There has to be something, you know?
Is this genderqueer-ness I identify with something that is going to pass? I am looking at some myspace profiles & groups and the average age seems to be late teens, if that. I'm 10 years older than that. 27! I've got a wife and two kids. What am I thinking and why haven't I figured out a real answer yet. Even if I figured it out and then tried to fight it, then at least it would be an answer, you know?
I would figure that I would know who I am at this point. I have an (normal check-up) appointment with my M.D. next week and I'm going to ask for a referral for someone to talk to.
I know there is nothing that is really "normal," but I feel significantly out of the average as far as that is concerned. And that is kind of important to me as I begin to discuss this with my wife. I want to go, "See, there are others. No big deal." But there doesn't seem to be anything else quite as unsure as I feel.
Some days are better than others. Today was bad at work. Very bad. Like, let's italicize and bold that. Very bad. This messes with my self-esteem and image and--just as I began to feel comfortable identifying myself to myself--I feel destroyed. It was my first day back in 2 weeks and I don't want to go back tomorrow. You don't even want to read the poem I wrote and put on my blog today.
I'm not posting just as a whining thing. I actually have a serious question. I know a lot of people have "always known" what they really are, and I'm happy for them. Really and sincerely and truly. But I really haven't had much opportunity for this introspection until lately. The second child really makes me put things in perspective. I've avoided introspection for a long time, and it haunts me now. But I am here, now, and I can't fix what I didn't do before, all I can do is worry about it now. Is that selfish? (Talking to myself here.) Like telling my mom and friends I am an atheist, I had to think it all through over and over, from all the angles . . .
Maybe genderqueer is just what I am and always have been and I hadn't been able to peg it before. I mean, I've CD'd a few times in the past 20 years, and I never felt really male or female steadily for any length of time. But the identity of it all--the androgyny and the genderqueer identity--is shiny and new.
Maybe I should go to the gay bars and try and talk to someone, but I don't think they'd just want to talk. I mean, I probably wouldn't. I should at least dress and go once. I rarely get out of the house anyway. Would that help? I went to Chicago Pride Parade last year and it was amazing, I only wish I would have gone in something a little more "me." That was kind of when it got going in my head.
Anyway . . . the age thing kind of bugs me, specifically.
The gist and main point of all that is: are there any others who are "late comers" to their identity? Genderqueer or not, I mean, that's what I identify as, so that's where I posted, but I don't want to leave anyone out. Epiphanies welcome!
Beatrix,
I totaly identify. I am confused about my gender and lately I have started to think myself as a female. On the outside I could still a male and I have been happy as a male for all of my life. On the inside my feminity is starting to grow and come out.
Many people will also identify that and Gender Identity issue will get stronger as that get older. That is a the case with me and many other here at Susans.
Just remember to be yourself at all times. I have found hidding just lead to emotional problems. Be yourself and remember to comunicate your feeling to your wife. It will help if she understands.
You are not alone.
Alice
Beatrix,
Don't feel bad, I'm 27 as well. It took me nearly a decade of drug addiction to come to terms with this.
If you are genderqueer and not transsexual, maybe that is the answer. Being genderqueer, I mean.
Nero
Posted at: August 07, 2006, 11:59:07 PM
You know,when I was going through DTs in rehab about 4 years ago, a counselor there told me that I was supressing myself through the drugs and the misty-grey dream world they create. She said that people find out everything about themselves around age 27. Sounded strange at the time, but I think I may have subconsciously set that date as the time when I would admit this to myself - I knew I was male on the inside, but wouldn't admit to being transsexual.
Hang in there, you'll know the answer. It just hasn't come yet. But it will when the time is right.
Nero
Beatrix, I was in the same place you are 10 months ago - at age 28. I am now living fulltime as a woman. I had no idea where I fell in the gender spectrum, but only knew for certain I was transgendered. Now is the time to start your introspective journey. I spent 2 months doing that and I came to realize there were so many obvious signs during my life, but I never bothered to look at the entire picture. Definitely talk to your doctor when you go. Start seeing a therapist as well. If you have issues you can't sort out on your own, a therapist can help.
