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Can Gender shift?

Started by RebeccaFog, April 29, 2007, 09:59:10 PM

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Owen

Hi Rebeccafog,
                      I have since an early age felt like I should have been a girl but like you had no concept about it till much later. I began expressing my feminity around age 20 but had to supress it due to family parent pressure. I have identified as male mcuh of the time but in later years, now in my 40's the feminine part of me is coming out and very hard to supress it. I am still in a bit of limbo at this moment, and still pretty much in the closet with it. I do experiance certain shifts in gender identity, feeling  more male on certain days, but mostly female and I act acordinly depending on my mood that day. There was a period of time recently that I reverted back to male, not thinking along the lines as female. But I have since slid back to being female. Its an overwhelming desire to be female in everyway. I now look at womens mags more than ever. I'm just being me, not really working on it hard.


Linda Ann

Love being female :angel:
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RebeccaFog

Hi Linda Ann,

   I wonder if we can consider your male moments a downshift:)

   Do you have a therapist to help you? I'm not saying you can't do it on your own, but it's good to have someone to share and grow with.  Just a thought.


Best of all wishes,

Rebecca
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Wendy

Dear Rebecca,

I was different at a young age and kept it to myself.  By 25 I was aware of something called TS. Periodically I do irrational things that almost seem controlled by some other force.  What I have found is that if I allow myself to go forward I find it very difficult to retreat.

I think I can stop doing certain things but I do seem to be failing when I have tried.  My guess is you can hold things at bay if you are allowed to express yourself.  My analogy is similar to letting some steam off the boiler before it explodes.

As we get older we frequently increase our obligations to other people. In addition it gets harder "to pass" if that is an objective.

You might be able to find a middle ground that is bearable and less disruptive to your life.  You have shared your concerns "face-to-face" with some important people to you and that is a good start.

W   


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RebeccaFog

Thank you, Wendy,

   You make perfect sense.


   I think that this issue is radicalizing me to some extent. I've always kept to myself, but now I want to push for the rights of Transpeople to be recognized. I want for every single one of us to be perfectly comfortable discussing our feelings openly. We all know that too much is damaged and lost when a person can't live out their basic human right to express their identity openly, without ridicule, and with respect & dignity.
   I have put my transition on hold, but not my resolve to contribute to our community.


Rebecca
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Donna

Hi, The idea of saying I'm male seems so foriegn to me now that I know I'm female its so revolting that I can't deal with it. I've never been more happy with myself.
Donna
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Seshatneferw

Yes, this has been a good discussion.

It feels good to finally know one is female inside. The next question remains, though: so what now? Yes, some physical issues can be fixed, and yes, some social issues can be fixed; but no, not all the physical or social issues can. What are the important aspects? What are the things that have to change, no matter what; what are the ones that should change unless the cost proves to be too high; and what are the things that can be dealt with?

The good thing about realising the gender identity problem is that these questions are now in the open, and hopefully can be dealt with in some other manner than just bottling it all up until five years down the road one explodes, destroying everything within a half-mile radius. The bad thing, of course, is that one has to start dealing with them sooner rather than later.

  Nfr
Whoopee! Man, that may have been a small one for Neil, but it's a long one for me.
-- Pete Conrad, Apollo XII
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Kate

Quote from: RebeccaFog on April 29, 2007, 09:59:10 PM
  The strange part of this is that after I decided to pursue a different course, I became calm. I don't feel overtly feminine like I have for the past year. I'm still certain that I'm not male, though. I just feel like I'm me. There is no tension anymore. Is it possible for a person to have GID just come and go?

Hey Rebecca... I was just poking through some of my oldest posts here, and thought you might find this thread about "    
Do transsexuals purge?"
interesting...

~Kate~
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cindianna_jones

Amy T wrote:
QuoteI have noticed that MtF TS especially sometimes fall into the trap of thinking in a binary context

1000 110 10101 01011 011010 11000 111

;)

No, I don't think in binary... but I do grok your point. The world is not binary and if we see it that way, then we fall into the same traps as those who persecute us.

This IS the hardest issue to deal with. "What am I and how do I deal with it?"

Patience and education helps, but action creates resolve.  If you are doing something, you are making progress. Even if it is in the wrong direction it is perhaps a good thing, for you will reach a dead end and know with some assurance that "this" is not for you.

Does identity shift?  I don't think so.  I believe that those of us who do not know "what we are" are searching. At some point in life, hopefully, we figure it all out. 

And then we can go bird watching. ;)

Cindi
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RebeccaFog

Thanks, Kate.

