Poll
Question:
Do you now feel physically vulnerable, living as a woman, when you used to feel safe?
Option 1: No, nothing has changed for me. I'm as safe as ever.
votes: 6
Option 2: Yes, things are different now
votes: 28
Option 3: No, I hardly ever think about it.
votes: 15
Option 4: No, nothing has changed for me. I'm as safe as ever.
votes: 2
This is for women who consider themselves transsexual, or transitioned women, that is, living fulltime as their target gender, with hrt and/or surgery.
Things are allot diffrent now, but Ive discovered that the less you actualy worry about it the better off you are...
Im not saying to keep it totaly out of your head, but dont let it become a focus or worry... People sence the aprehension and that makes you more of a target...
If push comes to shove, I can defend myself against most threats... I carry pepper spray... and soon as my permit arives in the mail... someone might find there kneecaps missing if they want to push the issue...
Fear is your worst enemy and thugs and creeps can smell it.... If you show no fear, they tend to leave you alone.
Things are different for me now, obviously. Nowadays I'd rely more on my plate armor and trusty shield to take on a guy my level than any raging berserker abilities I could have used prior but I can't say I'm afraid of meeting my doom.
As women we have to live with this, so throughout the millennia we have developed... other methods of asserting ourselves to men ;)
Quote from: soldierjane on March 11, 2008, 11:43:49 AM
Things are different for me now, obviously. Nowadays I'd rely more on my plate armor and trusty shield to take on a guy my level than any raging berserker abilities I could have used prior but I can't say I'm afraid of meeting my doom.
Hahahahahaha! *gigglesnort*
So, I take it you won't be calling on your level 7 Great Cleave talent either then? ;)
Quote from: lady amarant on March 11, 2008, 01:21:29 PM
Quote from: soldierjane on March 11, 2008, 11:43:49 AM
Things are different for me now, obviously. Nowadays I'd rely more on my plate armor and trusty shield to take on a guy my level than any raging berserker abilities I could have used prior but I can't say I'm afraid of meeting my doom.
Hahahahahaha! *gigglesnort*
So, I take it you won't be calling on your level 7 Great Cleave talent either then? ;)
No, but I can tank any instance with Shield Block and Devastate... Protection all the way! :P
I don't worry about it much but I'm aware that I don't have the upper body strength I did before HRT. I've learned new strategies for dealing with threatening men besides scrapping. Crying is a wonderful tool. Shed a few tears and it will reduce the tension of the situation. Yes, you can learn to do this! Begging foregiveness is another one for defusing confrontation.
The objective is to make the aggressor go away without physical violence. I'll say anything to accomplish that. Fighting can land you in jail and none of us wants to go there!
.40 GLock... not as good as a .45... but semi autos can be so nice...
Remember, the peacemaker is the only gun mentioned in the bible....
Smith and Wesson, the origonal point and click interface...
No matter how big you are... when a high velocity projectile takes out your kneecaps... the smallest foe becomes very tall very quickly...
I worry about my welfare more now. I still can defend myself but I'm not as strong as I use to be. I found out that a guy has more strength than I do and even if I can defend myself, I'm no match against him. I just hope that it never happens.
Sheila
I used to be a scared little mouse. I did have some problems early on and they were very difficult to deal with.
I don't worry about it now so much but much of that confidence comes from the area where I live. I do have red neck neighbors but we don't have a lot of people out "this a way". None of them know my past. I also have some nice guard dogs.
I don't worry about what I would do in a fight with a man. That's because I have the attitude that I won't become engaged in one. I don't visit areas prone to violence and I keep my profile low. I don't carry pepper spray nor a gun. I'm also older these days so I'm not as "attractive" to potential perps.
I am still proud of who I am. I walk with my head tall.
I think the question should be "Do you carry yourself as a victim, or are you proud and confident of who you are?"
Cindi
Well sure! There are just way too many skunks who prey on women nowadays. I don't have the physical strength I used to have at one particular time, but I do have a stun gun! >:D
tink :icon_chick:
I don't carry any weapon except an English police whistle on my keyring.
Bev
Quote from: LynnER on March 11, 2008, 01:56:56 PM
.40 GLock... not as good as a .45... but semi autos can be so nice...
Remember, the peacemaker is the only gun mentioned in the bible....
Smith and Wesson, the origonal point and click interface...
No matter how big you are... when a high velocity projectile takes out your kneecaps... the smallest foe becomes very tall very quickly...
