Hello to everyone. I am here to offer hope and perspective from the other side. In short, life is good and well worth the struggle. I will try to answer questions honestly and sincerely hope not to offend anybody with my lack of understanding of how things are now as opposed to how they were so very long ago.
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Welcome Complete!!
I so respect those who came before me and made their transitions in the days before information was readily available in the way it is now... You all contributed greatly to my transition being the relatively straightforward process that it was... I always try to do my best to pay that forward!!!
Onward we go!!!!
Ashley :)
Hi! Your thread title caught my eye so I popped in and went and found your first post too. 1972 Huh? Wow! :o
I started HRT in 1972 when I was 17 and also had SRS when I was 22 but that was in 1977 so I'm about four/five years younger than you. I went to Biber in Colorado.
So I'm curious, what brings you to this neighborhood? I mean why pop out of the woodwork now assuming that's what you've done? I've only been here a few months and have asked myself the same question.
Perhaps for my own enlightenment, you'd care to share your perspective on that?
Thanks! Oh by the way, welcome too. It's nice to have dinosaur friends. :)
Hi Complete :icon_wave:
Welcome to Susan's Place :) Glad to have you here, join on in the fun
Hugs
V M
Welcome, Complete!
Thank you for joining to give back. We, who are new to transitioning, are grateful to those who have gone before us and have paved the way to make it easier for those who follow.
So I'm curious, what brings you to this neighborhood? I mean why pop out of the woodwork now assuming that's what you've done? I've only been here a few months and have asked myself the same question.
Perhaps for my own enlightenment, you'd care to share your perspective on that?
Thanks! Oh by the way, welcome too. It's nice to have dinosaur friends. :)
[/quote]
Good question. I really am not sure. I think it has to do with trying to help. l know that you know just how hard and difficult this can be. It just seems that there is so much noise and misinformation that just makes it even harder.
Quote from: Complete on August 27, 2017, 11:00:19 AM
Good question. I really am not sure. I think it has to do with trying to help. l know that you know just how hard and difficult this can be. It just seems that there is so much noise and misinformation that just makes it even harder.
Thanks! I'm not really sure why I'm here either? I've been mostly oblivious to all things trans for the majority of my life but in recent times as transgender issues have become attention grabbing clickbait in the media and as trans people have been used as pawns in political games as a wedge issue, it has been pretty hard to ignore where I came from.
The increased awareness and visibility of trans youth has been something also driving my curiosity and interest. I grew up trans and transitioned as a teenager and never met anyone like me. Heck, doctors I was taken to for ten years didn't even know kids could be trans until my folks found one that did when I was seventeen so I missed out being able to share or compare my experiences and feelings with peers my own age and have come to realize that was a lot to miss. I've managed to make friends with a few young women here with a similar journey and while I'm more than old enough to be their grandmother, there's still a connection of sorts I've not felt with others and that is pretty special.
As far as being helpful, yeah, I've been through a lot and maybe have gained a bit of wisdom about certain things over the years but the world is such a different place from times gone by and I'm far removed from all this transition business. Plus it since seems like the majority here are working through all these things as adults which is completely different than things were for me, I don't feel like I have much to offer in the way of advice or guidance or that there would be any merit to it but I have learned a lot and that's important too.
Hope to hear more from you and for the chance to get to know another "old-timer". There's something to be said for that type of connection as well. Birds of a feather and all, you know?
You can look down and see where I am with my story so I won't repeat it. I do want to say that I look for people who have lived life after the big life changes of surgery and other momentous events. I want to hear how things proceed from there, how the mind adapts, what does the new normal look like. I appreciate those who share such information.
Moni
"As far as being helpful, yeah, I've been through a lot and maybe have gained a bit of wisdom about certain things over the years but the world is such a different place from times gone by and I'm far removed from all this transition business. Plus it since seems like the majority here are working through all these things as adults which is completely different than things were for me, I don't feel like I have much to offer in the way of advice or guidance or that there would be any merit to it but I have learned a lot and that's important too."
Yes. I tend to agree. Things are so different now and of course doing this as a desperate 20y/o is so much different than attempting this as a 40 something with a family and kids. I am sure there are some success stories out there but then everyone has to decide for themselves what they see as success. What worked for you or me might not work for other.
Quote from: HappyMoni on August 27, 2017, 04:14:23 PM
I do want to say that I look for people who have lived life after the big life changes of surgery and other momentous events. I want to hear how things proceed from there, how the mind adapts, what does the new normal look like. I appreciate those who share such information.
Moni
Hi Moni. For me, the biggest thing was getting through the healing process. Once l was strong and healthy again, it became a question of finding my way through the world as a young woman. I had no past and just started over from nothing. The best part was that the physical disconnect no longer existed. Personally l found that my life was no more difficult than for any other woman my age in America in the 70's.
