I think this is the first time I've ever posted anything negative, I've been full-time for about 2 months and while waiting for a friend at a bar the guy next to me clocked me.
Usually I'm able to turn these situations into a positive thing but in this case the guy was, well a huge ahole and started making noise, I held my head high, paid my bill and walked but as I did so my previous self reared his ugly head and for the first time in 20 years I was tempted to turn back and give him a life lesson, perhaps it's just the hormones but I have not been so mad in years, I literally saw red.
During my time in the Balkans and the Middle East I was always able to keep a level head but I feel like I'm less in control, is it it just a phase or are these the emotions I'll have to deal with for the foreseeable future?
How did he clock you? Did he throw slur words at you?
I don't think it was the walk of shame...more like the walk of safety. Drunk douchebags can get violent pretty quickly.
Sort of a phase and sort of not. We're like hormonal teenagers in our early years of hrt so it's hard sometimes to keep our emotions at bay, especially in a situation like that. However it does get easier but that comes with in time after you've gotten used to the new you, hope that makes sense. Since estrogen takes down the emotional shield that testosterone gives you, it's a really tough change to deal with at first.
You did the right thing by leaving - definitely better to be safe. It's understandable to be angry though, your right to be there and your personal safety was violated by this a-hole. Sorry you had to go through that.
The walk of pride IMO.
Every woman, trans or cis meets aholes. We do what all decent women do, be proud and leave them to crawl back under their rock
You did the wise thing. Cis or trans, when you're with an aggressive person, whether the aggression is related to race, religion, gender, or just him not liking the looks of you, you need to decide what's going to have the best outcome. I think you kept a very level head.
But that situation is scary. Not necessarily a trans thing, right? I mean a huge percentage of the cis female population has come in contact with violent or sexually aggressive men. It's terrifying because very real harm comes to women in those situations. I don't think any of us ever feel comfortable even after we escape.
When that sort of thing happens to me (which is very rare - I don't think it's happened to me ever as an adult, though as a kid I was bullied frequently) I just remember that attempting to instill fear in someone who is not harming you is a nasty and anti social, and that I've just stared into the eyes of evil.
After a good night's sleep, I'm feeling much more calm, sorry about venting my emotions but what surprised me was how emotional I was about the whole thing.
I wonder how much of it was the guy being a jerk and how much of it was just my bruised ego from him being able to tell I was trans.
I don't really think I was in much physical danger but in any case leaving the place was the right thing to do.
Sorry for being a drama queen but I was pretty upset when I got home last night.
He was looking for a fight to give his useless little life some meaning. You didn't give him one, he remains useless, and you stood tall and proud.
Kudos to you Antonia!
Quote from: Cindy on August 13, 2014, 03:54:14 AM
The walk of pride IMO.
Every woman, trans or cis meets aholes. We do what all decent women do, be proud and leave them to crawl back under their rock
This, and I also think that you did the right thing 8) A-holes will show up somewhere from time to time, if it amounts to nothing more than verbal abuse it is best to ignore them and walk away - Possibly inform the personnel working there that some drunk is bothering you
Always avoid a physical conflict unless they attack you and there is no other choice but to defend yourself as best as possible
No worries about venting, we are all here for you
Glad you're okay
Hugs
Quote from: rosinstraya on August 13, 2014, 06:53:38 AM
He was looking for a fight to give his useless little life some meaning. You didn't give him one, he remains useless, and you stood tall and proud.
Kudos to you Antonia!
^^ This!
I get angry when I rarely encounter these situations but it makes far more sense to walk away whenever you can.
I'd be angry too if something like that happened to me. I think your emotions were valid, and while you may have felt out of control at the time, I think you actually demonstrated good judgment and made a positive decision. Maybe you weren't in harm's way but it's often better to walk away than to get in a confrontation, because even if it wasn't physically dangerous it could have involved a lot of heated emotions and made you feel worse.
It is strange and sad to me that anyone would be deliberately and publicly insulting to anyone for any reason. This is bullying, nothing more, but nothing less either. Antonia, you are a strong and beautiful woman, that you should be treated with anything other than courtesy and respect is appalling. That this happened north of Texas is inexcusable.
What I do not know, is how to respond in a way that gives consequences to bad behavior. Most men are bigger and stronger than I am by a petty fair amount. I am no threat physically. But even if I was, to walk is the prudent and correct thing to do. It galls me that this sort of thing has few if any penalties for the perp. And even if hate crime or bullying statutes apply, then you are stuck with hours of followup. I have complained to the pub owner in years past, I have no idea if anything positive resulted.
Perhaps one day people will routinely treat each other with compassion and respect. Perhaps that will happen on the same day that hell freezes over. I hope it doesn't take that long.
