Say you are completely transitioned and no one could ever guess or find out about your past,
then you meet someone who becomes your best friend for the rest of your life
and this person, if they knew, would handle it ideally
would you prefer that:
- they never know about "your past"
- they know about your past but you never really talk about it
- they know about your past and you two are free to talk about related issues as they may come up
I would tell them if I thought they needed to know. ie. A prospective husband.
Otherwise, what would be the point?
they know about your past and you two are free to talk about related issues as they may come up
If I could not do that, I could not consider them any sort of friend.
I havent told my boyfriend and he is considering the concept of marriage, i would definitely tell him before we got married.
Quote from: bearded on December 18, 2010, 04:14:14 PM
Say you are completely transitioned and no one could ever guess or find out about your past,
then you meet someone who becomes your best friend for the rest of your life
and this person, if they knew, would handle it ideally
would you prefer that:
- they never know about "your past"
- they know about your past but you never really talk about it
- they know about your past and you two are free to talk about related issues as they may come up
If no one could ever guess or find out about your past, why would you need to tell? Except to make yourself feel better. And if you have an open and honest relationship then you would already have told them.
Ideally, this person, if they knew, would handle it.
I'm in the situation where nobody knows and I'm sure most people have personal and private details that they would not like to share with their life long friends and partners. This is just human nature. So why should I reveal a very personal and private issue, that I dealt with a long time ago?. Because, I have never let what I did interfere with my relationships, friends, family and work and I'm very private person by nature.
So in that sense I would not want anybody to know about this and I mean "everybody" because if as you mentioned there is no way anybody could find out, what is the point? Maybe its because you want to be honest or you want to feel good about yourself.
Yes, I want an open and honest relationship with my partner and where they know about my past and we are free to talk about related issues as they may come up. However, I will only tell them if I feel they can handle, understand and love me for who I am.
Kind regards
Sarah B
To me, I would want them to know early on. I think most people would want to know, if they really loved me for me, it would not matter. I just would not want to be married and 8 years later someone tells them ....I think my partner would want to know what else I have not told them? This is just my opinion. I think honesty is the best policy still.
Amelia
I once had this idea that if anyone asked to see pictures of me as a baby I'd say all my pictures were lost in a house fire. But I don't know.. to be close to someone is to be open and honest. I think the way that you view your past is important. If you view it as negative and shameful then you will send a message that maybe they should as well. I think because a lot of people don't know much about it then it opens the possibly of telling them about it in a better way.. not to say by sugar coating but ....pretty close :P
It's your medical history right? It's not a part of your personality? You are the gender of the sex you portray? Then awesome use that. What you went though was tiny, a consult an operation and that's it! Similar to say correcting a birthmark! You've always been you and your time in hospital was to correct a physical defect that is now perfect! (remember sugar coat if need be!) :P You don't consider to be a huge deal? neither should they!
I think for me I will avoid the labels TS/TG and if they mention them I'd say it's something similar in a way. I think those words TS/TG are just too tainted now, the thought of being defined by such a misunderstood word really concerns me. Even if medically that word has been applied to me it's still just a word, a tainted word that I will work around.
I don't know I still haven't completely figured out what to do about this yet.. hermit life is still cool though I'm going to have to fill that hump one day. As far as pictures go they'll just have to accept that they are not within my grasp.. and that I prefer to live in the now! xP
As an S.O., I have appreciated my wife's honesty with me - we didn't want a relationship with a lot of secrets. That said, I don't generally think I need to know details she doesn't share with me - it's kind of a two-way street. I understand that she was living a very painful lie in the past, one that I'm amazed at her courage to survive. For instance, I would never have asked her what her "old" name was - it doesn't matter, because that's not who she is. Sure, I've learned it during our relationship, but it is like anything else deeply personal that I might learn in a relationship - it's a sacred trust between her and I. Yet, if I didn't know she spent much of her life living that lie, I would want to know details of her childhood, school experience, relationship with her parents, etc - things that I can see for her would be very painful to share at times. As it is, we talk about these things when the time is right for both of us, but I can focus on the things she's done when she was able to live her identity - instead of the things that were part of the lie. In a sense, if she hid her past from me, she'd still be living a lie, as she'd have to lie to support not telling me about her past - it would still have power over her.
I also think it helps her - because I "know", she doesn't need to worry about receiving mail under the wrong name, having family use the wrong pronouns, etc, and that impacting the relationship. It's still hurtful when those things happen (to her, obviously, and to me because I care about her), but she can have the security that whatever someone who doesn't understand says or does, I'm not leaving her and I will continue to love her - and will continue to see her as she is: as a woman. I would think that the constant vigilance required to keep a S.O. from finding out would be very exhausting and anxiety-producing.
