OK. I've been quiet here for a few months, but thought I'd share an update. First, the history.
After my second marriage ended three years ago, I entered therapy to deal with my this loss. About eight months in, Laura came out, I contacted Kaiser for a referral to their Transitions Clinic, and I got "the letter" from my therapist to begin HRT. I began taking hormones during the early fall of 2016, but stopped in early December, mostly out of fear, a pattern that would repeat later on (yes, I know this is fairly normal.)
I then dated one woman for eight months, ended the relationship, and then began dating another woman for another nine months. Around June of 2018, I came out to her about Laura and told her I wanted to transition. She ended the relationship immediately, but said we could be friends. LOL
I then began HRT again (and replenished my wardrobe and make-up since I'd purged them two years ago). Between July and November, I started and stopped HRT many times, mostly out of fear of being outed and rejected. I will always be closeted since I can never be passable.
After several months of trying to date lesbians, which was a total failure, I found a wonderful woman on Match. I was really scared to come out to her, but did so after our third date. Happy for me, she was accepting, but insisted I not be on hormones until she was ready. I was also not to dress in front of her, although I could when we FaceTimed, which was several times a day. During our overnight encounters, which were incredible, she'd even suck my tiny breasts, so I had hopes she would feel comfortable with me being a woman. I did remind her from time to time about my need to return to HRT, that I could maintain my erections through altering my medication (Kaiser had said this was possible), but she often hinted that I should hide Laura like I did during my marriages. That if I could hide it for my ex-wives, I could hide it for her.
I found her comments a bit alarming, since I'd been upfront about my transitioning with her. I told her that I never expected to transition 24/7, or have SRS, but she was afraid both of me being outed in front of her friends (the theme was about hiding my boobs) and that she was afraid that my sexual orientation would change so that I preferred men. No amount of discussion relieved her concerns though, even when I told her about the binders I'd purchased to hide my boobs while playing tennis and being outside.
When she visited me this week, I again approached my need for HRT, and she strongly told me that she really hoped she could "change me" to just be a man around her, and that I could choose HRT or her. Not both.
And so, I find myself alone, again. I can be happy, but alone transitioning and dressing as Laura, or unhappy and in love with her. I had wanted both. I had wanted her support and her love. In the end, I found neither.
And so it goes.
Quote from: lauraelliott1951 on January 27, 2019, 05:33:43 PM
.......
When she visited me this week, I again approached my need for HRT, and she strongly told me that she really hoped she could "change me" to just be a man around her, and that I could choose HRT or her. Not both.
And so, I find myself alone, again. I can be happy, but alone transitioning and dressing as Laura, or unhappy and in love with her. I had wanted both. I had wanted her support and her love. In the end, I found neither.
And so it goes.
@lauraelliott1951 Hi Laura
how disappointing for you...I think its a tough call to ask you to have "one or the other" almost like asking you to cut off part of who you are. Your desire to be on HRT is certainly not unusual for a Transgender Woman but having to go without is pretty hard. I think once you have experienced the difference it can make to you ,going back feels almost cruel. I certainly hope you find you find someone to spend the rst of your life with who will love you..all of you for exactly who you are.
Liz
I also hope you find someone but this last woman was not the one as evident in her initial request that "...I not be on hormones until she was ready." Red flag! Her comments were her true voice speaking. You just didn't hear it.
I trust you will find the one for you, Laura. And that she will love you as you are.
Thank you Judi and Liz. After the disaster of losing my prior girlfriend after coming out, I was more careful with this girlfriend, and was totally honest up front. From reading posts by MtFs and their So's, I had hoped by going slowly, she would come around. Apparently, that didn't work. LOL. I do appreciate your well wishes, but I know I'm destined to be alone. the silver lining, though, is knowing I'll be my authentic self.
Laura
I did the same relationship back and forth with my last two girlfriends. I came out to both about being bi and crossdressing. They both were accepting but hinted at disapproval of the idea of transitioning. ("You don't want to go and become a woman, do you?" kind of thing). I hid that I did want to which ultimately led me to break things off with each of them.
Once I finally got to the point I needed to transition, I resolved to wait until I was at least near then end of transitioning to even try getting into another relationship. I'm at that point now, and as it so happens, I just met someone.
Before I took the plunge and began transitioning, I felt very much the same as you. I'm ridiculously tall. I wasn't very attractive as a man, and thought I'd make for a hideous woman. I knew I'd never "pass" as a woman. That held me back for four years. Eventually I just said "To hell with what anyone else thinks of me. I'm going to do this for me so I can finally be me." Maybe you too will get to that point.
Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
Thank you so much, Stacy, for your works of encouragement.
Quote from: lauraelliott1951 on January 27, 2019, 10:23:00 PM
Apparently, that didn't work. LOL. I do appreciate your well wishes, but I know I'm destined to be alone. the silver lining, though, is knowing I'll be my authentic self.
Don't forget the background music. ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE)
My, now ex-girlfriend, continued to talk the past few days. We really do love each other deeply, but since she was insistant that I not take hormones, I called her bluff. I told her I'd be willing to compromise by not doing HRT as long as I could dress as Laura when we're together, including a wig and make-up at times. this, too, was too much for her....
Her other fears had been that my sexual orientation would change and that I'd be outed by her family. No amount of talking about my desire for women or my intention to use binders was sufficient. However, it appears her hidden agenda was to eventually convince Laura to disappear in favor of my male self.
And this was exactly why I was upfront from the beginning of our relationship about my being trans. I'm certainly happy with dressing part-time, since I'll never be passable, but I'll never be ok with killing Laura completely.
For now, I've returned to HRT.
Laura
Good for you Laura.
I'm wondering why she thought she could change you since you were clear upfront as to what you wanted to do.
I can't imagine asking a partner to hide or change who they are, and I've (thankfully) never been asked to do so myself. I hope you find someone who adores you for all of you, Laura; it's not fair that you were blindsided by someone you thought you could trust.
Also, though I only have one picture to go off of... What do you mean you don't pass? Some of my mother's friends look a lot like you, and I'd never question their gender. I don't know what you sound like, or what the rest of your body looks like, but I think you pass in your avatar just fine. You're a beautiful woman, in my opinion, and I think HRT will only make you more beautiful (to yourself, and to others).
Hi Laure,
I am sorry about the relationship issues. I know how loneliness is and I do things to be sociable both at work and with gym classes. I know it is not the same as having an accepting loving relationship but it helps.
I feel as though I do not pass but blend very well. It is very true about bodies and faces as one get older. In the gym I am thinner that most woman my age. I am tall but thin. My hair is starting to really rock and I am so happy with that. Faces, I had FFS and I do not look male. VFS, had it twice and will never touch my voice again. My pitch is good but I am still recovering; it has been 6.5 months since my last VFS.
I overcompensated with operations to help feel better about myself. I did it to look female. Well no matter how many operations in the end it is about gaining self confidence and self acceptance. People will accept you or not; that is about themselves and not you.
I hope you find the comfort to be yourself in the ways that make you happy and find the companionship you desire. Do what you need to and desire to do to the point you need to take it. Your transition is about you and what you want to do to the level that makes you feel comfortable with yourself.
@transspoonie
Thank you for your kind words. I was hoping that by being upfront with her that she'd learn to accept me. However, she would freak out even when I was just wearing panties. Unfortunately, while I found her to be fairly demanding about a variety of things, I did love her with all my heart and wanted to make her happy. She asked for too much though.
Laura
@Rachel
Thank you Rachel. While I do hope to have FFS and perhaps vocal surgery in the future, I was willing to forego those to make my girlfriend happy. No amount of compromise was enough though.
Yes, loneliness is my present and future. Being 67, I fear a life without love, affection and companionship. it's a difficult choice to choose who I authentically am versus being in a relationship. I wanted both. Tomorrow is another day though.
Laura
Quote from: lauraelliott1951 on January 29, 2019, 04:37:28 PM
...I'm certainly happy with dressing part-time, since I'll never be passable...
Don't be so convinced about never passing. As noted, you look great. After HRT for a while you may see progress you never expected! You're only a couple years older than I, and I have no issue with passing. Never sell yourself short!
Tomorrow is another day and who knows what it will bring.
I can certainly relate to that. I'm lucky to have found "the one" in high school, who accepts me for me and looks forward to every step of my transition, but I've had multiple relationships where "being me" was less important than "pleasing them"—thankfully, of all the "problems" those people said I had, my gender was never one of them.
Also, if it makes you feel any better, my godmother is nearly 70 and she's finally found the man that's right for her. I genuinely believe you'll find the woman that's right for you, too, even if it takes time. I believe everyone can, with time.
Quote from: JudiBlueEyes on January 29, 2019, 08:57:24 PM
Don't be so convinced about never passing. As noted, you look great. After HRT for a while you may see progress you never expected! You're only a couple years older than I, and I have no issue with passing. Never sell yourself short!
