After you came out to your spouse, when did you start dressing around the house, and what is the "etiquette" on this?? I really want to start living as a woman at home and as soon as possible and start venturing out from there... But I also don't want to make it awkward for her, ya know?I realize she may not be as accepting... Also feel very self conscious about my voice, which I imagine is pretty normal.
Coming out to her on Friday the 27th, so nervous!!
I think this varies from relationship to relationship. I took it slow and in stages. I had been wearing men's bikinis (some extremely small) in our pool for many years, so one of the first things I did was switch over to women's bikinis, since I came out to her at the beginning of the swim season. I added shorts and tank tops over the bikinis for my watering routine in the garden, and switched over to women's underwear when it was not a swim day. Somewhere along the way I started wearing bras, and when the weather cooled I added leggings and skinny jeans, and women's t-shirts and sweatshirts.
I also bought running shorts and sports bras to wear for workouts on the treadmill in our back room.
When I started wearing wigs and putting nail polish on my toes, I let my wife know about it.
Every time I took a step further, I talked to my wife about it, and I took things gradually to let her get used to the changes.
I've been out on short trips (gas and fast food) partially dressed (leggings and oversize men's t-shirt) but have yet to do the full Monty outside the house.
YMMV, but I suggest taking things slow and gradual.
Your mileage may vary..
this is my story.. so far..
Married 29 years..
Came out in March..
First week.. took all blame.. did not defend myself
things were not well.
After first week...Started to defend and stand up for my self..
made it clear that this was going to happen. whether together at home or I'm homeless on the street..
At this point.. things where much better.. but wife in strong denial.. did not want to see anything..
For the next 3 months.. every week I would add something new to my new life..
I did not relent.. Made sure we where talking every day.. gave her time to adjust.
did not force things,But was persistent..
After 3 months.. Changed name..updated paperwork.. Came out at work..living fill time..
Things are progressing well at home.. not perfect .. its still work in process.. but things look good..
What would i recommend??
Give her time and understanding.. You have had a long time to come to turns.. she is just starting out..
She will be scared.. The more positive and confident you are.. the easier it is.. lead by example
keep talking.. and just as important.. listen to her
be firm in you course.. enjoy and remember the the good parts.. don't dwell on the bad.
I went from the lowest part of my life to 8 months later..one of the best...
We Still have a long road figuring out the details of who am and how We will fit in the world.. but no regrets..
good luck..
No hard and fast rules, the best advice that I can give you is keep your communication open and be receptive to each other's feelings, somethings you are going to do is going to hurt your spouse and some of her reactions are going to hurt you. The main thing is that you can work through these thing together.
No one wants to hurt a loved one, but if you're not intentionally hurt them then you should be able to talk your way through it together.
As has been said all ready, each relationship is different. Here is the coles notes version of mine.
20 years ago: came out as crossdresser, "you can dress but I dont ever wanna see you"
15 years ago: came out as trans girl wanting to transition " I will try to be here for you in your journey". She Couldnot take it , packed up left.
13 Years ago, My fear and unwillingness to continue transition, got to me We reconciled and she returned and I put every thing in a closet, just wore undies. That continued for quit a while
"dont let me see you in the Im not washing them."
2 years ago: depression returning start dressing with out her knowing, in mean time she sees therapist and says to me "the girl goes or I go."
1 year ago: I see gender therapist start hrt in 5 months, on hormones for 3 months without her knowledge she finds gel goes balistic.
1 day ago, She will shop for clothes with me, can wear any thing any time just not breast forms.
that I believe will come soon.
It has not been easy to get this far,alot of tears alot of anger and every other emotion under the sun. Some my think im an ass for doing every thing behind her back but I was tired of all the crap that I went through with her denial. I wish I did not have to put her through this but it is the only way I can live my life with some substance and happiness. Hope this helps .
