Hi I thought I would post and share this to show the possibilities of what can/could be done ...now considering what I have to work with ,when I first got them back from Alexandra and went to look at them I had a hand over my eyes and was peeking through my fingers I was afraid to look.... but as you can see the before part it looks like no hope but after the FFS is applied I look half decent, especially the side profile the before one of that which disguste me.
So with a bit of makeup and head cover I think I would be happy it's a sort of androgynous look which I favor anyway as I have a big frame so looking pretty would not suit me. I am glad I got this done it's helled me with dysphoria and gives me hope .
There other procedures perhaps that might be able to reduce the masseter and temporal muscles
I will have to study the "thinking outside the FFS box" thread
I have included the assessment as well
I can't imagine going cold cocked into a surgeons office looking at some computer genererated images and then doing surgrey, I have seen some FFS where there does not appear to be a very discernible difference but that is because the person was already very femmine looking so FFS for them was icing the cake so to speak
But when applied to some such as I the difference is quite powerful in effect
With what I have here I have an ideal to work towards a map
The base photos were high res and bright lights completely unflattering and im not on Hrt in these (but have started since)
Here is the link to her website http://www.virtualffs.co.uk/
(https://vgy.me/LyoKrD.gif)
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(https://vgy.me/51C5Yv.gif)
(https://vgy.me/3919DQ.jpg)
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Hello Mark.
Please remember that these virtuals are not and could not be 100% accurate but I hope they will give you a good idea of the possibilities and take you a long way towards planning how best to proceed.
Also remember that just like a surgeon, I am fallible and although I take quite an obsessive amount of care over virtuals, I will inevitably make a mistake every so often.
Working from photographs is not the same as seeing a person in real life. Camera lenses can affect the facial proportions to some extent and the lighting in a photograph can also affect how a face looks.
Facial surgery is not an exact science and while I can control the changes I make in Photoshop completely, a surgeon may not be able to control things with quite so much precision in real life.
The eye takes a little while to tune-in to facial changes so you may be disappointed at first glance. It is best to spend a few days getting used to the pictures before you make any decisions.
I have created 4 different versions of your pictures (a) to (d) adding extra procedures for each version. Here is a list of changes in each version:
(a) shows eyebrow plucking, brow bossing removal and rhinoplasty.
(b) includes lip lift, jaw narrowing and reduction, and chin narrowing and rounding.
(c) includes a face and neck lift.
(d) includes hormonal effects and beard removal.
I have also included an extra version of the 3/4 shot (e) with some hair and make-up added to help you visualise the possibilities. I managed to take the wig from one of the of the other pictures you sent me. I hope it gives you a clearer idea of the possibilities.
Hair:
Your hair has receded to the point that it is probably not going to be possible to regain a useful head of hair. There are some really good wigs available. Human hair is the best I believe and it is usually worth spending money on a good quality one. A more advanced wig option would be the "Cesare Ragazzi CNC Hair Prosthesis System". I have heard good things about it, but haven't seen it myself in real life. I suspect it is expensive and you have to visit one of their specialists every few weeks to have it reattached. Here is a video about it, but beware - this is clearly an advertisement so watch it sceptically and do your own research to confirm that the system is as good as they say.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhFld7jj_4A
There are some experiments going on at the moment into curing baldness and these may be an option in a few years time. Here are a couple of links:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/29/business/baldness-battle-fought-in-the-follicle.html?_r=0
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7431092.stm
Forehead:
The forehead is by far the most important area in facial gender. The male forehead usually has a bony ridge running across it at about eyebrow level called brow bossing, It also tends to have vertical ridges either side of the forehead ("temporal ridges") and often has a bump on either side of the upper forehead ("frontal eminences"). The female forehead is smoother and flatter with less pronounced ridges and bumps, and it usually has either no bossing, or very little bossing.
In your case there is no strong ridge of bossing - it's more a case of your whole forehead being somewhat projected. This means that from the front you don't see a strong ridge, but from the side, you can see that your forehead stands well forwards of your eyes making them a little deep-set.
I have set the bossing area back and taken a little off the upper forehead to but because your bossing does not look strong, the effect looks fairly subtle. I have also opened out your orbits to give you a more open, feminine expression. This is done by removing a little bone from the underside of the orbital rim.
