.com%2Fzk06l2.jpg&hash=2a889281ec0e68f4e699915dfeb1908392cec093)
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi57.tinypic.com%2Fdf7o5j.jpg&hash=4cc7862c5dc1f4c145fcb43d938928611b32e56f)
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi60.tinypic.com%2F28198jl.jpg&hash=78c2b7fc5941197a80c0f1e5b50d82ccc0b01ef0)
How would you present androgynously?
No. But I'm stubborn :D
Eh, too much color in the dresses and a couple of those suits look like they were actually tailored by someone who know which end of a needle to thread. Grey suit wouldn't be much fun! Suit with heels though does sound awesome.
Evelyn, does your brain ever hurt!? This is a total compliment BTW. Reading through here you are insightful, just slightly off the wall, pervasive, and almost always still remain relateable to everyone it seems. Is there a line waiting to here you talk? I really hope that all came out right, I kinda feel a bit awkward now.
I filled in as Mother of the Bride for my late GF at her eldest daughters wedding last July.. Had a blast.. Yeah, some people knew, but most didn't and seemed to have no clue.
Oh I would love to be invited to a wedding, even if it was one where people new me before!
The last one I went too was a wedding for my niece in early 2011....it was right at my in-between stage but still presenting male.. I did decide to wear some striped socks and these type shoes. The rest was 100% male clothing, black slacks, solid collard shirt and my hair was in a short pony tail. I felt really awkward going but wanted to finally have a little fun. When I arrived no one recognized me, and after they were told by me or someone else who I was, I was talked too as if I was ill LOL It got even stranger, as I waited at the end of the bar to get served, I mentioned to the guy next to me that they should have more than one bartender. He then proceeded to call the bartender down our way by saying "she" would like to be served. I was like are you kidding me!! Now what the hell are people going to think!!
I avoided all picture opportunities and I think I did fairly well since I just recently seen some from this wedding and only seen my arm in one pic.
The bouquet throwing and the garter toss was a really strange time, I wasn't invited in the bouquet toss (thank God) but it was awkward standing there watching the garter toss. Thank God no one asked me to go out for that either!! I did leave early since I didn't have the fun I expected to have, the last straw was when I needed to use the restroom and was looked at very strangely when using the men's room.
(https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQtglsudDpFM8vQGq2Xp6y_wS9LVocQ5VfIX4376cnZg4_DBa0m)
I'm torn on weddings. Love love love them. Seeing people so happy, I don't know just fills me with joy. But right now my younger brother and his future wife are planning their wedding. It isn't until November but I am honestly scared to death to attend it. He had intended for me to be his "best man" in their super catholic wedding but now I am not so into being a man at anything. I don't expect to be in the wedding at all. And that doesn't bother me. What bothers me is that everyone there will have known me a male. I mainly worry that I could some how cause a scene, or in some way take away from their day. If they invite me I plan to go as andro as I can if they are worried to. I won't bring up my worries to them but it is something that is weighing on me.
i only been to one wedding and i said i would never go to one again or i'd make everyone's life miserable lol. sry, cant do formal xD
Quote from: Michaela Whimsy on May 23, 2014, 10:52:49 PM
Eh, too much color in the dresses and a couple of those suits look like they were actually tailored by someone who know which end of a needle to thread. Grey suit wouldn't be much fun! Suit with heels though does sound awesome.
Evelyn, does your brain ever hurt!? This is a total compliment BTW. Reading through here you are insightful, just slightly off the wall, pervasive, and almost always still remain relateable to everyone it seems. Is there a line waiting to here you talk? I really hope that all came out right, I kinda feel a bit awkward now.
See:
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,163256.msg1417045.html#msg1417045
:D
It's the E. I just can't shut "her" up!!!
I think I'm really in my element around these parts. Just never been more comfortable and open about stuff, lately.
That is a really good question! I have two weddings coming up in the next year....one that I am expected to be a part of. I suppose if I am passable and I am accepted by them after I come out, I will go. Like Hayley, I would worry about becoming a spectacle or a distraction on someone else's day though. I love and hate weddings. I love to see people so happy and all of the love that is present, but the strong gender divisions and dress always makes me really sad.
Looks like a bit of late party dancing. It's obviously clear who's boy and who's girl here.
But for the one in-between. I wonder what they would look like. (I wonder what *I* would look like).
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi60.tinypic.com%2F2aaeede.jpg&hash=eafdf4c74ea02fd01d34af39f0aa2e6b1d2fa2eb)
If you're the word ninja, I guess I'm more of a word butcher using here instead of hear.
Sorry for the off topic.
The hard part about a wedding, I think, would be trying not to be the distraction that people remember the wedding by, if the people are real serious their wedding is a huge deal to them probably. A friend of mine who had a big NYC wedding was really offended that one girl wore pants, nicely dressed but pants. She is very traditional though. I have heard about those pants a few times.