I just came out to my wife last week. She was super supportive and initially said she would stay with me through the transition then leave but has now decided that we are going to try to stay together. We decided that I would begin wearing women's underwear immediately since I already had some hidden away and it was easy to conceal (I haven't fully come out in public yet, but that will be soon). She helped me shave my legs (which I can get away with because I never wear shorts). She says that we will slowly begin updating my wardrobe and next summer when we get some finances squared away we will do a big shopping trip for both of us. She was immediately ok with me wearing whatever made me comfortable. There are no hard and fast rules, what I did was just start the conversation with "I want to start doing ... Around the house but don't want you to feel uncomfortable,what do you think?" You'll honestly just have to feel your away around the subject after coming out.
Hi I am now living full time as a Woman My Wife is fine about my outer clothing but is still very uncomfortable about seeing Me in My underwear .We came to agreement that I dress and change in the spare room once I am dressed she is fine .I always wear PJs to bed and I have one set with a quite long Top that I have been able to get away with wearing without the pants like a nightdress .So Once I have got her used to this I may ask her If she objects to Me wearing Nighties .I have found that letting Her set the pace leads to the best results. Like in picking out clothes she used to only want Me to wear tops and blouses that could pass as Mens shirts and T-Shirts but recently she has been buying me realy beautiful Blouses and tops that are positively Feminine and even sexy She used to insist I always Do my blouses up almost to the neck but now I am allowed to show a little cleavage . So giving them time and going at their pace in the long term seems to get the best results without causing any upsets
Quote from: kelseygal on November 11, 2015, 09:59:36 PM
After you came out to your spouse, when did you start dressing around the house, and what is the "etiquette" on this?? I really want to start living as a woman at home and as soon as possible and start venturing out from there... But I also don't want to make it awkward for her, ya know?I realize she may not be as accepting... Also feel very self conscious about my voice, which I imagine is pretty normal.
Coming out to her on Friday the 27th, so nervous!!
If she has no idea of this side of you, you have a lot to go through before you start dressing around the house. If you don't have a gender therapist, considering going to one and at some point bring her along. Her reaction may not be what you idealize. It can be a rocky road. I have been married for almost 21 years. My wife knew about this before we married and we went to a gender therapist then. At the time, I was more or less a cross dresser. This year I had the courage to admit I am more than that and want to live FT as a woman. It's been tough.
I think the answer tends to be less a specific timeframe and more "when your wife is able to accept it without too much trauma." My wife is on a bunch of SOs groups, and one important lesson she always mentions is that it's important for a trans person to be considerate of their spouse's feelings and give them time to adapt.
(With that said, the answer for clothes was "immediately" for me, because it didn't bother my wife at all. She didn't care what I wore... but she cared what I *did.* When I pierced my ears, she cried for days.)
Quote from: brie33 on November 12, 2015, 12:45:39 AM
Some may think I'm an ass for doing every thing behind her back but I was tired of all the crap that I went through with her denial. I wish I did not have to put her through this but it is the only way I can live my life with some substance and happiness. Hope this helps .
I think the old saying about walking a thousand miles in a person's shoes before you can judge them applies here.
My story is similar. My wife has known almost since we were married 28 years ago but I've kept things secret at times. We've talked a lot about it but it basically comes down to the fact she doesn't want a feminine husband. I have never dressed around the house with her around. She has seen me once, years ago and was not the least bit happy about it. She does know I dress sometimes. As I've progressed with shaving my body and starting dutasteride and then recently spiro, she has become more and more distant. If I proceed, I'm probably headed for a divorce.
It would be nice to have honest chats everyday about this but when you have a partner that really doesn't want anything to do with this, it's pretty difficult.
Quote from: Jenna Marie on November 12, 2015, 06:53:53 AM
My wife is on a bunch of SOs groups, and one important lesson she always mentions is that it's important for a trans person to be considerate of their spouse's feelings and give them time to adapt.
My wife is also on SOs groups and because of that she's got it in her mind exactly how this is going to play out. I don't even know how this is going to play out. It also seems to me that these groups have encouraged her to be very defiant and intolerant.
As has been said before Kelseygal YMMV.
Take care,
Paige :)
Paige : Wow, it sounds like your wife has found some VERY different groups, or is taking their advice very differently. I'm sorry that things aren't going well for you two.
My wife went into a flat spin after I told her then she thought it was a phase. She even went and saw my therapist and told her she is bisexual and she can be with a woman. She was very supportive and even went clothes shopping with me and encouraged me to be myself. All of a sudden she changed her mind and is also on a SO group that is feeding her wrong info. Now she want to divorce even if I stop transitioning.
