Spirituality vs. Religion

[Maebh]

Maybe I am just  a dreamer.

Cindy

You're in good company there Cindy, for so were Christ, the Buddha, Gandhi, Jonathan Swift, Luther King, Chief Seatle, Mandela, John Hume and countless other who dared and gave hope to humanity.
May you never give up dreaming.

Light, Love and Respect.

Maebh

[cindybc]

Just got this from a friend and thought I would share it here with you all.

On this Plane, we are like little kids, laughing, joking, teasing,
but the biggest thing in my thought, here, is the hiding.

I can remember playing a game with myself when I was a wee tad,
hiding things, going about some other part of the games, then coming
back and trying to find what I had hidden. Now, a totally rational,
logical person would say, "How Stupid~!",,, and maybe it is, until it
is realized that wee tad had no one else to play with!, no brothers,
and no sisters; he was an only child, and mom didn't have that much
time to spend with him.

On the other hand, there is a very close analogy to what we have done
to ourselves in the Spiritual Realm. We left our Treasures, and came
down to Earth to participate in this crazy, mud-slinging, rough-and-
tumble Rugby game we call, "Life On Earth", just to get the
EXPERIENCE of playing the game, changing the rules in the middle of
the play, and, yes, getting our butts whomped good, while whomping
other's tails into the ground~!,,,

Then, we grow up a bit, and become more mature, and we graduate to a
more civilized game,,, say "Hearts" or maybe "Poker",,, but we still
have not found the Treasure we hid from ourselves.
Some of us recognize we DID hide a Treasure, taking the first steps
to finding it,,, and there are those, who have NO idea that there is
such a thing as a Treasure. Even so, they recognize the clear, clean
look in the eyes of those who are actively Seeking this treasure, and
who are making great strides toward finding it.

The Seeker, when asked, will give the answer to the question, "How
can you be so happy all the time~!~?" in very simple terms,,, "I
Love, and I love me,,, I accept, and I accept me."

The little wee tad is growing up, and watches the Clouds begin to
race away from the Sun, now beginning to see more clearly the steps
which must be taken, and realizes he is now much closer to finding
the Treasure which he hid from himself, seemingly so long ago.

Now, he plays the same rough and tumble games as always, but it is a
new game now, somehow,,, the air is cleaner, the muck and the mud not
so clinging, the perspective has changed to a realization it IS a
game, and we are supposed to get dirty and filthy, knowing the
showers are just around the corner,,, ,,, ,,,

And when the game is over, the time run out, we find the score tied
at INFINITY to ETERNITY,,, We take our broken noses, our bruised
bodies and hug and love those with whom we have contended, honoring
them for the challenges we faced,,,

We go to the showers and clean up, and find ourselves Glowing and
Brilliant, and even Huge in our countenance,,, It is then, when we
look in the mirror to comb our hair, that we realize the most
important fact of all,,,

The Treasure was WITHIN us, all the time.

Cindy

[Maebh]

Nice one Cindy 

The Treasure was WITHIN us, all the time.

And in others too.

HLLL&R

Maebh

[cindybc]

Hi Maebh hon, you wanna bet it is. It is in everyone if they wish to look within and truly see the splendor of spirit that dwells within each and every one of. Using this light which is capable of lighting the way for others who seek to find their own spirit of light within their own dark abodes or temples, depending on how one perceives their shell or body to be. The treasure is in the spiritual part of us.

We are spirit being having a human experience.

Cindy

[Maebh]

Yes Cindy, sometimes people have been so badly wounded they can't see it in themselve anymore, they gave up or forgot about it.

When seeing it in others they have two choices:
either they wonder how did you do it? and if you can see in them that spark you can encourage them and show to them that they are not that much different, that it is possible for them too, it might give them the hope and courage to try.
or they can be jalous of it and try to drag you down or even destroy you. I know about it, I have been at the recieving end of it. It is when what I call the "practice" becomes very important allowing you to recenter and recharge your energy.

I am lucky as I have created around me a circle of friends and support fearlessly dedicated to each others growth and well being.

HLLL&R

Maebh

PS. I have posted these pics of Corsica I promised you on the photos sharing thread. I hope you like them.

