Hello to all of you.... This is my first post, but I have read many before joining your forum.. So many interesting points of view.
I have have been researching the cost of SRS, which seems to vary so much.. I live in Australia where the cost of SRS is out of my price range, around $37,000Aus, the quote I received today. To me thats a total rip off price and shame on that surgeon. That is huge money for around 6 hours of surgery. It seems I need to be rich to be a transgender wanting SRS in Australia.. Besides that, the required skills are very limited in Australia where mistakes are made, and I am assuming this is the case with other countries around the world.
This is why many transgender members here seem to look to Thailand for their SRS needs... But even the cost of SRS in Thailand seems to be getting out of hand.. Thai surgeons seem to be using the transgender community as a production line in carrying out one surgery after another as quickly as they can, with a river of gold going to their greedy pockets... I have read so many reviews some good and some bad. It has to be remembered that many of the surgeons in Thailand are not trained surgeons, they are just G.P.'s or M.D.'s The letters FRACS after a Doctor's name indicate they are a fully trained and qualified Surgeon not purely a G.P. or M.D.
I have listed some pricing from Thailand. We, the transgender community have more power over the pricing than you might think. One voice will always remain silent but many will get us heard. Here are the most recent pricing obtained this month, July 2016. I will just make mention of the main top doctor.. If I have made any mistakes please correct me. Some of these pricing including accomodation and food but it has to be made clear that accomodation and particularly food in Thailand are cheap.. I guess some consideration in this can be taking into consideration when reading the pricing here, you will need to work out the total price yourself according to your needs. I must also point out that I am only making mention of the SRS pricing and NOT FFS.. These are totally different processes and need to be kept separate since I personally might trust one doctor to do my SRS but in no way would trust them to do my FFS.
Dr. Kamol Pansritum at the Komol Hospital. He is an M.D. Price 286,000
I think its a good option and affordable.
Dr. Boonchai Thanyalakpark M.D. at the Yankee Hospital. Price 295,000
I like the fact that the SRS is carried out at a main Bangkok Hospital with many highly skills doctors but, only M.D's
Dr. Chettawut MD is "board-certified". I will be contacting the Thailand Medical Board on this statement. Being Board citified does carry a lot of weight but is it current?? He charges 340,000 which is beginning to get high.. To be honest I really hate it when surgeons use Stock Photos of naturally beautiful women on their web sites. For me, I just get too many warning bells ringing in my ears when I read about Dr. Chettawut..
Dr. Sanguan at the PPSI in Phuket. He charges 400,000, beginning to get very high and he is still only an M.D... I am still researching this mob.
Dr Suporn M.D. Are you sitting down??? 565,000 as of today, and it seems to be going up around 10,000 to 15,000 each year. He mentions price rises. OK, girls.. I would avoid this doctor totally.. Unless you are rich, or have rocks in your head. This doctor is just getting far too greedy... There is simply no justification for his pricing. Higher pricing does not mean better surgery. I have read on many forums and reviews that he makes just as many mistakes with poor quality surgery as other surgeons who charge a lot less.. You will just be part of his production line with some Thai lady at the desk counting your money. He is supposed to offer a Life Time guarantee. Well, if I had a Life Time guarantee offered to me in Australia it would mean something but with this man.. Ya sure!!
Lastly in this current list.. The PAI. Dr. Preecha Tiewtranon has a wealth of knowledge in SRS but he does not do it anymore. As I understand Dr.Sutin Khobunsongserm, MD carries out the SRS, but there seems to be a very knowledgeable team behind him. To me Dr. Preecha is not a sleazy man. He looks like a very genuine knowledgeable surgeon without all the fancy web site and Stock Photo media. I have just received a PDF showing the yuck process and after photos, far too much information, but its not fake its real.. I like the fact they are in Bangkok. Just one small snag. I cannot seem to get them to send me a price list. They talk about the extra charges on their web site but I cannot find their pricing.. If their pricing falls into the 320,000 range, I will choose this team for my SRS. I would love to hear from others who have used the PAI..
Tess
Hey again.. That is funny.. No sooner I posted this thread, I received the pricing from the PAI.. WONDERFUL!!.. $8600 USD which is 301,000. Why pay 565,000.. or even 400,000.. To me the PAI is the best option. I am so happy there pricing is within my budget. It includes 5 days in a private hospital.
Tess
Hi Tess, welcome to Susan's. I have no clue, but I'm sure others maybe able to. I have moved your post to the GRS section where others may know. I look forward to seeing you around the forums. Good luck and Hugs
Mariah
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I believe SRS in Australia is more like A$13-17k with Dr Any Ives in Melbourne, after medicare and insurance discounts. Given the reviews I've read he's the only one worth considering here.
SRS with Andrew Ives in Melbourne Australia
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,196033.0.html
SRS in Thailand ranges from US$2000 to Dr Suporn at the top, and the quality is from extremely bad to world class. Just bear in mind that if something goes wrong in Thailand you've got no chance of doing anything about it. Not much chance in Australia either, but its much worse there. I'd not go to any surgeon I couldn't find decent independent reviews of. There's plenty of information available in Dr Suporn, and Chettawut, and not nearly so much on the others. There's reports of problems with all surgeons, but some are much better/worse than others.
This is by far the best post I've seen on PAI. She did an incredible amount of research and could have gone anywhere, but chose PAI.
My wonderful surgeries SRS, BA and FFS at PAI Bangkok
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,204651.0.html
This is interesting too
Wonderful transition without any RLE
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php?topic=209027.5
Dr Suporn (who I like)
https://www.the-ress.net/files/SRS-With-Dr-Suporn-2015.pdf
Quote from: Tess2016 on July 20, 2016, 05:31:20 AM
Hey again.. That is funny.. No sooner I posted this thread, I received the pricing from the PAI.. WONDERFUL!!.. $8600 USD which is 301,000. Why pay 565,000.. or even 400,000.. To me the PAI is the best option. I am so happy there pricing is within my budget. It includes 5 days in a private hospital.
Tess
Within a much better graded hospital I might add
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Thank you so much AnonyMs for those links. Her journey is wonderful and I am so glad it all worked out for her. It seems the PAI is looking more likely to be my choice. They do everything including voice. After reading more into their website and doctors, I read that they have extra training and become "board-certified".. That is excellent..