   I remember that thread. It is a good one.
   I know that what I'm doing might appear as a purge (I hope it doesn't come back to bite me like one), but for now, I'm looking at it as a side step. My personal history is not like most people's. I was born into a house of severe domestic violence. I spent some years moving around to foster homes then back to my real mother where for the last third of my youth, I was a latchkey child with no role models or even simple discipline. I've only recently realized that my gender issues are separate from my other issues. Fortunately, I have finally put a lot of the past behind me. I have no formal education after high school except for an occasional college course. My job pays well for this area, however, it is barely enough to support my girlfriend and I.
  I said all that because it's sometimes difficult for people to get across who they are from only knowing each other through a forum as opposed to hanging out.

  I am not denying my nature, though. I just want a little time to better understand myself. The process of receiving HRT was a stressful one for me. It called for me to travel a lot which was costing too much. I could see that I was going to have some financial problems if I kept going that way.  My home life had also become stressful. It is very important for me to have a stable home life due to the experiences of my childhood. I know that few people live happily ever after, but I know that I can make it better than it was becoming. I'm also sure that by reconsidering my approach to understanding my GID that I can bring my girlfriend along with me for the ride. She is already on my side, but needs some assimilation time.

  As for me, well I still need to work on a presentation. I still have nothing going on there. I want to know that I can carry myself well. I'm hoping that while I work out some of the knots and details, that I can also start other processes such as electrolysis. I guess I'm trying to do some of the work within my comfort zone. It is ironic because I have no problem explaining my condition to people, but I have a severe block when it comes to my gender expression. I don't know if the block was placed there by the adults of my childhood, but I'm pretty certain that it's been myself who has propped it up and given it reinforcement.
  I really need to work that one out. Another irony I have is that I have no problem with behaving extremely feminine and yet, I don't find it easy to express myself through my clothing. I believe this is an important aspect of a successful transition.

  I am very happy to have your advice and support. You have been an excellent example and role model for me. I know that I cannot stop this GID and that there is no cure. I'm not afraid of it anymore and I'm not trying to hide it. I just want to handle it as well as possible.

  I am and always will be Rebecca.


Love,

from no one other than Rebecca




Quote from: Cindi Jones on May 03, 2007, 05:51:49 PM
Amy T wrote:
QuoteI have noticed that MtF TS especially sometimes fall into the trap of thinking in a binary context

1000 110 10101 01011 011010 11000 111

;)

No, I don't think in binary... but I do grok your point. The world is not binary and if we see it that way, then we fall into the same traps as those who persecute us.

This IS the hardest issue to deal with. "What am I and how do I deal with it?"

Patience and education helps, but action creates resolve.  If you are doing something, you are making progress. Even if it is in the wrong direction it is perhaps a good thing, for you will reach a dead end and know with some assurance that "this" is not for you.

Does identity shift?  I don't think so.  I believe that those of us who do not know "what we are" are searching. At some point in life, hopefully, we figure it all out. 

And then we can go bird watching. ;)

Cindi


Hey Cindi,

   I'd like to figure it out while I am watching birds.
   Sounds soothing.


Love,

Rebecca
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cindianna_jones

The bird watching comment was about life after resolving this identity crisis.  It doesn't matter where you fall or what you decide. But once you get it out of your mind, you can start to live your life fully. It is a wonderful life! It would be nice if we could table our thoughts and enjoy life a few hours each day. But I know that's not how it works.

Chin up!

Cindi
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Shana A

Rebecca,

I too put my transition on hold. During 1993-4 my feelings of gender dysphoria were quite intense, so intense that I felt I had no other choice but to do the RLT. When I decided after a year plus full time RLT to go no further (HRT, etc), there were many circumstances that led me to make that decision. It wasn't at all easy to stop transition but it was also necessary for that time.

For the most part now, I live with being outwardly perceived by society as my birth gender, and recognize and accept who I am inside. What that is, I'm still not even totally sure, TG, androgyne, genderqueer, third gender, in between genders, etc. But I know that I don't feel at all "male". I've always felt that way, since I was a child, and probably always will. Sometimes I feel great pain at being invisible, other times it seems manageable. I don't think that my gender ever shifts, but the intensity of my need to live outwardly or not does seem to change.

zythyra   

"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken." Oscar Wilde


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Trish Peters


I'm new to the form. enjoy reading everyones thoughts.
Here is an interesting view on the dynamics of understanding our feminine or the inner female.

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/cathytg/essays.htm

go the the essays directory, interesting summary of Jung's "anima" and more.