Quote from: HappyMoni on August 27, 2017, 04:14:23 PM
You can look down and see where I am with my story so I won't repeat it. I do want to say that I look for people who have lived life after the big life changes of surgery and other momentous events. I want to hear how things proceed from there, how the mind adapts, what does the new normal look like. I appreciate those who share such information.Moni
Moni, I would be glad offer something to you but I'm afraid it won't be very helpful. Since I've been doing yardwork, it's 107ยบ outside and I'm taking a few minutes to cool off, I'll do it anyway and you'll see why.
I was never seen as a normal boy, fit in as one or even tried to. I was "special" from the get go and had serious social problems from the time I started kindergarten and found out that I
wasn't a girl. My friends were girls, I had girls playthings and at that age couldn't understand why I couldn't have long hair and look like girls. I was so distressed by this that after the 2nd grade, I was able to start growing out my hair which wasn't done in 1963 and did nothing but cause problems me for the next ten years. By the 5th grade, I was seeing psychiatrists who told my folks I was "probably gay". (dumba$$es!) Junior high (7th grade) I wasn't allowed to enroll unless I cut my hair and my folks got lawyers involved and then there were locker rooms and showers I wasn't having any part of so more doctors and psychiatrists got involved. It was a total flustercluck and there was so much ignorance about all this in 1967 and nobody had ever heard of gender dysphoria or even thought whatever it was could happen in children.
Heck neither I nor my parents knew what it was either. I all I knew was that I wasn't a boy. At fifteen, I told my parents I was never going to grow up to be a man and that I was going to live the rest of my life
as a girl. To them, this was more of a no sh*t Sherlock moment than any kind of shock or surprise BUT, this was 1970 and I was a sophomore in high school and this wasn't exactly possible as you might imagine.
I was already as androgynous as possible and the biggest queer ->-bleeped-<- freak the world had ever seen which made me really popular in school (not). I couldn't transition but I could sure push things over the line. I already had long blonde hair halfway down my back and was able to get my ears pierced, shave my legs and my mom took me to her salon to have my brows shaped. By 16, outside of the school environment where people knew I was a boy, I was pretty consistently gendered as a girl. The summer after my junior year, my folks had found a doctor that knew what the hell was going on and I started HRT. The week following graduation in 1973, my folks switched to my girl name and female pronouns. This was the only thing that made sense for me and they knew it. This was no "big life change" other than the fact that things became a lot more normal for me.
I got my first real job at 19 as a secretary/receptionist and just got on with life. With a few community college courses in office practices and bookkeeping (traditional work for women in the 70's) I got better jobs. When I was 22, I took six weeks off to have SRS and just went back to my normal life. Surgery changed nothing outwardly in my life and it was "momentous" only to me because with a few exceptions, people didn't know I was trans. There was no "mind adapting" other than the relief of having a longstanding problem finally fixed and other than becoming a sexual being for the first time in my life and figuring out how that all worked, the new normal was like the old normal.
My life has been pretty normal overall. I've had ups and downs, good times and bad and great loves and great heartaches. I was married for 12 years and divorced and have done some interesting and exciting things interspersed with the mundane and boring.
I don't know if any of this makes sense but maybe you can see why I don't think my experiences are really the kind of answers you are looking for? I've never lived as a man and had to go through the things you and many others here have which seem mind mindbogglingly difficult to me. Being trans as a child and adolescent was no picnic, especially in the 60's and early 70's but I've followed your recent adventures and commend you for the strength for doing what you needed to do. All this kind of happened organically for me as I grew up.
As my final thought before getting back to my outdoor work this afternoon, I have been happy and healthy even with all the things I've done to my body and being on hormones for 45 years so maybe that's one thing that might be comforting to you? In a year or two, you'll have a hard time imagining you were ever anything different.
If there are any questions you think I might be able to answer, I'd be glad to try but for now, I'm back to work because I have a lot still to do and have spent an hour writing! :D
--Lisa
Thank YOU, Lisa. Very well said.
My experience was different, although I too got that very bad news in kindergarten. I told no one until l remember blurting out at birthday party that l was growing up to be a girl. Funny you mentioned it; l too got the psychological treatments starting when was about 7. Same responses: l was either gay or would outgrow it. Wrong on both counts.
