So I'm worried HRT isn't working at all, I havn't noticed many if any feminizing effects, I've been taking hormones for 4 months now and I'm now taking Estradiol sub-lingually and Spironolactone, I have no breast growth at all, I'm still at AA, I'm seen as a girl even if I'm wearing male clothes but I only think that's because I make attempts at looking more feminine such as wearing make-up, doing my hair, plucking eyebrows, etc. Since starting the hormones I've had no side effects whatsoever which I'm not sure whether to interpret as a good or bad thing because if I had some side effects atleast I'd know they were working, I've had no mood swings, no tender nipples or breast tissue, no increased appetite, just nothing.
Any tips? Should I just give it longer? Should I increase my doses? Should I consult my doctor? What should I do? I'm wondering if I should add a progesterone to the mix, or change my estradiol from oral to needle. Any ideas or input girls? Very much appreciated
Hi, 4 months is not long at all. You just have to be more patient. Cis girls mature over 8-10 years and that is with not fighting "T". :)
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I agree with Jessica . I just started being able to see results after 8 months
Welcome. :) And yes, I agree with the others - I've seen time and time again with the girls that it can take a while to see substantial changes.
Yeah I thought so, it's just a bit discouraging hearing about other MTFs whos breasts have started to mature in just a short amount of time.
And thank you :)
ive been on hormones for 4 months too,but im not worried. i need to wait few months to see the effect..
I guess it's better that I look like a girl before i develop breasts anyway, when I went to my doctors last week the receptionist who i've known for a long time didn't recognise me because she saw me as a girl ;D
Quote from: SophiaF on July 03, 2014, 09:01:50 PM
Yeah I thought so, it's just a bit discouraging hearing about other MTFs whos breasts have started to mature in just a short amount of time.
And thank you :)
Everyones body handles HRT differently and also a key board will stand still for anything.
Take a lot of posts with a grain of salt. Not all is true in internet land.
This is why many have the HRT blues.
Puberty did not happen naturally over night... takes years.
Relax and enjoy the ride
Izzy
It takes time. Honestly, I didn't even start noticing anything substantial until I reached the same hrt length. And finding the right dose and medication combo matters too. I didn't respond much to lower E doses, though some do. Also, make sure to check your levels. I feel like I haven't been making as much progress as I was before, and sure enough, my E levels were much lower than they should be. It's a process, so expect ups and downs with it.
I think there are two ways: HRT works or HRT doesnt work.
It depends on your genes and on your body, less on your medication. I'm 17 month on hormones now and it happens nearly nothing. After changes the medication/application/antiandrogen every 5-6 month i recognized that i cant do anything more and my genes are not "good enough" for feminization. Its a hard fate. :'(
The huge task is to learn to live with the that.
Quote from: galaxy on July 04, 2014, 04:48:35 AM
I think there are two ways: HRT works or HRT doesnt work.
It depends on your genes and on your body, less on your medication. I'm 17 month on hormones now and it happens nearly nothing. After changes the medication/application/antiandrogen every 5-6 month i recognized that i cant do anything more and my genes are not "good enough" for feminization. Its a hard fate. :'(
The huge task is to learn to live with the that.
Galaxy, the trick is to go live life anyway. It's worked for me.
Ahhhh... but what is "Not working" Grasshopper?
HRT affects far more than your physical form. Emotionally, what changes, if any, have there been?
I have been on/off HRT several times in the past since my early 20's. Primarily for what I call the brain reset. It helped immensely for dealing with the dysphoria. Any feminizing effects did not present for about 6 months time. Usually first manifested by things not working as they used to downstairs. A major problem for someone who just wanted to be a "normal guy". My first sign to start stopping.
Did you have emotional changes?
Not for me. I'm the same person as before. I always felt like a woman. Of course the tears come a little bit faster and ive deeper up and downs but my feelings kept the same as the many years before. I'm interested in the same things, i love or hate the same things.
I always dont know what people mean when they talk about "emotional changes" ...
im in the same position... 3 months hrt and pretty much nothing...
Quote from: Annabolton on July 04, 2014, 10:37:39 AM
im in the same position... 3 months hrt and pretty much nothing...
