I am transgender. Like almost everybody else, I have a strong and enduring gender identity. Unlike almost everyone else, my gender identity is
opposite my physical sex. I doubt that other transpersons will find anything unusual in my story. Anyone else, though, might find it unbelievable and if so, I can hardly blame them -- gender dysphoria is a mystery to me, too.
This goes back as far as I can remember -- in my case, before kindergarten. And now, sixty years later, nothing has changed. Now, like then, people expect me to express myself as a male. But I've
never had any interest in playing that part; I don't have it in me. What I do have within is a female self and
she needs to be expressed.
My worst experiences with gender dysphoria were back when I was entering puberty. The thought of having an adult male body made me sick to my stomach. (I wanted to go through puberty, just not
that one.) As far as I knew, I was the only person
ever to feel the way I felt. In those days, there was only one choice: to be carried along by life, deeper and deeper into manhood, making sure all the while that my true self... my female self,
never showed. Confiding in anyone, or asking for help, was inconceivable.
A few years later, I ran across the concept of transvestitism. Not surprisingly, considering the times, it was portrayed as a bizarre mental disorder - shameful and disgusting. Whatever. But what could I conclude other than that I, too, was disgusting? In any case, the distinction was lost on me at the time, but my issue was different: gender
identity. What I wanted... what I still want... was to live my life through a female body. That, and to have the same freedom to express myself as anyone else of female gender, including through clothing (which sounds natural to me, not disgusting.)
As an adult I worked in male-dominated fields, everyone around me exhibiting, and championing, male behavior, and expecting me to as well. For a long time, I put a great deal of energy, enthusiasm and hard work into my career. But as the years passed, I grew tired of trying to flourish in that culture. Gender dysphoria certainly did not ruin my career. But the dysphoria did keep it from being as successful and enjoyable as it could have been. No surprise there.
How strange it is for one's gender and sex to be different at all, let alone
completely different. I know that most people would say that for me to assert myself as female is to ignore reality. But from my perspective, expecting me to play the part of a male, and to come alive and to feel fulfillment by doing so, is to ignore reality. And to almost anyone else, this sounds entirely psychological in nature. I see it, though, as a physical problem: I am female, so why is my body male?
Sometimes I feel stupid for this mattering to me so much. But it does matter. It's about being able to be genuine, and being able to convey something of my soul into the world. It's about feeling like a part of the world, on the one hand, or feeling like some kind of alien, painfully out of place, on the other.
My gender dysphoria has been remarkably consistent over the course of my life, being among both my earliest memories and my most recent thoughts. Being retired now, I no longer feel compelled to hide my female self; instead, I want to openly embrace and explore her. I want to enjoy being her. And ideally, I'd like to experience what it's like for my physical sex and my gender to be the same, like it is for almost everyone else.
My wife, known in these forums as @Moonflower , has known about this for many years- almost the entire time that we've known each other. Her full support has never been in doubt. She is the strongest and freest of spirits. She is my Shadowfax, my Demian. Bob Dylan could have been thinking of her when he wrote:
Quote
"In another lifetime she must have owned the world,
or been faithfully wed to some righteous king who wrote psalms beside moonlit streams."
Hi, BlueStar!
Welcome to Susan's Place.
Thank you for joining us. and telling us your story. Your wife,
@Moonflower, in the short time she has been a member, has already become loved and respected by many of us. You are very lucky to have her!
I see that you have already posted in the Introductions forum. :)
Here is some information that we like to share with new members:
Things that you should read
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@BlueStar, welcome to the family! Yes, your story to the rest of the world is very unusual, but within this family it is very normal, which in my oppinion is an extremely comforting thing. Your wife is Moonflower? I was just reading her recent posts about the lastest trans short film, thanking her for posting the thread. It is a beautiful movie. Again, welcome!
Hi BlueStar :icon_wave:
Welcome to Susan's Place :) Glad to have you here, join on in the fun
Hugs
V M
Quote from: BlueStar on November 19, 2018, 07:09:59 PMBeing retired now, I no longer feel compelled to hide my female self;
Welcome BlueStar! I too am
RETIRED and have been in some degree of active transition for the last 40 years! While divorced 8 for reasons other than obvious "SO" and I are once again together sharing
*grandkids* wishing you and Moonflower the best!
Quote from: lol achm!Warning - while you were typing 3 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Hi BlueStar,
I am so happy to see you introduce yourself. A warm welcome coming your way. Your story rings familiar, even the part where you feel silly for this to matter so much. I feel that sometimes. It is so important to who we are though. I hope the realization of you living as your genuine self will come quickly for you. Oh, and I hope you will let us here be a part of it. ;D
Say hi to Moonflower for me!
Moni
Welcome Bluestar! It's exciting to have you join. Moonflower has been very encouraging to both those of us in transition as well as the SO.
I hope you are able to find the support you need!
Lacy
Hello BlueStar and welcome to Susans.
I understand and appreciate all you say.
Again I learned of transvestitism before the term transsexual or transgender, my career was to some degree affected by my being transgender and I am now retired.
I wish you well on your journey.
Hugs
Pamela
Hi Bluestar
welcome to Susans's glad you found us and made your first post...always the hardest one!!
Sounds to me like you have made some of the toughest connections already. Being able to accept themselves as female/male is something many take a long to accept. I refused for many years myself.
I have had the pleasure of meeting your lovely partner Moonflower already and can see from her own postings how supportive of you she is.
