Having a micro penis is rare, and according to the Kinsey Institute for Research in Sex, Gender, and Reproduction, affects around 0.6 percent of the world's male population.
Wouldn't you know it. I would be one of the blessed 0.6 percent. Blessed? Not really. It's been a point of contention all my life. The statistics say I am more or less alone. But I was curious as another symptom of DES poisoning does anyone else have a micro penis,or had it removed? No not trying the macho thing in comparing sizes but rather trying to understand why I am me. At this point I am at the point of HRt that it just does not bother me any more but it would be nice to know, like being trans, I am not alone. I hope the subject is not too embarrassing to admit as I know acknowledging it might be intimidating. Thanks in advance
I'm 40, and to the best of my knowledge am not a victim of DES.
I am very small however (bottom 1.5% on size), though not officially 'micro'.
When I was younger I was conscious that I would never be able to satisfy anyone. But I did have a marriage that produced two wonderful children.
I was also born mildly intersex (intermediate hypospadia), the doctors performed two corrective surgeries before the age of 3, including a circumcision.
I've found my small size to be useful in transition; I've never been able to 'tuck', but have never really needed to either, a good pair of control knickers keeps stuff pretty smooth.
I've wondered many times if there is any physiological connection between my sexual development and my gender identity; I am 46XY.
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I'm 61 and was exposed to DES. My future vaginal canal is about 5.5" and my labia tissue is quite large but shrinking. Lol
Jessica
Megan Jessica Thank you for your comments. Megan I too, have two outstanding children. I am blessed beyond all hopes as they have become outstanding adults. It is still sort of immaculate conception to me. Like basketball where it dribbles on the rim before falling in. ::)
I was a DES baby but did not experience that symptom. Physically, that part of my body seems pretty normal to the best of my knowledge. The only external physical symptoms I have that I know of is pretty sparse body hair and an arm carrying angle typical of females, > 25 degrees.
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I had 0.75 inches of penile skin so I could not have the inverted penile method. ( Dr. McGinn tried to save the skin, it had no vascular support and it died. It was graphed in my vginal canal. When she removed it she held it up in the exam light, looked at it and said, it had no vascular support, puney, and put it in the trash). I am 13 months post op. Dr. McGinn did my surgery. I have another surgery April 4th with Dr. McGinn to lower my urethera ( it was inside me pretty deep from the operation and swelling), fix a small issue with my cliteral hood (small hole), remove a lot of scar tissue ( I did not have much scrotal tissue) and close off the bottom of my labial majora ( that is going to cut about 4 inches in diameter around the bottom half of the vaginal canal and reposition and make the labia majoria).
Dr. McGinn said, you know you are intersexed and have unique genitals, when I first saw her. One week after the operation she stitched me up. My sister is a Nurse and almost passed out. They closed off the vagina on each side. Dr. McGinn sat back and said to herself several times I did it. I was in the proceedure room in their office and she said now talk to me about what you know about your genitals. I told her that I always had an issue peeing. It took me a very long time. The hole was very small and on the under side of my glands penis. I had a UTI at age 12 and had an operation because the smallest pediatric cathiter was too big. They made another hole in front and closed off the bottom. Dr. McGinn said everything about your genitals and that area is unique. She showed me some things I had no knowledge others were made differently. I have a lot of fat in the area. SHe said females have that amount of fat. My scrotal graph lived. Dr. McGinn thought that it was going to die and she was going to have to use another graph.
Anyhow, I am on the 4th dot of the orange dillator, my goal is the 5th dot. I am almost in tears when I put the dilator in which is slow and always with another dilator before I use orange( when the scar tissue shrank at about 2 months I would have tears running down my face when I dilated). The large amount of scar tissue on the bottom on the vaginal canal is painful and I have a scar tissue ring. I was less than 4 inches when the operation was done. I think it was 3.75 inches. I was not allowed to push for 2 weeks when dilating and then I was shown how hard to push and after my 3 month check up. I could push hard.
I had an insey penis. It was always in so I could be in a bathing suit and there would be just the smallest dot showing, not a buldge, just a dot bump. My gonads were up most of the time. I was able to have a child after 6 years of marriage.
The last time I was with a guy I was in college. I picked him up at woodies in the gayborhood and we went to his place near by. After he was serviced he insisted on me. I refused several times and then I said ok. He took a look and said what is the use. I got dressed and left.
I am so incredably anxious to get my bottom finally fixed. When Dr. McGinn is done I will have a pretty awesone vagina. She has really supported me through all of this.
After 8 months on HRT I had no body hair and less arm hair that a cis woman.
