QuoteIf you are new to the website or the forums and which to publicly introduce yourself, post here. Tell us your story, how you came to join our family, life lessons learned, and tell us what makes the world a special place for you.
Hello.
I tried to write an introduction, but it started looking like my life story, so I just deleted it and we'll leave it at "Hello" :)
(=
I know what you mean about introductions turning into life stories, my own certainly went in that direction, but rather by design (=
Hello and Welcome to Susan's most wonderful Place Jess (=
Please feel free to join in on the conversations.
Welcome Jess,
i love life stories so no worries. i hope you can stay and chat, it is wonderful to meet new people here, everyone is so very nice. :)
beth
Thank you for the warm welcome, I needed that :)
As long as noone minds life stories, feel free to skip it all if you do.
Somehow it is much easier to use the Internet for me. I don't have to face anyone's reaction that way I guess. I think I just need to know that someone out there knows how I feel and what I am going through. That will make me feel so much better.
I am a 30 year old male and I am married with no children. My wife is my best friend in the world, we have known each other for 6 years and have been married for 2. Before we were married I told her, the first person I have EVER told, about my incongruent gender feelings. I felt she had a right to know. I also told her that I was marrying her because she is my best friend and I love her, but that I never forsee me being happy with my life because of those feelings. I was as honest as possible with her. She took it suprisingly well. Basically, she doesn't understand, she doesn't want me to talk about it, and she pretends it doesn't exist.
Well, 4 months ago she wanted me to see a therapist for depression. I have been depressed for as long as I can remember, but it had gotten to the point where it is affecting our relationship. All I do is go to work and come home and go to sleep. Things are getting more and more difficult to deal with. Anyway, I have been seeing a therapist for the last four months. I was diagnosed with Severe Chronic Depression I started taking Paxil and I am doing all of the things he has me do for depression.
Every session he asks me if I am still doubtful whether or not therapy will work, and every session I tell him that I am more than willing to try the therapy, but I have my doubts as to its effectiveness. Well my last session I guess he got perturbed, or upset, I am not sure which, he may have just been curious, I don't know, but he said, "The combination of therapy and drugs works to cure depression in a very statistically significant number of cases, what makes you so different?" I don't know what happened within me, I guess I broke down, but I started crying and had to have a 5 minute break. After I had collected myself a little bit, I went back in and with 5 minutes left in my therapy session, I told him about me... the real me. To which he responded basically, "So do you prefer men? I work with homosexuals all the time." I really don't think he understands at all where I am coming from or what my life has been like.
That was two days ago. I have been suicidal for a long time but I have never acted on it and have never attempted it because I care very much about my family and I know how it would hurt them. However, in the past two days I haven't slept and have eaten very little. I don't have very many friends at all, and certainly noone I can talk with about these kinds of things, not even my wife because she wants to pretend this doesn't exist.
I can't help but think that just maybe it's my time to go. I mean, my mother passed away about 10 years ago, my father would be devastated if I told him how I feel, my wife and I have an uncomfortable feeling between us because of my depression which is only getting worse not to mention the fact that we have this HUGE issue that affects my life and every part of it that can't be discussed, and my therapist has no idea how I feel and I don't think he really cares to know. My brother would miss me horribly.
There HAS to come a point where suicide is a viable option. Where is that point? If I were to tell my dad and brother the absolute truth it would hurt them more then if I were to have died. If I were to die, my wife would be sad, but at least she would be able to get on with her life. My work would miss me, but only because I am really good at what I do, but they could hire someone else. The only thing it's not best for is my puppy. I would never be able to go through the transition, I have read on how difficult it is, and I am not a strong enough person to do that, nowhere near strong enough. Not to mention the fact that I look like an ogre in a dress. I hate the way I look, I hate the way I feel, I hate being me, and I can't stay the way I am, I am a wreck, and it's only getting worse.
I guess my question is, where do I go from here?
Welcome!!! :)
Well my experience comes from the other end of the book, I'm not TG, but my spouse
is.....