Personally, I keep a Pershing II intermediate range ballistic missile in my purse for protection. It's not as good as it was before SALT II outlawed MIRVs but you can still get the buggers before they get too close!
Just my opinion, but any woman who lives and /or presents as female had better have sense enough to make accommodations for her own safety.
Quote"Do you carry yourself as a victim, or are you proud and confident of who you are?"
Especially that one.
Not to do so is absolutely misguided in the extreme.
Nichole
For myself this issue has changed considerable during and since transition. I I was/am an Airborne Veteran and while defending myself was never an issue back then I have lost so much muscle mass and physical strength that I do take care of what and where I go. However this is more than offset by the emotional strength I have gained the transition. I have found that I am much better equipped to deal with/defuse situations that would have required different tactics. I can run faster scared than they can mad :)
Steph
I don't know what I'd do if I was involved in a confrontation. I'm nowhere near as strong as I used to be. On the other hand, I'm just as flexible and just as fast and not above running for it. If worse comes to worst, I'm not above scratching their eyes out.
Quote from: LynnER on March 11, 2008, 01:56:56 PM
No matter how big you are... when a high velocity projectile takes out your kneecaps... the smallest foe becomes very tall very quickly...
I'll bet lots of us have a firearm, or a whole collection of them. Maybe part of our earlier "gotta be macho" selves. But, I hope no one who is TS, GRS or not, ever resorts to their use, unless they are in Texas, or other sympathetic state (sympathetic to toting and using guns). They will NOT be treated well in prison, to say the least.
A big part of our survival now is not letting any part of the system hurt us, including those who's job it is to protect.
Oh, I still have some number of them at home, but that's what they're for now......home protection.
The best defense is NEVER a gun, but not putting yourself in a bad situation.
The number of people that have actually warded an assault is a lot less
than people think and I see guns as more of a security blanket, or
even better, a bit like a nuke, knowing they're out there supposedly
keeps you safe unless someone's crazy enough to use one.
Unless you've got your hand on the gun when the person attacks you (you saw it coming),
what will you do if the person already got their gun out?
The best thing if your close to a safe area
would probably be to run away and weave while yelling loudly,
maybe leaving your purse behind.
Its very hard to shoot someone running and moving quickly erratically at a distance
with a handgun unless you've trained quite a bit (not likely for a crook).
Important Safety Tip
Women are extremely vulnerable when wearing a pony tail and high heels. An assailant, especially one coming from the sides or behind, need only grab the pony tail and give it a pull. The victim is pulled off balance and is quickly on the ground, her assailant on top of her. Be careful of secluded places!
I have had long hair for years and always wore it loose. The only time I ponytail it is during the hot weather.
I go anywhere any place where I feel is safe place go. I mean one just doesn't walk into any unknown zone that is a dangerous and foolish thing to do to begin with. Why bend over and show your red panties to the bull for? As for muscle mass, well I never had all that much to start with. I was skinny most of my life as my other self.
Quote"Do you carry yourself as a victim, or are you proud and confident of who you are?"
Yes there is much truth to this short post. I prefer projecting to people around what I wish for them to see and think about me and it works wonderfully. I will not go out unless I feel I can radiant good will and love to any who receive it.
The only weapon I have is Wing Walker, ever see a ornery lesbian if she wishes or feels a need for it? I love feeling safe and protected by Wing Walker. No one ever gave a crap about the street urchin I was before. ;D
Cindy
Quote from: Claire de Lune on March 13, 2008, 01:26:23 AM
Important Safety Tip
Women are extremely vulnerable when wearing a pony tail and high heels. An assailant, especially one coming from the sides or behind, need only grab the pony tail and give it a pull. The victim is pulled off balance and is quickly on the ground, her assailant on top of her. Be careful of secluded places!
Quote from: Keira on March 13, 2008, 01:04:17 AM
The best defense is NEVER a gun, but not putting yourself in a bad situation.
The number of people that have actually warded an assault is a lot less
than people think and I see guns as more of a security blanket, or
even better, a bit like a nuke, knowing they're out there supposedly
keeps you safe unless someone's crazy enough to use one.
Unless you've got your hand on the gun when the person attacks you (you saw it coming),
what will you do if the person already got their gun out?
The best thing if your close to a safe area
would probably be to run away and weave while yelling loudly,
maybe leaving your purse behind.
Its very hard to shoot someone running and moving quickly erratically at a distance
with a handgun unless you've trained quite a bit (not likely for a crook).
Thanks for the sage advice, Keira, Claire.