Take care
Liz
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
@KathyLauren @gracefulhat @V M @Kiera @HappyMoni @RealLacy @pamelatransuk @LizK
Thank you all for your kind and supportive comments, and for giving me a wonderful feeling of acceptance and respect- that same feeling that I had when my trans counselor asked me the name I'd like him to call me (which is Beth).
Thanks for making a difference in my life and for encouraging me on my journey. I wish I'd had friends like you throughout my life!
Beth,
Yea, I love to be able to talk to people with their real names! As for having friends on here, I have gained so much from having friends on here. As for them, well most of the time they read my posts, scratch their heads with a quizzical look on their face, and at least tolerate me. One day I'll learn to behave. There is definitely friendship to be had here, and good advice, and the occasional tear or two. Again, so glad you are here!
Beth, welcome to Susan's Place. It is always great to see new members! I think I have responded to a few posts from
@Moonflower . I first joined in March of 2017, the day I started HRT. I chose a good user name to start with, and it eventually became my legal name (first and middle). My wife also recently joined. To make it easy to connect the dots, she goes by
@Susan_Rose . Many of us started threads we use as journals, it makes it easy for our friends at Susan's Place to keep up with our progress. Mine is here: https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,233104.msg2076844.html#msg2076844
You will find a lot of good information on these forums, some laughter, and some tears, but we are all here to help one another. We all wish you the best in your journey.
Love always -- Jessica Rose
Beth,
Good to have you and your Moonflower aboard this vessel with us. I am one of those that has started a thread to recount Stevi's Saga. I am, also, one of those blessed with a wife who managed to make the transition with me. We are here for you to help with the bad times and celebrate with you when it is good.
Here's to the good!
Stevi
Hi Beth,
I very much could relate to your life story. Thank you for sharing it. I too struggled trying understand why I'm female but have the wrong body. When I was 13 or 14 I became obsessed with the why, spending months searching family records and photos trying to find something. Finally realizing that the why had no meaning and I am who I am as difficult as that can be.
I'm glad, like me, you are able to reveal your true self in life even if it took a long time.
All the best
Kath
@RealLacy @V M @Alaskan Danielle @Dietlind @Emma1017 @HappyMoni @Jessica_Rose @Stevi @kathb31
Thanks for all of your encouragement and advice. I appreciate all of it!
I'm realizing that coming out as transgender, and beginning the transition, are full of surprising and wonderful side-effects! For me, the best of these are: emerging from the shell that I'd built-up over the course of my adult life... interacting with and trusting people again... having good friends again... regaining the sense that I can communicate with others... and especially, feeling free, once more, to grow as a human being.
The thing is, over the course of my adult life, I'd become so withdrawn. When people would strike up a conversation with me, I could not respond with stereotypically male behavior. They would often look a bit confused. I would imagine that their concept of who I was, and my concept of who I was, were light years apart. And maybe they sensed that I was hiding something. But without feeling free to say anything about the real me - which was off the table - there seemed no way out.
It's occurring to me that I could never have enjoyed retirement, or accomplished any of those things that I'd always dreamed of doing at this time, without, first and foremost, telling my story to the people around me, and beginning the transition.
I look forward to learning more about your stories,
Beth
Hello again
I agree your latest post to a tee. It describes me perfectly.
I was so withdrawn and too much into privacy bordering on seclusion. I strongly suspect others thought I had something to hide or that there was something wrong or both.
Now I feel liberated, wishing to transition in 2019 and simultaneously and subsequently to enjoy my retirement.
Hugs
Pamela
Beth,
I relate to your self imposed isolation. I always avoided get togethers with other hetero couples because I knew I would be paired up with the guy for conversation at some point. I could fake my way through it, but it wasn't comfortable. I would not be surprised if you get much more social. I will now arrange get togethers. My partner is floored by this. Once you are comfortable in your own skin being social is easier.
Moni
Beth dear, yours is a beautiful post. We have so much in common. I sought help for my gender dysphoria fifty years ago, there were just no answers then. it just added another line on my mental illness file. But as previously mentioned Bob Dylan said "the times they are a'changing!" We are now able to benefit from the new medical and psychological understanding of what it means to be transgender. So ten years ago I began what you are doing, the journey of self acceptance. Over a year ago at 70 years old I began my transition of putting my body into alignment with my soul and living my life as the woman I always was inside. While there have been some painful sufferings of rejection, like you I have a totally supporting and encouraging wife. It makes a difference to transition with your "back" covered by love.
HiYa Beth,
I thought I should go ahead and reply here. As you know, I've been corresponding with your wife via PM. I'm sure she's been sharing, yes? >:( ... ;D
I mentioned in my first PM to Moonflower that I sent this post-link to my wife to make sure she didn't miss it. It's a very well-written with a basic summary that is not only personal but applicable to many. It should be stickied as required reading.
Take care
Faith
Quote from: BlueStar on November 19, 2018, 07:09:59 PM
How strange it is for one's gender and sex to be different at all, let alone completely different. I know that most people would say that for me to assert myself as female is to ignore reality. But from my perspective, expecting me to play the part of a male, and to come alive and to feel fulfillment by doing so, is to ignore reality. And to almost anyone else, this sounds entirely psychological in nature. I see it, though, as a physical problem: I am female, so why is my body male?
It goes back to before you were even born.