Did you know that with Dr Suporn, you do not even have to be on hormones. They say that the WPATH are only a guild and therefor do not hold to it. Basically, if you have the money and walk in with hairy knuckles and a beard, they will do the SRS.. I guess there will be ladies who would go to him but for me I would not even consider him.. or recommend him.
Tess
He's right, WPATH is a non-binding protocol. There are other standards of care out there as well that are based more on the patients wishes than the doctors wishes.
"Basically, if you have the money and walk in with hairy knuckles and a beard, they will do the SRS"
Gonna be blunt...that's none of your business, and it's pretty rude. Beauty standards have no place in the decision to transition.
Welcome to the site. I hope you find the information you're looking for, and I hope you learn something about acceptance while you're here, too.
Hugs, Devlyn
Quote from: Tess2016 on July 21, 2016, 06:25:32 AMDid you know that with Dr Suporn, you do not even have to be on hormones. They say that the WPATH are only a guild and therefor do not hold to it. Basically, if you have the money and walk in with hairy knuckles and a beard, they will do the SRS.. I guess there will be ladies who would go to him but for me I would not even consider him.. or recommend him.
Tess
That's not true. They require a letter from your psychiatrist and another from a local (Thailand) psychiatrist.
I have got only one thing to recommend. Choose based on results (in relation to your aesthetic preferences) and level of care you are going to recieve. Price difference should be the last thing that matters.
Quote from: Tess2016 on July 21, 2016, 06:25:32 AM
I guess there will be ladies who would go to him but for me I would not even consider him.. or recommend him.
There are already more than 200 ladies patiently waiting in line for their surgery (booked until 2018). They dont need more recommendations. Someone will appreciate that you are not taking their date :)
As for dr. Burin and dr. Sutin, they are both good surgeons, you will be in good hands if you choose PAI. As you live in Australia, you are relatively near Thailand... maybe you should consider making a trip there, arrange consultations with all surgeons you are interested with.. so you get first hand information and get to see plenty photos of their results. And have some vacation.
Quote from: mmmmm on July 21, 2016, 10:34:06 AM
I have got only one thing to recommend. Choose based on results (in relation to your aesthetic preferences) and level of care you are going to recieve. Price difference should be the last thing that matters.
This most definitely. Hugs
Mariah
Quote from: Tess2016 on July 21, 2016, 06:25:32 AM
Did you know that with Dr Suporn, you do not even have to be on hormones. They say that the WPATH are only a guild and therefor do not hold to it. Basically, if you have the money and walk in with hairy knuckles and a beard, they will do the SRS.. I guess there will be ladies who would go to him but for me I would not even consider him.. or recommend him.
Well, I'd shave my beard off before going, I'd not like to stand out like that. I've no intention of socially transitioning if I can help it, but that doesn't mean I don't want SRS. I just don't want to risk all the things I value in my life over social transition. I think it reflects well on any surgeon who's prepared to help people in need, and he would be far from the only one if he does.
I'm not aware of anyone who's gone to Suporn without HRT, but some transwomen have medial problems preventing them taking HRT (like estrogen sensitive cancer), and good for him if he helps them regardless of what anyone else says. I do think you misjudge Suporn as everything I've heard about him indicates he cares far more about his work than he does about the money.
WPATH has no legal standing anywhere that I know. There's is however a law in Thailand requiring psych letters before SRS, and as far as I know its only country with such a law. Personally I dislike WPATH, but at least its better than what went before. Plenty of doctors ignore it, for better and worse.
Quote from: mmmmm on July 21, 2016, 10:34:06 AM
There are already more than 200 ladies patiently waiting in line for their surgery (booked until 2018). They dont need more recommendations. Someone will appreciate that you are not taking their date :)
As for dr. Burin and dr. Sutin, they are both good surgeons, you will be in good hands if you choose PAI. As you live in Australia, you are relatively near Thailand... maybe you should consider making a trip there, arrange consultations with all surgeons you are interested with.. so you get first hand information and get to see plenty photos of their results. And have some vacation.
Yes please, leave my dates free ;) Oh to be rich and profusely affluence in financial resources. Its evident this DR. will continue to charge higher rates while he is supported. Taking into account the CPI of Thailand and the average wage of a Thai person, he is actually charging much more than most surgeons anywhere in the world. But hey.. If he can get away with it with his loyal clients where it seems are willing to under go over priced SRS in my view, then that is there choice. I just cannot see any reason to pay an extra 264,000 bart for the same outcome. I would rather put that money towards my other feminine transformations.
Thankfully there are many other surgeons in Thailand who are much more affordable. If they all charged the same as DR. Suporn, I could never afford to have my SRS done.. and that would have been a big worry and very upsetting.. The PAI seems to have it all, including fair pricing.. I will go and check them out in January. I also understand that foreign exchange rates might well make Suporn easily affordable with their exchange rates. The AUS $ has dropped quite a bit as late..
Yes, I am booked for a trip in January.. I have read heaps about Dr.'s Burin and Sutin.. Very well recommended.. With any surgery we all need to feel confident we are choosing the the right surgeon for our needs. I have just received my DNA and chromosomes results back as well as other results. It seems I have, without any HRT treatment, an extremely high level of natural oestrogen in my blood and amazingly my hips are at a development level normally found in a 18 year old girl.. Doc said it might explain my very late puppetry .. I will be happy to become the women I should have been born to be, which all starts with HRT and SRS.. closely followed by FFS.. ;)
PS.. I have had PM. Sorry I cannot respond yet.. But I really appreciate your advice.. Hugs to you..
Tess..
Quote from: mmmmm on July 21, 2016, 10:34:06 AM
I have got only one thing to recommend. Choose based on results (in relation to your aesthetic preferences) and level of care you are going to recieve. Price difference should be the last thing that matters.
So basically you are suggesting there is no need for this price listing SRS topic. "Price difference should be the last thing that matters." It does if on a budget. Not everyone can afford Suporn's prices. Aesthetic preferences is important but not at any price.. My first preferences is acutely quality of surgery/surgeons, their skills, history and my safety..
Tess..
I'm curious which Australian Surgeon quoted 37k. I know quite a few people that had srs in Australia as well as having it in Australia myself. I agree that price shouldn't be your top priority.
That said SRS is cheaper in Australia than it is in Thailand, AnonyMs is correct its about 13k
Quote from: Serenation on July 22, 2016, 08:03:29 PM
I'm curious which Australian Surgeon quoted 37k. I know quite a few people that had srs in Australia as well as having it in Australia myself. I agree that price shouldn't be your top priority.
