I have a very fast metabolism, so nothing seems to bring my estradiol level where it needs to be for feminization. It was in the male range on gel or spray, so I switched to oral estradiol. Despite taking a reasonable amount orally, my level never even made it to 80, and it felt even lower with all the interference from estrone. My first doctor said to add patches, but since the expensive, 3.5-day patches only seemed to help for a day or so, that was not a viable option. Since he also thought any level over 100 was too high, I switched to another doctor. She told me the best way to raise my estradiol level was with a weekly injection. After switching to a weekly subcutaneous injection of estradiol valerate (supervised or given by a nurse, so I know it was injected properly), my level actually declined back into the male range! My doctor's 'solution' is to raise the dosage by a tiny fraction or to give me a low dose twice a week, neither of which would produce a reasonable level in me given how fast I lose it. This doctor herself has admitted that the best feminization occurs at a level of 200-400, but she is totally unwilling to bring my level anywhere near there for any meaningful length of time. I find that very perplexing. She does not seem to understand that physical feminization requires a higher level than is necessary to normalize mood.
So, are subcutaneous injections worthless, or do I just need a higher or more frequent dose? My doctor wants to continue them.
My only other thought is to try the pills sublingually, but spending so much time with the poor-tasting pills in my mouth, only to obtain a wildly unstable level, really does not appeal to me. I will see the doctor again on Monday. As the sun is now stronger and the heat will soon follow, my window of opportunity to feminize is closing. I need a higher level now, because I see improvements overnight when my level is good. Is there something I am not thinking of that I should suggest to the doctor?
There are implants available from compounding pharmacies, both for bioidentical estrogen and progesterone.
Each is the size of a rice grain and last ca. 4 months.
Some people recommend them especially if other methods fail ( and they recommend them otherwise, either ).
If your endo is willing to administer enough of them to raise levels enough is another question.
Some side effects are lessened because of internal application, like the shots.
As aside, some gender clinics do not go mainly by levels but by how good feminization is and how the person feels.
You might think about adding bioidentical progesteron, topical or in implant form, for example.
Theory is it might help with breast development, has some antiandrogenic effects, balances some effects of estrogen and evens mood.
hugs
Hi Steph,
I think you are doing the right thing by discussing it with your doctor.
Do you know your free T level? Is it being suppressed adequately?
Quote from: Steph34 on April 22, 2015, 03:07:49 PM
My only other thought is to try the pills sublingually, but spending so much time with the poor-tasting pills in my mouth, only to obtain a wildly unstable level, really does not appeal to me. I will see the doctor again on Monday. As the sun is now stronger and the heat will soon follow, my window of opportunity to feminize is closing. I need a higher level now, because I see improvements overnight when my level is good. Is there something I am not thinking of that I should suggest to the doctor?
This might be worth a try at least? I know people talk about sublingual as if the levels are unstalbe, but I've read estradiol has something like a 13 hour half life. I'm not sure if that means anything as I'm no expert, but I would hope it would mean that sub lingual is a decent way to take it.
Quote from: Steph34 on April 22, 2015, 03:07:49 PM
After switching to a weekly subcutaneous injection of estradiol valerate
subcutaneous injection of sex hormones is pretty odd unless I'm mistaking you for taking implants instead?
Also wanted to add that the sublingual experiment everyone seems to reference can be seen here:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FXwOB5.png&hash=956ee89b4de6fd830187b7bc51dcb719d106d52d)
Source: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0029784496005133 (there is a pay wall though)
PO is SIG code for "by mouth" or orally, and SL obviously sublingual. There is definitely a difference with taking sublingual vs oral as demonstrate by the graph. One thing to note though is this is specifically micronized oestradiol aka estrace or estrofem
The timing of when u get your testing done could play a part in it. I myself get worried myself because my level was 79 5 hours after taking it and 96 3 hours after taking it. However I feel great and am seeing changes. I would say that the levels it takes to develop depends on your body. There are plenty of cis women with low estradiol. That being said as long as you are in normal range then I would try not to worry about it too much. However seeking options to increase your levels is not a bad thing. I am trying to do the same but right now it is a wait and see approach.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sounds like you need to find a new doctor ;) You should be getting your EV shot deep into a large muscle like your butt or thighs with a 1 1/2" long needle... Once a week is the usual frequency but some like to start at once every 2 weeks....