There's a popular misconception that the sex you develop as is determined by X and Y chromosomes. In fact, all being XX or XY does is determine whether you develop ovaries or testicles, everything from that point forward is driven by hormones. More specifically, in the presence of testicular hormones, a foetus develops as male. In the absence of those hormones, it develops as female instead (ovarian hormones aren't actually necessary for female development to occur, female development is what always happens if there are no testicular hormones present). This is easily demonstrated by a condition called Swyer's syndrome, in which the testicles of a genetically male (XY) foetus fail to develop. People with the condition look female at birth, and they grow up to look and behave just like ordinary women. Often, the condition isn't even spotted until, as teenagers, they fail to start menstruating.
The genitals undergo their development from week 7 to week 12 after conception, so by the end of week 12, you already have male or female genitals, something which can no longer change (unless you have GRS later in life of course!). The brain is different though. The early stages of brain development involve very rapid cell division (to produce the enormous numbers of cells that will ultimately make up the brain), and the migration of those cells to where their final place in the brain will be (which is often far distant from where they formed). Those early steps don't appear to have any major sex differences, so hormones during that part of brain development don't make any difference to the eventual sex of the brain.
By about week 16, the very first cells have reached their final position in the brain. Once in position, they start to grow the nerve axons that will permanently connect them to the other brain cells they're supposed to be interacting with. More and more cells reach their final position and begin to grow their permanent connections to other cells, and by week 21, the cell migration stage of brain development is over, and the main task (ongoing for the remainder of prenatal development) is the growth of nerve axons and dendrites (the "wires" that connect up brain cells), and synaptogenesis, or creating the junctions between those wires. During that time, a process of programmed cell death takes place as well, in which brain cells surplus to requirements are removed. This also appears to be the time when hormones have the biggest impact in determining the sex of your brain, so I'm guessing that there's a male way and a female way of connecting up brain tissue, which are subtly different at the microscopic level. It may be that different cells are removed during the programmed cell death stage if high levels of testosterone are present (testosterone is the main testicular hormone that drives male development), than if there's little or no testosterone there.
So, what appears to make people MTF transgender is that their testicles developed as normal and, to begin with, were producing enough testosterone for male genital development to occur. However, things then went south, and their testosterone production slowed or stopped altogether, so that during the crucial week 16 to birth period for determining whether the brain gets wired up along male or female lines, there wasn't enough testosterone present for the brain to be wired up as male. Instead, it got the patterning that happens by default, the female kind.
As to what can cause testosterone production to go wrong, any of the conventional genetic causes of intersex can. However, so can environmental factors, for instance exposure to external estrogens. Unfortunately, doctors didn't realise this, and for several decades during the mid 20th century, they were giving pregnant women high doses of an artificial estrogen called DES, a drug which acts as a chemical castration agent in men. Many of us in the older age bracket either know or suspect we were exposed to that drug. My own view is that the effect probably isn't limited to just estrogens though, and any hormones or other drugs that interfere with testosterone production in adult men will, if they're administered during pregnancy, run the risk of producing MTF transgender babies. This is a hugely controversial thing to say of course, because an awful lot of hormones and other drugs used in medicine do interfere with testosterone production!
Anyway, hopefully that answers your question. You actually are the person you perceive yourself to be, someone whose body developed along male lines, but whose brain developed along female lines instead.
@HughE ,
Thank you for your thought-provoking comment. It's amazing how the scientific understanding of human development has become so much more sophisticated during my lifetime. Obviously, it's not the simple story that we were taught in high school anymore. Thanks for describing it so well.
I was born in the mid-50's. My mother was at the end of her child-bearing years, thus significantly older than most women when they give birth. My parents and their friends are long deceased, so the details of what happened back then are lost in time. If there was a story to tell - anything unusual about my early development - I don't think they would have told me; that wasn't the kind of thing they were particularly open about. But it did appear to me that I was the last of the couple hundred boys in my high school class to go through puberty. Even then, it seems to have taken a mysterious prescription to kick it off.
If being transgender is a flaw- an accident of biology- then maybe it was actually a fortuitous one for me. I like to think that living life as a transwoman, while awkward and uncomfortable, has put me in a unique position to see and to blend the best male and female qualities, and to come up with something better than each alone often experiences.
That said, I'm still anxious to transition!
<edited to fix typo>
Hello and welcome Beth,
I love your succinct and well written introduction that obviously resonates with more than a few of us. I also want to add a bit to your question. Why is being female not the same as being feminine? I know myself to be a girl and female person. We who recognize diversity as reality know some cis men who seem to exhibit the most feminine of expression or traits!
Being part of the queer community all my life there are any number of gay men I know that can do drag or act and appear far more feminine than some of us in trans world. They remain men. Fascinating and fun and sometimes perplexing too. What is being female and what is feminine? We are some of the best explorers i can imagine for answering such questions......
Quote from: Tessa James on November 25, 2018, 02:31:40 PM
Why is being female not the same as being feminine?
What is being female and what is feminine?
Hi Tessa. I am intrigued by what you wrote, so I couldn't resist showing up at my sweetheart's thread to share my thoughts about the questions that you ask. May I explore them with you and others here?
My first knee-jerk reaction is to say that I am a female who is often not feminine, meaning that I often don't meet my understanding of society's expectations of me. And sometimes I do. I can choose to be feminine or not, but I always feel like I am a female, and expect others to perceive me as female. As I faced the questions that Beth was asking about herself regarding her identity, I had similar questions about my self, and concluded that I am a female. When I look in a mirror, I see a woman. When I close my eyes, I feel like a woman. When I fill out a form, I feel honest when I state that I am a woman. My female body parts all seem to fit me well, and I feel like I belong in them (even though my feet are too big, my arms are too long, my nails break too easily... but I digress).