You also have frontal eminences. These can be smoothed down as part of the forehead feminisation and I have simulated the effect.
I generally recommend that people find a surgeon who can do a forehead reconstruction which sets the bone over the frontal sinus back. The other method, where the bone is only ground down, can be very limited as most people have quite thin bone here. According to one study, the thinnest part is, on average only between 2.6 and 2.9 mm thick. It is difficult to know how thick a patient's sinus wall is in advance, even if you take an xray.
One thing to keep in mind is that forehead surgery requires a long incision - usually from ear to ear over the top of the head. This scar would be visible if you were not wearing a wig or hat. Facial Team, who I collaborate with are able to put the incision round the back of the head where there is usually good hair to hide it under. It would still be visible if your head is shaved of course.
It is easy to get confused about forehead surgery and the various options, so I recommend that you have a read through my web page on the forehead:
http://www.virtualffs.co.uk/Forehead.html
Frown Lines:
You have some vertical frown lines between your eyebrows. Reducing vertical lines is rejuvenating but it's also feminising because it softens your expression. I have simulated the effect. The lines may be reduced by the lifting of the forehead soft tissues during forehead surgery, and can be further reduced temporarily with botox. For a more permanent botox effect you can have the surgeon work on the underlying muscles during a brow lift or forehead feminisation surgery. However, like botox, this does reduce the lines but may also limit movement of the muscles to some degree.
Eyebrow height:
Your eyebrows sit in medium position. They will lift a little with forehead surgery and I have simulated the effect. The lift that comes with brow bossing removal tends to be reasonably subtle, but it does help to emphasise a more open, feminine expression.
Eyebrow shape:
Women tend to have thinner eyebrows than men. Yours are a little thick so I have plucked them, mostly along the underside to give them a thinner and more feminine shape. This also increases the distance between your eyes and eyebrows and that has a feminising effect. The natural underlying shape of your eyebrows is really good.
Eyes:
I don't see any problems with your eyes or the soft tissues around them. You have large eyes in proportion to your face - this is feminine and a good asset.
Nose profile view:
From the side, your nose is somewhat large and the bridge of your nose is humped. The hump is not technically a masculinity, but removing it to give the bridge a straight profile will have a feminising effect. I have lowered the bridge to reduce the size and remove the hump. Removing the hump will also cause the tip to lift a little as I have simulated. This also has a feminising effect.
Nose frontal view:
From the front your nose is already good. You should see a slight narrowing of the upper bridge and a slight lift to the tip in the simulation.
Nostrils:
The width and height of your nostrils is fine. You do not need to make any adjustments.
Cheek bones:
I don't see any problems with your cheekbones, and I don't recommend any changes.
Apple of the cheeks:
The apple of your cheeks (the soft part) would become fuller and rounder on hormones and I have simulated this for you. It is impossible to predict exactly how the hormones will affect you (everyone's different) but I've given you an idea of the kind of change you can expect.
Naso-labial folds:
These are the creases that come down from the corners of your nose and they tend to get a little deeper as we age. They are gender-neutral and have no masculinising effect.
Yours are completely normal and you don't need to worry about them. I only mention them because some surgeons recommend filling them, even in cases where they are not at all deep or are barely visible. All that would do is make your surgery more expensive.
Upper lip to nose distance:
The distance between the top lip and the nose tends to be shorter in women, and they also tend to show some of their upper teeth when their mouth is open and relaxed.
Your lip to nose distance is long and you don't show any upper teeth when your mouth is open. I have given you a lip lift to correct this. This procedure is both feminising and rejuvenating but it does leave a small scar at the base of the nose.
Lip fullness:
Your lips are quite thin. You could fill them a little if you wanted to for a mildly feminising effect but it would probably be best to see how the lip lift looks before you make any additional adjustments. I have not tried to simulate lip filling on top of the lip lift.
I recommend non-permanent fillers at first so that you can see the effect. If you like it, you could consider a fat transfer which can become permanent after a few sessions. I also recommend that you take a fairly subtle approach because over filled lips do not look good.
