So, I am not on T, but I am read male much more often than female. About a month ago I made a decision that I simply wasn't going to use the women's room anymore. I am over the 20 years of crap I have had to deal with in there. So, I started using the men's room. I don't use a public restroom often, so it has been fine and not really stressful. There is also a stall open.
What I have been thinking about though is what happens if when you go into the bathroom the stall is filled and but there are guys using the urinals? Do you wait and increase the risk of them noticing you are female (since you are just standing there), or do you leave?
Also, is it normal for a guy to hang around and wait for the stall? What do you look at while you wait for the stall? In the women's room it's normal to just kind of lean against the wall and watch the women do their thing in the mirror. What do you do in the guy's room? Look at the floor?
Thanks, guys.
I can't imagine that just because you're waiting to use a stall, they're gunna connect that you're "female." They're obviously just gunna think you have to poop. I highly doubt they'd even think about you being there anyway as long as you're not staring at them as they turn around from the urinal or anything.
I'd lean against the wall and flick through my phone, probably.
Quote from: Kyler on September 07, 2014, 06:42:07 PM
I can't imagine that just because you're waiting to use a stall, they're gunna connect that you're "female." They're obviously just gunna think you have to poop. I highly doubt they'd even think about you being there anyway as long as you're not staring at them as they turn around from the urinal or anything.
I'd lean against the wall and flick through my phone, probably.
Thanks for this. I didn't think about the phone.
What I am wondering the most about is that since I am not on T, if they decide to look in a studied way, they might read me as female. Like a guy in front of the mirror looking back or something. I don't know. Standing there is different from "in and out", which is why I have been comfortable going in. This is new to me and wondering what other guys who may not always pass do.
Is it normal? Totally. Some guys are pee shy, some just have to take a crap. I'll usually wash my hands while I wait, or just leave and wait outside the door if it takes them longer than it takes me to wash my hands.
I don't know if I'd pull out a phone while waiting inside, someone might think you are trying to record or photograph their junk.
Quote from: Brett on September 07, 2014, 06:45:23 PM
What I am wondering the most about is that since I am not on T, if they decide to look in a studied way, they might read me as female. Like a guy in front of the mirror looking back or something. I don't know. Standing there is different from "in and out", which is why I have been comfortable going in. This is new to me and wondering what other guys who may not always pass do.
I've used men's bathrooms before I even knew I was trans at times because I didn't want to use the same bathroom as my friends if I had to poop while on road trips, etc. People might have side-eyed me but they wouldn't say anything. I know that people have been known to get beat up and stuff but no one has come at me aggressively. I live in Indiana and I traveled through the south while using men's bathrooms, pre-t and "non-passable."
If your phone is facing the ground, I don't see how on earth anyone would think you're recording them.
When I went in and the stalls were full I just hovered by the door which was away from all the guys peeing and stared at the floor. Not in a nervous way, but in an 'I'm bored' way. Two other guys came in and did the same. As someone else said, you can wash your hands while you wait too, if standing feels awkward. I don't think guys are going to notice anything different if you're just standing there versus if you were moving around.
I've seen guys wait for the stall. I distinctly remember one guy just messing about with his phone. Personally, I hang around for a minute but then I leave after for a few and do something else.
I wait for a stall, guys won't notice or cAre. I just usually stand there and wait for a stall to open. No one ever says anything. It's normal, they will think you have to crap or pee shy or just won't think anything of it.
This may be needless or awkward but if you want to look busy enough, I guess you can wet a small portion of the clothing you're wearing as if 'washing a stain' :D
You can't poop in a urinal, can you? Good excuse to wait for a stall.
Quote from: Brett on September 07, 2014, 06:45:23 PM
What I am wondering the most about is that since I am not on T, if they decide to look in a studied way, they might read me as female.
Guys tend not to study each other, especially not in a bathroom. You're fine.