I wasn't 100% sure if I felt like male or female either, because I didn't have a good point of reference. I just felt like me. However, I knew I wanted to live as female and not as male. I can tell you I am already so much happier living as I am now. 27 is not too old and many people transition around this age. In a way, it's better than doing it as a teen, because you can afford the expenses. I guess it comes down to what roles would you be happiest in. Male, Female, or right in the middle. I personally would feel even more uncomfortable in the middle than I would as male, because nobody know what to call you and the world doesn't accept you very well, but that's just me. Female was the right choice for me.
Anyhow, as I said, now that you realize you could be TS, start looking at all of your memories from different angles.
Melissa
If it is of any help to you I hid until I was 29 an 11/12ths.
Granted I knew I was female identified internally, but had never dreamed I would get to be female this life. I had resigned to a male life from the start and I truly had no thought of being female this life. I lamented a lot and knew I would be happier if I was but I wasn't, and that was that.
In hindsight I was more than just 'female identified internally' and while somewhat cliché describing my previous state as "a female doing her best to pretend to be male." is fitting. BUT regardless, I did NOT think that then.
If it is any help I was /sort of/more or less/ happy as male. I attributed the massive hurt I felt to other things than GID.
Also if it means anything hiding did not mess with my emotions (unless quick to anger qualifies) but it was KILLING me inside.
An also again if it means anything when I /woke up/figured out/had my epiphany/ that I was in fact a girl there was and remains ZERO doubt about the subject.
I hope that helps in some small way.
Quote from: Nero on August 07, 2006, 11:20:47 PM
Posted at: August 07, 2006, 11:59:07 PM[/size]
You know,when I was going through DTs in rehab about 4 years ago, a counselor there told me that I was supressing myself through the drugs and the misty-grey dream world they create. She said that people find out everything about themselves around age 27. Sounded strange at the time, but I think I may have subconsciously set that date as the time when I would admit this to myself - I knew I was male on the inside, but wouldn't admit to being transsexual.
Hang in there, you'll know the answer. It just hasn't come yet. But it will when the time is right.
Nero
Thank you.
Maybe the age thing has a bit of truth, like all the rock stars that kill themselves at 27.
Funny you should mention the drug thing, I've been fighting those urges lately, and the thing is that I never was really into them, but when I did my occasional drink or smoke pot, it got where I couldn't move, and I was kind of helpless and everything was blurry.
I keep a bottle of tequilla at arms length from the computer, it's just where it sits, and I know if I drink it, I won't be able to hold our new baby tonight because I could drop her. That's bad. It's also pretty likely, because of my genetics, I have a disposition towards it (drinking.)
It's all a study of consequence. Thank you for sharing your story. It does help. I am glad you're better now.
Today was better at work. I'm still tired and confused, and I appreciate everyone's kind words here. I'll talk to my doc next week, and I hope that he doesn't have any biases in that kind of area to refer me to someone.
Got to go!
thank you
beatrix
Sorry folks I got you all beat . ;D
I was 54-55 when I started to understand what was wrong with me different about me.
Still haven't got it all together but that okay. I know i'm TG and really believe that i'm most likely TS. But what really matter is that I am becoming the person I should be.
Hang in there Beatrix.
You have got a long life ahead of you and don't push yourself into something you are not ready for.
:)
Jillieann
I'm another late discoverer. Fortunately (and until very recently I used to say 'unfortunately') I've known since sometime before high school that I wasn't really male but I wasn't female either. It wasn't until March of this year, just a few months before my 38th birthday, that I learned that I'm transgendered. And it's been less than a month that I've been identifying as genderqueer. I've been genderqueer forever, I just didn't know what to call it. Would you call that being a latecomer to my identity? Seriously, I'm asking.
The way I figure it, we have always been what we are. That inner core is what guides us on this journey of self-discovery. It's why some things just feel right and others just feel wrong. The trick is to clear off all the BS (I should be, I wish I was, etc.) and see that inner core for what it really is. And as we clear off the layers of "crud" our perception of that inner core changes. Some parts come into sharp relief almost immediately while others seem to be one thing until we can pick out the fine details and we discover otherwise. And where we end up, oddly enough, is right where we've been all along.
You know, some people feel different their whole lives and never look inward to try to find out why. It can be very scary in there. Good for you for looking inward.
Hi Casey,
I see you are new to Susan's. I want to take a moment here to welcome you.
