Everyone is welcome to join in but this question is primarily for the older girls... those of you that started your transition
later than say 35. Girls that had careers and lives as males. I think Lori posted something about this a few
days ago... she said something like "I don't want to transition, I have to transition". I've thought a lot about that
and at first I thought that was a funny thing to say. At the time I thought I wanted to transition. But the more
I thought about it the more sense it made and I think I feel the same way.
I don't WANT to transition... but I HAVE to. But the part of me that doesn't want to, the part that worries
about my SO, the part that realizes the pain I'm causing people and will cause people, the part that wants
things like they've always been seems to be in control right now.
I HAVE to get laser but I don't WANT to.
I HAVE to start coming out to people but I don't WANT to.
I HAVE to get FFS but I don't WANT to.
Please don't misinterpret what I'm saying... I have little doubt that I'm not TS... that is not what this is about. This
is about having the will to allow myself to live as me. To risk everything for my happiness. I posted
a while back that I was 99% sure I was TS, some lower percentage, maybe around 80% that I thought I could
pass and successfully transition and an even lower percentage that I wanted to risk my current life to do it.
I'm assuming this is the same for everyone, you HAVE to transition but you feel trapped by your current life.
So... my question is... when did HAVING to transition win out over not WANTING to for you? What was your breaking point,
where you said to yourself... "I've got to transition, somehow, someway, it MUST happen... I HAVE to do it"
Amanda
QuoteI'm assuming this is the same for everyone, you HAVE to transition but you feel trapped by your current life
That is a poor assumption. I transitioned when I had the power to do so. It took 40 years to have the resources. I would not start until I knew I could finish. I was never trapped in my life I have always enjoyed success.
Thank you Amanda for this thread.
Most of the membership will not know much of my recent past and I do not aim to go into it tonight, apart from Berliegh knowing, my life is still a closed book here but in good time, all shall become clear.
In essence, my moment of clarity re. transition, came as I was lying paralysed on my hospital bed at the very end of 2006. Christmas was done with and New Years was approaching and I had my third stroke. I had visits from priests, social workers and various people 'doing good' and I realised that no matter how much quiet patient planning I had done, my time was running out and that if I did nothing, I would never get the chance to put right the dreadful wrong that was my male existence.
Within 4 weeks of my discharge from the hospital, I had resolved that my life as a male had ended and I took the necessary legal steps to alter my identity and I have not had a single moment of regret from that day. Okay, I have had run ins with yobbish youths, intolerant adults and medical officialdom but I have come to realise that all of us have these problems.
QuoteI don't WANT to transition... but I HAVE to. But the part of me that doesn't want to, the part that worries
about my SO, the part that realizes the pain I'm causing people and will cause people, the part that wants
things like they've always been seems to be in control right now.
I HAVE to get laser but I don't WANT to.
I HAVE to start coming out to people but I don't WANT to.
I HAVE to get FFS but I don't WANT to.
I wanted to transition,
I want Laser or the old fashiond electrolysis,
I would like FFS if I could afford it.......
I wanted to transition because I needed to, I was just running out of time and in such a situation, the mind and soul becomes sharply into focus.... :)
I do not claim to have the answers or a special insight, please do not think this of me, but Amanda asked the question and each of us will have our own agenda when it comes to our final destiny because after all, we have had a dreadful hand of cards at our birth.. :-\
QuoteI wanted to transition because I needed to
It's a fine difference in what I'm saying. I NEED to and I HAVE to transition... those are given... I just don't WANT
to... who WANTS to put themselves through this? Who WANTS to destroy their current life. Who WANTS to
cause others pain.
Jennifer... I'm sorry to hear about your health issues. I hope things are better for you. :)
QuoteThat is a poor assumption. I transitioned when I had the power to do so. It took 40 years to have the resources. I would not start until I knew I could finish. I was never trapped in my life I have always enjoyed success.
I've enjoyed success as well but I feel trapped by that success... you know? I may have to give up my current life
to be happy in my gender. It's a terrible trade off we have to make.
Amanda
I was coming closer and closer to suicide. All I could think about was how I`m in the wrong body. Driving to work every morning I wanted to pull off into the lava fields. I would sit at the beach and wish I could be there female and full of life. I would have to say it was the overwelming suicidal urges i had that broke me. I needed a way out and found it. Now I`m 5 months HRT and felling good. Angie
If you don't mind a reply from an over-35 ftm...
I'm very successful and well educated; I'm a professional and have a good reputation in the community. I have a good job, family, and a few close personal friends. There is no doubt I'm transgendered. There is no doubt that I'll transition. Heck, I've already started.
My turning point came about a month ago when I had my AHA! moment. While I've always known I was male, I pushed it aside and tried to be a 'good girl.' I told myself I just had odd fantasies, and everybody had them. But after my divorce something was gnawing at me. And I finally figured it out. And denied it. And researched it. And accepted it.
Do I want to basically tell the world my private business?? No. But in order to truly be myself, I think I have to. The shift in my mental state changed instantly when I ditched my women's clothing and makeup, stuff that grossed me out my entire life, that I forced myself to put up with.
