Greetings
As you know I have been OD'd on E-Cyp. Not my fault either. My levels are between 450 and 600 or higher, they are slowly backing me down from there. These are unsafe levels.
You need to know that I am emotionally not stable, my logic is grossly impaired, and as I result, it is unwise for me to be on forum.
I will return if conditions are healthy to do so.
Evidently the situation is serious. I can't even tell, I am taking people's word for it.
Please solve the binary/ non binary problem. It makes my situation worse.
Blessings.
Nails out, hair on, heart wide open
Satinjoy, with love.
Thanks for keeping us updated Hun.
Look after yourself sweetie. This place isn't going away anytime soon. =)
You've got to help yourself before you can help others.
SJ,
Be safe and yes sometimes it a good thing to take a step back and away.
I do it when I need that mental and emotional break.
Hugs
Izzy
sootball will try to stay until you return.
conflict doesn't seem to run as deep as initially feared.
we'll be happy to see you again whether you do better or worse.
always loving, never uncaring.
Love and healing thoghts to you, Satinjoy. Bring your wonderful self back to us when you are ready. Take care of yourself <3
Wishing you healing..
Its always nicer when you are here..
:)
SJ
Hope you get well soon, I am nwe here but I have read several of your posts and was enlightened from all of them.
Waiting to hear you again with thoughts of joy and victory.
I spoke with Satinjoy this afternoon and she is doing much better but still has a long way to go. She asked me to extend her heartfelt thank you to all for your prayers,support and thoughtfulness . She will return as soon as she is able to and misses you all. She also did do a post on the Forest Thread if you would care to read it. Patty
Sorry I just heard or I would have been here sooner. Get well hun! We support you and look forward to your return! :icon_bunch:
Huggles :icon_hug:
Ally ;)
get well
Thank you for your well wishes.
For the sake of trans, my experience with the OD has been horrific.
I am still off the boards, not very receptive to advice other than "feel better" or "hugs", and under medical care.
I can tell you that anxiety levels on an estrogen overdose can and have been utterly devastating. And the mind races....
Fortunately, I have done withdrawl before, 30 years ago, on alcohol. This is a lot like that, only this is worse emotionally, the other is worse physically and with blinding craving. That I do not have, the craving.
Anyway, given the emotional instability/volatility/triggers, it is wise for me to remain off forum. Withdrawl can take 2 months.
Yesterday was utter hell dealing with the anxiety. Way over the top.
So, the takeaway for you my dears, is if you are on injections, please be very, very careful.
Blessings my dears until I feel well enough and stable enough to come back. I think it will be a long time, and I probably won't be looking at the forum feeling like this, I have to protect job and family before anything else, I focus on that, and my nerves are a mess requiring a lot of sleep.
You live in my heart, you know. Regardless of if I am on forum, or off. You touched me....
Just to debunk the idea that estradiol OD is no big deal. That is most assuredly not my experience with it, coming down from those levels has been a nightmare.
Nails out, hair down, heart wide open, living free. Because of you my dears, because of you, I live an authentic life.
Satinjoy..... the fairy sleeps comfortably, the sootball on her pillow, a reminder that she will wake again.
See ya :)
sootball gives the fairy pretty sooty eyes while she's sleeping.
talking about overdoses...
there is a reason why pregnant women have troubles controlling emotions.
what should have just been anxiety can turn into full panic. crying over absolutely nothing is not unheard of.
shutting oneself in and refusing to even talk to one's closest family, doing all kinds of illogical things, often some that are harmful to oneself.
not uncommon.
and getting down from there, even quicker the way it happens for natal women, can be just as horrific.
many experience severe depression and anxiety after giving birth. and do thing harmful to themselves or the child.
i didn't, but there was never any guarantee that i wouldn't.
Excellent observations and input Taka!
I hope you get as much rest as you can and feel better soon, Satinjoy. I've been watching this thread and hope you come back when you're feeling well!
I think Taka nailed it. The endo just tweaked the meds again, we will see what happens now.
I'm back.... just be very careful as far as triggers go please.... there were multiple triggers coinciding with the hormone stuff. Not very nice to have happen at all.
Love to all here.
Nails out, head up, heart wide open. :) And feeling a lot, lot better.