Chin height and shape:
I think the height of your chin is about right but the shape is wide and square. I have shaved off the corners to give it a narrower and more rounded and feminine shape.
Chin projection:
Your chin projection is good so you do not need to move it forwards or backwards.
Chin soft tissues:
Some people have very thin soft tissue on the chin. This means that the chin bone shows through well and so will any changes you make to the bone. Other people have very thick soft tissues on the chin. This means that the chin bone is hidden under a thick blanket of tissue and that can make it more difficult to see any changes to the bone structure. It is not possible for me to know how thick the soft tissues are from your pictures so I have adjusted your pictures on the assumption that the thickness is average. Just keep in mind that it is possible that the result would be more limited in real life if your soft tissues are thick.
Jaw:
Your jaw area is a little difficult to analyse. It looks like your jaw is wide and heavy. However you appear to be extremely muscular and that makes it likely that your chewing muscles are large. This can add a lot of width to the jaw. It is also possible that your soft tissues are quite think here. If the soft tissue is thick, it can make it difficult to see ay changes to the underlying bone.
The technique used to narrow the rear of your jaw would depend on whether the width is due to bone or muscle or both. If it is muscle then botox is a good and non-invasive way of reducing it. This is much safer, much cheaper and much less painful than trying to reduce the muscle surgically. If the width is due to bone then you would need surgery to reduce it. If the width is due to both muscle and bone, then you might need a combination of both. However, the chewing muscles will reduce on their own if some of the bone is reduced.
Estrogen reduces muscle mass all over the body so if you have large chewing muscles, you may see a notable reduction in the size of your chewing muscles. Wait at least a year on a full dose of estrogen to see the effect.
I have narrowed and reduced your jaw but because of the uncertain elements, there is some guesswork involved. You may find that in real life the reduction is greater once all the effects of hormones, bone reduction and lifting come together.
Chin and jaw surgery incisions:
Some surgeons work on the jaw and chin by making external incisions. This is completely unnecessary and leaves very visible scars. The best place to make the incisions is inside the mouth - this means that the scars will be invisible.
Adam's apple:
You have a visible adam's apple and I have simulated a tracheal shave to reduce it for you.
There are two ways of approaching the adam's apple when you do a tracheal shave. The old-fashioned method involves putting the incision right on the adam's apple. There are 2 problems with this - firstly it leaves the scar in a very noticeable position, and secondly. you can get adhesions where the scar tissue sticks to the adam's apple. That means that the skin can be tugged in an unnatural way when your adam's apple moves, such as when you are talking or singing.
The more modern method involves putting the incision under the chin and then tunnelling down towards the adam's apple. This means that the scar is in a much less noticeable place, and you avoid the adhesion problem. I strongly recommend that you find a surgeon who uses the under-chin approach.
However, there is a chance that what looks like an adam's apple in the pictures, might only be loose soft tissue.
Hormones:
I have simulated hormonal effects for you - mainly narrowing the jaw a little and filling the cheeks but they also soften and feminise the skin texture.
Simulating the skin softening is difficult and there is a lot of guesswork involved but I have made a cautious simulation on the effect for you.
These changes can be very powerful, especially when combined with beard removal.
Face lift:
I have given you a lower face and neck lift. This procedure is more about rejuvenation than feminisation but having said that, younger faces do tend to look more feminine than older ones for various reasons. There are various benefits like tightening up the cheeks, giving a nice definition to your jaw line, reducing the naso-labial folds and tightening up the soft tissues of the neck.
It is very important to have any lifting done after jaw/chin surgery and not before or during. This is because jaw and chin surgery cause a lot of swelling and this works against the lifting. It is also impossible to know in advance how much swelling you will experience or how well your soft tissues will re-adapt to the new bone and that means it is not possible to know exactly how much to lift. It is best to wait a few months for the swelling to go down, and then you can see clearly exactly what needs to be done with the soft tissues. Some surgeons will offer to do both jaw/chin surgery and lifting at the same time. I advise against it.
Beard:
I have reduced your beard shadow for you. Beard removal can be achieved with electrolysis and/or laser. People have mixed results with laser but there are many different types.. Laser does not work on grey, white or very light hairs. Electrolysis is also an option either for a complete beard, or just for the pale hairs that are left after laser. As far as I know, "galvanic" electrolysis is less likely to cause scarring.