Thanks, guys and ladies. I appreciate the comments. So for those who don't always pass, but use the men's room, you just hope for the best and stay in there until the stall opens? If there are a couple of guys waiting I assume no one talks to one another? I see women do that. Although my voice is not high, it can give me away.
Quote from: Jess42 on September 07, 2014, 09:26:24 PM
You can't poop in a urinal, can you? Good excuse to wait for a stall.
You can, but it's usually frowned upon.
I don't pass well and I have waiting for a stall before. nothing happened. no one talked to me and no one else was talking.
Quote from: aross1015 on September 07, 2014, 09:59:11 PM
You can, but it's usually frowned upon.
I once had to clean poop out of a urinal. that really, really stunk
Quote from: Brett on September 07, 2014, 09:40:30 PM
Thanks, guys and ladies. I appreciate the comments. So for those who don't always pass, but use the men's room, you just hope for the best and stay in there until the stall opens? If there are a couple of guys waiting I assume no one talks to one another? I see women do that. Although my voice is not high, it can give me away.
I'm pre-T so I pass mostly as a teenage boy. Started using the mens room after getting weird looks in the womens. As long as I don't talk I'm good. I typically scout the places I'm in to find the least used bathrooms tho so I don't run into the full bathroom scenario.
why would you ever want to talk to a stranger in the men's bathroom?
i wouldn't want anyone thinking i'm trying to hit on them.
Sorry for chiming in, but one of those unwritten rules is not to look at others. Those at urinals wont notice or care because they are too busy with their own "stuff", the rest will be busy with washing their hands and getting away from mirror... Recently, I started to wonder if there is another rule like not spending more than 5 secs in front if mirror... taking more time will get more side-glances somehow.
I also remember seeing small lines inside when guys were waiting for stalls, because there are quite a lot of people who are pee-shy.
I've used the men's bathrooms since I was 15, pre-T, pre-coming out, sometimes even not-passing, and no one has ever said anything or given me any weird looks. I live in Europe though, so maybe things are different here than in the US, who knows. Also, when all the stalls are filled I just stand there waiting, what else is there to do anyway? It's not like you have to wait for long, it's usually less than a minute! And if you get bored waiting you can always check your phone, wash your hands, look in the mirror etc.
I know of at least one guy who went in, stall was full so he fluffed his hair in the mirror and left. I saw it all through the crack in the stall door.
It's rare, but queues do happen in the dude's restroom. More common in peak hours (like a movie just came out or a lot if trains came in, etc).
There are a few unwritten cardinal rules about using the mens room. The first one is don't talk to anyone, and the second one is don't make eye contact. Its just the way things are done in there.
So, given these two rules no one will say anything to you although sideways glances do happen from time to time.
As far as standing in a line it depends on how badly you need to go and how bad it smells in there. I have turned around and left before when I saw a line and I would come back later, or if it reeked really badly and I could wait awhile I'd come back later to give it time to air out (what do those people eat!?!? - yeesh!).
As others have said if you don't take a urinal when it becomes available people will just assume that you have to take a crap. It is considered polite to gesture to the guy behind you to go ahead and use the urinal.
If i had to wait in a line I'd usually find neutral places to stare at until it was my turn. In my experience guys usually use their phones only when they are in a stall. You could play with your phone while you stand in line but make sure it's pointed away from anyone else.
And like someone else said you minimize the time spent in front of the mirror. Use the time that you are washing your hands to check your appearance.
I live on Osaka, which is a city of 8 million. When I go I to the guys, I just wait. They assume I have to ->-bleeped-<- and I've guys line up behind me. The bathrooms here have 14 urinals and 2 stalls. I've had salary men, old guys, youngsters and everything else behind me in train stations and busy stores. Sometimes I leave and go to a different bathroom but a lot of guys do. Just act bored and they don't seem to notice. It's a "I have crap and do does the other guy. Oh well. Read the news" sort of deal. I've been in bathrooms where I waited and waved old men and men with disabled wards in front and they think nothing other than "that was a nice young guy.".