If your picture is anything to go by, do you need HRT? I meant that as a compliment! :)
I think she wants the boobies! ;D I don't blame her, me too. ;) To anyone worried they aren't going to get any or much changes (breasts as well as other physical changes, hips, butt, face, ect), give it some time, lots, you're probably just slow to develop, like me. I got recognized as a woman after a year on them, but still to me didn't understand how so because I didn't look much different than I was before the hormones, just those little things I had done such as plucking hair, make-up and choice of clothing. It probably took me nearly a decade to completely fill an A cup bra, much my time before that I was shopping for bras in the little girls department, now that was embarrassing, to be a full grown woman but having tits like a sparrow. The most breasts growth I think I had was last year, it was very noticeable not only to me but my mom even say it, "Do you have a bra on?" Nope! Hehe ;D
I know you want it, the changes to be fast, but don't rush it, you'll get there, just enjoy the feeling you have within yourself. I suppose the hormones have to be doing something for how you feel, think, your emotions? Mental is the first thing, body comes after. I also know how difficult and upsetting it can be being this whole internet thing and seeing so many others that look drop dead gorgeous, have had such dramatic changes, and then some that results happened so quickly for them, its discouraging (thankfully my only form of internet back when I started was the old WebTV, so very limited on what I could see on screen, otherwise I'd probably had been a mess too) I know and I'm already there and still look at myself critically. As some of the others said, several months just isn't enough time (for some it may be but most not), double or triple that then perhaps you'll see the results you are looking for.
Oh god WebTV, I remember that as a kid lol. Still I dialed a BBS or two so even though I was young at the time I think I am showing my age....
I am wondering, if there are some commonalities between those who HRT seems very effective for like me (my breasts are already C sized and I am 5 months in) and those who it isn't very effective on.
People say age, but that seems to change what changes there are not if it is or isn't effective. I don't really buy the genetics argument either because looking at the girls around I am pretty sure that there isn't much evidence for the one cup size down theory. I also don't think it is regimen, because girls on all different doses and meds have similar and divergent outcomes.
Perhaps diet? Perhaps epigenetics? Some lifestyle factor we are missing? There has to be something at work here.
It is my suspicion that diet and metabolism do indeed play a drastic part in the effectiveness of hormones. I mean, doesn't it make sense that you need to put a bit of fat into your body for the fat redistribution to actually occur? Also, if you were super skinny with a high metabolism to begin with, why would that suddenly change? I mean your body may gain those few extra pounds, but I feel the fat redistribution will take longer.
I think there is some confusion about fat redistribution to begin with, I know I was. The fat you already have will not move around just because you start HRT. You need to intake some fat for your new setup to occur.
Quote from: Hikari on July 04, 2014, 12:14:51 PM
People say age, but that seems to change what changes there are not if it is or isn't effective. I don't really buy the genetics argument either because looking at the girls around I am pretty sure that there isn't much evidence for the one cup size down theory. I also don't think it is regimen, because girls on all different doses and meds have similar and divergent outcomes.
Perhaps diet? Perhaps epigenetics? Some lifestyle factor we are missing? There has to be something at work here.
Two facts are important, nothing more: AGE and GENETICS.
After study really much about endocrinology and hormones, blood counts and transition these two facts are the essence of that all. In most cases it really doesnt matters if you take pills or injections, it doesnt matters if you habe 3mg or 5mg E2, which antiandrogen ... its on you genes and if your genes say you got a breast, you got it. Nothing more. The results are so random ... but if you are young you have good results and if your genes are good you have good results too. Its that simple.
Well I don't know what my genes say, guess none of us do, I've always been quite feminine even before hormones, I'm 22 and the women in my family all have C and D cup breasts.
Thats really good basics ... i'm 37 and have bad genes ... i think i dont have to explain further details.
... on the other hand. If your genes also bad ... :-\
If you could only see how I use to look lol
There is hope for everyone cause before I wasn't feminine, physically.
Def not my face.
It just takes time.