Satinjoy
Quote from: Satinjoy on September 22, 2014, 06:43:32 AM
Greetings
As you know I have been OD'd on E-Cyp. Not my fault either. My levels are between 450 and 600 or higher, they are slowly backing me down from there. These are unsafe levels.
I hope you're OK, Satinjoy. If it helps, according to wikipedia, estradiol levels in natal women can reach 1500 pmol/l during their preovulatory period, so although your levels are higher than the usual range for trans HRT, they're within the normal range women experience as part of their monthly cycle. I think the concerns about high estrogen levels being dangerous date back to a time when ethinyl estradiol was being used for trans HRT. That stuff is dangerous, however, it shouldn't be being used for trans HRT any more. As far as I'm aware, there's little if any evidence that bioidentical estradiol is harmful in the ranges that normally occur in natal women.
Quote from: HughE on September 26, 2014, 11:44:37 AM
I hope you're OK, Satinjoy. If it helps, according to wikipedia, estradiol levels in natal women can reach 1500 pmol/l during their preovulatory period, so although your levels are higher than the usual range for trans HRT, they're within the normal range women experience as part of their monthly cycle. I think the concerns about high estrogen levels being dangerous date back to a time when ethinyl estradiol was being used for trans HRT. That stuff is dangerous, however, it shouldn't be being used for trans HRT any more. As far as I'm aware, there's little if any evidence that bioidentical estradiol is harmful in the ranges that normally occur in natal women.
Yes, gave myself a life threatening case of DVT using ethinyl estradiol some time ago.
There were other mitigating factors here, another perfect storm if you will, put them all together and you have a recipe for trouble.
I am so glad Shantel lived to tell the tale. Big part of this forest is Shan.
Thanks too Hugh, you just confirmed what the endo said to me.
Blessings.
Satinjoy
it might be worth mentioning that the thing i can't stand about pms, are the mood swings.
i hate it to death, having sudden hormone levels in all the wrong ranges.
the only comfortable time, mentally is from a couple days after bleeding starts, and until levels suddenly raise at ovulation time. half of my post puberty life has been horrible thus far.
physical pains associated with bleeding can get bad, i still haven't figured out why, it isn't consistent. might be stress induced. but i do know that i always get a sense of my digestion working backwards, and other abdominal annoyances that might not be too horrible but still make me feel like i'm about to throw up or have gottwn sudden cramps in my rectum or my intestines have contracted to block any natural activity.
still not as bad as dealing with mood swings during the two weeks long pms time. which can sometimes be longer for me, the time between periods varies from around 30 days to one week more than that.
this means that moon cycle and menstruation cycle will some times coincide in ways that either lessen discomfort, or give me hell for a few days. the worst thing i ever experience is when vleeding starts on the new moon, the days before that are seriously just pure hell. talking to people becomes a real challenge.
Quote from: Taka on September 26, 2014, 03:01:49 PM
this means that moon cycle and menstruation cycle will some times coincide in ways that either lessen discomfort, or give me hell for a few days. the worst thing i ever experience is when vleeding starts on the new moon, the days before that are seriously just pure hell. talking to people becomes a real challenge.
I'm sorry you have to suffer through that Taka, my SO used to become quite ill and suffer awful cramps too. I always babied her a lot during those times and took good care of her, we're long past that now but I do recall the pale face and dark circles under her eyes. It wasn't fun for either of us. I like to tell people that we went through painful periods and eventually menopause together and survived. When you love someone you suffer right along with them.
I'm so happy to hear your doing better SatinJoy, and back on the forum.
Ally ;)
i'm lucky to not get cramps that last very long. but it's happened that i've gone 2-3 days almost without eating because everything else suddenly stopped working properly.
i should probably ask a doctor if i have endometriosis or something, i've heard that can affect more than just the most obvious part of the body.
but it's gotten better after i stopped being so depressed. the human body is a mystery.
Being mtf non binary style is nice.
No cramps.
Its like being a grandpa. I get to play with the baby and then give it back when it poops.
And, my first grandchild was announced as a pregnancy Friday night. My youngest.
Interesting month.
If you are following this thread, don't worry about the triggers now. I am fully present again. And much stronger for outlasting the bulsh---t.
Good things have happened as a result with my indentity. It seems SJ and Satinjoy have met more at the core. Still the same, but somehow healthier.