Take it slow and make sure she is fine with it and what you are doing.Keep it at her pace because this is also a transition for her.
Best of luck
I think my wife is doing internet research on all of this (I came out 2 weeks ago to her.) For those of you who commented that their wife did a 180 or had negative reaction after SO groups, can you name the groups? I want to make sure that I'm aware of "information" she's getting.
I originally suggested My Husband Betty's site. Does anyone have suggestions for different/better sites for spouses?
Many thanks, I guess maybe I need to knock my expectations down a bit. I honestly have no idea what her reaction will be, but I imagine either really supportive or insta-divorce. She has said things that make me think both of those scenarios. Not sure if she knows something's up, was trying to be funny or just out of left field, but she actually said the other night she would love me forever even if I chopped off my willy...
I had worn a lot of unisex, more femme-like guy clothes, and women's jeans. After i came out as definitely transgender, i started to femme out a bit more but not drastically. I tossed the rest of my male clothes (except for a few sentimental things like my HS letter jacket) late last year.
I did not want to make the change drastic to my wife or kids, so i simply added shirts and tops, booties, sandals and light makeup. For me, that was enough to present the real me, fit my style and make it a gentle change for my family. I wear jeans almost every day, at home and in the office. My more feminine wear like skirts and pumps and the like i leave for when i travel or when i go out.
Lately as my hair is getting long, they are starting to see me in barrettes, hair combs and headbands. That is sort of a big change and i do get some "looks" for that.
Quote from: RobynD on November 12, 2015, 10:58:16 AM
I had worn a lot of unisex, more femme-like guy clothes, and women's jeans. After i came out as definitely transgender, i started to femme out a bit more but not drastically. I tossed the rest of my male clothes (except for a few sentimental things like my HS letter jacket) late last year.
I did not want to make the change drastic to my wife or kids, so i simply added shirts and tops, booties, sandals and light makeup. For me, that was enough to present the real me, fit my style and make it a gentle change for my family. I wear jeans almost every day, at home and in the office. My more feminine wear like skirts and pumps and the like i leave for when i travel or when i go out.
Lately as my hair is getting long, they are starting to see me in barrettes, hair combs and headbands. That is sort of a big change and i do get some "looks" for that.
Interesting, that is a nice progression. I too wear skinny jeans, started before they were even made in 'men's' cut, and used to buy womens skinny jeans! Glad you are getting some support at home, can't imagine the kid aspect...
I fully came out too my wife 16 yrs ago. She had me fully dressed the next day,that same day we went out in public,since then I dress every once in a while so not too overwhelm my wife,for she married a man,so I try to give her some guy time.
Quote from: kelseygal on November 12, 2015, 12:13:11 PM
Interesting, that is a nice progression. I too wear skinny jeans, started before they were even made in 'men's' cut, and used to buy womens skinny jeans! Glad you are getting some support at home, can't imagine the kid aspect...
Thanks. Oh and i forgot nail polish. I have polished my nails for many many years, but was somewhat subtle about it. I am a lot less subtle now they are longer and run the gamut of colors. That has also been an adjustment for them.
BTW, good luck on the 27th. Throwing positive thoughts your way.
pj : Well, my wife is on the MHB site and mailing list, and says both are good. They tend towards somewhat older members who can be a bit ... traditional about gender roles, but there are some good examples of successful long-term relationships. (MHB's site is not very active these days, but the archives might still be helpful.)
My wife also likes to point out that the latest big study on trans peole showed about half of all relationships survive, which is about as good odds as anyone else marrying in the US.
There are plenty of reasons for people to separate or divorce that have nothing to do with our being transgender. About half of all marriages go that way in the USA as Jenna notes. That said, the challenges of having a trans spouse can be significant. My wife and I will celebrate our 41st wedding anniversary this month. We have had a dynamic life together. She knew about my cross dressing, queer orientation and more early on. I did not, however, fully accept my trans identity until a few years ago and then quickly started transition with her complete support. She had a long time to adjust to my androgynous appearance and behavior before that happened.