That said SRS is cheaper in Australia than it is in Thailand, AnonyMs is correct its about 13k
I got a similar quote when I was looking in to SRS.. It came from a Sydney surgeon - whom I later discovered I didn't really want to use.
Quote from: kelly_aus on July 22, 2016, 08:08:09 PM
I got a similar quote when I was looking in to SRS.. It came from a Sydney surgeon - whom I later discovered I didn't really want to use.
I know someone who had srs in Sydney would be odd for the price difference to be that much. So it was 37k after medicare and private health insurance?
Quote from: Serenation on July 22, 2016, 09:12:48 PM
I know someone who had srs in Sydney would be odd for the price difference to be that much. So it was 37k after medicare and private health insurance?
That was the total price, no mention of Medicare or insurance covering any of it.
Hi.. Actually is more than I said.. $41,500 in total..
I sent a request to Assoc Prof Peter Haertsch in Sydney http://www.haertsch.com.au/procedures-surgery.html
He respond with this.
Together
Surgery $37500
Anaesthetic $2000
Assistant $2000
No detailed information, nothing more than this. I feel he is so out of touch. Every response I received from Thailand I received details in what they provided. There are no details on his web site either..
Tess...
Quote from: Serenation on July 22, 2016, 08:03:29 PM
I'm curious which Australian Surgeon quoted 37k. I know quite a few people that had srs in Australia as well as having it in Australia myself. I agree that price shouldn't be your top priority.
That said SRS is cheaper in Australia than it is in Thailand, AnonyMs is correct its about 13k
Hi.. No mention about Medicare or Private Health so that would be the price full price. I do not have private health insurace anyway.. Too expensive. Not sure that SRS would even be covered since its elective. I never investigated yet if medicare covers any part of the SRS. I am currently seeing a Gender Doctor, I will ask him.. He is simply a beautiful man who really cares.. He is looking after me and coordinating with my own GP and Psychologist. I have yet to see a Psychiatrist, which I have to before SRS.. He will arrange that for me.
I will investigate other options for SRS in Australia. Clearly Prof Peter Haertsch is the brother to Suporn :D :D ;)..
Tess..
PS.. Does everyone have to do an IQ test each time I post.. Or is is only up to a certain number of posts.. I realise Spammers would be an issue...???
Quote from: kelly_aus on July 22, 2016, 10:28:05 PM
That was the total price, no mention of Medicare or insurance covering any of it.
Quote from: Tess2016 on July 22, 2016, 10:58:07 PM
Hi.. No mention about Medicare or Private Health so that would be the price full price. I do not have private health insurace anyway.. Too expensive. Not sure that SRS would even be covered since its elective. I never investigated yet if medicare covers any part of the SRS. I am currently seeing a Gender Doctor, I will ask him.. He is simply a beautiful man who really cares.. He is looking after me and coordinating with my own GP and Psychologist. I have yet to see a Psychiatrist, which I have to before SRS.. He will arrange that for me.
I will investigate other options for SRS in Australia. Clearly Prof Peter Haertsch is the brother to Suporn :D :D ;)..
Tess..
PS.. Does everyone have to do an IQ test each time I post.. Or is is only up to a certain number of posts.. I realise Spammers would be an issue...???
Hi Tess Not all of SRS is covered by medicare and private health but certainly the majority of it is. Medibank paid 13000 towards mine and I think medicare was about 9k. Andrew Ive's requires you have both. Thailand certainly is a good option if you go with the better known surgeons.
All but basic hospital cover, pays out for cosmetic surgery and surgery that benefits psychologically which is how they spin srs.
I assume the "iq test" is just for a certain amount of posts, I recall there is restrictions on private messages and avatars till a certain post threshold is met.
Spammers are a big issue on the site and we have several a week who work there way in and we need to clean up after. Once you hit the magic number, you will not have to deal with the security measures and you just post.
Wow, that is really interesting.. To be honest I never even considered Medicare.. I wonder if there is huge waiting period like most things with our health system. I really need to investigate this more... Perhaps that is why that Aus surgeon charges so much. He is out to take advantage of Medicare. It just seems to be such an outrageous amount of money for 6 hours of work. That is the price of a decent car.. or a big lump towards a home.. Thats more than I earn in a year before tax. Its all very unfair. The university that guy went to was paid for by minions like me..
Thank you for this information. I have read that the skills of Aus surgeons is no where as good in Thailand. Its all getting to be a bit of a worry.. My anxiety levels are climbing. But I have time.. To be honest, I would have had it years ago but I was never in the position to do it.. Now I am and to be honest I think its a good time due to the many changes with government support mechanisms.
Before I become a primary school teacher I was in the Royal Australian Air Force where at that time it was an offence to be Gay, Lesbian and I assume Transgender. But now its fine.. Just typical.. Story of my life to be late or too early..
Glad when the IQ test is gone. I keep failing it. :D :D :D :D
Tess..
Quote from: Serenation on July 22, 2016, 11:11:12 PM
Hi Tess Not all of SRS is covered by medicare and private health but certainly the majority of it is. Medibank paid 13000 towards mine and I think medicare was about 9k. Andrew Ive's requires you have both. Thailand certainly is a good option if you go with the better known surgeons.
All but basic hospital cover, pays out for cosmetic surgery and surgery that benefits psychologically which is how they spin srs.
I assume the "iq test" is just for a certain amount of posts, I recall there is restrictions on private messages and avatars till a certain post threshold is met.
Hey.. The price in Aus $ for the PAI is $11,520 and that includes 5 days in a private hostile suite but not sure if they pay for the 10 extra days in a hotel.. I think they do. They pick up from the airport. Since they have quoted in US $, its my hope that the Aus $ to US goes up, making my surgery cheaper.. Getting it for 10K would be awesome..
If I joined Medibank now, I would qualify to claim when the time comes. But I still think even after rebates, it might be more expensive in Aus and I worry about the skills Aus surgeons have. Without a doubt, Thailand surgeons have the skills and Dr. Burin Wangjiraniran MD. has FRCS to his name. I really like that. I have asked if its possible for Dr. Preecha to be at my surgery.. The PAI is the only mob that has provided post opp images. Bit yuck but I now know what to expect for the first 8 months.. After that it all begins to look normal..