Priorities:
Your facial structure is not strongly masculine. What gives you a masculine look is more to do with the shaved head, beard shadow and heavy musculature. That's why you look so good in the make-over pictures. I think the forehead, nose upper lip, jaw and chin changes are all useful feminisation for you. But of course, it is just as important to focus on the secondary changes - hormonal effects, beard removal, eyebrow plucking, wig etc.
A good way to view your pictures is to use photo viewing software like Windows Photo Viewer. This will allow you to jump from the before to the after/s and back again by using the arrow buttons on your keyboard. However, you might have to rename the pictures if you want them to flow in a different order.
If you have "Photoshop" or "Photoshop Elements" you can load up a before and after picture at the same time and then by holding down "Ctrl" and pressing "F6" you can flick between the two. This often works for other photo software too.
I have improved the photographic qualities of your pictures (contrast, focus, colour balance etc.) so I am sending you copies of the before shots with the same improvements to make them easier to compare with the after shots.
The pictures are yours so feel free to share them and the assessment with any support groups you are member of if you want some second opinions. Do take prints to your consultations with surgeons or email them in advance - most surgeons welcome them.
Please email me to confirm that the pictures have arrived. If you have any questions about your pictures and your assessment please feel free to email me.
Let me know if you want any surgeon recommendations.
You can find out more about facial gender and FFS by reading through my website.
Please note that I regularly collaborate with Dr Simon and Dr Capitán of Facial Team. Some of the procedures I simulate are based on my discussions of surgical technique with them and on watching them operate. However, not all surgeons take the same approach, and not all surgeons have the level of skill required for all the changes I simulate.
The changes described in this assessment and illustrated in the pictures represent my opinion as an artist. You and/or your surgeon/s may disagree with my opinions. I cannot guarantee that my opinion is good or that the pictures are accurate so if you act according to my opinion, you do so at your own risk.
Thank you very much for entrusting me with your virtual FFS - I very much hope the pictures are helpful.
If you are pleased with my service, please consider writing a short testimonial for me that I could put on my website. It could be a single line or several lines. You can be completely anonymous if you prefer, or just use an initial. A location is useful but it doesn't have to be any more specific than listing what country you are from. It's entirely up to you though so please do not feel any obligation to write one or even to give a reason for not writing one.
Good luck and best wishes,
How much did you pay for this, if you don't mind me asking?
I'm trying to figure out how to get into doing exactly this, and it would be really helpful to know what it's worth. Feel free to PM me, if that's okay! If not, no worries or expectations. :)
Ok I will pm you 😊
I can't wait for mine to show up. Hopefully I'm next!
Hey Markie!!!!
I hope all is well in Kangarooland my friend!!! 😀
I just wanted to say that I had used VirtualFFS years ago too... I found her write up to be very useful and it very much mirrored Dr Ousterhout's assessment of what I should have done... I do feel though that the hoots hopping didn't bear that much resemblance to the final results ... The final results looked a lot better in many ways... I think she errs on the conservative side!!
Onward we go!!!
Ashley :)
Hi, Markie
Thank you so much! I'm quite impressed with the pictures—they look most useful. I've been debating getting a set done too. Now I'm even more inclined to do so when the time comes...
Wow. I posted a thread here when I first arrived and several ladies kind of poo-pooed the idea. Said people would be too broke or use a program. :P
I don't have that same level of knowledge yet, but it seems like this is the only person doing it. Style is super clear, mine is a bit more artistic on mine but photorealistic on previous ones i've done. I think I can do a few things he can't- whole boy poses for one, and i think I have done enough research to be able to do a fairly accurate muscle/fat redistribution to show what hrt potential someone has. I can also do things like show different hairstyles and colors.
And since I don't have the same amount of experience or expertise I'd charge a lot less to start with. I'm still capable of a lot of that write-up, but it would be coming from someone who spent seven years in art school- meaning it's going to be artistic and representative of the overall facial balance. I worked as a video game concept artist for a while, and made a living entirely off my personal work for a year before I got too sick to work. Now that HRT fixed me, I need to get back to working again. And this is seriously what I want to do as a career. It's just so incredibly helpful, and if you have a possible and artistic idea of what to do it can really help the surgeon know what he's looking for. And give you a much better foundation on which to communicate. I see so many examples of bad surgeries because the surgeon just doesn't seem to have a sense for the overall face. It's just a waste of money and emotional well being and could be at least partially prevented.