I suppose fit one gender or the other and add just enough flair to leave people guessing, but not talking.
The last wedding I went I felt terrible. It was my cousins shotgun wedding. I was no where near the thought of going out as female at that time I was dressed male. I definitely overdressed. I should have stopped at wal-mart on the way there and closed my eyes while i pulled clothes off the rack and just go ahead and leave the cow dung on my boots. What better chance to look awesome then a wedding right? No one said anything there, but there were jokes about it a few months later...
Love/hate weddings...
I just photographed a wedding last week. Everyone couldn't stop telling me how I was working my ass off, and I made over $120 in tips. I've never been tipped previous to my transition. *shrug*
I absolutely love weddings, but over the last few years I have found them to be really triggering. Too many things to think of like, how I feel I should have been married by now, thoughts about which wedding dress, wedding plans..everything. It also doesn't help when I found out I was snubbed out of a close highschool friend's wedding, that one really stung, and I honestly hope that non of you girls would have to go thru that.
Black slacks and jacket over a white woman's blouse with open neck and bling? Could be something a woman would wear...might fit the andro look?
I haven't been to many weddings, but have been in guy mode for all*. Am expecting to go to one later this year and, oh god, I can't wait!! :D
*Actually, I lie! Just remembered I went to the wedding of two friends as Julie during my first attempt at transition. Now here's the thing - I knew the bride and groom from uni, I don't know if the bride told her folks or not, presumably she did. Apparently after the wedding her father referenced me and said "that is how I feel too"... and transitioned to female!
I think its best if everyone avoided weddings. People should just cohabitate as desired, less issues down the road.
Done my best to avoid them,3 weddings in 56 years(school friend 1981,sister 1983,nephew 2013) is pretty good going
Quote from: big head horsey-face on May 24, 2014, 05:00:41 AM
I think its best if everyone avoided weddings. People should just cohabitate as desired, less issues down the road.
Would be nice if it happened that way, my sister recently broke up with her partner of 20 years. Messy.
Quote from: Ms Grace on May 24, 2014, 05:11:56 AM
Would be nice if it happened that way, my sister recently broke up with her partner of 20 years. Messy.
My family has bad luck with it other than one brother that has only married once and still married. I've been through two, both sisters had two, oldest brother went through 5 and dad went through 4, lol. I gave up on all that stuff at 30 years old. Just don't see a real future in it.
And sorry for the derail.
Quote from: big kim on May 24, 2014, 05:05:32 AM
Done my best to avoid them,3 weddings in 56 years(school friend 1981,sister 1983,nephew 2013) is pretty good going
Haha, 2 whole weddings and a reception for me. Don't plan on going to anymore in the future, but if I was really compelled I guess I would make an exception.
Oh I love weddings! Sure, things could end badly but I'm willing to take that risk myself.
I don't understand why a trans person should avoid weddings though. I mean, if there is some personal reservation that's one thing but cis folk could have reservations too.
Short of it is, we've got just as much a right to be there as any other invited guest.
My last wedding was a very traditional Greek Orthodox, I, as all the women did, went to the altar to meet the family. I wasn't passing at all well. Had a blast.
Never ever avoid anything because you are trans. Face life because you are human, and be proud.
Sure, it's a very binary kind of event - the white dress, the suits, bridesmaids, the pre-wedding ritual gender bonding stuff. Plenty of opportunities for awkward moments.
But it's also a family and friends affair. Most likely, everyone there knows we're trans already. They've got over it long ago. Many of them will have seen us in our new genders before, and many will have seen us in our old genders. Us being trans is not news to these people! They will have seen photos, heard stories, and gotten over the shock already. And those who haven't met you might be looking forward to the opportunity to do so.
And don't forget the fact that you received an invitation - meaning the happy couple wants you there.
In other words, nobody will be particularly surprised by us showing up. And it'll make the next wedding, and the one after that, just non-events as far as being trans is concerned.
One rule I'd suggest though: if nobody knows you're trans, don't use the wedding as a way of coming out. This is not the best place for your mother to see her "son" in a dress for the first time! If being there will be a clear distraction, then perhaps avoid the ceremony itself. There would be nothing worse than everyone staring at you instead of the bride. But rock the reception!
I'm going to a wedding this summer (one I can't really say no to, we've been friends since middle school), and I've been having a hard time finding something to wear - I'm not out to them, so I can't dress too unconventional, but I also refuse buying a new suit, and the old one is too big. I also feel uncomfortable wearing it. I have a grey one which sort of fits, but the dress code is ideally black tie but at least a black suit.