I also think there's a safety issue - what if somehow the other person does find out, after it has been hidden for years? I know that there are a lot of bigots out there that would feel humiliated, embarrassed, and angry if they "found out" the person they are intimate with did not have the expected letter on their birth certificate when they were born - and the deeper the relationship before they found out, the deeper their feelings. Now, I would never say that anyone should have any obligation to tell anyone. Nor would I say that victims are in any way at fault if they don't share, but are found out, and someone does something terrible. The people doing the terrible things are the terrible people. But those are also people you want out of your life as early as possible.
There are people out there who won't leave a relationship after "finding out". I know they are likely in the minority. But I like to think they are worth finding, while the bigots probably aren't worth keeping, certainly not worth lying to keep in a relationship. I'd also say someone that is not an S.O. likely has a whole lot less business knowing about the past than someone who is.
But, admittedly, my personal experience is with a wife who doesn't have a perfect situation, but I also think it would be very hard to create the perfect situation. And I would never pretend that I can understand fully what it is like to experience the pain of someone who is transgendered, particularly about their past. So I can accept that the person living the situation is better equipped than I am to decide what is the right thing to do in their own life.
Quote from: ameliat on December 18, 2010, 09:41:32 PM
To me, I would want them to know early on. I think most people would want to know, if they really loved me for me, it would not matter. I just would not want to be married and 8 years later someone tells them ....I think my partner would want to know what else I have not told them? This is just my opinion. I think honesty is the best policy still.
Amelia
I agree ;) , why put you life at risk after all that you've been through
but where do you draw the line on what medical history you share? I think it comes down to perspective how you view that certain medical history. If someone reacted badly because they found out later too many details then that is a sign of their intolerance and issues not any sign of lies or misinformation.
If someone says you should of told them from day one or from the start then should of you told them about the time you got your appendix removed? An ingrown toenail? Your ears pinned? A nose job? A heart transplant? It's your private medical history and it's your choice to share it, there are no obligations to inform anyone of anything like that. It doesn't define you and doesn't change anything. Unless the person has issues of intolerance which is something you can figure out and establish early on anyway. If you decide to be with someone who has those negative views then you know they could react badly, that is something out of your hands whether you tell them or not.
If the subject of having children were raised, it would be time to think about it I guess.
even before that conversation the potential partner could notice either a lack of menstrual cycle or the need for HRT medication which could be mentioned as part of a previous issue that required surgery that resulted in a need for HRT?
I'd say any mention or question of having children early on would result in a "I have no desire to have children, ever" etc from me which should be enough :P
But the more I think about this the more I wonder if it's worth it. Might just buy a dildo and cat instead xP
I don't know that any of the three choices fit. No matter what you do, hiding from your past means you need to take steps to cover your tracks. The only way to be completely stealth would be to cut all ties with your life before transition, becuase all it would take is for one person to slip up and disclose your past either directly or indirectly through something they did or said.
Knowing about it, but not talking about it is the same as denying it ever happened. The elephant in the living room.
For the third option, how much do they know about my past? Is the structure and function of my vagina any of their business, just as much as is my life before transition or the fact that I missed out on a traditional girlhood and the rites of passage that go with it make me less of a woman. I know that's not the intent, but the idea still diminishes my status as a female.
I don't know that we do any better referring to ourselves by our target gender "with a transgender past". No one else who has plastic surgery does this and all it does is diminish our status as our target gender. I've never heard someone refer to themselves as having a hairlip past, etc.
No matter what you do, hiding from your past means you need to take steps to cover your tracks.
Not possible in the current world, if you're on a computer, so are other people, if they are willing to pay, they can find out anything. An old friend of mine is a private investigator type, 20 years ago 90% of his business was 'skip tracing' - trying to find people who ran out on bills and family and all that. He said he found about 70% of them. Now he does about 50% of his business on background/credit checks. Not for the government, or for business, but for people who are 'involved' and want to know the full deal before they get in too deep.
Google lists 10,800,000 results for 'checking on a new boyfriend'.
just for starters:
Criminal Records Check Criminal Records History On Anyone - Get Court Records & More. USSearch.com/Criminal-Records
Instant Background Checks for Free! BeenVerified.com/Background_Checks
View Criminal History InstantCheckMate.com
Search All Public Records Criminal Records, Background Check. Court, Public Records. Search Free. Public.Records.peoplelookup.com
Arrest Records Free Check Anyone's Criminal Background: Arrests, Warrants & Misdemeanors. www.GovPoliceRecords.org (http://www.govpolicerecords.org)
That's just the free stuff, pay for it and you can get almost anything.
Anyone that goes to that much trouble is not a friend. "oh you ran a background check on me really? wow.. yeah ok.....I'm just going to go stand over here now".
Hi Mark
I think it's a good question.
imagined a situation and tell how you should react.
well, in my case it's the last one.
I pick my friends very carefully and I don't think I've got something to hide for them, why should I, there is no convicting or something.
of course in the past I've met people who are convicting but my tongue can be as sharp like the edge of a knife, and confronting people with their small mindedness is not excactly what they want to hear, so they left.