I don't pass 100% in the us, but even then the guys just think "oh well" or at the very least they don't say anything. The one time I was asked in the states the guy said "right room?" And I just nodded and added "can't grow a beard." He laughed and told me "you ain't the only one, son. At least you don't have a dog with mange on your face."
Quote from: Brett on September 07, 2014, 06:36:33 PM
So, I am not on T, but I am read male much more often than female. About a month ago I made a decision that I simply wasn't going to use the women's room anymore. I am over the 20 years of crap I have had to deal with in there. So, I started using the men's room. I don't use a public restroom often, so it has been fine and not really stressful. There is also a stall open.
What I have been thinking about though is what happens if when you go into the bathroom the stall is filled and but there are guys using the urinals? Do you wait and increase the risk of them noticing you are female (since you are just standing there), or do you leave?
Also, is it normal for a guy to hang around and wait for the stall? What do you look at while you wait for the stall? In the women's room it's normal to just kind of lean against the wall and watch the women do their thing in the mirror. What do you do in the guy's room? Look at the floor?
Thanks, guys.
Stand near the stalls, not by the urinals if possible, and wait. Nobody knows that you may only have to pee. Don't look like it bothers you because you aren't using the urinal. For me, that is when I wish even more that I could use the women's room.
I have seen cis women come in and use the stalls in the men's room. Some men don't pay any attention to them while others might make a rude comment. Those women just ignore any rude comments and and go on about their business with no reprocussions. Why can't men receive the same respect in the women's restroom?
Better yet, why can't we just have multi-user unisex restrooms with private stalls and respect each other's privacy?
i heard a story from a guy in london once, in a discussion about really odd experiences. he'd gone to the bathroom, and while he was there, some girl managed to go inside, do her business, and then leave. he didn't have any idea how to react, so he didn't.
i think you can find many stories about women presenting female who've gotten safely in and out of the men's bathroom.
I usually leave. Then again I usually just would rather not stand around in a bathroom... or any room with men lining the walls and peeing. If the situation has time constraints or there isn't another bathroom nearby I'll just wait it out. Sometimes there are lines like in the ladies room. I've seen it happen.
Quote from: Taka on September 08, 2014, 01:57:48 PM
i heard a story from a guy in london once, in a discussion about really odd experiences. he'd gone to the bathroom, and while he was there, some girl managed to go inside, do her business, and then leave. he didn't have any idea how to react, so he didn't.
i think you can find many stories about women presenting female who've gotten safely in and out of the men's bathroom.
Once in the Frankfurt airport an older lady for some reason decided to follow me into men's room (I assume she thought I knew where I was heading - well, I did... - and went with the flow). I think she got as far as pass the sinks and mirrors and was just about to turn around ti face the stalls when she realised that something was wrong. Well, the reaction from guys was kinda "whatever" - nobody said anything, pretty much zero reaction. I guess, men dont really see women as any kind of threats in their restroom... they are rather amused by the situation but wont show that...
Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on September 08, 2014, 02:48:10 PM
Once in the Frankfurt airport an older lady for some reason decided to follow me into men's room (I assume she thought I knew where I was heading - well, I did... - and went with the flow). I think she got as far as pass the sinks and mirrors and was just about to turn around ti face the stalls when she realised that something was wrong. Well, the reaction from guys was kinda "whatever" - nobody said anything, pretty much zero reaction. I guess, men dont really see women as any kind of threats in their restroom... they are rather amused by the situation but wont show that...
Women, on the other hand, love to make a big stink of it. (not the restroom itself haha... men being in their restrooms). I remember numerous occasions entering the ladies room pre-transition when I got yelled at for being in there.
I've noticed that women, usually younger ones, are pretty vicious when it comes to 'their' restroom.
I dred public restrooms, and only use one if I'm away all day somewhere.. I'm very shy on those situations..
If it's busy, I try and watch outside for a few minutes, see how many go in, and how many walk out.?? Usually when more have gone out than went in, I can enter confidently and go right to a stall.,. That plan seems to work well, except like at a concert or sports place, where it's lined up outside..
