I am going to be going into a hostile environment not only not trans friendly but frankly ignorant and psychologically damaging. My wife is forcing me to cut my nails and my hair to present fully male. This I can do, but it will be interesting to see what the dysphoric backlash will be with short hair. I had better be able to see past that again. I have some fear about this.
But after so much work at Susans to be authentic, to now have to return to extended family in a rigid cultural upbringing, really backwards, men are stereotypically male and women are stereotypically female and it is really sick, the guys get drunk and the girls gossip and the whole thing is totally unhealthy, a bunch of posturing. Only one person there, who is gay, knows who I really am.
But for the sake of marriage, appearances, peace, I have to present as the male binary side. I have to be totally in tune with my core and play the actor here, using only those components these others can handle.
Ugly.
What I dislike is the inauthenticity or requirement for deception -but not of myself - that his trip will require.
This is like playing with a gender grenade. The triggers are going to be rediculous. I have a week of this coming.
I could just imagine the mess that would happen if I bare a leg and shoot my endo prescribed estrogen in view of these people.
Any thoughts on necessary stealth my good friends?
If you saw me through your screen you'd be seeing full mtf transition right now, I am enjoying that component of who i truly am. Starting to look good after a year of hormones too.
Gosh after reading Atavan's stuff i feel like a blasted fool for having to cave in like this. Wonder if sh'e has any idea how much impact sh'e has on all of us here, if sh'e can handle the compliment. What a precious gift to the non binary and trans community that special one is. My understanding of non binary identity is largely based on h'er and Aisla's posts, I am in total agreement with them. Pronouns used here are what make me comfortable, I do not know the preference there, sorry.
Thoughts?
Nails out, hair down, and both temporarily at high risk. LOL. But Satinjoy is not at risk, only h'er nails and hair, and they will grow back. I just hope my wife can handle their return.
Satinjoy,
This sounds really awful. Family is family, and they have to be dealt with. All I can really say is HUGS!!!
My hair is so awful with MPB that cutting it would not be that big a deal (not that I am going to cut it), but the nails... I have had such a time growing them and learning to not break them that cutting them would be heartbreaking.
I hope you get past this trip without the dysphoria crippling you and then you get back to being you as soon as possible.
Good luck!
Erin
My biggest fear is having it to stay that way permanently. That won't work, the dysphoria will backlash and all heck will break loose. I can only do it for a short time, and i am quite fearful of how I will react to the hair issue.
Part of being an inexperienced trans.
And thank you for that hugs. Actually got teared up a sec on that one dear. Gosh I love estrogen and the sensitivity it gives to being able to feel again.
SJ
I am quite worried at what you are being asked to do. If you can't negotiate a significant concession eg send your apologies and not take the trip; or negotiate a minor concession eg hair trim and masculine cut while preserving as much length as possible I fear a dysphoria spike.
To avoid this I suspect that you may be best owning the performance, participate fully, see it for what it is - a mere charade, an illusion of no consequence to you who is secure in their identity; also I know that your love for your wife and faith run very deep indeed - perhaps it may be a powerful and more significant experience if your pain, your charade and your sacrifice is made in honour and celebration of that love and that faith.
Not sure if this helps but I have found that language is extremely impactful. Framing an experience in positive language is empowering and transformative. If you are able to own the performance you may gain far more than the short term pain that you will feel.
I am assuming that this trip means an awful lot to your wife and is not an unhealthy precedent, otherwise my advice would be quite different
Safe travels
Aisla
It is extremely helpful. And I have my antennae up, I sense the trap. Will leave myself an out, use the tools, stay grounded, use the advice, and enjoy the role-play. Great, an alchoholic stealth ts in a booze pit of masculine bulls--t.
The thread is actually intended more for others, not really a fear or vent thread. It is meant to tap how we all feel when we have to go stealthy.
But believe me, I welcome the advice on the more personal levels. And you know me very well, so I am on high alert now.
I have some escape pods planned. And the trip is necessary, to parents who are at life's great end.
Blessings to all.