I'm glad you found the site.
If your look for friends and or information about gender issues this is the place.
Please read the site rules at:
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,2.0.html (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,2.0.html) if you haven't already.
Then check out the Wiki, with ton of info on the gender topics. Oh and check out our chat and links section too. Have a great read.
Welcome to Susan's.
Okay back to topic:
Yes I'm one of the late bloomers as I call myself.
I learned that althought there are patterns to the discovery that you are TG there are no set rules. I think it has allot more to do with if you are a compliant person like I have been. I learned to control my feelings and even bury them at a very young age ( I beleived it was expected of me to act and think in a set way. My parents teacher and society demand that of me. ) I became so good at it that I actually created another personality that controlled all of me.
So It was much harder for me to discover that I was different , because I have alway denied and buried any of those feeling until just recently.
In other words I believe it has allot to do with how will you can decieve yourself. As we get older I think we get tried of fight ourselves and start to realize that we really are different, that just maybe we are not what we appear to be.
Anyway this is my thoughts on the matter of timing.
:)
Jillieann
hey guys and girls,
I've had moments of clarity throuhgout my life, but it all caved in and kept me blind and isolated for a few years. When I finally resurfaced at the age of 43, it all began to make sense to me. I look like a man ape, but my soul is female.
At this time, I am extremely comfortable with who I am. When I show strentgh in a social situation, I am shored up by my feminity. I am a female.
I may not be able to transition soon, but I know who I am and that is all I need at this time.
I haven't presented myself yet at this time, so I need to work on my personal expectations
Rebecca,
hoping that the transition process becomes easier and less expensive.
Beatrix, I think 27 is still young. There are some that discover later. Just depends on when denial and suppression breaks.
I think up till mid 20s almost everyone is trying to understand the world, communities, and selves. I think it all comes into clearity, as long as you have remained open minded around that age. And have allowed you to listen to yourself, your heart, and feelings/emotions/unconcous whispers.
Alice, yes maybe its just you needing to bring out a certain percentage of femininity to fit your soul. Things might not be balanced enough.
Being Genderqueer, things are not as clearly cut.
I like what you say Casey. You have been genderqueer all your life but didnt know what to call it.
Went to the doctor today, looking for someone to talk to, and he didn't really know enough about my insurance situation to have someone in mind in general, so I didn't ask about someone with experience in gender-variant people. I did a search, and it looks like there is at least one person in Rockford, IL, to talk to, which is right by my area. I hope she takes my insurance for at least the talking therapy part.
I did get some medicine, we'll see if that helps with my constant depression. We'll see.
Baby's crying . . . got to go!
beatrix
Posted on: August 14, 2006, 07:28:00 PM
I spoke to a therapist yesterday, one that has experience in this area (admittedly more with transsexuals or homosexuals than genderqueers) . A nice older woman and she represents the first "real" person I have told. I felt really good all day at work today, until I heard some under the breath comments from a co-worker.
I really just need to find something else to support the family, and to tell the wife. Those are the goals for the next month or so.
Anyone know any places hiring technical writers? Heh.
Good. I'm glad you were able to go to a therapist. I know how much beter it feels when you can tell someone openly about your feelings dreams and just about anything without worrying about them judging you.
You said your goals for the next month or so are finding a new job and telling your wife.
I think you and your therapist should work together on how you accomplish your goals.
I would ask which is most important and work on that one first.
Sorry no technical writer job here. :(
Would love to have you move into my neighborhood.
Hang in there.
:)
Jillieann
Congratz on your reveal to your therapist.
Saw some technical writing jobs listed on the web when I did a quick search. Maybe thats a possible way of finding a professional job such as that.
That's great that you found a therapist to talk to. Sometimes just being able to say something out loud to a "real" (i.e. face-to-face) person can take the stigma or whatever off of it.
Quote from: beatrixI felt really good all day at work today
Here's hoping there's a lot more days like that for you.
27 is young. My children are all older than that.