Regards
Satinjoy
Quote from: Satinjoy on September 29, 2014, 10:02:25 AM
Being mtf non binary style is nice.
No cramps.
Its like being a grandpa. I get to play with the baby and then give it back when it poops.
And, my first grandchild was announced as a pregnancy Friday night. My youngest.
Interesting month.
If you are following this thread, don't worry about the triggers now. I am fully present again. And much stronger for outlasting the bulsh---t.
Good things have happened as a result with my indentity. It seems SJ and Satinjoy have met more at the core. Still the same, but somehow healthier.
Regards
Satinjoy
That's good news hon! :)
Quote from: Satinjoy on September 29, 2014, 10:02:25 AM
If you are following this thread, don't worry about the triggers now. I am fully present again. And much stronger for outlasting the bulsh---t.
Good things have happened as a result with my indentity. It seems SJ and Satinjoy have met more at the core. Still the same, but somehow healthier.
Regards
Satinjoy
Yay!
Greetings my dears.
As you know I sometimes have it a bit rough. And I apologize for the emotionalism that goes with that.
In a rather oddly timed shift of fate, it seams that a job transfer and demotion went down this morning that has me reeling. But, I still have food and hormones and family so why complain. It will however be tough and even more stress than previously when I anxiety redlined. It is hard to say what will happen there.
My time on the forum will henceforth be very limited by circumstance.
For those that pray, I need it, as usual. We all do anyway, don't we.
As to the drama and the locked threads, I apologize, its largely stress, triggering, some poor choices made by others in probable innocence trying to help me, and hormonal vulnerability.
See you when I can, life on life's terms can be a bit difficult. I need to survive this, probably as usual the survival story will wind up with another victorious moment. I've beat the odds so many times its nuts.
I will be posting in the early mornings a few times a week. But I can occasionally still see what is up in here on my phone.
Nails out, head down, heart open anyway, I remain, Satinjoy. And I need this forum and every single one of you. When the sh-t hits the fan, this is one place that gets it about sticking with each other in spite of our disagreements and diversity and sometimes even emotional instability (me not you). Its more than a support forum, it is a survival forum. Living trans isn't easy.
Blessings. Love to all here.
---Satinjoy - aka The Fairy.
Satinjoy, I'm glad to see things are better.
Quote from: Satinjoy on October 03, 2014, 01:01:01 PM
Greetings my dears.
As you know I sometimes have it a bit rough. And I apologize for the emotionalism that goes with that.
In a rather oddly timed shift of fate, it seams that a job transfer and demotion went down this morning that has me reeling. But, I still have food and hormones and family so why complain. It will however be tough and even more stress than previously when I anxiety redlined. It is hard to say what will happen there.
---Satinjoy - aka The Fairy.
Been there multiple times in my working life, often having to reinvent myself and start over. The days when we work for the same company for 40 years, get the gold watch and fat retirement package are over. If you're still employed count your blessings and get rid of what you don't need, you may e surprised at what positive things can come out of it, things we usually don't appreciate at the time, but what we can see in retrospect a few years down the road. Thinking about you hon!
Hi Miss Satinjoy,
Like everyone else here I love you and will say a little prayer. I'm sorry about work, transition to something new is hard enough, that you are not celebrated by your peers in the workplace is their loss. I celebrate you and count myself blessed. Work hard, love well, and it will all sort itself out. "Thy will not mine be done."
Peace,
Julie
SatinJoy, your in my prayers. As always I enjoy reading your posts and look forward to seeing more in the future. I too am sorry to hear about your work. You are strong tho and I'm confident you'll pull through this even stronger.
As always, my best wishes to you. :icon_bunch:
Ally :icon_flower:
I hate to keep drawing attention to myself, but my daughter just miscarried and I am concerned, this is really too much for anyone to take.
This is supposed to be a support forum and instead we have lost that focus and that is so wrong.
Stakes are high, this kid is the one we had once had to hospitalize and was the stalking and worse victim.
Sometimes I think by being trans I opened
the floodgates of he'll against my family, by keeping my faith publically and championing trans too.
I feel lime taking my camaro into a wall.
I am so tired. What did I do to deserve this.
If anything happens to my kid I am finished.
Satinjoy
Quote from: Satinjoy on October 06, 2014, 08:23:36 PM
This is supposed to be a support forum and instead we have lost that focus and that is so wrong.