Don't get discouraged ladies! It takes time! My gf felt the same way for a while. Her expectations were so low that I think I was more excited when she started the 'mones than she was :p I asked her everyday for quite some time 'do ya feel different??? any changes??? itchy nips?' and her response was always nope, nope, nope. Well, now that she is a lil over a year on hormones and blockers, she is just now beginning to bud breasts. The most noticiable change she has had is fat redistribution to her thighs. She's always been incredibly thin- bordering on unhealthy, but since hrt she has brought her weight up to 130lbs. Her thighs were unable to touch at all before hormones, now they touch even when they are slightly apart and are super jiggly and awesome :3
But the thing to remember- these small changes took a long time! Her endo seems quite pleased with her results and always tells her that it is a SLOW process. He's really a great doctor with trans patients- first off, he started her on a loooow dose because he wanted her process to mimic cisgirls puberty. He said that would achieve max breast development over time, rather than going on a full female dose right away. He's also now trying to get her t levels into the female range and added progesterone to her regimen. So just give it time, and make sure your endo is knowledgeable with trans patients! Good luck!
Quote from: AnnaCannibal on July 04, 2014, 12:36:56 PM
It is my suspicion that diet and metabolism do indeed play a drastic part in the effectiveness of hormones. I mean, doesn't it make sense that you need to put a bit of fat into your body for the fat redistribution to actually occur? Also, if you were super skinny with a high metabolism to begin with, why would that suddenly change? I mean your body may gain those few extra pounds, but I feel the fat redistribution will take longer.
I think there is some confusion about fat redistribution to begin with, I know I was. The fat you already have will not move around just because you start HRT. You need to intake some fat for your new setup to occur.
My doc pretty much said this exact thing to me; he said I was naturally skinny so to get the best results it might be worth putting on a bit of weight. So I've tried to take in a bit of extra fat to help things along; not a lot, just a bit more than usual. Together with the muscle loss I've had so far its meant my body has started to shift overall towards a more female shape. I still feel like I've a long way to go though.
My doctor also said to me that everyone is completely different in how they are affected by HRT; some have very few results, some have a lot early on and then plateau, others have a gradual consistent change. But four months is still pretty early. I have been on oestrogen for five months and whilst I'm pretty pleased with how my body has responded so far, at four months my face had not changed one bit as far as I could tell, aside from slightly softer skin. Then this last month it has seemed to round out a bit more, my skin got softer still and stopped being so oily to the point of extreme dryness in places. So things can happen quite suddenly and in bursts. I think sometimes I don't even notice changes until they have already happened, if that makes sense. Same goes for the mental changes.
You're best off seeing what your blood test results are like and going from there. It's still early days yet :)
The effect of HRT has been underwhelming for me so far too, and I am 10 months in. It certaintly isn't easy to keep seeing the same face that you hate day out and day in when nothing seems to be happening, but at least I feel a lot better mentally now, and can deal with the frustration and envy I often feel. I do have good results from tests, but I guess for some the changes just take a lot longer. At least I hope they do.
What do you mean with "it will take time"??
I'm over 17 month now on hormones and t-blocker and the only change is a softer skin over the whole body and my acne is gone. My fat is still storaged at the belly and my breast was growing by 4-5cm (2inch) - thats 1 year ago. Ive notice no other real changes in that time. When it will happen when you say "it will take time" ... ?
Slow developer like myself, "it will take time", equals to still seeing changes even now after well over a decade on hormones (had some breaks in between that time a few times), but oh ever so slight. Yes, it takes time, this usually doesn't mean right away, nor even 1-2 years, could be 5, even 10, maybe you don't even realize how much you may've changed already. If you don't really notice it is because its very subtle, but I assure you, if you're taking hormones and have been on them for over 17 months, the changes are there. Got any before and after pics to compare. Find a before hormones pic of you, then try to duplicate everything, from lighting, your position, posture, facial expression, even try to wear something relatively similar, now take an after pic, compare the two.
And you want to get rid of that belly fat, you're going to have to work that off, cis-women get belly rolls too. My belly though never really fat, I was able to grab a few inches between my fingers a couple months ago (I had a waist still much like a guy), had a little bit of a roll there, worked that off by exercising, mostly stretches, still have a little bit but at least now I have a feminine curve to my waist that I never had before. Hormones aren't going to do all the work, they'll change your mood hopefully for the more positive so you can feel better about you, and they'll soften you up a bit (some more than others, probably depends on your metabolism) adding some nice layers of fat over your muscles, give you breasts (again, some just are lucky here, I'm still tiny pre-teen sized), perhaps add some fat to your hips (definitely did for me, I was flat as a board before every way), maybe stop your head hair from falling out, slow the growth of body hair a little, but aside from all this, what more can you expect without surgical intervention. Yes, it takes time, sometimes unfortunately longer for others than some. Just know that if you are taking them, they gotta be doing you some good.