Tomorrow is another day and who knows what it will bring.
Thank you so much Judi...You've added a bit of joy to my evening. I can't begin to express how wonderful it feels to have Susan's Place as a safe space to share.
Laura
Quote from: transspoonie on January 29, 2019, 06:15:32 PM
I can't imagine asking a partner to hide or change who they are, and I've (thankfully) never been asked to do so myself. I hope you find someone who adores you for all of you, Laura; it's not fair that you were blindsided by someone you thought you could trust.
The above quote from transspoonie is true all the time for every gender cis or trans. I made bad partner choices throughout my life and I am unfortunately pretty resigned to the fact that I may not have another. ( still hoping but doubtful ) But the thought of allowing myself to be manipulated in order to be 'loved' which really isn't love at all no longer holds any appeal to me. Love is more than romance and sex and passion ( not that those are bad things LOL ) but love also means honesty, caring and respect. Anybody that wants to change you does not truly love you IMO.
Quote from: lauraelliott1951 on January 29, 2019, 08:25:12 PM
@Rachel
Yes, loneliness is my present and future. Being 67, I fear a life without love, affection and companionship. it's a difficult choice to choose who I authentically am versus being in a relationship. I wanted both. Tomorrow is another day though.
Laura
I am quite a bit older than you, and I really don't care if I pass or not. I pass almost 100%, an it is not always about the looks, but about your confidence to be a woman!
And there is life alone, without a partner. I am alone for almost 16 years now, but I have a large circle of friends (all cis women), and I am active in social settings and volunteer for a non profit. My days are so filled that I have no time to be alone, and when I come home, I have some quiet time with my dog and after that I fall into my bed and am gone in no time!
Yes, once in awhile it would be nice to have a partner at home, but most of the time I am to tired to even think about a partner!
@KimOct
Kim,
I could not agree more with what you shared....My ex and I certainly were honest with each other from the start and I received more affection from this relationship than any other in my life....the unfortunate aspect was how she could be controlling and demanding. I had previously experienced this in a relationship I was in 20 years ago and I found it to be demeaning. Respect and compromise are part of loving relationships, so I'm especially disappointed that this GF couldn't even recognize or acknowledge Laura.
Thank you again.
Laura
@Dietlind
Thank you Dietlind. I would never have guessed that you're older than me...I'd always assumed, when I read your other posts, that you were in your early 50s... I do appreciate your advice though....Thank you.
Laura
Hi Laura,
Dating was a frustrating area for me as well. My situation is different in that I'm a full-time, out, trans woman who is attracted to both sexes. I've dated men and women since transition. I've learned to enjoy being by myself and the freedom that goes with it. I have single girl friends I hang out with and have an active social life, and dating for romantic reasons is no longer a source of frustration for me. I want to eventually find a partner, but I've decided to wait until after GCS surgery to put myself out there again. I enjoy a full life as a single person. I think deciding what you want more will help you achieve clarity. Being caught in the margins between who you are and what others want you to be will only lead to more frustrating relationships. I hope you figure out what you want and find your true love,
Best wishes!
Beverly
Quote from: Beverly Anne on January 29, 2019, 10:41:22 PM
I think deciding what you want more will help you achieve clarity. Being caught in the margins between who you are and what others want you to be will only lead to more frustrating relationships. I hope you figure out what you want and find your true love,
Beverly,
I do appreciate advice from someone who has walked the path I'm currently on...You're right about being caught in the margins. I've certainly placed myself there because of fear and doubts. That I'm pressing on and have restarted HRT, after being off for two months, is a positive step forward.
But then, I never stopped buying clothes and shoes. LOL.
Laura
Quote from: lauraelliott1951 on January 29, 2019, 10:30:58 PM
@Dietlind
Thank you Dietlind. I would never have guessed that you're older than me...I'd always assumed, when I read your other posts, that you were in your early 50s... I do appreciate your advice though....Thank you.
Laura
Well Laura, it appears that certain intersex conditions make one age slower. But again, the real age is in ones head, you are as old or young as you feel. One of my friends is a 89 year old cis women, who enjoys driving her Mini Cooper S like a living bat out of hell! She gets in and out of this little, low sitting car, as if it is a normal thing for her!
I try to stay young with getting involved in all kinds of stuff, and I hope this will keep me going for many years to come.
And yes, I am many years older than you, compared to me, you are a spring chicken!