And before I can do that I need examples, which means I need a couple of people willing to let me do them for free, in exchange for me using the results in my gallery. A couple of you said you wish you could afford it- how about giving me a shot? I'll do a portrait and profile for three people for free in exchange for permission to use the photos as examples. So you can definitely afford that and really have nothing to lose.
I'm good at what I do and feel really passionate about it. I'll be out of town for the next couple of days, but I'll reply to any messages when i can. (Coming out to grandparents, oh boy)
Once I get started it'll probably take 1-4 hours per photoset, depending on the complexity, whether I have to compensate for hormones, etc. quality of photo doesn't really matter as long as it's pretty clear what your features are- i can paint in details.
My profile pic is one of the edits I did for me.
Quote from: tgirlamc on September 04, 2017, 11:24:54 AM
Hey Markie!!!!
I hope all is well in Kangarooland my friend!!! 😀
I just wanted to say that I had used VirtualFFS years ago too... I found her write up to be very useful and it very much mirrored Dr Ousterhout's assessment of what I should have done... I do feel though that the hoots hopping didn't bear that much resemblance to the final results ... The final results looked a lot better in many ways... I think she errs on the conservative side!!
Onward we go!!!
Ashley :)
Hi Ashley ...yes Kanga land is good atm it's heading into spring in Perth , well you certainly turned out well 😊
I sure hope she does err on the conservative side... which makes. sense though ... Ill be insisting that the surgeon I work with studies her assessment 😊
Quote from: zirconia on September 04, 2017, 11:50:07 AM
Hi, Markie
Thank you so much! I'm quite impressed with the pictures—they look most useful. I've been debating getting a set done too. Now I'm even more inclined to do so when the time comes...
Welcome. 😊
Regarding the hair replacement video.....I can't stress what a nightmare this was for me. What looks to be an awesome and obvious fix turns into a hot mess attached to your scalp that you're helpless to fix. By the time you go in for "maintenance", you are miserable and absolutely on your last good nerve. Imagine sebum, a waxy like substance building up underneath the hairpiece, and have no doubt, it is a hairpiece. Now imagine an itch you can't scratch and a distinct smell you can't rid yourself of. I could go on and on but I really just wanted to warn sisters to this lie of a "solution" . It's not. It's a mess. Save your money and buy a quality wig. It's still by far the best solution.
I am not really impressed with the simulations. I think you will get far better results if you go to an aggressive doctor. There are many aggressive doctors out there and you can get much better results then the simulations
Quote from: reborn on September 05, 2017, 06:33:52 PM
I am not really impressed with the simulations. I think you will get far better results if you go to an aggressive doctor. There are many aggressive doctors out there and you can get much better results then the simulations
Hi yes I agree but for me if I can achieve the end product of the Sims I would be very satisfied as that look will match my body size.... it's early days as far as surgeons go I've been in contact with the surgeon at Olmec
His reply was that "as per the photos I will. Have a good result "
These Sims are for FFS not radical cosmetic surgery they give a conservative view of FFs possibilities
and they are abase line to work from 😊
And that look is far better than what I'm wearing at the moment...
btw how do you mean more aggressive ? I wish their was some way to reduce further that darn forehead...
Hi Markie
I don't think I would be keen on the wig system. If you have enough hair on the back of your heard for transplants then I would do that. If however you don't then a wig would be far better than the permanent wig system. Mine is now 10 months post implant since my second round and growing strong...
Yes it would appear so... ultimately I would like to not even worry about a wig though I have a nice 100% human hair one.. very comfortable but in my lime of work.. not practical I will see about a transplant however though it is short and fine... Lovely avatar 😊 your hair look beautiful
It seems to be a very conservative estimate of the effects - I assume that the simulations also include some non FFS things like beard removal or skin resurfacing as the skin looks smoother and lighter in the sims?