The sad part of any advice is that we must share it as a survival tool.
Attacks by males on women are never sexually motivated, even if they include rape. They are crimes of power, of the muscle-flexing, chest-pounding, female-dominating male. This is the motive in the majority of attacks.
It is best to avoid places in which you could expose yourself to an attacker, like a dark street, a fringe parking lot, or in an alley shortcut. However, life goes on, so know the area in which you're walking as well as you can. Be aware of businesses that are open, homes with lights on, police stations, fire stations, anyplace where you can summon the police for help.
For as much as I believe that a Colt .45ACP will stop anything, ya get only one chance to use it right, and that chance usually never shows when you're attacked in close quarters. If an attacker finds a weapon on you it's pretty likely that he will turn it on you.
Pack two better weapons if you can: gain skill in the martial arts, and don't leave yourself open to attack by walking on places that are generally acknowledged to be hazardous to women.
Bar hopping? Take some friends and go by taxi wherever you go.
Taking night classes? Try to get there earlier to get a parking spot closer to the building, or share the ride with a classmate.
When I was in my prior life I was more afraid of walking in dark places than I am now. There are no rules in a street fight and if you are attacked, you're in a street fight. Be aware of the weapons you have at-hand and *do not hesitate to use them!!!*
Good, strong nails applied to the eyes cause damage but *don't worry about it!* A car key can lacerate a face and put an attacker off-balance long enough for you to get some distance.
Maybe you won't get grabbed by your pony tail but you're wearing heels. A heel ripped down the attacker's leg causes a laceration with pain, bleeding, and can render him a whole lot less dangerous.
Whatever weapon you have at-hand, do not hesitate to use it. It's either you or him.
If you shout for help, yell something like, "It's an attack! Call the cops!" People seem to respond to a distress call more often if you give them a reason and what to do. This should work better than yelling "Help!"
Read "Back Off!" by Martha Langelan It's out-of-print but should be available on Amazon. It dissects the male hostility towards woman and gives practical ideas and strategies for dealing with it on public transit, at work, in the street, and other places.
Enjoy the coming spring and summer!
Wing Walker
if anything, im stronger now... im not afraid to defend myself anymore, i can stand up for myself.
the past was the weakness.
R >:D
Quote from: Beverly on March 12, 2008, 11:04:21 PM
Quote from: LynnER on March 11, 2008, 01:56:56 PM
No matter how big you are... when a high velocity projectile takes out your kneecaps... the smallest foe becomes very tall very quickly...
I'll bet lots of us have a firearm, or a whole collection of them. Maybe part of our earlier "gotta be macho" selves. But, I hope no one who is TS, GRS or not, ever resorts to their use, unless they are in Texas, or other sympathetic state (sympathetic to toting and using guns). They will NOT be treated well in prison, to say the least.
A big part of our survival now is not letting any part of the system hurt us, including those who's job it is to protect.
Oh, I still have some number of them at home, but that's what they're for now......home protection.
I'm not really that big into guns... but I've learned the necesity... and more and more living in Texas is paying off... I used to hate the place but now.... (Its actualy leagle to shoot a tresspasser if youve given them fair warning... and someone breaking into your home is a fair target the moment any part of them enters the building) In public I depend on my speed, my friends, and pure ferocity... Though for certian things/places I may start packing when my CC liscence arives in the mail....
I'd recommend Wen-do, self defence for women. Teaches you to "dirty-fight", make weapons out of anything you can, and use leverage with less strength than your opponent. Good for short guys too, only you can't get into a course unless you're female.
Dennis
Quote from: Dennis on March 14, 2008, 03:10:43 AM
Good for short guys too, only you can't get into a course unless you're female.
Dennis
:embarrassed: you got my hopes up.
Quote from: Beverly on March 12, 2008, 11:04:21 PM
Quote from: LynnER on March 11, 2008, 01:56:56 PM
No matter how big you are... when a high velocity projectile takes out your kneecaps... the smallest foe becomes very tall very quickly...
I'll bet lots of us have a firearm, or a whole collection of them. Maybe part of our earlier "gotta be macho" selves. But, I hope no one who is TS, GRS or not, ever resorts to their use, unless they are in Texas, or other sympathetic state (sympathetic to toting and using guns). They will NOT be treated well in prison, to say the least.
A big part of our survival now is not letting any part of the system hurt us, including those who's job it is to protect.
Oh, I still have some number of them at home, but that's what they're for now......home protection.
oh i do declare.....
using a gun is SOOOOO unladlylike *rolls eyes*
depends if its self defence or not... if it is, you wont even see a jail cell ...
