I've noticed something
In real life (You know, that thing you visit when you're off the internet) people tend to be less nice and brush people off. Also, people seem to have a standard of beauty and other traits far beyond what I would consider the average. I've thought about this long and hard and I've come to the conclusion that people in real life tend to completely ignore people that don't have traits that they like, aka the "average" person. This may explain why the loudest people are often the most popular, they are the most difficult to ignore! So what are your thoughts on this matter?
Do you think people tend to subconsciously ignore people?
If yes, then
Do you think that people on the internet are nicer because the traits are less visible?
and
Do you think ignoring people is a problem?
I agree. I will often notice the loudest person initially, but if they're a total ***, I wouldn't continue to give them the time of day. ;)
Well, I think that the loudest person may not be the most charming, but being loud forces people to notice and ask themselves "Do I like this person?"
It also allows them to advertise their personality, plenty of people are pretty cool, but they never speak up and are therefore never noticed.
Yes I understand, wallflowers are often overlooked which is a shame.
It's quite annoying though when in a group there are several loud people and the competition is fierce.
I prefer to be an observer than observed, but that's just me. Eventually I will get around to speaking to a quiet person if they seem amiable enough.
I've thought about this also
I've got loud neighbors, but they get negative attention from others
I tend to be reserved and rather quiet and try to not draw attention in public, but I've noticed that I get noticed by others just about everywhere I go
I'm not quite sure why
I'm pretty chatty once I get going but I don't like to waste breath. I love conversations but I don't fill the room with my presence, I guess.
Anyways, this conversations getting a bit off track, this isn't about our individual personalities. XD
I think it really depends on the community. I've seen people ignored online too. I don't think people are generally nicer online but if you're in the right community that you jive with you'll probably find it a more accepting place.
Just as in real life we're brought together by our commonalities. Online many of the places we meet each other is via communities that are brought together by a common point of interest. Such as being transgendered, liking a certain band, etc. You already have that commonality shared with this new group and then can branch off from that. It can be a bit more difficult to figure out what interests you may share with someone you've met on the street or in school. That can make the interaction with someone IRL a bit strained which may be why you'd think that people are meaner IRL than on the computer. It's simply a different environment where the way people interact is different.
Remember that internet forum/chat interactions are a give and go process. Everyone has a chance to get their thoughts out there where in some cases IRL they would have to push to have their voice heard and as you said louder people will tend to talk over those with a weak voice.
So like I said I don't really think people are nicer or meaner online it's just a different setting where in the right community a person who doesn't do well with in person interactions may flourish.
Quote from: Heartwood on May 20, 2010, 12:43:12 AM
Do you think people tend to subconsciously ignore people?
No, I think they consciously ignore others they either don't connect with or otherwise don't like.
QuoteIf yes, then
Do you think that people on the internet are nicer because the traits are less visible?
I disagree. I think people on the internet are way more nastier and probably showing their true colours and opinions because it's safer.
In real life people hide their true feelings most of the time.
QuoteDo you think ignoring people is a problem?
Only if you're the one being ignored.
If I am ignored while trying to get service in a store, I would be offended. If I'm with people in a friendly gathering and was ignored, my feelings would be hurt.
To me, saying that something isn't a problem because it's not you getting hurt is a bit like saying wars and starvation are not problems because you're not involved in them. So personally, I think it's important.
Osiris: I suppose that could be the case, but it seems like even when not bound by a common thread, people tend to be nicer.
Quote from: Heartwood on May 20, 2010, 01:17:35 AM
To me, saying that something isn't a problem because it's not you getting hurt is a bit like saying wars and starvation are not problems because you're not involved in them. So personally, I think it's important.
So what do you do about people who are ignored? Do you go up and speak to them? Do you ignore others?
I mean, if you've encountered it yourself, were you hurt? Feelings are very important and I think if I am hurt by being ignored, how much I must hurt another if I ignore them. It's a two way street.
And yes, all people look at themselves first before they can consider another. Otherwise, you're lying to yourself.
I have to be wanting to achieve something? I guess if there's anything I want to achieve it's a simulating conversation. If you are being offended or something I'm not trying to offend. :-X
I generally speak to people when I feel they are being ignored, or try to involve them in group conversation. It's true I think of myself first, but I think (or at least hope) it's normal to think about others too.
Quote from: Heartwood on May 20, 2010, 01:33:21 AM
I have to be wanting to achieve something? I guess if there's anything I want to achieve it's a simulating conversation. If you are being offended or something I'm not trying to offend. :-X
I generally speak to people when I feel they are being ignored, or try to involve them in group conversation. It's true I think of myself first, but I think (or at least hope) it's normal to think about others too.
I'm not offended in the slightest. :) Probably soon others will contribute their thoughts and ideas.
