So last night I was hanging out with a friend I met through work who has only known me since I've been transitioning and had my name legally changed. She does however know that I'm trans (only because someone told her...which I wasn't happy about, but what can you do.) I've known her for about 9 months, but for various reasons, we hadn't hung out in about 5 months until last night. So yeah, we're not really good friends and really don't know each other super well.
Anyway, last night was the first time we had hung out in months and I felt like things were going pretty well. Out of nowhere she asks me what my birth name was. She actually referred to it as my "real name." I told her that my name has been legally changed for over a year and the name she knows me by IS my real name. She then explains she means my birth name. I tell her that I don't see how that's relevant to anything really and that I don't feel like it's something anyone needs to know as I'm not comfortable with it. She then asks a few more times and then after we're done hanging out and I get home, texts me and asks me again. It sort of upset me.
However, this also happened with another friend who found out I was trans but had only known me after transition. She actually wouldn't let the issue go until I finally told her because I couldn't handle being asked anymore. I kind of feel like it's disrespectful, but maybe I'm just being oversensitive.
The thing is, like I said I'm stealth, I've been on T for over a year, and want to be recognized as male, not "that guy who used to be a girl," so this sort of thing bothers me.
Has this happened to anyone else? Why are people so eager to know this?
Say: "My birth name was *insert name of female asking you* and I hated it because it is a name I always associate with horrible people."
Then smile nicely.
I think people like it because they feel like they're in on some big secret. Honestly, I think you're right. Asking is way out of line and disrespectful to all you've gone through. People just don't realise that. Tell her that you want to be respected as male, and that is the only name you go by. Anything else was always foreign, and an incorrect name. If she doesn't accept that, tell her that she has some issues to deal with, not you.
I'm sorry but it's just something that people do. I'm not entirely sure why but they often don't realise it's rude. That doesn't excuse them, I know, but our lives are always a bit tougher. xc
"You know name changes are a matter of public record, so if you were all that interested you could get your ever-expanding fat ass off that chair and use your brain for something more than watching midget scat porn and look it up yourself."
Bet me she'll never ask again.
Wow, even texting you? She's just a nosey cow. I agree with the other guys here - a big part of it is wanting to be in on the super exciting secret ::)
I'm thinking it's more about wanting to find out "what you were like" before. They might be trying to see if they can look you up if they know your birthname. People are nosey beasts. Trans may be such an "exotic and exciting thing" to them they just have to welter in it, in all the wrong ways. They don't understand it's extremely disrespectful, well either that or they don't care.
I get that a lot because I have had a Buddhist name for 14 years now, and I always just counter with the smiling question "Why do you want to know?" Let them do the flustering, it's their turn ;).
I think morbid curiosity is a part but I also think part of it is innocent.
The people who ask this may be wanting to get to know us better and think that somehow knowing our birth name may provide some insight into us.
"Ah yeah, that wasn't a very pretty female name, I can see why you're trans"... or what?
Sorry, I'm just moody today :P
hnehehe.. if anyone ever asked me that. they are in for some confusion. I had a birth name, legally first and last name changed then by my parents.. and now on to my male name. Anyhow.. I've only had a couple people ask me.. and it feels gross. I ended up telling them, but it also then feels like they have power over you as they know this bit of info from your past you don't want dredged up.
Hm, I would consider lying and claiming that that IS my birth name. "Yes, my parents thought it would be cute to give me a male name. It ended up coming in handy." :P
I appreciate some of the more comical suggestions for future responses, especially Tekla's haha.
But yeah, I do agree that part of it may be innocent curiousity, but I feel like telling someone once that I'm not comfortable answering should be enough. Apparently not though. This girl also just texted me a bit ago and told me that after hanging out for a few hours last night, she "likes" me even though she has a boyfriend. I think I need to just steer clear of this particular "friend(?)"
And Tad, I do agree with what you said. I do feel like one of the main reasons it bugs me so much is because I feel like the other person will have some sort of power over me by knowing. Also makes me feel even more like they see me more as a girl trying to be a guy than as a guy.
As with many other things here, it's always reassuring to hear that other people have experienced similar things though.
John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmidt
You writing a book?
If I told you I'll have to kill you.
I changed my name when I entered the witness protection program.
Saying you're not comfortable answering is enough. If she doesn't respect that, stop associating with her. Was she clear on how she "likes" you? She may just mean as a friend.
I think she's definitely out of line. It's one thing to be curious - that's natural - but to be persistently bothering someone when it clearly is not something he wants to share? Seems like she needs to grow up and learn to respect boundaries.
This reminds me of this thing my dad used to do when I was little. "What's your name?" "Puddintame, ask me again, I'll tell you the same."
It's extremely disrespectful to ask, and keep asking.
I've had people ask, and eventually I told them off.
I am also stealth now and if anybody brings it up, even people who are also trans, or knew me before...it makes me uncomfortable. What's past is past. Leave it there. I'd personally rather forget that that part of my life ever existed.