I understand the reluctance to disrupt everything. I also understand the intense need to transition and be myself. I'm standing on the edge...
Bottom line is: I will most likey transition because I *have* to in the sense of finally being true to myself. Fortunately my future plans already included a lot of travel and an online job, so I can go stealth.
Jay
QuoteI've enjoyed success as well but I feel trapped by that success... you know? I may have to give up my current life
to be happy in my gender. It's a terrible trade off we have to make.
It is not a trade off. We do things that teach us and help us grow. We can not take anything past our death change is life, not to change is not growing. The only thing that can trap you is if your choices are not coming from your soul but from your ego.
QuoteWho WANTS to destroy their current life. Who WANTS to
cause others pain.
If you are not content you have no life to destroy. We have no control over how other's feel they are the one's that create the pain. We can help them grow also. Too many people think they have control over the world around them. The world was here before and will be after. Beliefs create most of people's problems.
QuoteIt is not a trade off. We do things that teach us and help us grow. We can not take anything past our death change is life, not to change is not growing.
You are thinking ONLY of yourself when you talk of change. What if those around do not want change. What if
they are happy the way things are? I disagree... it most definitely is a trade off, you are trading your happiness
for the happiness of those around you. How they react to the change is part of the equation. I know I can be happy
as a women. I'm not sure if those around me can be. So I feel trapped... do I follow the path to my happiness or as
I always have put the happiness of others first?
QuoteThe only thing that can trap you is if your choices are not coming from your soul but from your ego.
I have no idea what this means :( and I'd love to hear more :)
QuoteIf you are not content you have no life to destroy.
I have a life, it's not the life that I want, but it is a life.
Quote
We have no control over how other's feel they are the one's that create the pain.
I think my changes cause pain to other people, they choose how that react to the changes, but I created
the pain because it's my change not theirs.
Amanda
*smile* Lisa, you are such a cognitive-behavioralist!! :laugh: Aaron and Judith Beck would love you no end at all.
N~
Quote from: Nichole on April 29, 2008, 06:00:58 PM
*smile* Lisa, you are such a cognitive-behavioralist!! :laugh: Aaron and Judith Beck would love you no end at all.
N~
LOL... I have no idea what this means :( and I'd love to hear more :)
Amanda
Check it out "Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy" on Wikipedia.
QuoteCheck it out "Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy" on Wikipedia.
I actually did just that after reading your initial post...
QuoteCognitive-behavioral therapy is based on the idea that our thoughts
cause our feelings and behaviors, not external things, like people, situations,
and events. The benefit of this fact is that we can change the way we think to
feel / act better even if the situation does not change.
...and I agree with that 100%... it's how you react to any situation
that determines the outcome. But I don't see how it applies to what lisa said. I can
control my side of the change... I cannot control how others react, so it is a trade off
to me because I'm making the change.
Amanda
QuoteBut I don't see how it applies to what lisa said.
QuoteBeliefs create most of people's problems.
See any similarities now?
Event----> Reaction ----> <---- Automatic thoughts<---- Intermediate beliefs<---- Core Beliefs.
No I really don't... im sorry... I don't get it at all.
LOL... ok your editing your posts...
QuoteEvent----> Reaction ----> <---- Automatic thoughts<---- Intermediate beliefs<---- Core Beliefs.
You are light years ahead of me on this... I have NO idea what that means :)
Amanda
(made from the densest wood)
The diagram above is the basic presumption of CBT, core beliefs being the most deeply held and unconscious/pre-conscious beliefs.
Going back to the original topic.
I had lots of breaking points, it took me more then one to come round to now feel like I am ready for transition. If you have been following my "Battle Within" story (lastest chaper here https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,34048.0.html ), you will relise that I have covered the first breaking point, my big break down at work. The next serise of breaking points will happen in my next chapter called "anytime" (yes I have more writting to do), and in particular the days I thought I would act on suicidal thoughts just broke me into nothing. I had to move forward to now where I am comfortable with my decision to transition.
Alice
Quote from: AlwaysAmanda on April 29, 2008, 06:00:21 PM
QuoteIt is not a trade off. We do things that teach us and help us grow. We can not take anything past our death change is life, not to change is not growing.
You are thinking ONLY of yourself when you talk of change. What if those around do not want change. What if
they are happy the way things are? I disagree... it most definitely is a trade off, you are trading your happiness
for the happiness of those around you. How they react to the change is part of the equation. I know I can be happy
as a women. I'm not sure if those around me can be. So I feel trapped... do I follow the path to my happiness or as
I always have put the happiness of others first?
QuoteThe only thing that can trap you is if your choices are not coming from your soul but from your ego.
I have no idea what this means :( and I'd love to hear more :)
QuoteIf you are not content you have no life to destroy.
I have a life, it's not the life that I want, but it is a life.
Quote
We have no control over how other's feel they are the one's that create the pain.
I think my changes cause pain to other people, they choose how that react to the changes, but I created
the pain because it's my change not theirs.
Amanda
Just to respond to this, hon.
Women are always putting the needs and happiness of others before their own, but it's time to look out for number one. Don't feel bad for it. You've got to be true to yourself even if others get hurt in the process.
