Susan's Place Transgender Resources

It would be an incredibly though thing for me to do without the hormone. The hormones kind of give me the courage. I probably wouldn't be able to do it since there would be basically no change. HRT the wonder therapy

Slight conflict between title of thread and title of poll..."do you think you would transition..." -vs- "do you think you'd be able to transition."

No, I needed estrogen, whether or not it changed my body.  T was a poison.

I voted absolutely not, because without E I would've died by my own hand.

Yep I did. Twice actually.

First time (1964) doesnt count cos I was a little girl (about 4 years old)

Second time I was in my early twenties and having hit the buffers with the medics once before when in 1976 they had refused me puberty blockers, i decided I would take matter into my own hands and fullly transition before I even saw a doctor - thus making it very difficult for them to say no.

As it turned out I (cough cough) managed to get some hormones a bit sooner than I expected, but that's another story and not one I could condone in these more enlightened times when actually, compared to the dragons we faced in the 60's and 70's, todays doctors are FAR more reasonable. I eventually saw the doctors when I had already done a year, which had been fully documented, and thus on first visit collected not only hormones but also a refereral for surgery!

Back in the old days some doctors were sadistic to the point of disbelief taking great pleasure in making the patient cry, and taking them right to the edge of endurance... thankfully now things are much easier for you all, but back then having been bitten once I was in no mood to let them have a second chunk. Thankfully it worked too!

The whole point of transitioning for me, was to change my body to match my mind. And you can't really do that without HRT.

Quote from: Beth Andrea on June 03, 2015, 03:58:39 PM
Slight conflict between title of thread and title of poll..."do you think you would transition..." -vs- "do you think you'd be able to transition."

No, I needed estrogen, whether or not it changed my body.  T was a poison.

I voted absolutely not, because without E I would've died by my own hand.

sorry

While I have not even started HRT I feel that I could not transition without it for the following reasons.

1) Body hair and with HRT some feminization to at least start to change

2) Big one for me is that I feel it will tell me where I am going and realize it might not be the only indicator but I do feel it will be a strong one that will help me identify myself if that makes any sense.

Did I yes, which I did do by a little over 2 months. However, my medical history is why I knew I had to whether it would have been successful without the hormones I don't know. Hugs
Mariah

Definitely. When I first planned my transition, I decided I wanted it to be doctor-free, so I planned to transition without them.

Then a voice said, "Suzi, are you crazy?!? This is your one chance to get real breasts!"

Suzi, meet estradiol. Estradiol, meet Suzi.

Given the sub-par results I've had from hormones, yeah, I could have done it and probably would have. But then, for me, my dysphoria was all in how I was presented to the world, how I was perceived by the world.. My body has never really been the issue - I'm a woman, therefore my body is that of a woman.

I'm a masculine looking woman, all the lack of hormones would have done is make me very slightly more masculine looking than I am now, so no huge change really.

Quote from: kelly_aus on June 03, 2015, 04:28:21 PM
Given the sub-par results I've had from hormones, yeah, I could have done it and probably would have. But then, for me, my dysphoria was all in how I was presented to the world, how I was perceived by the world.. My body has never really been the issue - I'm a woman, therefore my body is that of a woman.

I'm a masculine looking woman, all the lack of hormones would have done is make me very slightly more masculine looking than I am now, so no huge change really.

I think you look more feminine than your perception allows you to see. That picture in your home made dress was quite expressive of your femininity.

I'm starting to slowly transition and I'm pre-everything, haven't even started laser yet. But I think it's possible to feminize yourself enough through clothes, makeup, nail polish, hair, and jewelry that you can present a feminine appearance without HRT. Sure you won't necessarily look "passable" but you can still be pretty and well put together even if you don't pass. You can look clean and like you take care of yourself, that you've put some effort into your appearance and you didn't just throw on the first thing you found at the store, that you have some style that's fitting to your overall personality. I'm also fine with looking kind of androgynous . I think the key is being confident and carrying yourself in a way that says "Im fine with who I am". As Ru Paul says you gotta love yourself first.

Quote from: stephaniec on June 03, 2015, 04:33:03 PM
I think you look more feminine than your perception allows you to see. That picture in your home made dress was quite expressive of your femininity.

Thanks, but it also hides a few things, like my being flat chested and the lack of hips.. Or a butt.. Or much of a waist. It also hides the very male belly fat I have.