People are just harmlessly curious usually, so I try not to hold it against them, even if it's really none of their business. That girl texting you, though...sheesh. Sometimes I wonder what makes it so hard for some people to understand that the whole birth-name thing is a sore subject for a lot of transpeople. You'd think it would be pretty easy to grasp why.
Usually I find that people don't ask, though.
But if they find out, or if they ask and I answer eventually for whatever reason, they usually know not to repeat it or use it to refer to me.
Every once in awhile, there will be some ignorant person who does decide they will call me by my birth-name as a joke or something, or out of some sense of irony since the name is very unfitting these days considering how I look. This is why basically, as a rule, I generally never tell cissies my birth-name, only ever other transfolk if it comes up during one of those "I had the worst name EVER" conversations.
"I had the worst name EVER"
Maybe if your mom and dad were Mr. and Mrs. Manson and they named you 'Charles'.
I was at school with a girl called Shandah Lear. You'd be amazed.
I've actually got a link floating around of some of the worst/most ridiculous names ever on record. Of course it's the internet, and it could be fake, but it's still hilarious.
OP, I don't think you're overreacting at all. It's stupid, and like tekla said if they cared that damn much they should just look it up themselves. Has she even given you a concrete reason why she wants it?
Quote from: tekla on March 28, 2011, 08:39:45 AM
"I had the worst name EVER"
Maybe if your mom and dad were Mr. and Mrs. Manson and they named you 'Charles'.
Or if they were Mr. and Mrs. Dahmer and they named me Jeffrey. Or if they were named Bundy and called me Ted. Etc, etc.
Thankfully, I don't know anybody with an infamous name, just people with names that very much didn't suit them.
I knew a kid named Cookie in kindergarten.
/offtopic
Quote from: Renard on March 28, 2011, 03:51:58 PM
I knew a kid named Cookie in kindergarten.
/offtopic
Thats so awesome. I would've tried to wear blue every day and serenade them with "C is for cookie that's good enough for me!!!"
I knew brothers named Bow & Arrow
Everybody needs to see the youtube video about bad questions to ask transsexuals. It makes me laugh and cry.
My teacher told us about the girl he used to bully because she was named Candy Cane... yeah horrible names do exist, and there is a Harry Dick near here.
My mom had a student named Hard Dick. He had no eyelids.
There was a girl I went to highschool with named Sunny Day. Best part, she was a complete twat.
There was also a girl named Sparkle.
Sometimes I am appalled at the direction taken in the discussion of a serious topic. Have we really sunk to the level of making fun of people's names and taking potshots at people who will never read this board? Instead of helping people figure out how to deal with such a difficult issue? Or is it because this is The Guys' Board?
My approach to being trans is completely different to yours. I embrace those moments and make jokes. I am completely open about my past. I think thats really the best way to be. Who wants to have something that they are openly embarrassed about? Not me. I'd rather not have a deep dark secret either. Being stealth creates at least one of those situations [and often times both.] I mean there are situations where its necessary, or just not worth the bother. Generally though I find it makes everyone a lot more comfortable about the whole thing. If you can crack jokes on yourself it doesn't give them the same amount of power to really do it behind your back because you'd probably shrug and agree with a smile [and possibly a witty retort.]
Story time:
My school uses a website to link professors and students with materials and online dropboxes ect. My name has inexplicably not been changed on that site [despite the fact that its been changed on my email and on the scheduling/business side of the site] I've had a couple teachers be like "whats up with that?" one of which I'm pretty sure didn't know I was trans [hah.] On like the second or third day of class he asked which I prefer to go by. Everyone in the class was like "wtf?" because most of them know I'm a big ole ->-bleeped-<-. I simply said "I go by Rowan, but if you want call me that I'll probably respond too so really do whatever you feel like." and left it at that. He seemed confused, but has called me Rowan ever since. The rest of the class was fairly amused. It was a very stress-free situation for me.
I've had people ask me what my birth name was, again with the 'What's your real name?' thing. It makes me really mad, it's none of their business, and it's private information. I can understand most people don't realise how touchy the topic is when they mention it, and it may just be idle curiosity, so I don't mind just saying, 'My old name doesn't matter, that's not me anymore.'
But if they question further than that, after it's been made clear that I won't discuss it and that it's none of their business, then they're an arse, plain and simple, and I don't need them around.
Quote from: GinaDouglas on March 28, 2011, 07:28:16 PM
Sometimes I am appalled at the direction taken in the discussion of a serious topic. Have we really sunk to the level of making fun of people's names and taking potshots at people who will never read this board? Instead of helping people figure out how to deal with such a difficult issue? Or is it because this is The Guys' Board?
It's because it's the guy's board. We suck.
LOL.
I'm sure, though, that a girl named Sparkle has heard it all before and doesn't care if we make fun of her name one more time. (And I'm saying this as a guy who has already heard every onion joke in existence in regards to his name.)
Quote from: GinaDouglas on March 28, 2011, 07:28:16 PM
Sometimes I am appalled at the direction taken in the discussion of a serious topic. Have we really sunk to the level of making fun of people's names and taking potshots at people who will never read this board? Instead of helping people figure out how to deal with such a difficult issue? Or is it because this is The Guys' Board?