I was taking theres pictures, descripted by you: same camera, same light, same position. I wanted this pics to have a some stuff for a realistic comparison. After checking these photos i recognized my body didnet changed in any way. Same hip-structur, waist, belly, muscles ... its really a absurdity. I cant believe it to myself but theres no difference between the pictures than a little more fad at the belly and a wider waist ... 10 years? I will be nearly 50 in ten years :'(
I was into high-performance sport before my transition, had 8% bodyfat / BMI 20 and nevertheless a little belly. I had always a little belly. Now after haveing hormones for 17 month, 4kg more, i have more regular execerise, twice a week running, some fitness, situps, squats ... nothing crazy, always to keep healthy and for controlling the weight. I really invest much time and power to become a feminine body, but i all dont work for me. My bellyfat is really tough - it happen nothing there or somewhere else.
Before HRT: waist 74cm, hips 94cm, 5cm breast, 59 kg
After 17 month: waist 79cm, hips 96cm, 9cm breast, 63 kg
Numbers dont lie ...
maybe if you posted a before and after picture we can tell you if we see the same as you
Quote from: stephaniec on July 06, 2014, 01:18:01 PM
maybe if you posted a before and after picture we can tell you if we see the same as you
Why is it so hard to believe that some of us simply don't get the results we are led to expect?
Quote from: kelly_aus on July 06, 2014, 01:24:15 PM
Why is it so hard to believe that some of us simply don't get the results we are led to expect?
I can understand , but I also see from my own face how difficult it is for me to see changes because I've lived inside my head for so long. I only caught a glimpse of some change when some one else posed they saw change. I struggle daily if not hourly with seeing change because of my internal subjectivity. Plus I've never made measurements of myself before or after HRT so I haven't the slightest idea if I've changed in any way.
4 months is not long at all. Everyone changes at different speeds, so you need to just live your life, stop worrying and changes will happen :).
And its not about, how high your dose is. It's about what dose is right for you.
Quote from: kelly_aus on July 06, 2014, 01:24:15 PM
Why is it so hard to believe that some of us simply don't get the results we are led to expect?
You're right, I bet quite a few people really don't get the results they were hoping. I think its hard to believe for some people because those people not getting results don't post many pictures, whereas the real dramatic changers are what stick in someone's mind. I think it may also be harder to believe because we tend to be harder on ourselves and what may be a suitable enough change to others, is insignificant to ourselves.
Quote from: AnnaCannibal on July 06, 2014, 02:00:26 PM
You're right, I bet quite a few people really don't get the results they were hoping. I think its hard to believe for some people because those people not getting results don't post many pictures, whereas the real dramatic changers are what stick in someone's mind. I think it may also be harder to believe because we tend to be harder on ourselves and what may be a suitable enough change to others, is insignificant to ourselves.
very true
Well maybe I am a bit hard on myself, my family and my doctor all say they've seen big changes in just these 4 months, also I sent a short video to my friends last week and they said if they saw me on the streets now they wouldn't recognise me and would think I'm a girl.
I was just worried because my breasts haven't grown at all but as you've all said it's only been 4 months, failing that I live in England and the gender clinic offer free breast augmentation after 18 months of being on hormones so there's always that option.
I'm going to quote myself from a similar thread..
Quote3 years on hormones and still haven't made it to a AA-cup.. Fat still accumulates in the standard male places.. No hips.. No butt.. Minimal, if any, facial changes. The avatar pic predates hormones by a long, long time.
Levels have been fine the whole time. Different delivery methods make no difference to levels or development. So, no, it doesn't happen for everyone - and, frankly, I'm surprised that anyone is saying so..
Some of you got a PM with pictures ...
I dont want to post it here official!
3 years of breast growth..
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FeTAYSSp.jpg&hash=f9cc8fd6c0c8e2e0244c247f4bf95f508aa44d2a)
Looks like no growth ... why dont you do an augmentation?
Quote from: galaxy on July 06, 2014, 03:36:21 PM
Looks like no growth ... why dont you do an augmentation?
