I've seen alot of this argument against Trans pepole. The idea goes that we were merely pandering to a gender stereotype a clichéd sexist ideal both socially emotionally and physically of what a male and female ought to be and morph ourselves into this internalized image. imposing this onto society and providing reinforcement to those traditional gender roles and fundamentally undermining the idea of sex equality.
I can't help but wonder how many trans pepole they've met. I mean I don't think I propagate a negative or stereotypical ideal of what it would be like to be female I REALLY want to be a scientist, I hope I have a career in biological sciences I have no interest in becoming a begin a kept woman I'd be terrible with young children I find very young kids grating.
I also don't like make-up I don't hate it to the point that I would NEVER wear it but I just feel it's been overdone. Alot of girls wear it everyday and I feel that doing that removes from it's impact and thus dosen't actually make you more attractive. It's also because it's gritty and I always make a compete ham of it smudging or getting it in my eyes.
So to you guys how are you not like what is stereotypically expected of your desired gender role?
Don't like sports. Don't know all that much about cars. Not very aggressive.
I cry too frequently (GID).
I have surprised myself at how typically female I am. Who knew? ::)
Still, I love cars and almost anything with wheels. I was an avid motorcyclist until I got sidetracked transitioning. Once I heal I hope to take a little motorcycle trip (alone) to visit friends – about 5,000 miles. I like shooting. Even in my sixties I still shovel the snow at my church, although I've been slowing down a little. :P I'm pretty handy fixing things and don't expect that to be removed along with my testicles. I would have made a lousy mother but hope to be a decent grandmother or auntie. (As a grandmother, you aren't stuck with the kids constantly.) When push comes to shove I can be pretty forceful.
But other than that and perhaps some things I can't think of now, I'm just a friendly, happy woman. :)
- Kate
Lets see..
I am MTF yet I love action movies and guns and knives. I do not like chick flicks. I am very much a homebody and I am the housewife in my home. So that way I am kinda steriotypical. But I love to blast heavy metal and black metal when I am alone.
I am a blend of male and female, why wouldn't my interests reflect that.
I live in jeans and tops, must like I always have. I am still a handy woman, fixing things that need it. If push comes to shove I can still fix the car.
I like action movies, sci fi, and horror movies. I do clean house to Cher, country music or Big Band. But I still like getting dressed up to go out. I enjoy it when guys check me out. :D
I like metal (I like light stuff too) and that is considered manly I guess.
I love to play paintball (even though I haven't in a few years due to $).
I am into computers, Linux and programming in Pascal, I guess that isn't feminine
I think 'The Bad Girls Club" and "keeping up with the Kardashians" are both utterly terrible shows.
I like classic cars, and I can change my spark plugs, adjust my choke, change my oil, etc.
I am a gun owner, and not a half bad shot.
Of course, I do a frightening number of stereotypical feminine things, I love cooking, I am the housewife currently, I do like chick flicks, I love anything soft, furry, and cute; I hate going out without making sure my (very long) hair is doing what I want it to. I watch daytime talk shows, etc I could go on for days....
I've always sort of considered male and female differences thrust upon us by society but, nowadays I am not so sure... For now it is just easier not to worry and just say that it is what it is.
I act the way I feel. The way that's me.
I acted like a stereotype of maleness for all my 7 years of being a teenager, now I've finally stopped and I don't think about it anymore. I don't try to act like anything anymore, I just be me.
And if who I am is stereotypical, or stereotypical in some ways, of being one gender or the other, oh well, that's who I am.
Stereotypes are stereotypes because a lot of the time they're somewhat true.
I am not a gender that is recognised well enough to be stereotyped. Its more common that people know I am biologicaly female, and try to assign a stereotype that is wrong. Same goes for the people who know me as male and joke about me being girly. I've learned to make jokes about my self.
recent example- I work with a theatre company on the set construction crew. The recent newsletter mentioned me among new members, saying I was on the set decoration crew. Obviously it was a mistake, because I'm a girl, and was clearly using a paint brush instead of drill and table saw. whatever.
Lets see, erm, nothing that really says male or female? Pretty much everything about me could be described as gender neutral :-\
I have to say my medical journey through this playground was all about my physical anatomical SEX and not gender.
It worries me not one jot whether I am precieved as a female bodied woman or as a female bodied man as long as I am percieved as female bodied.
I self define as a woman, and so I do prefer that definition, but I claim as my rightful playground the entire spectrum of human gender expression. It is true that I probably exhibit more female than male characteristics but I personally acknowledge no absolute boundaries.
I hate gender stereotypes, women can be tough, men can be pretty!