I've decided on putting together an outfit which consist of only women's clothes but which will satisfy the requirements for male semiformal attire - a women's tuxedo jacket (they exist), dress pants, shirt-like blouse and a scarf knit more like a cravat. And a pair of nice earrings. It'll probably look a bit out of the ordinary, but they're used to me doing strange things. So this will just add to an already entertaining (in their eyes) list. I can break the news that I'm transitioning later, at least then they'll know something is up :-) .
I don't dance, so that's not a problem. I don't have a date, and if they pair me they will do so with a girl, but then I'm bisexual leaning towards girls anyway. So it doesn't bother me. It's not like random pairings in a wedding are meant to lead to anything.
I'd have more problems if these people were more formal though, or less accepting with strict demands of demeanor and adherence to social rules. If I were ever invited to a wedding like that, I'd probably find an excuse not to go. At least until I can pass and no one would notice anything.
(Edit: typo)
I've been to a number of weddings over the years and never had a problem deciding how to dress, I'm just one of the women there and dress for the occasion.
However, in a few months time I'm off to a wedding between a trans-woman friend of mine and her trans-woman fiancee. That one's going to be very interesting, but I shall dress just as I would for any other wedding... as the woman I am!
Caroline
x
Well go as you want to the wedding. I guaratee that if you are dressed en femme at the reception after an hour no one will care. Or go one way to the wedding and then about an hour into the reception show up dressed en femme.
Last wedding I went to was a few months ago, and I had already been a few months into hormones. But yeah, I wore a causal male outfit, but it was a bit different. I wore a navy blue Cashmere sportscoat with a light blue shirt, light kakhis and a pair of brown armani loafers. It was fine for the atmosphere of this particular wedding,and I was at least able to dress differently then all the guys with their typical suit/tux look. I guess I'm used to continuing the secret for now, so it's not a huge deal to me even though it hurts and feels uncomfortable presenting in a more traditional masculine way. However, the most important thing was that I got to see one of my best friends getting married which was worth all of the awkward social anxiety I had that day.
If you aren't out yet, you may have to put up with dressing a certain way in order to continue to keep it a secret. Or you could say screw it and dress the way you want to if you think the couple would be okay with that. However, supporting whoever is getting married is most important. Why avoid a wedding if it's someone important to you?
I don't see why, unless they are far too triggering/GD inducing to cope with. The last one I went to was a few days after my 2nd hair zapping session so my face was still recovering. Looked slightly odd which combined with my longish hair in a more female style made me feel awkward. No one noticed anything worth mentioning though, but it was pre-HRT. Having to wear a suit made me quite grumpy and depressed the whole time though. Never liked suits, but since discovering that transitioning is a thing and that I don't have to be just transgender my whole life, suits have become even worse.
Personally I don't like weddings anyway. The sheer amount of gendering and enforcement of gender roles/expectation/presentation reminds me of one the things I hate the most about just about every society/culture that seems to have ever existed. It's not even related to my GD, just always looked at the world and hated what we do to ourselves and each other. As I transition and run into it even more, it just gets worse. The only redeeming factors are seeing people I care about, seeing them happy and interesting food.
Naomi
Simply, No.
I have mixed feelings about them, but no, I wouldn't avoid them.
Weddings can be triggering for me - I hate wearing suits, and it's the sort of event that I'd have fun putting an outfit together for if I transitioned. Still, I go through the motions as a matter of respect for the couple, and as support.
Well. I guess one can always go dressed like this. If you're going to dress andro... maybe do it right.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi59.tinypic.com%2F1128xsj.jpg&hash=4c262ccfbfead604232666f0cdfb530c07d77572)
;D
I'm going to my first wedding next month, as a female.
Should be interesting.
I actually was the bridesmaid in a friend's wedding about a year post-transition. I didn't try to present androgynously, though, so that may not be quite what this thread was about; in fact, I re-wore my wife's bright red satin bridesmaid dress from a previous wedding. I didn't have any problems, though as someone else said, it was mostly friends who probably were kinder to me than strangers might be (the strangers who *were* there seemed nice enough as well!).
If invited I go. I present female, if it isn't good enough for them, too bad, you shouldn't have invited me. /shrug
-AM
I figure I would go but just present androgynous. I wouldn't push feminine boundaries any more than I have to (frilly stuff out of the question). I just want my level of transition to be congruent with my attire.
It's totally possible to pull it off and I'm actually more inspired to turn heads being dressed well, androgynously, instead of looking like a binary conforming unfashionable tool.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi57.tinypic.com%2F2eegbr9.jpg&hash=c22673e8e44e33c1fe384147b72bfcdaeeb24093)
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi59.tinypic.com%2F346290n.jpg&hash=ca9750ae9b3d16ef8f4b8a425a6ccbcbda944453)
Quote from: Evelyn K on May 25, 2014, 06:42:07 PM
I figure I would go but just present androgynous. I wouldn't push feminine boundaries any more than I have to (frilly stuff out of the question). I just want my level of transition to be congruent with my attire.