Quote from: Steph34 on April 22, 2015, 03:07:49 PM
After switching to a weekly subcutaneous injection of estradiol valerate (supervised or given by a nurse, so I know it was injected properly), my level actually declined back into the male range!
Why subcutaneous instead of intramuscular which is the usual way it's done with injections? I've heard that it doesn't absorb quite the same way, someone suggested to me that it might give faster/higher peaks and lows and a nurse said it just wouldn't absorb as effectively. But, I also heard from transmen that T works as well both ways. So who knows? I take mine intramuscularly as directed by my doctors.
QuoteThis doctor herself has admitted that the best feminization occurs at a level of 200-400, but she is totally unwilling to bring my level anywhere near there for any meaningful length of time.I find that very perplexing.
Have you asked her why she doesn't want to maintain those levels? I just wonder because ciswomen can experience levels up to 650 pg/ml during their menstrual cycle, and if we took an average between the lowest and highest levels during a cycle , we would probably come up with an average around 300 notwithstanding the much higher levels they are exposed to during pregnancy (in the thousands). So, if these levels are fine for them, for several decades, why should they be a problem for us? I'm not a doctor, I'm just left quite perplexed as you are and would really be curious to get an answer. Have there been any papers showing that such levels are harmful to transwomen?
I think these questions should perhaps be raised when discussing next time with your doctor as well as the reason why subcutaneous is favored by her when the vast majority of us take it intramuscularly and EV is indicated to be taken that way. Let us know what she says. :)
Quote from: AmandaMarie on April 23, 2015, 01:15:42 AM
I would say that the levels it takes to develops depends on your body.
+1.
Quote from: TransSasha on April 22, 2015, 09:29:48 PM
Also wanted to add that the sublingual experiment everyone seems to reference can be seen here:
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FXwOB5.png&hash=956ee89b4de6fd830187b7bc51dcb719d106d52d)
Source: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0029784496005133 (there is a pay wall though)
PO is SIG code for "by mouth" or orally, and SL obviously sublingual. There is definitely a difference with taking sublingual vs oral as demonstrate by the graph. One thing to note though is this is specifically micronized oestradiol aka estrace or estrofem
What an interesting & useful graph this is - thankyou Sasha, for posting it.
I'm also wanting to find out how soon estradial levels rise after a sub-lingual dose is placed in the mouth. Does anyone know?
This study also has a really interesting graph in it on page 3, as it shows the two distinct (but 'separate') estradial cycles operating on a daily basis in natal-born women: www.eje.org/content/148/2/227.full.pdf
Looking at the graph Sasha posted more carefully, it looks like it's indicating that when estradial is taken sub-lingually, it takes an hour to show in blood serum, and that at that first hour interval, it is at a peak.
Of course, it could just be that the first measurement in the study was taken at the first hour interval. Presumably the study text as a whole provides this detail.
I've read studies where high levels of estradiol are detected 30 minutes after sublingual administration and other studies have noted an effect within minutes...sublingual delivers the hormone directly to the blood right away so that levels shoot up quite quickly in a matter of seconds to minutes.
Quote from: Laura_7 on April 22, 2015, 03:27:10 PM
There are implants available from compounding pharmacies, both for bioidentical estrogen and progesterone.
I really do not want any foreign objects inside my body. Feminization is meant to awaken the 'real me' from the masculine shell, and implants would make me feel fake.
QuoteAs aside, some gender clinics do not go mainly by levels but by how good feminization is and how the person feels.
