Well, the subject isn't entirely accurate.
It started with my mother, going down on her knees, yelling "BE A WOMAN BUT KEEP YOUR DICK!!!!!!"
And has continued. Several friends have told me that they're jealous of me, that they'd love to 'have both' (breasts and dick.) "Best of both worlds" is something I've heard too many times. An internet friend of mine wants me to keep my dick so she can tap it when she gets the chance.
So, after reading the 'differences between mtf and ftm transition' thread, it came to mind - do people tell you "be a dude but keep your boobs" or anything of the sort? Of course, atrophying, muscular, hairy boobs aren't something that anyone really wants... unlike petite little things with cocks and tits. *sigh*
I don't think anyone has told me to keep my boobs. Wouldn't be surprised if someone else has had to endure someone begging for that.
My ex did not wish me to do anything physical to transition, but she realized that I had to go where I have gone.
I have heard the 'best of both worlds' comments before too, but I have tried to explain that there is no 'best of both worlds'. In fact, while I understand why some do, I personally find it disgusting especially on this body.
My ex actually said he didnt care if I took hormones or anything like that, but he "needed me to have tits". One of the big things that broke us up.
my one friend said "You're still going to keep your hair right?" [usually its a long shaggy stoner cut with bangs down to my nose]
ha!
I said of course!
and I intended to until the lady at the hair place cut it mad short thinking I was 14 and my mom had sent me in to get cleaned up for the holidays [ugh!] but thats besides the point.
Other than that, no. I'm pretty sure most people in my life are almost relieved to see me transition. Its kind of nice.
Quote from: Autumn on January 29, 2010, 12:47:55 AM
after reading the 'differences between mtf and ftm transition' thread, it came to mind - do people tell you "be a dude but keep your boobs" or anything of the sort?
nope nobody's told me anythin like that. My family's been very supportive.
Quote from: Chris on January 29, 2010, 01:43:55 AM
nope nobody's told me anythin like that. My family's been very supportive.
Ditto. If MTFs do hear this kind of thing more than we do, it's probably do to sexualization of women/misogyny, etc. All that good stuff Julia Serano talks about.
Quote from: Autumn on January 29, 2010, 12:47:55 AM
So, after reading the 'differences between mtf and ftm transition' thread, it came to mind - do people tell you "be a dude but keep your boobs" or anything of the sort?
...My mother does. Mum insists "Can't you just get them made... smaller or something? A reduction? Like a lot of bigger-chested girls have? Instead of... surgically disfiguring yourself!? Even if you insist that you want to be a boy. The larger guys have... some extra tissue up there." (Thanks Mum, comparing me to an obese male.)
...Well, then again she's also told me numerous times that "You know, no one would want to be with a girl who's trying to pretend to be a guy. A girl who feels the need to surgically mutilate herself like you obviously seem to want to." So maybe she's not the best example for being supportive of something like that. :eusa_wall:
I actually read your post all the way through so I know it's not a question for mtf...but I just wanted to say your mom sounds very dramatic, lol. Sounds like you've got your hands full.
Quotetrying to pretend
Strange thing to read, nonsensical I guess. Who would
try to pretend, either you pretend or you are real.
No one asked me to keep my breasts, but my mother asked me to keep my uterus and all associated equipment so I could still have kids. I politely declined! :)
Yes, one person asked me not to transition- but not transition at all. He got over that quickly.
Quote from: Autumn on January 29, 2010, 12:47:55 AMSeveral friends have told me that they're jealous of me, that they'd love to 'have both' (breasts and dick.) "Best of both worlds" is something I've heard too many times.
I've thought this too. I'm a guy with boobs (for now) and lots of guys think it would be great to have them so he can fondle them. A non-trans guy might like them for awhile, but they would get old
reeeealy quick. Not to mention the insults and dysphoria than would develop. As a guy who's had boobs for a long time now- no, it sucks. Bio-men don't know what they're getting into wishing that. :-\ I think most transguys would agree.
Quote from: Autumn on January 29, 2010, 12:47:55 AMAn internet friend of mine wants me to keep my dick so she can tap it when she gets the chance.
This is so insulting I don't know where to begin. Let her tap someone else's dick. This is for
you. If you want something removed or changed you have a right to. It's
your body and
you have to live with it. Tell people to leave your body alone because it's not theirs.