No,we haven't. Where have we lost focus at? I see people getting help here every day. ???
Quote from: Satinjoy on October 06, 2014, 08:23:36 PM
I hate to keep drawing attention to myself, but my daughter just miscarried and I am concerned, this is really too much for anyone to take.
This is supposed to be a support forum and instead we have lost that focus and that is so wrong.
Stakes are high, this kid is the one we had once had to hospitalize and was the stalking and worse victim.
Sometimes I think by being trans I opened
the floodgates of he'll against my family, by keeping my faith publically and championing trans too.
I feel lime taking my camaro into a wall.
I am so tired. What did I do to deserve this.
If anything happens to my kid I am finished.
Satinjoy
No don't do that honey, we're here for you!
That's quite enough of that, Satinjoy! You're the second trans person to threaten conditional suicide in my presence in the last 36 hours, and I won't have it!
I'll tell you what I told her:
If you do it I'll raise you from the dead and make your afterlife miserable.
I'll make you haunt a toilet seat...
In an outhouse...
At a fat camp....
One that uses enemas!
And if that doesn't work, I'll cry, a lot.
You, your daughter and your family can get through this. And Susan's? We argue, we bicker, we debate and we fight, but in the end we come together when one of us needs the others. We are here to support you, and each of us, emotionally. We will remain here, doing what we do. You've done your share of giving and we're all here to give back.
Susan's is a karma bank, and we give interest. You are a valuable depositor. We need you here.
Hate to smack you while you are down, but this is why you do not self medicate.
Quote from: Susan on October 06, 2014, 09:58:04 PM
Hate to smack you while you are down, but this is why you do not self medicate.
Self medication was not an issue here as Satin Joy points out in the first post on this thread.
I understand it was the endocrinologist who made a mistake with dosage.
Quote from: cathyrains on October 07, 2014, 05:35:35 AM
Self medication was not an issue here as Satin Joy points out in the first post on this thread.
I understand it was the endocrinologist who made a mistake with dosage.
Both endo and shrink manage the meds. I am a sober alcoholic, I wouldn't dream of setting a dose for myself nor recommending a specific form of estrogen. And thanks Cathy.
As to the conditional suicide, the feelings are only feelings, there will never be a chance of suicide for me. I even have an escape plan with someone on the forum who would intervene, both physically and mentally. Actually 2 people.
Now that I have wallowed in shock and self pity overnight we will get on with the business of healing the kid, and the more difficult business of dealing with the boyfriend that got her pregnant out of wedlock in the first place.
But we wanted that baby.
Jessica in all due respect the forum has become distracted by the issues between binary and nonbinary. That issue has become toxic.
Edited here. Sj.
Learning these female emotions and having this mtf transitioned body is like learning who I am all over again. Nonbinary or not, it still is a full hormonal transition, 16 months in. Didn't expect this part, the depth of feeling is so much deeper, the volatility so intense.
Focussing on the kid. I'm human, the night of despair is a normal reaction, one I did not allow her or anyone else to see. We have our eyes on her, she promised she would not hurt herself. I just don't want her to run.
-Satinjoy.
SJ
Glad that you have got to a good place. You have had the week from hell and your resilience is amazing. Remember PM anytime. Unfortunately when endos and labs get it wrong, we are the folk who bear the consequence. Keep it up, you are an inspiration to many.
Safe travels
Aisla
Quote from: cathyrains on October 07, 2014, 05:35:35 AM
Quote from: Susan on October 06, 2014, 09:58:04 PM
Hate to smack you while you are down, but this is why you do not self medicate.
Self medication was not an issue here as Satin Joy points out in the first post on this thread.
I understand it was the endocrinologist who made a mistake with dosage.
Doesn't make a difference to my point. It wasn't even really directed directly at Satinjoy, it was a warning to others. I will point out it's very rare for a endocrinologist or any medical professional to make a mistake of that nature, and if a trained medical professional can make a mistake that is this serious, then it's even easier for you to do so when self medicating.
SatinJoy I'm so sorry to hear about what happened with your kid. Wishing you all my hopes for a happy outcome. :icon_bunch:
Sending huge biiig cyber hugs your way! :icon_hug: :icon_hug: :icon_hug:
Ally :icon_flower:
Quote from: Susan on October 07, 2014, 02:53:17 PM
Doesn't make a difference to my point. It wasn't even really directed directly at Satinjoy, it was a warning to others. I will point out it's very rare for a endocrinologist or any medical professional to make a mistake of that nature, and if a trained medical professional can make a mistake that is this serious, then it's even easier for you to do so when self medicating.