First - find a new therapist.... find someone that specializes in the TG stuff... (we're still looking for one we like, but they ARE out there.) The therapy isn't working because they're treating the wrong problem... its like giving you pepto for a headache.... not gonna work...
Next, maybe go into some marriage counciling with your wife...
Suicide is never the best option... you have people in your life that love you, your wife loves you... therefore its worth fighting for...
You have to decide how far you want to go, talk it over with (your wife) ... I -know- shes confused... I'm so confused, still confused about Jaycie's desires... Maybe lead her here, the folks here have been really helpful to me...
My mantra has been basically.. lets look at today.... we're not telling our families today.... all we have to worry about today is getting ourselves more used to and comfortable with the transition... I told Jaycie, I didn't even want to -think- about coming out to some members of our families before she was 110% comfortable with herself first....
So don't rush ahead to the "OhMyGodMyFamlilyWillNeverUnderstands" and just worry about YOU for a while....
Hello My T-Sister Jess,
I have felt ALL the things you are feeling now. I too told my wife 1st, when I was 36 and she hated me for it. I too thought my family would think me better off dead. I also had two kids I thought I would ruin their life with my tgism. I too thought I looked like an orge. I too knew SRS was not for me. I too hated myself and thought about suicide.
So where do you go from here? Well, you are young and you have no idea what can or will be in store for you. I will tell you, at least I'll tell you how it has worked out for me.
I got divorced when I was 38, it was sad, but we both are happy now. I came out to everyone I knew and lost a few friends but made many new and cooler ones. When I told my kids, they both laughed and told me they already knew and they see me as papa no mater I'm wearing. My family all accepted me, although they said they did not want to see me enfemm, which is cool, other than I see them a lot less now. I found a lovely sweet hearted woman who is into me, no mater how I'm dressed. With feeback from her I grew into my own femme style and learned how to dress...and now have people tell me I'm pretty.
I'm now 48 years old and I'm happier than I EVER have been in my life. If I had 'checked out' I would not have ever felt loved, trully loved another, happieness or felt inner peace, felt pretty, or strong or the joy of helping another.
So hon, buck it up, because there is a light at the end of the tunnel. It will not be easy, but all you have to do is look for your own honest path to happieness.
You can be happy and you can make others happy.
Love
DebTV
PS Your shrink is lost..find another
*looks you in the eyes*
You are still alive, that
PROVES you are strong enough for transition.
Interestingly what you describe I can relate very much to. A few months ago that could have been a decent reflection of myself. Differences of course.
Quote from: Jess on June 24, 2005, 01:24:56 PM
There HAS to come a point where suicide is a viable option.
I will be concise. I am still alive because I did not want to hurt those I care about. When they finally die I expected to see one last sunset.
It should be noted that my life long hurt and feeling that life is not worth it has
GREATLY abated since I 'came out' and started on the transition path.
Quote from: Jess on June 24, 2005, 01:24:56 PM
I can't help but think that just maybe it's my time to go.
Consider that if it were your time you'd have gone already ;)
*shakes head no.* I do not believe this is the case.
Quote from: Jess on June 24, 2005, 01:24:56 PM
... certainly noone I can talk with about these kinds of things, ...
You can and I suggest that you do talk to us. (= We don't bite.
PMs, Email, therapist, spouse, your puppy... whatever but make sure you talk. – I've been there, trust me, talking is good for you right now.
Quote from: Jess on June 24, 2005, 01:24:56 PM
...To which he responded basically, "So do you prefer men? I work with homosexuals all the time." I really don't think he understands at all...
It seems most therapists who are not aware of gender issues always seem to think that we must be homosexual.
As such, I think a new therapist is in order, one that understands gender.
Quote from: Alison on June 24, 2005, 01:53:37 PM
... its like giving you pepto for a headache.... not gonna work...
:icon_chuckel: Oh so true! Well stated!
Quote from: Jess on June 24, 2005, 01:24:56 PM
I guess my question is, where do I go from here?
I advise:
Sit down and think. Figure out who you are, where you are going and what you want.
Examine your options.