I love to play sports, mostly hockey and I occasionally watch hockey too. That might just be my Canadian blood though :laugh:. I'm a bad cook, I can do simple stuff like make soup or something... pretty much anything else is using the microwave and toaster ;D. I don't eat meat though so it's not like cooking is important :P. I like action movies, but I pretty much can enjoy any genre except horror.
Even though stereotypes bug me, I do fit a lot of female ones, make-up, girly clothes (although I almost always wear jeans), easy-going/submissive, emotional, love chick flicks, cute cuddly things like kitties :laugh:, I could go on and on. I feel like I'm not helping the situation when it comes to stereotypes, as I fit a lot of them, it's just who I am though, I don't think of it too much :).
I fit a lot of male stereotypes - I'm an applied math major, I'm into computers, I love hockey and basketball (watching) and soccer and baseball (playing), I'm not especially talkative and I get hopelessly confused by most 'feelings' conversations. When I'm single I'm fairly promiscuous and sexually aggressive. I don't know what to do with children. My usual taste in clothing is best described as 'drab.' And I'm an online gamer, a Navy veteran, and a fairly good aircraft mechanic.
But I prefer sweet mixed drinks to beer and dark liquor, I know nothing whatsoever about cars (though I can fix one if someone can point me to the part that's broken), I love pop music and boy bands, I smile a lot and giggle a little bit, I love to cuddle with my friends, I dance (with my hips) and I don't ever plan to lose the inflections in my voice, which are much more gay boy than straight girl already anyway. I exfoliate and moisturize and use hair product and shave pretty much everywhere. And when I've been on T a little bit and have had top surgery, one of the first things I'm going to do post-op is buy a tight pink shirt and skinny jeans and wear them out to a club, and I don't care who knows it!
Hmm...
Well, I do fit a lot of male stereotypes, but there are a few female/not male things that I like or do.
1) I can handle watching stuff like Ouran High School Host Club (even though I HATE romance) because I think it's funny
2) I don't like sports much. Maybe it's just because I'm not good at them. :P
3) I don't like working on cars; just too much stuff to do, and I don't think it really actually helps anything. (Although, I do love me a good sports car >:-) )
4) (If I was actually fit enough to be good at fighting...) I prefer a nimble fighting style over just brute force.
5) I love to collect Asian things (esp. Japanese) and Anime/Manga things (although this isn't really stereotypically male or female, Asian things--like cherry blossoms and stuff--are kind of feminine).
6) I am extremely level-headed and logical (not to say that guys/girls aren't logical, but stereotypically, guys are considered extremely violent, and girls are considered to be obsessed with their emotions).
That's more than I thought I'd be able to come up with. :o Glad I got to sit down and actually think about it for a minute, though. I've needed an excuse to do it.
Well, for one thing, much of my musical taste isn't especially "girly". No-wave, experimental industrial, noise, power noise, doom metal - not exactly princess and peach puff stuff. I've always had steel-toed boots in my wardrobe, and I enjoy patched, pinned and studded clothing. My hair is close-cropped over most of my head, with large pink bangs, and until recently I had a mohawk. Hmm, what else? I can be fairly loud, and I've been known to get in fights. There are other things, but those are a few of my less... "girly" traits.
I guess I AM a stereotypical woman with the exception that my childhood and teens taught me how to fight effectively for what is important to me. When other women say they admire me and wish they could be more like me, I feel very proud ;D
lets see for me i think im stereo typical but not by conscious effort i like cooking and once wanted to be a chef i love food network. especially Giada. i dont like sports at all playing or watching totally pointless to me. i like drama movies and horror i like to read and i like to go to clubs and people watch. in other ways not so typical like im no good at conversation. i hate a phone with a passion its so impersonal. i guess im a mix of both but the more traditional male things like hunting beer drinking and fast cars do nothing for me show me your at least as smart as me preferably smarter and im attracted lol.
jessica
Post Merge: March 31, 2010, 05:09:58 AM
6) I am extremely level-headed and logical (not to say that guys/girls aren't logical, but stereotypically, guys are considered extremely violent, and girls are considered to be obsessed with their emotions).
guys are extreamly violent in my oppinion its what makes me so uncomfortable around them but thats me
I suck at ALL sports (exception: swimming. ::) figures, eh?) , and I can't tell a ferrari from a mercedes. Two of my biggest downfalls from my point of view.
HmMmm I like sports, well football at least. I don't really care for much other sports really when I think about it. But I do love watching football, and go borderline crazy fan behavior for the New York Giants. I like video games from time to time, although I prefer Super Nintendo to any of the newer systems and stuff... I like playing video games with my friends though and rarely on my own. That is all I can really think of, my other interests are either feminine or even stereotypically transcend gender barriers.