I am pretty sure I was a DES baby. My equipment seemed, prior to HRT, to be in the normal range, though nothing to brag about. My external signs are sparse body hair, female pubic hair pattern and female digit ratio.
I saw a urologist a few months ago he knew I was MTF before we meet. As part of the examination he asked me to lower my panties when he looked he asked when I had surgery, I told him I'm still waiting to have it. I've always been small down there but since HRT everything has shrunk and retracted and is not visible beneath the hair .
I'm not intending to brag, but I was the opposite. My penis was ridiculously huge. People would freak out when I showed them it. After switching to hormone therapy, the size cut down to around 8 inches. I'm happy with that. I don't need people worrying about a python snooping around their back garden. The funny thing is, even after taking hormones, my penis was still bigger than my ex-boyfriend's penis. I could tell that made him feel very insecure.
xAmyX, at least you will have enough material when you have srs.
I'm a DES baby for sure and intersex. I didn't officially have a micro penis but it was barely 1.5 inches if that. Dr Bluebond-Langner took one look at me and said there wouldn't be enough material and she would have to do a skin graft. When I had my genital electrolysis at McGinn's Pappilon Center the nurse who injected a local took one look at me and asked when I had an orchi. I told her I hadn't and she was shocked and said that that I must be intersexed. My testicles just stayed up in there so I never really tucked and bathing suit were never a big issue pre-op.
After my GCS Dr Bluebond-Langner confirmed that I was intersex in that on the inside, the testes and everything was there, just not fully developed. However through skin grafts, she was able to get a little of 6" in depth and I've been able to maintain that so far and I'm on the 2nd largest dilator (green on my dilator kit with Orange bing the biggest.) She could not use most of my scrotum and barely had enough to form the labia. Even though I'm only 5½ weeks post op, I'm super thrilled with the results.
I had the hypospadia, but I was 10 weeks premature too. Penis is average, but looks small due to my size.
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Quote from: Sydney_NYC on December 09, 2017, 05:52:00 PM
I'm a DES baby for sure and intersex. I didn't officially have a micro penis but it was barely 1.5 inches if that. Dr Bluebond-Langner took one look at me and said there wouldn't be enough material and she would have to do a skin graft. When I had my genital electrolysis at McGinn's Pappilon Center the nurse who injected a local took one look at me and asked when I had an orchi. I told her I hadn't and she was shocked and said that that I must be intersexed. My testicles just stayed up in there so I never really tucked and bathing suit were never a big issue pre-op.
After my GCS Dr Bluebond-Langner confirmed that I was intersex in that on the inside, the testes and everything was there, just not fully developed. However through skin grafts, she was able to get a little of 6" in depth and I've been able to maintain that so far and I'm on the 2nd largest dilator (green on my dilator kit with Orange bing the biggest.) She could not use most of my scrotum and barely had enough to form the labia. Even though I'm only 5½ weeks post op, I'm super thrilled with the results.
I am so happy that everything is working out. I envy you. And everyone else who has sought their true identities.
In one of my encounters the woman looked down, started laughing, and asked if I was deformed. At the time I remember saying "yes" but that was 20 years before I knew why.
One of my early signs that I was trans happened in elementary school. The school doctor examined me and after I left the room, I overheard the doctor tell the nurse that I had a micro penis. Although I was by no means big, it turned out I didn't have a micro penis. The thing is, instead of it making me feel bad, it made me feel good. I liked the idea since I didn't want the thing anyway.
Moni
Call me miss stupid but what is DES! How would I know if I was intersex as I have little body hair very petite & most certainty has a micro
Diethylstilbestrol (DES) is a synthetic estrogen that was developed to supplement a woman's natural estrogen production. First prescribed by physicians in 1938 for women who experienced miscarriages or premature deliveries, DES was originally considered effective and safe for both the pregnant woman and the developing baby.
https://www.cdc.gov/des/consumers/about/index.html
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Quote from: coldHeart on December 10, 2017, 05:46:00 PM
Call me miss stupid but what is DES! How would I know if I was intersex as I have little body hair very petite & most certainty has a micro
I am not going to call you that because your not. The thread hasn't been active much lately so it's very likely you just missed it. HugeE is a great resource on this and has studied the subject a great deal. In any case, when you have some time you might want to look at the DES sons thread (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,84224.0.html).
I have no idea if I was exposed to DES or not (even if my mother is still alive I have no interest in speaking to her, plus my father is useless and kept no records), though there is a chance I was. I was a little over 7" pre-HRT. I've no doubt shrunken a little.
Thanks dena, interesting read.