R >:D
Quote from: Rachael on March 14, 2008, 06:29:37 AM
oh i do declare.....
using a gun is SOOOOO unladlylike *rolls eyes*
Hardly, 'unladylike.' Simply crude and nasty, not to mention moving one more distance from their intended goal: safety.
What does a gun provide one with? Security? Safety? When you hold one does a sense of peace and comfort flow through you? Or do fear and thoughts of a rather more violent sort arise?
Nichole
Quote from: Nichole on March 14, 2008, 02:27:37 PM
What does a gun provide one with? Security? Safety? When you hold one does a sense of peace and comfort flow through you? Or do fear and thoughts of a rather more violent sort arise?
The first thing every Sensei ever told me about weapons was this: The moment you take up a weapon, you usually put yourself at a disadvantage, because you forget all the other weapons you have at your disposal, not to mention your surroundings. In the context, they were of course referring to not forgetting your unarmed skills, but I think it's true in the wider context as well.
Like any other weapon, a gun narrows your focus, and makes the situation as much more dangerous for you as for the person you are aiming at. Unless you have learned to overcome that narrowing, you turn a potentially deadly situation into a certainly deadly one. I'm not saying not to use a gun, but if you are going to, make sure that it doesn't restrict your options rather than giving you more of them.
I don't like guns knives or any type of weapons, I don't believe in violence but I do have lots of self confidence in my own abilities to socialise and get along with folks. For an old bat like I am it is nice to say I am not aware of having any enemies that I may be aware of. I also choose not to go anywhere where there might be problems after certtain hours. If you are a young person then I understand the need to want to go out and have a good time. What I have been suggesting to the young folks here and at the trans meeting here last night is, bring a friend with you. It don't mater if you are a T woman or a GG the perpetrator see a woman vulnerable and alone, easy prey. As Wing Walker and I go everywhere together to do what ever we need to do. But then I'm kind of a sucky I like to go where ever she goes.
Cindy
Being a woman is no joke. I've been pawed, and I've been groped, and I've been stalked. That's why I'm taking martial arts. The most important part of it is knowing that I don't have to be afraid, that I don't have to be a victim.
Vulnerable? Only in the sense that I'm aware that (near-sighted, half-blind) men might see me in sexual terms now. I'm not afraid of them, just aware that they may see me in a very different context than before... and that my actions which would have just been "friendly" as a guy might be interpreted differently now.
But ya know, at 6'2", it's just really hard to feel "vulnerable," lol. I almost feel empowered in a way, as I have the height to protect me (and I think it intimidates some people), and I'm slowly gaining an appreciation for the power of female sexuality ;)
AND, I'm lovin' the way most men instinctively feel a need to protect women, that urge for chivalry. I kinda feel like I've *increased* my safety net out there, rather than become a potential victim everywhere.
I know people talk about a "male privilege," and IMHO it DOES exist. But you know, there's a "female privilege" too which is REALLY nice ;)
Guns and weapons? God no. Don't get me wrong, I've handled them all at one point. But I have this silly notion that tools attract reasons to use them. My faith lies elsewhere.
~Kate~
Quote from: Kate on March 14, 2008, 03:56:54 PM
Guns and weapons? God no. Don't get me wrong, I've handled them all at one point. But I have this silly notion that tools attract reasons to use them. My faith lies elsewhere.
I'd have to agree. Tools of violence tend to aggravate violent situations. All too often you hear stories about people back home in SA resorting to the gun and ending up dead themselves, where there might have been a different outcome had they taken the opportunity to consider alternatives. A weapon should be a last resort, if any resort at all.
Quote from: lady amarant on March 14, 2008, 04:04:03 PM
... All too often you hear stories about people back home in SA resorting to the gun and ending up dead themselves, where there might have been a different outcome had they taken the opportunity to consider alternatives. A weapon should be a last resort, if any resort at all.
In THIS USA as well, Simone.
Quote from: Kate on March 14, 2008, 03:56:54 PM
...and I'm slowly gaining an appreciation for the power of female sexuality ;)
AND, I'm lovin' the way most men instinctively feel a need to protect women, that urge for chivalry. I kinda feel like I've *increased* my safety net out there, rather than become a potential victim everywhere.
I know people talk about a "male privilege," and IMHO it DOES exist. But you know, there's a "female privilege" too which is REALLY nice ;)
... I have this silly notion that tools attract reasons to use them. My faith lies elsewhere.
