Voice Progression (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KN-Jh16QOM&fmt=18#lq-lq2-hq)
Do I 'have it' yet, guys and gals? I've been practicing so hard. I apologize if this is the wrong forum.
Hi Sarah.
I suppose this might answer you question are you MtF or FtM. You sound more male than female. But generally I would class this as gender neutral. I would take my ideas from physical appearance and not judge on voice.
Hope that helps
Love
Cindy
I know that voice is only one aspect of passing; I'm MtF. I'm just curious as to whether or not this one particular aspect (the voice) seems passable as female. Thanks!
Awesome. When I first heard it I thought you had a GG say the words. But I really think that you are right there. But do watch the way you speak. Women say words differently than guys. That was the next thing I had to learn.
But good job, Sweety. ;D
Janet
Thanks! I'm trying to get that aspect of speaking down, too (the way I actually say the words). I guess I can only pick up on that through observation. ^^;
I coach voice transition in MD, DE, VA, and honestly, that's very nice progress. I don't know how long you worked to get there, but your pitch is nice....could be a tiny bit higher, but not really necessary. A lot of that will be tied to visual body cues. The resonance and modulation of your voice needs work, but will become more stable with daily practice, and will fall more in tune with average female voice patterns over time. As Janet said, watch out for your word choices and enunciation. Listen constantly to other women. Make discreet eavesdropping your favorite hobby for a while. Find a fundamental note, ie G3, A3, and memorize it. Practice, practice, practice.
Nice work, Sarah
Miss Bev
Quote from: Miss Bev on May 30, 2009, 09:16:41 AM
I coach voice transition in MD, DE, VA, and honestly, that's very nice progress. I don't know how long you worked to get there, but your pitch is nice....could be a tiny bit higher, but not really necessary. A lot of that will be tied to visual body cues. The resonance and modulation of your voice needs work, but will become more stable with daily practice, and will fall more in tune with average female voice patterns over time. As Janet said, watch out for your word choices and enunciation. Listen constantly to other women. Make discreet eavesdropping your favorite hobby for a while. Find a fundamental note, ie G3, A3, and memorize it. Practice, practice, practice.
Nice work, Sarah
Miss Bev
Thank you very much, especially for the advice. I honestly don't know a lot about these individual aspects (resonance, modulation); I didn't watch tapes or the like, I just practiced all of this without any aide, except for a tip about positioning my larynx (I think that was it) from a good friend. Maybe I should take classes or finally order some tapes, because I don't know a lot about voice.
....Have to run to my regular jay oh bee (sales) in a minute or so. I measured the frequency of your voice, and it 'averages' around F3. Like I said, raise it a note or two.
How do you adjust your larynx?? Put your fingers on your throat and swallow. Feel the thyroid cartilage go up? Now yawn......it goes down. Learn how to move it up and down without swallowing, yawning. It's a muscular exercise you need to do.
Miss Bev
I've been practicing that with my larynx, I'll keep at it. Raising my voice a note or two... it'll take some time to slip into getting comfortable with that and making it sound natural, but then it was the same with getting to the way my voice is now. Thanks for the advice. =)
Ha. I knew I recognized you from somewhere on the internet, Sarah. Don't tell digibutter I'm here. (https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdigibutter.nerr.biz%2Fimages%2Fsmiles%2Fshifty.gif&hash=a6b58a41716be95cb40e1f674671334ea3c93564)
I'll just copy-paste my response here.
Your "new" voice is much, much better. Hearing it in direct contrast to your old voice probably makes it sound better than usual, but regardless, I probably wouldn't second-guess you being female if I heard you in real life.
Quote from: TooManyToasters on May 30, 2009, 10:50:49 AM
Ha. I knew I recognized you from somewhere on the internet, Sarah. Don't tell digibutter I'm here. (https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdigibutter.nerr.biz%2Fimages%2Fsmiles%2Fshifty.gif&hash=a6b58a41716be95cb40e1f674671334ea3c93564)
I'll just copy-paste my response here.
Your "new" voice is much, much better. Hearing it in direct contrast to your old voice probably makes it sound better than usual, but regardless, I probably wouldn't second-guess you being female if I heard you in real life.
Wow. I wasn't expecting this. Good to see you! Your secret is safe with me. ;)
Your voice sounds pretty good, although I would agree with Bev that raising it a note or two would help.
Personal opinion (using standard disclaimer):
I think one important factor is to never use your old voice.
Your training should be done to get a single, natural voice.
If someone drops an ice cube down your neck you shouldn't have to think which voice to use to complain.
I also think that recordings with before/after, while impressive, cloud the ability to really objectively evaluate the new voice.
Obviously, a single voice presumes full-time.
It takes more effort to do the old voice than my current voice, and I used it just for the sake of this before and after, really. I'm really trying to make this voice my own; also, my instinctive reactionary voice is set on the track of the voice I use now. I'm just a freak for before and afters, I guess. ^^; I'm living fulltime, have been since April.
Quote from: Renate on May 30, 2009, 11:39:06 AM
never use your old voice.
Your training should be done to get a single, natural voice.
If someone drops an ice cube down your neck you shouldn't have to think which voice to use to complain.
I agree here too. Forget the old voice. Also, practice coughing, clearing your throat, and sneezing. When you can survive a cold in public full time without getting clocked, you have reached the promised land.
the second voice sounds good.