Quote from: Katelyn-W on March 30, 2010, 03:02:23 PM
That might just be my Canadian blood though :laugh:.
100% the Canadian blood, myself, my mother, my step sister and almost every gg I know loves it just as much, if not more then the males.
Vancouver better get past the second round this year...
I love video games and roleplaying, and actually want to be a game designer. Furthermore. I don't wear excessive amounts of make up. Just some concealer and foundation to cover what is left of my beard, and maybe a little lipstick and lip gloss. I don't bother with eyeliner, eye shadow, mascara or even blush. I do dress and behave feminine but I never go over the top. I actually enjoy wearing jeans, and only occasionally put on a skirt in public. While I like "girly" music like Kelly Clarkson and Katy Perry, I also enjoy "hardcore" music like Alice Cooper and Nightwish, as well as classic rock, like Queen and Aerosmith.
I am a very feminine girl, but I do have masculine qualities.... but when you think about it, every girl does. It really annoys me when people try to poke the finger at me and say "You can't be a girl if you like video games and rock music!" when I know so many biological women who enjoy these things too. Does that make them all men as well? Seriously.... down with double standards!
I love sparkly things, prefer having long hair (although it's short right now ):, usually wear gender neutral or women's clothing, knit, hate sports and athletic things (except I watch figure skating), paint my nails, most of my friends are girls, don't drink beer, like the menfolk, listen to Lady Gaga and the like, the list goes on. A list of gender steretypes I fit would be a lot shorter.
I see so much variation in people, I'm really having trouble nailing down what the definative male stereotype is even supposed to be! :laugh: I hear and read things, but I just don't often see those characteristics in the men I speak to.
The only real stereotypes I see are when people intentionally catagorize themselves to conform to some "subcultural guidelines" - and even then (I'd like to think) most people grow beyond that.
I have absolutely no idea if I fit "the stereotype" or not (or to what degree). For all I know, I could be a living stereotype. I try not to concern myself with it. Going out of my way not to conform to a stereotype seems just as unforfilling as deliberately conforming to a stereotype.
Don't get me wrong - there are other men out there I look up to, and aspects I admire (and try to cultivate in myself). But I'm not about to take an array of those aspects from someone (or some stereotype) and emulate them as-is, as an inseperable set, and without thinking about why.
I actually do kind of fit a stereotype, it's just not one that North America recognizes. ^_^
I tend heavily towards feminine things, and my personality is feminine in a lot of regards. But I do have more masculine elements as well.
Femininity-wise? I'm tempted to start quoting Otomen and Kashimashi (which is a sign right there).
I like cute, shiny, fluffy, sparkly things (not necessarily all at once, there's very few of those). Love stories, upbeat songs, flowers... I can also go really emotional at times, especially in romantic matters. I try to look as femininely cute as possible (including incorporating girls' clothes into outfits here and there), and I also use way too many smilies. ^_^
On the other hand, I hang around arcades playing racing and shooter games. I buy and build Gundam models. I'm pretty good at computer programming. I have an interest in cars (though I don't know that much about them at present). I can shove nearly every emotion into the background and run on pure, ruthless logic. And though I don't subscribe to the 'aggression makes a man' idea, if you lay a hand on my girlfriend, I will break it off at the wrist.
Basically I'm a ball of contradictions, if indeed you believe that these two sets of things cannot exist at the same time.
(Lots of people would be surprised how many of these attributes are not actually diametrically opposite each other.)
I find that too many people are willing to define themselves by what they're not. For example, is there very much more to the masculine stereotype than not being effeminate? Any one of the things I mentioned in my 'girl's section' above is enough to get your 'man card' revoked. (Try revoking mine; I never applied for it, ha!) When you define yourself by what you're not, then you give all title to your identity to someone else. They can change who you are, without your input, by changing who they are. Why people do that is what I don't really understand...
I love to shop, especially for jewelry and clothes.
I love singing along to music I listen to, which can vary from Metallica to Porter Wagner
I paint my nails all the time
I enjoy shopping for make-up (Goth make-up)
I'm sure there's a few other things...but those are the ones that came to mind
Oh yeah. And if I watch something sad on TV or in a video game, I'll cry. I try to hide it, but if it gets too much I'll just cry
I have alot of ear piercings. Which is starting to become more accepted among males anyhow.
I wear gothic make up sometimes, which is also more accepted in today's society, in males.
I have a love/hate relationship with shopping.