Remember hon - You didn't create or choose this problem but you're going to fix it. Don't feel bad for putting yourself first for a change.
Quote from: Nero on April 29, 2008, 07:00:02 PMWomen are always putting the needs and happiness of others before their own, but it's time to look out for number one. Don't feel bad for it. You've got to be true to yourself even if others get hurt in the process.
Remember hon - You didn't create or choose this problem but you're going to fix it. Don't feel bad for putting yourself first for a change.
I love you, Nero. :)
You don't know how badly I need to hear this.
How badly it hurts when my family accuses me I'm harming my children by transitioning--and they refuse to listen when I tell them it isn't a choice and if I couldn't transition, I'd be dead by now. They make themselves stone deaf.
And then I reflect how for the first 45 years of my life, I did exactly what they're demanding--I suppressed my own needs to satisfy the demands of my family-- until I just couldn't keep doing that any more. I get no credit for having stuck it out that long, even though it had been slowly killing me inside for all those years. If I had continued to obey their demands, I would have killed myself for sure-- but they are so determined to heap guilt on me, they will never let go of their absolute denial of my needs, no matter how I try to get through to their stony hearts, they will never give an inch. Their denial is so deep they have no idea of how badly they hurt me by it.
They deny that I'm a woman but if I hadn't been so timid and withdrawn in nature, so easily coerced into putting the family's wishes ahead of my own, I would have asserted my own demands long ago.
Amanda, I attribute my ability to finally come out and transition to my process of maturation, how I finally grew a backbone when I reached the age when many women are able to come into their own power after having served their family's needs all their lives. In reading other women's stories of maturation and discovery of their own power, I recognize myself.
FFS? Of course I don't WANT it. I want to get few surgeries as possible and stay in good health. But I will most likely NEED FFS not WANT it.
SRS I will get not only for my body image issues but for good health so I can lower my HRT doses.
My breaking point?
Realizing I was selfishly messing up my wife's life, AND my own, by not facing facts. Taking the easy route of inertia, stringing my wife along with the hope I'd become who she needed me to be someday.
No, I wasn't sacraficing myself for anyone, or putting my dreams on hold for them, or... nothing like that. I was immature and afraid and lazy, and was getting some of the things *I* wanted from the relationship: a close, though platonic girlfriend, a female life I could "leech" off of, acceptance and closeness of femalekind... oh sure, it was great. FOR ME.
The poor girl would ask me constantly over two decades if I was going to transition someday, and while I wouldn't dare say yes, I also just could not bring myself to say NO, NEVER. I couldn't do it. The more she pushed, the more I avoided it, and the more I realized that I couldn't say NO because I knew.. I KNEW... I would have to. Somehow. Someday. When the stars were Just Right. I was just setting up the chess pieces for the Perfect Move, where I could do it and no one would be able to stop me. My entire life had been one long manipulation to make that happen.
Yea, I'm an immature, selfish bitch.
It all built into an avalanche of clarity one bitterly cold Thanksgiving Day, when I stood in the howling wind, tears freezing to my face, fully realizing what I had done to her, AND me - and was going to do to both of us now. I never "decided" to transition really. I just realized I WOULD, and all the rest... the whining and crying on here for two years was just me venting at the futility of resistance. I KNEW I would. I ALWAYS knew I would.
I realized that I *am* That Kind Of Person. Someone who believes in something so deeply, so insanely selfishly, that it's more important to me than anything. ANYTHING, including my wife's happiness... or even my life itself. It's horrible. It's ugly.
But it's also the Truth.
~Kate~
Quote from: Kate on April 30, 2008, 08:33:56 PM
I realized that I *am* That Kind Of Person. Someone who believes in something so deeply, so insanely selfishly, that it's more important to me than anything. ANYTHING, including my wife's happiness... or even my life itself. It's horrible. It's ugly.
But it's also the Truth.
Hmmm, more taking a responsibility after the fact, and ignoring the fact itself to take responsibility for it. We all seem to do that, well, most of us, especially after a certain age and after certain life choices we made.
As I have told you, I feel more for the women we loved and married prior to our transitions than I do for us. But, I also wonder very much if that 'feel' isn't exactly what I am calling you out on as well. We internalize this sense that 'becoming an autherntic self' is selfish, yet we praise the authenticity of the soldier who 'throws himself on a grenade' to save his buddy.
We are left in a relational, emotional and moral quandry for which we 'blame' ourselves as though that blame can somehow expiate our perceived sins. It cannot. It never could. The fault of being born as you are, as I was, is whose 'fault?' Whose 'fault' is Down's Syndrome?
To become an authentic self seems to me to be more important, and better for all concerned than continuing to tamp-down that authenticity in the interest of 'saving someone else from hurt.' Who have you, or I, saved from hurt lately? And if you saved her from hurt, what price did that salvation exact on you?