SJ, hon, you and I are not only on the same trip, we're in the same car. we're doing the same thing for the sake of our families. And I'm no happier for it, either.. but I have been with my wife, longer than I've been without her. I'm not terrified of being alone, as she says I am, I would just have nothing of a heart left if we parted. So, like you, I am regressing. I wouldn't even call it stealth. My nails keep breaking, so I bite them short. My hair is getting longer, tho I had the ends trimmed, but it is getting past that "hmmm, whats going on" stage that others are commenting on. So, I may very well, get a "(I know most of you hate the term) pixie cut, or an androg trim that could be either M or F and still look, thru my eyes, like a girls cut. I wish we were closer, to commiserate, lean on each other when we get that crushing feeling. I have a neverending supply of hugs for you. I -do- know exactly what you are feeling. I have been entrenched in that very same feeling for almost 3months now. And it hasn't got any better. I am taking my E tho, only every several days, to keep my mind from taking my body out for a stroll on the interstate., and it's working, at least for now.
As for being surrounded by neaderthals, or bimbettes, I am also, but to an extent.. The girls I work with, are totally supportive, some joke with me about the boobs I have now, making me laugh and forget the anguish inside. Their hugs and knowing compassionate smiles help loads!! The guys I work with, not so much. I am so very afraid they know or suspect, because each one I work with, makes some trans comment, I think they are trying to test the waters, seeing if they'll get a reaction to either confirm or deny any rumors about me. One said "California now's allowing kids to go into any bathroom they want to make them feel better about themselves.." "Have you worked with ______, our he/she, yet?" I'm dying inside because I want to pummel them for being insensitive, arrogant, "homophobes" (ik they aren't that but you get my meaning). So, yeah, I'm surrounded by them too. But any mention to HR about it, and they would know who/where it came from. So I am to keep it inside.
SJ, the tightest, warmest, longest hugs for you. I hope we can endure this.. this.. trial..
Paula
Thanks dear
Keys to peace and happiness in compromise
Acceptance of her comfort zones and mine. Joy in having commonalities to explore together. Joy at having a working marriage, and knowing that compatible comfort zones are a great gift.
Having said that, the other folks issues, I do not accept. They have a serious problem and perpetuate it, but I must be quiet for the sake of peace.
The physical dysphoria with the hair is a another issue as it is a trigger. But whatever the outcome, it will not steal my joy. Just make the wig important again when I need quality time. ;)
I hope you get the same peace and joy that I have. Acceptance authenticity self validation and knowing who I am at the core was what worked for me
SJ,
Sorry to hear about the reasons for your upcoming trip, and that your extended family are locked into the stepford model of behaviour.
I always wonder how much of the person you see is truly genuine when there are such rigid expectations of behaviour - it is just as probable they are acting a part as much as you will be. With my own side of extended family, I feel quite guarded for reasons similar - I can out on the indifferent male act, but that is purely a defensive mechanism.
As for the hair and nails - the nails will grow back soon enough, and the hair can be as Paula suggested. The fringe on my hair sits somewhere around the tip of my nose, but I get away with it with careful styling and use of product.
Endure, paint a smile on for those who warrant one, and remember that you are giving of yourself for a short time only.
Well, I just gave my wife the greatest gift that I have to give to her. I gave her a pair of sizzors and told her to make herself comfortable. Then I closed my eyes.
When I opened them I saw the original male that married her.
Now lets see just how much strength this transexual has to resist dysphoria in the name of love.
I don't like wigging up, but I have to remember that wigged and dressed i am just as authentically Satinjoy as if it was h'er own hair.
It is going to be very weird when I take off the clothes tonight. The GQ presentation just got more "in your face".
I cannot give my wife a greater gift than this male presentation she originally married.
That is my focus. Positive from ashes. Love from sacrifice.
If I could do it for the stage, I can do it for her.
I am still strong, I am trans, I am real, and I am loved. So be it.
God bless all here. If there is recoil, I know you will pick me up from the floor again.
Love to all who post and who help me. Forced instead becomes a sacrificial gift to avoid the bull of ignorance directed at an innocent woman with the heart of an angel. I will not give them that opportunity. The outsiders cruelty stops with me, it will not reach her.
--Satinjoy
And I may actually be able to trade long hair for short hair and no beard. If that were true, then the whole presentation changes and time spent in full transition becomes time really in full transition. I would love that.
We'll see where it takes me. I hate fooling around with a dysphoric live wire like this. I don't like forced acceptance of stealth.
It gets weird and I percieve it as largely cruel.
But a gift to my wife, that I can do.