But an honest conversation about my transition is not something I would avoid, I've nothing to be ashamed of and good friends tell their little secrets to eachother, isn't it?
is this answering your question a bit?
love
annette
Quote from: Muffin on December 19, 2010, 07:33:38 PM
Anyone that goes to that much trouble is not a friend. "oh you ran a background check on me really? wow.. yeah ok.....I'm just going to go stand over here now".
While I agree in principal, when I first met my wife and for a while after, I probably would have done checks if they were available. The fact is, I couldn't understand why this amazing person would want to have anything to do with me and the thought that she may have motives lingered in the recesses of my mind for a while.
I appreciate that may be isolated and perhaps a bit pathetic. But I thought I'd put it in to demonstrate that there are more reasons to feel that way that an innate sense of personal superiority.
Yeah that's fair enough, so to amend my words I'll add "of mine" to the end of my first sentence :P
Quote from: Muffin on December 20, 2010, 06:10:29 AM
Yeah that's fair enough, so to amend my words I'll add "of mine" to the end of my first sentence :P
I think my wife would have been seriously offended if I had done those checks.
My point was that, people might do them, not necessarily to test if this lowly individual is worthy of me, so to speak, but to just figure out why this person can contemplate tolerating someone, (me), when I can't!
But a big hug to Muffin. :)
Interesting hypothetical situation. Hypothetical in that you never know if people will handle it "ideally". The way it was worded, I assume you didn't mean romantic "friend"?
For me the only answer that would be acceptable is c). If I have to hide my past, they are not an ideal friend. If I am going to be spending a lot of time with this person, it takes way too much energy to sidestep memories of past situations and the context of the gender I was living at the time. Romantic friend or not, the answer is a no-brainer for me. The baggage comes with.
I don't know if the OP asked this question specifically for post op MtFs but for FtMs it's kind of impossible to not tell a partner lol. I think it's absolutely crucial for a relationship to have complete honesty and I know I would tell a partner if I was transitioning or even if I was post-op.
Personally, I've always regarded transition as a life long kind of thing.. and in a sense you have to abandon traditional ideas of what a female bodied person is (XX, basically, with no genetic sex abnormalities) because as a MtF that's never going to happen. In terms of bodies tho of course, a post op MtF is very lucky that they can achieve what a born female would take for granted.. I just think that transitioning would be such an integral part of the person you are today that you would not be able to not tell a partner. It made you who you are.. and if a potential partner was so offended by the idea how could you accept them when essentially, you are in terms of body, a transsexual? it seems hypocritical to me. Then again I'd want to be involved with the trans community and be able to support other pre op or non op transgendered people without having to worry about 'secrets'.
Although of course a lot of trans people want to leave behind their trans identity when they fully transition (I may be talking solely about those who can achieve a full transition), so everyone's different.
Awesome question, bearded :) I believe in accepting my past and not dismissing it, no matter how far I've come. I don't need to have my past a constant subject of discussion but I would like to think that I am open to talking about anything at all with my partner (assuming this is partner and not just best friend). I believe in forming very, very deep bonds with a bff and with a partner. I don't want to not share something but I also expect reciprocity. I would be hurt if I was friends with someone sharing everything about myself and they were holding something back. Even if you put in there that the person WOULDN'T be accepting, I'd still tell them. I couldn't be close friends with someone who would reject me based on transition. That's a bunch of blah that I just couldn't participate in, you know? But I would have a hard time with like a guy spouse or a boyfriend talking about gender stuff all the time. It would kind of creep me out and make me think there's a different reason he wants to talk about it (like is he taking notes or gathering ideas of his own?). Well, I don't know, lol, I guess this is a super interesting question.
Just know that I'm not one of these people that believes that my whole entire life pre-transition didn't happen and that I need to spend my energy negating it. I believe my life is a whole series of interconnected events, thoughts, etc. and I need to keep them cohesive to feel like it all makes sense. That's just me though. Great question :) Meghan
Quote from: VanOcc on January 03, 2011, 05:55:34 PM
Personally, I've always regarded transition as a life long kind of thing.. and in a sense you have to abandon traditional ideas of what a female bodied person is (XX, basically, with no genetic sex abnormalities) because as a MtF that's never going to happen. In terms of bodies tho of course, a post op MtF is very lucky that they can achieve what a born female would take for granted..
Post-op MtF bodies are indeed fairly close to XX bodies, but its a little bit of an overgeneralization to say that we can achieve what born females (bodied) take for granted. We must take hormones on a daily basis that our otherwise female bodies do not produce enough of naturally (post-menopausal women aside), in fact we are at increased risk for cancers becuase of the medications, for that matter since we were born with prostates we are still at risk for prostate diseases (including cancer). The list goes on and on, but I'll remind you that we pay dearly (financially, emotionally, etc) for what born females get to take for granted.