To become authentic seems better late than never. And for me, or you, to moan and hair-pull and garment-rend seems like a pose to me. A pose that says, "See how long-suffering I was? Why couldn't I suffer more?" And, thus, we often set things up to increase our suffering. We must 'pay' for being born transsexual. How does one do that? By protesting our guilt, shame and inadequacy on a BB for some of the world to see? Or, maybe making sure that our lives totally fall-apart and we become martyrs to the cause of engendering constant happiness for another, or others?
Strange, that. My ex, my sister, my brother, were never completely happy and content prior to my transition. What difference would my not transitioning have made, honestly?
Some pretty smart cookie told someone else on this board lately that:
It is what it is. She was right. If we find it otherwise we collude in our own martyrdom and take the fire like many of those early Christians took the sword or the lions: sincerely hoping for martyrdom to 'prove' our sanctity.
We aren't saints, Kate. Neither you nor I, we are women. To embrace that is to embrace the contingent nature of our existence. You haven't colluded in your wife's disappointment. To shoulder the blame for her unhappiness alone is to claim something that is not yours: the responsibility for making another happy & content. We cannot do that, no matter the 'should-have-dones.'
Admit that you feel good about transitioning. That you enjoy who you are becoming, and that deep-down you wouldn't trade your own authenticity for anyone else's so-called happiness.
That is neither horrible nor ugly.
Now,
THAT'S the truth.
Nichole
Quote from: Nichole on April 30, 2008, 09:31:14 PM
And, thus, we often set things up to increase our suffering. We must 'pay' for being born transsexual. How does one do that? By protesting our guilt, shame and inadequacy on a BB for some of the world to see? Or, maybe making sure that our lives totally fall-apart and we become martyrs to the cause of engendering constant happiness for another, or others?
Not fallin' for the public display of self-loathing, huh? Sigh. Therapists! I can't get away with *anything* around here anymore, lol.
Yes, quite so, although I tend to self-flagellate myself in other ways usually. Oh poor me, I'll never be a REAL girl. Oh poor me, I'll never be BORN a girl, so why bother? Oh poor me...
Still, I think the "breaking point" is often when we do finally see what we are, what we've been doing, and truly accept it all for the first time... in all it's purity, rawness and exposed vulnerability. You just can't go back after that. You can't close your eyes again. The heart would just wither and die if you tried. However it's interpreted by us or anyone else, however we GOT to this point in our lives... we're here now.
It's like following the route on a map for decades, trying to get to some mythical destination, only to suddenly realize the map is totally fake... you've been following directions for another country, another planet all along, yet believing the whole time that it HAD to be you messing up the instructions. It COULDN'T be the map, nooooo of course not.
And damn. One day you realize it IS the map that's wrong. Totally. And you've made a mess of things wandering all over the darn place trying to MAKE it work. And here you are. Lost now from your own wanderings and ignorance of the facts.
What to do but accept that it happened... and try to find your way home?
I'm sorry Amanda. You ARE breaking. And you know it. All the
Old Ways are failing you now, aren't they? Your hiding places vanishing? Things you thought you valued suddenly in question? Doing and thinking things that "aren't you?" Hating yourself for daring to believe you actually *deserve* something?
Don't leave us, OK? Just lurk if you have to, but stay connected... to us or anyone you can. Vent. Scream. Cry. Do whatever you have to do, but don't cut yourself off, OK?
~Kate~
Following maps? *smile* Last I checked they were printing maps on a page. Only takes a second to get from Philly to NYC or SF on a map.
Seems to me like we should be following a road, or track, or path. Or be on an airliner following an air-route.
Perhaps, if we put the map aside and just watch the roadsigns the problem will be less than it is trying to follow a map made by another, for another's journey.
Love,
Nichole
My breaking point was the when I discovered an inner harmony that I never knew was missing.
To make a short story long... (Only half joking.)
My kids and I had different Spring Breaks. So, my wife (seems strange to call her that nowadays) took the kids to the Out Banks of North Carolina. While they were gone, I would become me when I got home from school. I even took a day off to get my hair done, visit some friends and meet with my counselor.
By my counseling session, I knew I was transsexual.
My counselor had always been surprised at how conservative I had been when looking at my own ->-bleeped-<-. From early in our sessions, she had me far more towards being transsexual than what I did.
I needed data.
The week I spent as me was that data. Indeed, that particular day was the crucial datum I needed.
What I felt, was a normalicy that I had never before experienced. I was finally comfortable in my own skin, and that was a first for me. I was 48 years old at the time, and I finally liked the person looking back at me in the mirror.
That was April 2006. June 2006, I was handed my bag and told I couldn't live at the house any longer.
Over the past two years, I have had many doubts, questions and concerns about my transition timeline, but I never doubted that I would transition.
Once you have experinced that deep, inner harmony, there is no turning back. Transitioning becomes a need, not a want.
Chaunte
My breaking point was when I took a ride to the hospital in the back of an ambulance, and started to realise that if I didn't do something I would die as a male, and I couldn't bear the thought of that.
QuoteJune 2006, I was handed my bag and told I couldn't live at the house any longer.
I was dismissed from my 'family' and I felt llike I was released from a prison of conformity. Thirty years later, I was released from the demands of social conformity when i decided that life as a male was no longer tenable and that if I did nothing about it, I would soon die. I had my third stroke, was paralysed, unable to do anything a normal human could do without aid, unable to speak, unable to do the most basic toilet and washing tasks alone, very alone and wishing upon death.