My emotions are starting to swing more the male way, suddenly. For what reason, I don't know. But I have my sensitive moments. Then again, that's only a gender stereotype in closed minded people's eyes, cause I know plenty of sensitive men.
But I really have more male tendencies than anything. I could probably count my female tendencies on one hand.
Post Merge: April 03, 2010, 12:18:52 PM
Quote from: kyril on March 30, 2010, 07:37:23 PM
And when I've been on T a little bit and have had top surgery, one of the first things I'm going to do post-op is buy a tight pink shirt and skinny jeans and wear them out to a club, and I don't care who knows it!
hells yes! Me too :D
I'm sensitive to other people's feelings - empathetic streak a mile wide.
I believe that whoever invented the myth that men shouldn't cry needs to be slapped back into the stone age :P If I need to cry, I'll do it.
I love crushed velvet. I so want one of those poet shirts in black or burgundy. ..Ah yes, clothes. My preferred style is actually romantic goth, but obviously I can't pull that off right now.
I'm also deep and creative, but there are quite a few blokes out there like that. I'm related to two and live with another two (certainly the deep part) :P But then I hate stereotypes, full stop.
I'm an emotional, feminine, artistic sort of a boy, even at my full 6'2 height.
I don't like sports, I find cars "pretty" but would be lost if it broke down on me, and I don't drink beer, at all, ever, cause it makes me feel ill.
I knit, I like to do make-up for friends or my daughter, I'm a great cook and I Love Love Love the chocolate.
I have some bits that you could consider "conform with gender steriotype" though.
I like digging 'round in the garden, getting muddy.
I repair the furniture and the electronics around the house.
I'd never put on a shirt during warm days if I didn't have the chesticles.
etc. etc. etc..
I'm "me".
Nothing more, nothing less.
I loath football with a burning passion, come to think of it. I loath any form of sport lol.
I dont like beer.
Most of my friends are girls.
Ive never seen the god father :P
Hmm yeah, like everyone else here I'm a bit mixed. I'm stereotypically male in quite a few ways, I like sports, (though I'm not particularly good at them, :P) prefer action movies to chick flicks, hate shopping with a burning passion, etc. But, on the other hand, I certainly have characteristics more commonly thought of as girly. I like cooking, (but then, so does my dad,) I'm pretty artsy/creative, and I think I display my emotions more than most boys do. Not to mention that when I was younger, I was pretty girly, wore dresses, liked dolls, etc. But on the other hand, I was never not allowed to "act like a boy" at the same time, so I never really felt the need to be one or the other as a little kid, which I'm grateful for.
I think when it comes down to it, most "normal" biological guys/girls don't fit these stereotypes any better than us.
Excluding that though, the rest fits the stereo type i suppose.
Because i know loooads who dont all fit it, i think its rare if they do lol.
That goes for CIS aswell
Quote from: Luna! on April 03, 2010, 02:58:10 AM
I actually do kind of fit a stereotype, it's just not one that North America recognizes. ^_^
I tend heavily towards feminine things, and my personality is feminine in a lot of regards. But I do have more masculine elements as well.
Femininity-wise? I'm tempted to start quoting Otomen and Kashimashi (which is a sign right there).
I like cute, shiny, fluffy, sparkly things (not necessarily all at once, there's very few of those). Love stories, upbeat songs, flowers... I can also go really emotional at times, especially in romantic matters. I try to look as femininely cute as possible (including incorporating girls' clothes into outfits here and there), and I also use way too many smilies. ^_^
On the other hand, I hang around arcades playing racing and shooter games. I buy and build Gundam models. I'm pretty good at computer programming. I have an interest in cars (though I don't know that much about them at present). I can shove nearly every emotion into the background and run on pure, ruthless logic. And though I don't subscribe to the 'aggression makes a man' idea, if you lay a hand on my girlfriend, I will break it off at the wrist.
Basically I'm a ball of contradictions, if indeed you believe that these two sets of things cannot exist at the same time.
(Lots of people would be surprised how many of these attributes are not actually diametrically opposite each other.)
I find that too many people are willing to define themselves by what they're not. For example, is there very much more to the masculine stereotype than not being effeminate? Any one of the things I mentioned in my 'girl's section' above is enough to get your 'man card' revoked. (Try revoking mine; I never applied for it, ha!) When you define yourself by what you're not, then you give all title to your identity to someone else. They can change who you are, without your input, by changing who they are. Why people do that is what I don't really understand...