Other than the: You're not going to DO anything, are you? when I came out, no.
There is great fascination with the penis, for sure. But I can surely understand why any female-identified person would not want one permanently attached to their body.
So for me, I'd say no, as the comments pertained to transition in general and their not wanting to have to explain to their other friends about me, rather than keeping a body part someone would want to play with in a sexual way. I did think about keeping the vag, 'just in case' but decided that I personally don't enjoy being penetrated there.
Jay
You know, I had the weirdest call today. It was sort of along these lines, and I'd like to get the WTF? off my chest.
I spoke to someone (that knew me "before") who said they were supportive. In the beginning they were. Right name, right pronouns, and got everyone else doing the same thing.
I really didn't expect this... but they seem to all of a sudden (after 7 months) think I'm mentally unstable!
I've been transitioning for more than 7 months, but that's just how long they've known.
It came up today that I was looking at being on testosterone when I made a joke about helpdesk work and voices breaking.
Then it was "Oh no. You're not are you?".
They said that they know people, and have read about so many people that have later regretted it.
They are convinced I'm both bipolar and have borderline personality disorder. They asked point blank "Have you been getting your bipolar seen to?". I don't know where the hell that came from - I've been certified by a professional to be none of those things. I asked where the hell they got that idea from, and they said I had "mental instability".
I mean, I'm a little weird and I tend to get snappy when I really, really need a cigarette - but unstable? I understand the borders between others and myself, and I don't cycle between depression and mania. Hell, I don't change mood at all without some sort of cause.
It was a long and drawn out conversation that didn't get any better from there.
It's just so "WTF?!". I can't help but think they've been merely humoring me during this time, and they seem to think it is some "exploration" phase (which they would have been supportive of - as long as I came to the conclusion they wanted). I can't help but wonder what impression they have given other people about me.
And they decided to drop the bomb - "I don't want to see someone I care about hurt themselves". I hate that.
So no. They didn't beg as such, but they tried to patronize, manipulate, guilt trip, and convince me I was mentally unstable.
... and I expect more of it from more people the closer I get to physically changing.
I've got two big courts cases coming up against my local health authority one in local court and one in European court - over just this wrongful labelling me as mental etc. The shrink has even told the other sides lawyers that I might be a mental and be a regretter...and I've been on estrogen 5 years and glad to have the male bits die... The hetero folks must think we wake from surgery and start screaming 'OMG! You cut it off. Stitch it back pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease!' As if.
Well...
My mom and my grandma both want me to keep my body the way it is.. which would mean me not getting top surgery (which is something I've wanted to do for years). After I explained why I want the surgery though, they seemed to understand a little better.
As far as getting lower surgery, I can see why they wouldn't want me to get it.. And though I'd love to, I don't see myself even considering it until the procedures produce better results.
When it comes to my body, I try to not let their wants get to me. I appreciate and accept their opinions on the subject, but in the end I have to do what is right for me. I also feel that if we keep the lines of communication open, that we will be able to reach something close to a mutual understanding.
The father has told me many times that he doesn't really care if I have short hair and wear boy clothes, as long as I don't bind because it's unnatural and will give me breast cancer.
I've gotten it from both sides, with some people encouraging me to get on T, and others saying to hold off on it. I didn't take either as being un-supportive however.
My ex-GF is MTF, and we were both part of a good sized queer/trans community in Chicago. She would regularly try to force the issue on me, always wanting to help me get an appointment with the informed consent endocrinologist she went to, or trying to get me to go to group meetings with her (work schedule always got in the way), or trying to introduce me to other FTM guys. I'm still undecided about how far I want to go with transitioning, so it got to be kind of overwhelming.
My old roommate was the opposite. When I told him that I think im trans, and we talked about transitioning, he said that I should wait to do anything. he said "If you're still changing your mind about it, your not ready to go on T."