I like to be actively involved in my health care decisions, and levels are an important part of that for me. If my average level is less than a cis woman my age would have, I can be pretty certain that I am getting sub-optimal feminization, since if anything, post-pubertal feminization requires *higher* levels due to lower sensitivity and past damage from testosterone. My feminization has been rather poor recently, although my doctor disagrees because she saw me once last April pre-transition and then not again until January, during which time I did feminize somewhat. Going by how I feel can be problematic because, as I said, a full feminizing dose will initially be interpreted by my brain as an intense high because it has been craving the stuff for so long.
QuoteYou might think about adding bioidentical progesteron, topical or in implant form, for example.
Theory is it might help with breast development, has some antiandrogenic effects, balances some effects of estrogen and evens mood.
My problem is clearly one of low estradiol. I tried progesterone and unfortunately, it did none of that for me. I had rapid weight gain in a male pattern on the shoulders and stomach, my face masculinized, and I became tired and depressed. It seemed to counteract the benefits I was getting from the estrogen.
Quote from: Cynthia Michelle on April 22, 2015, 08:07:43 PM
Do you know your free T level? Is it being suppressed adequately?
My free T has been in the female range for several months now, and actually dipped to a new low this month.
Quote from: Deinewelt on April 22, 2015, 09:15:58 PM
This might be worth a try at least? I know people talk about sublingual as if the levels are unstalbe, but I've read estradiol has something like a 13 hour half life. I'm not sure if that means anything as I'm no expert, but I would hope it would mean that sub lingual is a decent way to take it.
That half-life sounds reasonable for oral estradiol. Sub-lingual (dissolved under the tongue) is different from oral (swallowed). Sub-lingual estradiol, as indicated by the graph, results in a sharp peak and rapid drop following each dose. Also, my unusually fast metabolism means that my hormone level tends to decline much faster than the references indicate. I need a doctor who is willing to compensate for that by prescribing a higher or more frequent dose.
Anyway, while I complained about poor taste and time investment, those would be minor nuisances if it were otherwise effective. My larger concern is that some of it may be taken orally by accident since I tend to have a lot of saliva and a difficult time keeping it suppressed under the tongue. Oral estradiol worsens my persistent yeast infection on the scalp, presumably because it passes through the digestive tract, causing a greater increase in Candida growth than other ways of taking my hormone. The end result is hair loss, so I really cannot take my estradiol orally.
Quote from: TransSasha on April 22, 2015, 09:23:50 PM
subcutaneous injection of sex hormones is pretty odd unless I'm mistaking you for taking implants instead?
No, it really is a subcutaneous injection in the abdominal area. I will not use implants.
Quote from: TransSasha on April 22, 2015, 09:29:48 PM
PO is SIG code for "by mouth" or orally, and SL obviously sublingual. There is definitely a difference with taking sublingual vs oral as demonstrate by the graph. One thing to note though is this is specifically micronized oestradiol aka estrace or estrofem
I was given a generic version of the above, so I believe that is what I have.
Quote from: AmandaMarie on April 23, 2015, 01:15:42 AM
The timing of when u get your testing done could play a part in it. I myself get worried myself because my level was 79 5 hours after taking it and 96 3 hours after taking it. However I feel great and am seeing changes. I would say that the levels it takes to develop depends on your body. There are plenty of cis women with low estradiol. That being said as long as you are in normal range then I would try not to worry about it too much. However seeking options to increase your levels is not a bad thing. I am trying to do the same but right now it is a wait and see approach.
My level has been very low for a woman, and I am seeing poor feminization. You have a point about the timing, but my doctor prefers to test the 'trough' level, and given my fast metabolism, it is practically gone by the time she feels I am ready for another dose. She really does not care about my 'peak' level, which I find rather odd because that is when I do feminize, only to lose my femininity when my level crashes.