Talk to your spouse. Your best friend and partner. In my opinion you two need to really work on the communication lines regarding this.
hello Jess,
thank you so much for writing your life story. I know exactly how you feel. You are not alone in this. I spent years waking up in the morning wondering if it would be my last day. As soon as i told someone who i was that cared and understood, i immediately started feeling better. You have told two people who do not understand, a therapist that should be replaced, and your wife who needs to learn about you so she will understand. You do not have to tell anyone besides your therapist and your wife at this time. take small steps and every step will make you stronger, less depressed and happier than you have ever been. You don't even have to decide how far you will go (SRS etc) now, there is lots of time to decide along the way. I have only told my wonderful partner and my doctor so far, plus all the wonderful people here.
I am telling my my children and their mother soon. I am writing poems to express how i feel. i have written a story that shows them what we feel. i have gathered information on transsexuality and compiled it so i can give each a copy. maybe your first step is to give your wife something that will show her what you are feeling so she understands. sometimes when you tell people in person they block their minds because they dont want to understand. dont worry bout anyone else now. just having one person understand and love you is the most wonderful feeling you will ever have. just take one step, then determine the next step, you can rest at any step or stop completely at anytime.
i will share any of the information i have compiled if you want anything. just pm me and ill send it thru email.
Please stay and chat with us, we all need each other. i know you will be feeling lots better soon if you do.
i know there's lots of love and happiness in your future Jess. :icon_bunch:
love
beth
Jess,
however bad things are for you right now, they WILL get better. If you stay alive for nobody else but the pup, well then, stay alive for the pup right now. Please listen to the folks on this forum. You need to find a therapist who is experienced in TG issuses. The regular therapists are gonna assume you're gay, or trying to get out of your marriage, or whatever. Please, please promise us you won't harm yourself and please look into a different therapist. Promise?
Thank you so much for all of your kind words, they mean an incredible amount to me. I have another appointment with that therapist tuesday, and I am going to go to it. I spent saturday searching the Internet for a therapist that deals with gender issues in my area and there were none. I guess thats what I get for living in Alabama.
Jess
You can try asking your therapist for recommendations, or your MD (if you feel comfortable telling them)... try also looking for gay and lesbian resources in the area... from what I've seen the gay/lesbian/TG communities seem to work hand in hand... :)
The time before transition and accepting yourself is the worst. It does get better. I though that suicide was a viable solution compared to how those I love would feel. It's not. They would rather have you around different than not have you around, if they really love you. And if they don't, then there are other ways not to be in their lives.
Family will come around. Your partner will or will not, and if she doesn't, then she was not the right one, as hard as that may feel.
I lost my partner in my transition and we both seem happier now. The person she was married to was not the person I was, and to continue as the person she thought I was was not an option. I'm sure there will be someone in my life at some point and she will be with me as I am, and love me for who I am, not for who she thinks I am. We all deserve that.
Your therapist may be willing to educate himself too. Maybe you could ask him if he'd be willing to look at some resources. It won't make him an expert, but if you can't find someone in your area, that might do in the meantime.
Dennis
Thank you all SO MUCH, just for being here, for this site, it is so helpful, thank you.
I had my therapy appointment yesterday and he said he had read up a little bit on the subject.
He asked me 10 or 15 questions which I answered. They were like.
Do you feel like a woman?
What age did you start feeling like this?
What was your earliest memory of feeling like this?
Have you ever dressed up? If so, how old were you? What was the situation?
There were others but they were all questions like that.
Then he changed my diagnosis to 'Gender Identity Disorder'. He told me that I was going to be fine, and that lots of people are just like me and they find something to live for, and so can I.
He also told me that he has no experience at all dealing with this issue or my feelings and he told me that it would be best if I see someone with more experience dealing with these issues.
He told me there is a therapist about 3 hours from me that deals primarily with this or a therapist that is local who has seen 3 or 4 people with this issue. I told him that I would see the therapist that was local and see what happened with that and gave him permission to release my records to her.