You sound like the awesome bishy otaku friend I wish I had in high school :3
One of the major reasons I value the fandom culture is because it does give more room for variances of gender and sexuality, and the anime/manga/etc. fan culture is a shining example of that. My first role models of powerful, creative people who didn't fit the gender binary were all from things I found in otaku culture: visual kei music, yaoi and sci fi manga, and so on. I love that gender variance is actually valued in these spaces. Much as I might laugh at certain parts of fandom, that aspect never gets old.
Now, then, I must get dressed and go to WonderCon! :laugh:
How am I not like gender stereotypes...I really couldn't tell you. I can't even tell you which ones I conform to on either side of the gender spectrum, just like anyone I'm a melting pot of contradictory habits, emotions and mannerisms. Being human is to not make sense, using cold ruthless logic to determine the right choice and then doing exactly the opposite because it feels right. I embrace the fact I'm just me and love the chaotic nature of who I am because a stereotype is a merely way of labelling people without bothering to understand them.
I hate beer.
I don't understand anything Sci-fi, except Lost. Does that even count as Sci-fi?
I love Americas Next Top Model, especially the arguments.
I couldn't care less about flashy cars, I'd rather just have an ordinary car.
I like clothes shopping, now that I can actually browse the menswear without getting funny looks.
I probably have more products(soaps, moisturisers, deodorants, hair stuff, etc) than most women.
i see emotion in people thats' generally overlooked. [odd, cause i'm usually rather distant]
i like COLORR
eh i'm sure there's more...
Quote from: pebbles on March 30, 2010, 01:28:59 PMSo to you guys how are you not like what is stereotypically expected of your desired gender role?
Are you addressing FtM only? As the opposite, MtF, I do not consider myself "typical" in the least and which, to my mind at least, is the whole point of being able to freely express myself at all!
I don't think anything in particular was meant by the 'guys' reference; some people just speak like that...
Certainly enough MtFs have answered by now that it's ok for anyone to, anyway. ^_^
I am unapologetically a stereotypical female.
In fact, I thoroughly enjoy almost everything about the female stereotype.
On top of that, I see absolutely nothing wrong with embracing my stereotypical behaviour.
It's who I am.
I love to read books, especially romance novels. I love "chick flicks." I'm totally into shows like One Tree Hill and The L Word. I'm overly emtional and my voice gets high pitch when I get flustered. I seriously sound like a 14 year old boy who's going through puberty.
Quote from: casorce on April 05, 2010, 09:47:03 PM
I am unapologetically a stereotypical female.
In fact, I thoroughly enjoy almost everything about the female stereotype.
On top of that, I see absolutely nothing wrong with embracing my stereotypical behaviour.
It's who I am.
This ^ :icon_chick:
Quote from: casorce on April 05, 2010, 09:47:03 PM
On top of that, I see absolutely nothing wrong with embracing my stereotypical behaviour.
It's who I am.
I agree, there's absolutely nothing wrong with embracing a stereotype if you do happen to fit into it. It's just a shame when people are forced into stereotypes in order to be accepted.
I'm not competitive, I'm nowhere near macho, I have a very low sex drive, I'm not very outgoing, I'm not very dominant or intimidating, I'm not sporty, I like to read a lot, I don't mind doing housework and actually quite like it sometimes.
There was a website with gender stereotypes on that someone posted on another forum, and here are my answers from that.
The website is - http://1020blog.wordpress.com/2007/01/25/stereotypes-of-the-male-and-female/. (http://1020blog.wordpress.com/2007/01/25/stereotypes-of-the-male-and-female/.)
My answers on the other forum -
Guys are stronger = This depends on the individual. I doubt that I'm stronger than all women simply due to possessing a Y chromosome.
Guys are better at sports = My country's only Winter Olympics medal was won by a woman. Personally, I'm rubbish at sports.
Guys are players = I'm assuming this is the sex-related one? No, I'm not.
Guys hate reading = I love reading, and spent a lot of time as a child reading.
Guys always have an I dont care attitude = Another sweeping generalisation debunked.
Guys dont get grossed out by scrapes and bruises = Seriously? Are these guys toddlers or something? Men can get "grossed out" by injuries.
Guys are tough = I'm tough in some ways, not tough in others, but I'm not stereotypically tough.
Guys are thick headed = No.
Guys are accosiated with the color blue = Only in the last 100 years. Pink used to be masculine, with blue feminine but the 20th century reversed that. Personally, I prefer red as a colour (or is that dark pink?)
Guys like cars = I don't drive and know almost nothing about cars other than what make they are.
Guys become jocks in high school = No, I was more of a book-reading nerd.
Guys take 2 second showers = I've taken showers that lasted 10 minutes.