If I see that the stalls are all taken, I just simply leave. It's awkward waiting in the bathroom and when a stall does come free, I rather not take it immediately because the guy before me probably did a number two hahaha
Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on September 08, 2014, 04:03:35 AM
rest will be busy with washing their hands and getting away from mirror... Recently, I started to wonder if there is another rule like not spending more than 5 secs in front if mirror... taking more time will get more side-glances somehow.
I wasn't aware of the 'rules' in the mens bathroom so does looking at the mirror really gets attention that much?
Quote from: Taka on September 08, 2014, 01:57:48 PM
i heard a story from a guy in london once, in a discussion about really odd experiences. he'd gone to the bathroom, and while he was there, some girl managed to go inside, do her business, and then leave. he didn't have any idea how to react, so he didn't.
Japanese women use the men's a lot because the ladies is always full. They look up, and that's about it. One time when I was waiting a woman walked out of the stall and I think one guy registered it, shrugged and went back to reading his book.
Hi, folks. Thanks again to everyone who took the time to post. It was definitely helpful. :)
Quote from: makipu on September 09, 2014, 02:30:01 PM
I wasn't aware of the 'rules' in the mens bathroom so does looking at the mirror really gets attention that much?
people like to go on and on about men's restroom "rules" but I've found straight cis men break them all the time. I have been confronted with conversations in public bathrooms by all sorts of folks. Though typically I knew them in advance of our encounter.
Guys get in, do their business, and get out. Half of them don't even stop to wash their hands on the way out. And when guys talk in the mens room it's always a little uncomfortable. Even when waiting in line at sporting events...men usually don't talk...except to make a joke about how it's usually the ladies who have to stand in line.
So if you're waiting for a stall, most guys would assume you have to poop. Just don't spend time staring at anyone else.
And as someone else pointed out, guys are not very observant unless something is majorly out of place. So you'll be fine.
For us MTF's it's a very different issue. Women are observant, and there's a much greater chance of waiting in a line and talking.
I haven't run into this problem yet, since I just started consistently using the men's room a couple weeks ago, but I am kind of worried about it. Logically I know no guys in the men's room probably care about my presence much, nor are they probably going to even notice me at all (seems like cishet guys are ironically just so terrified of coming off as gay they pay no attention to anything in there, even when they're whipping their junk out right next to each other), but the fear is still there. I just put on my best blank/stern face, look like I know what I'm doing, and pointedly ignore everyone. when I inevitably end up having to wait for a stall I'll probably just lean against the wall or leave if it's busy.
But ok, random question here--has anyone had difficulty quickly distinguishing urinals from sinks when going to wash your hands? This is never a problem I thought I would have, but without looking around more than is socially acceptable (so to speak) it's hard to tell who's standing in front of a urinal and who's standing in front of a sink. I mean, hands are at about the same level, most guys take the same stance in both places... it's just a little difficult sometimes when you're not used to the environment yet and keep forgetting to take note of where things are when you enter. I almost stepped uncomfortably close to a guy at the urinal the other day because it took a little too long for me to remember where the hell the sinks were.
Quote from: Dante on September 10, 2014, 12:45:14 AM
But ok, random question here--has anyone had difficulty quickly distinguishing urinals from sinks when going to wash your hands? This is never a problem I thought I would have, but without looking around more than is socially acceptable (so to speak) it's hard to tell who's standing in front of a urinal and who's standing in front of a sink. I mean, hands are at about the same level, most guys take the same stance in both places... it's just a little difficult sometimes when you're not used to the environment yet and keep forgetting to take note of where things are when you enter. I almost stepped uncomfortably close to a guy at the urinal the other day because it took a little too long for me to remember where the hell the sinks were.
Urinals don't have mirrors above them and sinks stick out from the wall farther.