Those events and probable outcomes helped me to make the decisions to take full contol of my life, become a little more insistant with my doctors and take conntrol of my life. My employer terminated me, my family were non-existent, my friends deserted me and I had nothing to lose by going fulltime as a female because I had no other human to answer to. I was a free bird for the first time in my life.
I am probably very ugly, I get abuse daily, I feel hairy in the wrong places, feel very inadequate, often feel as if I am being fraudulent by trying to live as a female, I get criticised because I cannot make babies like a 'real' woman or cannot satisfy a man like a real woman can etc., do not know how a woman feels each month during menstruation, Child care, husband ego management, managing the demands of a rampant penis etc......
Breaking point?
I cannot nor will not diminish any of the postings before this one because the nature of forums is to speak freely among friends and I truely hope that all of us can speak freely here and in that spirit, here lies my thoughts.... :angel:
My breaking point was in two parts..
1) Seeing family and friends dying from all sorts of things...here today gone tomorrow, some never reaching or doing what they wanted to do. I realized I was not going to live for ever...you have one go at this...and I better not past it up.
2) Could not go on anymore with this problem I had since a child and could not understand the problem and the need of dressing up which was a secret from everyone (my wife thought it was just kinky game, the couple of times I was seen dressed and we had sex) I just could not take this secret life any more and started to do research on the net to better understand this and to talk to others like me, this was about 9 years ago, I was in my late 30's at this time. After I had a good understanding about my situation I broke the news to my wife and thats where my life took some wicked turns as she could not accept it, and left within 3 months of the talk :'(.....Anyway I would say this period of time was my breaking point.
QuoteI am probably very ugly, I get abuse daily, I feel hairy in the wrong places, feel very inadequate, often feel as if I am being fraudulent by trying to live as a female
Jennifer... I like your new avatar... and you are now where near ugly. Not even close sweets.
But I feel the see the same things in myself: ugly, hairy, inadequate, fraudulent, these are words that define
us... for now. But I think they are not life sentences, we will bloom and they WILL be forgotten given time.
Amanda
Quote from: AlwaysAmanda on April 29, 2008, 03:40:42 PM
It's a fine difference in what I'm saying. I NEED to and I HAVE to transition... those are given... I just don't WANT
to... who WANTS to put themselves through this? Who WANTS to destroy their current life. Who WANTS to
cause others pain.
Amanda
You got it. I've always wanted to be a girl. It when I needed to do it when I realized I was married, had a kid, good job, and fully entwined into a male/husband/father life. A successful one at that. Who in their right mind would want to give all of that up to change sex?
A Transsexual pushed to their limit. I still don't WANT to do any of it, I have to do it now. It needs to be done. I need to get it out of the way so I can go on. I've hit a dead end, a brick wall. I'm in checkmate in the game of life. There are no more moves. It's time to play a new game.
QuoteA Transsexual pushed to their limit. I still don't WANT to do any of it, I have to do it now. It needs to be done. I need to get it out of the way so I can go on. I've hit a dead end, a brick wall. I'm in checkmate in the game of life. There are no more moves. It's time to play a new game.
That about sums up where I am too... I feel like I may have a move or two left... but clearly out of good options.
Amanda
Quote from: AlwaysAmanda on May 13, 2008, 01:24:15 PM
QuoteI am probably very ugly, I get abuse daily, I feel hairy in the wrong places, feel very inadequate, often feel as if I am being fraudulent by trying to live as a female
Jennifer... I like your new avatar... and you are now where near ugly. Not even close sweets.
But I feel the see the same things in myself: ugly, hairy, inadequate, fraudulent, these are words that define
us... for now. But I think they are not life sentences, we will bloom and they WILL be forgotten given time.
Amanda
Thank you Amanda for the kind words. I don't get many and you have boosted me tonight after a torrid day. I hold on to the prospect of being prescribed hormone therapy following my next visit to the Gender Idenntity Clinic in London in June because I am convinced that this will do great things with how I feel about my looks, maybe even change them in those subtle ways that oestogen alone can manage. I struggle to see what it is 'exactly' that seperates a male from a female face apart from the look and texture of the skin and that a girls is usually considered 'attractive' whilst a man is either 'handsome' or downright ugly.
As for the torrid nature of my day, I was in town to meet with someone. I waited an hour but the person failed to turn up. I felt very exposed and vulnerable just waiting around in all my fine work clothes ( skirt, blouse, tights, low heels, scarf and name badge ), 2 men approached me 'for a chat' and a number of teenage schoolie's decided that I was game for some taunting, I felt an obvious ->-bleeped-<- rather than a less than attractive 48 yr old woman abnd I eventually made my way to my place of work feeling rather annoyed . For a short while, I am ashamed to admit to feeling like giving up with transition until I had a few million currency units, a private island off the coast of Thailand and Dr Suporn at my disposal to rearrange my face etc., however I am not going to just give up.