Now for my IQ test.. ??? ::)
Test...
Quote from: Tess2016 on July 23, 2016, 12:53:54 AM
Wow, that is really interesting.. To be honest I never even considered Medicare.. I wonder if there is huge waiting period like most things with our health system. I really need to investigate this more... Perhaps that is why that Aus surgeon charges so much. He is out to take advantage of Medicare. It just seems to be such an outrageous amount of money for 6 hours of work. That is the price of a decent car.. or a big lump towards a home.. Thats more than I earn in a year before tax. Its all very unfair. The university that guy went to was paid for by minions like me..
Thank you for this information. I have read that the skills of Aus surgeons is no where as good in Thailand. Its all getting to be a bit of a worry.. My anxiety levels are climbing. But I have time.. To be honest, I would have had it years ago but I was never in the position to do it.. Now I am and to be honest I think its a good time due to the many changes with government support mechanisms.
Before I become a primary school teacher I was in the Royal Australian Air Force where at that time it was an offence to be Gay, Lesbian and I assume Transgender. But now its fine.. Just typical.. Story of my life to be late or too early..
Glad when the IQ test is gone. I keep failing it. :D :D :D :D
Tess..
Actually, Andy is quite well skilled, just he doesn't have the worldwide reputation that the Thai surgeons do. As far as cost goes, you keep saying "it's only a 6 hour surgery" like time has something to do with the complexity.. It's actually quite a complicated procedure that requires a high skill level. It's not something a surgeon with the basic qualification could do.
There are also thing to consider like insurance costs.. Doing trans surgeries seems to cause a nasty increase in premiums. There is also theatre costs, anaesthetic costs etc - all things most Australians have no real experience with due to Medicare.
Using an Australian surgeon also has other benefits, such as ease of access should there be issues down the track.
Oh, and Andy went to Liverpool University in the UK, so you didn't pay a cent for his training.. And university students have mostly paid their own way via HECS since 1989..
Tess, you can find independent photo's of post-op results for many surgeons online if you search. People write blogs and things, and post them occasionally. I've found them them for Suporn and Chettawut, but I can't find PAI, or Andy Ives.
Yes, I have seen some by searching but the PAI provided stages as the vagina heals.
I have sent an email request for info to Andrew Ives...
Tess...
Yes, I realise all that but in my view it still doses not justify $41,500.. However, it seems Andy does not charge that kind of sum.. I have yet to find out..
Tess..
Quote from: kelly_aus on July 23, 2016, 01:20:39 AM
Actually, Andy is quite well skilled, just he doesn't have the worldwide reputation that the Thai surgeons do. As far as cost goes, you keep saying "it's only a 6 hour surgery" like time has something to do with the complexity.. It's actually quite a complicated procedure that requires a high skill level. It's not something a surgeon with the basic qualification could do.
There are also thing to consider like insurance costs.. Doing trans surgeries seems to cause a nasty increase in premiums. There is also theatre costs, anaesthetic costs etc - all things most Australians have no real experience with due to Medicare.
Using an Australian surgeon also has other benefits, such as ease of access should there be issues down the track.
Oh, and Andy went to Liverpool University in the UK, so you didn't pay a cent for his training.. And university students have mostly paid their own way via HECS since 1989..
I stayed 9 days in a private hospital, with my own room, foxtel. 24/7 care from nurses and visits from surgery everyday. It's not like 6 hours and you go home. All this sort of varies from surgeon to surgeon. Not sure about PAI, but friends have taken pics from recovery with chett and suporn and those are definitely not first world places.
Hey Serenation, did you have any out-of-pocket cost? Did Medibank and Medicare pay it all...??
Tess...
Quote from: Serenation on July 23, 2016, 03:00:06 AM
I stayed 9 days in a private hospital, with my own room, foxtel. 24/7 care from nurses and visits from surgery everyday. It's not like 6 hours and you go home. All this sort of varies from surgeon to surgeon. Not sure about PAI, but friends have taken pics from recovery with chett and suporn and those are definitely not first world places.
I have just had a PM from a friend. She has a friend who was going to use Chett but decided on Suporn instead. She said the recovering area was third world and nothing like she was expecting and certainly did not support the price she paid.. I feel that the Yanhee would have been a better option for her.. but even better the PAI.. She said the taxi ride from Suporn to the Bangkok airport was utter agony.. I feel that if cannot afford Andrew, I would most defiantly be having it done in Bangkok.. I really need to talk to my Gender Doctor.. I am sure he will have some advice on this. Even though my ETA for SRS is not until December 2017, I still need to have it booked and paperwork approved and deposit paid long before then...
Tess..
Hi Tess, it doesn't really matter if the cost rules him out, but that experience your friend had with Suporn doesn't match what I've heard from others (many times). The pdf I linked to contains photo's of the hospital rooms and hotel, and its not 3rd world. The overall service is commonly said to be as good as it gets. I believe the hospital itself is not as good as PAI's, but its still a major hospital. Dr Chettawut operates out of his own private clinic rather than a hospital. Perhaps she meant Dr Chettawut's recovery area?
I guess the ride back to the airport depends on how you're doing. I think most people are fairly well recovered after 30 days, but not all, and some go back earlier. Its not exactly a taxi, Suporn has his own vehicle (also a picture in the pdf). Having said all that, one of the big downsides to Suporn is that recovery is twice as long as other surgeons - he says it himself. It can be quite a long time.
Something else to consider, after the taxi ride comes the flight back to Australia...
If you do some searching you'll find various reports of problems people had with the various surgeons. Its difficult to work out what it all means as they have all had problems.
Yes there maybe some confusion. I am getting information 3rd hand via text message, but it does say Suporn.
I have just received a text message from Andrew Ives.. Its the weekend so I do not expect to hear from him until Monday.. Would be nice to have it all done in Aus but $$$$$..
Tess..
Tess, its 13k gap fee with Andrew I'ves (there abouts), no matter where you go travelling home is going to be fairly uncomfortable, at 5 week mark I drove for many hours home on endone (heavy pain killer), that said I don't recall my friends saying the trip to the airport from thailand stood out as a particular issue.
I'm not here to sway anything, just to say what the price in Aus was, Suporn is a damn fine surgeon, Chetts had some major issues (two fistulas in the last year or so) but does good work and is a little shorter on the waiting lists.