~Kate~
I'll bite again, not picking on you, Kate. At least not meaning to, but you've written a couple of things this afternoon that have struck me as being worth following up with.
In regard to 'female privilege.' How do you mean that?
Is having one's body 'objectified' a privilege? Or is there something beyond that, like 'being able to form fairly intense relationships w/out the need to sexualize them?' Like with other women, children, etc?
Is there an "African-American" privilege?
I agree that in some situations being part of a minority or a subordinate-class might have some advantages over being a part of the dominant class. But, is there a 'privilege?' And if so how does that play out? What places it in the context of social interactions? Where is it placed?
Goddess, you just say the most intriguing things this afternoon! At least for me! :laugh:
Quote from: Nichole on March 14, 2008, 04:18:31 PM
In THIS USA as well, Simone.
Gee, is there more than one? :P
Many of our citizens aren't aware there are at least two. :laugh: In fact, I think some of our citizens are unaware that there is more than one country on the entire planet!! Just different states all in the USAmerica. :laugh: :laugh:
N~
Hi, Kate,
I would love to have you as my best friend.
As for involving the law, now that is a good question. I have heard that if you are involved in a crime that is a violent interaction with another person, even in self defence, most times it is the trans person the cops haul off to jail.
I read in some paper not long ago of a similar situation and this time it was a GG they hauled off to jail and proceed to beat the crap out of her until she was about an inch being beaten to death. I also believe that this kind of violence is much more prevalent against GG's then it is to us, but then we are a minority compared to GG's.
As I have mentioned in a previous post, a lone woman walking down some empty street at night becomes good bait for a predator. Predators don't bother worrying or waste time debating if you are a GG or a TS, to them you are simply easy prey. Safeguard by bringing a friend with you. Or if you really feel it a necessity for something to defend yourself with, take up some type of martial arts.
Cindy
Quote from: cindybc on March 15, 2008, 05:19:54 AM
As for involving the law, now that is a good question. I have heard that if you are involved in a crime that is a violent interaction with another person, even in self defence, most times it is the trans person the cops haul off to jail.
I read in some paper not long ago of a similar situation and this time it was a GG they hauled off to jail and proceed to beat the crap out of her until she was about an inch being beaten to death. I also believe that this kind of violence is much more prevalent against GG's then it is to us, but then we are a minority compared to GG's.
Rumour, and one off cases that apear to be more prevenant due to bad press they attract....
The police are generally good people, like you and i. A few bad apples stink the whole barrel of good to high hell....
Dont be so quick to judge.
And they will only haul the transperson off to jail if A, they can tell, and B, if they have done something other than utter self defence...
there is such thing as reasonable force... self defence doesnt cover shooting the whole clip at the guy who attacked you. one in the knee is enough if it stops him attacking you, that is all your legally allowed to do. use resonable force to stop the attack, whatever that may be and no more.
Sad thing is, many transpeople hear these stories and go out into the world hating cops.
I feel ashamed that im associated with some of you... when im on the force after university, i garuntee ill get painted with that brush, regardless of my status. Blind hatred makes you no better than the supposed 'transphobic officers'
R >:D
Hi Rachael hon, sorry if my post didn't set right with you. I certainly had not meant to deliberately hurt or upset anyone. I never said that most or all police officers are violently aggressive and could create more problems then good, I only said, I was not certain As to just how often this kind of treatment by police takes place, I really don't know, but it happens. Have you ever been assaulted by one of those predators or street thugs? I pray you never do. Well I have experienced one such situation where I was beaten and assaulted once, ya in the nice little peaceful town I lived in, but thankfully never had a repeat performance luckily my injuries were not severe. I remember a lady on this very board tell me 7 years ago, "you are never 100% safe in any town or city no mater where it is."
I would certainly not want to experience that again. The police were involved, someone else had called them. I was already back home when there was a knock at my door and I opened the door, I was still pretty obviously shook up and she noticed it and she was sympathetic, But then I knew every police person in that town. There was not much she could do to help me as far as finding the perpetrator, but she did sit with me until I chilled out. I will admit I am truly not certain how many bad cops there are, probably in the minority, one can only hope, I thought I had already mentioned that.
I believe there is a thread here on Susan's somewhere that lists violent deaths of TS folks if you wish to check it out. All I wish to emphasise is just be careful and do not expose yourself unnecessarily to any possible dangerous situation where you could get badly hurt or worst. I do send prayers for your success as a police woman Rachael hon.