[cindybc]

Hi Maebh I do so agree with all the contents of your post, and yes there are those who want what you have, jealousy, very true. The there are those also who can feel your spirit, it feels strange to them and will not know how to react. I get this response especially with those of the younger generation not just on this message board but out there to. Children certainly one of the most precious gifts given to us, they especially feel it and animals as well, all of nature for that mater. I feel that I would sooner project this kind of energy to others around me then to go out there projecting fear, hate, deceit, lies and greed or any type of negativity. People will look at you but not in an attempt to out who you truly are. They look at you in amazement as to what they feel, perhaps a warmth, although they don't have a clue what it is they feel. 

I have long left behind me the fear of being outed, I live as who I am and do my best everyday to do what ever I can to do what is the right thing to do to another. When I am out there working I think only of hoe best I can serve others. I have not the time to worry about if someone will read me as being trans or anything else that seems to posses others. But then I have come to the end of transitioning trail four years ago. I am now just dedicating myself into learning from others about their ups and downs and trying to work through it to help them find solutions for them. But then only they can make the last decision for better or worst, and I always pray for the better result of course. Sometimes praying for another is the last straw in helping another but then even a reed on the rivers edge that one clings to as a last resort can grow to be a sturdy and stout oak tree. 

Wasn't it when one named Jesus was sitting on a hillside telling the little children stories he said to the elders, encourage the young ones to come to me because I am gentle and humble of heart. While the Jews were conspiring to execute this gentle person.

Cindy   

[Fox]

To start off with my belief structure I would like to say the differences of religon and belief for me. I calssify religon as the active worship of a deity or multiple dieties. Thus I do not have religon as I see it. I do however hold a very open belief structure. First I believe that no religon has it all right or all wrong and dislike when one religon tries to tell another your wrong. Secondly I believe in the power of belief and disbelief as strong opposing forces. Thus one of reasons i believe in multiple different after like theories because if enough people believe in something that energy will collect togther and can bring that belief into being ie for cristinas who believe in heaven and truly think they will got heir when they die they will go to a dimensonal heaven with people of like minded belief and in the same token a true atheist can will their sentientce out of exsistence but not the energy itself which makes up the soul. As a personal belief on death I lean strongly toward reincarnation because it makes sense to me on a scientific lv as well as spiritual (if energy can neither be created nor destroyed then it must go in cycles) so if souls are made of energy they become recycled to be used anew if there not residing in a dimensional after life of there own or someone elses design. As you can see I believe strongly in energy on both a higher and lower spirtual lv and its manipulation and useage. I also believe scientificaly that all energy springs from a common source and that all energy can be broken back down into that source ( what this source is I do not know). I also believe in the inherint balance of the universe and all opposing forces the scales can be tipped far in either direction but you can never break the balance itself for one to exist so must the other. As for dieties I lean more toward a polytheistic stance as it makes more sense to me for there to be more than merely one. Even in the bible god says thou shall worship no other before me. Now why would he say this if their truly wasn't anything else out there to worship. I think dieties are a massive collection of energy givin sentience. I mentioned before that i don't worship anyhting the reasonf or this is I do not believe in the nature of true perfection even for supposedly higher beings for if true perfection where reached then all that would be left for eternity would be endless boredom. I do not think the act of creation itself is grounds for required whorship of the creator. If a scientist ever manage to create life in a laboratory I do not believe that scientist creation should devote their entire exsistence to them. That being said I do believe that there is a singular being at the heart of everything but I do not think it is the god that the top 3 most practiced religons in the world worship. One last belief of mine is that creation itself is one big cosmic joke the universe has a sense of humor. Creation was a means of alievating boredom of what may have once been the only truly perfect being ever and once everythign was created that being would cease to be perfect because even it didn't know whats its creations would do next  thus it can be entertained by being suprised.

[cindybc]

My theory is that;

I believe that the ancient knew about the universal powers that be, *synchronicity* and also knew the mantras to open those channels into the forces that be. These forces happen to resides within our own inner being.

All energy, mater, and even time and space itself in the realm of creation is as one, like a very large hologram, maybe an infinite one, layer upon layer, quantum realities or dimensions. Yes I believe the ancient knew or were aware or connected to the powers that be, but then even the ancient were on the deteriorating end of this knowledge or abilities.