I had been talking to someone who just srs in melbourne like a month ago and she had a blood clot and had to get put under an additional two times, she's a bit depressed at moment that she hasn't recovered as fast as she had hoped and is having wisdom teeth issues , but treatment for that been postponed so she can recover.
My friend that went to chett had a completely unrelated issue to her surgery and spent almost her entire recovery in a random thai hospital. (she says travel insurance was a life saver)
Stuff can go wrong, no matter where you go.
Edit : I also just asked someone more experienced than me about Dr Haertsch and they said health insurance and medicare does cover the majority of it and brings it down to a similar price to Andrews
Thank you.. That is good information. My issue is, I do not have private health insurance.. At 13k that would be about what I would pay all ups with the PAI including air fair.. Air fair to Melbourne cost more than to fly to Thailand.. Everything cost heaps in Aus. I will be glad when its all done and I am as I should have been born...
I might inveterate the price of health insurance.. I will probably not continue with it after I have recovered.
We are going to Thailand in January and we normally have travel insurance.. It covers unlimited hospital.. I am assuming that includes if I have medical issues during SRS in Thailand. I normally use InsureAndGo Its cheap for what we get.. http://www.insureandgo.com.au/?promocode=holidays10&gclid=CjwKEAjwq8y8BRCstYTm8qeT9mwSJACZGjUkB43_Je-4eHjsaZTHjuKcdM__yRd8Lx4PIGH7KNQd5hoC78bw_wcB
Tess..
Most travel insurance does not cover medical tourism, it's only for unintentional needs. I have seen one that does. I'll see if I can find it.
Hi.. I finally heard from Andrew Ives..
I do not really know why I am bothering with seeing a Psychologist. That seems to be a lot of money for just a chat... I might train to be one myself.. I am only seeing one psychiatrist since I am wanting SRS.. That is what my Gender GP has told me, he never mentioned seeing two. I will ask him what I need to do as far as the psychologist. If I do not have to see him I will drop him....
This is what was stated in their reply...
"The surgical cost for the procedure is approximately $11,000. The anaesthetist fee and theatre fee are additional. You must however have private insurance in order to be eligible to go ahead with surgery.
We also follow the WPATH international standards of care, which means that we require two independent reports from psychiatrists to go ahead with surgery. You must also be on hormones for at least 12 months and living in your chosen gender for at least 12 months."
No world on the cost of anaesthetist or the theatre, but I bet they cost heaps.. I really do not see why I have to take out private health insurance.. Its no wonder Transgender ladies seek out Thailand for their skills and affordable pricing and ease of process. I have options in Thailand but so far I like what the the PAI has to offer....
Tess...
Quote from: Tess2016 on July 28, 2016, 03:19:43 AM
Hi.. I finally heard from Andrew Ives..
I do not really know why I am bothering with seeing a Psychologist. That seems to be a lot of money for just a chat... I might train to be one myself.. I am only seeing one psychiatrist since I am wanting SRS.. That is what my Gender GP has told me, he never mentioned seeing two. I will ask him what I need to do as far as the psychologist. If I do not have to see him I will drop him....
This is what was stated in their reply...
"The surgical cost for the procedure is approximately $11,000. The anaesthetist fee and theatre fee are additional. You must however have private insurance in order to be eligible to go ahead with surgery.
We also follow the WPATH international standards of care, which means that we require two independent reports from psychiatrists to go ahead with surgery. You must also be on hormones for at least 12 months and living in your chosen gender for at least 12 months."
No world on the cost of anaesthetist or the theatre, but I bet they cost heaps.. I really do not see why I have to take out private health insurance.. Its no wonder Transgender ladies seek out Thailand for their skills and affordable pricing and ease of process. I have options in Thailand but so far I like what the the PAI has to offer....
Tess...
Compliance with WPATH rules is, as far as I know, an insurance requirement. As far as theatre and anaesthetist fees, they are mostly covered under private health insurance - which, unfortunately, you don't have.
Oh, I see.. That explains a few things.. I can look into taking out private health, but I think I cannot make any claims for one year.. Not sure.. It might not be that long but not to matter, I have planned to have my SSR December 2017.. So, going by the price I have been given, and you say that other stuff is covered by private health.. I guess I am up for 11k out of pocket as they call it.. as long as nothing goes wrong.. ::) If that right, then Australia is back in the ball park.. but not sure what I have to pay in private health.. I have to pay the government loading too. Never understood that.. If someone goes through a bad time, due to losing their job perhaps, they have to cut back and one thing to go would be private health.. In time they get back on their feet but now they have to pay a loading $$ ... As far as I am concerned, it deters Aussies from having private health after a certain age, and then puts extra strain on the public system. I had my kidney stone removed and it cost me nothing.. Yet a friend of mine who had a heart attack, and who has private health, is up for $$$ in out of pocket cost.. I even had a privet room.. Nothing makes sense with private health.. But I will still look into it.. Do you know if they all cover SSR..???
Tess..
Tess...
Hi Tess and welcome.
Girls on here have a tendency to champion their own surgeon and clinic. That's totally understandable. If you're placing your hard-won rights, cash and very life itself in the hands of someone then you need to believe in them. Only if something really goes wrong are you likely to hear dissent.
Having written the above I am with PAI for reasons that, I believe, to be sound. I go into surgery tomorrow on what I hope will be stage 1 GRS: I have several stages lined up :)
PAI are competitive on price without being worryingly low cost: as you know you can get surgery for very little if you're prepared to play russian roulette with your health. Some Thai girls feel they have little choice and there are some horror stories around. The Thai clinics as far as most girls on this forum go probably boil down to 3 or 4 choices and you will know who they are. From everything I've seen, with all caveats applied, I think you're very wise opting for PAI.
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php?topic=212657.new;topicseen#new
Yes.. I have read so much about the offering of the surgeons in Thailand and it does come down to just 4 or so. I keep coming back to the PAI.. They seem to be a benchmark for standards, training and affordability. Being so close to Bangkok is a bonus... That means they are very close to a major hospital, just in case.. and.. shopping and other things.. They do not showcase their results on their website. But the PDF they send on request is full of good, real information.
Good luck with your surgery... I really cannot wait to get my SRS done.. Good riddance to that yuck thing, for ever!!.. LOL.. I am still out on FFS for the PAI, but that is my only choice in hospitals when getting it done in Thailand. Far to many alarm bells ring with Chett and others.. To get it done will cost the earth.. I will be getting my Trachea shave done at the same time as my SRS.. Its much cheaper to get that done in Thailand and its also cheaper with the PAI to get it done at the same time since I am already asleep..