Not too stable right now, huh? Lot of rationalization to make the unacceptable acceptable. We'll see where this goes. But I am ok for now. Whatever works to stay sane.
I gotta admit the guy head is attractive, and the girl component knows that. No wonder she wanted me to get the cut so bad.
Life is wierd. I try really hard to make it work somehow.
Negotiate the beard then. Can you get away with shaving it down to a moustache or goatee as an interim compromise? A slow reduction of the beard whilst keeping the hair shortish may work as a compromise. Once beardless, it's only a short step to electro/laser.
I do feel for you, it's all to easy to get depressed, angry, and lash out, but you have admirable restraint. Being forced to do something had never sat well with me, and I can't believe that it would be easy for you either.
The totally unexpected has happened.
I will be shaving the beard off immediately after the trip. My wife made the concession, or maybe I extorted it by telling her I would not grow the hair back in exchange for the removal of the beard.
I am offered the opportunity to change my presentation and mental state from forced genderqueer to androgyne.
I have been empowered with choice based on my own needs. I have not seen my full female self in the mirror in 3 decades.
Oddly there is peace. There is turbulence in my head as memories of the horrifying past return, memories of hatred of me by others, because of my DES formed face, soon to be revealed again.
Now the real fun begins.
Wife loves the male haircut, it will stay. And I am buying a better wig for moments when my hair can come down. Is it inauthentic to have to wig up to present female?
Nails out, head up.
That's great! Give and take in the relationship. I'd trade the hair for the beard anytime. Using a wig to go femme is less confronting for her - long hair probably triggered discomfort. Plenty of dudes with no beard, far fewer with long hair.
Enough time has passed SJ - your face is your own, and the young are hurtful for their lack of understanding.
SJ
Your wife is a real keeper and I think you have come out well ahead. As Luna says swapping out the beard for shorter hair is a great result. Laser and electro with styled shorter hair could help you into a far more authentic and less controlled presentation
Hope the trip goes well
Safe travels
Aisla
Many thanks. I have to remain fluid on the facial hair for the theater so no laser. Body hair is one thing, but I need my full instruments resources to compete in the professional arena. However in stasis, in core, the beard is gone unless my wife recants, which would hurt. But the door is open now.
I can't believe I give the biggest gift I could in the face of my dysphoria, and wound up with a greater one coming back to me, if it comes to pass.
Love to all here
Wow, be out of town or in training for a couple of days and see what I miss? I have to do something like this for my brother next month. We are having a memorial service for my Mom who passed last fall, and setting her ashes in luminaries in the outgoing tide. There will be 60 or more family members there, most of whom are politically to the right of Ronald Regan.
Rich asked me to come as Doug, so as not to distract from why we are there. I love him and agreed, he has more on his plate than anyone ought to have and this is a gift I can give. So Satin Joy my friend we will be going on stage again. The scene is written, the plot improv, and the company hostile. For me this is not a trigger, but for me a gift to my brother. For you, a gift to your beloved. In both cases I think it is right and true.
Am I compromising authenticity. Maybe, but so what. This is a gift to bring to people who we care about. I need not be pure, I must be respectful and loving. That said, I don't have to live this way, and you my dear manage to pull it off without rancor and without going mad. I admire you.
You are beautiful short hair or long. I'm glad you get to ditch the beard, for me that was a huge trigger into self loathing. I'll keep my phone handy for the next few days. Sorry I wasn't able to take your call the other day. Have faith and know peace, I love you sweetie,
Julie
Good heavens Julie ya look gorgeous. No kidding.
Many thanks.
I'll believe the beard is really gone when its gone.
But i have permission, and will shut up and just do it, rather than weakening anything by bringing it up over and over again.
And my wife is taking me to my home racetrack for dinner and racing and fireworks, to celebrate our oncoming 28th anniversary night.
Love it.
Also long hair gets caught in the motor clutch and chain in a professional racekart... Disasterous if it occurrs, not funny it has happened to the girl drivers, killed one of them a few years ago.
Be safe driving tonight, I'll be thinking of you.
You are very kind. Sometimes I feel every one of my sixtyone years. I do what I can with what I've been given.
Happy Anniversary!!!!
j
Can you imagine what it would look like if the wig got into the chain during a race?