Quote from: ƃuıxǝʌ on May 20, 2010, 01:34:56 AM
As someone who is considered to have a 'loud' personality, some of this speculation is skirting close to being offensive, yes.
Ah.
Sorry? I don't really think I said anything offensive. All I've really stated is that loud people tend to be noticed more, which I don't think is false.
Quote from: ƃuıxǝʌ on May 20, 2010, 01:34:56 AM
As someone who is considered to have a 'loud' personality, some of this speculation is skirting close to being offensive, yes.
I don't think this thread is intended to knock loud personalities, just highlight the plight of the ignored.
All my friends are loud and outspoken, which I like. I'm just one of the quiet ones most of the time but I can be a bull in a china shop when someone steps on my toes. :)
I'm not offended either
I am however concerned about some of the people that seem to be ignored by society
These guys have basically said it.
What this thread is about is more or less thinking about psychology as applies to the OP, and how we feel about it.
Well, that was it's original intent, but as conversations are growing things, we can flex the subject, just as long as it doesn't get too off course. If we start talking about tamagotichis or something, I'm gonna have to nudge this thread back on course, lol. ;)
people in real life tend to completely ignore people that don't have traits that they like
I think its more that they seek out people who have traits and qualities they like, admire and enjoy. You can't possibly deal with everyone, so you make choices.
Quote from: tekla on May 20, 2010, 01:59:08 AM
people in real life tend to completely ignore people that don't have traits that they like
I think its more that they seek out people who have traits and qualities they like, admire and enjoy. You can't possibly deal with everyone, so you make choices.
Isn't that kind of like saying the same thing but backwards?
No. You are saying that the ignoring of some certain people is a willful act, and I'm saying that the choosing of people other than those is the willful part of the deal (most of the time). That's a big difference. I'm not choosing to ignore A, B and C, I'm choosing to pay attention to D, E and F.
Now there are people who have traits/habits/mannerisms you don't like, appreciate, or want around you as part of your life. You do shine them on, but's that's specific, not general.
I generally find also that the 'loud' (whatever you mean by that, I think we all have a different sense of it) though not the easiest to ignore, are often the first ones to get that specific rejection because a lot of people really don't like that exact behavior as its seen as rude, boorish, and a sign of ill breeding.
And the difference between RL and the net is not a matter of liking people according to traits, but a difference in what those traits are. Physical attractiveness counts for more in RL than it does on line, while writing style counts more on line than it tends to in RL.
I think I know a perfect case study for this, and I've seen it time after time. You have some guys and two women. One woman is kinda plain, overweight and the other is a stone-cold fox LA model type. Both girls pull out a cigarette at the same time and all (ALL) the guys whip out their lighters in a race to be first to light the cute girls cigarette while the plain girl is standing there with no one offering to light hers. The guys are not choosing to ignore the plain girl, they are choosing to try to impress the babe, had the babe not been there, plain girl would have got her ciggy lit right off. As it is, everyone will notice it, and several of the guys will offer to light hers too, but it's strictly second-place. We didn't want to make her feel bad, we just wanted to help the other one first.
Even among our so called intellectuals we find ignorance...
So is ignorance bliss or blistering?
The folks running the "lost and found" of human beings is obviously failing
Maybe they need to be reminded what human beings are
Then again, I'm guilty also... I shine my loud obnoxious neighbor on as much as possible... I can't stand the sight or sound of him but I still at least say hello and ask him how he's doin' if I have the displeasure of seeing him
Well, actually, I was saying ignoring people was a subconscious act. While it is true that when there is a more "preferable" person to impress, people tend to ignore all others, I find it's also true when there is someone they don't want anything to do with, they tend to more or less ignore them, even when there is nobody else. And while I realize that a good chunk of the ignoring might be conscious, I was thinking that a good bit wasn't, as it seems that when people tend to compare their positive traits with others, they seem to go top tier and ignore whatever the "average" may be.
For example, I might think my hair is horrible, even when there are plenty of people who's hair is worse then mine and look fine. Then again, it may be more of a symptom of setting my standards for myself too high then ignoring the average. Personally I think there's a little of both. Maybe people only see traits that range of extremes of positive and negative. I suppose there are a lot of forces at work.
As for the loud being the first to be rejected, it sure doesn't seem that way in high school, but then again, high school is a world in and of itself, you know what I mean? :P It does seem that the loud are the ones that the strongest opinions, positive or negative, are formed around.
I guess what I'm saying is that we seem to have very similar points of views, but I guess I'm not as good at explaining it as you are. I guess I'm a little confused as to what point I'm really trying to make, too, lol. :-x
Quote from: tekla on May 20, 2010, 02:28:20 AM
No. You are saying that the ignoring of some certain people is a willful act, and I'm saying that the choosing of people other than those is the willful part of the deal (most of the time). That's a big difference. I'm not choosing to ignore A, B and C, I'm choosing to pay attention to D, E and F.