Cindy
From the first moment I transitioned, I felt much more vulnerable out in the world. I quickly stopped shopping at the 24/7 grocery store at 1 AM, being careful when walking to my car in parking lots, etc. Although I'm now living as androgyne, I don't feel any less vulnerable, even if wearing male clothing. It isn't a friendly world out there for someone who is visibly gender variant.
Z
Quote from: Kate on March 14, 2008, 03:56:54 PM
Vulnerable? Only in the sense that I'm aware that (near-sighted, half-blind) men might see me in sexual terms now. I'm not afraid of them...
Ya know, I sorta take that back. Since reading these threads about fear and vulnerability, I've been paying more attention to how men look at me now. And ya know... it's not exactly FRIENDLY. Older men, and younger but obviously married guys are often super-sweet and chivalrous. THAT I love.
But in noticing my encounters today, AND in hindsight, younger men often give me this look of... I dunno... Wariness? Discomfort? I USED to fear I was being read and making them uncomfortable. But no one else seems to notice me, so I doubt guys have some special ability to tell.
Women are almost always friendly with me, smiling and laughing at whatever chitchat we come up with. But men... men go very quiet, and don't seem to want to make eye contact. They're obviously uncomfortable, but I'm not sure why? I DO think the height has something to do with it, so maybe they're intimidated. I dunno. But in any case, it doesn't exactly give me a warm and fuzzy feeling, lol...
~Kate~
Tall women are intimidating.
How often does a 6 foot guy look up at a women, I'd say, never for 99.5% of them.
Also, strangely, I've found there's a automated response to tall being manly from men
that I don't see in women. Probably again because many women are used to have
other women be taller than them, so they don't see that as a manly trait per see.
Its an automated response in the brain. The brain does a lot of automatic gendering.
In our case, with the height with otherwise female attributes it creates a mixed signal I think.
I don't want to seem discouraging, but that's what I found.
A guy, from a course, which knew my name, I had introduced myself
and he'd seen me in class, still refered me as a "gars"=guys (which
in french is gender related, but not in english) when he left. Very anoying.
Hi Kate I really don't know if this is common anywhere else but I have seen many tall women in supermarkets and malls around Vancouver here. They truly are beautiful looking ladies to, and sometimes I feel like running to Wing Walker and say "De plane!" "De plane!" and then jump her arms. ;D
Cindy
Quote from: Kate on March 17, 2008, 08:13:09 PM
Quote from: Kate on March 14, 2008, 03:56:54 PM
Vulnerable? Only in the sense that I'm aware that (near-sighted, half-blind) men might see me in sexual terms now. I'm not afraid of them...
Ya know, I sorta take that back. Since reading these threads about fear and vulnerability, I've been paying more attention to how men look at me now. And ya know... it's not exactly FRIENDLY. Older men, and younger but obviously married guys are often super-sweet and chivalrous. THAT I love.
But in noticing my encounters today, AND in hindsight, younger men often give me this look of... I dunno... Wariness? Discomfort? I USED to fear I was being read and making them uncomfortable. But no one else seems to notice me, so I doubt guys have some special ability to tell.
Women are almost always friendly with me, smiling and laughing at whatever chitchat we come up with. But men... men go very quiet, and don't seem to want to make eye contact. They're obviously uncomfortable, but I'm not sure why? I DO think the height has something to do with it, so maybe they're intimidated. I dunno. But in any case, it doesn't exactly give me a warm and fuzzy feeling, lol...
~Kate~
Hi, Kate,
I hope that what I have to share with you here is of help to you.
There are more tall women in the general population. I am not a demographer or a marketing specialist but when I casually observe that there are "Tall Girls" stores in shopping areas I believe that there must be a clientele someplace. Same goes for shoe sizes. Many stores stop at women's 10 but more are going to women's 13, in medium and wide widths.
There is much truth to what Keira said about tall women being intimidating. I worked with one woman some years ago who was a perfectly proportioned woman well over six feet tall. I should have had her curves and stature. When she took charge of a meeting she was in-charge.
If you look at the general population you will find more women closer to your height than you know, and here in BC there are many taller than I am, and I am six feet tall, and not thinly-built.
I make eye contact with all people I can as they pass me, however briefly.
With guys I project a "no fear" at young guys, a confident look for those not quite my age, and a warmer, "just-between-us-baby-boomers" look to those my age.