My expressions of my feminine or non-feminine self vary widely. If I could take an "average reading", it might be near the middle of a feminine to masculine spectrum, but I still see myself as a female, so I would probably land a little on the female side of the middle. I attribute most of my androgyny to the freedom that women currently have for expressing ourselves in many ways that men are not allowed, such as wearing business pant suits to evening gowns to overalls; heels to flats; makeup or not; enjoying every color of the rainbow; reading romance novels to engineering textbooks; build muscles or curves... In my geographic location, and in the culture that is surrounding me, I can be feminine or masculine, and no one accuses me of fooling them, unlike men. I can even use a Men's Room when the line is too long for the Ladies' Room, and no one gets upset. I feel so privileged as a woman.
So, what do I mean when I use the word "feminine"? I hate to say it, but it might be entirely dependent on my understanding of what other people expect of a female, which they would not allow for a male. Examples include, but are not limited to evening gowns, heels, makeup, certain colors, certain books, and certain physical characteristics. So, I think that "feminine" is a sociological term. I can't find any meaning for it in my head right now that comes from within me. I can't think of anything that makes me feel more or less like a female. Simply, I think that "feminine" is dictated by our culture's demands from females, as opposed to what it demands from our males.
So, Tessa, I seem to be concluding that "female" comes from within me, and "feminine" comes from outside of me. If this is the case, then I'm not surprised that you and I know some men who appear far more feminine than many cis or trans women, but they remain men. After all, differences between members of a group of people are far greater than the differences between "normal" representatives.
On the other hand, my dear Beth (aka BlueStar) feels more honest when she is expressing her feminine characteristics. So, does "feminine" have some intrinsic power? Is society all wrong (or all right) about what it defines as feminine? Do feminine "things" put us in touch with our female selves? Of course we say a resounding, "Yes!" No?
Quote from: HughE on November 24, 2018, 11:47:19 AM
It goes back to before you were even born.
There's a popular misconception that the sex you develop as is determined by X and Y chromosomes. In fact, all being XX or XY does is determine whether you develop ovaries or testicles, everything from that point forward is driven by hormones. More specifically, in the presence of testicular hormones, a foetus develops as male. In the absence of those hormones, it develops as female instead (ovarian hormones aren't actually necessary for female development to occur, female development is what always happens if there are no testicular hormones present). This is easily demonstrated by a condition called Swyer's syndrome, in which the testicles of a genetically male (XY) foetus fail to develop. People with the condition look female at birth, and they grow up to look and behave just like ordinary women. Often, the condition isn't even spotted until, as teenagers, they fail to start menstruating.
The genitals undergo their development from week 7 to week 12 after conception, so by the end of week 12, you already have male or female genitals, something which can no longer change (unless you have GRS later in life of course!). The brain is different though. The early stages of brain development involve very rapid cell division (to produce the enormous numbers of cells that will ultimately make up the brain), and the migration of those cells to where their final place in the brain will be (which is often far distant from where they formed). Those early steps don't appear to have any major sex differences, so hormones during that part of brain development don't make any difference to the eventual sex of the brain.
By about week 16, the very first cells have reached their final position in the brain. Once in position, they start to grow the nerve axons that will permanently connect them to the other brain cells they're supposed to be interacting with. More and more cells reach their final position and begin to grow their permanent connections to other cells, and by week 21, the cell migration stage of brain development is over, and the main task (ongoing for the remainder of prenatal development) is the growth of nerve axons and dendrites (the "wires" that connect up brain cells), and synaptogenesis, or creating the junctions between those wires. During that time, a process of programmed cell death takes place as well, in which brain cells surplus to requirements are removed. This also appears to be the time when hormones have the biggest impact in determining the sex of your brain, so I'm guessing that there's a male way and a female way of connecting up brain tissue, which are subtly different at the microscopic level. It may be that different cells are removed during the programmed cell death stage if high levels of testosterone are present (testosterone is the main testicular hormone that drives male development), than if there's little or no testosterone there.
So, what appears to make people MTF transgender is that their testicles developed as normal and, to begin with, were producing enough testosterone for male genital development to occur. However, things then went south, and their testosterone production slowed or stopped altogether, so that during the crucial week 16 to birth period for determining whether the brain gets wired up along male or female lines, there wasn't enough testosterone present for the brain to be wired up as male. Instead, it got the patterning that happens by default, the female kind.
As to what can cause testosterone production to go wrong, any of the conventional genetic causes of intersex can. However, so can environmental factors, for instance exposure to external estrogens. Unfortunately, doctors didn't realise this, and for several decades during the mid 20th century, they were giving pregnant women high doses of an artificial estrogen called DES, a drug which acts as a chemical castration agent in men. Many of us in the older age bracket either know or suspect we were exposed to that drug. My own view is that the effect probably isn't limited to just estrogens though, and any hormones or other drugs that interfere with testosterone production in adult men will, if they're administered during pregnancy, run the risk of producing MTF transgender babies. This is a hugely controversial thing to say of course, because an awful lot of hormones and other drugs used in medicine do interfere with testosterone production!
Anyway, hopefully that answers your question. You actually are the person you perceive yourself to be, someone whose body developed along male lines, but whose brain developed along female lines instead.
Thank you Hugh for such a detailed scientific explanation.
I am sure you are correct in your summary both on the general reason for being born transgender (para 2-5) and on the subject of DES (para 6).