Aggressive, extensive and EXPENSIVE surgeries...or look like a very poor version of a RuPaul's drag racer? Sorry, it would not even have been option for me. And getting care? All but a few would most likely have been committed to an asylum. It was, unfortunately, viewed widely in society as a mental disorder.

Quote from: kelly_aus on June 03, 2015, 04:59:20 PM
Thanks, but it also hides a few things, like my being flat chested and the lack of hips.. Or a butt.. Or much of a waist. It also hides the very male belly fat I have.

I think talk of male belly fat should be a TOS violation my pics are always above the shoulders

Quote from: stephaniec on June 03, 2015, 04:09:47 PM
sorry

No apology needed, Stephanie...you are *awesome* and I appreciate the pointed questions you've been posting lately!

*hugs*

Quote from: stephaniec on June 03, 2015, 05:11:29 PM
I think talk of male belly fat should be a TOS violation my pics are always above the shoulders

Yeah! We could call it "Pseudo Pregnancy Presentation"---PPP--or some such.

;)

thanks Susan's is an awesome place.

Transition without HRT would have been absolutely pointless for me.

The only way I could have done it without hormones was if I castrated myself.  T was murdering my brain and I couldn't stand it anymore.  I actually did begin transition before I was prescribed HRT because once I knew for certain I wasn't male I jumped right into full time.

I seem to be a little confused about whether the question is fully transition all the way to surgeries or begin transition full time without any hormonal assistance.

I went full time without hormones but most definitely wanted them. My Psyche flat refused to help me at all until I was full time and had legally changed my name being as that was the policy for most if not all NHS Gender Clinics at the time. His one concession if you'd call it that was agreeing to let me see the center Speech Therapist who happened to be a Magistrate so was able to sign my Change of Name Deed making it all legal. Her first thought was to dissuade me from self prescribing which she succeeded at because she told me scary horror stories.

The question of if I would stop if they refused hormones was never asked but by the time they agreed to hormones I was 5 months full time and had concluded I'd done the right thing so I would not have stopped being me for anyone or anything at that point. I can't say that hormones have done that much for me except in my boobs but then we can all see the old us in the mirror until we do FFS.

Transition was about me not what others thought, Most still saw a man in womens clothes and happily let me know not usually politely but all I wanted was to be accepted by friends and to see a womans body in the mirror. Still missing out in the friends department but thanks to hormones and Dr Chett I almost have a body.

I wouldn't recommend people to transition without hormones with the knowledge I have now but if you put me back to 2007 and told me the only way you can do this is without hormones but I knew re the abuse and upset what was to come I'd still do it.

Hugs

Sorcha

Yes, i was able to do it because social transition was a really important step in improving my mental state of being. I didnt care what others had to say about me regarding the decisions i made. Everything i have done until this day, i have done with my own sheer will power in order to love myself. To me, being able to live comfortably in my own skin and finally expressing who i am on the inside gave me strength to live on. I knew what my end goal was and i set small goals for myself because i focus on the present and i take it one step at a time. If i had different circumstances and maybe a little older than i am now, then no, i probably wouldnt be able to do it without hormones.

Nah. Social transition and being perceived as female is only part of the equation. The effects of hormones on the physical make up of my body and how my brain receives stimuli is extremy important

Yes,  in fact I did.

I went full time five months before I began HRT. I changed my name and gender legally before I began HRT. If for some reason I was denied HRT it wouldn't have changed my transition plans on bit.

I never could have done it. It took me almost a year and a half of hormones before I started passing consistently.

Testosterone was like the ugly blimp hormone for me... it mutated my arms, legs, face, and midbody into a giant disgusting muscular mass. Also, I would have been bald before long.

So yeah... I could never have done it without hormones. Even with hormones I had complete and total "I can't do this" breakdowns because I felt like my body was unfixably masculine.

Quote from: Carrie Liz on June 04, 2015, 06:48:14 AM
I never could have done it. It took me almost a year and a half of hormones before I started passing consistently.

Testosterone was like the ugly blimp hormone for me... it mutated my arms, legs, face, and midbody into a giant disgusting muscular mass. Also, I would have been bald before long.

So yeah... I could never have done it without hormones. Even with hormones I had complete and total "I can't do this" breakdowns because I felt like my body was unfixably masculine.

w ell, quite obviously you been proven wrong about unfixable . 

this may sound odd, but did anyone in here that did transition before hrt, did you ever have your testosterone levels checked and find them low?  I still believe the hormones were a great confidence booster, but the lack of testosterone is a whole different feeling in itself too.  (or to me it was.)