Each and every living spark or souls of all living being are one cell making up the brain of Oneness. We are all parts of the Oneness, the whole, through the interconnection of each individual souls of all living things in Universe.

Yes there are many messengers or aids, ancient evolved beings, *spiritual beings* which some see as angels and others see as light beings, I see the light beings. But when one is dealing with an infinity of potentialities the theories will continue to grow. Just like many ancient Holly manuscripts, of which many have not even made it to the light of day yet, were written one word at a time.

Cindy   

[postoplesbian]

I do not like religions or churches. All those people sitting in a phewwwwwwww snif snif phewwwwwww   Too much ego at those places.. I don't do judgement of others or i am not into gossip or pretending i am holier than thou. To each their own. I don't mind large groups if its about making a change in the way the world is run such as in helping with the Obama campaign but i am not into the social scene of church or religions or even political groups. However, i am a very spiritual woman who listen to above the best i can and i know it when i don't because i suffer the ravages of not hearing. As jesus says let those who can hear hear.

hugs Danielle

[Ell]

i believe i no longer know what i'm talking about in regards to either religion or spirituality. and i always thought i knew when i was speaking incorrectly. i have nothing to say about either of these subjects which will not add to the confusion in terms which i myself do not, and cannot hope to understand.

-ellie

[Lisbeth]

All those people sitting in a phewwwwwwww snif snif phewwwwwww   Too much ego at those places..

I don't do judgement of others or i am not into gossip or pretending i am holier than thou.

*giggle* Do I detect a whiff of judgment in your statement there?

[postoplesbian]

Well to me gossip is talking about a person. Talking about a group of people isn't gossip its about pointing out differences with that group in general and isn't about pointing a finger at a certain person.

Ok forgive me lord for judging i am wrong lisbeth is right 

[cindybc]

I call Gossip, *telephonitis* very very catching disease. the only prevention is to throw your cell phone in the crick.

[whatsername]

I've been tempted to investigate the Unitarian churches.

Just for clarity while they have similar names the Unitarian tradition and Unity denomination are not the same thing.  Though I like them both tremendously.  My grandfather was a Unity minister for many many years and quite a bit of my family either attends or grew up in Unity churches.

I'm more of a pagan myself though not a terribly "religious" one.  I have my own personal observances and goddesses who mean something to me but I'm not a very dedicated follower as these things go.

[Lisbeth]

Well to me gossip is talking about a person. Talking about a group of people isn't gossip its about pointing out differences with that group in general and isn't about pointing a finger at a certain person.

Ok forgive me lord for judging i am wrong lisbeth is right 

It's human nature to make judgments about other people. I'm not worried that you have a low opinion of most church people. And I'm not worried that they have a low opinion of us... as long as they don't try to do us harm because of it.

[nickie]

Oh, my Goddess, look what I started here. Thanks to everyone for all your wonderful posts. This is so enlightening.
As far as defining one's own religious status, by the rules of the Fundamentalists, I am an atheist. I have no problem with that. Atheists are usually thinking people. I do enjoy UNITY, it is the best social outlet I have ever had. I have gotten more support there than I have from the whole Trans "community". We just hosted the most beautiful Candlelight Vigil for the Day of Remembrance that I have ever taken part in. I was one of the speakers, for the first time.
As far as UNITY vs. Unitarianism, they are across the street from us, and about the only difference is, our music program is better. They have a rainbow flag, and we don't, I guess it won't fit with our decor... we are "Sister" churches.
My favorite story about Hell:
"One day this fellow passed away. He went to Hell. The devil decided to show him around personally, so they got in his golf cart. They soon came to a golf course. The devil explained as to how there were only 13 holes, they just didn't care about finishing the course, but assured him he would enjoy it anyway. Then they saw the place where the newcomer would live. The devil apologized for the dead landscaping, broken windows, and lack of pretty decor, but assured him he would be comfortable. He explained how there are 3 square meals a day, usually too hot. Then, they passed a huge hole in the ground, where people were screaming and trying to jump clear of the flames licking their behinds. 'What the hell is that?' queried the man. 'Oh, we had to put that in for the Baptists', the devil answered."