It's totally possible to pull it off and I'm actually more inspired to turn heads being dressed well, androgynously, instead of looking like a binary conforming unfashionable tool.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi57.tinypic.com%2F2eegbr9.jpg&hash=c22673e8e44e33c1fe384147b72bfcdaeeb24093)
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi59.tinypic.com%2F346290n.jpg&hash=ca9750ae9b3d16ef8f4b8a425a6ccbcbda944453)
I Like this i love your style.
Id just have three rules/guidelines ill follow.
1) invited
2) bride and groom are awhere of my being trans and what that entails as far as clothes.
3) NEVER not go because im trans, this is self emposing trans have no place in society.
oh and as an after thought, if all the men are at one side and women at the other DONT stand in the middle of the isle because you will be in the way. :p
If i went dressed like the above id probably stand with the men.
Because just as men shouldnt mean suit, suit doesnt mean man either. Id be stading as a suit with other suits.
Quote from: Androgynous_Machine on May 25, 2014, 05:54:05 PM
If invited I go. I present female, if it isn't good enough for them, too bad, you shouldn't have invited me. /shrug
-AM
I agree if they know what they are getting themselves into. I have a wedding that I am going to be invited to in the fall of 2015. By that time, I plan on living in an new place, and will most likely have been on hormones for about 15 months. She would never uninvite me, but seeing as how 50 of her guests/wedding party will be former employees of mine who had not seen me in over a year, I feel like I could potentially be a major distraction on her day. It isnt even a matter of acceptance (the groom has two moms), it is just the potential distraction. I guess a lot depends on the level of "out" I achieve with everyone between now and then. Also, if I am passable/stealth enough, I may go and just act like another guest that no one knows. If I am not passable, and too deep in to go as male, I may not go out of respect for it being her day.
Quote from: ButterflyVickster on May 25, 2014, 07:20:21 PM
I Like this i love your style.
Oh that's not me. ;D
But I'm gettin' there.
Quote from: Evelyn K on May 25, 2014, 10:17:54 PM
Oh that's not me. ;D
But I'm gettin' there.
I Didnt think it was you. But style is presentation, not the person. So since you said like that, its sorta still your style even if its not you. Get what mean?
I Mean Im no stranger to the realisation the person is a part of it, I said anough times myself I wish I could pull that off, or wear that. (skin tone, hair colour ect)
But the woman in those pictures I Dont think for a moment would look out of place at a wedding. But I woould never of thought of going dressed like that, Antill now ofcorse.
Oh that's cool. I've really been trying scope out a style for myself, just studying things that potentially makes a trans person look too funky for their own good and consequently inviting their being clocked. So far I've found keeping my fashion sense analogous to my level of passibility is the safest bet. Keeping things on the androgyny side no matter how "pretty" I become only helps me look even better.
Some other examples I posted in the androgyny forum which I might wear at a wedding...
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi58.tinypic.com%2F2aflora.jpg&hash=1ef8bec763101af4a81ed14e139fe5f67fa20592) (https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi58.tinypic.com%2F34i4tuw.jpg&hash=90c98f72fb5feac0e3c45ab06ba33546e2d7718b)
And maybe if I was feeling a little more daring. Except without the vest...
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Foi58.tinypic.com%2F8vyfr8.jpg&hash=239034e96e13556781128a9dda5c19303647425a)
With the pic on the right you see a suit, and thats all you see. Antill you see the "pretty" face. sort of thing.
tbh honest i had the exact oposit happen to me so i know first hand what you mean by...
Quote from: Evelyn K on May 25, 2014, 10:45:04 PM
their own good and consequently inviting their being clocked.
Yeah a work freind of my sisters it was telling her how when he saw me it was from the bottom up.Nice legs, Skirt, Boobs, then boom man face. (his words)
But I comfort myself by telling myself its my own fualt for not useing make up of grooming my brows. (but that probably not true)
I think what happened was my face wasnt as feminin as my wardrobe.
and with the pic here its the oposite, the femininaty is told by the face not taken by it.
Yeah. I don't care how feminine one feels inside with the girl screaming to jump out. You still have to moderate your presentation according to your passability - that is, if you don't want to get the stink eye or draw undue attention. I'd rather be looked at and admired for my sensibility. Not scorned for my queer-ability.
And I see nothing wrong with disciplining your transition with sort of mindfulness.
Thats because there isnt.
While I agree with Evelyn on staying mindful of your passibility in relation to your presentation, (most) weddings are very lovey and happy events.
I've found there's a more accepting atmosphere at the weddings I've gone to in my transition than the typical day to day, and for whatever reason I've met guys at each wedding that became interested in me. For that reason I'll keep going to them! :)