Transition is huge. We started with the social changes first and she was actually relieved and happy to call me her wife. It helps that we are both bi, pan or heck just sexual. It is the individual person that counts and with a spouse we do not go through transition (good or bad) totally alone. My family is definitely taking a wild ride as my journey progresses.
SO support groups vary with their membership and the first group we met was mostly focused on the grief and loss adjustments our SO will likely experience to one degree or another. I am simply not the same person I was 4 years ago and that entails many adjustments to adapt to or for some to resist.
It would be nice to have a crystal ball or a lifetime sense of loving security but save that for the Disney channel. Relationships that are significant require commensurate effort to maintain and even grow our love, communication, respect, trust and care for one another. The future is yet a dream but I still want the companionship of this special woman and we have a lifetime of experience to build on. I work on and expect to be friends forever.
I hope people will also see divorce as one of many reasonable, if painful, adjustments to our truth that need not mean failure. Loving someone deeply means we also want the best for them even if that is not being with us.
Ugh. I tried to respond to this and realized that I was writing my life story again. Then I read that story, and distilled a punchline:
Whenever you start, it'll be too early and too late. If I had waited until my wife started seeing a gender-aware therapist, I'd have a lot less scarring. But those scars are healing. And it was rather impossible for me to wait for that, as we didn't know that we should both be in therapy until long after I'd tried "cross"-dressing.
Quote from: kelseygal on November 11, 2015, 09:59:36 PM
After you came out to your spouse, when did you start dressing around the house, and what is the "etiquette" on this?? I really want to start living as a woman at home and as soon as possible and start venturing out from there... But I also don't want to make it awkward for her, ya know?I realize she may not be as accepting... Also feel very self conscious about my voice, which I imagine is pretty normal.
Coming out to her on Friday the 27th, so nervous!!
What works for me is to be honest. When i came out to her, i spoke to her at night and we went shopping for clothes the following day. But she knew i was struggling with it for at least a year. She went away on a trip and i had bought a wig and some clothes while she was gone. I burned them before she returned but the guilt was so big i told her what i did, i told her everything.
I only move forward when she is comfy and take a step back if necessary in order to avoid overwhelming her with the changes.
Like, our intimate moments at first were male and female. Shed ask me to put on man perfume and clear my nail polish etc, i thought it was perfectly acceptable and decided to comply, we adjusted little by little. Now we snuggle and kiss and other stuff in bed in full girly mode and she bought me a beautiful girly pj as a gift for our girly netflix and chills (where we actually netflix and chill on the couch lol)
Id tell her how you feel about things first. Depending on how she takes it id tell her you want to explore by means of dressing up etc.
Re voice: forget about it. Either use whichever voice you feel most comfy with (masculine or fem) OR practise with her in the car if shes in the mood or anywhere. Remember its easier for her if she is part of the changes.
Best of luck x
Clara
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Bottom line... Don't present while your wife is still in shock, still digesting, or otherwise still sorting out runaway thoughts and emotions that come as a result of dropping the T-Bomb. A common scenario goes like this:
1) I told my ____ the absolute deepest darkest thing possible and the Earth did not open up to swallow me, no lightning strikes, no meteor hits.
2) ALRIGHT! I Lived!
3) Full speed ahead since ____ did not bolt for the door
Usually resulting in the SO going into OMG mode. Too much to process too fast.
The timeline can vary from minutes to weeks. It depends so much on the person and how it is all handled, before, during, and after.
My wife always knew I had gender issues. It took many years before she would stay around the house the occasional Sundays I needed my 'escapes'. She understandably didn't want to 'encourage" or be a party to her possible demise.
I went through 2 divorces very early in life. I had several long term gay relationships then met my current wife. Married 30 years. She new I had a strong feminine side and cross dressed. She was fine with it. Had to be masculine for work, but have gradually migrated to the fem side. She had not wanted me to be full time at first, then decided she preferred me as female and she has really encouraged me to transition. I just recently retired and plan to do just that. Have been on HRT for about 12 years and have had facial hair removed. You will notice that I have made compromises. Ones that we could both live with. The big one for me is to make sure the money keeps coming in. Some on the site seem to have no problems with work, but your mileage may vary. Finances are the #1 cause of divorce. Do you have a realistic income plan in place?