I think the bald head really makes it harder to see how things will end up with a hairpiece or wig. I do think however you could get a bit more out of FFS than was simulated, but that is rather common as she does a conservative simulation in most cases. Depending on the surgeon, you may want to push them a bit to do more than the average. You can take the sims with you and ask if this is a realistic outcome or if some things cannot be done as well or if some parts can be done more than simulated. If more can be done, do it ;)
Hi Anja, yes there are the non FFS things like beard etc, yes I will be pushing for the end result of the Simulations at the bare minimum ....i have already had 2 reply's from surgeons one I have discounted as he seemed to think just Nose Reshaping + Septo graft, Mandibular Angle Reduction, Genioplasty,
The second one the Chief surgeon at Olmec was better as he has studied and taken on board
Alexandra's observations but didn't mention anything about a lip lift and recommended non surgical jaw reshaping? Still he has done thousands of ops so would be able to see attributes I myself cant
I think with the jaw he may have been referring to the maseter and temporal muscles
But really I will have to go and see the surgeon in person, I've read some of your discussion on the thinking outside the ffs box thread.... I got lost after a while as it gets quite technical, but if you have any suggestions pls post😊
Anyway at this point of time I am very happy that anything can be done for me as I thought I was a lost cause
So the ffs simulations really impressed me I would be very satisfied if I can duplicate if I can do more and get a more aesthetic result I will set my sights higher, there are a few thing 's I have to contend with bodywise to avoid a mismatch
Well a big thing for you would be skin - women have more yellow skin tones, men have more red tones. Some of this changes with hormones, other conditions like thyroid or adrenal gland issues can lead to a more reddish skin, older women sometimes get more reddish skin color after menopause. Also good skin care, protection against UV light and maybe at some point a skin resurfacing (CO2 Laser or deep chemical peel) to completely smoothen the skin may help.
I think some more can be done at the nose - maybe an alarplasty.
Not sure if cheek implants or fat grafts to the cheeks have been diskussed - these can give the face a bit more feminine definition.
It seems that a neck lift and maybe also a face lift was alsready in the simulation? The neck lift is in any case quite crucial to make you look more feminine. I would not skip that. Women usually have less bulky necks than men and in my opinion most women have thinner skin, so the bones of the jaw and cheeks are more visible than in men - this can change with hormones over a long time, or maybe if fat and muscles play a role, some fat removal or botox to reduce muscles may help.
Yes skin rejuvenation is on my list either deep peel or lazer or maybe both
The surgeon from Olmec recommended to do skin rejuvenation after FFS, first FFS then a full face/ neck lift also recommended cheek implants too
Alarplasty looks interesting ,
how long does one have to wait after FFS to do face lift?
Does anyone have the images of FFS Simulations and images of the "real" results? It would be interesting to see the suggested outcome and the real results.
That would be an amazing help!
Quote from: DanielleBasel on September 10, 2017, 03:44:29 AM
Does anyone have the images of FFS Simulations and images of the "real" results? It would be interesting to see the suggested outcome and the real results.
That would be an amazing help!
Seriously- I would REALLY love to find something like this, and I've looked but can't find much of anything.
Quote from: Colleen_definitely on September 04, 2017, 09:48:06 AM
I can't wait for mine to show up. Hopefully I'm next!
Well looking at your avatar .....you will look amazing... Lucky you 😊
I hope you post them
Quote from: Lexira on September 10, 2017, 02:42:09 PM
Seriously- I would REALLY love to find something like this, and I've looked but can't find much of anything.
Yep... Absolutely same! That's why I asked here in this thread. Thanks for support.. :-D
Quote from: markie on September 11, 2017, 08:27:50 AM
Well looking at your avatar .....you will look amazing... Lucky you 😊
I hope you post them
Dermablend is a magical product. :laugh:
Thanks though. I'll see about posting at least some of them when she finishes up with my pics.
I use Portrait Pro and it's sculpt feature. Note that in the lower picture the nose is sculpted, the forehead shortened, the jaw line slimmed, the face smoothed simulating a face lift. Cheeks are more pronounced, and distance between lips and nose is shorter.