Quote from: KayXo on April 23, 2015, 09:15:58 AM
Why subcutaneous instead of intramuscular which is the usual way it's done with injections? I've heard that it doesn't absorb quite the same way, someone suggested to me that it might give faster/higher peaks and lows and a nurse said it just wouldn't absorb as effectively. But, I also heard from transmen that T works as well both ways. So who knows? I take mine intramuscularly as directed by my doctors.
She has expressed concern about my level going too high, which I find rather odd and irritating because my level has never even been where she wanted it. Intramuscular injections typically produce a peak much higher than her target levels.
QuoteSo, if these levels are fine for them, for several decades, why should they be a problem for us? I'm not a doctor, I'm just left quite perplexed as you are and would really be curious to get an answer. Have there been any papers showing that such levels are harmful to transwomen?
I am not aware of any evidence suggesting that such a level is dangerous, yet my doctors seem to be treating this hormone as if it is a toxic drug rather than the healthy hormone that it is. I think they fear being reprimanded for violating Endocrine Society guidelines or whatever, since my current doctor herself has admitted there is no evidence to suggest a level of 400 is unsafe. She also wants to go really slowly to find my perfect dose, as if I would drop dead if my level reached 401, unlikely anyway given my metabolism. I think she is just cautious to a fault, but what really made me cry hysterically in the office was her totally deaf ear to my concerns.
Quote from: KayXo on April 25, 2015, 08:40:37 AM
I've read studies where high levels of estradiol are detected 30 minutes after sublingual administration and other studies have noted an effect within minutes...sublingual delivers the hormone directly to the blood right away so that levels shoot up quite quickly in a matter of seconds to minutes.
I do feel a rush of positive energy within minutes after taking it that way. If everyone felt the way I did, people would be doing it to get high.
Quote from: Steph34 on April 26, 2015, 12:19:24 PM
I really do not want any foreign objects inside my body. Feminization is meant to awaken the 'real me' from the masculine shell, and implants would make me feel fake.
Well of course it is up to you.
One of them is the size of a rice grain, implanted with an incision and they simply dissolve over months.
There are people who say this is close to what an ovary does.
But as said it is up to you.
Quote from: Steph34 on April 26, 2015, 12:19:24 PMI tried progesterone and unfortunately, it did none of that for me. I had rapid weight gain in a male pattern on the shoulders and stomach, my face masculinized, and I became tired and depressed. It seemed to counteract the benefits I was getting from the estrogen.
Do you happen to know if this was bioidentical progesterone or the more synthetical form progestin ?
They have different effects.
In oral form, one is a capsule, the other pills.
Quote from: Laura_7 on April 26, 2015, 01:02:55 PM
Well of course it is up to you.
One of them is the size of a rice grain, implanted with an incision and they simply dissolve over months.
There are people who say this is close to what an ovary does.
But as said it is up to you.
I really do not want to feel fake by trying to mimic a cis female body; I am very uneasy with the prospect of anything inside of me.
QuoteDo you happen to know if this was bioidentical progesterone or the more synthetical form progestin ?
They have different effects.
In oral form, one is a capsule, the other pills.
I tried both and had similar problems with each. The bioidentical progesterone capsules were harsher than the synthetic MPA pills, but they both had the same undesirable effects, no feminizing effects at all aside from a little breast swelling during the first day or two that quickly subsided without any lasting growth.
ok best case scenario, you switch to IM injections. oil suspended hormones are meant to be shot deep muscle. its really odd they have you shooting sub Q. Sub Q is better for water based suspensions like growth hormone, or hcg.
I mean you can shoot oil suspended sub q but typically it takes a far longer time to de ester and released into the blood stream. I personally would see about getting switched to IM. Now I'm not saying you can't shoot sex hormones sub q. In fact theres studies where this was done and levels were still within normal range:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17143361 (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17143361)
but IM is definitely the more popular route. no harm in trying and switching back if the outcome isn't favored
Implants are considered the gold standard of hormone delivery by many endo's and gyno's, regardless of specific application - be it HRT or contraception or cancer treatment. They release a consistent dose that can be specifically tailored to the patient. Also, for most formulations of HRT, there is no external capsule that requires removal at the end of the implants usefulness, it is entirely absorbed by the body.