Fur flyeth
Best wishes for you, I know you are doing well
SJ
Glad you are in a good space for the weekend, no fur to be 'flyeth'! :D
Aisla
Totally unexpected outcomes going on here. Wanted to check in, say thank you to everyone here, and to let anyone that is curious know that I am doing ok.
As to physical dysphoria, it is at a low presentationally, the environment is way less hostile than I had perceived it, maybe because I finally accepted myself, stopped worrying about hiding, and just started enjoying without attempting the male female thing. There has been some interesting fluidity on the streets of NY here on vacation, the male side went into hyperdrive protection mode. But generally all this therapy and posting and friendship here seem to have made some kind of fundamental shift in comfort zones. Nails that were left all broke off but I was building something, duh, and I have just generally been having a good time. The hardest thing has been keeping my pantlegs from riding up the calf and exposing my legs. Though at this point I am so sick of hiding and refuse to buy into negativity that I really don't care too much.
So I let go and let the body language say whatever it wants and I just comfortably am fitting in. Outed myself more with my nephew so now he knows it all and I have the one major support person in the family. Since he came out as gay, everyone else seems to have mellowed, and instead of the neanderthal thing, it has actually been a good time. Felt really awkward for a couple of hours before our party, but eventually that mellowed out. I just felt a little lonely being the only non male non female in the crowd. Then I danced my butt off and discovered that I have some new moves.... oh my.... but nobody figured anything out and the laughter was genuine. Some of that Broadway dance training stays in the muscle memory I guess, though I never did dance on Broadway, just regional theater and a lot of it. The show I was in where I did dance in rehearsal closed before opening, a classic scenario here.
But it has been a fascinating lesson in just being, in observing the rigid male female roleplay and clearly understanding that I fit neither of those models, and any doubts I have had, or hesitations, about my non binary identity and not wanting to be totally female have been flatly and definitely answered. It is not for me, except physically and hormonally non surgically, and that played down socially as a private thing.
Rambling. But the message to those I care for so much here on the board is that the self examination and ongoing therapy is evidently well worth it, good choices based on truth are really freeing, and there's nothing wrong with this social fluidity that allows you to go anywhere any time and know who you are, while being truly free.
And in my heart I carry an entire forum of binary and non binary dear ones that I hope and pray are having a positive experience as we all carry on as truly unique individuals in a rather strange world. I just want you all to find happiness in who you are.
Love to all here, Satinjoy is doing ok and getting some rest before going back to the battles of the business world, which unfortunately I have been losing. That is another matter, and a scary one.
Enjoy my dear friends. Give yourselves a big hug for you have made a difference in my ability to live without fear of being trans anymore.
Huge, that one.
Off forum again. I have a rule that my obsession with the forum must not take time away from the wife and kids.
Nails broken, hair off, facial hair on (it will stay, it has to -- but now that is my choice and not forced, which is freeing), but who I am is not compromised, as strange as that may sound being stealthy at the moment. I just don't need the drama or the aggravation, its about family joy and rest.
I can doll up again later when I get back in something flowing and soft with my hair back on. The nails will come back. A more jarring presentation with the short hair. Oh well. My own statement I guess against gender conformity.
Thank God for the genderqueer posts, the support, and those fabulous videos showing me I am not alone. Just me being real.
Enjoy dear ones, blessings and love from the big city. Into the wild tomorrow, chatting with parents, having a heart to heart with my father who has funded the hormones and knows the entire deal about DES, and who I am. Incredible. Could not have dreamed that would be possible.
Blessings and Joy. See ya in a week or so, unless I can get online again for a quick dive in, making sure you are all ok and thriving.
:)
SJ
Your insight and personal exploration, insight and growth are quite amazing. You have come so far and achieved so much that you can't fail to excite and encourage others to seek their path and a better future.
I really respect your commitment to your wife and kids, and your determination to protect them at all costs, is quite inspirational.
Resilience, strength and self belief are required to take the journey which you have chosen. You have these qualities in abundance.
Travel safe
Aisla
SJ
What more can I say that Aisla didn't just express. You are delightful and amazing. I understand the concerns when business goes south. For a couple of decades it seemed like every few years I would end up out of work, broke, and wondering what would come next. I have always been provided for, you will be too. That is what faith is all about. Do the footwork, and the results will be what they will be, but usually positive and usually surprising. Have a wonderful time, say hello to the Great White Way for me.
Julie