So much good information gals, thank you thank you. Seriously you probably saved my behind, and for that I am very grateful. Slow and steady wins the race, FTW. My standard for success here is she gives it a chance, but preparing for the worst. The main gist of the letter was to explain, then assure her of my intentions to stay with her, work through it together, and to grow closer in the end. I did make sure my letter gives her a really graceful way to duck out if she so desires, so hopefully if that is the case there won't be too many hard feelings...
It is super scary during the period leading up to telling your spouse about something like this. I knew there was a chance I would lose my family over it which is why I delayed for so long. The marriage was something I was convinced would "cure" me so it's not like I ever thought it would come to this. However, like many who have survived childhood gender dysphoria and drowning it with whatever we can, I came to the end. It was either confront my issues or leave the planet. I only preface it this way to make you understand just how scared I was of losing my family.
So... I eventually told her (almost a year ago). She (luckily) majored in psychology in college so she was at least moderately educated in transgender topics and she (also luckily) had always been attracted to women anyway. The conversation proceeded through a lot of tears and sobs but she said we would work this out together and then see what happens.
Today? I'm about six months HRT, presenting full time, and we are already making preliminary plans for GRS and legal changes. She is excited that we get to have another wedding (we plan to get handfasted after I am legally a woman) and every change I go through is something she is genuinely happy about. She is more attracted to me now than she used to be (and I'm not even passable) and our daughter has adapted like a freakin' rock star. I love them so much and literally owe them my life at this point.
I tell you all this to show you the contrast. The level of fear I felt vs. the reality were sooooooo far removed from each other that is all seems so strange to me now.
It all depends on your spouse's education, capacity to adapt, and her personal sexuality. Be prepared for anything, though. That includes good things!
Everyone has covered just about anything I would have said here. But quickly for me, the key points are patience, love, understanding, communication and above all else honesty when discussing anything with her...hiding what you consider your worst fear may not be her worst fear. My partner and I have committed to stay together through my transition. I hope you and yours can do the same
Good luck
Sarah T
Quote from: kelseygal on November 11, 2015, 09:59:36 PM
After you came out to your spouse, when did you start dressing around the house, and what is the "etiquette" on this?? I really want to start living as a woman at home and as soon as possible and start venturing out from there... But I also don't want to make it awkward for her, ya know?I realize she may not be as accepting... Also feel very self conscious about my voice, which I imagine is pretty normal.
Coming out to her on Friday the 27th, so nervous!!
I came out 3 years ago. I present outside the house only. My wife said just last night as I came home that she hates Olivia. She doesn't want me/her here. Olivia is a bitch and liar.
So as I am unemployed and on a constant threat of homelessness I comply.
Not being able to be me in my home and short periods of relief leaves me a depressed emotional wreck.
Thanks Abysha, you are lucky your wife is the way she is... My wife is not well educated on psychology matters, doesn't seem to be attracted to women (though I'm not entirely sure on this) , and comes from a conservative christian upbringing. Needless to say whatever happens will be interesting.
Sarah, that is something I have read here often - whatever response we dread, is usually far above and beyond reality.
Olivia, Im so sorry to hear that you are in that position. I really wish the best for you and hope you find some employment relief soon. That is definitely tough position where you feel like you don't have a choice :( Your transition is beautiful, I've seen some posts on the before/after or another thread and it is a huge encouragement to me. Be strong girl!!! *hugs*
Kelsey, sometimes they are not atracted to women but they are atracted to you, if that makes sense. Focus all your efforts into making her feel amazing beside you, so that your apearance is secondary and your soul is all that matters.
My wife and I love each other so much, and this is because she's always been my #1 priority in life. And because aparently I cook very well, also. haha.
Big hugs, hope you both stay together <3
This really reaallly varies.
My wife and I are well on our way to splitsville. So I pretty much dress how I want. She winced when I first started wearing dresses and complained but I just really ignored her. There was no tiptoeing around it and I felt that since she absolutely did not want me to transition I might as well just go right ahead.
