Well,
I have a BF that likes my voice... everyone says it fine and they like it...
I do get sired on the phone a lot... sucks.
But in person I am fine...
So what to do..
If I knew I would get a great result I would do it in a heartbeat... but its scary and I talked to people that talk to a lot of girls and they say that I should not do that to myself.
So, I am a wait and see person now.... when I feel they have perfected the procedure I will do it.. for sure... and I am sad I am going to wait..
Ugh
Keri
Being sirred on the phone is a big no no for me, but that's just me. Phone is a big barometre for whether your voice passes or not. When your voice is not 100 per cent passable, some people start looking for other clues for transness. Only this is a big enough reason to have vfs(in my view).
Keri, have you already tried voice training? It sounds like you have a fairly acceptable voice already, so maybe a little tune-up is all you need. It's a lot cheaper, at any rate. I am doing it through a local university. George Washington University has a transgender speech therapy class that's $50 a session. The initial evaluation was $175. They teach breathing, pitch control, and other techniques. There might be something similar where you live.
With kindness,
Terri
I'm a bit selfish and think it's your opinion that matters and not others, at least in a matter like this. That said, the surgery is not without risks. I don't think anyone is going to 'perfect' it any time soon until we get to the point where they are essentially growing you an entire voice box, etc. The glottoplasty has been done on hundreds of people...
Dejin,
Just I just wanted to point out that Dr Kim does not perform glottoplasty. His technique is called vocal folds shortening and advancement of anterior commissure, which is pretty different.
Quote from: Ritana on July 07, 2016, 02:25:14 AM
Dejin,
Just I just wanted to point out that Dr Kim does not perform glottoplasty. His technique is called vocal folds shortening and advancement of anterior commissure, which is pretty different.
His is still glottoplasty, just with some refinements.
I suppose someone could refine it even further, but I don't think we'll see any major developments in this area for quite some time. Even Dr. Thomas (who doesn't do a glottoplasty variant) is sort of reconstructing the voice box, so until we get to the stage where you get a totally 'new' one, it should be small improvements I think.
"glottoplasty" just meas reshaping the glottis - whichi s the vocal folds, so Dr Kim does that, but it is not a "Wendler glottoplasty"..
Keri - you have to think selfish here, I believe. What is it that YOU want. Honestly, with every trans surgery, there will be plenty of friends and family who advise against it. This is for many reasons - mainly though they are scared for you in case it goes wrong or something is not as you expected it in the end. The other main reason is a selfish one on their sied, they believe that you would change too much and they will miss something. A friend of mine still says she loved my old voice because it was so deep and husky and in her ears erotic. But I am not doing this to please her or others but to feel better about myself. I also had this issue about the phone, but much less in person. However occasionally I was asked about my voice, or even if I was trans because of the voice. This really bugged me a lot. A big reason also was that I just hated my own voice. I did not like to speak because I hear my voice and I did not like it. This is a lot better now, at least on the good voice days, I still have bad voice days though.
All my friends als say that I never should get FFS - I am actually not decided on that yet but if I do it, it will be because I feel I want it and not because my friends say I need or don't need it. As I said, most people close to oneself do not like us to do surgeries, risking things, spending money changing ourselves into s bit someone else - for good freinds we are ok as we are and there is no need to change in their eyes. A common misconception probably is, that they think we do these surgeries JUST to please others, to better fit in, etc. Which is not always the case.
Waiting for better surgeries is a neverending game. Always there will be better surgeries in the future and none is perfect. Same with GRS - there ar buccal transplants right around the corner and stem cell vaginas in the near future - but one has to consider the waiting time versus just starting to live now ;)
This is your decision, and if you weigh the pros and cons and decide it's something you really want, then you should do it. Several girls have had remarkable outcomes and it has been a life-changing event for them.
However, if you want my opinion- I say wait and do some more training just to see what you can come up with. I jumped the gun, thinking the risk was negligible and I haven't been able to speak normally for almost a year. I'd do anything to go back in time and cancel if I had the chance so decide very carefully! Best of luck either way!
For me, I am in the same position as you (Keri). In person, no problems. Over the phone, the misgendering happens more often than I'd like. I know that this surgery is only one step of my voice training process. I would say that the surgery is already perfected. It's just 1) how it's performed, 2) the person's healing powers, and 3) environmental factors that are the variables. That's a lot of variables and they apply to any surgery.
In the case of 1, if the surgeon has a bad day, a stitch could end up a micromillimeter in the wrong place and that could affect the outcome.
In the case if 2, a slow healer will certainly have a longer period of wait time than a fast healer. If the person smokes, drinks, eats certain kinds of food, that may affect the outcome.
In the case of 3, if the person accidentally or conscientiously talks or utters sounds during the crucial period of silence, that could affect the outcome. It seems to me, from what I've read in this forum, the period of silence is different for everyone. Outside factors beyond a person's control could also affect the outcome. For example, somebody smokes near you and you start coughing because of it or you eat something you're allergic to.
Like others here, I would say do the surgery for yourself, not for anyone else. Everyone I know tells me my voice is fine, but I'm not comfortable with it. That's why I'm going for the surgery.