No one I've talked to about it has been against it though.
its funny my parents haven't told me not too.. well not BEGGED
but this one guy who had a thing for me once.. (excpet he refused to view me as a guy) we were talking about sex, and I told him I was a top.. and then got mad when he found out that when I say top.. I mean 'pitcher'. and he says "dont transition, you are so pretty." lol wtf..
and he says that I shouldnt transition untill I have had vaginal sex.. because it will "change my mind" which pisses me off! >:(
and someone else told me that same thing...
and my friend said that I shouldnt do it.. because I wont enjoy sex.. ugh I hate how people presume.. that I would even want to have sex like a girl, and people assume that transitoning means getting a penis.. its not that easy.. I will still have my lower junk for a while at least.
I hate HOW they say it.. turn and look at you and say "don't transition" as if THEY know whats best for me, as if they know how sick i feel in the body i'm in.
Quote from: Elijah on January 30, 2010, 01:24:24 AM
...I hate HOW they say it.. turn and look at you and say "don't transition" as if THEY know whats best for me, as if they know how sick i feel in the body i'm in.
Don't let it get to you Elijah, just remember that nobody knows you as well as you do. Even I have trouble trying not to care about what other people say and think, but you just have to try hard to ignore them if they aren't going to respect the way you feel about yourself.
That's what I find the most ridiculous about people trying to deny that I am trans. I want to tell them, "Listen to yourself, you're arguing with me about HOW I FEEL. How could you possibly know how I feel better than I do?"
Like when my mom tried to tell me, "Just be gender neutral." She doesn't want me to change myself physically, and not for any other reason than she doesn't want me to be different. She doesn't understand that being just "gender neutral" is NOT ENOUGH. But she's slowly accepting it more...
Quote from: Elijah on January 30, 2010, 01:24:24 AM
and he says that I shouldnt transition untill I have had vaginal sex.. because it will "change my mind" which pisses me off! >:(
This is the comment that I got the most from people. My own mother even offered to take me to a bar to meet some random guy and get laid. They always seemed so *sure* that this would fix everything; it seemed to me that they were missing a rather large point... it pissed me off to no end then. Now I'm more inclined to shrug my shoulders and chalk it up as 'yet another thing that people probably won't understand unless they've lived it.'
Quote from: Eryk on January 30, 2010, 03:56:47 PM
This is the comment that I got the most from people. My own mother even offered to take me to a bar to meet some random guy and get laid. They always seemed so *sure* that this would fix everything; it seemed to me that they were missing a rather large point... it pissed me off to no end then. Now I'm more inclined to shrug my shoulders and chalk it up as 'yet another thing that people probably won't understand unless they've lived it.'
WOW.
I was 29 before I ever had vaginal sex, and it did nothing for me. Oh I did figure out how to make it work and all, and I figured it was better than nothing. But, obviously, it did nothing to make me F at all, and in some ways reinforced my dysphoria.
Jay
Quoteand he says that I shouldnt transition untill I have had vaginal sex.. because it will "change my mind" which pisses me off!
Haha, isn't that the classic line? All girls need is a good dickin' and they'll stop that crazy lesbian, feminism, equal rights, wantin' a penis thing...
My mother has been a lot more supportive in the last 6 months than she was in the last few years.
It used to be that she'd keep telling me to "live life in the middle, like you are now." I would point out things like "Mom, it's really frustrating and *not safe* to not know if this guy hitting on me is gay or straight..." and she would always reply "It doesn't matter what other people think, just be yourself!"
??? I don't know how that whole bit was lost on her...
Well not many people actually know as of yet, my family doesn't even know yet, yes, I'm a chicken! ><
But of the people that do know, I've only gotten one really bad reaction, from someone that was a courtin' me. Being the nice guy that I am, I told him upfront, he seemed cool with it at first, when he thought that "transgender" and "tomboy" were the same thing... then once he actually figured out everything that it entailed, he had a major freak out, told me I'd always look like a girl no matter what, so I shouldn't bother, said that he wouldn't date me unless I stayed a girl (uhm.. I kind of don't see that as a threat.. I'm better off WITHOUT him ANYWAY, thankyaverymuch!), and he told me I was too pretty to be a guy, I'd never be accepted as a guy, I'd never be a 'real' guy, I'd be turning myself into a butchered woman, etc, etc. Needless to say we don't talk anymore! :D
On the other hand though, I do have a few friends that can't wait until I can get on testosterone because "my voice is way too high and hurts their ears when I get hyper" LOL Gotta love 'em!