Hugs
Pamela
Quote from: BlueStar on November 25, 2018, 12:25:59 PM
@HughE ,
Thank you for your thought-provoking comment. It's amazing how the scientific understanding of human development has become so much more sophisticated during my lifetime. Obviously, it's not the simple story that we were taught in high school anymore. Thanks for describing it so well.
I was born in the mid-50's. My mother was at the end of her child-bearing years, thus significantly older than most women when they give birth. My parents and their friends are long deceased, so the details of what happened back then are lost in time. If there was a story to tell - anything unusual about my early development - I don't think they would have told me; that wasn't the kind of thing they were particularly open about. But it did appear to me that I was the last of the couple hundred boys in my high school class to go through puberty. Even then, it seems to have taken a mysterious prescription to kick it off.
If being transgender is a flaw- an accident of biology- then maybe it was actually a fortuitous one for me. I like to think that living life as a transwoman, while awkward and uncomfortable, has put me in a unique position to see and to blend the best male and female qualities, and to come up with something better than each alone often experiences.
That said, I'm still anxious to transition!
<edited to fix typo>
Hello again BlueStar
We have yet more in common.
1. My mother gave birth to me aged 33.
2. I was born in 1955.
3. I was late going through puberty which I quite frankly dreaded before and during it.
4. My mother and father never told me anything about my birth apart from being a couple of days late.
My mother regularly told me that I had told her I wished to a girl aged 2 in 1957 which I cannot remember saying as too young. However I do remember telling my grandmother I wished to a girl aged 4 in 1959!
Hugs to you Beth and to Moonstar
Pamela
@Tessa ,
I've never thought there was any great correlation between female (the physical sex) and femininity (the gender). I wouldn't be surprised if there is less correlation there than there is between males and masculinity. But these are treacherous waters for me to be wading in, never having thought too deeply about the precise definitions of all of these terms.
I've always thought that our society allows women a much wider range of expression than it does men, but I suppose that's relative to what qualities one wants to express; trans men, for instance, might not agree with me. I've often marveled at the many women who, compared to almost all of the men that I've known, seem to have wonderful, if not stunning skills of communication and expression. To my eyes, their skills along these lines, have often approached the genius level.
But there are so many different kinds of talents people can have. So I'm not surprised there are men, not themselves trans, who can express feminine qualities as perfectly as you describe. Maybe one thing that says is that it takes a very special combination of biological factors to make a transwoman.
Beth
<edited to fix typos>
@pamelatransuk ,
I've been meaning to thank you for your additions to this thread, and I've set aside today for that purpose. As my trans consciousness ascends, communication is becoming more and more important to me.
I thought that your November 23rd post, here, very nicely clarified what I was trying to say in my post. You made my points better than I did, I think. Thank you. On to your November 25th post: if my parents were still alive, I'd love to ask them what they saw. I'm guessing that they saw something: my mother seemed concerned, and my father downright alarmed, by my lackluster male development.
I've been thinking: suppose I had been born with my physical sex and gender both female. I wonder if I would have understood and appreciated that opportunity - to enjoy being a feminine woman, to make an art out of it - as that life unfolded? Would I have taken full advantage of that time to express my feminine qualities... those qualities that, from my current vantage point, I value so much? Or would I have taken it for granted and wasted the experience?
Would I have been a kind woman, one who seeks a universal kind of love and who strives for higher consciousness? Or would I have been a petty and hurtful woman, like some I've seen over the years?
Would I have simply gone with the flow - enjoying being a housewife with no education beyond high school? As far as I know, that's how life turned out for most of my female high school classmates. Or would I have developed my love for mathematics and science, which is the direction that my life took, if only because of the opportunities that were available to me as a male?
I have a metaphysical bent to my personality, which leads me to wonder if this experience as a male, while uncomfortable for me, was just what my soul needed. It has led me into two exciting and rewarding careers, both of which required higher education and a healthy degree of self assertiveness. Perhaps in the future, in a female body (however that comes about - transition in this lifetime, or reincarnation into another), this time as a male will help it to succeed beyond my wildest expectations: feminine, but not caustic or powerless; masculine, but not dull or oppressive. That is, a female life that balances the best qualities of both genders.
Beth
Hello again Beth
Thank you for your kind words.
Now here I can see a difference between our lives. Certainly in our parents generation (mine were born in 1920s) the norm was such that only the husband worked and the wife stayed at home as did my mum. However when I was 18 in 1973, it was becoming customary for the wife to work aswell and to have just as a much a right to a career as a man. Therefore if I had been born a girl as I have always wished and reached adulthood in 1970s, I believe I would still have had no desire to be a housewife but at least to find a job. I was never ambitious and spent my career in taxation finishing in middle management. I am the average person in this respect; I had some happy years and some unhappy years. I took early retirement in 2013 to look after my mum; she sadly passed away in 2015.
However I agree with everything else you state. I would have looked forward to adulthood as a woman instead of dreading it. I would have been more sociable. I probably would have still been a private person but not reclusive. I would not have had so much bitterness and aggression due to GD. I would have been able to appreciate emotions whereas I spent most of my life just existing and wishing my life away. This includes a willingness both to give and to receive love. Yes I think we would all like to turn the clock back if we could and be born in the correct gender but alas that is not possible.
At least we both do not have to live our entire lives as the wrong gender and we may now look forward to life as a woman. I am now 9 months HRT and will publicly transition in 2019.
I wish you every success on your transition journey.