Now there are people who have traits/habits/mannerisms you don't like, appreciate, or want around you as part of your life. You do shine them on, but's that's specific, not general.
I generally find also that the 'loud' (whatever you mean by that, I think we all have a different sense of it) though not the easiest to ignore, are often the first ones to get that specific rejection because a lot of people really don't like that exact behavior as its seen as rude, boorish, and a sign of ill breeding.
And the difference between RL and the net is not a matter of liking people according to traits, but a difference in what those traits are. Physical attractiveness counts for more in RL than it does on line, while writing style counts more on line than it tends to in RL.
I think I know a perfect case study for this, and I've seen it time after time. You have some guys and two women. One woman is kinda plain, overweight and the other is a stone-cold fox LA model type. Both girls pull out a cigarette at the same time and all (ALL) the guys whip out their lighters in a race to be first to light the cute girls cigarette while the plain girl is standing there with no one offering to light hers. The guys are not choosing to ignore the plain girl, they are choosing to try to impress the babe, had the babe not been there, plain girl would have got her ciggy lit right off. As it is, everyone will notice it, and several of the guys will offer to light hers too, but it's strictly second-place. We didn't want to make her feel bad, we just wanted to help the other one first.
Your example is not really a good one, as it is purely based on sexual attraction. Of course the hottie will get the offers before she even opens her mouth, duh! Sorry but I have a habit of pointing out the obvious. :)
Quote from: Hermione01 on May 20, 2010, 02:56:49 AM
Your example is not really a good one, as it is purely based on sexual attraction. Of course the hottie will get the offers before she even opens her mouth, duh! Sorry but I have a habit of pointing out the obvious. :)
I'm not really seeing your line of logic, because I think that's kind of the point.
What would your example be?
EDIT: Well, thanks to everyone's contributions I've changed my position on the subject.
People tend to seek out positive traits
Those who do not have those positive traits tend to have less or no priority.
People tend to hold themselves to higher standards because the want to be like those they seek out, and the average is generally ignored because extremes are the most noticeable.
People on the internet aren't picking someone because they can't see their bad traits, but because their good traits are easier to see, as people experience others through text and text can be any way you want it to be.
The "louder" people for lack of a better term tend to make both friends and enemies faster because their traits are easier to see, speeding up the process.
What do you think?
Quote from: Heartwood on May 20, 2010, 03:00:56 AM
I'm not really seeing your line of logic, because I think that's kind of the point.
What would your example be?
I suppose my point is that being physically attractive will obviously attract attention, and it's not related to being loud, quiet or reserved, which is what I thought the topic was about. Someone showing cleavage is going to receive more attention than a girl who isn't.
If someone is ignored because of their appearance alone (as pointed out, for being overweight or plain or even for the colour of their skin), well there isn't much they can do. They will have to seek out a group they can belong to.
I think there is a difference, I've misunderstood original post. :-\
Quote from: Hermione01 on May 20, 2010, 03:26:31 AM
I suppose my point is that being physically attractive will obviously attract attention, and it's not related to being loud, quiet or reserved, which is what I thought the topic was about. Someone showing cleavage is going to receive more attention than a girl who isn't.
If someone is ignored because of their appearance alone (as pointed out, for being overweight or plain or even for the colour of their skin), well there isn't much they can do. They will have to seek out a group they can belong to.
I think there is a difference, I've misunderstood original post. :-\
Oh, okay.
I kind of assumed that the two girls were the same in every way, but if you are saying that the pretty one is more quiet while the other is more outgoing, I think in that case it really depends on how those traits seem to balance out. I suppose if neither is talking much then the other girl really hasn't gotten a chance to show her stuff, but depending on how she looks it might not be enough anyway to balance out natural beauty.
...What was this thread about again? XD Oh, right, how the quiet tend to be ignored. I think that there may be a number of factors involved, but a large chunk might be both verbal and non-verbal communication. Most of a person's beauty, IMO, is how they carry themselves.
I hope this is right.
I try silence and being 'mousy' so that people will let me be. I really hate it when people try to drag me 'out of my shell.' I built this shell with my own town hands and if I want you to burst in and break it, I'll let you know. So if someone is being ignored, sometimes it is cause they want to be.
And there is another huge difference in Rl vs. Net in that whole 'real time' deal. I can post when I have time, and sometimes I start a post and leave it for hours, days even. There are a lot of times in life, and I'll assume I'm not alone here, that hell yeah I'm ignoring you, not because I'm subconsciously doing it, but because I have something with a real time deadline that I have to get accomplished. "Not now I'm busy."
I live in a large, crowded city and am a user of public transport - which means I ignore nearly everyone. The only people that get in my sightline are interesting people, people I know and people who may be a threat.
Quote from: LordKAT on May 20, 2010, 05:14:52 AM
I hope this is right.