Tess..
you need to have two psychiatric reports no matter where you go, private health and medicare covers the private hospital since no one knows how long you will be in hospital, you pay the surgeon fee's up front, and then insurance pays the hospital stuff so no one has to worry how long you are there.
Quote from: Serenation on July 29, 2016, 04:32:24 AM
you need to have two psychiatric reports no matter where you go, private health and medicare covers the private hospital since no one knows how long you will be in hospital, you pay the surgeon fee's up front, and then insurance pays the hospital stuff so no one has to worry how long you are there.
If she going to Thailand she can get over that by going to go to the two psyches in Thailand... Or so pai told me that
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Dont forget to factor in that Ives does penile inversion only, in it's most basic form. I don't think any Thai surgeons still use that technique. The combination technique used by most Thai surgeons appears to give a more aesthetically pleasing result.
Hey there..
With the PAI, I only need one letter...
How to make an appointment/surgery; (Only 1 letter)
1. Letter from Psychiatrist doctor*
2. Hormone Therapist. In the letter, your local doctor should write you the letter to qualify for surgery.
3. Plan your available date to be surgery and departure from Bangkok
4. We will confirm you for surgery date
5. You may start to book your airline ticket
6. We will confirm you all detail and hotel booking, if require
7. For transportation to be pick up from the airport, we need you to confirm your airline flight itinerary
Even if I do not have a letter when I go to Thailand....
- If you cannot find your local psychiatrist doctor there. You may come to consult with our psychiatrist doctor here. Doctor fee is USD50. It is 1 hour consultation and if approve. We can start surgery in the next day.
Its not a big deal in Thailand but I will still go with letters from a Psychiatrist, my Psychologist and Gender GP.. Apparently, I do not have to see a Psychiatrist that many times.. I just need to see them over the course of a year so they can write a letter..
I am sure it will all be OK.. I have decided not to bother with Australia for my SRS.. I am not taking out private health insurance just for SRS.. and I really do not feel Aus surgeons have the skills same as Thai surgeons.. They might provide an outcome but perhaps not the best one..
Tess..
Getting letters at home is going to involve less anxiety than getting them in Bangkok especially if don't have any sign-off at all. I got 2 psychiatrist letters in Melbourne for Chet and as both are WPATH members I got immediate confirmation they were OK. One I had been seeing for about 18 months and the second was 2 visits.
I could have gone to Andy Ives and had a consultation with him. Nice guy and doing a very good job in a country with few surgical resources available for us. My issue was that I was very small and wanted someone experienced with grafts just in case. Purely my feeling and I have no evidence to say Andy wouldn't have done a good job. I needed a graft too as it happened.
Get as informed as you can right up to departure so that you understand what is going to happen and what the recovery process will be like. Takes a lot of stress away and I found it was much easier to work things out for myself as things happened.
All the best.
Emma
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Quote from: Tess2016 on July 29, 2016, 05:14:40 AM
Hey there..
With the PAI, I only need one letter...
How to make an appointment/surgery; (Only 1 letter)
1. Letter from Psychiatrist doctor*
2. Hormone Therapist. In the letter, your local doctor should write you the letter to qualify for surgery.
3. Plan your available date to be surgery and departure from Bangkok
4. We will confirm you for surgery date
5. You may start to book your airline ticket
6. We will confirm you all detail and hotel booking, if require
7. For transportation to be pick up from the airport, we need you to confirm your airline flight itinerary
Even if I do not have a letter when I go to Thailand....
- If you cannot find your local psychiatrist doctor there. You may come to consult with our psychiatrist doctor here. Doctor fee is USD50. It is 1 hour consultation and if approve. We can start surgery in the next day.
Its not a big deal in Thailand but I will still go with letters from a Psychiatrist, my Psychologist and Gender GP.. Apparently, I do not have to see a Psychiatrist that many times.. I just need to see them over the course of a year so they can write a letter..
I am sure it will all be OK.. I have decided not to bother with Australia for my SRS.. I am not taking out private health insurance just for SRS.. and I really do not feel Aus surgeons have the skills same as Thai surgeons.. They might provide an outcome but perhaps not the best one..
Tess..
Is Suporn like that too?
So you could just get a letter in Thailand rather than go through 12 months RLE and tick all the other boxes at home...
Quote from: Ellement_of_Freedom on July 29, 2016, 06:48:20 AM
Is Suporn like that too?
So you could just get a letter in Thailand rather than go through 12 months RLE and tick all the other boxes at home...
Suporns requirements are on his website and are very detailed. You don't strictly need 12 months RLE, depending on various factors. The wait list is over 12 months though. He does ask for 1 foreign letter and will arrange the other for you when you get there. I think you'd need to contact them if you wanted to get both in Thailand, but I'd expect it's possible.
For this reason and others, is why I will pass on Ives... Sounds great to get my SRS done in Australia but... I really want more than can be offered in Australia.. I did more research on that Assoc Prof Peter Haertsch, who is very very very expensive. I could not believe he only provided me with a Note on his pricing.. with no details at all. Apparently a friend of a friend mine went to see him last year, but was not impressed at his knowledge of SRS.. She needed questions answered, which we all need to hear from our chosen surgeon, but he seemed to not be able to answer her questions. So she had it done in Thailand at the Yanhee.. Far cheaper and no regrets.. Thats a nice outcome. My friend is arranging a meet with her friend to have a chat.. ^-^
Tess...
Quote from: Lauren O on July 29, 2016, 04:55:39 AM
Dont forget to factor in that Ives does penile inversion only, in it's most basic form. I don't think any Thai surgeons still use that technique. The combination technique used by most Thai surgeons appears to give a more aesthetically pleasing result.
Quote from: Lauren O on July 29, 2016, 04:55:39 AM
Dont forget to factor in that Ives does penile inversion only, in it's most basic form. I don't think any Thai surgeons still use that technique. The combination technique used by most Thai surgeons appears to give a more aesthetically pleasing result.
wrong on multiple counts.