Many 1000's of cis women all over the world use implanted hormones for a variety of reasons. This doesn't really mimic anything, just delivers a customisable and consistent dose.
Do you really want to discount a proven method for what seem like not so good reasons, Steph?
Steph,
from everything that I came across, it seems levels vary a lot from one ciswoman to another and fluctuate so much during a menstrual cycle, going much higher during pregnancy that trying to mimic levels of a ciswoman is senseless. Some women are more and some women less sensitive to the same level, and remember that even if you measure your levels, chances are that these are not at all indicative as your levels might be twice as high or low on another day. My doctors stress the importance of finding the right dose for ME without compromising my health.
Progesterone might not be essential as some do quite well on estrogen alone. It depends. ;) To each their own. :)
Quote from: TransSasha on April 26, 2015, 03:47:45 PM
ok best case scenario, you switch to IM injections. oil suspended hormones are meant to be shot deep muscle. its really odd they have you shooting sub Q. Sub Q is better for water based suspensions like growth hormone, or hcg.
I will ask the doctor about IM when I see her today. I have not previously discussed it, but I think she would have her concerns. Most people on here who inject that way seem to have very high levels, and neither I nor my doctor think a level of 1000 would be good for me at this time.
Quote from: kelly_aus on April 26, 2015, 04:16:51 PM
Do you really want to discount a proven method for what seem like not so good reasons, Steph?
For me, it would invalidate the whole psychological benefit of transitioning. I stand by my reasoning even if it seems senseless to some. My doctor might not even prescribe it, anyway.
Quote from: KayXo on April 26, 2015, 10:40:55 PM
from everything that I came across, it seems levels vary a lot from one ciswoman to another and fluctuate so much during a menstrual cycle, going much higher during pregnancy that trying to mimic levels of a ciswoman is senseless. Some women are more and some women less sensitive to the same level, and remember that even if you measure your levels, chances are that these are not at all indicative as your levels might be twice as high or low on another day. My doctors stress the importance of finding the right dose for ME without compromising my health.
I am not trying to mimic cis female levels or shoot for some ideal level, but to me it just seems to be common sense that having *less* exposure to estradiol each month than most non-pregnant cis women would be insufficient for feminization, given my lower sensitivity to the hormone due to my age and past development in the wrong body.
Thanks anyway to all who responded to my post. I will see the doctor this afternoon and see how it goes.
I hope you and your doctor find the route and dose (and overall regimen) that best suits you so that mentally and physically you get all the possible benefits without compromising your health. :) I personally think you may be focusing too much on levels instead of just how you feel and overall feminization as indicators whether the regimen is working for you or not. Even when you test levels, levels fluctuate from one hour to another, one day to another so what's the point really? They may be quite low one day, relative to what your "target" level is and quite high another. To get a rough estimate of average levels, you would have to take measurements every single day over the course of the cycle of the injection, I think.
Let us know how it goes. ;)
My feminization in recent months has been rather poor, leading me to be concerned that it is because my level is not where it should be.
This is really weird. When I saw the doctor, she told me my level was around 800. I could have sworn it was only near 30. After looking it up on the computer, it appeared they changed the blood results. The "initial result" for estradiol was 31, but the "corrected result" was 808. ??? The estrone result was raised as well. My doctor also found that confusing, so she ordered a repeat test and decided to keep me on the same regimen pending the results. It kind of makes me wonder if the lab suspected that I am trans and decided to report a fake, high level in an attempt to prevent me from getting HRT. Has anyone else seen their blood results modified after the fact? :-\
I asked my doctor why she prefers subcutaneous injections when EV is typically given as an intramuscular injection. The response was that subcutaneous injections produce a steadier level, unlike IM injections which produce a high peak level that crashes to near nothing. She said it is absorbed just as well, but more stable over time. :)
The doctor even claimed to be considering writing a paper about injecting it subcutaneously, but it was unclear if that comment was serious. If the claim of steadier release is true, that would be beneficial for me given my tendency to quickly metabolize what is already in my blood. I guess I just need to wait for the new result. I intend to switch to twice weekly injections anyway because I usually feel quite low by the weekend after injecting on a Monday.