I have had high levels of T and that was under the supervision of a dose calculated by my endocrinologist. I did my doses every three weeks as prescribed, I didn't do it a day sooner or a day later. My body simply gained an excess of T in its system which needed to be monitored and had my doses adjusted accordingly. In that case, I went onto a three-monthly dose of T which stabilized the high levels. These things happen and it is normal, it certainly holds no reflection on the professional themselves.
SatinJoy, I am sorry to hear about your child, I hope everything turns out well. Keep your chin up :icon_hug:
Grandchild dear... focus is back on helping my daughter, the jolt is resulting in the bf getting responsible and they are still planning on marriage. They grew up a little, maybe me to.
The grandbaby is in heaven with my stillborn son who died just before birth many years ago. One day my family will be together with them all.
Thanks all for the support. Working on living with the deep estrogenic emotions.
Blessings
Satinjoy
Quote from: Satinjoy on October 06, 2014, 08:23:36 PM
I hate to keep drawing attention to myself, but my daughter just miscarried and I am concerned, this is really too much for anyone to take.
This is supposed to be a support forum and instead we have lost that focus and that is so wrong.
Stakes are high, this kid is the one we had once had to hospitalize and was the stalking and worse victim.
Sometimes I think by being trans I opened
the floodgates of he'll against my family, by keeping my faith publically and championing trans too.
I feel lime taking my camaro into a wall.
I am so tired. What did I do to deserve this.
If anything happens to my kid I am finished.
Satinjoy
Oh Sweetheart I am so sad for you. I don't know what I would do without my kids and grandkids. They are quite simply the principal reason I stick around on this planet. Call me anytime. If you've tried and I haven't answered, it is because I'm having a lot of unpleasant conversations lately with Donna and finally just turned the ringer off. I understand depression and fatigue. I'll turn it back on, and sorry.
Love you lots,
Julie
Quote from: Satinjoy on October 08, 2014, 05:05:26 AM
Grandchild dear... focus is back on helping my daughter, the jolt is resulting in the bf getting responsible and they are still planning on marriage. They grew up a little, maybe me to.
The grandbaby is in heaven with my stillborn son who died just before birth many years ago. One day my family will be together with them all.
Thanks all for the support. Working on living with the deep estrogenic emotions.
Blessings
Satinjoy
My son and daughter-in-law experienced the same thing, it can be a crushing blow to the kids but they will survive and grow from the experience. Hugs of you sweetie!
Quote from: EchelonHunt on October 07, 2014, 08:58:55 PM
Which needed to be monitored and had my doses adjusted accordingly. In that case,
Which is why we don't allow discussion of self medicating :) Because they won't have the medical professionals monitoring their hormone levels.
i can't remember anyone here suggesting or not speaking up against self medicating.
i got some interesting advice in the chat a way back though. never did take that advice as i don't feel a need to hurt myself unnecessarily.
one thing i like a whole lot about this section is that there is less pressure to transition and no continuous focus on the medical aspect of it. we may discuss possibilities, but none outside what is administered and monitored by medical professionals.
here i can be myself without feeling like i have to prove anything, and without feeling left out when everybody else talks about hrt.
i'd sooner consider going the binary route through the established system in norway, than getting anything through shadier routes.
Quote from: Susan on October 07, 2014, 02:53:17 PM
I will point out it's very rare for a endocrinologist or any medical professional to make a mistake of that nature, and if a trained medical professional can make a mistake that is this serious, then it's even easier for you to do so when self medicating.
Yes. Self medicating is a very bad idea. But when you are in the hands of incompetent doctors, it can be just as bad. I had an issue where my first endo was closing his practice and moving out of state back in June of 2008. He included three contact numbers/addresses in the letter. I was completely freaking out since I was still on a full HRT regimen at that time. I called the first place and they accepted me. It was an Internal Medicine clinic. None of them were Endocrinologists. I was relieved at first. But I soon found out that these guys had no idea what they were doing when it came to transpeople. They would misgender me, scratch their heads about medications, etc. It got worse after I had my orchi done. I noticed that my E levels had dropped to half of their previous level.