But if you want to stay with your spouse and she accepts to certain degrees than you have to work that out with her.
I don't see the big deal about clothing. Clothing is clothing is clothing. It's just cloth. But it's what it symbolizes that bothers them, that your soul and spirit is that of a woman.
My wife knew before we got married. The only advice I can give you is to sit down and talk to her about how you feel.
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Quote from: kelseygal on November 13, 2015, 11:11:25 AM
Thanks Abysha, you are lucky your wife is the way she is... My wife is not well educated on psychology matters, doesn't seem to be attracted to women (though I'm not entirely sure on this) , and comes from a conservative christian upbringing. Needless to say whatever happens will be interesting.
Sarah, that is something I have read here often - whatever response we dread, is usually far above and beyond reality.
Olivia, Im so sorry to hear that you are in that position. I really wish the best for you and hope you find some employment relief soon. That is definitely tough position where you feel like you don't have a choice :( Your transition is beautiful, I've seen some posts on the before/after or another thread and it is a huge encouragement to me. Be strong girl!!! *hugs*
Thank you.
I am trying to stay positive. I think I decided to move in with a friend in another state today. She offered me a safe place.
I just worry being in a similar situation down the road.
I have been crying all day. My wife is trying to make up again. I couldn't even talk this morning I am a real crying sobbing wreck.
I think she feels guilty now.
She can't take back what she said I feel totally worthless.
I wish I didn't agree with her in my heart. Everything they said to me as a kid is true. People will hate me I don't have a chance. There is no hope.
Dear Oliviah You are not Totally worthless and there is always Hope .The fact that Your wife is now trying to Make up again shows that she has thought about what she said and realised that she was only reacting to her fears of losing You .You may find that now she has seen that attacking Olivia has driven You further apart she may start to learn to accept You more no situation is totally hopeless .Talk to Her ask her her fears explain your needs and see if You can find a compromise that will work for You both .That is what I did with my wife and so far things are working out very well.Good luck and stay positive
Hugs Anita
QuoteShe is more attracted to me now than she used to be (and I'm not even passable)
Such a nice contrast to my situation of "I can't stand to even look at you." I dream of acceptance. I am so happy for all of you that have found a way through to acceptance with your wives.
It took a little time for me, but not too long. She's known since July. I've dressed on occasion in front of her, but it wasn't until very recently, like the last week, that I started doing it all the time. The hardest part is that my daughter is getting mad at me for stealing her mother's clothing. I keep trying to tell her it was her mother stealing mine, but she's worn it so much, I can't convince her!
As an update, things went well, better than I could have ever expected. The woman I married is the most classy, compassionate, kind and understanding person I have ever come across. Maybe I'll post more details in the future, but for now I am going to take some private time and focus in on our relationship - discovering together what the next steps are. Thank you all again for your stories, suggestions, encouragement, and everything else. I truly believe you made an incredible impact on how well (so far) everything has unfolded. *hugs all around*
K
FANTASTIC!
Quote from: kelseygal on November 21, 2015, 02:04:41 PM
As an update, things went well, better than I could have ever expected. The woman I married is the most classy, compassionate, kind and understanding person I have ever come across. Maybe I'll post more details in the future, but for now I am going to take some private time and focus in on our relationship - discovering together what the next steps are. Thank you all again for your stories, suggestions, encouragement, and everything else. I truly believe you made an incredible impact on how well (so far) everything has unfolded. *hugs all around*
K
Congrats Kelsey :)
Quote from: kelseygal on November 21, 2015, 02:04:41 PM
As an update, things went well, better than I could have ever expected. The woman I married is the most classy, compassionate, kind and understanding person I have ever come across. Maybe I'll post more details in the future, but for now I am going to take some private time and focus in on our relationship - discovering together what the next steps are. Thank you all again for your stories, suggestions, encouragement, and everything else. I truly believe you made an incredible impact on how well (so far) everything has unfolded. *hugs all around*
K
Woohoo! I'm so happy about this.
My wife was the first person in a long line of people who surprised me with a reaction I didn't expect. You will find that some of the people you know are truly rotten and yet others will react in unexpectedly supportive ways.
That's is great news...I am so happy this is working out for you! :) :)