Thanks. Guess it was a big no-no to use the old voice in comparison. ^^;
I actually have practiced coughing, and even sneezing. Clearing my throat... I hadn't thought of that. I'll practice with it.
Definitely more female in the second voice. They don't sound like the same person to me.
Myles
Quote from: myles on May 30, 2009, 09:45:13 PM
Definitely more female in the second voice. They don't sound like the same person to me.
Myles
Thanks! It took about a year to get to how it sounds right now.
Quote from: The Sarah♀ on May 30, 2009, 09:40:16 PM
I actually have practiced coughing, and even sneezing. Clearing my throat... I hadn't thought of that. I'll practice with it.
I recall a great actor saying how pleasant it was to film a role using his real voice because he didn't have to think about even breathing in the right accent and voice for whatever role he was playing. It's not just the voice, it's the whole package of sounds.
While I think you're doing an amazing job, as shown by the contrast (which I really liked BTW) if I were to just hear your new voice I'd probably think first off that you were a gay man. That's without any visual clues, of course. There's a bit of - I don't know - throat tension or something happening there.
Could I suggest you listen to someone like, say, Marilyn Monroe who spoke in an ultra-feminine way to the point of caricature. Try out that breathy, girlish way of speaking and then let it fall back towards your new voice to a point where it feels comfortable and natural. Loosen up that throat a little more.
Thanks... I'll try that, too. I appreciate all of the advice.
I know plenty of GGs that speak in a lower pitch than that. It sounded very natural to me. You have a feminine resonance no doubt. You could raise the pitch to sound a bit better, but you're already well in the passing range.
I have a question of my own. I would prefer to keep the ability to talk in my old male voice from time to time (for several reasons); how much harder does this make maintaining a feminine voice in the long run? Right now I can do both voices very well, but I find that I actually have to think to speak in my female voice rather than coming automatically.
There are probably others who could give you a better answer, but for me personally, using my voice as I have for a long time, it's the male-sounding voice that takes more effort. It isn't as easy to do anymore.
You are doing a fantastic job. It's actually phenomenal. I sure wish my voice training would progress as well. Hugs,Gen
Quote from: Genevieve Swann on May 31, 2009, 09:56:30 PM
You are doing a fantastic job. It's actually phenomenal. I sure wish my voice training would progress as well. Hugs,Gen
Thanks!
Quote from: The Sarah♀ on May 31, 2009, 09:07:24 PM
There are probably others who could give you a better answer, but for me personally, using my voice as I have for a long time, it's the male-sounding voice that takes more effort. It isn't as easy to do anymore.
Mike's voice is hard to find anymore. But yes, I maintained it for personal reasons, and very, very infrequent use. The voice of Mike's that I maintain is hard to find, and is not as resonant as it used to be. If I sing in Mike's old baritone voice, it screws up my alto voice for a day or two, so I make sure not to do that....
I decided a couple weeks ago to pretty much let it go, even if I'm talking to creditors or insurance companies etc. as Mike. I only have a couple still in that name, and it's funny....they call me ma'am even using a male name without question.
On the phone, I've been addressed always as a girl for a while now. People who don't know about me think I'm my own sister, or something. Then again, pretty much nobody who knew the old me is unaware about the truth now, as I'll gladly be out and open with everyone I know. Since April, I've decided never to hide under the male guise if I can help it, and just be me anywhere, anytime.
Now I need to take things a step further. My voice might be passable, but I know that I can improve it substantially. I'm certain that a lot of this advice will help, so I'm really, really thankful to everyone who's given me their input. :D
Your voice sounds very good to me! When I listened to the second voice, i definitely pictured it coming from a woman. It does sound a tiny bit strained though. Practice makes perfect right?
Wow I wish I could get my voice to sound as good. I need to find a vocal coach or therapist. Something to help I guess
How did you learn to do that?
Tristan and Neon,
It is easy. Practice, Practice, Practice, Practice, Practice. And when you are done more Practice, Practice, Practice, Practice, Practice, Practice.
It is the only way.
Janet
yeah i know its just really hard
I did it for 4 months straight, before I finally heard something that was really close. Another 2 months and I had it. Now it is hard to even find the old male voice. Thank the Goddess.
Janet
Quote from: Janet Lynn on May 30, 2009, 07:03:35 AM
Awesome. When I first heard it I thought you had a GG say the words. But I really think that you are right there. But do watch the way you speak. Women say words differently than guys. That was the next thing I had to learn.
But good job, Sweety. ;D
Janet
Is there a source somewhere I could read up on that?I get (even though I'm a LONG way from mastering) the concept of changing the pitch and mastering the resonance and so forth....but the more subtle things like what you mention I feel like I'm not even seeing. I'd love to be able to wrap my head around that concept.
I think it sounded pretty good. I am far from an expert, though.
Sometimes I wonder about people recommending to raise pitch. The most soothing and calming female voices I have ever heard were from GGs that have deep soothing voices. Then again that could be due to my General Anxiety Disorder. :)
There is a good source on-line. http://www.youtube.com/user/tgvoice (http://www.youtube.com/user/tgvoice) Kathe Perez is an internationally known Speech-Language Pathologist, who provides Voice Feminization therapy. Her you tube has many good clips.
Janet