Could it be a lack of money?
Could it be a lack of existing breast to augment?
Could it be the small problem that anaesthesia like to try and kill me?
Or could it just be that it makes no real difference to me?
Quote from: kelly_aus on July 06, 2014, 04:26:17 PM
Could it be a lack of money?
Could it be a lack of existing breast to augment?
Could it be the small problem that anaesthesia like to try and kill me?
Or could it just be that it makes no real difference to me?
Well, you look happy and that's the most important thing I think. :)
You look fine Kelly-aus. Afterall, while many of us may want biggest breasts (I certainly do), they don't make a woman.
I started hormones, injectable estradiol valerate back in May 2001 (missed 2 years and some months in between though), today I still only just fit in an A cup. Last year was my biggest breast growth, that's when I finally filled out my bras better. Most of my years on hormones I was shopping the smallest size I could find, basically training bras. Sometimes it just takes a while, a long while.
Hi SophiaF,
I agree that 4 months is not a lot of time, if I remember correctly, I think my breasts were really sore at 3 months. and my body hair was thinning, skin was getting softer. The changes are gradual, but you will start to notice more differences over time. And if you don't enough feminization from HRT, surgery will get you where you want to be.
Funny I was reviewing a paper yesterday on breast growth in trans*women in Europe and there was a statement that most trans*women in the survey were unhappy with the degree of breast development, the average development was to an A cup and 70% sought BA at some time.
Thats right ... most of the women i know go to BA and most of them dont have an A or AA.
Ok I would like to ask a question here as I am dumb as a nail to HRT. I moved away from my family and son to be more myself. And yes we are still close but they wouldn't understand and my son is a adult now. I'm very ok with that. My question is I DON'T want a 42 DD. Can you stop and keep what you have at any point? Also do you have to deal with a doctor to get medication or is there other routes? I live in a rural area and we'll to be honest..... I just don't want to go thru the headaches.
Quote from: Autumn Faith on July 11, 2014, 04:36:53 PM
Ok I would like to ask a question here as I am dumb as a nail to HRT. I moved away from my family and son to be more myself. And yes we are still close but they wouldn't understand and my son is a adult now. I'm very ok with that. My question is I DON'T want a 42 DD. Can you stop and keep what you have at any point? Also do you have to deal with a doctor to get medication or is there other routes? I live in a rural area and we'll to be honest..... I just don't want to go thru the headaches.
There are informed consent clinics, it doesn't have to be an endocrinologist, but they will still usually send you to get blood tests done by a doctor, just they aren't all gate keeper like some doctors are.
While the likelyhood of a 42DD is pretty low, AFAIK they will grow until your body says enough so long as you take estrogen. If you just stopped taking HRT all of the really nice things like the different skin and whatnot would stop, and T would take control again (or if you had T factories removed, you would lose bone density until you got some sex hormone back in your system)....Ciswomen don't get to choose their size, and many do opt for a reduction for various reasons. In any case it is very unlikely to get such a big result so, I wouldn't worry too much about it.
Quote from: Autumn Faith on July 11, 2014, 04:36:53 PM
Ok I would like to ask a question here as I am dumb as a nail to HRT. I moved away from my family and son to be more myself. And yes we are still close but they wouldn't understand and my son is a adult now. I'm very ok with that. My question is I DON'T want a 42 DD. Can you stop and keep what you have at any point? Also do you have to deal with a doctor to get medication or is there other routes? I live in a rural area and we'll to be honest..... I just don't want to go thru the headaches.
No love, you can't stop it. You get what you get and that may be tiny, back-breakingly huge or somewhere in between.
To answer your other question, you don't HAVE to go through a doctor but given the widespread effects of HRT across all the body's systems it is (to understate things a bit) a fair bit safer to have someone who knows what to test and what the readings from the tests mean advising you.
Rosie
Ok thank you both. At times I wish I lived in the usa. I believe it would make things easier as many have gone before me to pave the way. While it may be common in Toronto or Vacouver.... the rest of the country at times still seems like it's in the dark ages.
Give it time, four months is nothing. You're probably just on a super tiny dose; Endos are notoriously conservative at the start of transition.
I've been on for more than a year and my boobs are still small. It takes years to achieve any substantial development.