So, I went to them and requested that they double my dosage. Without any bloodwork or batting an eye. They said, 'okay'. This completely screwed me up. I went through absolute hell for several months. I was also passed around like a hot potato. I saw three different doctors and none of them had a clue. The third one suggested that I seek out someone else.
I eventually contacted the individual that is now my current endo (and ironically, was third on the list I got from my first endo AND was located at the same hospital that I had been going to since I was 18 for non-trans related medical reasons. I suppose that hindsight is 20/20, eh?)
When I had my first visit with her, she was absolutely shocked that the doctors at the former clinic would be so careless. But I accept half of the blame for asking them to do it in the first place.
Lesson learned: leave the doctoring to the doctors. BUT, also find one that knows what they are doing in regards to your specialized needs.
Quote from: Susan on October 08, 2014, 05:59:44 PM
Which is why we don't allow discussion of self medicating :) Because they won't have the medical professionals monitoring their hormone levels.
Yes, every time someone brings up self medicating, usually in the MtF forums, though I have not seen mention of it here or even of specific dosage levels, I'm quick to share my own experiences with DVT from having self medicated in the past. Lucky I'm not below the turf at Forest Lawn!
Quote from: Satinjoy on October 08, 2014, 05:05:26 AM
The grandbaby is in heaven with my stillborn son who died just before birth many years ago.
Blessings
Satinjoy
And they are with my stillborn twin sister.. :'( Someday I'm certain we will ALL be together..
Blessings also
Now that will be quite the meeting Mark... :)
Wow the days were dark ones.
I am still experiencing mood swings, unfortunately not too much euphoria, mostly it slides from peace to depression to anxiety. But it stabilizes as I interact with people. Expected, and they pendulum swings are not so wide now. I hate the anxiety attacks. Mild depression I have always had, first time it went away for real was when I took estrogen.
For the forum, the reason for the thread is to allow others by way of transparency to see what the effects of a dramatic serum shift can do to us. The Endo I have has been doing this for 30-40 years, this is their thing, to do transitions, and mine has not been easy. My levels have been whacked from the beginning. Could be the result of being 138 and 5'9 in the beginning. Not much fat.
Anyway I still will stick to them, they take care of a lot of folks here, some come up from...... 200 miles away....
E-cyp injections are a bit volitile I guess but they solve certain problems for me, namely crashing. On max dose orals I bottomed every day at 25 serum level.
Whatever.
Tonight I start an adjusted dose. Thiers of course, splitting the difference between the bottom and top levels, hopefully finding a stable level, or one where fluxuations are in normal ranges. That is their business, mine is to take my blood work every three weeks, meet them every four right now, and see my shrink, I even time the injections and the other meds (the usual stuff for us) so that it is taken within 5 minutes of recommended dosing time each day or week.
Anyway, it is a record for others now, it is posted within TOS rules.
Hanging in there kids..... living the miracle.
As to the daughter and that stuff, life on lifes terms is not easy, there will however be a season of joy, and maybe a real nice wedding.
I just realized I will have female emotions there, when it comes, oh no
Love to all here
Satinjoy
SJ
This thread has been enormously powerful. Your raw honesty in sharing your experiences has been particularly inspiring and invaluable to this community.
The last few weeks have been pretty intense for you, and the fact that you have emerged so strongly is testament to your spiritual strength in addition to the great love which binds your family together.
Wishing you all the very best on your travels.
Aisla
SJ,
My mother had a stillborn son before she had my older sister and myself, so that was an older brother I never got to meet. Hopefully I will be able to meet him again someday.
The injections taking care of the crashes... oh, the crashes... I remember them all too clearly when I was on my tri-weekly dose. It would be a sudden dip in mood and energy in the middle of the third week. Going on the three-monthly dose made the crashes go away, it was wonderful. The mood swings were gone and the hormonal changes were more smooth than erratic.
I can relate to the levels have been whacked as well - before T, I had low T levels for a biological female and I suffered from PMDD in which the sufferer becomes increasingly sensitive to their natural hormonal changes.
Season of joy, is that referring to Christmas? :) Oh, a wedding, how exciting! A few tears (or perhaps a lot?) will be shed but at least they will be tears of happiness! :icon_hug:
Kind regards,
Jacey