I was and remain well aware that transition from man to woman is no easy ball game and was given sound warning and advice from my friend Berliegh and despite her cruel bluntness, she was 100% correct. When born, we are given our gender on the basis of visible genital arrangement and raised accordingly. This may remain the case for ever until the social world and the medical world in particular realise that as human souls with emotions and the power of intelligent thought, we each tend to follow an inbuilt instinct. In our cases, we follow a gender path that is at odds with our genital arrangements but by the time we realise this, we have been brainwashed into a life that in many cases, is quite intolerable and needs to be corrected.
I mentioned above the taunting that came my way from a group of school students, they saw me and instantly hurled loud abuse in a public arena directly at me. What bothered me about the incident was the fact that those kids were all GIRLS!! What kind of future do any of us have if our youngsters behave like this? God help future young people that have gender identity crises because without a serious and concerted campaign of education much like the one that has given the Gay community the recognition that they clearly deserved, we have a bleak future. :(
Very simple for me...it was a class in college called:
"Sex, Self and Psychoanalysis"
Made my situation very real to me...and was one of the best classes I have ever had.
QuoteI hold on to the prospect of being prescribed hormone therapy following my next visit to the Gender Idenntity Clinic in London in June because I am convinced that this will do great things with how I feel about my looks, maybe even change them in those subtle ways that oestogen alone can manage.
Wow... from your avatar I would have thought you were already on hormones. I think they will do wonders for you. I don't think if
I knew I would call you trans from your avatar picture. I just see a woman.
QuoteI struggle to see what it is 'exactly' that separates a male from a female face apart from the look and texture of the skin and that a girls is usually considered 'attractive' whilst a man is either 'handsome' or downright ugly.
Well.... some of the things are the forehead does not protrude as much, a shorter upper lip, a short chin height... all of which you
seem to have from your avatar. I think your face is quite pleasing and I think hormones will enhance that. I have the same
problem looking at myself... all I see if male but it gets better every day. There have been some glimpses of Amanda
when I'm in boy mode the last couple of week and I hope that the changes continue.
I'm so sorry you have to put up with taunts and name calling, I feel for you. That is how some kids (many) are raised and
socialized I guess in todays world.
Amanda
Quote from: Christine on May 14, 2008, 03:05:10 PM
Very simple for me...it was a class in college called:
"Sex, Self and Psychoanalysis"
Made my situation very real to me...and was one of the best classes I have ever had.
Hello Christine, it is often the most unexpected that gives us the opening that releases us from our private jail. My get out of jail card was paralysis in a hospital bed following my 3rd stroke, nothing more to lose apart from life itself, rather concentrates the mind somewhat.....
We all need that kick up the butt and it is amazing how that comes to us all........ :angel:
Posted on: 14 May 2008, 21:35:19
QuoteWell.... some of the things are the forehead does not protrude as much, a shorter upper lip, a short chin height... all of which you
seem to have from your avatar. I think your face is quite pleasing and I think hormones will enhance that. I have the same
problem looking at myself... all I see if male but it gets better every day.
Amanda, Once again I thank you for your kind appraisal. Your desciption of my 'forehead, shorter upper lip, chin height etc. mean little to me because I have minimal understanding of this. The upper lip does interest me most of all because I constantly see women showing their top teeth more and in a very attractive way, something that is missing with men......do I make any sense? I call it the Billie Piper, Jodie Kidd mouth, this is one of the things I desire, perhaps more than a female facial surgury or a boob job because it is the small details that clinch it in the eyes of others that decide if I be considered a woman or not.. :)
QuoteAmanda, Once again I thank you for your kind appraisal. Your desciption of my 'forehead, shorter upper lip, chin height etc. mean little to me because I have minimal understanding of this. The upper lip does interest me most of all because I constantly see women showing their top teeth more and in a very attractive way, something that is missing with men......do I make any sense? I call it the Billie Piper, Jodie Kidd mouth, this is one of the things I desire, perhaps more than a female facial surgury or a boob job because it is the small details that clinch it in the eyes of others that decide if I be considered a woman or not..
Your most welcome :) I guess it's OK to hijack my own topic... but instead I started a new one to discuss this:
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,35032.new.html#new
Amanda
My breaking point was when my wife said she would never leave me (when I told her that I hoped she'd never leave me), yet when I asked her if she'd divorce me if I did look like a woman, she said "I'm not attracted to women". THAT coupled with the realization that she was never any more visibly attracted to me when I looked all macho and muscular, turned on the light bulb. Let others deal with the confusion, for me it is quite simple: Transition! It's not all doom and gloom, though. Yesterday we went to the Wal-Mart in my home town (I am from a small town where quite a few people would recognize me) and I was very concerned about my appearance. I was wearing a pair of my wife's purple maternity pants, and dark blue gardening shoes (the kind that Wal-Mart sells). From the waist down it was pretty obvious that I was dressed feminine. I had our son with us. There were A LOT of people taking second looks at me, and a few of them looked at me in the eyes, then stared at my legs and feet. It was a little unnerving. In the end, I survived and my wife said to me "Remember, be who you are". I think she is comfortable with the thinking that I am a tomboy (which I am). If I born a girl, I would still enjoy carpentry, doing heavy work in the garden and trying to hit softballs as far as I could hit them. Lately, more women have been calling me "sweety", so I don't know if that means I am coming off as feminine, or that I look feminine, or both. Anyway, I'm rambling as I'm prone to do on here. I will be seeing an endo in September. In the meantime I am trying to wrestle my hair loss. Went to pick up my scripts yesterday at Wal-Mart, and was told that my insurance denied Propecia. The pharmacist told me that I should have my doctor prescribe Proscar instead, that it was "the same exact thing". Well, I read on some hair loss forums last night that Proscar isn't that effective in treating hair loss, because of the differences in dosages and the need to have the same dosage each time out. Depressing :(
Aeron
Quote from: AeronTG on May 24, 2008, 09:41:30 AM
The pharmacist told me that I should have my doctor prescribe Proscar instead, that it was "the same exact thing". Well, I read on some hair loss forums last night that Proscar isn't that effective in treating hair loss, because of the differences in dosages and the need to have the same dosage each time out.