I can imagine that the surgeries can be improved in the future. This would require a new approach though and this takes a lot longer than I would want to wait for. The reason is: even with a perfect glottoplasty, it leaves Y shaped vocal folds. Those are prone to not behaving always in all situations like V shaped regular vocal folds and one has to be careful with intubations for the rest of the life. The other available surgery CTA does not have that, but it knocks out one on the two muscles controlling the pitch of the voice, reducing the pitch range and in addition it puts tension on the vocal folds even when resting.
The future may be in those reconstructive surgeries like Dr Thomas tries to develop further - making the whole larynx smaller and repositioning it. But in my opinion this is far from perfected yet, plus it leaves a visible and not small scar.
So there is of course room to improvement but one has to think if it is worth waiting 20 years or getting it done now with less perfection. 18 years ago, I chose to wait, actually and in retrospective I am glad I did and did not have voice surgery back then but 18 years later with better results. But then I would not want to wait another 15 years, given that now I am over 40 and back then I was in my mid 20ies. But also the surgery results back then were really turning me off and not they may have issue and not be always perfect but its really a lot better
That makes a lot of sense regarding V vs Y shaped vocal folds. I'm hoping that this is my very last surgery (having had rhinoplasty, breast aug, GRS already) for a while. I suppose if I had open heart surgery when I'm older the intubation thing will be an issue. (so if they shove a really wide breathing tube in me and stretch my vocal cords, will I sound deep-voiced again?)
My allergist (who has associates in the ENT office across from his) says that the vocal cord procedure that Dr. Haben and others do is "easy and highly successful." That makes me hopeful that my outcome will be good this time.
Hi Keri, it is your call and either choice is correct. In my opinion, how you feel about your voice more so than what close people say how you sound should guide you.
Quote from: GeekGirl on July 08, 2016, 03:21:56 PM
I suppose if I had open heart surgery when I'm older the intubation thing will be an issue. (so if they shove a really wide breathing tube in me and stretch my vocal cords, will I sound deep-voiced again?)
Yeson recommend always using a smaller (size 6) intubator after the surgery. As long as you can commuinicate this whenever you have surgery, and they use a camera to intubate you, it should be fine. If they use a larger intubator or "shove it in" without taking care, they may actually injure the suture or open it again, causing the voice to deepen or be damaged. This a drawback for sure. This is why I am now carfully choosing anaesthesists when I think about surgery and also why I made a little emergency card in case I need a surgery after an accident and am unconscious.
Hi Keri-
I also have the kind of voice that gets me sir's on the phone but in person I seem to have no issues. I can't afford that surgery but even if I could afford it the risks seem a bit too high to me. So I just live with it and try to avoid using the phone.
Get the surgery because you want to do it - research the risks - don't let others make the decision for you.
Anja,
You are always helpful in your posts.
Can I be cheeky and ask if you could email me a sample of that emergency card you created?
Thanks in.advance
Ritana
I uploaded the card here: https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,192899.msg1744634.html#msg1744634
Actually it should say 5.5 size and not 6 size, according to Yeson, but I used 6 size because it seems to be working as well and is still better than the larger sizes. The card certainly can be a bit fine tuned - I think I did misspell at some point. I orderd it on a credit card sized plastic card (needs to be resized to about 95% to really fit) für about 8 EU, this makes it durable and also looks more official and like something to be taken seriously.
Thanks so much for all the advise. I think I just want to least invasive surgery.. I don't need much pitch to be ok... Even if I only get 45 HZ I would be pleased..
So I want the laser surgery only if I can.
I am looking in Thailand right now because i love it there..
Haben seems first on my list right now in NY.
I was with my bf all week doing things and no one ever gives me a second thought with my voice.. .. I know I pass in person but want less effort.. I just don't want to think about it
Keri
If you are going for the laser vocal fold tightening, make sure you talk to some people who did this. Writing to them about how it was for them, also in the long run after a year or so, and if possile speak to someone on Skype, Phone or in real life who has done this, so you get to know what awaits you. In any case, it would be great if you share your experiences later here, if you opt for doing this, since I believe little has been written about the laser-only surgery yet. Its the third option and most here had either glottoplasty or CTA or both - no one has written about the laser-only and no one so far about doing a complete reconstruction with Dr Thomas.
Quote from: Keri - formerly known as Dodie on July 10, 2016, 12:42:17 PM
Thanks so much for all the advise. I think I just want to least invasive surgery.. I don't need much pitch to be ok... Even if I only get 45 HZ I would be pleased..
So I want the laser surgery only if I can.
I am looking in Thailand right now because i love it there..
Haben seems first on my list right now in NY.
I was with my bf all week doing things and no one ever gives me a second thought with my voice.. .. I know I pass in person but want less effort.. I just don't want to think about it
Keri
Hey Keri,
Please do let me know if you find a reliable surgeon that does voice change surgery in Thailand. I am also looking for one in Thailand and planning to do it within this year.
I pass almost always but My voice is my achilles heel I should say.... i always wanted to fix it but like what everyone says it was a scary unreliable surgery years ago.... My TS lawyer who helped me with all my transition legal stuff before stopped me from doing the laser only voice feminization.... She did it and her voice is so weak and sounds like an old lady even years after... It scared me but the newer vfs looks tempting/ promising....
I nevr considered it as an option when I transitioned, only now in the past 3 years it seems the risks are getting lowwr, if one cjooses the best surgeons.