I started crossdressing when I was a pre-adolescent (way back before computers--practically before TV), but I was deep in the closet until my mid 50's. In a very real sense I am a late bloomer. I knew I was different when I was younger, but I wasn't sure what I was or in what direction I was going for a long time. All I knew was that I was different. I have always felt androgynous, but for many years I resisted any public expression of this, always wearing conservatively styled men's clothing and hairstyle. My crossdressing was strictly confined to the closet--I would secretly wear some of my wife's things when I was sure everyone was out of the house. This changed about ten years ago when I came to terms with the fact that my crossdressing was not just a phase that I would outgrow. I started buying my own feminine clothing and experimenting with makeup, and I finally told my wife that I was a crossdresser. I joined a support group and even went to a few meetings dressed en femme. Since then I am much more comfortable with myself. I still present as a male 90% of the time, but I have become more relaxed in my clothing style and sometimes mix more feminine clothing in with my male attire. About once a week I dress completely en femme at home.
When I was in my 20's I did not know whether I was transexual or not. I had constant fantasies about transitioning, but never did anything because I was married and had young children. I felt I had an obligation to care for them and was getting my career as a college instructor started. Now my wife is retired, the kids are grown and moved out on their own, and I am a tenured professor. I am also quite content in my identity as an androgynous crossdresser.
Beatrix,
Lately I've been feeling that I might be genderqueer too. I don't know if this will pass so I can't help you with that. In life, I present as a male because I don't know any other way to present myself. I think I put my feminity across in how I carry a conversation.
I'd like to find a good wig and start wearing blouses or tunics, but that's not going to happen soon. Even after I start hormones (probably not for a long time), I have no intention of presenting myself fully as a woman. I'll probably end up in some kind of in between form depending on how it goes.
Part of what is stopping me from moving forward into transition is that I have a partner who I love and who accepts me as I am at this point. I am isolated where I am and I have no immediate models for ideas and support. Basically, I'm trying to play out all scenerios in my head so that when I see an opening, I'll be more likely to spot it.
Another side to this is that I am bisexual even though I prefer women. I understand that I'll never be able to play out all the different facets of my sexuality. So, I have this large sensual part of myself that will remain unused, unexplored, and eventually will just feel painful or just negative.
I quit writing this. I thought I knew where I was going, but I can't picture it. I'd like to know more about what it means to be genderqueer.
Obviously, I'm a little lost here, so if anyone has any truths to tell, I'm willing to listen.
Rebecca
Rebecca...
Presenting as one's gender of circumstance for lack of other experience...
Bisexual with a mild preference for the opposite gender...
With an understanding and loving partner who "gets" me...
Sounds a lot like my story. That's part of why I'm 30 and just starting to explore this... It's never been a big enough issue till now. I have always been able to play the "proper" role when need be... but i'm learning that that's just not all there is to me. The real me is much more than just female, or just interested in guys. I tread almost every gender, preference, social, and political line there is. The only thing I seem to go to extremes on are that extremes are too limiting. I can't stand being polarized by society, and so I'm seeking other answers.
I guess I've just been close enough to what is called "normal" that I've been able to deal, until now. If there's more to be experienced, I find an increasing frustration in not experiencing it... and sooner or later, I have to face that I'm something more than I thought I could pass for.
It's not going to be simple, but at least I'm not the only one.
Maybe it's the fluoxetine (prozac). I'm very confused lately. I'm going to call the Dr. tomorrow and ask to be changed to a different med.
I talked to the therapist again last night, and she was supportive and we talked about a bunch of stuff, but she asked me to think about those things I may lose if I undergo any type of transition.
I think that she thought when I said transition, I mean't MTF, but I'm not entirely sure about the whole thing yet. I would feel more comfortable in a middle-road kind of thing, which I'll have to research because she doesn't have the experience in the genderqueer thing.
There's no pushing the idea back in the bottle once I tell my wife, and things may explode, but I have to remember to do it kindly and patiently. Hopefully that will work.
And I'll have to find another job. It's getting bad. I'm forgetting stuff, really obvious stuff and I don't know if it's the gender thing, the new baby thing, the drug thing, or the depression & anxiety thing, or a combination thereof.
I'm still lurking here, not posting a lot, because I'm busy with baby and other stuff (3 blogs now, funny how they multiply).
I'm gonna see if I can get a book published, too. This weekend, I promise that I'll send something out. We'll see if it comes back.
b
I have to agree with Alice.
