I know this question is asked a lot but need an answer. I recently have gotten a hair cut and am passing as a guy. So, should I use the men's or women's bathroom. I personally would like to use the men's for obvious reasons. Any ideas?
Hi hellhound! (it just doesn't seem right to say hellhound in a cheerful manner) Anyways, I would totally use the mens bathroom (if I were you, of course). If a guy gives you any trouble just give him a dirty look, or whatever guys do in those cases :icon_doh:.
If you pass even a little bit, guys won't give you a second glance. They assume that if you look male-ish, and you're in a male space, then you must be male.
Also, when you start to pass more and more frequently, entering the womens' room will become an ordeal. (I'm pre-T, and I still almost made someone scream by walking into the restroom - still not sure whether to be happy or annoyed by that...) I'd almost suggest just using the mens' to avoid that hassle!
Really though, guys don't look at other guys in the bathroom (possibly the one and only good thing about homophobia). So long as you look vaguely like a dude, you probably won't get a second glance.
Rule of thumb Ive always gone by... use the bathroom of the gender you present. It took me a while to get used to using the ladies room, now I dont even think twice. I have noticed that woman tend to linger longer and are more chatty... guys just get in and get out.
Oh, and if you really want to pass, be like the other guys and dont wash your hands on the way out! :o
Quote from: Stacy Brahm on June 13, 2009, 04:30:35 AM
Rule of thumb Ive always gone by... use the bathroom of the gender you present. It took me a while to get used to using the ladies room, now I dont even think twice. I have noticed that woman tend to linger longer and are more chatty... guys just get in and get out.
Oh, and if you really want to pass, be like the other guys and dont wash your hands on the way out! :o
Yes, use the restroom of the gender you are presenting! And yes, guys don't look at each other much in the restroom.
And, having used the ladies room for the past two months, I've noticed it isn't just men who don't always wash their hands after taking care of business. ::)
- Kate
In psychology, there's this thing called the "spotlight effect." Basically, it means that you think everyone around you is looking at you all the time when in reality, they're not and they could care less.
http://www.wordspy.com/words/spotlighteffect.asp (http://www.wordspy.com/words/spotlighteffect.asp)
My advice as far as bathrooms would be....don't worry about a thing! lol, it's not like someone is gonna ask you to take off your pants and prove it.
I'm still too nervous to go to the men's room ... :/
Quote from: Miniar on June 13, 2009, 07:36:17 PM
I'm still too nervous to go to the men's room ... :/
Just go for it. Guys never talk to each other in the bathroom.
Quote from: Kara on June 13, 2009, 07:52:03 PM
Just go for it. Guys never talk to each other in the bathroom.
I know, I walk up to the door to the (I know) empty men's bathroom, and then veer to the left, hang my head and take the other one cause I'm still stuck in the what ifs.
Quote from: Miniar on June 13, 2009, 08:00:03 PM
I know, I walk up to the door to the (I know) empty men's bathroom, and then veer to the left, hang my head and take the other one cause I'm still stuck in the what ifs.
Try using one at 1 am or 5 am or something when no one is around. Someplace that you know stays open a while but is always deserted at that time. Maybe a gas station? Or a grocery store would be even better. Just go in, do your thing and allow yourself to get comfortable with the idea. If you're not willing to just rush into it, that is.
At some point, you're going to have to go in there if you want to or not, so you might as well start now. :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: Kara on June 13, 2009, 08:05:14 PM
Try using one at 1 am or 5 am or something when no one is around. Someplace that you know stays open a while but is always deserted at that time. Maybe a gas station? Or a grocery store would be even better. Just go in, do your thing and allow yourself to get comfortable with the idea. If you're not willing to just rush into it, that is.
At some point, you're going to have to go in there if you want to or not, so you might as well start now. :icon_mrgreen:
good idea. the first times I used the men's, was always with another male. go in with another guy and nobody will look twice.
I started using the men's room as soon as I started binding, which was basically when I went full-time... over a year prior to starting T. I was terrified, honestly, and I used to make sure to clear my throat in as deep a voice as possible every time I went in and another guy looked at me. Don't know if it worked, but I was only noticeably clocked twice that I recall... neither incidence resulted in someone saying something.
My theory always was that men might see someone they believe is female in the men's room and think it's weird, but not say anything... but if a woman sees someone in the women's room who she thinks is male, she'll make sure everyone knows it. In the end, it's safer to hit the men's room... because, in the end, even if they say something, the vast, vast majority of men will never be violent toward someone they believe to be female. However... a woman gets a little too uppity about a man in the girls' room, and her boyfriend/husband/male friend etc may feel the need to assert his "manhood" and forcibly remove you.
SD
I agree with Sebastian. As someone who used only men's rooms for decades, I've seen a few people who were obviously women use them, too - usually at some place where there was a huge line for the women's room and no line for the men's but not always. No one ever said anything.
This is a test. Gird your loins, so to speak. Stand with confidence. Chest out, shoulders back, a slight look of disdain on your face. Open the door and enter.
And be disappointed because it is no big deal. ;)
- Kate
I agree with the using the one that you are presenting. The first time I used the ladies room, I just walked in like I owned it, did my business, washed hands and was about to leave when I was confronted by another woman. The question asked? "Where did you get those shoes. They are so cute". I was wearing my Vans sneakers and I got them at a local store. I told her were I got them.