Get that life of yours rocking and have lots of fun with it!
Hugs
Linde
Quote from: Dietlind on January 30, 2019, 12:29:53 AM
Get that life of yours rocking and have lots of fun with it!
\
Linde,
Thank you for your advice and your words of encouragement.
Laura
Laura,
As I approach 2 years post-op this spring, I'm still negotiating this in my relationship as well as building my lesbian community, which has been my first priority since I took the step to medical transition.
Unfortunately, fundamentally straight women as well as lesbians who carry a mental or emotional block about gender seem unlikely to change that easily. Before I started dating my current partner of 20 years I had already decided that I would never present as full email and always wore feminine styled under things so that if we ever became intimate they would have to know right from the get-go that that's who I was.
And yet my partner had a pretty big push back early in our relationship when I said I had to consider transition and then when I needed to transition and told her as much about three years ago I got a strong push back and our romantic relationship really has not recovered since my surgery. fortunately she and I are poly and so I get to see other women and that's not especially easy either in two years I've had exactly three dates with women only two of which have resulted in anything like a relationship.
I think my best suggestion for you at this point is that if I were in your shoes with your now ex-girlfriend I would have insisted on HRT non-clothing I know for me my emotional state has had a much much bigger effect on my life then how I dressed ... Ymmv of course :-). AndI continue to dress pretty well Butch until I was post-op the entire year plus that I was on HRT I just dressed as a guy I told everyone that I was transitioning and I moved my parents in that general direction however I never felt comfortable wearing a dress while I still had my <shenis>. Again ymmv
❤️❤️
To be honest you need to find someone dressed as Laura not as male then switch things because they fall for the person they first meet not the second. I think finding love and acceptance in others will be extremely difficult you need to find acceptance and love in yourself enough to go outside and live life as Laura. if you keep meeting new women as say Robert they will fall for him and they will associate you with him. You really need to step out as Laura and start as Laura. People are individuals and they will always do what they want and change in a way they want why can't you? You might find someone accepting toward Robert but not Laura because they are letting Robert into their lives Laura is a stranger and their rejection is clear that they do want Laura. That is why you need to meet as Laura and that means fully dressed from the start.
I think that if you base your love and support from others mainly it will not hold. People are like water ever flowing and changing. Instead of changing others you need to change your self.
Quote from: SadieBlake on January 30, 2019, 07:00:53 AM
think my best suggestion for you at this point is that if I were in your shoes with your now ex-girlfriend I would have insisted on HRT non-clothing I know for me my emotional state has had a much much bigger effect on my life then how I dressed ... Ymmv of course :-). AndI continue to dress pretty well Butch until I was post-op the entire year plus that I was on HRT I just dressed as a guy I told everyone that I was transitioning and I moved my parents in that general direction however I never felt comfortable wearing a dress while I still had my <shenis>. Again ymmv
❤️❤️
Sadie,
Navigating relationships, particularly when your mate loves you as a male, is difficult and prone to failure. While I'd spent much time trying to negotiate just the terms you described, even HRT was too much for her to bear. If I had one priority at the moment, it's HRT, but while I could negotiate not dressing as Laura in the near term, I'd never be able to promise to not dress in the future.
It's all moot though. She knows and loves me as my male self, not as Laura. I'm happily back on HRT now.
Laura
Quote from: Asakawa on February 04, 2019, 02:48:57 AM
To be honest you need to find someone dressed as Laura not as male then switch things because they fall for the person they first meet not the second. I think finding love and acceptance in others will be extremely difficult you need to find acceptance and love in yourself enough to go outside and live life as Laura. if you keep meeting new women as say Robert they will fall for him and they will associate you with him. You really need to step out as Laura and start as Laura. People are individuals and they will always do what they want and change in a way they want why can't you? You might find someone accepting toward Robert but not Laura because they are letting Robert into their lives Laura is a stranger and their rejection is clear that they do want Laura. That is why you need to meet as Laura and that means fully dressed from the start.
I think that if you base your love and support from others mainly it will not hold. People are like water ever flowing and changing. Instead of changing others you need to change your self.
Asakawa,
I appreciate your view and advice. You're right about how a partner's perception at the beginning is the one the relationship is based on. She sees the Male me, and while I outed myself to her after the second date, I'm afraid she wasn't open enough to love the woman in me.