Now I am terrified, I know how to deal with hiding it, I know how to deal with myself, but... I am not quite sure how to deal with talking about it or how to deal with it in the open, talking about it. It's very scary. It makes me feel like I have been caught doing something terrible and now everyone knows about it and I have to justify it to them.
Jessica
hello Jessica,
Don't ever feel like you have done something wrong because you haven't, and don't think you have an emotional problem because GID is not a mental condition, it is a biological condition. This condition can cause problems like depression but the disorder is something we are born with. as for dealing with it in the open, it only has to be talked about with your new therapist at first. Most of us find talking about it a great relief (once we start) but are apprehensive about starting just like you are. i am happy that you found a therapist with some experience and have a better opinion of your old therapist now. I can tell that you are already doing better and that is great. It is nice to have you hear with us Jessica, we need each other for support.
love
beth
Hi Jess and welcome to Susan's.
After reading through all the post replies, I must agree 100% with Alison in her entire posy reply.
Gina
Well, my wife and I got into a huge fight night before last. It wasn't so much a huge fight as a, "I can't take this anymore." She was going to move out and I told her I understood. Well, last night we spent a lot of time talking and it came down to this:
She is going to stay and we are going to see where therapy continues to take me. Additionally, we are also going to see a christian marriage counselor.
We agreed:
We both care about each other.
I am going to stay in therapy
We are going to see a christian marriage counselor
See if there are other options than suicide or transition.
She said that if I suicide she will be mad but understand.
She would rather me transition than suicide, she made it clear she would leave if it came to this.
She really wants me to look for other options.
I understand her point of view and where she is coming from. What options are out there other than my two? Am I missing any possibilities?
Thats my little update
Jessica
My suggestion would be to seek a therapist that is at the least non denominational. It is difficult for me to believe that a *christian* therapist could be impartial.
Options are a kind of funny thing Jessica, sometimes they can be camoflauged, you have to watch carefully for them and strike quick when oportunity presents itself, your dad can talk to you about that one and the mentality behind it, I've talked with Wajdi some in Email and I know he understands what I'm talking about, but the same mentality priciples work in these things also. Talk with your dad about options and life, then consider what Leigh said, it makes all the sense in the world when it comes to you and your wife together, The theraputic process itself is complicated enough without getting idealologies involved.
Terri
Hi Jessica,
Just a thought as I follow the string of this post. Have you considered that this is a really big thing for your wife also and that she may benefit from councelling. If the new therapist works out you may like to explore that avenue. I find that the more you understand something the easier it is to accept.
The posts in the significant others forum may also be a way to help her understand what you and her are going through.
Please think of this, as thinking human beings we are designed to have a choice there is never just one way. There are options and the best way to explore those options is with someone else. It is to easy to convince ourselves in isolation. It is however not as easy to convince someone else particularly if there is a flaw in our logic.
My humble advice, share your experience. Here is a safe place to start, a therapist with experience with people like us will help and your wife may just turn out to be your best ali. Even if she doesn't at least you will have tried. Either way be gentle and try to be there for her too. You are after all a partnership.
Good louck Shelley
QuoteHave you considered that this is a really big thing for your wife also and that she may benefit from councelling. If the new therapist works out you may like to explore that avenue. I find that the more you understand something the easier it is to accept.
I have spent a lot of time talking to my wife. She does not like this subject at all, but we do talk about it. We have sorta talked about it since before we were married when I told her how I felt. But for a long time it was sort of a 'we are not going to talk about this right now." Lately, the past three weeks things have sort of exploded and I am not sure if thats me, or her, or both of us. Ever since I started therapy things have been in a downward spiral fast. I understand her point of view very well, she is terribly afraid of loosing me and she doesn't want to loose me.
However, She has made 3 things crystal clear to me in every conversation.
1. She will not stay with me if I go through either of those two doors (suicide or transition). She believes that there is a third door, out there somewhere, I would love to believe that, but I am not so sure. That is the main focus of my therapy though. To find out what options there are for this, to look for that third door.
2. I don't need therapy, all therapy will do in her eyes is 'feed this' and make things worse.
3. God is the only thing that can 'cure' me of this 'addiction'
It's very hard to be understanding and caring when she is yelling at me and telling me this is my fault for opening my heart to demons. But yes, I do try and understand where she is coming from.
