HOW DO YOU ALL FEEL ABOUT HAVING TO DISCLOSE LEGAL GENDER IN ORDER TO PURCHASE AN AIRLINE TICKET
Quote from: xsocialworker on August 13, 2009, 08:25:31 AM
HOW DO YOU ALL FEEL ABOUT HAVING TO DISCLOSE LEGAL GENDER IN ORDER TO PURCHASE AN AIRLINE TICKET
It doesn't bother me. I purchase all my airline tickets online and if I recall the form doesn't ask for "Legal" gender it simple asks to check Male or Female.
-={LR}=-
I bought tickets last night and didn't disclose my sex. Even if I had... whatever. who cares.
it doesn't bother me either.
nope, doesn't bother me either.
Its life. I could care less that my drivers license and passport say im female. It doesn't control who I am inside.
My legal gender matches what I've got between my legs. There is a big F on my passport & other identity documents. There's no need for them to 'ask' me for my legal gender. The only thing they've asked me is my credit card number & expiration date.
Quote from: Fer on August 14, 2009, 07:38:23 AM
My legal gender matches what I've got between my legs. There is a big F on my passport & other identity documents. There's no need for them to 'ask' me for my legal gender. The only thing they've asked me is my credit card number & expiration date.
Isn't it funny that it's often the Numbers that are more important than the Letters :)
-=LR}=-
I for one am disturbed by the new legislation that is going in place that requires verification of gender to obtain a boarding pass. As someone who is likely to pass long before I am able to legally change my gender, I am concerned about the possible harassment that could result in being forced to come out to some stranger at the airport.
Besides which, it's none of their F*ing business what I've got in my pants.
My DL says female and that is all I have ever shown when getting a ticket. Plus there is my carry letter.
Janet
Quote from: Janet Lynn on August 14, 2009, 08:27:39 PM
My DL says female and that is all I have ever shown when getting a ticket.
FYI, the rules have now changed. I was just reading about this in the paper. They will now be checking against federal databases, and if your gender doesn't match your tax records they can refuse to let you board.
Then how will anyone be able to go to Thailand? If the feds wouldn't let us change our genders in the fed databases, then they will not let us change our gender.
Interesting conundrum.
Janet
I put down Ms. on my train ticket a few times way before my name got legally changed (which was recent) and they didnt' seem to care.
Quote from: Janet Lynn on August 14, 2009, 08:27:39 PM
My DL says female
How did you manage that Janet, has Oregon started doing it like Washington?
Similar, just took a letter from my therapist and the name change. Did them at the same time.
Janet
That is so freaking cool! I didn't know Oregon had such a policy in place. I am in LaGrande, just a hair south of the Washington border and started thinking about moving north a bit when they made their change. I was really worried, because I get a substantial amount of money from the Oregon Opportunity Grant program so the new dl was looking at costing me about $400 a month.
Check with your therapist. They have to be on the approved list. And check with the DMV in your area. the state has some new rules about getting a license that might be a hinderence. I made it just under the wire of the changes.
Janet
Is this an American thing? I travel to Sweden and Turkey at least twice a year & I've never been asked to undress or prove my gender.
Quote from: Jeannette on August 14, 2009, 09:31:07 PM
Is this an American thing? I travel to Sweden and Turkey at least twice a year & I've never been asked to undress or prove my gender.
Yes, it's a U.S. thing. It's supposed to roll out August 15th for domestic flights, and apply to anyone flying into the U.S. by 2012, if I recall correctly. They will be asking for gender and birth date, and checking against federal records. (I'm sure they'd check your passport for international flights.) Supposedly it's to weed out legitimate travelers who have similar names as people on terrorist watch lists. I guess the whole Cat Stevens fiasco finally caught up with them. ::)
And Janet - You'd still be able to travel to Thailand. You'd just have to tell them you're male. >:(
Edit: O.K. Here's a link to a news story. http://www.statenews.com/index.php/article/2009/08/airline_ticket_buyers_to_be_required_to_give_birth_date_gender_ (http://www.statenews.com/index.php/article/2009/08/airline_ticket_buyers_to_be_required_to_give_birth_date_gender_) On re-reading, it appears they will be checking against the watch list, and they are asking for the gender that appears on "government documents". So I guess if your state allows you to change the DL before surgery, you may be O.K., at least for domestic flights. Still doesn't help me, though. :(
Quote from: Jamie-o on August 14, 2009, 08:24:35 PM
I for one am disturbed by the new legislation that is going in place that requires verification of gender to obtain a boarding pass. As someone who is likely to pass long before I am able to legally change my gender, I am concerned about the possible harassment that could result in being forced to come out to some stranger at the airport.
Besides which, it's none of their F*ing business what I've got in my pants.
agreed!
Gender is wholly irrelevant to the airline security issue and I can't see how it would make any difference whatsoever. If someone on a watch list is travelling they will need extremely high quality forged papers to pass existing controls and if you have those, why bother with a gender difference?
I mean seriously, can anyone contrive a realistic scenario where the gender marker makes any actualy difference? Surely he watch list isn't just a name and gender pair? I would imagine it's whatever info they have on the individual, i.e. passport numbers, photos, addresses, etc..
As a frequent visitor to the US, I'm constantly surprised by some of the symbology - marble pillars, senates, eagles, spanky shiny uniforms, gathering biometric data, all stereotypes of an authoritarian state if you were building a movie set (anyone remember that old Star Trek episode with the modern world version of ancient Rome?).