Thank you Lisa and Complete. You are correct, our paths are different, but that is okay. You may find it interesting that people with experience such as yours were the the type of people I was jealous of for so many years. I was jealous of your situation because, whatever else you had to deal with, you had a direction that was clear. I never fit with any potential solution until just recently. Well, that is done and over, I don't agonize over it. I do find hearing your stories fascinating. I guess there is a personal interest, as well. I have very much focused on transition and necessarily so. You said in a year or two I will have a had time imagining I was any different. I am so interested in the thought of this. Living life without all the transition related thoughts is a bit hard to conceive at this point. I will say that after only two months it is hard to imagine the old plumbing. I hope you are correct about the rest. Well, even if our stories are very different, that is no problem. I will be away from my computer most of the week. If you write and I don't answer that is why.
Moni
That was mega-inspirational to read, Lisa. Thanks for your story :)
I don't want to steal the thunder from Complete's thread but there are a few thoughts I would like to add.
Those of us that did go through transition in the 1970's and earlier often hear such things as "you paved the way for the rest of us" or we get called "pioneers" or "trailblazers". Not that a little occasional acknowledgment that things might have been harder in the past hurts but to be somehow regarded as the paragons of transness or the founding mothers of the sex change industry is simply inaccurate. Many others came before us and I didn't go through any of this for someone else. I did it for me because I had to.
I never met another trans person until I was 22 and checked into the hospital to have SRS. I've met less than half a dozen during my entire lifetime and have never been part of the LGB or trans community until just this year when I joined this and another trans forum. I've lived close to 45 years blended into the woodwork as we used to say so how is this paving the way or pioneering for others? Other than maybe being a non-descript marker in a long forgotten statistical survey somewhere, it isn't. Yes, resources were harder to find and we had to deal with extreme gatekeeping but overcoming these obstacles is the same thing anyone else today would do if highly motivated or has no other choice besides suicide.
Now as far as the jealousy or idolization of trans youth goes, most completely miss the mark or have misconceptions about how great this is/was. While partly true that we didn't have to totally tear one life down to start another and the complexities involved in that or get lost in the confusion of are we or aren't we, dealing with all this without the maturity or adult reasoning ability combined with the normal challenges of growing up different need to be taken into account. Even normal kids have a hard enough time and as some of the experiences we go through in our youth can be formative or have lasting impact, the lack of maturity of other youth can leave its mark psychologically as well as well as literal physical scars. I am proof of that.
We see young, often pre-pubescent trans kids in the media today and hear their parents stories about depression, social problems, anxiety, suicide ideation, self harm, eating disorders, etc., and how social transition seems to be the magic bullet for dealing with these things or at least helps. The impression I get is that most people or the general public at least thinks this is a new thing. While transitioning is relatively new within the last 10 to 15 years, extremely gender dysphoric/gender atypical children are not and suffer just as bad as the Jazz Jennings' of today's world do. Why we don't hear about trans kids from my generation that didn't have the supportive and understanding parents that I did is because they're likely all dead and this is killing kids even still today. That I had to live through 18 years of my life as a boy that looked and acted like a girl, that was mocked, abused, ridiculed, ostracized and nearly beaten to death that never had normal childhood experiences, socialization or relationships is nothing to be envious or jealous about. As I said, growing up and adolescence is hard enough for everybody - kids and life can be brutal enough. Throw being trans into that mix and this is nothing to be wished for especially if your family had been unsupportive.
Yes, established adults with late onset gender dysphoria that go through transition have a lot to lose and deal with that I never did but it would be a mistake to think my childhood or others like me was a cakewalk or easy or that some things don't still haunt me to this day. We've each had our challenges and demons to slay. It may seem like the grass may have been greener from the outside looking in and while it's true to some degree getting this out of the way before becoming an adult is advantageous in ways but this life is no picnic for any of us at any stage of the game.
For sure. Each of us definitely is allowed to decide whether it has been a success on our own. Welcome Complete. Sometimes I wonder why I stay on the radar considering Im post op and married to my wonderful husband now after moving away from the State I lived all my life up until now to be with him. It's nice to see another post op around here. I often feel that same way in regards to advice and guidance these days considering it seems like forever now even though it has only been 10 months since my SRS. Anyways, you never know who you may help. It maybe yourself in the end. Hugs
Mariah
I
Quote from: Complete on August 27, 2017, 04:16:12 PM
"As far as being helpful, yeah, I've been through a lot and maybe have gained a bit of wisdom about certain things over the years but the world is such a different place from times gone by and I'm far removed from all this transition business. Plus it since seems like the majority here are working through all these things as adults which is completely different than things were for me, I don't feel like I have much to offer in the way of advice or guidance or that there would be any merit to it but I have learned a lot and that's important too."
Yes. I tend to agree. Things are so different now and of course doing this as a desperate 20y/o is so much different than attempting this as a 40 something with a family and kids. I am sure there are some success stories out there but then everyone has to decide for themselves what they see as success. What worked for you or me might not work for other.