For most of my life I lived as male but I felt female inside. I had to keep it locked away untill just recently. I at times let my feminity out a little only to hid it away again. But now that I am older the female side has to come out. I believe as we get older the feelings become mature and more natural if that makes any sense. I am still sorting out my feelings here. Not sure what I am. I definitly feel more feminine that I have in the past and am slowly letting it out.
Owen
Love being female
Hi Tristan,
Your situation does feel familiar to me. I don't expect to ever pass as female. It would be better if there were already an accepted template for inbetweeners, or "crossbreeds" (as I've been thinking of myself lately).
I have read that there are communities spread out across the country where genderqueer people can present themselves as they wish. Maybe it's going to be up to isolated individuals in less enlightened communities to start showing ourselves as who we are. It scares the hell out me just thinking about it, but maybe the only thing holding us back is ourselves.
Once a few of make create a presence maybe others will follow. I feel like vomiting just thinking about being the one of the first.
Beatrix saidQuoteIt's getting bad. I'm forgetting stuff, really obvious stuff and I don't know if it's the gender thing, the new baby thing, the drug thing, or the depression & anxiety thing, or a combination thereof.
Beatrix, I have felt this way in the past. I couldn't remember anything and it literally felt like the inside of my head was becoming solid and unusable. Sometimes when people were talking to me, I didn't understand anything they said and my simplest tasks at work became arduous chores. It was
definately stress and anxiety. It took me a long time to get past it, but when I did, everything became clear again. My shoulders felt loose, ideas flowed easily through my mind, and most importantly, I became reconnected with who I was as a child and who I should be now.
I said all that because I want you to know that anxiety/stress
can be overcome. It's not something you can just turn off, but it can be worked out using different methods which you may be familiar with because you already have a therapist.
with Love,
Rebecca
Beatrix,
I know exactly what you are going through as I have just got through that period myself. It was a few very bad weeks but for now I am happy again. My doctor things my medication has started to take full effect. These medications always take a while to work so I would wait a while and talk to your doctor before changing - it is worth waiting if you have not been using the medication for long enough.
Once depression lifts you will be supprised how quickly you will feel normal and can start to make good decisions. First thing you need to do is find stability.
I am also in the middle of both genders. I am not interested in transistion as I have never consisdered myself a girl. What I am doing is lots of research into gender issue with my theripst and I will soon be talk to a Gender specilist in Sydney to give me more ideas. For myself I needed to enjoy be TG and to stop fighing myself. I am sure you are in the middle of that fight yourself - just relax and enjoy the ride for a while - it will give you a small mental break that you need. I am lucky as I am single so I so I can not offer you much advise on how to handle the wife.
Remember there are many out there who do not feel the need to transistion and are happy to stay as a cross dressor. You may be one of them - nobody is preasuring you to do anything you do not want. Once you feel stability say out loud what you want to do. I can category say out loud I do not want to transistion. That is just me - say what you want to do and ensure everyone including your wife and cousellor know what you want. I have found that many of my friends are very understanding- they have seen me struggle with this so they know I am not doing anything just because I feel like it. It is inside of us and we must express our feelings to be happy and stable - denile does not help.
I am also starting to experiment and I am starting to go out as Alice. I consisder this experimentation as a learning experience and help me to better understand myself. Be safe in whatever you do but if you feel like experiementing it is easy to do.
Good luck with this.
Alice
Alice, that is a healthy attitude. Never feel pressured to transition. You should do it only if your situation will be better in the end. I knew from the beginning it would make mine better and it has for the most part. Not that it made life's problems go away (and in fact introduced additional ones), but because I feel much more comfortable with who I am.
Melissa
I can say without question. I know what you are going through. I am 28 year old lawyer who identifies as androgynous, bi-gender, whatever(my born sex is male). It runs pretty deep with me. I fall into the very typical androgyne boat as not really being able to identify with males or females fully. (I also live in the Chicago area BTW). Unlike you I have always had a clear idea of my gender self, but it has screwed up relationships. It is also nice that my immediate family has figured this out even though it is unspoken.
I do not have kids or wife/husband. But I do think you may have hurt yourself with not being upfront with your wife in the first place.
But I do have a professional career.
Also getting out HELPS. Luckily I found a few friends who are also genderqueer and I do have someplace to go. Getting psychological helps, but having a community and friends to fall back on also helps greatly. I never had the issues of depression that many people with gender issues also face, but it seems like that is what you are going through. Seek help, but also seek friendship.