Hugs
Pamela
@pamelatransuk ,
I grew up on a farm deep in the country. I think very few people there had any education beyond high school. The young men graduated and usually went right on to jobs in the local mills, marrying their high school sweethearts. Only a very few went on to college. It wasn't the culture. Almost all of those who did, I believe, were from nearby villages: children of doctors, lawyers, or local mill management. I think that era was only just beginning to come to an end, and going off to college was becoming more commonplace, as I was reaching adulthood.
I would like to offer my condolences to you on your mother passing away. My mother's passing was a terrible loss for me. It still is, though it's been so many years now.
And thanks for the encouragement regarding my trans journey. I'm in a lull, waiting for counseling, which is coming in a few weeks. My counselor is a transman - the first other transperson I will have ever met in person. I'm curious to find out if we look at each other with deep empathy or complete incomprehension - each of us born with (and rejecting) what the other values so dearly. I expect that it will be the former.
And a disclaimer that I meant to put in my last post: that I love math does not imply that I'm particularly good at it! But I do work at it a bit every day.
Beth
Many thanks for your kind words, Beth, and I offer you my condolences for the loss of your mother.
Pamela
Hi Beth
Glad your are here at Susan's place where the cool ladies hang out.
I just got here myself and sure am happy I found Susan's.
Your S/O is a wonderful caring person you can see it in all her posts. She loves you very very much!
Hope we become good friends on S/P.
Hugs AJ
@Moni ,
Thanks for your recent posts on this thread. In one of them, you mentioned that you hoped I would soon begin to live my authentic life. On that note, Moonflower took me Christmas shopping a few days ago. We found a beautiful dress, which I love, and which fit well. Then, when we came home, she did my face and nails. I have always liked wearing dresses, but I never thought I'd care about cosmetics - a bit of a bother for someone like me, who, deep down, is a bit of a slob. But I'm growing to really enjoy them. I love the nail polish, especially; when I'm out and about, I feel like a piece of living art. In any case, this is me, and it brings me peace.
You also mentioned being paired up with the man when a hetero couple comes to visit. That's familiar, for sure, and it never plays out very well. In fact, it usually goes over with a big thud. I'm definitely becoming more social as my transition progresses, and I've seen my wife raise her eyebrows in surprise several times now. But I doubt I'll ever be a social butterfly.
Beth
My experience is similar to yours, BlueStar. I had lived a dual life since childhood, feeling comfortably female and being that in private, and uncomfortably pretending to be male in the expected societal role. I thought of myself as an actor, or actress in this case, playing the role of my life. Because I looked like a girl and didn't experience normal male puberty, my teenage years were marred by verbal and physical abuse and depression. Life is so much easier and more fulfilling being my real self all the time and dumping the male facade. Glad to know a kindred spirit.
Quote from: BlueStar on November 29, 2018, 01:35:27 PM
Moni,
Thanks for your recent posts on this thread. In one of them, you mentioned that you hoped I soon began to live my authentic life. On that note, Moonflower took me Christmas shopping a few days ago. We found a beautiful dress, which I love, and which fit. Then, when we came home, she did my face and nails. I have always liked wearing dresses, but I never thought I'd care about cosmetics - a bit of a bother for someone like me, who, deep down, is a bit of a slob. But I'm growing to really enjoy them. I love the nail polish, especially; when I'm out and about, I feel like a piece of living art. In any case, this is me, and it brings me peace.
You also mentioned being paired up with the man when a hetero couple comes to visit. That's familiar, for sure, and it never plays out very well. It always goes over with a big thud. I'm definitely becoming more social as my transition progresses, and I've seen my wife raise her eyebrows in surprise several times now, but I doubt I'll ever be a social butterfly.
Beth
Hi Beth I have been reading your thread since you started, as well as your partners and have to say you are both amazing people. it was heartening to read of your escapades in shopping and especially the encouragement you are receiving from your biggest supporter.
I probably fell into the slob category myself...mainly because I had no interest in my appearance at all...I didn't care. That has all changed and I love to wear nice clothes, makeup and especially jewellery I would not even look in a jewellers window as it used to break my heart that I could never have the pretty things I saw.
Enjoy the experience and I encourage you to explore your feelings this is a time of learning, renewal and doing,
Take care
Liz
Quote from: pamelatransuk on November 26, 2018, 08:50:08 AM
Hello again BlueStar
Hugs to you Beth and to Moonstar
Pamela
I apologise to you both for my mistake and I correct accordingly:
Hugs to you Beth and to Moonflower.
Pamela
Quote from: pamelatransuk on November 30, 2018, 05:52:29 AM
I apologise to you both for my mistake and I correct accordingly:
Hugs to you Beth and to Moonflower.
Pamela
No problem. The hug for Moonstar got to me without any notice of being misaddressed.
Thanks and hugs,
Grace
@Beverly Anne
Thank you for your post and for telling me something of your story. The last few lines you wrote are ringing so true to me:
Quote from: Beverly Anne on November 29, 2018, 02:04:16 PM
Life is so much easier and more fulfilling being my real self all the time and dumping the male facade. Glad to know a kindred spirit.
It leads me to tell this story... I had my annual physical exam recently, which meant of course that I had to have blood drawn. I decided not to remove my nail polish before the blood draw, which would mean that the nurse would see my painted nails. I was OK with that.
It wasn't until I was sitting down in the chair, and the nurse - a rather stern faced young woman - was approaching with the syringe, that it occurred to me that maybe this wasn't the best time or place to have tried this out. But, much to my surprise, when she saw my fingernails, her face softened. She seemed disarmed - much more relaxed than I'd ever seen her before. For the rest of the time I was with her, she spoke to me with surprising kindness and respect.
