When I first tried putting on a bra with the hooks at the back there was just no way that was going to happen. I think I spent the first nine months of being full time putting it on with the hooks at the front and swinging it around. But then I started to challenge myself to hook it up from behind. Clumsy and hillarious would probably describe those attempts but now I am rather adept at getting it on and it takes me a second to remove one. I know a genetic cis woman woman would probably say "la de dah, big deal" but I'm quite pleased with that accomplishment.
I'm also getting really good at shaving my legs! ;D
What are your awesome personal accomplishments that a cis person would shrug at?
Perfecting a female voice, and presentation, and ultimately passing both in appearance and speech, is probably the most daunting accomplishment of my life.
I was convinced that these would ultimately be impossible for someone as clueless, oafish, uncoordinated, and physically inept as I am. When I realized that I passed most of the time and that my voice was sweet and feminine, in my mind it rivaled winning the Olympics or getting elected president.
My voice by far. It's funny when I wasn't even trying for years I would get mamed on the phone, but once I started transitioning and started putting effort int he opposite happened at first. It took a good 3 or 4 months tell I got the voice where I wanted and needed it to be. Now I'm consistently mamed on the phone without any problems.
Mariah
Shaving my face...There's so many dents and dimples. I didn't even know I had dimples! And my chin? I think my partner laughed at me for weeks over the cuts.
Now it's my socks. I have to pull them up with slacks. I've folded them over years. How does anyone deal with socks half way up their legs??
Quote from: Ms Grace on April 07, 2015, 07:28:00 AM
When I first tried putting on a bra with the hooks at the back there was just no way that was going to happen. I think I spent the first nine months of being full time putting it on with the hooks at the front and swinging it around.
My cis girlfriend always does it like this. Many do it like that.
I always joke with her, "You know it's backwards, right?"
Learning how to boil an egg without it exploding or something. I was quite proud of myself.
Quote from: KarinMcD on April 07, 2015, 11:43:02 AM
My cis girlfriend always does it like this. Many do it like that.
I always joke with her, "You know it's backwards, right?"
LOL
Quote from: Ms Grace on April 07, 2015, 07:28:00 AM
I'm also getting really good at shaving my legs! ;D
Me too. For years, I didn't do anything about body hair because I thought shaving it would be too painful. But once I started, it seemed easy and natural enough.
Quote from: marsh monster on April 07, 2015, 12:13:59 PM
Learning how to boil an egg without it exploding or something. I was quite proud of myself.
I'm going to try this tomorrow. ;D
Quote from: Ms Grace on April 07, 2015, 07:28:00 AM
I think I spent the first nine months of being full time putting it on with the hooks at the front and swinging it around. But then I started to challenge myself to hook it up from behind.
My cis girlfriend does this all the time too. :laugh: I always thought that's how it was supposed to be done.
I don't have a beard yet but I do have tons of peach fuzz that I shave. The first few times it felt strange. There's something instinctive about not wanting to put something sharp, like a razor, that close to your face.
This topic only really makes sense if you see cis and trans as being immutable properties, and inherently different from each other in some fixed way.
I don't, but perhaps detailed dissection of that view that is food for another thread, which I might start if people are interested?
For here I will perhaps merely observe that breaking out of the fixed "trans" mindset, by means of using a massive self-mindf**k thought experiment, and managing to reach a place where I can switch headspace, virtually at will, to see the world through cis eyes, is something that I am immensely proud of.
That took a lot of time and work. Though ironically I suspect it is something that I am proud of, while both cis and trans would shrug at it, because both groups would be puzzled as to why one might want to be able to do that...
Quote from: Rejennyrated on April 07, 2015, 01:45:22 PM
For here I will perhaps merely observe that breaking out of the fixed "trans" mindset, by means of using a massive self-mindf**k thought experiment, and managing to reach a place where I can switch headspace, virtually at will, to see the world through cis eyes, is something that I am immensely proud of.
I'm curious to know what you mean by the "fixed 'trans' mindset."
For me, the cis mindset is simply one in which a certain view of "how things are" seems obvious and immutable and people (like me) who don't fit are inconceivable, like something being red and blue at the same time. It's a mindset that can hijack my perceptions and my reactions if I don't pay attention, giving me a confusing double vision when I look at myself and the world.
My 'trans' mindset, if you want to call it that, is more about opening my mind up to more possibilities "than are dreamed of in your philosophy" and seeing people for who they are rather than for what my preconceptions would tell me they are. In that mindset, cis and, for that matter, binary trans, are simply two points in an infinite universe of possibilities. (My favorite metaphor is "an infinite-dimensional vector space of gender", but I'm not sure anyone who hasn't taken college math would understand what that means.)