I try silence and being 'mousy' so that people will let me be. I really hate it when people try to drag me 'out of my shell.' I built this shell with my own town hands and if I want you to burst in and break it, I'll let you know. So if someone is being ignored, sometimes it is cause they want to be.
With me, I'm always a little desperate and wanting someone to talk to me when I'm quiet. So I love it when people reach out to me. I didn't realize some people weren't like this. XD
We both learned something then.
I like it, I can get ignored pretty easily and it's relaxing. Some people sort of belong in the background, and I seem to be one of them for the most part.
Right-oh so I decided to join in on this thread since I guess I have a few things I disagree with in the OP.
First off, I really don't think that people on the internet are nicer or tend to ignore folk less - I actually think it's the opposite. Take a forum for example; people read posts, then (possibly) reply and quote a sentence or two - that's one sentence or two from replies that may be a lot longer written by perhaps one or two people of all those who replied. Why? Because the other posts and sentences are utterly uninteresting/insignificant for getting your own word out. After all; it's not like someone is puppy-eyeing you expecting a reply. As for 'nicer': no, people aren't nicer on the internet, they're simply avoiding getting banned and have more time to throw a stab by the way of different, acceptable wording. They'll still think someone's stupid and they'll still get it across.
Then there's the whole 'average people' thing... People aren't average, if they're labled as 'average' then they simply fail to profile their positive/unique traits imho. If that leads to them being ignored or more accurately: not noticed then I really don't see how that's a problem/failure on the part of the person who doesn't notice them. 'The world ignores me!' why? Because every individual in the world is an inconsiderate jerk and all together they weaved some forza ignore plot? Meh, seems like a mirror-mirror-on-the-wall moment to me.
Anyhow, those are pretty much my initial reactions to some of the things I read in this thread. Personally I do ignore people and I really don't feel bad about it; it saves for awkward situations and I much rather ignore someone then to pretend to care/take an artificial interest in them a.k.a. 'See, I'm not ignoring you, but I really don't give a damn about what you're saying *smile/nod*'... ::)
Ps. Ah btw, I'm really not trying to offend anyone with my post, just giving my own, honest opinion - feel free to throw me a hog-pm if it gets to you. ;)
i was gonna say people are not nicer on the internet and elaborate about it but no_id said it all
now what i'd like to add that people hear , then see ,IRL speaking , so if your silent and just stand in the back you will not be seen/noticed , not ignored , even if your above average on how good you look , you'll get some interest at first but then if you keep the silence you'll just be forgotten
so it's not really about ignoring , intentional ignoring happens though , for A LOT of reasons , including not wanting to be associated with you , avoiding talking on a certain subject with you , being too busy with whatever (just thinking sometimes even) ,.......... and the list goes on
me i always enjoyed just sitting on the back and watch ,well basically because i don't talk too much , but to be honest i like it that way ,mostly because i can see everybody and nobody can see you , so you have more understanding of others that they even realize you do
Quote from: no_id on May 21, 2010, 02:55:52 AM
Then there's the whole 'average people' thing... People aren't average, if they're labled as 'average' then they simply fail to profile their positive/unique traits imho. If that leads to them being ignored or more accurately: not noticed then I really don't see how that's a problem/failure on the part of the person who doesn't notice them. 'The world ignores me!' why? Because every individual in the world is an inconsiderate jerk and all together they weaved some forza ignore plot? Meh, seems like a mirror-mirror-on-the-wall moment to me.
Anyhow, those are pretty much my initial reactions to some of the things I read in this thread. Personally I do ignore people and I really don't feel bad about it; it saves for awkward situations and I much rather ignore someone then to pretend to care/take an artificial interest in them a.k.a. 'See, I'm not ignoring you, but I really don't give a damn about what you're saying *smile/nod*'... ::)
Ps. Ah btw, I'm really not trying to offend anyone with my post, just giving my own, honest opinion - feel free to throw me a hog-pm if it gets to you. ;)
You are right on and my side is , thanks for not bothering me and making me respond ti inane conversation. I know how to get attention if I want it. The part of being unnoticed is more accurate usually.
I read that there is no such thing as an average person because no one person could have the 'average' of every possible area of the species.
Quote from: LordKAT on May 21, 2010, 06:58:09 AMI read that there is no such thing as an average person because no one person could have the 'average' of every possible area of the species.
Nah, there might be somebody. It's just an incredibly unlikely occurrence.
I never ignore anyone, but I find myself talking to the ones people ignore. Like the mentally disabled, the girl without an arm, the obese, the just plain weirdos.... the freaks of life.
Not that they are freaks, since I am the biggest freak, so I love them all even though no ones likes me.
I battled everything they battled in life, except the armless one, but I talked to her when no one else did.
I don't see why people have to be rude, since there's no point. But I never had a friend.