It was a completely different story, though, when I got back into the waiting room. There sat a man, a little older than I, maybe in his 70's. I hadn't put my gloves back on yet and he immediately caught sight of my painted nails. I saw him gawking at me, from the corner of my eye, the entire time I was crossing the room. From the look on his face, it was clear to me that he considered me to be an utter abomination. He seemed to have lost his ability to control himself - unable to stop gawking and unable to hide his contempt. (Hopefully, after that encounter, he'll handle his next meeting with a transwoman a little better!)
I think the man represented the past - what attitudes were like, here, when I was a child. Those were the days when I first wanted to be female but didn't dare speak of it to anyone. I think the nurse represented the softening of those attitudes - how younger people, at least, are beginning to make a place in their world for transpersons like us.
I'm looking forward to hearing more of your story,
Beth
Quote from: LizK on November 29, 2018, 04:09:25 PM
I probably fell into the slob category myself...mainly because I had no interest in my appearance at all...I didn't care. That has all changed and I love to wear nice clothes, makeup and especially jewellery I would not even look in a jewellers window as it used to break my heart that I could never have the pretty things I saw.
@LizK ,
The other day my wife bought me a pretty little hair clip. It's actually not meant for an adult, she says, but even so, it's a beautiful thing to me. Maybe this seems strange, even to some other transpersons, but I felt a deep sense of healing and inner peace when I put it on, completely out of proportion to the cost of the gift.
As we continued shopping, it occurred to me that if I'd always been free to wear the clothes, accessories and colors that were beautiful to me, they would have always come the women's side of the stores. I would never have set foot in men's departments; nothing there has ever appealed to me. And I would have taken great pleasure in appearing in these beautiful things. That probably explains the lack of interest that I'd taken in my appearance, prior to beginning transition.
When I decided to transition, I thought that, being a fully mature man, I'd transition into a fully mature woman; I wouldn't be the kind to get excited about nail polish and hair clips. Wrong again! I do need to enjoy these things (for awhile, at least).
Beth
Quote from: BlueStar on December 02, 2018, 01:45:00 PM
@LizK ,
The other day my wife bought me a pretty little hair clip. It's actually not meant for an adult, she says, but even so, to me, it's a beautiful thing. Maybe this seems strange, even to many other transpersons, but I felt a deep sense of healing and inner peace when I put it on, completely out of proportion to the cost of the gift. Beth
It is the priceless acceptance that it represents.
Beth,
My partner has been telling me I was a teenage girl for the last two years. I am now up to my early twenties in her estimation. I used to be able to get ready and be out of the house in 5 minutes. Now, lol, it is do my hair, do my skin care regiment, put on make up, pick out my clothes, yikes, it gets involved. I usually don't mind it. Don't be surprised if you do a revisiting of things you missed. You may also find yourself being that social butterfly more. Actually, being on Susan's has helped me be more social. You are going to surprise yourself in many ways, I think.
Who is this BlueMoon you speak of? Sounds like a drink! lol
Moni
Wow my 3000th post. See how social you can get?
@Maid Marion
Quote from: Maid Marion on December 02, 2018, 02:08:44 PM
It is the priceless acceptance that it represents.
I expect that you are right. The depth and the constancy of her acceptance are making all the difference for me.
Beth
Quote from: BlueStar on December 02, 2018, 03:34:20 PM
@Maid Marion
I expect that you are right. The depth and the constancy of her acceptance are making all the difference for me.
Beth
It was so refreshing to read you partners first forays onto this board. I thought at the time that whomever had Her as a partner was truly blessed. The hair clip is a little a perfect example of just how accepting. Many of us will never get to experience "little girl" moments that many long for. The clip is a small example of the depth of that acceptance
Take care
liz
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Quote from: BlueStar on November 30, 2018, 04:05:46 PM
@Beverly Anne
It wasn't until I was sitting down in the chair, and the nurse - a rather stern faced young woman - was approaching with the syringe, that it occurred to me that maybe this wasn't the best time or place to have tried this out. But, much to my surprise, when she saw my fingernails, her face softened. She seemed disarmed - much more relaxed than I'd ever seen her before. For the rest of the time I was with her, she spoke to me with surprising kindness and respect.
It was a completely different story, though, when I got back into the waiting room. There sat a man, a little older than I, maybe in his 70's. I hadn't put my gloves back on yet and he immediately caught sight of my painted nails. I saw him gawking at me, from the corner of my eye, the entire time I was crossing the room. From the look on his face, it was clear to me that he considered me to be an utter abomination. He seemed to have lost his ability to control himself - unable to stop gawking and unable to hide his contempt. (Hopefully, after that encounter, he'll handle his next meeting with a transwoman a little better!)
I think the man represented the past - what attitudes were like, here, when I was a child. Those were the days when I first wanted to be female but didn't dare speak of it to anyone. I think the nurse represented the softening of those attitudes - how younger people, at least, are beginning to make a place in their world for transpersons like us.
Beth
I agree. It is unfortunately the case that we seem at times to witness an anti-reaction from the older generation. However we usually receive a much more understanding and accepting stance from the younger generation. Times are changing, I am delighted to say.
Hugs
Pamela
Quote from: pamelatransuk on December 03, 2018, 06:40:04 AM
I agree. It is unfortunately the case that we seem at times to witness an anti-reaction from the older generation. However we usually receive a much more understanding and accepting stance from the younger generation. Times are changing, I am delighted to say.