Two days later, she came into the store wearing the same shoes. She saw me and showed me her new shoes, and smiled. We talked shoes for a bit. So if you act like you belong there, you are accepted.
Janet
I agree it has helped me to go with a friend a few times to build up confidence. Also, the very first time I used the ladies room was in a primarily gay/lesbian nightclub so the people there were probably used to it anyways lol :embarrassed: I guess that was cheating but it helped me realize that if you're dressed the part the majority of people won't even notice, much less care.
While I started on a trip and used airports and a crowded truckstop, one of the places I really got confidence, esp. using a urinal, was my local grocery store. Small bathroom, 1 stall, 1 urinal tucked in a corner. I used it pretty much every time I went to that store. 9 times out of 10 it was empty, so I got comfortable with the idea of the men's room.
Now that I pass pretty much all the time I don't feel awkward. The main awkwardness came when in the airport I needed a stall and they were full. Do I form a line? What do I do with my bag? That sort of thing.
Jay
Quote from: sneakersjay on June 14, 2009, 02:56:33 PM
While I started on a trip and used airports and a crowded truckstop, one of the places I really got confidence, esp. using a urinal, was my local grocery store. Small bathroom, 1 stall, 1 urinal tucked in a corner. I used it pretty much every time I went to that store. 9 times out of 10 it was empty, so I got comfortable with the idea of the men's room.
Now that I pass pretty much all the time I don't feel awkward. The main awkwardness came when in the airport I needed a stall and they were full. Do I form a line? What do I do with my bag? That sort of thing.
Jay
If anyone asks, just say you've got a #2.
I've been using the men's room for quite some time now. Never got hassled, but I did avoid using public restrooms whenever possible. I always made sure to take a leak before I left home; and unless I really NEEDED to pee, I would nix the public restroom and wait till I got home again. I'm a lot more confident now, but it's been a gradual thing.
One trick that I used made me feel a little more confident: As long as there was nobody in the bathroom WHILE I was peeing sitting down, I would quietly raise the toilet seat AFTER I had finished. It was just a psychological thing that said to any newcomers, "See? I'm an ->-bleeped-<- like all the other guys!" Except it's much more accepted to leave the seat up in the men's room.
I have to admit that I'm a little worried about jury duty in a couple of months. I'll be trapped there all day, maybe for several days, and I won't be able to hold it till I get home! But I figure that I'll be post-surgery by then and much more confident generally. My voice should be even lower, my facial hair should be a bit more noticeable, and I won't need a binder anymore. I will have changed my gender markers by then, too. Plus, I might pack, just for the added confidence.
Anyway, I agree with everyone else that for guys it's safer to use the men's room. If you're a little too butch in the women's, the gals in there can make all sorts of trouble for you.
Quote from: Sebastien on June 14, 2009, 01:16:07 AM
However... a woman gets a little too uppity about a man in the girls' room, and her boyfriend/husband/male friend etc may feel the need to assert his "manhood" and forcibly remove you.
SD
About three or four years ago, I accidentally stumbled into the women's restroom at a Taco Bell. When I came out, I was met directly with the shocked expression of a girl in her early 20s. Confused, I looked back at the door, saw the sign, looked back at her and said "Ummm. . .sorry?" I'd washed my hands, put the seat back down, everything, but she couldn't be bothered with those details.
She proceeded to spit out "Oh my god" and "gross!" in half a valley girl accent over and over again, turning around and meeting back up with her boyfriend in line at the counter. After some hurried whispers, male laughs, female noises of disgust, and glances back at me in line, I just left the place.
. . .I wish I hadn't remembered that. -_-;;
I think the basic jist is that we tend to create most of the drama we fear in our own heads, and in the end, the sad reality is.... the rest of the world just doesnt give a damn about us, they are more interested in themselves. Point of comfort, or sad commentary... choose your poison... ;)
I do not understand why FTM could not use men's room. However I have to admit that as pre-transition MTF some men looked weirdly at me probably because I nearly always used a stall.
I must be oblivious, because I have peed sitting down for about 20 years now. I never noticed anyone giving me the hairy eyeball, even when I had to wait for a stall. Perhaps I just wasn't paying attention, but generally people in men's rooms avoid noticing each other.
The only time I got a look was when I was in the stall by the door while wearing heels and a skirt. That was my first excursion out in a skirt, well before transitioning. Once seated I realized I should have used the women's room. :P When I left the stall to wash my hands, the man at the other sink gave me quite a look but said nothing. ;)
- Kate
I've only recently started using the men's room. I was scared for a long time, but i finally worked up the courage and just did it. I brought a bathroom buddy (a male friend) with me the first couple of times. Like everyone else has said, guys try and use the bathroom as quickly as possible, and don't even make eye contact. A lot of them don't even look up from the urinal. I haven't been hassled or anything, even though I still look kinda girly. You just have to walk in with confidence!
The only issue with bathrooms are when people who draw attention to themselves might make you feel awkward. And by drawing attention to themselves, I dont mean by dressing. Even in places that would seem "safe" someone people can creep out others.
Being in drab one day this week I had to the use the mens room at a corporate client, and there was a guy in their whistling to himself and seems somehow out of place. It creeped the hell out of me, I just did my business and got out ASAP.
Thats never (yet) happened to me in the ladies room, though Im sure there are women who excel just as well at creeping out others...