They are almost the same: Propecia has 1 mg finasteride per pill, while Proscar has 5 mg. The difference doesn't really matter as far as blood DHT levels go, but I guess prostate issues are serious enough that a larger safety margin is a good thing. The thing is, though, that a quarter pill of Proscar is just as good for hair as one pill of Propecia, and much cheaper. If you want something slightly more effective, dutasteride (Avodart) is a bit better at blocking the conversion of testosterone to DHT, and since it's primarily intended to treat prostate enlargement like Proscar it too is likely covered by your insurance. Anyway, all of these will mostly just prevent any further loss, not cause much re-growth of hair that has already been lost.
I hope this wasn't too much of a violation against the forum rules regarding drug and dosage discussions. If so, please accept my apologies.
Nfr
Quote from: Seshatneferw on May 24, 2008, 11:00:19 AM
Anyway, all of these will mostly just prevent any further loss, not cause much re-growth of hair that has already been lost.
I was looking at some very old photos of myself the other night, and was shocked to see how much MORE hair I had in my mid/late thirties versus my late twenties... all because of taking Propecia for five years or so (long before HRT). It worked fairly well for me, but obviously took quite some time to show significant results.
~Kate~
First I would like to thank Nero for that statement. You cannot know what it means to hear another say that.
"Women are always putting the needs and happiness of others before their own, but it's time to look out for number one. Don't feel bad for it. You've got to be true to yourself even if others get hurt in the process.
Remember hon - You didn't create or choose this problem but you're going to fix it. Don't feel bad for putting yourself first for a change."
For far too many years I did exactly that. Even now, Im not sure sometimes whether Ive caused more harm to myself or to others by allowing myself to do that. Sad to say, I dont believe my family will ever admit to that sentiment in full. I never ever thought that I was such good husband/father/stepfather that I would be so opposed in this. Another thread that.
My breaking point was a series of points over 40+ years and culminated last July. Each one getting more severe and harder to handle. I wont go into a lot of details or this thread will turn into another book. Basically after 4 suicides (I call them that because there is no way short of shear luck or devine power that I should be writing this today) and years of misinformation, lack of knowledge, and the building of sucessive walls and barriers that those methods I had put in place finally failed.
I can only speculate as to why now and not sooner. But thankfullly, finally I have been empowered to allow myself the gift that I have ever known. That gift of finally knowing yourself and allowing yourself to be known to the world. Had it not been for two caring women where I work and them hearing my pain, I would have made suicide number five the last one, for I was going to jump from 14 floors up.
Once I found out that the times had changed and I was not alone and others like me were there and I could talk to them, it was nothing but forward for me. It has not been pain free nor do I expect the rest to be without it but that is where my breaking point was, at least the one that put me over the top. I am 61 years old and had tried to transition in the early 1970's but was denied it by the medical field then. Hugs as always.
Wendy
I quite agree with Nichole's well expressed thoughts and feelings that she has so well expressed in her post.
QuoteI think the "breaking point" is often when we do finally see what we are, what we've been doing, and truly accept it all for the first time... in all it's purity, rawness and exposed vulnerability. You just can't go back after that. You can't close your eyes again. The heart would just wither and die if you tried. However it's interpreted by us or anyone else, however we GOT to this point in our lives... we're here now.
My first wake up call was when I was contemplating on driving my car into a rock cut one night on my way home, That was the deciding point that convinced me it was time for Cindy to be born.
I have felt those feelings as well, probably the vulnerability, insecurity and fear would have got the best of me if I had not met Wing Walker. We supported each other. I did as someone has mentioned. I did not make the decision to begin transitioning. It was not a decision it was just a need to move ahead, it was easier to go forward once I surrendered to become me. Kate you are a very beautiful and awesome butterfly that is about to take it's first flight into the brilliant blue sky.
Cindy
I am 56 years old and I see myself as a middle-aged woman. My breaking point came after I knew that I was not supposed to be a boy at age five. It was solidified when I was 9 years old and knew that I should have been the girl standing in-line in front of me in the fourth grade. It stayed internalized, suppressed for 42 years, until I was 51. that was in 2002.