I think the changes with younger folks are absolutely wonderful. While there are a few younger 'haters', the vast majority are accepting and peer pressure keeps the few in line (unless they form packs!)
The older generation will die off, and with them will go their poor behavior. I'll be gone as well but the young folks will have a much better, happier life, and I rejoice in that.
Hi @BlueStar , Beth,
I have been wondering how you are feeling lately. If you feel like sharing, I would love to know more of how things are going for you. Are are finding it easy or satisfying to expand your horizons?
Moni
Moni, Ann, and everyone who has been so kind as to wish me well, on this thread,
Thank you for your concern. All is well in my world.
My initial HRT appointment was just a few days ago. The staff were very friendly and supportive, and gave my wife and me plenty of time to ask questions and consider the choices. In the end, I walked out with the prescriptions already sent in to my pharmacy. I never expected this to happen so fast!
So my HRT has only just started and I doubt it has had any real effect on me yet. Still, I feel so happy. In fact, I cannot remember ever feeling happy like this and so a part of the world. For once, I feel as though my lifetime, and my body, can be perfect for me. I feel as though my body is finally beginning to express my true self. I feel increasingly comfortable being out in public, comfortable in my clothing choices, and comfortable that how I choose to look is how I should look. (Is this what non-trans people feel like all the time?!)
In some small way, this is like being able to go back to that point, when I was a very young child and first experiencing gender dysphoria, and taking the other path... the one where my gender and physical sex were in perfect alignment. It's as if all the dysphoria-related unhappiness that came between that moment and the HRT appointment just vanished in a puff of smoke. Who knows if this feeling will last. But even so, I've gotten to a place where, as recently as a few months ago, I never imagined even reaching for.
During the lead-up to Christmas, I told my story, by letter, to several of my old friends. One response was a transperson's dream: immediate and fully supporting. He couldn't have been more helpful and encouraging. The other response was strange and disappointing, coming, as it did, from someone who had once been such an excellent friend. He completely ignored my coming out story; it was as if those paragraphs of my letter had never been written. I suppose everybody who comes out has a story or three like that (or worse).
A few months ago I couldn't foresee if coming out and transitioning would turn out to be the right thing to do or if it it would be a mistake. I finally decided that I would just take one step at a time. And if completing a step left me feeling healed and energized, I'd know that it was a step in the right direction. If not, that would be the end of it. By this measure, every step so far, especially HRT, has turned out to have been exactly the right step to take.
Transitioning has been a very healing experience for me!
I hope everything is going well with you. I'm looking forward to hearing more of your stories.
Beth
Quote from: BlueStar on January 06, 2019, 06:21:37 PM
A few months ago I couldn't foresee if coming out and transitioning would turn out to be the right thing to do or if it it would be a mistake. I finally decided that I would just take one step at a time. And if completing a step left me feeling healed and energized, I'd know that it was a step in the right direction. If not, that would be the end of it. By this measure, every step so far, especially HRT, has turned out to have been exactly the right step to take.
Transitioning has been a very healing experience for me!
Beth, congratulations on starting HRT!! Your post, especially the part I quoted, brings tears of joy to my eyes. Your approach sounds exactly right. May your healing continue.
Beth,
I am so glad I asked you to give an update. Your response was so good to hear. It is wonderful to hear that you are on a path that is making you feel whole, happy! I appreciate your wisdom of watching your reactions as you progress. Actually experiencing things rather than theorizing what might happen can't be emphasized enough. I really think you have fantastic things headed your way. You are just open the doors to your real world and I am excited for you.
As for how people respond to your news, the good ones can really boost you, and the bad ones can hurt. You know what you are doing is right, and the mature, true friends will stick with you. Some people take time to adjust. Be strong and confident in being you. The rest is not in our control.
Hug hugs,
Moni
Quote from: BlueStar on January 06, 2019, 06:21:37 PM
So my HRT has only just started and I doubt it has had any real effect on me yet. Still, I feel so happy. In fact, I cannot remember ever feeling happy like this and so a part of the world. For once, I feel as though my lifetime, and my body, can be perfect for me. I feel as though my body is finally beginning to express my true self. I feel increasingly comfortable being out in public, comfortable in my clothing choices, and comfortable that how I choose to look is how I should look. (Is this what most non-trans people feel like all the time?!)
In some small way, this is like being able to go back to that point, when I was a very young child and first experiencing gender dysphoria, and taking the other path... one where my gender and physical sex were in perfect alignment. It's as if all the dysphoria-related unhappiness that came between that moment and the HRT appointment just vanished in a puff of smoke. Who knows if this feeling will last. But even so, I've gotten to a place where, as recently as a few months ago, I never imagined even reaching for.
Beth
Hello again
This really is a wonderful uplifting summary of your starting HRT and the immediate high and exciting and confirming feeling afterwards. Congratulations on starting HRT; you'll remember that event for ever! I am sure from your description that already you believe quite correctly that you are on "the right fuel" and that you appreciate the emotional realignment of brain/mind to body in that the GD has disappeared (if only temporarily) and you feel "top of the world".
I note the differing reactions from your old friends; so glad one is fully supportive and sad about the other but please don't assume it is necessarily a complete blanking as some people need to process before coming to a decision on acceptance.
Finally HRT certainly heals and I hope it continues for you not only with HRT but with your transition as a whole.
Hugs
Pamela