Quote from: Asche on April 07, 2015, 02:04:53 PM
In that mindset, cis and, for that matter, binary trans, are simply two points in an infinite universe of possibilities. (My favorite metaphor is "an infinite-dimensional vector space of gender", but I'm not sure anyone who hasn't taken college math would understand what that means.)
Would the dimensionality of your infinite vector space be countably infinite or uncountably infinite? How many ways are there to be trans or cis? We could, of course, extend the vector space descriptions using Dirac's notation also called bra | ket notation. The MTFs amongst us would be the "bra" component leaving the "ket" for the FTMs I guess. Quite what the field matricies would describe I am unsure of. I dread to think what the complex conjugates could turn out....
Quote from: Asche on April 07, 2015, 02:04:53 PM
I'm curious to know what you mean by the "fixed 'trans' mindset."
For me, the cis mindset is simply one in which a certain view of "how things are" seems obvious and immutable and people (like me) who don't fit are inconceivable, like something being red and blue at the same time. It's a mindset that can hijack my perceptions and my reactions if I don't pay attention, giving me a confusing double vision when I look at myself and the world.
My 'trans' mindset, if you want to call it that, is more about opening my mind up to more possibilities "than are dreamed of in your philosophy" and seeing people for who they are rather than for what my preconceptions would tell me they are. In that mindset, cis and, for that matter, binary trans, are simply two points in an infinite universe of possibilities. (My favorite metaphor is "an infinite-dimensional vector space of gender", but I'm not sure anyone who hasn't taken college math would understand what that means.)
I like that viewpoint (a lot actually), although it is different to mine.
As to what I meant, I was referring the view that one is either cis or trans and that this is in effect an absolute property which permanently affects ones perspective. However I don't want to Hijack this thread so perhaps we should get a room... ;) I'm happy to start a thread or indeed if someone else would like to I'll happily join in...
Jeeze folks, this is just meant to be a light hearted thread, please take your nit picking derailment elsewhere...
Quote from: cpvwye on April 07, 2015, 02:29:33 PM
Would the dimensionality of your infinite vector space be countably infinite or uncountably infinite?
At first blush, I'd have said countably. But (I'm a little rusty on this -- it's been 30+ years) I think that would mean that it wasn't a complete vector space. On the other hand, I kind of like the idea that the set of genders is "incomplete."
Quote from: cpvwye on April 07, 2015, 02:29:33 PM
I dread to think what the complex conjugates could turn out....
I dunno. It might be fun to do some, ah,
complex conjugating (wink, wink) with your besties....
Haven't done it yet, but I'm looking forward to going topless! (in more ways than one hehe)
To the OP:
My wife of more than 2 decades has always done the hook in front and spin to the back method. I was watching a tv show one time where a girl was getting out of bed and they obviously didn't want to show her breasts, so she put her bra on and hooked it in the back. I was intrigued and tried that next time I thought about it when I put mine on. It's doable, but I have always done it like my wife, and apparently many cis girls. lol
I learned the hook in front method from cis women as well, and if it's good enough for them... :)
I learned the hook in the front method from my mom.
I've always hooked it in the back even though I did know of the other method, just easier for me and less work overall.
Quote from: Ms Grace on April 07, 2015, 02:43:19 PM
Jeeze folks, this is just meant to be a light hearted thread, please take your nit picking derailment elsewhere...
My Apologies Grace
(Though to be fair I did preface my original remark by the fact that I thought any detailed discussion of my contribution would be better elsewhere. I did so precisely because I didnt want to derail this.)
my method is to buy a bra with the hook in front.
I found hooking at the front and swinging around the back was fairly ungainly but about the only way I could manage it. Like mentioned above though I saw some women on TV sows/movies just slip them on and hook them up and I thought "time to give that a go". Took me a while to work out the logistics and not hook the wrong ones together but got there in the end. I know for some women it's not possible due to size, frozen shoulder or other reasons but I'm glad I at least finally got it happening for me. Much quicker and slightly more "ladylike" if I need to do it in front of someone else I guess!! ;D
I've found the best way is to have my handmaidens dress me after I have been lead from my bath of milk and honey by my nubile young man servant.
Then I burn the toast and wake up :laugh:
Personally I've found baths of honey and asses milk just leads to ant problems... ;D
Not to mention the upkeep for the forsaid asses.