I have pointed her to this site, along with Lynn Conway's, and a few others.
She says, that they are absolutely out of there mind and that I should not believe such B.S. All I am doing by visiting those sites is feeding my 'addiction'.
And she refers me to this site:
http://www.realityresources.com/therapycure.htm
And around and around and around we go. What makes this so difficult is that I really love her & I don't want to hurt her. At one time I believed that we were soulmates. I love her so much in fact, that it might be that I have found a third option which would be to hide it, not talk about it, pretend it doesn't exist like I have done for a long time and, as I saw in another thread, avoid tall buildings, and weapons of any kind. After all, I have lived for 27 years like this, what's another 30 or 40. Try to the best of my ability to be that man that she has always viewed me as.
Sorry for ranting. I guess the short answer is yes I have tried to talk to her and I certainly understand where she is coming from. It was even my idea that we go to marriage counseling, but I think we are beyond where even that would be helpful now. She has really given me a choice. Hide it and 'give up my addiction' or we part ways.
These are his credentials? Hardly what I would call suffucent.
Jerry's main credentials for addressing these matters at all is derived, not by some academic title, but by the gut-wrenching "school of hard-knocks!" And the many years of intensive therapy he himself has gone through, as well as the unnumbered seminars, written and taped resources, group-therapy sessions; as well as ... just the arduous, long and hard work of recovery.
Good Morning Jessica. I can relate very well to how you describe the situation with your wife. Is very simular to the relationship between my own Woman and I, only there is no element of relidgion involved in this matter.
We have always had a kind of "different" relationship as I was always a more dominant type, but at the same time ceded such things as financial control and daily decisions to her. This had the effect of giving her a lot of leverage on me at first, even to the point that I at times almost believed myself that I would not be capible of dealing with day by day details of mundane life but have discovered I haven't the problems with this I had thought I did.
Our relationship over the last 10 years was for a long time a solidification of her influence and control over certain aspects of my personality and needs to the extent that even while I was determined to follow my own will in my own matters, she maintained a deep influence over my actual actions.
It took me a long time to understand that by understanding me so well and desiring to channel various traits and characteristics to her own benifit, she was actually putting herself into the position of replaceing higher authority I had always unquestionably obeyed and served for so many years before and during our early relationship and have always needed. I am not so dominant a personality as many even close to me would believe, at least not in particular relationships. The problem is she never understood the respect and recognition factors involved in my professional and MC relationships and thus can not achieve my unquestionable commitment to her desires which infuriates her, as she is familiar with how I defer to others for no apparent reason to her while resisting her own efforts at control of my actions or behaviors and does not understand the how and why of it.
For the parts this woman does fulfil in me, I return many things she is in desperate need of, but it is an incomplete exchange and makes for a fiery relationship at times and I have been having to become much more assertive with her, leaving her to accept what I must do without necessarily understanding, or, make a seperate life from me to avoid the conflict. This is NOT something that can be resolved with professional counciling as it involves diametrically opposed life goals and viewpoints that can't be compromised short of one or both of us compromising ourselves which is no solution at all.
It all comes down to sometimes you have to draw the line in the sand and accept the consiquences. Some things can be resolved and some can't. It just depends on what you can live with or don't find life worth living with.
Terri
Hello Jessica,
Let me just start out by saying that I really feel for you. You have a choice to make, and it is a hard one only you can decide. Your wife gives you no choices and as near as I can tell is totally unwilling to accept any answer to the problem other than repression to satisfy her religious conviction regardless of it's consequences to you. I'm sure that in her heart it is her love for you coupled with her conviction that you are posessed and going to hell that drives her demands. You have hit the perverbial irrisistable force against an immovable object.
You said in one post that she and you had agreed to therapy and christian counseling. In my opinion she demanded and you capitulated. This is a one way street with her, there are no other choices. Will she ever come around? Probably not. The more you exercise your right to be, the more she will cling to her beliefs for support, fearing that to aquiesce will condemn her to hell for not trying hard enough, and giving into the devil.