(//)
Quote from: DawnOday on September 11, 2017, 10:50:07 AM
I use Portrait Pro and it's sculpt feature. Note that in the lower picture the nose is sculpted, the forehead shortened, the jaw line slimmed, the face smoothed simulating a face lift. Cheeks are more pronounced, and distance between lips and nose is shorter.
(//)
It's quite amazing how a combo of small changes can add up to a subtle but noticable change
On the subject of wigs these are probably very expensive but appear to be the best you can get
I think it's the way I'm heading.... ie if one is willing to spend the $$$ on ffs then why skimp on the hair if you need it
Vacuum gripper wigs.... Human hair no tape no glue no hooks and you can feel the rain on your scalp and the breeze as well apparently can play sport in them too😄😄😄
https://vimeo.com/86078694
Quote from: DawnOday on September 11, 2017, 10:50:07 AM
I use Portrait Pro and it's sculpt feature. Note that in the lower picture the nose is sculpted, the forehead shortened, the jaw line slimmed, the face smoothed simulating a face lift. Cheeks are more pronounced, and distance between lips and nose is shorter.
Thank you so much for sharing your work with us... Love to see them and hope that they will motivate a lot of others to send in their VFFS results and the real results!
That is a simulation......
btw I started this thread for people who are interested in ffs simulations it was never intended to be real
want to see before and after go to the before and after thread the fact is it is an intensely personal decision
to be honest I dislike seeing my before photos... they do my head in.... but because others have been generous I decided to give something back as little as it may be
Maybe generate a post asking for before and after ffs sim vs end product surgery
Quote from: markie on September 12, 2017, 09:34:45 PM
That is a simulation......
btw I started this thread for people who are interested in ffs simulations it was never intended to be real
want to see before and after go to the before and after thread the fact is it is an intensely personal decision
to be honest I dislike seeing my before photos... they do my head in.... but because others have been generous I decided to give something back as little as it may be
Maybe generate a post asking for before and after ffs sim vs end product surgery
Yes... Totaly agree... I dislike my before photos as well... :D
And agree again... Like I wrote: I meant like you FFS Simulations (also called Virtual Facial Feminization Surgery, or simply VFFS).
Quote from: markie on September 12, 2017, 09:34:45 PM
That is a simulation......
btw I started this thread for people who are interested in ffs simulations it was never intended to be real
want to see before and after go to the before and after thread the fact is it is an intensely personal decision
to be honest I dislike seeing my before photos... they do my head in.... but because others have been generous I decided to give something back as little as it may be
Maybe generate a post asking for before and after ffs sim vs end product surgery
I know what you mean. I tried over a year a go. Only a handful of takers. But the ones that were brave enough to look beyond the present was to instill confidence. I had read. Confidence is a big factor in passing. At the time I was trying to give back too. illustrate to the others how it alters your look for comparison. Yes a simulation with a cheep piece of software. I don't know of any program that would not require a before but the requestor would be the one to send it to me. So if they say send it back, I would be a fool not to. I made no claim that this was Surgeon approved. Utilized Doctor approved software? No I described my software and it's capabilities. Nothing more, nothing less. I did not offer a service... Been there done that over a year ago. Good luck. You can get similar results with Photoshop but i don't have the skill yet to use it well, so the sliders make it much easier. Sorry to upset you. Not my intention.
Mmmm I know that feeling.... It's not nice ...only time will tell what sort of result I will get but this gives me some
comfort on the possibilities... in fact I did not start Hrt proper until I had got these back now I am on a full transition dose.... which is rocking my world ;D
Quote from: DawnOday on September 12, 2017, 10:34:26 PM
I know what you mean. I tried over a year a go. Only a handful of takers. But the ones that were brave enough to look into the future, the result of most of them was pretty dang pretty
Yes you are right about looking into the future..... I was really worried about what I would get back
Ive seen one? of your Sims.. very impressive
Quote from: DanielleBasel on September 10, 2017, 03:44:29 AM
Does anyone have the images of FFS Simulations and images of the "real" results? It would be interesting to see the suggested outcome and the real results.
That would be an amazing help!
Hi friends Maybe I can help you ...