No thunder to be stolen here, Lisa. Our histories are really quite different. The only remote similarities are that we were able to survive and managed to successfully deal with our challenges around the same time and the same age.
In essence, l believe, it comes down to just plain dumb luck and the general ability to deal with an impossible situation. I too feel uncomfortable with those often tossed about labels like "pioneer " or "trailblazer ". I didn't pioneer anything. I struggled mightily and successfully with an unheard of and completely unbearable situation....and then, l just disappeared into the reality of my life. As l get on in years and reflect on a long and happy life, l just wish l could offer something useful.
Welcome Complete
Didn't find your other posts.
But now I find some more from the 70s. My details from what I can remember are in my signature.
Not the longest around with you and Lisa_K here.
And yes the "Pioneer" and "Trailblazer" do get old sometimes, but I try not to argue with many around me. Being 66 I can connect with the many that are in their 60s around me, just now going through all this. I find I can't give much help with current stuff, But do give them some insight in the Dark Ages as I call the 70s.
One of the reasons I came back to all these forums and local groups, Was my partner of 38 years died in 2014 (Also similar to mine but she was 40 years old at that time), and I wanted to re-connect or find any others from the 70s.
Georgette
Quote from: Complete on August 28, 2017, 09:48:51 PM
No thunder to be stolen here, Lisa. Our histories are really quite different. The only remote similarities are that we were able to survive and managed to successfully deal with our challenges around the same time and the same age
Yeah, having a history like mine seems to be really rare for people around my age which can be pretty isolating at times. It's weird that even among this crowd I'm different but at least there's a few young gals with a similar path I can relate to if I crank up the wayback machine and remember what it was like growing up and dealing with all of this while still living under my parent's roof, interventions and guidance. If anyone is considered to be pioneers, it would have to be my folks because their understanding, acceptance and all the things they did for me was way ahead of the times and they put up with a lot of crap because of me that I didn't fully appreciate at the time. I do now though and wonder why there are still so many parents today that reject who their kids are. It makes me sad but with more awareness and better resources, things are slowly improving.
I think perhaps that one very important element contributing to my survival (besides sheer stubborness)' was the fact that one, l was self-sufficient after high school, and that my mom at least, did not just reject me as being crazy. I had been on my own for almost three years when l returned home to tell her l was pursuing a surgical reconstruction. Of course she must have been shocked and terrified for my well-being, but nevertheless she strongly expressed her love for me and her support. When the time came, she was there for me to watch over me and make sure all went well.
There is no question in my mind that early intervention in addressing any medically treatable condition is always best. Parents are key to recognizing the signs and taking appropriate action.
I'm about your ages and have known I was a girl since I was 5, 1964. I grew up in a war zone, parents had issues, so there was no one to tell. I've always figured myself born female with a birth defect, called male on birth certificate, put in boys clothes[hated them] hair cut short[protested every time]. Picked on and beat-up a lot as a teen. Suicide has always been a close friend, way to close. In 1980 I had a 'weird' moment with my best friend at the time when I realized fully for the first time how much in love with him I was. That was when all that I had heard of what you women had done[which wasn't much] entered my mind in that instant and I wanted to transition as fast as humanly possible. Of course 'transition' didn't exist then, it was the pieces that had to be put together by someone competent to do it. I wasn't. So with things falling apart around me, I just slunk off into the future. And here it is 37yrs. later and I've finally found my happiness! Just what you girls did 40-50yrs. ago. I hope with all of my heart that when parents read your posts with mine they will see that their kid is not a monster or something wrong, but they just have a problem that needs to be fixed and can be. So when your called 'pioneers and trailblazers' know that you were! Because those of us out in the wilderness [and there were more than I ever thought!] heard bits and pieces, hear and there, and so knew that there was hope somewhere, somehow. There's a football coach here that had to rebuild a team after many bad seasons, he's called it 'Brick by Brick' and now we have a good team. You 'old-timers' are the bricks of the stairs to where we are now! Young people now don't know what it was like back then, and I'm sooo glad of that. The "ordinary' lives that you've lived is what we all have strived for, and in you we see it is possible. Thank you for sharing your stories with us for you truly are appreciated!
Thank you Dani, your words are very kind. I think you are very astute in noting that young children really are quite aware at a very young age. We actually knew something was very wrong and it is oh so important, to have a parent understand even if, (as was the case with my mom), they have no idea what to do or where to seek help.
There is hope. This condition can be fixed. In my opinion clear, honest, and yes early, diagnosis is key. Surgery and chemistry may or not be the corrections intervention and so again diagnosis is the key.