Quote from: Dante on September 10, 2014, 12:45:14 AM
But ok, random question here--has anyone had difficulty quickly distinguishing urinals from sinks when going to wash your hands?
Not once, dude. But thanks for the laugh. :)
I think you're overthinking it. Heck, half or more of all guys don't even wash their hands on the way out. In fact I've been in quite a few bars where they had a second mens room in the back with a couple urinals...and that's it.
Quote from: skin on September 10, 2014, 01:15:59 AM
Urinals don't have mirrors above them and sinks stick out from the wall farther.
Lol, I was going to say the same stuff about sinks having mirrors as an extra accessory :).
As for the question above with regard to use of mirrors, it is a bit tricky. Washing hands and combing Your hair is OK, but deviating from the above might get an extra side-glance, or not. When I was not yet aware of this stuff, I once was bold enough to take out a comb and start brushing my hair - now, that went awkward pretty fast :D. On the other hand, once, after an international flight, I just went to the airport restroom to take a shave and nobody said anything or gave any looks.
And yeah, guys are so friggin afraid of looking at others that it gets funny at times. Sometimes, I feel pretty uncomfortable to take men's room and last time I popped into someone when leaving - but before he could get any closer look, he deliberately turned his face away and headed towards closest empty stall.
It's really a sick reason why guys are almost afraid of talking, looking, etc. It's due to fear someone will think they're gay. (I was at a gay guy event and the rules on bathrooms were totally broken down and it was like being in a women's room again.) Women, otoh, have to look out for the off chance that they'd be attacked.
--Jay
Quote from: GnomeKid on September 09, 2014, 11:32:17 PM
people like to go on and on about men's restroom "rules" but I've found straight cis men break them all the time. I have been confronted with conversations in public bathrooms by all sorts of folks. Though typically I knew them in advance of our encounter.
I agree... All this rule business is silly. I get looked dead in the eye all the time, people talk to me. Every "rule" possible has probably been broken, lol.
Quote from: Kyler on September 10, 2014, 02:59:46 PM
I agree... All this rule business is silly. I get looked dead in the eye all the time, people talk to me. Every "rule" possible has probably been broken, lol.
There are no universal spoken or written rules. However, some individuals have their own personal rules. Then you have the REAL PIGS who will never change.
Quote from: mac1 on September 10, 2014, 05:52:18 PM
There are no universal spoken or written rules.
I dunno, the 1-3-5 rule seemed pretty universal to me.
The advice that I received is never to look at another guy and don't make any acknowledgements. When waiting for a stall to open up keep your eyes focused on waiting for one to open or looking at the ground.
Quote from: skin on September 10, 2014, 06:09:00 PM
I dunno, the 1-3-5 rule seemed pretty universal to me.
If that happens to be "leave an empty urinal between you and the next guy" it is rather common for most when possible.
Since I'm MTF, I sit to pee. I don't get back up right away. As that will tell someone who came in with me at the same time, I had sat to pee. Then they might ask questions. If no one came in with you can just get up and leave. When done you can also put the toilet seat up. Also don't talk first until you absolutely have to.
I hate to say it, but my paranoia has kept me out of trouble. With certain things better save then sorry.
In the 50's a cross dresser walking on Chicago Ave near State St in Chicago was murdered. Her murder was not investigated PERIOD.
I have been using the men's room for over a year. I have only seen lines at athletic stadiums and theaters. The lines move much faster in the men's compared to the women's. Once you get in the door there are guys all over, I just follow the line until I can see where the guys wanting to use a stall are lining up, guys are using the stalls to pee too. You have to keep looking to keep up with the line you are in or someone will go ahead of you. I don't see how they can pee at the urinals with guys almost standing directly behind them in some cases. Once I get in stall and close the door I feel fine as there are guys all around outside of the stall; noone would look in, so I can sit and pee fine. Theaters restrooms are much smaller than at the stadiums so there is usually a little communication as to do you want to use a urinal or stall, verbally and motioning. I have been lucky and never have had my shark week when having yo use one of there super busy restrooms.