You have to ask yourself certain questions.
Is it more important to maintain this relationship by repressing yourself and resuming the role you wife wants?
If you do this can you be sure that the act of repression will not turn your love to
resentment?
If your love turns to resentment, what about the certain regret over years lost, spent in pain, that could have been spent in joy? Such regret might be a powerfull force leading you
to actually commit the sucide that until now you have only contemplated.
When you first came here you told us of your depression and your sucidal inclinations. You even went so far as to write a 6 page letter to your family to say good bye.
If you return to your prior efforts at denial, will not these other feelings return?
It is my impression that your wife is more concerned for herself rather than you. Is this reciprocal love?
Mind you it is not my intention here to in any way disparage your wife, and not being in the relationship I cannot say with certainty that my ascertions regarding her intent are correct. If it were me however these are certainly questions I would be asking myself so I state them here.
With regards to Jerry, I looked at the pages. Nowhere does it say were his degree came from or what degree he has. There are many categories of Phd, and it is not an MD. My guess is, because that is all that I am left with is that he has a doctorate of divinity which in no way makes him a qualified therapist. You would do better consulting a witch doctor.
Also he could have gotten such credentials on line for enough bucks and may have only taken a couple of courses at a local christian community college. He doesn't really say, we are simply left to wonder.
As to his "cure" rate, he provides no clinical research to prove any such cure. It is dubious if he himself is cured or that he was ever really GID. His testimonials provide no clue as to the identity of the transgendered he is supposed to have cured. For all we no he made them up.
His only evidence is anecdotal. That is not science, it is speculation supported by faulty premises.
As to his analysis of the "cause" of GID being some sort of trauma around the age of 3 or 5, he is full of it. My life until I was about 9 years old was idylic. It was when I was sent to Psycologists to "cure" me that my nightmare began. That was when I suffered trauma, at the hands of these so called caring professionals. I am quite familiar with the "cure" and have no doubt that Jerry is a puveyor of these all to familiar techniques coupled with a good dose of fundamenatalist BS.
If his cure rate is what he says it is than using the percentage of potential TS's to population I think we would find that there are few if any remaining TS's in the world, since apparently he's been doing this since 1963, and that this site doesn't exist and is just a figment of our collectively deluded minds.
Well Iv'e rambled on enough here. Jessica, I hope all goes well for you and that you choose the path that is best for you. To thine own self be true.
Cassie
Short and to the point:
Jessica, your life is your own. Live it as YOU wish.
Do not live it entirely for others.
I believe one could so bury themselves behind (religious or otherwise) convictions as to never find themselves again in this life. That is a pretty good definition of hell to me.
As far as realityresources goes.. I can't help but wonder if their last name is by chance.
*chortle* ok the more I read the more I'm finding funny so I'll just shut up and go away now.
Hi Jessica,
Some very good advice has been provided here. Ultimately you will have to make a decision on which path you will walk. Many people do mistake our own image of ourselves as something to be cured. I believe this to be in part because they have settled on what they believe us to be and when that does not line up with what we in fact are it causes confusion on their part. Part of it is because when they realise how others who don't understand us will react toward us they feel under threat also. Part also is a sense of loss of what they had.
Many of the stories from significant others talk of that loss. Time may or may not heal this sense of loss and that is for that individual to deal with. We may be able to help ease their sense of loss but only they can truly deal with it. If that process leads to acceptance on their part then you are one of the lucky, if not you have to decide whether you can live without that acceptance. My wife made it clear that she could not accept me en femme. So beit, that side of me I share with the people here and in quiet moments on my own. That was my decision and something I live with. You need to decide if this path is for you. The thing that you have on your side is time. Don't rush a decision that will affect your life in such a very large way. Try on some of the shoes of life, choose carefully and try not to burn to many ridges before you are sure.
Most of all good luck and try to gain acceptance within yourself it will make it easier for others to accept you. This no guarantee of acceptance just an easier path for them to follow you on.
Shelley