It's not uncommon for blood results to be changed or corrected. I would doubt the people who ran the test would have any idea that your transgendered beyond the codes they used to authorize the test in the first place and that isn't taken into account when doing the lab work. The only thing that they do use is if your chart with them shows male or female and only comes into play as to what the normal levels are for many different blood tests. It's good that your doctor is having it done again to clear up any doubt in concerns to those numbers. Good luck and hugs
Mariah
Quote from: Steph34 on April 30, 2015, 11:33:34 AM
When I saw the doctor, she told me my level was around 800. I could have sworn it was only near 30. After looking it up on the computer, it appeared they changed the blood results. The "initial result" for estradiol was 31, but the "corrected result" was 808. ??? The estrone result was raised as well. My doctor also found that confusing, so she ordered a repeat test and decided to keep me on the same regimen pending the results. It kind of makes me wonder if the lab suspected that I am trans and decided to report a fake, high level in an attempt to prevent me from getting HRT. Has anyone else seen their blood results modified after the fact? :-\
I'm as perplexed as you. ???
QuoteI asked my doctor why she prefers subcutaneous injections when EV is typically given as an intramuscular injection. The response was that subcutaneous injections produce a steadier level, unlike IM injections which produce a high peak level that crashes to near nothing. She said it is absorbed just as well, but more stable over time. :)
The only thing that personally worries me is that levels that are too steady might desensitize receptors over time whereas some fluctuation might keep them more responsive as with anything that you take. To avoid too much fluctuation, one can decrease frequency of injections; I take them every 5 days, for instance. And on a personal note, I've noticed better response when my hormone was injected in an area where there was less fat vs. more, so that muscle seems to give, at least for me, better bio-availability than if some is perhaps also injected in fat (subcutaneous) because of the thick layer of fat on top of the muscle; i get injected in the butt area!
But, to each their own, and if it works for you and your doctor prescribes it that way, then I have no say, of course. Just sharing with you my own experience and knowledge on the subject. :)
Quote from: KayXo on April 30, 2015, 11:53:48 AM
The only thing that personally worries me is that levels that are too steady might desensitize receptors over time
whereas some fluctuation might keep them more responsive as with anything that you take.
That makes sense. When I was on weaker products, I did seem to feminize better when I took a few days off occasionally. However, a level that peaks in the thousands and dips to near zero would give me some pretty wild mood swings, and I doubt it would be beneficial given my fast metabolism.
Quoteto avoid too much fluctuation, one can decrease frequency of injections; I take them every 5 days, for instance.
My doctor plans to write a prescription for twice per week, although subcutaneously, to stabilize my level.
QuoteAnd on a personal note, I've noticed better response when my hormone was injected in an area where there was less fat vs. more, so that muscle seems to give, at least for me, better bio-availability than if some is perhaps also injected in fat (subcutaneous) because of the thick layer of fat on top of the muscle
I really do not have a choice because the needle I will be given is too small for intramuscular injections, and I would like to give subcutaneous a chance first anyway. You also reported better feminization with progesterone, while I found it masculinizing, so who knows?
QuoteJust sharing with you my own experience and knowledge on the subject. :)
Always welcome :)
Quote from: Steph34 on April 30, 2015, 12:26:32 PM
However, a level that peaks in the thousands and dips to near zero would give me some pretty wild mood swings, and I doubt it would be beneficial given my fast metabolism.
Over exaggeration. This could perhaps be the case if you injected every 3-4 weeks, even with a fast metabolism, but on a weekly basis, this shouldn't occur and I personally have not suffered from wild mood swings due to injections. On the contrary, I feel better, more stable than on pills taken 2-3 times daily.