We've continued to talk after the breakup, and we do still love and care for each other. That's the difficult part, knowing someone loves you but is unwilling to love, or even recognize the woman in me. We've met twice in the past week, and while I'd classify our current relationship as FWB, I don't think that's sustainable. She knows I will not bend about being male 24/7, and I know she's unwilling to accept Laura.
As we were in bed this morning, she even referenced how I was male 24/7 during my marriages and that some type of conversion therapy could fix me. I chose not to share how those therapies are illegal in California and that I'm born this way. Being trans isn't a choice for me, which is why Laura kept popping out.
Yes, I'd love to go out as Laura, and perhaps as my body image conforms to my vision of who Laura is, I'll venture out...I'm not that confident. I'm just too afraid of being stared at or ridiculed. I will make an attempt to attend a few trans support meetings though. if I were able to make a few trans friends, then maybe I'd be more comfortable being Laura outside if I had a partner in crime.
Thank you again.
Laura
Update:
In the two weeks since our breakup, my girlfriend and I have kept talking and FaceTiming several times a day. We missed each other's company and still loved each other very much. She also continued to spend several nights a week at my house, where affection and intimacy flowed freely. Last week, she even brought me a necklace, which at the time, seemed like a positive sign....
I had continued to dress as a boy around her, but dressed as Laura, sans wig and make-up, when we were video conferencing. However, she's fairly dug in that she can only accept me as a partner if I surrender Laura and live as a man full-time. I had so hoped that I could continue hormones and I was certainly willing to compromise when it came to dressing around her. However, I can not destroy and abandon Laura. I can be happy living as Laura part time, but I've lived too long denying my need....It's not that I hate being a man. I just love and need being Laura more.
My girlfriend has one foot out the door and her demands are clear. If I continue to be Laura, then I'm the one who is quitting the relationship. That she puts all the pressure on me is interesting, given that she knew about Laura from the beginning. However, once I reinforced my need to be Laura and I restarted hormones, she told me that she can never accept me as a woman, even if it was part time.
And so it goes.
Laura
After spending Valentine's Day through Saturday morning together, and hearing her continued pressure to abandon Laura if I wanted to continue the relationship, I told her that I felt she had essentially put a gun to my head with her demand. While we had continued to express our love for each other, I knew she would never compromise. Laura is part of me and after trying to bury her for so long, I'm unwilling to go back in the closet. Our relationship is now officially over.
On the positive side, I've been on estrogen patches for three weeks now, and my breast buds have again filled up and are slowly expanding. I restarted Sprio today as well. Onward towards the adventure.
Laura
Quote from: lauraelliott1951 on February 16, 2019, 08:52:07 PM
After spending Valentine's Day through Saturday morning together, and hearing her continued pressure to abandon Laura if I wanted to continue the relationship, I told her that I felt she had essentially put a gun to my head with her demand. While we had continued to express our love for each other, I knew she would never compromise. Laura is part of me and after trying to bury her for so long, I'm unwilling to go back in the closet. Our relationship is now officially over.
On the positive side, I've been on estrogen patches for three weeks now, and my breast buds have again filled up and are slowly expanding. I restarted Sprio today as well. Onward towards the adventure.
Laura
I wish you good luck on your path!
Who knows, she might decide to comeback?
Thank you Dietland. I'm afraid compromise is not a concept she believes in. Emotionally I'm ok. I'd rather she was in my life, but she never did believe that Laura was an important part of me, one I needed to express. Laura can not be denied any longer.
Quote from: lauraelliott1951 on February 16, 2019, 10:23:26 PM
Thank you Dietland. I'm afraid compromise is not a concept she believes in. Emotionally I'm ok. I'd rather she was in my life, but she never did believe that Laura was an important part of me, one I needed to express. Laura can not be denied any longer.
I understand your feeling, this trans stuff destroyed my marriage, but I still became a woman! I wish it would have worked out, but all the wishing cannot cover up the reality!
Good luck and lots of hugs!
Linde
Many thanks Dietlind. Unfortunately, this was the second relationship destroyed by my transition. I think I've learned my lesson. LOL. I'm going to focus on me now.
Quote from: lauraelliott1951 on February 16, 2019, 10:56:25 PM
Many thanks Dietlind. Unfortunately, this was the second relationship destroyed by my transition. I think I've learned my lesson. LOL. I'm going to focus on me now.
That seems to b the best for the moment! I did it, and I feel pretty well as a woman. Now that I am almost done with that, I would not mind to find a partner again!
I am getting slowly a little scared about my orichi in a few days, after that, the dor for a return is mostly closed!