Maybe next they should take a leaf out of Ceaucescu's book - he had people break into citizens' homes and take sterile cotton swabs of the scent. There were warehouses full of bell jars containing cotton swabs, just in case they had to hunt you with dogs.
Hehe, I remember when the Berlin Wall collapsed ... there was an East German joke about what happened to the Stazi which claimed they all became taxi drivers. When you were drunk, you just got into the cab - you didn't need to say a word, because they already knew where you lived :)
It is the law and as a Southwest customer, I got an E-Mail they sent out to frequent flyers that one could store this info in their data base and they would only ask it that one time. Even when I was pre-op and had an M on my license, TSA officials never said a word to me. I don't think TS's are really what they are looking for or ever were. You can check the NCTE website for updates.
Post Merge: October 26, 2009, 07:07:51 AM
In the era of electronic data storage, privacy is long gone. I applied for SS this month and even though I changed my gender years ago and they call me M'am in person and on the phone, they still have all the records of when I was male. The Orwellian TV that watches you in your home is as passe as a steam locomotive.
How I know what is my ''legal gender''? Must I choose male in case I travel to Ireland for example or to the state of Idaho???
Just tell 'em your a Wack-a-Mole.
I was nearly arrested in the Canadian airport two times. Has never happened in the Europe even I have ''passed'' here worse. Male airport security workers have not tried to search me here, in Canada one did.
Quote from: DarkLady on October 26, 2009, 09:22:02 AM
How I know what is my ''legal gender''? Must I choose male in case I travel to Ireland for example or to the state of Idaho???
Your legal gender for identification is whatever it states on your legal ID
Quote from: DarkLady on October 26, 2009, 09:22:02 AM
How I know what is my ''legal gender''? Must I choose male in case I travel to Ireland for example or to the state of Idaho???
I go to Idaho all the time and they don't look up your skirt. It's a red state, yes, but Boise is very much blue. I don't want to defend them too much because the whole state does need to die in a fire in terms of civil rights, but in my experience it isn't as bad as the stereotype makes it out to be.
I've never been to Idaho and I doubt I will in this lifetime. To their credit, they were one of the first states to oppose adopting the "The Real I.D."
My passport tells female (in case that is legal id while travelling).
I travel lots (within the US and over to Canada as well). I am a Canadian living in the US on a work visa (hopefully to become a green card at some point in the future). Recently I've had to identify gender on my ticket. Because of gov't funness I cannot change gender (at least not for a while). My passport picture hasn't been updated since I began T a year ago (I am now sprout a near full beard). And yet, I've never been stopped (granted my travel tends to put me in premiere level of travel). The reality is that skin colour and other privilege trumps all (at least from an FTM point of view).
Whatever your official ID says (either state issued ID or passport) is what you must put down on your plane ticket.
Post Merge: October 27, 2009, 11:55:47 AM
Quote from: Jeannette on August 14, 2009, 09:31:07 PM
Is this an American thing? I travel to Sweden and Turkey at least twice a year & I've never been asked to undress or prove my gender.
Definitely an American thing but will likely propogate to other nations as the FAA tends to direct airline requirements. That said, it's supposed to "ferret out" terrorists who cross dress (not like they wouldn't get female bombers or vice-versa). Quite honestly, the ones who will likely face the biggest challenge are those who's skin colour doesn't match that of the colour of freshly lain snow. Let's be real here: it's a target against minorities ('cuz they all look the same and ya can't tell 'em apart, doncha' know?) and trans minorities.
My understanding is that the airport staff is supposed to be trained on trans individuals and are to be respectful (HAH! since they can barely smile when you say "Hi! How's your day going?" I have doubts about this but we'll see as time progresses).
Quote from: Janet Lynn on August 14, 2009, 08:36:29 PM
Then how will anyone be able to go to Thailand? If the feds wouldn't let us change our genders in the fed databases, then they will not let us change our gender.
Interesting conundrum.
Janet
By disclosing thier gender.... embarassed once, thingy chopped up once!
Personally i have an F on my passport, dispite not having a F on my birth cert yet, the Uk is helpful that way....
Although last time i went into the US, I didn't have to disclose it, or even buying the ticket on the return. (was 3 weeks back?)
Quote from: DarkLady on October 26, 2009, 09:37:20 AM
I was nearly arrested in the Canadian airport two times. Has never happened in the Europe even I have ''passed'' here worse. Male airport security workers have not tried to search me here, in Canada one did.
Sorry that happened to you here, it's quite unusual. For future reference, if it ever happens again just request to be searched by females (or by females with a male in the room) if it makes you more comfortable. Airport security was probly just taking advantage of the fact you weren't from here. Makes me sick, but just so you know it's the law here that you can only be searched by a gender that your comfortable with (provided your presenting female.)
Also this new law you guys are talking about sucks ass, it's one of the reasons I hate the US and I don't even live there lol. In Canada (Ontario atleast) you can change all of your "legal" documents EXCEPT your birthcertificate before you have the surgery as long as you have a letter from a therapist saying it would be a good idea. Once you have the surgery you may change your birth certificate. As such even in the government database your male life ends and your female life begins as a wholly new person. The government will no longer have any information on you being male, your previous male gender just becomes another person completely unrelated to you (unless your a criminal of course. In which case crimes committed as a male will still have your fingerprints on file, and you will still be known that way) but as long as you follow the laws then everythign is fine ^^
I used to say "M' was for "Martian" and I was on a secret fact finding trip.
Funny, I always thought F was for feline. Then I learned that some cats really are evil.