Also myspace is not exactly the best place to look at profiles. The site tends to lean young in the first place. There are other people out there who are genderqueer (I identified myself as androgynous since early in High School) who are your age, and being introspective about these issues can happen any time in your life. Just as long as you can identify these issues at some time and find who you really are.
Chris
Part of the fun is that I've only recently thought about all this and put it into words . . . and still they fail me. I have always been differant. I mean, really differant.
But I want to kind of transition, not all the way, but as feminine as possible without surgery (any kind) and hormones (though I'm not sure about that one). Somewhere in-between is the destination right now.
I don't know. Today was weird. I'll talk to my therapist next week. She suggested I wait a little longer (the baby is about 6 weeks old now) before I tell my wife. I see the reasons, but . . .
What's most frustrating is that I have trouble putting it into words, even still they fail me. I've studied the English language for nearly a decade now, and I still don't have the words. Or even spelling prowess.
I do need to get out, and I know Chi-town is not that far away, but I just need some time. I'll research that a little more.
Quote from: beatrix link=topic=5430.msg39060#msg39060
I know a lot of people have "always known" what they really are, and I'm happy for them. Really and sincerely and truly. But I really haven't had much opportunity for this introspection until lately. The second child really makes me put things in perspective. I've avoided introspection for a long time, and it haunts me now. But I am here, now, and I can't fix what I didn't do before, all I can do is worry about it now. Is that selfish?
Epiphanies welcome!
I was reading older topics, and thought this might be helpful to those questioning their identities or maybe feel they've put it off for a long time, and they've come here to Susan's to finally answer the questions they have about themselves.?
I'm a perfect example of this. I put off trying to find my true self almost my whole life, and have just realized how important it is for me to know, and start living my life knowing why I am the way I am, and that not recognizing it and ignoring my true feelings had just made me miserable. And I look back now, and think, it didn't have to be that way, if I'd just of pursued it sooner.?
Many of you appear to have started your journey much sooner in your lives, but maybe some didn't.? I'm not sure.?
But whether you are like me and just starting this journey of self, or have been walking your path many years, I notice that we all still have struggles sometimes, and our personal issues still affect us daily it seems.?
Thoughts.??
I'm actually OK with not starting until late in life. A long time ago in the humor section someone posted a thread "why middle-aged transition doesn't suck". There were lots of humorous entries, but in the aggregate I think it pointed out that there are advantages either way.
For me:
* I wouldn't have had my two fabulous children if I'd started earlier.
* We all envy young beautiful women. But they're often insecure and uncomfortable with themselves.
* I got to experience life from both sides of the gender divide. That is priceless.
* I have money and wisdom I didn't have 20 years ago. I've needed all of both that I have to make it through.
* Delayed gratification makes seeing true self all the sweeter.
* My life has been pretty great. There are a lot worse things than being a man who wishes he were a woman.
Quote from: suzifrommd on October 15, 2014, 04:52:20 PM
I'm actually OK with not starting until late in life. A long time ago in the humor section someone posted a thread "why middle-aged transition doesn't suck". There were lots of humorous entries, but in the aggregate I think it pointed out that there are advantages either way.
For me:
* I wouldn't have had my two fabulous children if I'd started earlier.
* We all envy young beautiful women. But they're often insecure and uncomfortable with themselves.
* I got to experience life from both sides of the gender divide. That is priceless.
* I have money and wisdom I didn't have 20 years ago. I've needed all of both that I have to make it through.
* Delayed gratification makes seeing true self all the sweeter.
* My life has been pretty great. There are a lot worse things than being a man who wishes he were a woman.
I agree and couldn't have said it better!
i can only hope to be able to celebrate my 30th birthday as visibly me.
but it doesn't bother me. only getting started late means i could get a daughter.
that only one i will have to care for for the rest of my life, unless i'm lucky enough to find true love.
I really think I deserve the late bloomer award here I started HRT at 63 years young and 9 months. December 25 2013 I will always will remember that date . My journey was planned out for me while still in my mothers womb, I am sure she knew what or whom I was then and I wish she were alive today,to see I have become a beautiful woman who looks like her. Patty