Quote from: Sarah_P on December 11, 2017, 10:01:12 AM
I have no idea if I was exposed to DES or not (even if my mother is still alive I have no interest in speaking to her, plus my father is useless and kept no records), though there is a chance I was. I was a little over 7" pre-HRT. I've no doubt shrunken a little.
DES was banned in the US by the FDA in 1972/73. Prior to that, it was even in prenatal vitamins and a lot of pregnant women were given DES this way and didn't even know it. It also caused a lot of problem with cervical and ovarian cancer in cis girls who where exposed to DES in the womb. Not every DES son turns out to be a transgender woman later, but it's a much higher amount than the general population.
Quote from: DawnOday on December 10, 2017, 02:36:28 PM
I am so happy that everything is working out. I envy you. And everyone else who has sought their true identities.
In one of my encounters the woman looked down, started laughing, and asked if I was deformed. At the time I remember saying "yes" but that was 20 years before I knew why.
Thank you. I feel very lucky everything worked out. Now if we all understood this earlier, life would have been much simpler.
DES was "unlabeled for use in miscarriage prevention" by the FDA in 1971. It was not banned for human use by the FDA until 2000.
In the 1970s the FDA simply issued their official bulletin in their monthly mailings to doctors offices.
I am likely a victim of DES. All I know is my mom took a prescription given to her by her OB. He was an older doctor at the time. I do not have a micro penis. I do have other features that seem to be even less likely. Somewhere between 7 and 12 weeks or so the bones develop in certain patterns. Testosterone causes the sacroiliac joint and the knees and elbows to form slightly different profiles in males. Somehow I missed that step. No one has a good explaination. DES is still likely.
The penis and exterior genitals form male when exposed to DHT. Regular testosterone will not do the job. In my case my size is all appropriate but aside from a split penile raphe which is not that terribly uncommon, I also had a not fully fused perinial raphe. Instead of fused and a raised ridge I had a kind of soft divit that when I was young hurt to touch kind of like a fresh scar does. Now it is all skin but just sort of a wide darker strip with some red lines. I know too much info right. ;) I also seem to have a gap in my pelvic floor muscles in the perinium.
As much as I want SRS, now is not the time to have a surgery slow me down. Perhaps in the future. I'd like to see the technology improve a bit. I'm not the least bit ecstatic by how they look in 99% of photos I've reviewed.
Quote from: xAmyX on December 12, 2017, 05:20:35 PM
As much as I want SRS, now is not the time to have a surgery slow me down. Perhaps in the future. I'd like to see the technology improve a bit. I'm not the least bit ecstatic by how they look in 99% of photos I've reviewed.
Don't forget that most of the picts online are when they are still healing. It takes up to a year for everything to settle down to the final look and those pictures you never see online hardly ever.
Honey, I've watched a lot of post op trans porn. I know what it looks like fully healed. ;) Personally, I have not been able to get aroused by it's looks. No matter who did the operation. Pre op trans girls turn me on SO much more!
Naturally, I want to look like what I'm attracted to, this way I can be attracted to myself. *Cackle*
Don't get me wrong, I'm pansexual and love vaginas too, but only natal female vaginas. Neovaginas do not cut it for me. My eyes can see every little detail and clearly identify it as a wound, which is not going to turn me on. If anything, it's going to do quite the opposite. Doesn't mean I wouldn't date a post op trans woman though. Life isn't solely about sex. The person matters most to me. Just grammatically showing that it's lower on my list of preferences as far as genitalia goes.
A post op trans man's genitalia being two steps lower than that.
For me: trans female penis > natal female vagina > natal male penis > trans female vagina > trans male vagina > trans male penis (if you can call it that). Everyone has their own preferences. These are mine.
As far as human beings go. I'll love everyone equally. I'll hug, kiss, love, and cherish anyone that shows affection for me, when I desire to show affection myself. That's where the real bonding is. The quickest way to my heart is making me feel important. That's when my heart starts to melt, and I'm forever bound to you until you set me free.
Although people have done nothing but take advantage of me because of that, and now I'm building up a tougher wall.
I hate when someone goes out of their way to make me massively fall in love with them, only to then break up with me because of my love for them. F#@%ing A@#holes! If you don't want such powerful love from me, either do what I would prefer, f#@$ off and not date me at all, or the next best thing, bring me into your life at a rate you can handle, and if that happens to not be enough for me personally, I will be the one to leave. I hate to do it, but I have to learn how to defy my own heart in such cases, because if I don't, that person is just going to leave me anyways.
Better now than later!
Sorry for going a bit off topic everyone. Cary on.