All women get a look that projects a sort of sistership or bonding, however loose it might be. I flash and return smiles of varying degrees of cordiality to all women and I never decline to answer a civil greeting or off-hand remark from another woman. Quite often I hear how nice my nails look or how my skin or makeup look. I always have a smile ready for those times.
No one has had whatever they felt they needed to ask me about my gender.
Wing Walker
While there may be a lot of tall girls, what's considered tall for a girl is not 6 foot or over usualy.
there's less than 0.5% at 6 foot and over and that's even in the younger generation.
Btw, people think height is going up all the time but in fact, children in this generation or probably less than half an inch taller than the previous one. Height is related to nutrion of the mother and the child as he grows up rather than genetics and there's a limit to how tall a population pool can get even if you feed them well.
In Montreal, french canadians are not very tall (avg height for a women is 5 foot 3)
and I'm the tallest women I've seen anywhere.
There may be taller women than 6 foot around here but they are very very rare indeed.
Quote from: Keira on March 18, 2008, 09:41:02 AM
While there may be a lot of tall girls, what's considered tall for a girl is not 6 foot or over usualy.
there's less than 0.5% at 6 foot and over and that's even in the younger generation.
Btw, people think height is going up all the time but in fact, children in this generation or probably less than half an inch taller than the previous one. Height is related to nutrion of the mother and the child as he grows up rather than genetics and there's a limit to how tall a population pool can get even if you feed them well.
In Montreal, french canadians are not very tall (avg height for a women is 5 foot 3)
and I'm the tallest women I've seen anywhere.
There may be taller women than 6 foot around here but they are very very rare indeed.
I did some research on this awhile back. According to the USA Census for 2000, the average height for women in the USA 5' 3.8" . The standard deviation is roughly 2 inches so the vast majority of women in the USA fall between about 5' 2" and 5' 6". That sounds about right to me. At 5' 10", the average height of a USA male, I fall in the 90th percentile of women.
C'est la vie :(
The height of most Americans appears to have largely leveled off, failing to keep pace with the increase in height in many parts of Europe, especially Scandinavian countries, said Richard Steckel of Ohio State University.
"Northern Europeans are now 2 inches taller than Americans," Steckel said. "Seventy-five years ago that wasn't the case. We're falling behind."
Seattle Times: Americans grew in height and weight over past 40 years (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/health/2002074924_bigger28.html)
See also: Wikipedia: Human height: Average adult height around the world (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Average_height#Average_adult_height_around_the_world)
Quote from: Lisbeth on March 18, 2008, 11:43:02 AM
The height of most Americans appears to have largely leveled off, failing to keep pace with the increase in height in many parts of Europe, especially Scandinavian countries, said Richard Steckel of Ohio State University.
"Northern Europeans are now 2 inches taller than Americans," Steckel said. "Seventy-five years ago that wasn't the case. We're falling behind."
I read somewhere that this is largely due to the overall better standards of healthcare in Europe. Don't quote me on that though...
... damn, South Africans are short. Oy vey. Another nail in the coffin of my passing... ::)
America must be a country of midgets, "oooops!" sorry scratch that one. Average height 5'3.8" Wow that's still .8" taller then me. How many other hobbits are there on this board? ;D
Have a good sunshiny day all.
Cindy
Quote from: Keira on March 17, 2008, 09:18:43 PM
Probably again because many women are used to have
other women be taller than them, so they don't see that as a manly trait per see.
Its an automated response in the brain. The brain does a lot of automatic gendering.
In our case, with the height with otherwise female attributes it creates a mixed signal I think.
Awl, darn it! I was hoping I was just
"sexy and exotic" to men, not being read, lol...
But you sure make a good point. Heck, my coworker (woman) across the hall is 6'1" or so, and I have to admit *I* was intimidated by her at first. I'm definately not used to seeing women eye-to-eye. It's an odd feeling, lol.
In any case though, these threads and those reactions HAVE made me more wary of men in general now. It's kind of ashame, because as a guy I really never got any negative reactions from men OR women. But now I fear I've sorta alienated a significant portion of men now :(
Oh well. They'll just have to get used to having a tall woman around!
~Kate~
Awwwwwww! Kate, com on over hon. I'm use to having people taller then me in both sexes and I do think tall women who are
Quotesexy and exotic
I don't think much has changed for me pretty well anyone I meet likes me. I guess my silly sense of humor has something to do with that to. I should have been a stand up comedian. Cindy doffs her hat with long plume and holds it to her midsection and bows gracefully to the clapping, shouting, and whistling crowd. "hee, hee, hee!" Have a wonderful day hon.