QuoteI agree... All this rule business is silly. I get looked dead in the eye all the time, people talk to me. Every "rule" possible has probably been broken, lol.
Rule-breaking urinal moments yesterday: I had my first urinal conversation yesterday with an instructor of a class I'm taking. He came in and used the urinal next to me (only two there) and started talking to me. Awkward! Fortunately I was finishing and he had just arrived, so I briefly answered as I zipped, washed my hands, and booked it out of there. I wasn't sure how in depth a convo I should keep up in there, LOL. That and I was sleep deprived, which didn't help my thought processes any.
Jay
When the stalls are full I usually go outside of the mens room until one opens up. I feel weird standing in the mens room waiting. I don't use an STP or anything.
Yes, jay, I have heard guys talking at urinals who seem to know each other; that seems to be when the rule is definitely broken.
I don't mind waiting for a minute in the men's room.
I don't try to make conversation with other dudes, but it's less about an "unspoken rule" and more about the fact that I wouldn't want a stranger to strike up a convo with me while I was waiting to do my business lol
The good thing is that guys really don't pay attention to detail the same way women do (in my experience). Honestly I've never gotten so much as a second glance while waiting in line.
I agree, kdbrrw
I've had plenty of mens room conversations, I never started one though. Men talk in there more than you may think, they laugh an joke around in some cases.
I no longer stp in public, so I always wait for a stall. In my experience, nobody cares. Nobody wants to know why I'm waiting, and there are often other guys waiting too. I'm not super comfortable with it, so if there are a lot of people I usually leave and come back in a few minutes. The public restrooms I use tend to be in urban areas, and there are often guys using the stalls to change clothes or do drugs or whatever, so there are times that I just give up on waiting and seek out a different place to pee. That dynamic sucks for stall availability, but I feel like it also cuts down on anybody being surprised if I decide to forgo the urinals.
Guys do talk sometimes, and the people who talk are the same people who don't tend to bat an eye at any visible differences. I don't like to talk to strange men in the bathroom but any guy talking is drawing all the attention, which is nice.
I'm still a tiny bit pensive about how obvious it is that I sit down to pee, but nobody has ever asked me about it. Most people aren't in there long enough to notice even if they were paying attention, and I think if anyone noticed and cared I would see them as the weird one.
I've only walked out once when waiting and it was empty then anyway except for the guy in the cubicle. I just didn't fancy standing in a particularly grotty toilet listening to someone grunt and fart when I could sit outside until he'd done.
All other occasions it's just head down and mind your own business. No one really cares, just watch out for queue jumpers, I had to shoulder my way back in front of someone the second time I used them.
IMO talking is limited to "See you next week", "Is there enough toilet paper?" all practical stuff, not just general chitchat.
I went into a train station men's room earlier and thanks to this thread I paid attention. It's in Japan, but Osaka is a lot like everywhere else (it's the dirty cousin of Japan).
I was asked "you got the right room?" By the guy behind me. My husband chuckled and I said "what? Me?"
Even though my voice is andro the guy just waved his hand and apologized. Just act natural.
For the record my husband is a bio guy and he sits to pee when he can. No one questions him either
Quote from: LordKAT on September 11, 2014, 10:36:16 PM
I've had plenty of mens room conversations, I never started one though. Men talk in there more than you may think, they laugh an joke around in some cases.
I wouldn't know about that. I didn't normally go there with other guys. Thus it was just other guys that happened to be there.
Quote from: mac1 on September 12, 2014, 07:54:06 PM
I wouldn't know about that. I didn't normally go there with other guys. Thus it was just other guys that happened to be there.
I
never, go there with other guys. It was
always just other guys who happened to be there.
I went in once with another guy that is come out to a few months before. We were having a conversation and both needed the toilet, so it would have been daft not to. He just said as we went in "I hope you're not expecting me to talk to you when I'm having a ->-bleeped-<-", i laughed and said I find that weird as well, and that was that. Conversation restarted as we were drying our hands.