Guys like hats = No, I don't wear hats.
Guys wear whatever is clean = OK, this one is accurate but I don't see why it's so bad.
Guys like Car or porn magazines = No and no. I would be far more likely to read a magazine about science, computers, history or genealogy.
Guys brag about intimacy = No.
Guys have more tickets = I don't drive.
Guys take too many chances = Not really. I know plenty of women who take many more chances than I do.
Guys always lose all arguments against girls = No, no male person loses all arguments just because the person they are arguing with is female.
Guys are doctors = The vast majority of men aren't, and there are plenty of female doctors (and male nurses).
I don't care about sports. I'm not competetive except where marching and concert band is concerned.
I don't care about cars. (Well, I love the old, white-topped classics, but as far as drooling over magazines and boasting about your car's engine and whatnot, no interest.)
I'm painfully shy with very little confidence in myself.
I'm not a gamer, but this could be due to a financial incapability to try video games, so maybe I am and just don't know it yet.
I'm not a "player." I'm almost 20 and I've never dated, but when I do it will be with someone I care about, and not just a way to pass the time.
I'm not muscular and I don't care. Actually, I prefer it. I'd rather read a good book or watch Star Wars than work out.
Other than that, I fit the male stereotype pretty well with my interests and personality. At least, I don't have any similarities with the female stereotype.
I hate team sports. Although I admire the aesthetics of classic cars, I couldn't care less about what's under the hood. I enjoy sewing, knitting and beading. I like romantic comedies (especially if the guy is cute. >:-) ) I'm not very competitive, and I usually excel at diplomacy. I place more importance on love than on sex. I'm sure there's more, but I can't think of anything right now.
Yeah, I loathe team sports - and prefer skiing. Oh well, there goes the "hating sports" stereotype...
Quote from: pebbles on March 30, 2010, 01:28:59 PM
I've seen alot of this argument against Trans pepole. The idea goes that we were merely pandering to a gender stereotype a clichéd sexist ideal both socially emotionally and physically of what a male and female ought to be and morph ourselves into this internalized image. imposing this onto society and providing reinforcement to those traditional gender roles and fundamentally undermining the idea of sex equality.
I can't help but wonder how many trans pepole they've met. I mean I don't think I propagate a negative or stereotypical ideal of what it would be like to be female I REALLY want to be a scientist, I hope I have a career in biological sciences I have no interest in becoming a begin a kept woman I'd be terrible with young children I find very young kids grating.
I also don't like make-up I don't hate it to the point that I would NEVER wear it but I just feel it's been overdone. Alot of girls wear it everyday and I feel that doing that removes from it's impact and thus dosen't actually make you more attractive. It's also because it's gritty and I always make a compete ham of it smudging or getting it in my eyes.
So to you guys how are you not like what is stereotypically expected of your desired gender role?
It's such a BS argument, starting with the fact that it's never used against cis folk who reflect gender stereotypes. I don't go out of my way to be girly or butch any more than any other woman. I think that's more or less true for most other trans people I've met: whether men or women, they make about as diverse a group as anyone else.
I study physics. I rock climb. I guess that's "non-stereotypical," but sometimes I do both of those things with other women, indeed, some of the same women. I usually wear (light) makeup, and I like to look pretty. I guess that's "stereotypical." I am athletic, but loathe the kind of competition that many men seem to enjoy. I'm quiet. I'm opinionated. I'm empathetic. I'm not terribly good with children. I like to bake. My apartment is a mess. I drive a beat up truck. I wish I drove a Subaru Outback or Impreza. I like chocolate. I like beer. I enjoy watching sports, but I rarely do.
Am I a stereotype? Am I a rebel? Do I care?
Chocolate???
Did somebody mention chocolate???
Oops, we were talking about being different than stereotypes, weren't we .... I failed .....
Quote from: Alyssa M. on April 08, 2010, 12:23:38 PM
It's such a BS argument, starting with the fact that it's never used against cis folk who reflect gender stereotypes.
Yes. Having a beer in a bar, one of my friends states "That's not a very lady like drink".
I reply, "I don't see you complaining about any of the other beer drinking women in the bar."
Let's see, gender stereotypes... Meh I actually have a google a list for this - confusing topic.
Right, so.. I suppose I'm quite vain in terms of smell/clothing/hair - looking good is important to me.
I'm not a big fan of shopping, I go in, glance, get what I want and get the hell out.
Beer is my #1 drink.
I had to learn not to be careless.
I don't care much for cars.
My hands are always neatly manicured.
I'm a big fan of sports, both in terms of watching and playing them.