Anyone have any proactive ideas? :-\
Julie
it takes courage to walk.
As all who have responded to this have said, you did do the right thing. My own reaction though would probably be wrong on every possible count. I have not encountered this reaction but something tells me I would resort to past behavior and do the wrong thing. Most likely I would tell him no matter what you consider me to be, are you ready to get your teeth knocked out by a woman? Just my past rearing its known ways I guess due to a life of homelessness, drug use, antisocial behavior, and a total lack of regard for consequences. Now dont get me wrong I have changed my character radically in the last decade and a half or so, but how I would act right in the moment is unknown. It is probably a good thing I've read this as I can play out a few scenario's so as to be prepared. I think the ONE thing that would cause me to react as you did would be to avoid that same person from taking it out on an innocent unsuspecting person at a later time. Thanks for this as you might have saved some possible grief, or worse. Dani
Quote from: antonia on August 13, 2014, 06:46:22 AM
After a good night's sleep, I'm feeling much more calm, sorry about venting my emotions but what surprised me was how emotional I was about the whole thing.
I wonder how much of it was the guy being a jerk and how much of it was just my bruised ego from him being able to tell I was trans.
I don't really think I was in much physical danger but in any case leaving the place was the right thing to do.
Sorry for being a drama queen but I was pretty upset when I got home last night.
Hey, everyone needs to vent. I've been in similar situations. It sucks when you have to deal with it. But letting it out is better than keeping it bottled up.
The only direct confrontation i've ever really had was late last year. A drunk guy came into work at the end of my shift and starting yelling about how disgusting it was that my hair was in a pony tail. It was really weird, I had figured that after 2 years of being full time, everyone had either accepted me or gotten over it. It was scary, but then one of my coworkers chased him out with a broom so I felt a lot better after that.
Quote from: Newgirl Dani on August 13, 2014, 04:52:42 PM
As all who have responded to this have said, you did do the right thing. My own reaction though would probably be wrong on every possible count. I have not encountered this reaction but something tells me I would resort to past behavior and do the wrong thing. Most likely I would tell him no matter what you consider me to be, are you ready to get your teeth knocked out by a woman? Just my past rearing its known ways I guess due to a life of homelessness, drug use, antisocial behavior, and a total lack of regard for consequences. Now dont get me wrong I have changed my character radically in the last decade and a half or so, but how I would act right in the moment is unknown. It is probably a good thing I've read this as I can play out a few scenario's so as to be prepared. I think the ONE thing that would cause me to react as you did would be to avoid that same person from taking it out on an innocent unsuspecting person at a later time. Thanks for this as you might have saved some possible grief, or worse. Dani
I think one upside to being M2F is that reservoir of male fortitude we can still rely on in case of 'emergency'...
It takes courage to walk. Very wise words :)
I have the same problem, my ego/my inner being is hurt and literally vandalised by getting clocked. Not that the people are rude or anything, it's the very fact of getting clocked.
Time heals, girlfriend :) Good luck!
Quote from: Evelyn K on August 14, 2014, 12:18:20 AM
I think one upside to being M2F is that reservoir of male fortitude we can still rely on in case of 'emergency'...
Dont count on that "reservoir" to last for long time. When I was 2 months into HRT, I also had one incident (I was not the target, but decided to step in) - oh, how my blood was boiling despite any previous calming efforts from E... Well, no bloodshed occurred and no limbs were broken, but I felt ready for that kind of turn of events. Now, I would only engage hand-to-hand with a man, if I had no other choice and if I had something blunt to whack him over the head as soon as possible.
Yeah, that wasn't a real walk of shame Antonia, that was a walk of pride. Let idiots be idiots.
Quote from: Cindy on August 13, 2014, 03:54:14 AM
The walk of pride IMO.
Every woman, trans or cis meets aholes. We do what all decent women do, be proud and leave them to crawl back under their rock
Well said!
Quote from: Evelyn K on August 14, 2014, 12:18:20 AM
I think one upside to being M2F is that reservoir of male fortitude we can still rely on in case of 'emergency'...
I've never been big/strong enough to take on most men. So I've always known that my only chance is to fight dirty. As a woman, that won't change. One swift blow to the groin...and the playing field is level.
It's not lady-like. But as you said, it's just in case of emergency.
All i will add to these very good comments is this:
Don't feed the monkeys >:-)
Quote from: Myarkstir on August 14, 2014, 06:14:57 PM
Don't feed the monkeys >:-)
There's an old Polish proverb. "Not my circus. Not my monkeys."
You did well in not confronting a drunk ass. You left with pride.
He's just as paranoid of you as you are of him, but you didn't let him win, so that's good on you :) Personally, I would never go into a place like a bar, alone. I know you were meeting a friend there, but it's best to go in the same time.