Andrew does optional scrotal grafts, not mandatory like chett and suporn all three are cowpers gland self lubing with penile skin inner labia. no one else in thai is doing mandatory scrotal though I'm sure every surgeon can do scrotal grafts these days, the difference is in the ratios. chett can build the vagina canal out of 3 different skin types. Different surgeons emphasise different aesthetic you don't just go to the 18th best surgeon in thailand and expect it to look like suporn did it.
When I had a consultation with Ives a year ago he said he did penile inversion only and then couldn't show me any pictures of the work he has done despite multiple requests.
Quote from: Tess2016 on July 23, 2016, 01:50:19 AM
Yes, I have seen some by searching but the PAI provided stages as the vagina heals.
I have sent an email request for info to Andrew Ives...
Tess...
Re. PAI, yes indeed. There was a peer reviewed academic paper that I linked to a few weeks back. The abstract contains no "nudity." But there's a button top right to take you through to very graphic descriptions of how one of PAI's fairly typical procedures looks. Here's the non-nude abstract: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25356769
As I say that's a peer reviewed paper so less anecdotal than most blogs etc, though I'm certainly not dissing qualititative write ups by those who have gone through the surgery: I did one myself on here earlier today.
IN 2008 when I went I wanted Dr. Suporn but his price at that time was not far off of Bowers in the USA. I ignored him since I am not going to fly 24 hours and pay the same price as the USA.
I did find a doctor you mentioned and his price at the time was 7500.
Well worth the money.
In fact, I could fly to the USA and get my SRS done for about the same price as flying to Thailand for Suporn.. Its not just his price. He might be a good surgeon but his technic is unproven and I also find it strange that no one else has adopted his method despite the fact he lectures on it. Another issue I have.. Apparently it takes a very long time to recover after his surgery method.. Also the fact he is way outside of Bangkok. To me he does not tick any of my boxes.. But he must be appealing to Transgenders since he is apparently booked up..
Tess..
Quote from: Katie on August 02, 2016, 07:49:13 AM
IN 2008 when I went I wanted Dr. Suporn but his price at that time was not far off of Bowers in the USA. I ignored him since I am not going to fly 24 hours and pay the same price as the USA.
I did find a doctor you mentioned and his price at the time was 7500.
Well worth the money.
Quote from: Tess2016 on August 03, 2016, 12:47:07 AM
In fact, I could fly to the USA and get my SRS done for about the same price as flying to Thailand for Suporn.. Its not just his price. He might be a good surgeon but his technic is unproven and I also find it strange that no one else has adopted his method despite the fact he lectures on it. Another issue I have.. Apparently it takes a very long time to recover after his surgery method.. Also the fact he is way outside of Bangkok. To me he does not tick any of my boxes.. But he must be appealing to Transgenders since he is apparently booked up..
Hi Tess,
while I can't say I've been to Suporn I am bit of fan and I think I can answer some of that.
I believe his technique is well proven, he's done more than 2000 SRS and I believe most of its using using his technique (he started with penile inversion). There's been so many posts about Suporn over the years you can tell if its good or not. Dr Chettawut has copied at least some of his technique, and I keep hearing that other Thai surgeons are also doing the same, but I've no idea how true that is.
Recovery is definitely longer that for other surgeons, and he says himself its double that of penile inversion. Its one of the major downsides of his technique if it matters to you (eg getting back to work). I'm not sure but I think its also more involved and has a higher incidence of requiring early post-op revisions (he does do a lot of them). As a result he basically requires patients to stay 30 days post-op in Thailand at the hotel next to the clinic so they can look after you. Can you imagine what that would cost in a 1st world western country? Its a big reason why they wouldn't' adopt this technique - they can't.
And its not like western surgeons are short of patients, for whatever reason, so why should they change?
He doesn't really lecture. He did a presentation at a conference in 2004 (I think that's the date) and none since. He was co-author on an academic paper this year, which quite surprised me.
Its an hour from the airport, two from Bangkok, and Chonburi is not very nice. But so what? I'd only be there for Suporn. I'd put up with just about anything for that.
Price is personal I guess. If pay for someone who does what I value, assuming I had the money.
I guess we all have our favourite surgeons or those we trust to do our SRS.. Its a good topic here since so many points of view have been stated.. Its a big thing to have SRS, and most of us have been saving up for a long time or even waiting for a long time, so its important we choose wisely, and to go into it with open eyes and realise we have researched and determined the best options as individuals. There are some surgeons I would not choose but its not suggesting they are not good at what they do, but rather it is a personal choice, for what ever reason.. My ETA for SRS is December 2017.. There is still time to choose but my list is getting shorter.. For me, at this time, Suporn and Chettawut are not on it..
Tess..
I don't know enough about other surgeons, but if I couldn't go to Suporn or Chettawut I'd take a serious look at PAI. That's mainly based on what Warlockmaker has written. Normally that's not nearly enough, but I'm very impressed by the way she researched it. I'd probably want to visit them first.
I'm a bit confused why pai is not more popular to be honest ... Is it because the teacher (preecha) is not doing the surgeries ?
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PAI don't seem to market themselves towards Western patients, and its very difficult to find any independent information about them. I've never seen any independent post-op results from PAI, but I've seen many for other surgeons.
Another possible issue is that all the other surgeons are known by name, but who's the surgeon at PAI? Its not Preecha and it appears to change over time, so you don't feel a lot of confidence in what you're getting. Unlike Bowers, McGinn, Brassard, Suporn, Chettawut, etc. Perhaps its a branding problem.
For all of that I'd never consider them except for Warlockmaker. She's very smart, and I have a certain amount of trust in her opinion.
Hi.. Not so sure it is a branding issue.. I feel it might be due to geographic reference since while doing searching from Australia, Bowers and McGinn are not given much mention on web searches.. As for Brassard, I have never heard of that surgeon. I have read a few bad reviews about McGinn. There are many SRS surgeons around the world but not many seem to promote themselves. This is the case in Australia. Thailand seems to be the best known out of all SRS surgeons, in particular Chettawut who promotes himself on the Thai media... I have Thai friend who tell me to avoid this surgeon.. He is very well known in Thailand, for not all the right reasons. One concerning review about Support is his "Live Time Guarantee".. I must admit I was swayed towards Suporn for this option despite his high prices. But, a few reviews suggest his guarantee is not worth anything.. He basically ignores you.. I do not know if any of that is true but I have read more than one comment about that. Regarding the PAI, their surgeons take extra study to be Board Registered. Dr. Burin Wangjiraniran MD. FRCS is a highly skilled surgeon and I have asked that Dr Preecha be present during my SRS, even though he is not doing the actual surgery... I like the fact that the PAI does it all, including Voice.. I have not seen the PAI surgeons change during the past 2 years so not sure how often they move on..