Quote from: Carrie Liz on June 04, 2015, 06:48:14 AM
I never could have done it. It took me almost a year and a half of hormones before I started passing consistently.

Testosterone was like the ugly blimp hormone for me... it mutated my arms, legs, face, and midbody into a giant disgusting muscular mass. Also, I would have been bald before long.

Not at all complaining or offended :)  But I am bald, 6 foot tall, and with a moderately large bone structure. So I'm gonna have some hurdles myself. You're not alone Carrie Liz. But be your gorgeous self girl :)

The answer is no.

I wanted some physical proof that I was female. My hormone profile being estrogen dominant is that proof. Otherwise (for me) I would view myself as a cross dresser. I am not a cross dresser. Cross dressers are cool people but I am not one of them. People who transition without HRT aren't any less valid either but I'm not one of them. I also don't like to use prosthetics like breast forms. I don't even like wigs. Some people need them understandably but I want my body to reflect my identity and that is only possible with hormones and surgery.

There's only one exception I would make and that is if I were to transition as a child or teen.

YES!
Back in the 80's I had no idea what HRT was, dressed and accessorized female, just being myself I thought.  Fast forward to when I finally came clean. Informed my psychiatrist I was here seeking SRS, not hormones (HRT).  Underwent SRS 8 months later.

Never considered my 'cross dressing' (no breasts forms, butt) a fetish.  Just something transsexual women do to feel comfortable. It worked until 'intense transsexualism' took over.

I love what HRT does.  Especially to my face but it was not a deal breaker.

In an age before modern medicine, I would most likely die young by suicide and get by using my youthful looks as a gay man, desperate enough might become enuch (cut sack genitals off).

I can live if I had looks, but I cannot live without hope of love as being the feminine lover. If I turn into a rugged old ugly man.. then Im better off dead. Rather be an ugly woman than an average man.

All other things being equal and it being, say, a hundred years ago, I would not. I was 54 when reality got through my thick skull. Given the conditions I have, and the average life expectancy then, I would have died of natural causes long before I reached 54.

I think I would actually, but i'm not saying it wouldn't be hard. It most certainly would. Back in the old days 80's girls used premarin to transition, and while this changed their bodies, usually breast growth was minimal to non-existent, I think. And they didn't have testosterone blockers. I wouldn't consider it cross dressing, I don't know how I would cope with having an andro body with just SRS and no boobs, but I would probably cheat and create cleavage, I guess. My face wouldn't change, so the trick would be makeupmakeupmakeup. Since my voice is fairly high, this wouldn't be a problem. However, if I was clockable I don't know if I could. I think hormones are a confidence booster.

I used to think that it would be something I'd never ever do, but recently I got to a point where I seriously considered going fulltime without them because it's been such a hassle to get them with therapists lying about their experience, trying to cure me, leaving their jobs after 2-3 sessions, etc. I was strongly urged against it and finally have a therapist ready to give me a letter at the next appointment, but it's still a struggle to not just do it anyway.

Quote from: Cynobyte on June 04, 2015, 07:26:25 AM
this may sound odd, but did anyone in here that did transition before hrt, did you ever have your testosterone levels checked and find them low?  I still believe the hormones were a great confidence booster, but the lack of testosterone is a whole different feeling in itself too.  (or to me it was.)

Mines was ~304ng/dl. It was a bit on the low side, but  my nurse practioner said since we took my blood later in the evening(when T lvls are at their lowest) it might not be 100% accurate.

I suppose there's no way of knowing how desperate I'd get, but I'll be forever grateful that HRT made it possible for me to blend quietly into the cis population. I think I would have had to become a lot MORE desperate, because it was finding out about HRT - that I could naturally develop along the lines of the woman I would have been with a female puberty - that convinced me to try transitioning.

(And my T level was 180 on the scale where normal starts at 300... but I never had any symptoms.)

Quote from: Cynobyte on June 04, 2015, 07:26:25 AM
this may sound odd, but did anyone in here that did transition before hrt, did you ever have your testosterone levels checked and find them low?  I still believe the hormones were a great confidence booster, but the lack of testosterone is a whole different feeling in itself too.  (or to me it was.)

I did not transition before HRT but I have been plagued with low T and ED for a long time. When my first baseline labs came back they were like 185.