As somebody who had to use this bathroom for 35 years these are my experiences:
- Guys don't normally look at another guys while in the restroom, this is specially true in a locker room, they talk, but they don't look other guy eyes.
- some people like to talk while they are in the urinal, specially if you are in a bar or drinking alcohol, but they don't look.
- 99% of the time stalls are not busy, so people can walk directly to them if needed (as a woman I have learned to love and hate when I have to wait in a really long line for the ladies room in a public event)
- normally when you use the stall in a men restroom people will automatically assume you are doing number 2, nevertheless most of the time the toilet would have urine all over it (most guys have a hard time directing their shot).
So don't worry if you have to wait for a stall, people will not look you on the eyes, they may say something like "big sh**?".
Quote from: mzaomz on September 13, 2014, 08:31:52 AM
So don't worry if you have to wait for a stall, people will not look you on the eyes, they may say something like "big sh**?".
Could this really be the case if the person isn't that much "passing"?
I don't know about that, but the rest of that post is spot on in my experience.
from what i hear, many cis guys prefer stalls even just for peeing. being shy about your private parts isn't a crime.
also http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa141/gadnihasj/checkmate_nderasore.jpg
Passing privilege like a lot of privilege is invisible. I have a friend who has been "passing" for years and years now. He takes it for granted. He says stuff like "Why is this a big deal?" It drove me nuts. Now that I am getting read as male, I'm trying to keep remembering what it's like to be new to this and still look in between.
--Jay
Quote from: makipu on September 13, 2014, 04:58:06 PM
Could this really be the case if the person isn't that much "passing"?
Quote from: mzaomz on September 13, 2014, 08:31:52 AM
As somebody who had to use this bathroom for 35 years these are my experiences:
- Guys don't normally look at another guys while in the restroom, this is specially true in a locker room, they talk, but they don't look other guy eyes.
- some people like to talk while they are in the urinal, specially if you are in a bar or drinking alcohol, but they don't look.
- 99% of the time stalls are not busy, so people can walk directly to them if needed (as a woman I have learned to love and hate when I have to wait in a really long line for the ladies room in a public event)
- normally when you use the stall in a men restroom people will automatically assume you are doing number 2, nevertheless most of the time the toilet would have urine all over it (most guys have a hard time directing their shot).
So don't worry if you have to wait for a stall, people will not look you on the eyes, they may say something like "big sh**?".
^^This is spot on. Guys are generally not very observant, but as others have mentioned here, they are even less so in the mens room because of the desire to not see other guys' junk or have other guys looking at theirs.
A big part of the passing privilege that Jay mentioned is that guys walk around acting like they own everything. I'm MTF, so I'm having to learn how to dial that back. So if you walk into the mens room confidently and just do your business, no guy is going to think twice about it. Honestly.
When I find the stalls (1 stall in many cases) filled I wish that I could use the women's restroom or that all public restrooms could be multi-user unisex. I never consider using a urinal.
Quote from: aleon515 on September 15, 2014, 02:32:47 PM
Passing privilege like a lot of privilege is invisible. I have a friend who has been "passing" for years and years now. He takes it for granted. He says stuff like "Why is this a big deal?" It drove me nuts. Now that I am getting read as male, I'm trying to keep remembering what it's like to be new to this and still look in between.
--Jay
This is important to keep in mind. I felt like my transition was slow, and even before transition I was often not read as the correct gender for the bathroom that I was using, but now I take it for granted that I can just waltz into the men's room and usually don't have to do a lot of thinking about it. I get reminders when I'm in spaces where people know ahead of time that I'm trans, or when I encounter people in the men's room who are themselves not visibly gender typical.
Whatever you look like, it's still probably best to just bluff your way through any difficulties. No matter what anyone's private thoughts are, most people just want to pee or poop and move on. If someone is drunk or crazy they might try to engage more but they tend to bring more attention on themselves than whatever they are questioning or complaining about.