Tess...
We are still trying to figure out what they do for voice surgery. The current view based on little information is that they do CTA which isn't a good option unless combined with VFS. Should you learn more about the procedure they use, we would be interested in knowing about in the voice section.
I must admit I have not researched this option much since I am not ready to have it done.. I did not know there were options.. Clearly I need to go into this with open eyes.. There are surgeons I could use rather than the PAI.. I guess its a matter of choosing the right surgeon for the required surgery.. I do not think I would use the PAI for my FMS. If I had the money I would most certainly be going to Dr Jeffrey Spiegel...
Tess...
Quote from: Dena on August 03, 2016, 06:32:05 PM
We are still trying to figure out what they do for voice surgery. The current view based on little information is that they do CTA which isn't a good option unless combined with VFS. Should you learn more about the procedure they use, we would be interested in knowing about in the voice section.
There are several options for voice surgery with some pretty risky and some not very effective. Variations on VFS seem to be the best but for really difficult voices, CTA and VFS can give the maximum pitch change if you are wiling to live with some restrictions. Picking a voice surgery can be as difficult as picking a FFS or SRS surgeon.
What are the restrictions..??
Tess..
Hard to research CTA and VFS.. Not even Dr Jeffrey Spiegel makes any mention to it.. http://www.drspiegel.com/voice-feminization-surgery/ No idea what he charges.. but he is a very expensive surgeon..
Quote from: Tess2016 on August 03, 2016, 10:39:13 PM
What are the restrictions..??
The main restriction is that the range is somewhat restricted. This is not a problem with a normal speaking voice but if you wish to sing, you may not have the needed range. I was willing to have both procedures done if it would have been required but my desire was to only have VFS in order to maintain as much range as possible. It appears CTA wasn't needed in my case so I can range into the upper male rage to well into the feminine range. VFS goes under several names depending on the doctor so you really need to understand what the procedure is and then see what the doctor provides.
Look with all due respect I find it astounding so many pre op women get so critical of each doctor and his so called techniques.
THe truth is that ANY doctor that is doing this surgery on a regular basis and has done a good number of these surgeries, and finally you have talked to a few of his clients and herd their stories. YOU ARE VERY LIKELY TO be happy with the results!
With that said some of the well known doctors are cheaper than others.
I personally think the hyper critical points of view would be more applicable to getting FFS. Since your face is something the world sees I would seriously hope someone was more critical of the doctor doing FFS than the one making a hole..............
Katie
Quote from: Katie on August 05, 2016, 07:31:28 PM
Look with all due respect I find it astounding so many pre op women get so critical of each doctor and his so called techniques.
I take the opposite view. I'm often surprised by people choices, and the reasons behind them. I don't like to be critical since it tends to cause arguments, but I do have strong opinions on SRS surgeons, both for and against. I prefer to argue for rather than against as it causes less friction, and I'm not here to upset people.
FFS remains a bit of a mystery to me. Its some time off, but I'm starting to research it now. I wish I could see more results in person, but I don't get out into the trans community much. Hopefully in a few years I'll have a better idea.
Quote from: Katie on August 05, 2016, 07:31:28 PM
Look with all due respect I find it astounding so many pre op women get so critical of each doctor and his so called techniques.
While I may have come to the realisation that SRS is not something I need, there was a time when I thought I did want it. As a result of this, I've done my research, done the due diligence. The results of which showed me that the claims made by some surgeons do not stand up to any real scrutiny.
I understand your point of view Katie, but.. I have read some real horror stories.. I really do not want any post opp' issues or any life long issues, or even any corrective surgery at a later date. I feel any major surgery requires careful consideration and we all need to feel confident in who we choose to do our SRS. While most of the final outcomes will be very similar, its the entire journey that needs to be considered. I really want my journey to be a pleasant one. My own SRS has been a long time in coming.. Therefore I am not about to jump in with my eyes closed and eeny mini miny moe my SRS surgeon without careful consideration after researching them. I also do not believe they are all as qualified to do SRS as they might claim to be.
Tess....
Quote from: Katie on August 05, 2016, 07:31:28 PM
Look with all due respect I find it astounding so many pre op women get so critical of each doctor and his so called techniques.
THe truth is that ANY doctor that is doing this surgery on a regular basis and has done a good number of these surgeries, and finally you have talked to a few of his clients and herd their stories. YOU ARE VERY LIKELY TO be happy with the results!
With that said some of the well known doctors are cheaper than others.
I personally think the hyper critical points of view would be more applicable to getting FFS. Since your face is something the world sees I would seriously hope someone was more critical of the doctor doing FFS than the one making a hole..............
Katie
Again I stand by what I said which I am not sure you completely gathered. IF you go to a doctor that is well known, has done this surgery many times, has a good reputation with the gals that used him YOUR LIKELY TO HAVE A GOOD OUTCOME.
Of course you cannot guarantee anything but the odds are you will be happy.
Those of us that HAVE had the surgery for the most part don't argue over who did our surgery. WE are just happy its done. I am sure each and every one of us have parts that look different than the next person JUST LIKE ANY WOMAN ON THE PLANET.
Katie
Quote from: Tess2016 on August 06, 2016, 05:15:38 AM
I understand your point of view Katie, but.. I have read some real horror stories.. I really do not want any post opp' issues or any life long issues, or even any corrective surgery at a later date. I feel any major surgery requires careful consideration and we all need to feel confident in who we choose to do our SRS. While most of the final outcomes will be very similar, its the entire journey that needs to be considered. I really want my journey to be a pleasant one. My own SRS has been a long time in coming.. Therefore I am not about to jump in with my eyes closed and eeny mini miny moe my SRS surgeon without careful consideration after researching them. I also do not believe they are all as qualified to do SRS as they might claim to be.
Tess....
No one goes into srs wanting complications or revisions, I'm in a support group with post ops from all over the world, I don't think anyone had no issues at all, sadly you have to assume your are going to get granulation, pulled stitches, as most people do. What you really don't want is a fistula, but it happens so make sure you know when was the last time they had it happen, and how often they've had it happen. Have a plan for who is going to fix complications after you get home.