Quote from: Ms Grace on April 08, 2015, 01:44:12 AM
I found hooking at the front and swinging around the back was fairly ungainly but about the only way I could manage it. Like mentioned above though I saw some women on TV sows/movies just slip them on and hook them up and I thought "time to give that a go". Took me a while to work out the logistics and not hook the wrong ones together but got there in the end. I know for some women it's not possible due to size, frozen shoulder or other reasons but I'm glad I at least finally got it happening for me. Much quicker and slightly more "ladylike" if I need to do it in front of someone else I guess!! ;D
I could do both methods since before I even realized I was trans. But I still find the hook-and-swing method easier.
Not only am I rather talented in bra methodology but I can wax my pits, legs and other interesting areas with a talent second to none :icon_chick:
Same here. I have never had a problem hooking in back where as my mom always used the front method.
Mariah
Quote from: marsh monster on April 07, 2015, 03:25:40 PM
I've always hooked it in the back even though I did know of the other method, just easier for me and less work overall.
Wearing earrings in bed, and even to bed.
Putting earbuds in whilst wearing earrings.
Those days when eyeliner works *wistful*...........
Quote from: marsh monster on April 07, 2015, 12:13:59 PM
Learning how to boil an egg without it exploding or something. I was quite proud of myself.
Yay. I did it today. :D
Here's something to learn
How to remove your bra without taking your top off.
The first time you see it done, you're like, what the? How in the hell?
It's pretty easy though.
And men are always amazed when you do it.
Open the clasp.
Pull the strap out over one of your arms.
Then pull the whole bra off over the other arm.
Or for more fun, pull the other strap over your arm too.
Then reach down the front of your top an pull out the bra.
Quote from: Ms Grace on April 07, 2015, 07:28:00 AM
When I first tried putting on a bra with the hooks at the back there was just no way that was going to happen. I think I spent the first nine months of being full time putting it on with the hooks at the front and swinging it around. But then I started to challenge myself to hook it up from behind. Clumsy and hillarious would probably describe those attempts but now I am rather adept at getting it on and it takes me a second to remove one. I know a genetic cis woman woman would probably say "la de dah, big deal" but I'm quite pleased with that accomplishment.
I used to do this. After a month on spiro, my girlfriend at the time made me start putting on a bra the right way. We're still close friends. She's the best. :)
Quote from: KarinMcD on April 08, 2015, 03:04:09 PM
Here's something to learn
How to remove your bra without taking your top off.
The first time you see it done, you're like, what the? How in the hell?
It's pretty easy though.
And men are always amazed when you do it.
Open the clasp.
Pull the strap out over one of your arms.
Then pull the whole bra off over the other arm.
Or for more fun, pull the other strap over your arm too.
Then reach down the front of your top an pull out the bra.
This task is completed almost daily when I walk in the house after work. ;)
Quote from: KarinMcD on April 08, 2015, 03:04:09 PM
Here's something to learn
How to remove your bra without taking your top off.
The first time you see it done, you're like, what the? How in the hell?
It's pretty easy though.
And men are always amazed when you do it.
Open the clasp.
Pull the strap out over one of your arms.
Then pull the whole bra off over the other arm.
Or for more fun, pull the other strap over your arm too.
Then reach down the front of your top an pull out the bra.
I tried that and almost strangled myself. Shouldn't have done it wearing a sports bra. :D
Quote from: KarinMcD on April 08, 2015, 03:04:09 PM
Here's something to learn
How to remove your bra without taking your top off.
The first time you see it done, you're like, what the? How in the hell?
It's pretty easy though.
And men are always amazed when you do it.
Open the clasp.
Pull the strap out over one of your arms.
Then pull the whole bra off over the other arm.
Or for more fun, pull the other strap over your arm too.
Then reach down the front of your top an pull out the bra.
I thought that was the first thing a self respecting girl would learn :icon_chick: The real trick is putting another one on because you just wanted to change bras before going somewhere
Oh yeah, got that bra removal without taking off my top process down pat ages ago... the things you learn due to being utterly lazy! Reckon I can get one on without taking off my top too now... :angel:
LOL, I was just remembering a time when I had one with removable straps that kept malfunctioning so I had to quickly switch bras out because I had a ride waiting to take me to an appointment :D Imagine hurrying to get ready to go and the straps suddenly going *Pop!!!* :o
Quote from: KarinMcD on April 08, 2015, 03:04:09 PM
Here's something to learn
How to remove your bra without taking your top off.
The first time you see it done, you're like, what the? How in the hell?
It's pretty easy though.
And men are always amazed when you do it.
Open the clasp.
Pull the strap out over one of your arms.
Then pull the whole bra off over the other arm.
Or for more fun, pull the other strap over your arm too.
Then reach down the front of your top an pull out the bra.
I learnt this a while back too. My wife was surprised when I did it. :P