I don't really like chocolate.
I'm quite muscular and I love pumping my muscles.
The length of my showers depends on what I'm doing.
My house is always neat, I hate junk.
Oh I love to game.
Meh I was a bit of a player back in the day.
Reading is fun.
Getting dirty is fun (down and- as well).
I like fashion.
I like to watch porn every now and then.
I suppose I'm a bit all over the place with stereotypical behaviour (looking at the list). I know some of the things I like/do would be considered feminine, others masculine, but I never paid it much attention. Whatever works for me and is enjoyable.
I would watch porn all the time if more of it was well-made and reflected my rather unusual tastes.
How i am like a gender stereotype:
I am obsessed with shopping
I wear make-up every day
Im very emotional
I always end up messing with guys heads
How i am not like a gender stereotype:
I dont really like chocolate
I like computer games
I am really messy
Although not a car person i do enjoy driving
How are you NOT like a gender sterotype?
I'm not like a transsexual stereotype!
I'm not like any stereotype. I'm like every stereotype. Depends on when you catch me, where my head is at
And a lot of what I read above is B.S. to the point of being warblgarbl. What? Guys don't read? Hello? Who invented the book? Who invented the PhD? Guys that's who.
And the whole 'sports' deal? What's up with that. Granted that it's only recently that women got into that, but all men didn't do them, only a select few in most of them. The 'real' popular ones require hundreds if not thousands of dollars in equipment, more in training - and, at that, few can pull it off. That, and the definition of what constitutes 'sport' is broad enough to include auto racing, dwarf-tossing, and I see poker being listed on ESPN - really? Poker a sport?
Quote from: tekla on April 11, 2010, 08:10:09 AM
I'm not like any stereotype. I'm like every stereotype. Depends on when you catch me, where my head is at
And a lot of what I read above is B.S. to the point of being warblgarbl. What? Guys don't read? Hello? Who invented the book? Who invented the PhD? Guys that's who.
And the whole 'sports' deal? What's up with that. Granted that it's only recently that women got into that, but all men didn't do them, only a select few in most of them. The 'real' popular ones require hundreds if not thousands of dollars in equipment, more in training - and, at that, few can pull it off. That, and the definition of what constitutes 'sport' is broad enough to include auto racing, dwarf-tossing, and I see poker being listed on ESPN - really? Poker a sport?
which is the reason most stereo typys are incorrect
Pebbles:
What a great question! Also, I love everybody's answers. Really enjoy learning more about everybody here.
All I can say is, I'm just me ... no affectations ... no airs ... no postures. I don't know how to be any other way. Many people may not like the way I am. Sorry about that, folks. I'm not trying to curry their favor anyway.
To keep this brief:
Imagine a combination of a laid-back mathematician, a non-stuffy literary type, a responsible hippie [THERE'S an oxymoron for you!] and somebody who has widely varied tastes in just about everything who believes in the motto: Live and let live.
That's me.
I told my gender therapist that many transwomen seem to go for the girly-girly look and behavior. This, I think, is what may rile up the general public. I don't know. Anyway, I don't wear a dress and don't ever plan to. I go for the upscale casual look ... understated elegance ... well put together but not uptight.
Interest? Name it! I'm into SO many things that I have real trouble concentrating on any one thing. I like it this way. It's great. So much to enjoy! Still love Janis Joplin at full intensity ... still love The Rolling Stones at their down 'n dirty best in the early-1970s ... still love Jimi Hendrix melting everybody's minds doing "Voodoo Chile" at Woodstock! Hey, what can I say? By the same token, I love watching the singing group Celtic Woman, watching any Michael Flately dance ensemble, relishing any performance by The Three Tenors (Luciano Pavarotti, Jose Carreras, Placido Domingo) ... you get the idea. Want some variety of interests? Here you go: Ever heard and seen a female Blues Master? She's just one click away:
http://www.wat.tv/video/big-mama-thornton-early-in-1ae9l_184gn_.html#id169880nIc0K112164665 (http://www.wat.tv/video/big-mama-thornton-early-in-1ae9l_184gn_.html#id169880nIc0K112164665)
... hooha! Get down! These would have been my mid-high-school days! Love it!
All of you have such GREAT answers to this post. Thanks for your input. It's SO interesting!
Take care. :)
P.S.:
Yours truly was, is and shall ever be a nerd. Recruited by The U. of Chicago, given an academic scholarship, theoretical astrophycis major, personally tutored by Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar (Nobel Prize 1983), blah blah blah. Nerd stuff. Who else but a real nerd would review a calculus book at www.amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com)?