Nobody ever got my hormone levels right until I intervened and went on Hormone strike. My T level wasn't measured until I had been on Estrogen for 8 months and by then it was non existent. My Doc told me is was too low to measure. This was without a T blocker. Maybe it was always too low we'll never know.

Hugs

Sorcha  ;D

Wow! I was the high scorer with 203, pre-HRT. Never saw that coming.

I would have to be on hormones to even consider transitioning. I wouldn't have the courage or the beginning of curves to pull off anything good.

I started to transition before hormones. it was once i got hormones that I started full time. but before that it was everywhere but at work

  I have been transitioning without being on HRT. Don't really know when I went full time, I have been gradually socially transitioning as I have lost weight adding different wardrobe items, makeup etc as I lost it. Somewhere while losing  185lbs  I was full time.  I do really want to be on HRT and will start in 3 weeks, wanted to get below 200lbs before I started and that has taken me a little over 2 years. What I am really hoping for with the HRT are the mental aspects of it though I do want the physical changes as well. I pass most of the time right now,  under all that fat I had a lot of feminine features.

I totally think I would have if the question is 'would I have transitioned before the availability of HRT' HRT was like coming home.However,if HRT hadnt been available,my personality would have been different.Whether you have estrogen or testosterone as your dominant sex steroid has(in my opinion) a massive effect on who you are-how you see,smell,taste,interact with the world etc.The greatest benefits of HRT have been mental for me though I'm not denying the physical changes were most welcome.

No answer fit me.

Would I?..... Who knows. Maybe yes. Likely No. I Dunno.

Now, have hormones helped clear my mind? Lessen my chronic depression? Give me a sense of hop for "A" future? Yes.

I did transition at first without them than got them later

I dont think I would have, I think if hormones were not available, I would have just remained a frequent cross dresser.

It would have been tuff for me, not to look how I felt.. My teenage age years were tuff, as I was jealous how the girls were developing.. So wanted breasts and to wear those summer dresses... and hrt let that dream come true.. and I love my breasts.

Quote from: noleen111 on June 06, 2015, 02:16:23 AM
I dont think I would have, I think if hormones were not available, I would have just remained a frequent cross dresser.

It would have been tuff for me, not to look how I felt.. My teenage age years were tuff, as I was jealous how the girls were developing.. So wanted breasts and to wear those summer dresses... and hrt let that dream come true.. and I love my breasts.

yes, the proper proportions, that's what drove me crazy until I got hormones. I know cross dressing wasn't going to solve my situation.

Quote from: Cynobyte on June 04, 2015, 07:26:25 AM
this may sound odd, but did anyone in here that did transition before hrt, did you ever have your testosterone levels checked and find them low?  I still believe the hormones were a great confidence booster, but the lack of testosterone is a whole different feeling in itself too.  (or to me it was.)

I transitioned before HRT. When I was put on a moderate dosage of Spiro (for a heart condition), I started having my T levels checked periodically, and it has gone down from a moderately high level to a low-to-normal range. I think it may be due to a combination of Spiro, aging and maybe some weight gain, but I can tell the difference in my libido, aggressiveness and other aspects of my mental outlook. I consider those changes to be very positive.

I'm uncertain that I'll ever be medically suitable for HRT, so I just decided to do what I could. When you're retired, things are less complicated. :)

-AshleyP

How do you say Hell NOOO in the most female voice and accent possible :)

The effects of E have been so far reaching mentally that to be denied that part would have really given me the incorrect frame of reference and response to be who I truly am meant to be.

Quote from: AshleyP on June 06, 2015, 04:59:12 PM
I transitioned before HRT. When I was put on a moderate dosage of Spiro (for a heart condition), I started having my T levels checked periodically, and it has gone down from a moderately high level to a low-to-normal range. I think it may be due to a combination of Spiro, aging and maybe some weight gain, but I can tell the difference in my libido, aggressiveness and other aspects of my mental outlook. I consider those changes to be very positive.

I'm uncertain that I'll ever be medically suitable for HRT, so I just decided to do what I could. When you're retired, things are less complicated. :)

-AshleyP

my dear, there are so many health concerns that testosterone can cause.  If you dont smoke, you may be able to try estrogen injection form.   If you are happy with how the lack of testosterone has made you feel, estradiol will change your entire outlook.  If its your dr keeping you from the hormones,  you may have to remind him whos health you are looking out for.  Happy mind, happy body!  It may sound stupid, but try chemo for a few years.  I compare those to my walking dead years.  To this day when I close my eyes, I see orange:) it scared me, but after the estrogen,  orange is now my fav color.. 