I wonder how many of those that are most vocally against us or give us a hard time do so because they are afraid of their own feelings be it because they are attracted to trans people or because they might be trans themselves.
I guess I've gone from mad to feeling sorry for the guy :-\
Wow, well done! Anger is almost always a secondary emotion. You were insulted and embarrassed. Your feelings were hurt and you responded as most of us do with anger. The anger happened after the insult and the feelings of powerlessness and is an automatic response to that. It is a mental adaptation that has kept us from being eaten or killed by someone from a different group since the Pleistocene.
To move from there to sympathy rocks. I sometimes never get there, but I know from long experience that until I do, I continually pay a price, my stomach is not calm, my mind does not focus. I am proud to know you - Thank You
Julie
Quote from: antonia on August 15, 2014, 07:57:56 AMI guess I've gone from mad to feeling sorry for the guy :-\
Nice 'transition' ;D
Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on August 14, 2014, 04:04:27 PM
Dont count on that "reservoir" to last for long time. When I was 2 months into HRT, I also had one incident (I was not the target, but decided to step in) - oh, how my blood was boiling despite any previous calming efforts from E... Well, no bloodshed occurred and no limbs were broken, but I felt ready for that kind of turn of events. Now, I would only engage hand-to-hand with a man, if I had no other choice and if I had something blunt to whack him over the head as soon as possible.
I am 2 months plus on HRT, and I agree, while it might help to have a bit more "reservoir" than the average cis girl, I agree you cannot count on that having much endurance or power...from all I have heard, physical strength and endurance take a nosedive.
Johanna.
Quote from: antonia on August 15, 2014, 07:57:56 AM
I wonder how many of those that are most vocally against us or give us a hard time do so because they are afraid of their own feelings be it because they are attracted to trans people or because they might be trans themselves.
I guess I've gone from mad to feeling sorry for the guy :-\
Antonia, I have often wondered a similar thing during sporting events or on online sports discussion forums...the amount of "hidden gay admiration/bashing" is phenomenal.
There are always tons of comments such as "That's so gay" when another person disagrees with what someone said or did, references to gay-type intimate events, etc.
I often wonder if the most serious and intense and repetitive "gay bashers" are in fact closet gays -- whether they would admit it or not.
Johanna.
Quote from: JohannaJohn on August 15, 2014, 11:20:29 AM
I am 2 months plus on HRT, and I agree, while it might help to have a bit more "reservoir" than the average cis girl, I agree you cannot count on that having much endurance or power...from all I have heard, physical strength and endurance take a nosedive.
Mostly strenght - endurance actually a kind of boost, but it is a different kind of boost.
Quote from: antonia on August 15, 2014, 07:57:56 AM
I wonder how many of those that are most vocally against us or give us a hard time do so because they are afraid of their own feelings be it because they are attracted to trans people or because they might be trans themselves.
I guess I've gone from mad to feeling sorry for the guy :-\
I suspect that some (not all, but some) are afraid of us, for various reasons. We upset the notion of male supremacy. Here's someone who was "born male" but who rejects it? Then there is the internalized transphobia. More than one transphobic person has been trans themselves, just as many of the biggest homophobic names over the last 50 years turned out to be homosexuals themselves. And there is misunderstanding, that we are assumed to be "perverts", that this is a "lifestyle choice", that we may try to "recruit" children, and other such ignorant nonsense.
Quote from: antonia on August 15, 2014, 07:57:56 AM
I wonder how many of those that are most vocally against us or give us a hard time do so because they are afraid of their own feelings be it because they are attracted to trans people or because they might be trans themselves.
I guess I've gone from mad to feeling sorry for the guy :-\
^^ Yep. Does the phrase, "The lady doth protest too much, methinks" ;D
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_lady_doth_protest_too_much,_methinks
Quote from: antonia on August 15, 2014, 07:57:56 AM
I wonder how many of those that are most vocally against us or give us a hard time do so because they are afraid of their own feelings be it
because they are attracted to trans people or because they might be trans themselves.
I guess I've gone from mad to feeling sorry for the guy :-\
Exactly, I wouldn't doubt he was probably sexually attracted to you as you are beautiful from your avatar. His knowing somehow that you don't fit into his own preconceived notions about what a man is or what a woman is makes him question who he is as a man.
I like to say that any experience you ever have in your life was something you wanted at one point. For you, perhaps, just wanted to shatter some A-hole's ego.
Exactly :)
Quote from: Evelyn K on August 15, 2014, 04:34:31 PM
^^ Yep. Does the phrase, "The lady doth protest too much, methinks" ;D
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_lady_doth_protest_too_much,_methinks