I am also a DES baby. Last time I researched it they had only studies on DES daughters, incomplete info on DES sons. My mother and I believed that had something to do with why I tended toward the feminine. It was introduced about 1949, but by 1952 they knew it did not prevent miscarriages, which it was originally proposed to do. They also knew it would cause birth defects. They still kept it on the market until 1972. So now we have baby boomers who have children that have so many defects they cannot function in society. To my knowledge my penis was average before hrt, but. I know some men that are huge, so who knows? Merry Christmas!
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Thanks Deborah. I stand corrected on the origin date. I got the info in 1985 from a website of a DES support group on a pamphlett my mom left in her drawer before she died. I actually printed out all the pertinent articles from the website. I think it is lost now. As so much of my life is now.
I would appreciate any response to my intro. It really tore me up writing it.
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DES is not the end all be all solution to ->-bleeped-<-. Most of us assume because of the time we were born and symptoms we may have. I for example besides the micro penis, I also had late descending testicles. On the defective/underdeveloped banner I also have a deformed heart, Congestive heart failure, arteriosclerosis, myopathy, depression, diabetes. Or about 7 of 10 symptoms of DES poisoning. The other thing I use to come to this conclusion beside the length of time I have been questioning, is that I was married to my dream girl. She was smart, beautiful, driven, a boys dream and nympho. When we dated we were together for a couple nights a week. Being married is much different and I had never lived on my own. I could not overcome my secret desires no matter how hard I tried. And the sex was different. There is a certain element of danger when you are making love in the back seat of the car while parked at Belmont Shore, or the drive in. But quite different when sharing a bed. As much as I wanted to, I could not. I ended up seeking out someone who did not care about sex as much. I have been married to this person for the last 35 years. We have two kids. I never stopped thinking about being a woman and it was finally coming between us. We addressed the ghosts in the room and we are all the better for it. I wish I could find the medical records to affirm the poisoning but the government was corrupt long before now and they protected the pharmaceutical companies after the payouts to the women who got cancer. Besides If DES was the cause, then Evangelicals would not have a leg to stand on. http:\\DESACTION.ORG (//http://http:%5C%5CDESACTION.ORG) Des Sons I wish I had proof positive but I do have a preponderance of evidence.
Quote from: KITTYCINDERS on December 25, 2017, 09:31:31 PM
I am also a DES baby. Last time I researched it they had only studies on DES daughters, incomplete info on DES sons. My mother and I believed that had something to do with why I tended toward the feminine. It was introduced about 1949, but by 1952 they knew it did not prevent miscarriages, which it was originally proposed to do. They also knew it would cause birth defects. They still kept it on the market until 1972. So now we have baby boomers who have children that have so many defects they cannot function in society. To my knowledge my penis was average before hrt, but. I know some men that are huge, so who knows? Merry Christmas!
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If you look at the diagram in this article under "Male Genital Development":
https://www.hormonesmatter.com/maternal-des-exposure-intersex-development-males/
it shows how micropenis occurs. Penile development is split into two phases. The first takes place during weeks 7 to 12 after conception, and is when the labia fuse together to form the scrotum and the shaft of the penis, and the urethral opening migrates to the tip of the penis. If something goes wrong with your androgen production during this stage, you develop hypospadias (and in more severe cases, labioscrotal fusion might not occur, so you're born with two labia and an internal pouch rather than a scrotum).
The second stage of penile development takes place during the remainder of the pregnancy (labeled "external genital growth" on that diagram), and is where the penis elongates. During that time, the testicles also descend from the abdomen, via the inguinal canal, into the scrotum, following which the inguinal canal is supposed to close up (although in my case, on one side it didn't, causing a hydrocele to form). If something goes wrong with your androgen production during this time, you end up with a penis that is shorter than it would otherwise have been (in extreme cases resulting in a micropenis). You can also end up with undescended testicles, or problems such as hydroceles or inguinal hernias because your inguinal canals didn't close up properly.
Quote from: xAmyX on December 09, 2017, 02:25:12 PM
I'm not intending to brag, but I was the opposite. My penis was ridiculously huge. People would freak out when I showed them it. After switching to hormone therapy, the size cut down to around 8 inches. I'm happy with that. I don't need people worrying about a python snooping around their back garden. The funny thing is, even after taking hormones, my penis was still bigger than my ex-boyfriend's penis. I could tell that made him feel very insecure.
Excessive amounts of LOL for his masculine insecurity. His ex-girlfriend has a bigger penis than him.
It also occurred to me that a conversation about micropenises might be a good thing for a trans guy to read? Depending on whether the whole "clearing the fly" thing causes dysphoria to him......