Any fellow nerds out there? Here's the review:
http://www.amazon.com/Calculus-One-Variable-Introduction-Linear-Algebra/product-reviews/0471503037/ref=cm_cr_dp_hist_4?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=0&filterBy=addFourStar (http://www.amazon.com/Calculus-One-Variable-Introduction-Linear-Algebra/product-reviews/0471503037/ref=cm_cr_dp_hist_4?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=0&filterBy=addFourStar)
I'm "Old-Time Math Hobbiest" on that page.
There should be more women mathematicians and physicist!
How I am NOT like a stereotype:
I am not a strong silent type. I ramble on and on. I like to talk.
I like to go kissy kissy to my kitties (so does my cisboy flatmate so there)
I like cute things. I have a ceramic deer collection.
I cry when intimidated, not that I enjoy it.
I read celebrity gossip
I am interested in (mens) fashion
I can't drive.
but then...I am getting really into cars, but only classic cars. I go to auto shows. I like sports and am a secret jock. And I am very competitive, especially when it comes to arm wrestling.
This was all stuff i used to worry about, but what you are into need not define yr gender. I have learnt that now.
Quote from: elvistears on April 16, 2010, 01:24:11 AM
I like to go kissy kissy to my kitties (so does my cisboy flatmate so there)
Hah yeah, I do that too, and I agree it seems like more of a steriotypically girly thing but my (very male) brother also does the exact same thing.
Quote from: pebbles on March 30, 2010, 01:28:59 PM. . that we were merely pandering to a gender stereotype a clichéd sexist ideal both socially emotionally and physically of what a male and female ought to be .. . I also don't like make-up
;D ;D ;D Just realizd last night I don't wanna be a Drag Queen or any close approximation thereof; I suppose I've been in the closet way too long because I just wanna be a Good Mom for my kids! Have been with old friends in Jackson Heights NY these past couple of days and was invited to a formal attire, advance sale only Drag Queen Cabaret which is an annual event. Many of the girls looked AMAZING (photos/VDO coming hopefully) and was jealous to say the least but out of the nine contestants maybe only 3 or 4 were FT living
pre-op women and when my gay friend owner/sponser and I had sat down to discuss the way I feel about myself he pointed out that . .
"papi if true you prefer men as partners unlike a lot he knew who were married and/or liked women in general then your stll much better off remaining pre-op within the LGBT community rather than try to full transition and thus have to compete with gg women for what would amount to strictly straight male attentions" Edde then went on to remind me of the suicide rate and how in his opinion it primarily relates to irreversable post-op girls and if I want to keep my family intact too then I MUST at least consider keeping thet one (and only) very important male connection appendange!
The house was packed with many gorgious Columbia women as well and trying to tell "who's who" sometimes become a real challenge so IF LIKE tHE TYPICAL GENDER STEROTYPE IN THE SENSE THAT i WAS PAYING AS MUCH ATTENTION TO THE MEN THAT WERE THERE TOO I also realized that in terms of "the heated competition" I may perhaps be better off remaining nominally male out of deference to keeping
THE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS!
I'm majoring in graphic design, anything with the word design in it, is probably not very masculine!
I love art, and doing craft projects
I know nothing about cars
I don't like many sports
I like to go shopping
I love cuddling my cat, and he loves daddy's kisses and lovings!!
I'd much rather be barefoot or wearing sandals than in shoes
I like little kids and very much want to be a daddy!
I prefer fruits and vegetables over meats
I enjoy musicals
I don't like stereotyping myself though! :P
Im sorry what can I say, im living proof of a female stereotype like seriously! Just look at me hahaa :)
Well for starters my mum usually checks i haven't drowned and died when i get in the bath because i take that long.
Still working out what an androgyne gender stereotype is ;D
My problem is that I am so NOT like a stereotype that I'm pretty sure my mom doesn't take my trans-ness seriously. She once told me that there's "no way" I could have already decided that I want to transition, because I "still have so many female tendencies."
Still, I'm perfectly happy with being feminine and silly. That's who I am; I'm not going to act like a macho idiot just to prove to my mom that I'm a REAL MAN on the inside. ::)
Quote from: LucienOctopus on May 04, 2010, 10:51:12 AMThat's who I am; I'm not going to act like a macho idiot just to prove to my mom that I'm a REAL MAN on the inside. ::)
Soooo true. Like I have said in the past, just because I show alot of male traits it doesnt make me not dysphoric. I am sill MTF because that dysphoria is intense enough to do something about it.
I tottaly get it. I still like violent movies and I get confrontational and like it so I really do read male alot, despite my best efforts. LOL