[Lisbeth]

My favorite hell story is this person died and met god. So god asked him whether he wanted to be heaven or hell. He wasn't sure, so god offered to give him a tour of both.

First they came to a room that god said was hell. In it were people who had three-foot forks attached to their arms. The table was filled with the best food you could imagine, but with the long forks there was no way to get the food into your mouth. The people were yelling at each other and arguing.

Then they came to a room that god said was heaven. It looked exactly like the other room. There was the same sumptuous food, and the people had the same three-foot long forks on their arms. But the the people were laughing and having a wonderful time.

When they were back in the hall, the man said, "I don't get it. Both heaven and hell are exactly alike. Why are the people in heaven so happy and the people in hell not?"

"Well, my son," said god, "you see, the people in heaven have learned that with those forks on their arms they can feed each other."

[nickie]

I love it!

[cindybc]

Hi Maebh and all

Not certain I posted this before but I thought it to be supportive to this thread.

The experience and the child within

Being denied us our truth by those out there who force us to live their lie... How many lifetimes does it take to learn that wisdom is that which blows through quantum realities on the cosmic winds that blow in and out of our time and space continuum?

To communicate on the same level as a child, one must first be able to think and feel like a child. Who would be better qualified to know this child more inside and out than the one who embraced this child within her own womb for the first nine months of it's life?

I am a child of the Universe, in a place that does not know time and space.

I don't truly know if anyone presently living in this finite realty really knows all of the answers, I much doubt it, or at least not in the conscious memory. Although there is a good possibly that to a greater degree much more of our memory is stored in our subconscious mind, I do not believe that the physical mind is capable of containing all of the data within the Oneness of al that is, but we as one may come to know the oneness of all that is. 

There are those who I would have to admit are truly more advanced in the awareness of their subconscious minds eye then others, This inner knowing is called **wisdom**, The experiencer becomes the experience and the Oneness of all as the experiencers of the manifestation or creation of the spheres within spheres or the (quantum realities, or dimensions ad infinitum). And how far along are we on this journey of awareness?

Do we as spirit beings truly choose to loop back to a certain point along this time space continuum to be reborn into this time in this reality once more or could that be for as many times  that a soul has or may have experienced life in how many realities since the Big Bang, where hence forth we are assigned to undertake another mission through the vessel of reincarnation? How many lifetime memories does a soul contain?

We all experience our own varying personal levels of hell and heaven as we go through life in this reality. It is a learning and growing cycle that refines us to the best us we can be as we learn from the school of life.

It is those who will not learn from their turbulent,and contrarian existence who will end up getting caught in the repetitive loop of their own making to endure the same turbulent cycle again. It is of our own choice that we do so.

From how science sees it, as it is said that for every action you get an equal and opposite reaction. This Karmic loop is, I believe to be, that whatever one puts out to universe will returned to them in equal portion.

If we can manifest our own hell, why not our own heaven?

Now, about these sensitivities: some say they are a curse while others call them a blessing or a gift. Why such a dichotomy?

As it is said, any vision is all in the eyes of the beholder.  And so it is with the experience of living. Thus it it is in the mind and heart of the experiencer, the empathy let us say. We know that as we think negative thoughts, so will we get negative results to our thoughts in return. You cannot expect to continue doing the same errors over and over again and expect a different  result. But this process works the opposite as well where positive thoughts can also equally bring positive results, or positive results from meticulous constructive planning and administration.

As we continue along out journey we learn much more about the mystery of our inner selves and our own potentials. We find many qualities within that we had no idea were ever there before. We can again begin to  see through the eyes of a young child who sees everything as possible.  Those same eyes can see with a limitless ability to bring healing and wisdom to an ailing world.

Cynthia 
 

[nickie]

Cindy, very eloquently put. I always say I don't believe in reincarnation, but I probably didn't in my last lifetime, either. Our own ignorance allows us to re-experience until we learn the Truth. I remember a movie called Groundhog Day, in which Bill Murray played a guy who kept repeating the same day over and over again, until he 'got it right'. I had to watch it twice to get it. I know my words are much more simplistic, but, hey, that's me.