See my alexandra virtual ffs before and after and my after ffs surgery
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi292.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fmm7%2Flipetc%2Flipetc003%2Fcatsd.jpg&hash=fca2deb6b9d5346a4cc0c9545eab0ea0616963e9) (http://s292.photobucket.com/user/lipetc/media/lipetc003/catsd.jpg.html)
Quote from: Brunaftc on September 18, 2017, 01:48:07 AM
Hi friends Maybe I can help you ...
See my alexandra virtual ffs before and after and my after ffs surgery
Dear Bruna
Thanks a lot!
That's exactly what I was looking for. And this first example supports my assumption... That VFFS is fine, but that it's so incredible difficult to predict the exact outcome because of so many factors, that it's may questionable.
Thank you so much and I hope there are even more to come from others as well!
And btw... The real outcome looks really great compared tp the prediction of the VFFS... :D
Cheers, Danielle
Hi Bruna thanks for sharing those.... Indeed the ffs is very subtle I. can see the changes in the before and after
Vfs the front profile shows the most I must say you very were feminne and attractive to begin with so only a light touch
Would be needed.. reality looks most in impressive 😊
Quote from: markie on September 19, 2017, 01:50:11 AM
Hi Bruna thanks for sharing those.... Indeed the ffs is very subtle I. can see the changes in the before and after
Vfs the front profile shows the most I must say you very were feminne and attractive to begin with so only a light touch
Would be needed.. reality looks most in impressive 😊
Thanks friend :)
I also found my after VFF not very consistent with the reality of after FFS
Mmm was it better or less? I hope I can get at least the end result of my Vfs if I could get better I wou be very happy anyway for me anything is better than how I look now 😁
Hi,
In another thread I posted pictures of my before after vFFS pics that were just done by Alexandra Hamer during my FT consultation in Marbella.
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,225421.msg2028908.html#msg2028908
Thanks for that.... Wow you look even better than the Vfs after how rewarding 😊
Here is a simple google search of before and after ffs pictures. https://www.google.com/search?q=ffs+before+and+after&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS718US718&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiU5b_T57bWAhVO82MKHWD7CfwQsAQIJw&biw=1292&bih=678
Quote from: markie on September 20, 2017, 10:33:50 PM
Mmm was it better or less? I hope I can get at least the end result of my Vfs if I could get better I wou be very happy anyway for me anything is better than how I look now 😁
Some parts was poor in vff , anothers, betters :)
Alexandra got mine back to me on Sunday and her assessment was basically "grind down your brow ridge and temporal ridge, and open the eyes with a minor orbit reduction. Hair transplants in the corners wouldn't hurt but it's minor so that one is optional." The nose tweak she did was merely to show how little effect it would have and that it was likely not going to be worth the pain. The lip lift was another optional that was demonstrated but she does not feel that it adds enough to be worth the pain or scar. (I definitely agree on the nose, but I kind of like the lip lift look. It might be a little too young of a look for somebody pushing 40 though)
So what we have here from left to right is the before (well, before with beard shadow removal for the front view because the one I sent her looked ROUGH as it was taken shortly after a laser treatment and I was inflamed) then hairline correction in the corners plus temporal ridge reduction and brow ridge reduction, then the same with a small lip lift and nose tip lift.
The really interesting thing for me is how she is very much against a hairline advancement for me, and after seeing these pictures I definitely agree. Dr. Dulin suggested doing one, but I think that's out of habit more than anything but I will insist on him not doing an advancement or I'll find another surgeon. I'm going to hold off on hair transplants in the corners as well as they are starting to fill in on their own already a little (remember these shots are from two months ago).
(https://i.imgur.com/Hqq7tIN.png)
Thanks Colleen ...wow you are very femme looking already do I see why she suggests just minor work. but it looks quite powerful and it may be even better for real... I like the lip lift too👍😊
btw what type of lazer are you using?
Thanks Markie. I definitely lucked out in many ways feature wise. Being told I looked like a girl while growing up running from gender dysphoria was pretty rough though.
My recipe for facial frying is a Lightsheer Duet diode laser run by a sadist. Actually she's wonderful but I have a pretty high pain tolerance and push her to crank up the juice.
M;mm I reckon it would have been ..still its in your favor now 😊
thanks i'll see if I can find one my area
Precisely zero complaints here about that now.
I bet 😉😀🌞