I see how joshing someone over their name can be viewed as poking fun. I forget that not everyone has thick skin and can laugh at themselves. I don't think the less serious posts here make the more serious ones less helpful.
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It makes me a little uneasy when people ask about it, often referring to it as the "real name" (err.. as opposed to imaginary?? fake? unreal?) or "original name".
To some I actually bother explaining that it was the name of a person that doesn't exist any longer, and most respect my wishes as soon as I ask them to mention it no more since it makes me uncomfortable.
Quote from: Kohdy on March 30, 2011, 10:57:59 AM
I just hate how parents have a say in the matter what our name is going to be, and we have to take so many steps just to change it later in life.
How do you propose you get a name when you can't feed yourself, talk, walk or do anything else for yourself? Do you want to go through life being called anything and everything that someone (besides parents) else chooses? Changing your name legally is one of the less hassling parts of transition, it is just much more sudden in others eyes.
Quote from: Kohdy on March 30, 2011, 11:23:01 AM
I suppose you're right, but I feel that maybe we should be able to legally change our name earlier than 18. Almost 20 years of being called one name is really hard to change for the people around you.
I agree. I'm almost 20 and I just legally changed my name. and my family is trying a little to remember. But it's really hard for them too. and they don't know how big of a deal it is to me to not be called by a
girl male. I'm trying to decide if I should keep reminding them everytime they forget, just as a helpful reminder. I'm not mad at them for forgetting. but then I don't know if they would take me reminding them too well.
Quote from: Kohdy on March 30, 2011, 07:36:59 PMI'm legally changing mine this summer, and my parents (especially my dad) have a hard time using my male name. If they use my birth name, once in a while I'll chirp in and remind them it's Kohdy. Once in a while my dad will even correct himself. The first stage of them getting used to your name is a little awkward, but it just takes time and patience, and persistence (do remind them, if you don't speak up they won't ever use the name or pronouns you want them to).
Ah, okay, yeah, maybe I should start reminding them once in a while. I'm not really out to them yet. but I actually think it's helpful that I changed my name first, and give them time to get used to them, so it's not like I throw a bunch of changes at them all at once.
You can legally change your name under the age of 18. My daughter did.
Quote from: LordKAT on March 31, 2011, 03:23:55 AM
You can legally change your name under the age of 18. My daughter did.
In what state?
Quote from: JohnAlex on March 31, 2011, 12:42:22 PM
In what state?
Any state you can change your name under 18 --- however most if not all require parental approval
Quote from: Rob on March 31, 2011, 01:26:17 PMAny state you can change your name under 18 --- however most if not all require parental approval
I figured that. I guess I assumed that LordKAT wasn't talking about with parent approval.
Quote from: LordKAT on March 30, 2011, 11:18:42 AM
How do you propose you get a name when you can't feed yourself, talk, walk or do anything else for yourself? Do you want to go through life being called anything and everything that someone (besides parents) else chooses? Changing your name legally is one of the less hassling parts of transition, it is just much more sudden in others eyes.
I would of rather been called by a number. >_>
I would of rather been called by a number.
From now on you will be number Seventeen (#17) - I am number one.
I think everyone should choose their own names, it seems like a coming of age process to me, and it just seems natural to choose your own name. Why should 2 people, who have known you for only a few hours, be able to pick out the name that will be used for you for the rest of your life?
It used to be like that, often babies were not named until a later point in life because they died at such a high rate in the first year so there was no sense getting all attached to them.
seems like a good process to me. Baby will be known as baby #1, if they last till they are 10 then they will get a name. lol
Quote from: tekla on April 05, 2011, 09:49:31 PM
I would of rather been called by a number.
From now on you will be number Seventeen (#17) - I am number one.
And I am Captain Picard.
Go fetch me a sandwich. And some tea. earl grey. hot. ;D
I'm number one, you're only a captain, that's like the second lowest class of officer there kid.
I have learned over time that once I explain I am trans one of the first questions to escape the person's mouth is "so what is your birth name," it's something about the mystery that pushes people to wonder for some reason. But most of the time I simply say that I would rather not discuss that topic, and if it doesn't move on to something else, I end the conversation all together.
she needs to learn to respect you for who you are, and if you don't want to talk about your birth name she should understand. if not she is not being a supportive friend anyway.
I still look female and go by my birth name so I have not had this type of situation come up yet. But I think the reasons behind why people want to know vary. I think some are just curious and we all know human beings are the most curious creatures on earth and want to know everything. Which is why shows like entertainment tonight do so well and why people like to stop to look at a car accident on the side of the road. So people are curious by nature and the ones that ask for a birth name do not realize that it can be a painful memory or bother the person they are asking. So mixed in with curiosity is a touch of ignorance. We all are enveloped in the trans world meaning we know the hardships we know the terminology, the issues etc, but other people that are not trans do not know it is like and therefore do not realize what we go through to become the men we were meant to be. I can understand it hurts but to a degree we have to find a way to educate others and not get mad or upset. The more people know the less ignorant they will be. Of course some people are like brick walls and don't get it but at least we can say we tried.