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RebeccaFog

Quote from: zythyra on May 06, 2007, 09:02:22 AM
For the most part now, I live with being outwardly perceived by society as my birth gender, and recognize and accept who I am inside. What that is, I'm still not even totally sure, TG, androgyne, genderqueer, third gender, in between genders, etc. But I know that I don't feel at all "male". I've always felt that way, since I was a child, and probably always will. Sometimes I feel great pain at being invisible, other times it seems manageable. I don't think that my gender ever shifts, but the intensity of my need to live outwardly or not does seem to change.

zythyra   


   This does sound similar to what I'm feeling.  Thanks.
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Shana A

QuoteThis does sound similar to what I'm feeling.

It's good to know I'm not the only one who feels this way.

zythyra
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken." Oscar Wilde


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Wendy

Quote from: zythyra on May 08, 2007, 08:34:21 AM
QuoteThis does sound similar to what I'm feeling.

It's good to know I'm not the only one who feels this way.

zythyra

What you wish would happen in your mind ...is not always the same as what seems practical at the time. (Hey that rhymes.)

One thing that I have found to be of great comfort at this forum is to be able to talk to people that can relate to and/or understand some of your feelings. :)  That fact makes me feel better but is not a gender shift.

W
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Nikki_W

Personally the only thing I think that shifts for me is the balance of importance between being female all the time and not flipping my life upside down. I don't think my female identity changes.

However I strongly believe that anyone on this thread who says gender identity can not change based on their life is expressing the same ignorance and closed mindedness to the experiences of others that is expressed by people who tell us we can't be female because we we're born in a male body. Just because you understand yourself and others like you doesn't make you any better than someone that refuses to understand or accept you when you refuse to understand or accept someone different from you.
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togetherwecan

Quote from: RebeccaFog on April 29, 2007, 09:59:10 PM

  Something strange happened about two weeks ago. I was riding on the train back from the gender clinic and I was thinking about my SO. She has had a really hard time with this and she has been in such pain that I can't even imagine what it was like for her. It occurred to me that, despite how badly I wanted the treatment, I was going to have to stop the process. My thought was that I just needed to put it all on hold. The one thing I can say about myself is that I can't live with the thought of putting another person in pain. It goes against my nature to be the source of agony for any human being.
 

what about your pain and all that you suffer and endure for her?
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RebeccaFog

Quote from: togetherwecan on May 13, 2007, 12:10:57 PM
Quote from: RebeccaFog on April 29, 2007, 09:59:10 PM

  Something strange happened about two weeks ago. I was riding on the train back from the gender clinic and I was thinking about my SO. She has had a really hard time with this and she has been in such pain that I can't even imagine what it was like for her. It occurred to me that, despite how badly I wanted the treatment, I was going to have to stop the process. My thought was that I just needed to put it all on hold. The one thing I can say about myself is that I can't live with the thought of putting another person in pain. It goes against my nature to be the source of agony for any human being.
 

what about your pain and all that you suffer and endure for her?

   The joy she gives me outweighs the pain I feel for myself [most of the time].  I'm not stopping my treatment so much as I am redirecting my energies into understanding myself better. I know I am going to fall back into the gruesome depths of GID. I think my SO is at a higher comfort level now than she was earlier. At this point, I believe I have nothing to lose and everything to gain by putting in the effort to bring her along with me. I want to run, but it's better that I walk.

   Ideally, I wish I could just live amongst others like us and move at a quicker rate of experimentation.  Sometimes, I wonder what it would be like to live in Province Town on the cape [of cod].
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Wendy

Quote from: RebeccaFog on May 13, 2007, 02:51:55 PM
   Ideally, I wish I could just live amongst others like us and move at a quicker rate of experimentation.  Sometimes, I wonder what it would be like to live in Province Town on the cape [of cod].

I agree with you Rebecca.  It would be nice to talk to someone in person that you could trust and they would understand.
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Lucy

Quote from: Wendy on May 13, 2007, 11:58:36 PM
Quote from: RebeccaFog on May 13, 2007, 02:51:55 PM
   Ideally, I wish I could just live amongst others like us and move at a quicker rate of experimentation.  Sometimes, I wonder what it would be like to live in Province Town on the cape [of cod].

I agree with you Rebecca.  It would be nice to talk to someone in person that you could trust and they would understand.

Wendy, I know that it is not the same but I am here if you want to talk, I all ways have been. and you Rebecca. Gender ID doesnt shift, I feel that we just become more aware of it and better understood. Where it would be nice to transition there are to many people asround us that we care about and do not wish to hurt. My wife is hetrosexual and does not fancy other women physicly and so for that reason if I and others around me in the same situation decide to change and start HRT and so on we will loose our loveed ones causing server pain to them and our selves.

We can all live in this dream land where we want to talk to like minded people, well thats why were here isnt it, If you do want to talk to some one face to face go to a Support group or get a good gender theropist.

Hope your well love Lucy
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