Enjoy our conversations, as always, Steph and best of luck. :) I hope you feel better and you deserve it.
I had awful mood swings on pills taken multiple times per day; the ups and downs were overwhelming, and my feminization was nonexistent. That (and the high estrone level, which I fear could interfere with estradiol) is why I wanted to switch to injections. Still, it has been my experience throughout life that people tend to underestimate my metabolism. Even my doctors were often perplexed by how low my estradiol level was.
My repeat blood test showed that my level was indeed over 800. I find that very surprising, given that I was on a fairly low dose and my levels have always been lower than predicted, not higher. It does make me wonder about the integrity of the lab, especially given the initial report of 31 for the prior test. I have since received a decrease because a level over 800 is too high for me. An abnormally high level may cause photosensitivity and candidiasis, both of which I have suffered from for a long time, but much more so since switching to injections. Too high a level can also end the development process faster; my doctor says that higher levels only produce more feminization in the short term and not in the long term. I am reluctant to decrease too much, though, because I want to feminize, after all. I think I have reasonably good sensitivity to estradiol, so I should not need an abnormally high level. I will discuss it again with my doctor the next time I see her.
My levels crossed over 100 using patches and I can say that results are pretty obvious. The constant delivery of the transdermal method has really brought my moods in to a manageable swing and no complaints thus far. I usually get tested on a Tuesday when the current patches have been on for 3 days, so they are only delivering marginal doses and things are still feeling fine. Might be worth discussing with your doctor.
Quote from: kaitylynn on April 10, 2016, 04:30:23 PM
I usually get tested on a Tuesday when the current patches have been on for 3 days, so they are only delivering marginal doses
Patches supposed to be worn every 3.5 days are guaranteed to deliver the same amount of estradiol daily. After 3.5 days, there is no longer any guarantee and this is why it is advised to change patches. Hence, by 3 days, amounts delivered into the blood are still the same. :)
Quote from: kaitylynn on April 10, 2016, 04:30:23 PM
My levels crossed over 100 using patches and I can say that results are pretty obvious. The constant delivery of the transdermal method has really brought my moods in to a manageable swing and no complaints thus far. I usually get tested on a Tuesday when the current patches have been on for 3 days, so they are only delivering marginal doses and things are still feeling fine. Might be worth discussing with your doctor.
This was an old topic; I have since switched to patches and I love them! My levels range from 110-220 and I agree that the steadier flow helps with mood swings. I still do have swings because I am an emotional person and levels are not totally steady; I would not want that anyway due to fear of desensitization. My physical results are as good as with any other method and I feel better. :)
Quote from: KayXo on April 11, 2016, 02:03:45 PM
Patches supposed to be worn every 3.5 days are guaranteed to deliver the same amount of estradiol daily. After 3.5 days, there is no longer any guarantee and this is why it is advised to change patches. Hence, by 3 days, amounts delivered into the blood are still the same. :)
I am not so sure. I have usually received blood tests 1 day after applying a new patch. Once my blood was drawn 2 days after application, and my level was about 40% lower. :-\
Quote from: KayXo on April 11, 2016, 02:03:45 PM
Patches supposed to be worn every 3.5 days are guaranteed to deliver the same amount of estradiol daily. After 3.5 days, there is no longer any guarantee and this is why it is advised to change patches. Hence, by 3 days, amounts delivered into the blood are still the same. :)
That has not been my experience. When testing with 3 day old patches, my levels were markedly lower than testing the day after applying fresh ones. The results are individual.
The normal female T range is 36 to 150 ng/dl. The test I take goes down to 3. I have below 3 ng/dl. (this is on IM with spiro and prometrium).
When I was on pills and everything else the same my T was 22-36 ng/dl.
Your T level could be high. I take a high level of E IM every 10 days.
How many trans does your endo treat?