Cindy
Quote from: Kate on March 17, 2008, 08:13:09 PM
Older men, and younger but obviously married guys are often super-sweet and chivalrous. THAT I love.
...... younger men often give me this look of... I dunno... Wariness? Discomfort? I USED to fear I was being read and making them uncomfortable.
Women are almost always friendly with me, smiling and laughing at whatever chitchat we come up with. But men... men go very quiet, and don't seem to want to make eye contact. They're obviously uncomfortable, but I'm not sure why? I DO think the height has something to do with it, so maybe they're intimidated. I dunno. But in any case, it doesn't exactly give me a warm and fuzzy feeling, lol...
~Kate~
Kate, Listen to what you said, girl:1.) Older men are friendly and chivalrous.
2.) Women are almost always friendly, and chit chat.
3.) Younger men don't make eye contact, and go all wary.
So, it sounds like it's just the young guys who have some mystic knowledge of who you are. Problem is this:4.) Younger married men are
also friendly and chivalrous.
Two sets of younger men, the married ones friendly, the unmarried ones not friendly.
Okay, my pop psych answer to all this:
Married men, regardless the age, find you attractive, and no threat, since they are not generally "shopping" , but rather, window shopping. Women find you no threat.
Unmarried, usually younger men find you a threat, probably because of your height, because they don't want a negative response from you to any contact that could be construed as an advance.
Okay, this analysis comes from a 5' 6" girl who sees eye to eye with most women. Young unmarried men, and older men alike treat me in a friendly way. I'm no threat to them. Only occasional homophobic women who have their gaydar going feel threatened, and give me the wary look.
Amazons don't give tall men the willies. You gotta find a tall one, if you're looking around, and ignore all those who feel threatened.
Bev
luvs amazons....hehehehe....
Height is about power in men.
Why do you think that the avg height of a CEO is 6 foot 1.
That tall people are seen as more intelligent, charismatic, etc,
regardless of their intrinsic quality (that's been studied extensively).
When your taller than a man, you put him outside his usual role
or protector, of being the strong one in the relation, thus they
are intimidated. Especially if they're not sure of themselves,
which most younger men aren't.
Why do you think models always seem to be dating ordinary older guys.
Because these guys are no longer intimidated by them or because they
have money or whatever, they have some other base of power than their looks
or physical presence.
I like short people. I like tall people. I like people.
I personally don't find tall people intimidating. It's the really small squirrelly ones you have to look out for (ankle biters are the worst!)
Hi Kir Better invest some money into buying stove pipe to put around your legs when you go int small squirrely people territory. Don't have to worry about me though, I do more barking then biting.
Cindy
Quote from: Kate on March 18, 2008, 12:25:11 PM
But you sure make a good point. Heck, my coworker (woman) across the hall is 6'1" or so, and I have to admit *I* was intimidated by her at first. I'm definately not used to seeing women eye-to-eye. It's an odd feeling, lol.
I
am used to seeing women eye-to-eye, but that's because I live in Minnesota "where all the women are strong, all the men are good looking, and all the children are above average."
Quote from: lady amarant on March 18, 2008, 12:00:17 PM
Quote from: Lisbeth on March 18, 2008, 11:43:02 AM
The height of most Americans appears to have largely leveled off, failing to keep pace with the increase in height in many parts of Europe, especially Scandinavian countries, said Richard Steckel of Ohio State University.
"Northern Europeans are now 2 inches taller than Americans," Steckel said. "Seventy-five years ago that wasn't the case. We're falling behind."
I read somewhere that this is largely due to the overall better standards of healthcare in Europe. Don't quote me on that though...
... damn, South Africans are short. Oy vey. Another nail in the coffin of my passing... ::)
I wonder if that's why people usually think I'm European. Doesn't being foreign/different always have a sexual connotation in people's minds? LOL
No one cares how tall you are if you're cute, Simone ;)
Quote from: soldierjane on March 22, 2008, 12:33:31 PM
No one cares how tall you are if you're cute, Simone ;)
Operative phrase being "IF you're cute." :P
Quote from: lady amarant on March 22, 2008, 12:41:14 PM
Quote from: soldierjane on March 22, 2008, 12:33:31 PM
No one cares how tall you are if you're cute, Simone ;)
Operative phrase being "IF you're cute." :P
You're just a closet hottie, admit it. ;)
Quote from: soldierjane on March 22, 2008, 01:20:20 PM
You're just a closet hottie, admit it. ;)
Aw, thank you!!! But no. ;)