I tried to touch my dream after I left the military in 1974 but back then such things were considered reason for a good beating or ostracism by the neighbors. I wore some feminine attire a few times when my first ex wasn't home but that was not the pleasure or the fullness of experience that I sought.
It was in 1995 that I got my first computer and began to earnestly research all that I could about transgender, from scholarly works to the chick-with-a-dick porno. Eventually I found truth and people who helped guide me.
In 1998 I divorced for the second time but I was still afraid to buy my own truth instead of the world's un-truth so I married the third time in 2000. That lasted nine months. After that encounter I knew that I was to follow my heart and be the woman that I was born to be. I was sure and I told my psychiatrist who sent me to a gender therapist. 92 days after meeting the gender therapist I began HRT and I ain't looked back!
I did not want to transition but if that is what they call the process by which I could change my body to become congruent with my mind, then I decided to transition. I also think of it as embracing the woman who has always been inside of me and becoming the best "her" that I could be.
From the first meeting with my gender therapist I saw my transsexuality as a gift given to me by my Creator. Others may see this differently and I honor that so please honor my right to see it differently. I believe that I am, as in some Native American beliefs, two-spirited, able to comfortably work with both genders to bring help and healing.
So my breaking point had been a long time in happening. It was more like little pieces of the edifice of lies that I bought into were falling off and exposing the hollowness of my life.
I have always found life to be rather pleasant, even when marriages and debts were killing me. I always found something positive, be it my evening classes, my work, lunch with friends, a trip to another city, whatever I could squeeze fun from, I did.
Now I don't need to look for the wonderment in each day. It is there when I open my eyes in the morning. To borrow from Harry Chapin's Sequel, "...I finally like myself. At last, I like myself."
I acknowledged who I really was one night in March 2002, in Susan's Transgender Chatroom. I had been lurking for months and I finally got up the nerve to sign-in. I asked to speak and was encouraged to do so. After 2-1/2 hours my old self faded into the back and the woman I always was began to take her first tentative steps. Cindy was in the chatroom to help draw me out. We have been together ever since, and will be forever.
Wing Walker
Flying Continuously Since 2002
Wing Walker, you just summed up my experience as well. Amazing how so many of our stories are similar. I joined Susan's 2 months ago and here I am.
Jay
I am at my breaking point. I have had two major surgeries, two strokes, and I am now alone. My wife and I are separated over my GID. I don't want to die as a male.
But I fear 'them' and why they will think, but I have done that all my life. And that is why 'he' is still here. I HAVE to transition, but I over analyze everything. And I think that is a major drawback.
I have to say that my 'heroines' here have to be Kate, Nicole and Amanda. You three ladies have given me more insight to myself then anything I have read. I have always felt that I would be seen by "them" as a Guy In Drag ( that is why I hate 'GID' ).
I am going in for a makeover with a lady here in Portland. She is well recommended and has extensive knowledge of our special needs. Wish me luck. It maybe the kick in the butt I need.
I know that some of you will say that I cannot let 'Them' run my life, but I still have that fear.
I wish I looked as good as you ladies in this thread. And that includes Jennifer.
Sorry for the rambling.
:icon_love:,
Janet
You'll always have us Janet... please don't forget that. I know I tend to forget that too.
I'm really sorry to hear about your problems. If there was a magic wand I could wave to make them all go away
I would... that goes for all of you.
And I'm honored Janet that you would include me in a list with Kate and Nichole... (my guiding lights) but all I do is share
things I've thought or that I'm thinking about... about my experiences.... it's not special insight... it's just a glimpse into my
world. I'm so happy it helps someone.
QuoteI am going in for a makeover with a lady here in Portland. She is well recommended and has extensive knowledge of our special needs. Wish me luck. It maybe the kick in the butt I need.
Janet... you have heard this before but I'm sure you need to hear it again. None of us can see what others see... I think
for most of us just starting out we see the guy still. As Meghan says I'm not full time, I'm not even part time yet... lol...
and I look at myself in the mirror every morning, with no makeup and wonder how I will ever get there. But then I post
pictures of myself with makeup on to hotornot and thousands of obviously blind guys rate me as a 9.2. I don't get it. I
hope someday I do.
But you will have a great time with your makeover... and it will change your life.
I think I've posted about this before, but after mine I was so stunned at how female I looked. I had worn makeup many times
before but like anything the more you do it the better you become. And the special lady that did my makeover was an artist.
I know it sounds lame but I had to touch my face to make sure it was really me in the mirror. It was a moving and very
emotional experience and I had not even considered that I might react that way. I would plan your makeover for very early
in the day... the hardest part for me was going back to guy mode. I cherished every second and the day flew by. And when
it came time for the day to end... I spent another hour just staring at a face I've never known, unable to force myself to
remove the makeup. I just stared at the face that looks so right to me... so feminine... the one I saw in my mind all those
years. And then as I removed the makeup I cried like a baby. I looked at Amanda in the mirror and I promised her that her
time was coming.
I hope you will share your makeover experience with us.
Amanda