Hi everyone, I really need some opinions because I am in the job market right now and am having quite some difficulty. My mom tells me she thinks it's because I am in the middle of transitioning right now, people might not be able to tell if I am male or female. We talked about FFS and I personally think my jaw is what's getting me clocked. My mom on the other hand says that is ridiculous, lots of women's have strong jaws. She told me the only thing is the grow out my hair, get an adam's apple reduction and if I want, the Yeson voice surgery. After all of this, I would like outside opinions on what could help me pass better. What works for me, what doesn't. Please ignore the beard shadow, I only have eyeliner on in these photos.
https://imgur.com/a/3p7GX
Firstly, you're a very pretty woman. I lie in agreement with your mother as I don't think your jawline is impeding you in any way whatsoever; in fact, it gives a really pleasant dimension to your face.
The features that do instantly pop out to me, however, are your adam's apple and your nose. The adam's apple is especially predominant on the side as you have a very thin (this is a good thing), feminine neck.
Your nose, though shaped nicely, is somewhat large for what I'd read to be a natal female, especially one of Asian descent. Again, it's more noticeable from a side view and it's not the length of it so much as the general girth of the bridge.
But honestly, your pronounced collarbones, delicate neck, well-defined jaw and soft eyes are things that 95% of the natal female population would kill to have.
Some women get plastic surgery to get a jaw like yours. I think it's androgynous rather than masculine and that's why the slightest hint of beard shadow really makes you look different. Honestly, you are really very pretty and I didn't even notice your adam's apple. Thinner women tend to have a more prominent one anyway.
Your adam's apple is really prominent, especially for an Asian woman. If there was one thing I had to choose, I'd pick that. (I had a trachea shave done myself, and my adam's apple was a lot less prominent than yours, even before surgery)
It's interesting that your mom mentioned voice surgery for you. Have you taken any voice lessons from a professionally trained private instructor? It's a lot cheaper and safer than voice surgery, and could get you the results you need. I suggest trying that first.
Very nice. I love the shade of black your hair is. I have to dye mine every two weeks to keep it that shade.
You're very pretty ;D
Welcome to the site. Thanks for sharing your photos. That is pretty brave.
I think you are not going to have a real problem. Yes, there are some concerns but as you will see here over and over, "How do you feel"? Not how do you look.
I also want to share some links with you. They are mostly welcome information and the rules that govern the site. If you have not had a chance to look through them, please take a moment to read the first several stickies:
Things that you should read
- Site Terms of Service and rules to live by (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,2.0.html)
- Standard Terms and Definitions (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,54369.0.html)
- Post Ranks (including when you can upload an avatar) (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,114.0.html.)
- Reputation rules (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,18960.0.html)
- News posting & quoting guidelines (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,174951.0.html)
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Once again, welcome to Susan's. Look around, ask questions and join in.
With warmth,
Joanna
You're a beautiful lady. Your face and jaw look very feminine. No need for any corrections in my opinion.
You look beautiful, Allie. Lot's and Lot's of women would be pleased to wake up with that pretty face. Don't know what your bod looks like, but I'd never gender you male....least not from your face. Consider yourself blessed, Hon.
I think you're very pretty, Allie. You look fine, however, voice and mannerisms are a large part passing too. Not being able to see and hear you in action, I can't comment on that. If your mom commented on your voice, perhaps that is an area to work on. I believe that there is a lot that you can do with your voice through training and practice.
Your adam's apple is a bit prominent and if someone wondered about your gender, they may look there. Or, they may happen to notice it and then pay closer attention to other things like voice.
Whether or not to have surgery is not an easy choice. If you were to decide to have surgery I would suggest trachea shave as the first priority. Second priority would be rhinoplasty. I don't see any need for anything else.
I'm with the others, I really don't see your jaw as in issue. You are rather pretty. Hugs
Mariah
So when I look at your pictures I see a beautiful woman... OK prominent adams apple from the side, but really, that's all
Quote from: AllieChic on October 06, 2016, 12:09:40 PM
Hi everyone, I really need some opinions because I am in the job market right now and am having quite some difficulty. My mom tells me she thinks it's because I am in the middle of transitioning right now, people might not be able to tell if I am male or female. We talked about FFS...
I now have a better idea of why you are having difficulty finding a job. And contrary to what I, or you, or your mom, or anyone else in this thread may have previously thought, it is not because you don't look feminine enough. Sure, you would probably benefit from some FFS if you wanted to, but I am going to go out on a limb here and say the real reason is because you are rude and lack manners.
Shocking, right? Well, this is my take... you come to this forum, never having visited before (you registered for these forums on the same day you posted). Then you post in the wrong subforum (should have posted in the FFS subforum, but you didn't know about that, because you didn't put any effort into reading anything here). This thread is your very first post, and you spent very little effort introducing yourself or your situation - just a short paragraph. After you post, you never check back for responses, not even 6 days later. All these people in this thread gave their time to you, reviewing your photos and writing their honest opinions, along with giving you plenty of compliments. The least you could have done was check back a day or two later and thanked people for their responses. But you didn't.
You are probably struggling to find a job because you're the type of person who doesn't send thank-you notes to the managers, HR staff, and other interviewers, thanking them for their time. Being courteous, respectful, and displaying consideration for other peoples' time are all really important. And those traits, along with other personality traits that reveal whether you will work well together with others in their team, will come through in your job interviews.
If your voice is getting you clocked, you need to work on it immediately. And it will take time to rectify. Read up on it, and get the software necessary to properly evaluate where your voice really is. (You don't want your voice dipping below 160 Htz, and your average baseline should be around 220.) There's also the matter of timbre.
Likewise, take care of your beard shadow -- electrolysis is your best bet.
While you're certainly passable in Western culture, I do wonder if other Asians would clock you based on your jaw/chin/forehead. And even if you're getting by, there's something profound about facial surgery. Seeing a different face in the mirror, one without the tells you've grown so accustomed to. I was doing just fine in the real world before I had my facial work done, but afterwards... I stopped clocking myself in the mirror. And that, as it turned out, provided immense relief from my dysphoria.
All that said, if your voice is spot on, it can overcome an ambiguous reading.
Finally, when looking for work in the midst of transition, a lot depends on how you're actually presenting yourself. A lot of employers aren't going to want to deal with the headache and heartache of someone who's actively in transition or visibly/audibly transgendered. If you're presenting as female, but your paperwork says otherwise, that's going to throw up all kinds of red flags.
On the other hand, there are some jobs out there that if you can get the work done, they won't care. Things like phone work, for example, which actually could be the perfect opportunity to practice your voice.
Quote from: Sophia Sage on October 12, 2016, 08:02:27 AM
Likewise, take care of your beard shadow -- electrolysis is your best bet.
This is wrong advice for Asians like her and me. We are more than fine with just laser. Electrolysis is not needed for Asians due to our skin tone and black hair.
Quote from: Sophia Sage on October 12, 2016, 08:02:27 AM
While you're certainly passable in Western culture, I do wonder if other Asians would clock you based on your jaw/chin/forehead.
I agree with this. Asians are good at clocking other Asians. We're much more familiar with what Asian faces normally look like, so we can pick out subtle differences that others may not see. For example, we can often tell if someone is Japanese, Chinese, or Korean based on how they look. I don't think most westerners can do that.