Thank you all who answered my question.   The last part to mention for that question,  that others did mention, yes I had ed too;)  but for me when I was about to achieve an orgasm, I went soft.  I spent months going mad what the issue was.  But from that, I changed my way of thinking about sex and orgasms and started having orgasms more like a female.  Some say no, but they are just like mywifes.  Then from there I found all different types of orgasms.  I just think testosterone binds our thoughs and habbits to make a drive for an orgasm.  Its that freedom from not having this drive or urge.  Its now a desire to feel good, bound up with all these emotions from estrogen;).    Instead of a short burst, I can last a long time, and have one over and over, when I can catch my breath;)   I have to admit, i had one at the treasure island buffet, while eating a chocolate strawberry (plus i was buzzing off marinol for the pain!)   My wife was thinking I was having a seizure;)     for some, this is TMI,  but I bet others found the same, or hopefully I have inspired you to go find your new sensations;)

There have always been trans people, HRT is a relatively recent advancement. I think most of us would transition if we had both understanding and a relatively tolerant society. There would still be options like orchi for trans-feminine people, like hijras in India often do. Without HRT, I would still transition, but it would be expressed as a feminine third gender rather than female in the binary sense, which HRT will allow me to do.

I ticked yes. If I had felt safe as a child,   I 100% would have transitioned back then before gaining access to hormones. People often were asking if I was a boy or girl and I desperately wanted to be open about my gender identity. But in reality transitioning after starting hormones has also worked out so... As mum would say " it must have been ment to be!"

In short: my circumstances are such that I will have to endure about 3-4 more years before I can begin hrt. If the choice was up to me, I'd give myself first shot at earliest reasonable and legally possible age.

I have a question and a few comments though.

From @Rejennyrated's post it looks like docs are easier at allowing hrt if someone is already living their life as a woman. Is that so?

@Cynobyte
This is actually an interesting point about lack of T.

So here is more about me... I grew up in southeastern Europe. My first memory of being bullied goes to kindergarten. I wanted to play with girls' stuff in their corner. Girls bashed my ass away. Then boys bashed me too for ever approaching girls' stuff. And bullying over it just continued. Nobody cared. I spent my childhood pretending through ground school and high school. Horrible places and horrible years. When I separated form parents at 21 and moved to another country, that was my big chance. Not as big, as they were still quite LGBT unfriendly. At least I had shot at having privacy at home. Unfortunately, all I was doing was very uneducated. I kind of had health insurance, but those guys were really good at avoiding me. So, I stayed a woman in boundaries of my home. That is, when I got rid of my roommate first. I would confine to a friend now and then. They'd either consider me a joker, high, or would distance themselves from my life. I was not really encouraged to share and ask for thoughts.

At age 28 I read for the first time that my state is actually known as transsexualism. At age 29, almost 30, I learned that treatment of my state is not only surgery, but also hormone replacement therapy. That said, today it is about <2.5 years since I understood hrt exists. Maybe I should get one of those banners counting 'time since ...'.

So I pretty much know the feeling transsexuals had before hrt existed. I came out of a time capsule, lol. :(

Now I am in a LGBT friendly country and have my own home. From what I tried, living my life as a woman is actually a big confidence and self-esteem booster. I want it. After 3 decades of hiding, I am good at masking how I feel about my state. It doesn't make the pain any lesser though.

So wanted or not, I already began my journey without hrt and am not waiting for hrt to get as much as I can. Currently I am working on getting my facial hair removed so I can walk out without that nasty shadow on my face. Night is my friend. I conceal it much better at dark. So, excitedly waiting that half of the year when we have less than 8 hours of daylight. Currently, the sun rises before 5:30 a.m. and falls almost at 10 p.m. That sucks for me now.

No. I wouldn't.. I mean... I was literally feeling crazy before HRT and now (although I'm still crazy in many ways ;) ) I am at peace  knowing I at least won't get more effects of T... I literally would maybe die without hrt.. just from my own misery. 

The estrogen is all I've ever wanted , which has been totally confirmed by being on it for 20 months. I needed it at birth , but the cards were played this way , so be it, I'm so glad I got them now. I'm realizing I probably would of died if they weren't available.